The Duran Podcast - Putin making deals. Europe isolated and desperate

Episode Date: September 7, 2025

Putin making deals. Europe isolated and desperate

All right, Alexander, let's talk about the meeting of the Coalition of the Willing, which took place in Paris, the statements from the Coalition of the Willing, which was chaired by Macron and Stamer. Whombe, whom I believe combined, Macron and Stammer combined, barely have an approval rating of 25% or 26%. Both of them combined. Yes. Anyway, they chaired the Coalition of the Willing Meeting. Steve Whitkoff sat in on this meeting, talk about what they said. Zelensky also spoke to the media. He gave a statement afterwards as well, as did Macron. So they both gave speeches and statements after the meeting concluded,

where they did also hold a phone call with President Trump. We're getting some reports about how that phone call went. Spoiler alert, it did not go very well for the Europeans. And at the same time, we have some very interesting statements, some of the most interesting statements and comments from Putin, connected to the conflict in Ukraine, to security guarantees, to negotiations with Trump that he made not only in Beijing, but he's repeating many of the comments that he made in Beijing at the forum that he's attending in the Far East. So where would you like to begin? Well, let's start with the meeting in Paris, because what they did, Stama and Macron,

is that they came together. This has been what they've been doing basically since February. And they again came up with this idea of sending forces, European forces, NATO forces, to Western Ukraine or to Ukraine or to some part of Ukraine. It's never quite clear which part. I mean, you know, they always say it's not going to be the combat line. It's going to be far back sometimes, but then other times it's not. It's going to be in various cities. There's never any clarity, full clarity, about the composition of the force. So sometimes it's going to be, you know, British and French ground troops. Then we're told that there aren't enough of those. So the British contribution will be mostly in the country.

the air and by sea, which means, by the way, getting British warships into the Black Sea, just to say. So there's going to be, this, by the way, has been said before. I mean, I can remember some months ago, people looking into all of this coming to the view that the British couldn't really deploy ground forces to Ukraine. They didn't have enough of them. The logistics weren't possible so that they were going to provide aircraft and ships. And then again, And it all changed. It was going to be ground forces again. And once more, it was aircraft and ships.

So, I mean, it's all very nebulous and it's very unclear exactly who is going to be involved. So Macron gave a summary. He gave an encounter afterwards. He said, I think it was 25 countries. We're going to provide troops, except he never provided. 26, 26. 26, exactly. So then again, but again, it's not clear.

what exactly these commitments really amount to in many cases. Italy and Poland have said that they're not going to provide troops. Germany, one gets the strong sense that Mertz would love to send troops to Ukraine as part of this force, but most of the members of his government don't agree. And of course, German public opinion is solidly opposed. So there's a question mark over Germany. In the end, I don't think with Germany it ever would happen. But then we start colliding with reality because we've had this same discussion again and again.

And we're always told that it depends on two things. A ceasefire. And notice they talk about a ceasefire in Ukraine. We've just had a summit meeting between Putin and Trump in Alaska. Trump agreed with Putin that there would not be a ceasefire, that there would be a move towards a negotiated resolution of the conflict. But I noticed that Macross still talks. He still brings up the word ceasefire all the time.

They clearly have not got past that. Anyway, they say a ceasefire, but of course a ceasefire depends on the Russia. the Russians must agree, and they have always said they won't agree. So that's one thing. And the other is a backstop and a guarantee to the military forces that are going to be deployed in Ukraine from the United States. And we've had people like Andersfelsor, Erasmus, the former NATO Secretary General from Denmark. And what he's describing, and he gave a long account of what he wanted,

and it appeared in an article in the Financial Times. I mean, he wanted basically the whole of the NATO system to be moved forward into Ukraine as well, with the United States deeply involved. So you could see what is in the back of all of their minds. So Trump back in February basically said no to this idea. He said, you know, we're not going to provide you with security, those kinds. security guarantees. We're not going to provide you with that kind of backstop. Then before the meeting in Alaska, he had what I think was a very unfortunate telephone call video conference

with Merth and the other European leaders, Macron, Stama Zelensky. And he told them something which, as we'll come to in a moment, really isn't true, which is that the Russians weren't objecting to security guarantees for Ukraine and weren't objecting to European forces being sent to Ukraine. I mean, I don't know how he came about that Trump said that. Maybe he didn't say it, but I mean, he never denied that he did say. And of course, that then set the whole ball rolling again with the Europeans coming up with all of these discussions and ideas and proposals to send troops to Ukraine.

Ukraine. And of course, they said, well, you know, since Putin doesn't object to the security guarantees and to our troop deployments, there is no risk for you to provide us with security guarantees for our forces in Ukraine as well. So that's the trap. I have to say this, which Trump fell into. Because, of course, when the Europeans called him yesterday after their meeting, and said to him, look, we've now got it already. We've got all our troops ready. We've got all our plans worked out. They don't, by the way, but that was what they said to him.

They said to him, now it's your time, your chance to come forward and deliver to us that which you promised before, the security guarantees for our troops, which Putin, you told us, didn't object to and all that. Well, Trump obviously found himself in a very difficult position because he doesn't really want to give these security guarantees. I think that is obvious. The Russians, obviously, far from McGree, remain completely opposed. So Trump became evasive.

He wouldn't be pinned down. The whole conversation became extremely tense. and apparently he then started talking about sanctions and specifically sanctions on India and he started to ask the Europeans, why are you still buying Indian oil? And there is an explanation for this too, by the way, because this came out of the whole discussion in Paris

because, of course, the way the Europeans want to get the Americans to force Putin and the Russians to agree to all of these things is by imposing the bone-crushing sanctions on the Russians, which they think will force the Russians to fall into line and accept NATO-Sark security guarantees to Ukraine and European troop deployments in Ukraine. Well, we've already seen how that worked out with India, but Trump clearly wasn't, didn't want to be pushed. So he pushed back and he said, well, you know, you want me to start imposing these sanctions. Why aren't you sanctioning India already? Why are you still buying Russian oil? Russian oil supplied to you by India.

So the whole conversation went completely awry. Everything basically began to unravel and fall apart at that point. And you get the reports in the media, including the mainstream media here in Britain, about the fact that this was a tense call and that it didn't think it didn't really go well, which leaves us in effect exactly where we were, where we started. That's the thing to say. Now, just to quickly add something, of course,

Witgolf was there, he was in Paris, he did attend the meeting for all of 20 minutes. He then went away. And it's again difficult to explain why, because we've had all this rhetoric from the Americans, or all these claims in the Americans, that Putin, when he met Witkoff in Moscow, agreed to security guarantees of Ukraine and military deployments in Ukraine. And, of course, the last thing Whitgolf wants in a discussion like this

is to be asked questions about the kind of commitments that Putin's agreements Putin supposedly made, which he didn't make over the course of the conversation with him. So you can see both Wikov and Trump basically trying to distance themselves from this whole affair and the Europeans, as I said, left in exactly the same position in which they have always been. With Macron now coming out and saying, oh, well, it'll all be sorted out in a few weeks time. Yeah, like it on. 26 countries will provide Ukraine with security guarantees. Once there is a ceasefire deal that has been agreed on, okay, Macron.

Even Zelensky is calling Macron's bluff. Even he is saying to Macron that this is just all BS. Even Zelensky realizes it, finally. Zelensky realizes it that none of this is going to happen. So, I mean, just to summarize the meeting, if I've got this right, the Europeans, they want the United States to commit to Project Ukraine. which is effectively a commitment to Europe, a commitment to NATO, a commitment to the European political elite. So they want the United States. They want Trump to say sanctions on Russia and the U.S. military involved in Ukraine. So that's what the Europeans want. In other words, they want

the U.S. money and commitment to flow into, to continue to flow into Europe. Because that's her greatest fear that the United States is going to walk away. So that's what they're asking of Trump. It's not so much about Ukraine as it is about committing to Europe. Correct. What Trump is saying is, look, I want you guys to cut off India, to cut off China, to stop buying Russian oil, which is by extension, cutting off India and China, just about everybody else. Cut off bricks, cut off your trade with everybody, and everything's just going to come to the United States.

Yes. Right? So, I mean, it depends. Well, one side wants the money to flow into Europe. The other side is saying, forget about the money flowing into Europe from the United States. States, you guys have to get rid of everybody else and you're going to be purchasing everything from us. Yes, that's exactly what it demands.

In a way. In a way, I mean, what makes this whole business about secondary sanctions and all of this so ridiculous is that we've had all those meetings in China. It's absolutely clear that India is not going to stop buying Russian oil. And China, of course, has just agreed a massive energy deal with Russia. So, I mean, they're talking about sanctions, which by definition are not going to succeed in putting pressure on Russia, but are only going to make their own situation, their own economies in Europe, even worse. There is a, there is something, I mean, there's a kind of bloody mindedness about this, which is so strange in the end. You don't listen to what the Russians are saying, obviously.

You're not really paying much attention to what the Americans are saying either because it's clear that the Americans don't really want to be involved. They've even started to reduce military and military supplies and training for some of the East European countries within NATO, which makes it even less likely that they want to make a big commitment to Ukraine. And you're not listening and you're not paying much attention to what's going on. in the Far East where Putin is making all those deals. It's like these people just really just want to talk.

Well, they are talking exclusively to each other. And anything that comes from outside just doesn't get through. And, you know, they have to talk to Trump. And you sense that they don't really like to do that. And they do it through, you know, with all that teeth grinding and anger that comes of it. And of course, Trump then makes these impossible demands on them. Would they say then go to, because they can't let the US go. They do everything they possibly can to accede to. So I suspect the 19th sanctions package will impose some kind of sanctions

against India. And of course, the Indians will probably, as a result, I'll get more cheaper oil than their own economy. They'll find a way. But what it will mean, again, is higher energy costs in Europe. What does Trump lose, though, from all of this? When you think about it, when you're in Trump's position, in the U.S.'s position, you're not committing to security guarantees. You don't want to commit to security guarantees. You don't want to get bogged down in Ukraine. So you're not committing to that if you're Trump. You're being evasive, like you said. And if you can get the Europeans, to agree to cut off India and China and purchase everything from you.

So be it. I mean, if you're the United States, if you're Trump, you can even say, you know what, Russia will buy whatever oil you have and we'll find it and we'll sell it to the Europeans at a markup. I mean, if he gets the Europeans to agree with him, which he just might give in the trade deal that he had with Ursula in Scotland. So if you're going in with that mindset, whatever I tell the Europeans to do, they're going to do it. You know, you don't lose anything if you're the Trump White House. As long as you're not committing to boots on the ground in Ukraine or some sort of no-fly zone, I mean, you're fine.

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Well, I mean, I think that that's actually a very, very, very good point. I mean, you know, there's an awful lot about, you know, Putin's stringing Trump along. You could argue it's Trump who's stringing the Europeans along, which is, I mean, exactly what it is. And, of course, they play into it. They want to be strung along. They want to be strung along.

When he tells them to jump, they say, how high? And then they try and jump higher still. I mean, this is an astonishing performance. And if you could put it like that, I mean, Trump is the circus master who's running the circus. Because ultimately, they all do what he wants. Yeah, but what drives the Europeans is they want to get that commitment from the United States. That's what's driving them. They want the United States to say, we are going to stay in Europe.

Yes. Don't worry about it. The money from the U.S. will continue to flow to Europe. Essentially, that's what they're asking for. Yes. Will the money dry up or will it continue to come to us? That's the questions that the Europeans want Trump to answer. But they're going about this in a roundabout way using Ukraine and the conflict in Ukraine and all of this stuff.

But that's what's really bothering the Europeans. Yes. What about the comments that Zelensky made? What about the comments that he made about going after the Drusba pipeline? And in a way, that is a type of sanctions. I thought that was a very... Right. I think there's two things to say about Zelensky.

First of all, he came to this meeting. He clearly has lost patience with Macron. I mean, he said, you know, what you're telling me is all theory. there's no actual substance to it. I mean, it says an awful lot when it is Zelensky of all people who is pointing that out. It tells you how unreal in so many ways this whole thing is. But in every other respect, he was clearly at his most aggressive and he's most angry. So he's going to go after the Drushba pipeline.

He's going to go after other pipelines. He wants more missiles. He's going to launch a missile war against Russia. The Europeans appear apparently very keen to provide him with those missiles. The Russians are claiming, again, that Matsz has actually delivered to Zelensky to the Ukrainians' tourist missiles. Remember, we were talking about that before, and that it looked for a few months as if that wasn't so. And now the Russians are saying that it is, that it actually has happened after all. So all of that, all of that is going on all the time the Europeans, as I said, doing, if they're jumping as high as Trump tells them, they're jumping as high as Zelensky's telling them.

And that is another extraordinary thing. But he did, Zelensky gave no sign that he's really interested in any substantive negotiation with the Russians except on his terms. He does appear to recognize now that in Ukraine's interest, some kind of freeze of the conflict, a temporary freeze of the conflict on the existing conflict lines is unavoidable. But in all other respects, I mean, he came across to me as both angry and aggressive and frustrated with the Europeans, but in no mood to give any ground at all. I mean, I don't know what your view was, but that was my sense of him. No, I agree. I think the big fear that I have with all of this is coming from the Europeans in that they will support Zelensky no matter what. Yes.

Whatever crazy ideas he's cooking up or he has in his brain. I mean, we saw that with the Duda interview where Duda actually admitted that Zelensky was trying to get Poland into a war with Russia. I think the danger is that the Europeans are getting so desperate to keep the United States invested in Europe that they might go to the extreme to try and provoke Russia, whatever attack they can get Zelensky to do, whatever false flag they can help him with in order to get the United States to commit, you know, to try and maybe in a way to call Trump's bluff. in a way. That's how they may see it. They may say, you know, we have to provoke Russia to an extreme. We have to put together a false flag. And that way, you know, we'll put Trump up against the wall and it'll be okay, Mr. President. Are you going to support the Europeans or are you going to not do anything now? I mean, they make it, they may get to that level. And the talk coming from Zelensky is that he's also getting very desperate.

Absolutely. The other side of it. Desperate is exactly the right word. And it is the word to, it is the word to focus on. Because there was an element of desperation about this whole meeting, both the Europeans, what the Europeans were doing and what Zelensky was doing. I mean, they sense the Russians are winning and they sense that the Americans are drifting away. And they are panicking. And they are becoming desperate. And they're coming up with ever more. extreme ideas, and you can see this. I mean, they're now openly talking about long-range missile strikes against Russia. Everybody, we're told, at this meeting, agreed to this. And, of course, the Russians have given warnings about what that might mean. And they're not, it's often they're disregarding those warnings. It's that they're embracing them. It's almost as if they are wanting the Russians to react in that kind of a way. precisely because they're now so desperate in some way and in some form to get the United States involved. And if we go back to Putin now, and we'll talk about Putin in a moment.

But this, I think, extreme restraint of language, which I think has been frustrating people for so long, is partly his calculations about this. Now, you can push back on that. You could say, well, Putin being very restrained, being very, you know, calm and whatever, not only provokes these kind of actions, but it encourages the Americans ultimately to think that, you know, if they come to the American Europeans rescued, the Russians won't respond. So, you know, it's, I mean, what I'm going to say doesn't mean that I necessarily agree with Putin's approach.

That's the point I'm making. But what Putin, no doubt, is calculating, and I suspect he's been calculating this for some time, is that the Americans are getting tired of this whole conflict, that the Americans want out, that they are starting to drift away from Europe altogether, that they have far too many other problems, both domestically and around the world. And the right thing to do in light of that is to take this to take this quietly, to go on talking nicely about Donald Trump, even as Donald Trump repeatedly insults him, which he does do, by the way, but, you know, just ignore it.

It's all noise. You get on with Donald, as Putin now refers to him, pretty well all the time anyway. So keep your doors open to the Americans. Don't give way to these ceaseless provocations that the Ukrainians and the Europeans are. coming up with. Handle them. Handle whatever it is they throw at you, be it missiles or drone strikes on refineries, your military, the Russian military is able to cope with all of this. And just keep going. And eventually, Ukraine, you will win the war in Ukraine and the Americans will probably want to drift away too. The enormous risk is, of course, that the level of provocation,

that might cause the Ukrainians and the Europeans to engage in in order to force the Russians into a reaction, could in that case be extreme? And I don't want to put any ideas into people's heads, but I mean, we can all think of certain things that the Ukrainians have already tried to do. The shelling of the Zaporosia nuclear power plant is one. I absolutely maintain, and it is, by the way, the official Russian view that the purpose of the Kusk operation in August 2024 was to capture the Kusk nuclear power plant, which is, by the way, the biggest in Europe. So, I mean, you know, I don't want to suggest anything beyond those historic things. But given the kind of people we're talking about in Europe, given how death. and angry they are becoming and how panicky they are becoming, it may be a mistake not to pour

a cold shower on them from the Russian side and tell them, look, this is our red line. If you cross it, there will be consequences and warn the United States that those consequences will follow too. So anyway, that's what I think. But I agree with you completely. I mean, that I think is the great danger. It's been the danger in some respects ever since the fall of Afdeiakka last year when Macron first floated the possibility of sending French troops to Ukraine. Without a ceasefire, by the way. Without a ceasefire, yeah.

The other problem is that the Europeans are backed by the neocons. Absolutely. So, I mean, you know, that's the other issue. So they're backed and supported by the neocons. I'm sure they're backed and supported by much of the CIA as well and parts of the State Department, as well as the Pentagon. So, I mean, that's another problem with the Europeans and the UK and all the plans that they're cooking up is that you do have a significant, very powerful part of the U.S. government and the U.S. deep state that is supporting and encouraging these types of escalations. Yes.

What do you make of Putin toying with Zelensky telling Zelensky that he can, twice he said it now, two times that Zelensky could come to Moscow. If he wants to negotiate, he can come to Moscow. And then to wrap up the video, it does seem like Putin is openly stating now that there will be a military solution to this company. It seems like he's inching towards that official statement that, you know, okay, the negotiations are great and we want a reproschement with the United States and all those things. But let's be real. This is going to end with the military solution. At least the answers or the

statements that he's been giving kind of tilt in that direction. I don't think there is any doubt about this at all, both in his press conference in China and in the speech he's just made in the Far East. I mean, he said a whole series of things. He said Zelensky's illicit. He said, Zolensky's illegitimate. So talking with him is a road to nowhere because whatever this, whatever Zelensky signs has no legal value. So that, he also said that in order to get an, you know, a really cast iron agreement, you'd need to go through an incredibly elaborate process. You'd need to have, you need to have a lifting of martial law. You need elections. You need a referendum to ratify the agreement. I mean, he's putting up so many obstacles in the way of this, technical obstacles,

as he admitted, but he's insisting that there must be some way to address them. That, I mean, that makes a, I mean, basically he's saying that Zelensky must step down and that the Ukrainians must do all kinds of things, which I do think the Ukrainians are in a political position to do. And he's now again saying security guarantees only makes sense. If there are also security guarantees provided to Russia too, well, nobody in Europe is ever going to agree to that. And I mean, he's clearly talking about something along the Istanbul type of security guarantees. He says he's reiterated his opposition to European forces. NATO forces in Ukraine, more forthrightly, by the way, in the speech in the Far East. But then, I mean,

he teases Zelensky. He says, of course, I'm absolutely willing to meet you, despite the fact that you're illegitimate, despite that you are the head of the current administration, rather than the president of Ukraine. You know, if you want to meet, I'm here in Moscow. I'm, you know, my office is in the Kremlin. You're welcome to come. We can meet. And we can meet. And we're. We can talk. He said that apparently to Trump in Alaska. He's apparently said it. He said it twice now. Once in the press conference, one in the speech he's made today. And, well, there is absolutely no way Zelensky's going to Moscow. I mean, if he were to go to Moscow, quite apart from the fact that Zelensky would be frightened of going to Moscow for all kinds of reasons. But he would be going to Moscow for no other purpose to the enemy's capital. the reason you go to your enemy's capital is to surrender them. So there is no way that Zelensky is going to go to Moscow. So you're absolutely correct.

And about what Putin is talking about. And he said, the soldiers want to see the war won. I mean, that's basically what he meant. And if we don't get all the things we want, we will continue with the war. with the war until it is won. So you're completely right. He's now coming very close, extremely close, to saying that a victory, military victory, is the only viable outcome. By the way, and just to also say something, he also gave a very, very clever answer about Ukraine's EU membership, possible EU membership. He was asked about it by his favorite journalist,

Pavel Zarubin. So this is clearly staged. But he said, of course, we don't object to people joining, you know, economic and business blocks, sorting up their trade as they choose. And we never objected to Ukraine joining the EU. But of course, Zarubin said to him, well, the EU is no longer an economic and business or trade bloc. It's becoming a political military one and one that is hostile to us. And Putin left that unanswered. So he's in effect preparing the ground for the day when he says, well, Ukraine cannot join the EU. That is clearly what he was doing. You know, just to wrap up the video, Alexander, we did two videos, one about a month ago and another one, many videos on the EU topic, but I think the first video

that we did on the EU topic was about a year ago, where we asked the question about Ukraine, EU membership, given how close the EU was becoming to NATO and the fact that the EU was becoming its own military bloc as well as being integrated into NATO. And so we posed the question about whether Russia's position to Ukraine's entry into the EU, you had changed. So we actually did a video on that, many videos on that, but the first time we asked that question was over a year ago. But, you know, we also asked the question in a video that we recorded about two, three weeks ago with regards to the Russian military. And I remember asking you, what are your thoughts about how the Russian military feels about the negotiations

with the United States and a possible solution based on root cause Istanbul Plus? Or, you know, even something lesser than root cause as Istanbul Plus. We actually tackled that topic in a video. So it's interesting to see Putin address these two core issues. Yeah, absolutely, because they're obviously central. And of course, the point about EU membership, a question from a top, I mean, there's no possible way to understate what an important journalist in Russian terms, Zarabini is. I mean, he's basically, I mean, he's essentially, you know, the key journalist, the key contact between the media, the Russian media and the Kremlin.

So here we have Zarubin actually expressing a question, a direct question to Putin, essentially telling Putin, it's not acceptable for Ukraine to join the EU. And this has now been said in Putin's presence openly for the first time. And as I said, he gave that particular answer that, you know, I just talked about. And Putin, we discussed, as you said, the attitude of the military. And here we see Putin actually talk about the attitude of the military. They overwhelmingly, that was his word, they overwhelmingly want to see. Russia achieve all its objectives in the war. The commanders, the general staff, the ordinary soldiers in the trenches whom from time to time Putin himself speaks to and calls. So that's the sentiment within the Russian army. And since we're talking about the Russian army, it's worth pointing out on this score that perhaps intentionally the Russian military, the Ministry of Defense, Defense published a photo of Gerasimov, the chief of the general staff, who is also the

Supreme Military Commander of the Forces in Ukraine. And behind him, there was a map which showed Adessa and Nikolaev as part of Russia. Yeah. No coincidence there. No. I think with the Russians, this is all carefully staged, and I get to say something, I think this picture of the map and Putin's words have been choreographed. I think like some of the questions at that press conference also. Yeah, I also think that everything that Yerazimov said during his update a couple of days ago is playing out on the battlefields. Absolutely. I mean, now we've got...

I mean, we're seeing it. We see. Yeah, we got photos of Russian troops in Kupians. I mean, the Ukrainians denied that they were there, and then, of course, the Russians released pictures showing Russian soldiers walking around Central Kupiansk with flags, apparently without being in any risk or danger. So, I mean, that does bear out to a great extent what Gerassim have said. I've no doubt that what he was saying was true. I mean, there is ebb and flow, there are Ukrainian counter attacks, there are occasional Russian retreats, but those retreats.

are always tactical. And the overall stories, the Russians, are advancing. All right. We will end the video there. The durand. Dotlocals.com. We're on X. We're on Rumble. We're on Telegram and go to Durant Shop, pick up some merch. Like what we are wearing in this video update, there is a link in the description box down below. Take care.