The Duran Podcast - Zelensky, Art of the Deal

Episode Date: May 6, 2025

Zelensky, Art of the Deal

All right, Alexander, let's talk about what is going on with Russia, Ukraine, Trump in Russia, Trump and Ukraine. Where do you want to begin, Alexander? There's so much news going on. There's Zelensky's threats that he's going to hit the May 9th Victory Day. But now he's actually saying that he's afraid that Russia's going to do something to Ukraine. So he's kind of turned it around all of a sudden. The reason that he's turned it around is that there are reports saying that the United States

has told Zelensky, don't you dare do anything during May 9th. And we're also getting reports that China has spoken to France and the UK. Interesting. China went to France and the UK and they said, tell your puppet, he better not do anything in Moscow on May 9th. So now Zelensky is trying to turn it around and say that Russia is going to do something to Ukraine on May 9th. So he's walking all that back.

Anyway, we have that. We have Trump's interview with NBC News. He's talking about how the negotiations with Russia and Ukraine are moving along. I don't know what he's talking about there. We have the minerals deal, and everyone's waiting for the main document, which is the limited partnership agreement. There's so much to discuss with what's going on with Ukraine. But I think the message that I'm getting is that the Trump White House is

bogged down but also completely lost as well. Yeah. They don't have any direction as to what they want. No, I don't think they have any direction about what they want. In fact, I'm going to say something because I know there's all sorts of theories out there about, you know, that this is also, you know, cunning plan to keep the war going or some cunning plan to end the war. there is far too much chaos and dissonance for there to be a plan. I mean, I've encountered many situations where people do engage in cunning plans and go in for all kinds of theater and smoke and mirrors and all that kind of thing. This is just too disorganized and all over the place for that to be true.

Consider, and I think before, you know, I just want to say this before we get on to Zelensky, because what Zelensky is doing is absolutely outrageous. But let's just mention this. Last week, we had clear statements from the State Department that the United States is no longer involved in the mediation. It's pulled out completely of mediation. It's, in effect, walked away. Absolutely clear statements.

All you need to do, read, listen to what the State Department, the spokesman says. And along comes at Donald Trump. He gives an interview to NBC. Negotiation is still underway. He's there still moving in one direction. They're almost there. You know, they're getting on better with one side as opposed to another.

You and, of course, tell us which side that is. Which side do you think it is? Well, I'm going to make a guess that the side he's getting on better with at the moment. Today, today is Russia. And I think he's now angling for a meeting with Putin in Saudi Arabia because, well, he's just said so. He wants to meet Putin when he goes to Saudi Arabia later in May. This is very difficult to keep up with. But as I said, it is all over the place.

And it suggests to me a complete lack of a clear negotiating strategy. Why wouldn't go to Saudi Arabia? Well, why indeed? Is there a G20 meeting? No, there is nothing. There is absolutely no. meeting of that kind. I mean, it's a bilateral visit. Trump had arranged with MBS that he'd go to Saudi Arabia is going to be his first foreign trip abroad. By the way, I think that's absolutely right.

I think that Saudi Arabia is incredibly important key country. It's absolutely correct that Trump would want to go to Saudi Arabia first. And it is a massive snub to the Europeans that he's not going to Europe instead. I mean, normally, when a US president comes into office, the first country he visits is somewhere in Europe, Germany, Britain, someplace like that. But this time, he's chosen Saudi Arabia. I think that is geopolitically wise. But then, you know, so you get again with Trump the sort of feel, the sense that what is important and what is not. which is often very insightful and very sound. But then you also get the chaos as well,

which is he suddenly wants to meet Putin there. He's trying to get Putin to come to Saudi Arabia. Very, very difficult to get that organized, I would have thought, at the last moment. Bear in mind that Putin's calendar over the next couple of days is absolutely packed. This is a very, very busy month for Putin. he's got obviously the

the victory berate to deal with he's got meetings with Lula and Xi Jinping and all sorts of other important people for president of Q Fidso I believe Orban is going but I'm not sure about Orban Vitz Fidsso definitely seems it's going Vucchich probably going

You know all these people He's got all these people to meet He's using Pings like a four day meeting Four day meeting Yeah absolutely it's a huge meeting coming up. And on top of all of that, he's suddenly been told that Trump wants to see him in Saudi Arabia. I mean, it may not be easy to sort that out as Trump wants. But anyway, when you see this moving backwards and forwards from one position to the next position, last week, Zelensky is up, Putin is down.

Now, this week, it's starting to look like it's the other way. That tells you that Trump doesn't have a clear negotiating strategy. The administration is deeply divided. There are clearly different factions, fighting it out. Song do want to commit to Ukraine. Others don't. But let's just talk first about Zelensky. Because these statements, these threats that he made against the Victory Day parade were absolutely outrageous.

And I mean, you only have to go and look at his comments to see that he was. definitely threatening the Victory Day Parade. Now, it's completely understandable that the United States should have privately warned him against doing so. It is absolutely understandable that this has provoked the wrath of China, given that Xi Jinping is going to be in Moscow at that time. But consider how it has come about. Zelensky's on a role, or at least he, up to a few days ago, thought he was.

He met Trump in Rome. He had all those photo ops with Trump in Rome. He's had the absolute unqualified backing of the Europeans. He's got a mineral rights extraction deal, which we still don't really know the details about. But anyway, some people see that as a plus for him. He's had the first glimmers of arms deliveries, $50 million license to supply arms to Ukraine, which somebody is going to pay for. One wonders who precisely, by the way.

Talk clearance of $310 million for re-equipping the F-16s or servicing the F-16s. Talk now in the New York Times that he might actually get more Patriot missiles from that German. in Israel. So, I mean, he's on a role and everybody can see that he's politically secure. So what does Zelensky do? Well, exactly what Zelensky always does. He makes incredible threats. He speaks in this astonishing way about, you know, carrying out attacks on a city at which world leaders are gathering. And what should one expect, given what we know about the kind of person that Zelensky is. I mean, these European leaders who embrace him in the way that they do,

you know, Kirstehm are actually hugging him and all of that. I mean, what they are doing is that they're hugging someone. Well, you've described it. You've talked about the Olensky curse and all of that. I mean, this is incredibly erratic, irresponsible individual to be treating. in that kind of way. Just about a week ago, he had a meeting with his intelligence people in which they were quite openly talking about the fact that they just assassinated a general, a Russian general,

in a town close to Moscow. So no longer any attempt even to deny that there is some kind of attempts to carry out assassinations inside Russia. So this is somebody you shouldn't be embracing. this is somebody you should be keeping a distance from. But no one in Europe seems to get this. And I think the Americans sort of do, except, as I said, Trump doesn't get it.

Trump doesn't get it, exactly. He's promoting the Vatican photos as if it was a, he thought it was a victory, a plus for him. Exactly. I mean, it seems to me extraordinary that three years into this conflict, five years plus into Zelensky's presidency, people haven't grasped what an extraordinarily erratic, irresponsible, reckless, dangerous individual this person is. And I could use far stronger language, which I am not going to. But I mean, it's extraordinary, wild threats.

And as I said, the Europeans, the three monkeys, they don't see, they don't hear, they don't speak. The Americans, you know, mumbling words of, you know, to Zavensky, you know, telling him, you know, he mustn't really mustn't do this. Because if you do something like this, well, all sorts of terrible things will happen to you. Why would he believe that? As I said, he probably, when he started making those threats, thought that he'd got what he wanted. He'd played a master poker game against the Americans and got what he wanted from them. After all, he wrecked their whole plan, the Kellogg plan. He said that was completely unacceptable.

The Europeans backed him in it 100%. the Americans show no anger. We spoke about how Trump's comments in response on true social were extraordinarily weak. So do that. And as I said, you feed Zelensky's confidence and ego and he moves forward and makes threats of this kind. And you bring down the wrath of China on your head and you create a situation which might be incredibly embarrassing. By this point, as I said, in Zelensky's presidency in Korea and war, you should know better. But there it is.

So who is telling Trump to lay off of Zelensky, to back off of Zelensky? Someone is telling him, who do you think it is? Because the Trump administration, after they got into that White House fight with Zelensky, he's been walking back a lot of the rhetoric that he was directing at Zelensky, the dictator stuff, and Zelensky's the greatest con man or the greatest salesman. He got $350 billion off of us. Every time he comes to the United States, he leaves with billions and billions of dollars. All of that stuff, after the White House fight, the Trump administration has been walking at back. And they've been walking it back in a very dishonest way. For example, they said that the,

that Zelensky had apologized in a letter to the Trump White House. We know that's, that's a lie. That's a lie. First of all, there was no apology. He never apologized. He never said, I am sorry or I apologize. And whatever letter was sent to the Trump White House was in the form of of a letter drafted by France, by Macaron. Zelensky didn't even write anything. So you've seen the Trump White House now for the past month or so making excuses for Zelensky backing off of Zelensky. They've even backed off on the requirement or the pressure that they were putting on Ukraine

to hold elections. They backed off on that as well. And to be honest, Alexander, outside of Medvedev, even Russia is not so aggressive towards Zelensky. Now, I understand the argument, and we've made this argument many times, that, you know, why would you want anyone else to come into power in Ukraine when you've got, you know, Zelensky, who's a catastrophe for Ukraine and everything that comes out of his mouth benefits Russia. But he did threaten to attack Moscow on May 9th.

You got a strongly worded statement from Zaharva, but it didn't really, I don't think it really sent a message to Zelensky where he would then back off and say maybe I went too far or anything like that. Medvedev sent a message, which was very, very strong. But, you know, that's Medvedev. He's the hawk in all of this, but his response was very strong. It just seems like, you know, you're saying that Zelensky feels like he's on a role, but I just get the sense that on all sides, on all sides, he's being encouraged to be on a role, to say these things, to do these things, to act this way. I'm just trying to figure out what's happening here.

What's, who's, it feels like there's, there's a power above that, that is steering all of this and is explicitly saying, just back off of this guy. I'll tell you what I think. Let's talk about the Russians in a moment, because I think the Russians to some extent are semi-detached from all of this. But can I just say something about the Russians? I will say, I just want to say one thing that happened last week. Peskov made a statement, and let me know if this is correct, where he said that

they will negotiate with Zelensky, even though they consider him illegitimate, they will negotiate with him because there's no one else. But I consider that to be a kind of a walkback in a way. I mean, no, it is a walkback because six months ago, it was, this guy is completely illegitimate. Yes. Whatever he signs has no value. Has no value. Now, Peskov did say that was still the case. He said, we will negotiate him, but we, We will negotiate with him, but whatever he signs, you know, we're still, we're still, you know, it doesn't look as if it's any legit. It seems like they watered it down a bit.

Yeah. Can I, can I just, I think there is an explanation for this, but the key thing to understand is that the Russians do not control what is going on in Kiev and, you know, who is playing the big picture of. propping up Zelensky at the moment. And here I think we can actually speak clearly about who is playing a role here. Firstly, obviously, the Europeans. Stama, Macron, Ursula, all of this crowd. They are absolutely infatuated with Zelensky. They're propping up Zelensky.

They're telling themselves. I think they've now really come to believe this, that this extraordinary individual really is Churchill. or De Gaulle or Julius Caesar, or whatever they believe he is. I mean, you know, the way they talk about Zelensky is just ridiculous. The way the media writes about Zelensky in Europe is ridiculous.

But they talk about this all of the time. They propped him up. They've told the Americans constantly, look, Zolensky is this great individual. And they made this support for the Zolensky a touchstone of support for Ukraine. So Zolensky is Ukraine. Ukraine is Zolensky.

If you don't support you, Zelensky, you don't support Ukraine. So I think there is this pressure from the Europeans as well. But I don't think it is where the most important support for Zelensky comes. Where it's coming from are from two groups of people within Washington. I say two groups of people. I want to make it clear. We're talking about one ideological group who are, of course, the neocons. But there are neocons within the administration.

Rubio, Kellogg, Kellogg, especially. Kellogg meets with Zelensky regularly. He talks up for Ukraine regularly. He's clearly the person who defends Zelensky within the administration to Trump. Mike Waltz, the national security advisor, until he ceased to be national security advisor. was another such person. And the other group, powerful group, is Lindsay Graham and his supporters in the Senate and in Congress. And we know that Lindsay Graham has put together this big package of so-called bone-crushing sanctions against Russia and all of that. For the moment, he's

making it clear that he's not going to press forward with that unless Trump gives him the green light to. But I think that that sanctions package is also a message to Trump that Zelensky has all of this support in Congress. 72 senators, Lindsay Graham is saying, which is a big majority of the Senate. There are also near conservatives, as we know, amongst the Republican conference in the House, though to a lesser extent. So there is a strong body of support within the United States, within the administration, within, of course, the agencies of the permanent government of the United States, which have been pushing back ever since the February Oval Office meeting to support and prop up Zelensky. And they're the people who are constantly pushing forward with all sorts of

attempts to move the pendulum back strongly in his favour. So we have all of these various different groups. And I think that Trump, for the moment at least, doesn't seem able to break with them. Perhaps at some level he doesn't want to. I don't know. But I think that for the moment, this coalition is strong enough, powerful enough, to be able to keep Zelensky where he is. And the knock-on effect of all of this is that it secured Zelensky's own position in Kiev. You remember, I've discussed this in several programs now, and we've talked about this at length, whereas a year ago, after the fall of Dejvka, Zelensky's position looked very, very fragile,

and if there'd been a real push, he could probably have fallen. and of course his electoral mandate was coming to an end. Today, because the Europeans support him, because so many powerful people in Washington support him, because he's managed to cut deals with the nationalist militias in Ukraine, his position looks secure. So it is much more difficult to move against him than would have been possible a year ago.

So he's much more secure and confident about his position. He knows he's got political allies in Europe and in the United States, and he's able to call the bluff of anybody in Washington who is coming against him because he thinks that at the end of the day, he can be as rude about the Americans as he wishes. I mean, his comments after the Americans produced Kellogg Miners, we're frankly insulting about Kellogg Minus. I mean, you know, I won't recognize Crimea. I won't accept any of this.

It's absolutely not something I'm in any way prepared to do. This is the person who's getting hundreds of, has received hundreds of billions of dollars of USAID and he's dictating outcomes to the United States and the Americans meekly accept it. I mean, they won't push back against Zelensky the way that they've done. Now, when it comes to the Russians, the consistent Russian position since last summer was that Putin has said, look, this man is illegitimate. He's not been reelected. The Ukrainian constitution does not provide for the president's term to be extended in this way. Given that this is so, we have serious doubts about, to put him mildly, about Zelensky's capacity. to sign any document. But what's happened over the last couple of days, a couple of weeks, is that the Americans have come along. They've been pushing for a ceasefire. I think the Russians have basically rejected that. The Americans have come along and they've said, we want you

to accept Kellogg Miners. The Russians have rejected that too. So what the Russians have been doing, is they've been saying, look, we're not prepared to go with any of this, but we are prepared to sit down without conditions and negotiate with Ukraine. And it's a position, by the way, a formal position that they have always held. They are therefore able to point out, not just that there's a question mark over Zelensky himself, but more importantly, that it is Zelensky who is refusing negotiations and won't rescind his October 2020 decree, which prohibits negotiations. So how can we actually negotiate when we can't get past first base because this man won't negotiate with us? But in order to be able to take that position, you have to nonetheless say,

well, look, even though we have all of these doubts about him, he is the person in place for the moment at least, we have to work with him because there is no one else. But that doesn't mean that we are holding back on anything else that we've said. And I think that is the Russian position at the moment. It's tactical. And you get Medvedev who plays the role of the hard man who takes all of the threats and says all of these things. You get very strong statements from Zaharva. But Putin himself, of course, always remains quiet. And he's actually, actually given a massive interview to his favorite journalist, Pavel Zarabin, who he says, you know, the importance in this situation of remaining disciplined and calm.

Yeah. I mean, yeah. I mean, I see your point. It comes to me, it comes across to me as if because of the negotiations, the potential negotiations with the United States, the Russians accepted a watering down of their position with Zelensky. And that involved in Zelensky. It was soft, but it was there. It was there. It was there. And I think Zelensky picked up on it.

He absolutely picked up on it. And that's why you see him saying the ridiculous, crazy stuff that he is saying. When the Americans for a short time were talking about getting Zelensky out, the Russians hardened their position. Now that the Americans have backed off that, the Russians have, as you correctly said, watered down their position. The initiative on this comes from the Americans, not ultimately from the Russians. Because, as I said, the Russians don't control the situation in Kiev. There are rumors, however, that the Russians are actually preparing in private, and they're not publicly announcing it, a kind of new...

government, if you like, or maybe not a government, but at least a group of people who will take over in Kiev if and when the Russians actually get there. And apparently the person that they're talking about and thinking about is Nikolai Azarov, who was Yanukovic's president, prime minister, who was, you know, the pre-Myidem president. And Azarov is actually an ethnic Russian, just to say, even though, he's been prime minister of Ukraine. and is known to be very close to Kremlin thinking on many things. Well, given the fact that the negotiations have broken down, I don't even think they were negotiations,

but we'll call them negotiations with the United States because I don't know what else to call them the talks between Whitkoff and Putin, which is really what it was. Because that all looks like it's broken down, perhaps the Kremlin should not follow the U.S.'s lead on all of this stuff. I mean, maybe they should rethink the strategy of it. I don't know, because I do think it has emboldened. It hasn't bolded Zelensky and Ukraine to a certain extent.

Yes. To a certain extent. Oh, it has. Yeah. Absolutely. I mean, as I said, Zelensky believes that he's on a role. He's on a role. Yeah, yeah.

Absolutely. You know, I agree with you that the EU and the UK is starstruck with Zelensky. I think there's no doubt about it. I think Stammer's starstruck. with Zelensky. No doubt, Macron, former theater guy, probably looks at Zelensky and looks at him in awe. Trudeau was absolutely obsessed with Zelensky, Annalina Berbach. I think all of the Europeans are absolutely just obsessed with this man who was a one-time actor-comedian and is now president and is now Churchill and all of these things. This, I completely agree with you. I think with the

U.S., the propping up of Zelensky, which has caused Trump to backtrack, And it has made Trump look very, it's not the art of the deal. It's not, Trump does not look like the dominant art of the deal guy when he's when he's with Zelensky. That's for sure. At least after the White House argument, it's been all walking back since that White House argument. But I think with the U.S., a lot of it has to do with the grift that is Ukraine. I think the support from the Senate, I think the support from the neocons inside of the White House. not so much that they're starstruck with Zelensky.

I think for them, it's the grift that is Project Ukraine. I think that takes us to the minerals deal, because the minerals deal is absolutely a grift. We've got one document which was signed. That's what they tell us. It was released by Ukrainian officials, this document, which really doesn't tell us much. The main document, they say there are three documents, but it's clear when you read the document that was published, that the main document is the LP agreement, the limited partnership agreement. That has not been released. We're still waiting for that document to be released.

Will it be released? I don't know, but Zelensky is now saying that if the parliament, the Ukraine parliament, does not sign off on this minerals deal agreement, and we'll call it a minerals deal agreement, that's not what it is. It's an investment fund agreement. if the parliament members do not sign off on this, then he demands that the United States, listen to what does guy say? He demands the United States revoke visa access to parliament officials who vote down this minerals deal. So he's making demands of the United States there, Zelensky, and Bolden and then Bolden Zelensky.

But obviously, there's a reason why they want to keep the money in Ukraine for 10 years, at least that's what Ukrainian officials are saying as part of this deal. They want that money in Ukraine. They want to keep it there. They don't want transparency. They don't want audits. I think there's definitely some stuff going on here with this minerals deal, this investment fund deal. That's what we're talking about, investment fund deal.

And the $300 million and the $50 million, you know, that's just money going into this fund. Ukraine's going to put money in this fund that they get from the revenue of the sale of oil and gas. That's what they're saying. But at the end of the day, this money is going to sit in Ukraine for 10 years. And we're going to probably forget about it in two, three years. And who knows who's going to how this money is going to get distributed. It is the only explanation of what this thing is, because nothing else about it makes any kind of sense. Now, you know, I am somebody who has drawn up agreements.

I've drawn up massive legal agreements. I looked at this thing, this text, and it gave me a headache. I mean, usually I actually enjoy working through contracts of this kind. This one, it just doesn't make any kind of sense. You have some kind of fund. It's not at all clear how it works. It's not clear who runs it. It's not clear who the shareholders are.

It's all over the place. But each side is going to put money into this fund. The Ukrainians are going to put money from something that's being developed, but it's not even clear what it is. The Americans are going to put money in, except, again, we don't really know where that's coming from, or even how much money the Americans are supposed to be putting. And it could be far more than people think, actually.

I mean, people assume that, the American share is limited in some way or capped in some way, which I don't really see that that is what the agreement says at all. It says that... Not in the agreement that was published. No, not in the agreement. Maybe it's in the LP agreement. Exactly.

Exactly. There is a provision that people are homing in on, which is in Article 6, which says that any military aid provided to Ukraine by the United States in future will be... treated as part of America's contributions to the fund. And many people are seeing that as basically saying that the United States, seeing this as a mechanism for the United States to provide weapons to Ukraine and future on credit. Well, it could work in that way. It's a very, very strange way of doing it. And if I have to be honest, that doesn't seem to me to be what the investment fund is all about because in that case, all the money that's going into the fund is Ukrainian and not really

American because American military aid presumably won't come in the form of money. Presumably, I mean, I don't know. But as you absolutely rightly said, the key document is not this document at all. It's the limited partnership agreement, which is referenced many times throughout this agreement. and the text of which is being held back. We don't even know whether it's been signed. Now, the Ukrainians say that it hasn't. The Americans sort of say that it has.

I think more likely than not, it has been signed. To be honest, this looks to me like Afghanistan all over again or Ukraine as it was before all over again. you set up this vehicle, or rather, if you don't call it a vehicle, actually, call it more an account an account into which you put money, endless sums of money. It's like one of these offshore accounts we all hear about, only this one happens to be located in Ukraine. In Ukraine.

In Ukraine. In Ukraine. Which, which, you know, Mike Waltz, before he was sacks. said was one of the most corrupt countries in the world, which is true as it happens. Anyway, you have an offshore fund, an offshore account in Ukraine, basically operated for the United States. William, I said the United States, maybe not the United States, but for some people in the United States.

And for some people in Ukraine, the money just gets poured in. As you rightly say, it's retained in Ukraine for 10 years. The agreement doesn't say it's retained. The text of the agreement that we've seen doesn't say it's retained in Ukraine for 10 years, but it looks as if that is the intention. Well, the economy, I believe she's the economy minister. She said it. She said it.

She said it. She said it's going to be there for 10 years. So it's going to be all that is going to be pouring in. So money from Ukraine itself, all these assets and natural resources, natural gas exports, coal exports, whatever exports. Ukraine has and steel exports, crane exports, the money will presumably go into Ukraine. I say that because, you know, we don't really have a clear picture of what resources are covered by this fund. But money goes in to this account. Money from the United States

goes into this account. You pretend that this is all done in order to develop the Ukrainian economy. But again, it's completely unclear how or what the mechanisms for that is. Everybody, I think, could see that Ukraine is going to go down anyway. So you put money into this offshore account in Ukraine. Ukraine falls. You move on and reopen the account somewhere else because the money goes in and it will go straight out again. That is exactly what's going to happen. It's exactly the story that we've seen time and again play out in one place after another, in Afghanistan, in all sorts of other places that the United States has been involved in. But it just keeps the flow of money going.

That's all that it's doing. It's not, I mean, it's referred to by many people as a mineral rights extraction deal. Donald Trump appears to think it is a mineral rights extraction deal. He's still talking about it as if it was the agreement that he first floated. several months ago. Well, that is not what the text of this agreement actually, the text that we have seen actually points to. The text points to something completely different. As I said, essentially an offshore account located in Ukraine, one to which U.S. taxpayers are expected to contribute to. He needs to distance himself from this. Yeah, if I was advising Trump, I would, I would tell

him shut this thing down. Tear it up, shut it down, distance yourself from this. Because you mentioned Afghanistan, we saw what happened in Afghanistan. We saw what happened with the funds in Afghanistan, with the money that poured into Afghanistan. And we also saw the military result in Afghanistan. This is exactly the direction that Ukraine is heading towards much faster. There's not going to be a 10 or 20-year thing. There's going to be a one or two-year thing.

and it's all going to fall on Trump. Exactly. $3 trillion was Afghanistan. It's all going to get that far. But anyway, you're absolutely right. I mean, it's the same mechanism that has been created all over again. And we come back to your point, the point that you just made a moment ago. This is really why there's all this support in Congress.

There's all this fight back within the bureaucracy. on the part of the neocons because of course this keeps the grift going and it's been going for years since before 2014 but it really got going in a big way

after the Maidunku in 2014 and it keeps going now so all the money still goes into this fund and it goes straight out again I mean one of the most extraordinary things about all those three trillion dollars that were poured into Afghanistan is that the results are invisible.

There's almost nothing there that was, I mean, there wasn't, any railways created, any roadways created, any real new airports, nothing. I mean, the money just went in and it went straight out again. And that's exactly what's going to happen with this. Yeah, that's why I'm saying, and we've got to see that limited partnership agreement, but I'm assuming going off of what the Ukraine minister, what she said in that post, I'm assuming that she's seen the documents, obviously, and that the money's going to stay in Ukraine for 10 years.

That's what she said. For 10 years, the money is going to remain in Ukraine. And my thinking on all of this, I don't know, maybe Griff is too strong a word. I don't know. I think it is far too weak. Okay, but I'm thinking on all of this, I think in a very irrational way, I guess, is if it was in the U.S., then people would most likely audit it. They would most likely take a look at the spending, the money going in. I imagine there would be committee set up in government to look at the funds.

I would imagine. I mean, you know, I'm sure I'm going to get pushed back on that as well, given all the government waste. But still, if it was in the U.S., the chances are better that the money would at least be looked at. Absolutely. I mean, money like this sitting in Ukraine for however many years is just, it's a recipe for disaster. Absolutely, of course it is. I absolutely share your points about, you know, your points about, you know, the fact that things in the United States are not as good as one would like. to believe that they are. But, you know, there are accountancy institutions of the United States.

There are still courts that work sometimes. There are regulatory bodies. There is congressional oversight. None of that exists in Ukraine. That's the whole point about setting up offshore accounts. The fact that you don't have to declare accounts or have any of these regulatory instruments that apply to normal accounts in other places. So, of course, you set it up in Ukraine. Because, of course, there is no possibility. There is no mechanism in Ukraine for regulating these things in that kind of way. Because as we all know, Ukraine doesn't have a legal system in any sense that is understood in other places. It's just a corrupt system, as the Americans themselves say.

And that's the reason why Zelensky wants this site. Of course it is. That's why he was so panicked and urgent to get this side, get this to the Parliament. Absolutely. I mean, you can understand something, something. If you are asking a parliament to ratify an agreement of which nine-tenths of the agreement have not even been provided to the parliament, and then you are threatening the MPs, getting your big brother in the United States to threaten the MPs that if they don't decide this,

you know, ratify this agreement, they'll be all held to pay for them. that already should tell you what this really is. I mean, the whole thing has a godfather look about it. And it is, that's exactly what it is. You know, you're going to vote for this. Otherwise, you know, you're going to take its sight unseen because, you know, if you don't, then all sorts of bad things will happen to you. I've got my big friend across the, you know, across the ocean who's going to come around

and has been knocking on your door. And maybe you won't get your cut anyway. So this is, this tells you what this whole thing is really all about. Now, of course, the absurdity of it and one shouldn't, well, I say absurdity. One should, this isn't funny what I'm going to say. But Donald Trump came along, said, the United States has given all this money to Ukraine. We need to get it back. This is what, you know, the whole mineral rights extraction deal is all about.

It's about the American people getting back their money. What he's ended up with is a mechanism that will lose the American people. Far more money, probably, if it ever really gets going, than has been the case up to now. So we've ended up at the extreme opposite end of the position that Trump assumed, said he would take this, and which as far as I can see from his public statements, he still believes that it has gone. I wonder whether he's even read this thing. I wonder who exactly drafted it, whether he supervised it properly. I mean, I presume it was drawn up by people in the treasury. But, I mean, they've completely reworked this, and it's ended up with something completely different

from what I think, well, from what he said, it would be when he floated this whole thing in the first place. This whole thing is trouble. It's all trouble. I would distance yourself from this thing. I don't know. We need to see that LP agreement. Well, absolutely. I doubt we'll ever see it.

Maybe we will. Maybe we will. Okay. You know, I have to say we should see it. And it'll be very interesting when we do see it. But will it ultimately make any difference? Because whatever the agreements that you make are, the fact is that you set up an investment funds in Ukraine.

And overseas account in Ukraine. At the end of the day, I mean, whatever rules are drawn up, whatever regulations are created, who's going to enforce them in Ukraine? So just to wrap up the video, it's chaotic. It's chaotic. The Trump administration with regards to Ukraine. with regards to Russia. There's no plan. There's no direction. It's just being made up. Every couple of days, they're just making things up. And it's not only Trump making things up. It seems like there's

four or five different factions that are pulling in all kinds of different directions. Absolutely. Exactly. And of course, you're absolutely correct. And the president himself, Donald Trump, is completely at sea. And to repeat again, there is no plan. here. This is not about some clever plan to fool the Russians into a freeze, as some people are saying. If that kind of plan existed, the United States would be going about it in a completely different way. So there is no plan here. It is chaos. It is muddle. There are different factions. I mean, we haven't spoken about the other side, but I mean, within the United States, there are, there is a group of people who have absolutely figured out.

what Vladimir Zelensky is all about and who clearly are very, very angry about this whole thing. I mean, Marjorie Taylor Green is hopping mad. I mean, she's published a tweet in which she says so. What on earth is this? Sean Davis, who is the CEO of the Federalist, which is absolute, you know, MAGA magazine, very good magazine, incidentally,

just to say, very interesting magazine. He is furious about this. He's been on Fox. He's been talking about this. there are people within the administration who are seen through this. Obviously, I don't know this for a fact, but I'm pretty sure that J.D. Vance, who clearly doesn't like Zelensky, I'm pretty sure that he's seen through this. I'm sure that there are other people also. Maybe Tulsi Gabbard, maybe others, Donald Trump Jr., people of that kind.

So there is another group of people in Washington who can see perfectly well, the driven. that things have been following over the last two weeks. But there is no consensus within the administration on the way forward. So you have one group pulling in one direction, another group pulling in a different direction. There's an anxiety, urgent anxiety by people in Washington, and in Ukraine to keep the money going. For Zeletsky, by the way, that's probably the most important thing of all. Keeping the money going is for him the most important.

Because not only does that bind the Ukrainian elite to him, but of course he probably personally benefits from it too. So, you know, you could see how all of this is playing out. And Trump himself, I think, to me he seems lost. He talks one week about how mediation is called off. The next day, he talks about, you know, we're actually making real progress and we want to meet Putin in Saudi Arabia and all of that. It's chaos.

You know, just the final note, it makes Trump look exactly the opposite of how he puts himself, how he markets himself. He's not looking like he's in charge. charge. He's not looking like he's decisive. He's not looking like he's, he's the chief executive. It looks the exact opposite. Exactly. Dare I say, it looks very Biden-esque. Yeah. Exactly. Yes. Instead of making decisions, he just seems to be just a drift.

Yes. That's exactly what's happened. And I wonder whether he understands. that, whether he sees that himself. I don't think he does. No, I don't think he does. I don't think he does. Because if he did see it, he would make one, there's only one right decision to make. There's only one right decision to make to walk away. Exactly.

That is the only right decision to make at this point. Exactly. And he would have the backing if he's electoral constituency. It would not come at the political cost that many people think it would. Quite the opposite. Quite the opposite. This way, he's heading into trouble. Yes.

Into big trouble with this. Yes. Yeah, and it's bogging him down. Just another final note. It's bogging him down from handling everything else. Correct. Which is exactly what we warned would happen when back in the summer of last year, we on this channel were the first people to say that he should not get himself involved

in negotiations about Ukraine. He should simply walk away on the first day that he became president. Dastrously, he didn't follow that advice. He probably didn't even hear that advice, but the result is that we are where we are. All right. We'll end the video there. The durand. Dot locals.com. We are on Rumble Odyssey, picture, Telegraph. For the next. Go to the Durant Shop, pick up some merch, like what we are wearing in this video update today. Link is in the description box down below. Take care.