The Ebro, Laura, Rosenberg Show - 185.) Hasan Piker & The Democratic Candidate Debate + Nolan Wells Update (9/23/26)

Episode Date: September 23, 2026

Today on Ebro, Laura, and Rosenberg - the team discusses Netanyahu’s wrestling promo about Mamdani, Ms Rachel being called an antisemite, Jews For Jesus billboard, Does Hasan Piker need to change?, Kevin Ortega-Rojas Debates Piker, Nolan Wells Update and so much more! (9/23/26) Hear more of today's show on Patreon: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.patreon.com/c/ELRShow Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Just don't call in a podcast. The Ebro-Lora Rosenberg Show. Yo, Ebro-Lora Rosenberg show. Thank you, Rassan. Hello. Thank you very much. Good morning. You'll shout to Mendez in the building, King Lou, and producer Griff.

You got Ebro-Lora Rosenberg. About to hit you with a nice, solid hour of the goings-ons, and our feelings about said. things. That's what we do every day here at the ELR show. We come on 8 a.m. We got the UN General Assembly cracking down around the city. We got protests.

We got Netanyahu doing some sort of wrestling promo. That's how I described. That's what I thought. I was like this is a terrible wrestling promo. I'm going to see you tonight at Raw, brother. What was that? I've never seen a teaser drop for a UN speech.

And I'm going to tell the truth about you. Do we have it? This sucks. bro. It's a terrible wrestler. You have it or not? Yeah, we got Nanyahu with his promo. Bro. I think we had it. No, we do, we do.

When I saw it, I was... Shame on you, Mr. Mamdani. Shame on you for supporting the Hamas terrorist monsters who butcher their people. Shame on you for inciting riots. When did he do that? I'm coming to the UN. I'm going to tell the truth about our heroic soldiers.

And I'm going to tell the truth about you. What truth? The truth about him. What truth? Well, I think we'll play Mom Donnie's response, but that was just, well, you're just going to lie? What riots against Jews in New York? You don't remember the famous riots of 2026? I think we would remember.

I remember the random crazy people going down to Gracie Mansion and protesting him for no reason. Protesting Mom Donnie. Yes. And yelling all those Islamophobic. That's all I remember. horrific words and do you remember

Mamdani supporting Hamas no no I definitively don't remember him supporting Hamas either in fact I'm pretty sure he said bad things about Hamas I'm pretty sure like you just literally

that's what I said I reposted it and I was like you really just think American Jews are stupid like he just thinks people are really stupid and I guess some people are But maybe that's not for American Jews maybe that's for people in Israel yeah because

if they got a election about that. And if they're spreading enough made up propaganda about Mamdani in Israel, right, then he looks like, which he's doing. Right. So he can spread the propaganda about Mom Dony and then be like, look, I'm there and I'm standing up to Mom Donnie. That's right. So yeah, maybe you're right. Maybe he's not playing and I think it's a little bit of both because you know they've done a good job, you know, tricking certain people into believing that Maumdani is somehow anti-Semitic, anti-this. Yo, I, people think Miss Rachel hates Israel.

Well, it hates Israeli people. And Israel. I'm pretty confident she doesn't love Israel and I would understand why. I mean, I just think she's critical of the Israeli government. Yeah, yeah, sure, sure. I mean, but that's why I put it that way. But like if we critique America, we don't hate America. Yeah, like, why do I?

Why? And that's what I'm saying. Like, why can't we do this? Like normal people. We keep saying this over and over again. You literally need a therapist. We need a therapist to talk to. Yeah.

this isn't it's I'm not like saying people aren't no I this was my this morning I'm arguing with a friend of all of us who we all all love great person unquestioning she's not saying nasty things she just keeps sending me back arguments that I'm not making so so so like for example so I'm you know she saw the interview in Rolling Stone she's asking me questions and I'm like yeah I just feel like swindy so then she just sends me stuff about like you know Jews history and in Israel and different stuff like that and I'm like I'm not arguing that I think and then I think part of it is people are getting fed though on the algorithm what insights them the most of course so she's seeing extremist stuff about like you know Jews have no place in Israel and Ashkenazi Jews

have no place anywhere and you're just blah blah blah and so she's sending me her responses to arguments I'm not making I said no reasonable person is saying the Jews should get up and leave Israel. No, I have never heard a serious person. Serious keyword. Keyword. And I'm sure right now in our comments there are people. Yeah.

Serious people don't expect people who run the country who are there to be like, hey guys, we realize the air of our ways. We're going to walk the other direction and leave the few million people. No one's saying that, bro. Stop. We're just saying, govern better, equal rights, one state solution, where everyone's treated fairly. Do what America does,

which by the way, I don't think it's that high a bar. Just try to do what America is. And America does a bad job. And we're doing a pretty bad job. Well, which brings me to... But then she keeps sending me back arguments. And I'm like, I'm not...

Nobody's even talking about that. But also, too, the only thing I can relate it to is obviously my experience is being a mixed black American. Where there are unsurious people that would tell me I'm not black. And I've met other mixed... you know, people will be like, well, you know, black people. I'm like, what black people? Because serious black people, educated black people in your family,

people who understand what race actually is, would tell you as a mixed person you're black. So you have to like, and to your point of like serious people saying things, sometimes people do struggle with who actually. Well, even more now than ever, because they're getting it fed to them. Right. So she's obviously, I believe, seeing things where like extremist people, are being, you know, and I used to see some of that stuff too, like stuff that would make me feel

defensive where it's like basically Israeli people are all bad, have no place anywhere, are, I'm like, bro, that's not what, again, real humans that I know are simply saying stop killing innocent people. Yeah. And kids and journalists and people trying to help. And, and so you're, you're coming back to me with other arguments. It's not the argument. I was just like, I said to her, I woke up this morning to an argument. She said, sent to me and I was like hey I don't really understand what you're responding to I'm not questioning why we would feel a connection there I'm not doing that that's just not really where my argument goes I don't know enough history about it and frankly if we're being real in terms of geopolitics it's

kind of irrelevant at this point everyone always wants to get into some thousand years ago I'm like bro we are here right now how are you going to make it work the people that are in power need to do the best by everybody. Don't tell me how bad Hamas is. That's who you want to be compared to? Well, look at Hamas. Oh, so cool, act like Hamas then. Would that be the argument for the U.S. Post-9-11?

I guess for some people it was. Well, look at Al-Qaeda. I guess we should do what Al-Qaeda does. But that was what people thought. And by the way, we... And how'd that work out for you? So anyways, yeah, people make these... The argument's moving around right now

about a lot of things. You just realize they're arguing. with bots they're arguing with but that's why I bring up the miss Rachel thing like somebody oh right miss Rachel being a great example I've only seen her post like please stops killing children yes like I'm seeing all these children and I know people who like literally are out on Miss Rachel and I asked somebody yesterday like and they were like well she doesn't like Israel and I was like well when did she say that where and what is that from because she's saying please stop killing people please stop killing children like yes specifically children yeah specifically children

That's which is her cause, which is, by the way, she was down in the border here. Yes. Fighting for kids' rights in America. Yes. Trying to get them out of cages. Yes. This is what she does. And does that mean she hates America?

Do you think that if there was an ongoing, do you think right now if there was an ongoing attack on Israeli children, you think she wouldn't be saying, please stop doing that? And by the way, she did speak out of the children that were murdered during October 7th. She also spoke about that. Right. Of course she did. but like that wasn't an ongoing thing. And like when she's been doing this, it's been an ongoing thing

that she's fighting against. Well, also it's ongoing. That's what I mean. Like what there's also speaking on behalf of detained children who have been detained by ICE. Yes. And she's also speaking on behalf of kids in Sudan and the Congo and other things.

But once again, that people throw that by the wayside because and people, you, I think you, somebody said on the show the other day, it's like, why is everybody, or somebody said to you, why is everybody always talking about, Israel. Well, because people bring up other things for sure, but nothing gets the algorithm going like when you talk about Israel. Yeah, that too. Well, because let me explain. I do have these feelings

that hit still every once in a while. On my way here, you know, I'm only allowed 10 openings of Instagram per day. Take one in the morning. I took an Uber here today, so in the morning, I'm trying to see what's going on. And I get fed a Theo Vaughn video of Theo Vaughn talking pretty seems like this week about Israel. And when you see Theo Vaughan, you know, who has sat with some of the people he sat with and sort of made comments on some of the things he's made comments on being...

You mean like sitting with Trump or what do you mean? Yeah, and... Being pretty supportive of MAGA and... He's not supportive, but he's a legitimizer. He's a justify, like, you know, by having like, bigots on his show and platforming bigots, yeah, I feel the way about that, right?

Did he have Trump? I don't think he had Trump, but a bunch of different people. But endorsed him, I think. When he was there hanging out with him for sure. But even beyond that, he's had like more roguy kind of people. I don't think he had like Fuentes,

but I remember he had that one comment where he said something about respecting Nick Fuentes' honesty or something like that. So when you see someone who said stuff like that, you know, and respectfully Theo Vonn, And I'm not saying I'd ever laugh at Theo Von Clips. I do.

I think he is funny. I've laughed at Clips of his before for sure. But, you know, when he looks like someone who might be chasing you yelling, shut up, Jew boy and throwing rocks at your back, and you've seen him hang out with these people. And the one political issue he's obsessed with is that, it strikes a court. It does strike. And he's like, this is the worst thing we've ever seen, blah, blah, blah, blah. And you're like, well, it's not. No, it is.

But then you're like, no, he said specifically it's the worst thing we've ever seen on our phones. and he's right. Of this era, these other things that we're talking about, to your point about what the algorithms feed. This is what everyone's seeing. And this is what's being paid for by the U.S. government.

So what I'm trying to say is I understand why other people have a moment of being triggered about like, oh, is this about something else? But like it's not. Maybe it is with Tucker Carlson. Maybe it is with Candace Owens. It was like the converses that the other day.

Once again, I'm putting this through a filter I can relate to. Black people were triggered by that. Right. It wasn't what the answer. was about we never saw the rest of the ad and then there's people on the algorithm right now going see see you make everything about race it's like i don't think we made everything about race i don't think that's how this played out i think we're responding to a world that has made everything about our appearance and how we show up and present in society as melanated peoples and so and people have

been killed because of that and there's been a lot of well that's the jewish thing too right we have a real history that throughout time every like 80 years people are like these Jews man you ever notice out things in this town feels like it's not going the right way Jews are doing all right though like that is a real thing with history based in family members who are pictures on your wall that are dead yeah so that but that doesn't make your argument right no which is why people were people were wrong about the conference at exactly but were they but were they why was the picture looked like that i know i'm like worthy but were they but that specific photo that they chose to push out yes it sure looks like it was based on the ad i saw it looked yes it looks like they were but our

experiences inform us that's right we're having what i'm trying to say is and i know people believe i'm trying to be like overly gentle i i believe there are a lot of people who can still be won over to seeing what's happening here. I really do. And I think it does not help to tell them your feelings are completely invalid. Just understand how bad the Israeli government is, and that's it. Well, so I made the comp. It requires a little more work than that.

When I had the conversation about Ms. Rachel yesterday, I made the comp to the Hassan Minaj thing we talked about. Okay. Where it was basically like, look, you know, as an American born person, looking at the place that your parents are from or your heritage is from and you're making a critique of the government or a critique of society, societal structure, whatever. In America, people get defensive. Like, why are you talking about India? You're not supposed to be talking like that. Yeah. Why are you talking about Israel? You shouldn't be saying it. Why are you talking about this place? Shouldn't be

saying it. Well, and you're used to a whole, remember, guys, I used to believe when this whole thing started, and I told you this, and I still stand on this. When five years ago, people would throw on Zionists loosely, it was coded anti-Jutalk. It was. I knew the people saying it, and a lot of it was coded that. But things changed over time. We had combos and you were like,

bro, nobody's really a Zion. Like, what do you mean Zionist? And I'll be like, no, bro, I'm telling you, there's people moving that are like really trying to bring back this movement of like, and you're like, what? I'm like, I'm telling you, man, it's getting crazy. When I was seeing getting thrown loosely at me on the internet,

it was being used as just an anti-Semitic word. Yeah. And that can be true, too. But again, that's one specific thing. It requires holding multiple thoughts, guys. I had an incident with somebody that I care about, too, who happens to be an older Jewish woman that I have loved for. She saw a photo of us interviewing the mayor. She's like, oh, he's anti-Semitic.

And I said, I was like, why do you feel that way? Like, oh, he's just anti-Semitic. And I was like, well, I just, I said, I am not Jewish and I am not Muslim. I was like, but I feel like criticizing the Israeli government for what they're doing is not necessarily criticizing Jewish people. Good for you. And she looked at me and she said, I'm Jewish. I see things differently. Like that was her shutdown to me.

And I waited. I was like, are we going to continue talking? She wrapped it up and walked away. And I was just kind of, I thought we were going to be able to have a better conversation about it. But she chose not to. And that's where she stopped. And, you know, I left it along. A lot of people do that.

A lot of people do that. They're like, hey, you don't understand. It's like, but you just give me information. I just want the information. Yeah. How? You know, like, I know there, you know, how is this? People need to be pushed in these moments.

It's not easy. It's not comfortable. But guess what? Guess what informs all of my beliefs in being the ally and being on the side, always of the underdog. It is my Jewish values I was raised with that is literally like, this is who we stand with. You can't that have a blind spot for yourself.

That's not how this works. Like, not for me. But people have it. No, that same way people assume just because you're white and you present as white but you're Jewish, that you know, you're racist.

Yeah. And there's no convincing them that Rosenberg, no matter what you do, you're racist. Well, you have to remember, I truly believe that every group is equally shitty. It's just about who's wearing the power structure. because if another group ends up and they're in the spot,

they're going to do what human beings do. Be shitty to other humans. I really truly believe that up and down. I've seen it. I've seen it too much to know that like no one has gotten particularly good. But the Jews are in an interesting spot, right? Because we're this minority group, but we also are in a different place in the power structure.

So it's very complex in that way. You can feel like a minority group who's under threat, but you also have these immensely powerful Jewish people who in my opinion, and for a lot of us regular sort of nine to five middle class Jews put us in a really awkward hard situation because I can't even identify with that experience at all. By the way, on a funny note,

I feel like this is the kind of joke that I'd rather tell in a Jewish room, but for you guys, you too, I would tell it to all day. Our audience, I don't know, hopefully y'all love us enough to understand why it's funny. Have you ever seen the curb when Larry, there's a curb when Larry's in New York that one season and he meets this little boy who's gay. Like the kid's like clearly gay.

You know the episode? The kid's like, oh my God. He's like seven and like really gay. And that's another storyline is Larry gets him a gift that the mother's like, why did you? Oh yeah, I remember that episode. It's a single mom with two sons, right? Just the kid.

Just the kid. And he gives her, what's the gift again? It's a sewing machine. It's a sewing machine. He's like, why did you give my son a sewing kid? And he's like, he loves it. I mean, he's gay. And she's like, what?

And that's the lady, he was trying to date, right? Yeah. Yes. So in that episode, he says to the little boy, the little boy is drawing a swastika. And Larry's like, oh, no, no, you can't do that. And he's like, why? This is such a cool symbol. Why can't I draw this?

And Larry's like, that's a swastika. It's a Hitler sign. And he's like, who's Hitler? And he was like, Hitler was a bad, was a really bad guy. He hated the Jews. And the little boy goes, well, why do he hate the Jews? and Larry goes, because they're a bit much.

Again, that is a joke for us to make. But sometimes I'm like, man, we are, we're a bit much, we're a bit much. It's a lot. You know what I don't need? I don't need to drive through New Jersey and see the billboard, courtesy of Jews for Jesus that just says Jews.org.

Oh, my God, I'm seeing those pop up all over the place. I was like, wait. Oh, that's new. Why, because Jews are a bit much? That's a bit much. And it's not us. That's not even, I went to it. It's Jews for Jesus.

Jews for Jesus. Wait, why is it not us? You could come, you know, not us. I don't, I'm not going to make some huge declaration. I don't know where the line is drawn. But when I hear people go, yo, yo, being Jewish is great. You know what's even better? Believing in Jesus.

I'm not saying you're wrong. Jesus is a great guy. But it's sort of like a line in the sand, not particularly Jewish for most Jews. But maybe they're not saying he's the Messiah. He's just a great guy. What's their movement? No, I think you. What's their movement?

I believe. Because that's the discrepancy, right? The real discrepancy is Messiah or not. Right? No man, listen. That's the only discrepancy. It wasn't that he was a cool, wasn't a cool dude. It wasn't none of that.

It was Messiah or not. Well, listen, I saw it the other day while I was on the phone with my dad. My dad said, let me look it up right now. And he's like, reading it. And he's like, blah, blah, blah, blah. And he's like, yeah, it's juice for Jesus. And then he's like, ah, let me not read this too much right now. The kind of mood I'm in, I might sign up.

Yeah. By the way, my dad also wanted to amend my wife. wanted to amend my what I said about him and um Hassan Piker which is oh okay he was saying basically he feels about Hassan Piker is that regardless of him being a streamer his his he is incredibly powerful and it's not that he needs to shut the F up is that my dad believes he is the type of um I mean you we've had this kind of debate a lot or a conversation a lot he's the kind of person on the left who spends a little bit too much time yelling this is an example you're focused a little too much on genocide Joe and not enough on there's a Nazi

in the White House named Stephen Miller. It's the focus being too hard at the Democrats as we gear up to election season, not focusing on the right. I thought about that with your dad. But we said it yesterday. It's your dad. First of all, Hassan is a streamer. He's a rabble rouser. And he wants to

point out while the Democrats are full of shit. That's what he really wants to point out. This isn't the top. But that's line up. It's line up to get the job done. But he's not a politician. But but then what are you for? Do you do you see the current administration as an existential threat or not? Right, but for his, for Hassan Piker, that's not a good enough, he's of the ilk.

That's not a good enough platform for the Democrats to just be like, these guys are bad, elect us. He's saying the whole conversation is, guys, stand for more than that, be more than that. And I think have actual policies that are actually what the people want, not just, But there are a bunch that are like that. But see, this is what Kamala got caught up in. This is why people ran with the, oh, what did she stand floor? Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

That narrative started because it was so much of the, hey, they're bad, don't trust them, just vote for us. I disagree with that because I heard her talk about policy. But that's exactly right. But the narrative shaping got people trying to line up just to line up allowed the narrative to be shaped as it'll just be more of Joe Biden. and they're claiming, because I don't even believe the election was actually, I don't think the results. I don't believe the results. How could you say that? I guess I don't.

But they are, I don't believe the results in 2000 either with dangling Chad. So there's multiple times where I was like, but that's the Hassan Piker ilk. They are of the progressive ilk that we need to talk about the stuff, not just line up because. But doesn't this go back to what we always say is wrong with the Democrats? Well, they never line up. Put out the extreme right, the extreme right, they may not like it either, but guess what? They line up to them. I'm letting everyone know that's not who Hassan Piker is or will be or you should expect them to be.

But some of that and what I'm saying is while on some level I respect it, on another level I think it's selfish. I think it's about your brand building and where you feel you need to be. I think that's valid. I think that's valid too, but again, he's not a politician. I know, but he has to understand the power. He wanted this power. He has this power. Well, I don't know.

We're gearing into the most important election. I think, no, I don't know. From just my observing, he was doing him and got a big following. Well, but then he just. And people started to come to him because of. On a specific media run, we had him on a he chose, I'm going to New York and going on a media run. Yes. Like he went on a run.

So he's going for it too. This is not just happenstance. Well, no, I mean as far as people asking him to campaign with him. Yes. Like for him, them being like, yes, come out with me in my state and bring people. That was them asking him. For sure. Or him saying, hey, I like this candidate and I like their policies, them connecting

and then him going out because he was like these people actually have things that are aligned with Hassan's interests. like that was him helping them because he has a large following. I think there will, listen, there will be this issue in the Democrats because just like we talked about yesterday, you want people to line up, moderates want people to line up. I'm not saying support people you don't like by. No, no, no. Democratic establishment wants people to just line up, all of these things. But we also want the perfect candidate.

There's all of these things that on the left is. Like if you don't check this box, check this. You know what I mean? Whereas on the side where you have people who literally don't have shame. No, it's a line up for anything. We're going to line up for anything. So that comes with something. When you have people who are principled, it comes with something.

But we also, there's being principled and there's being smart. You know what I'm saying? Like, there's not, I'm not saying be irresponsible, but spending your time focused on how much you like Tala Rico and how much you like Al-Sayette. and how much you like these people who are really important right now and can flip super important seats rather than maybe focusing on other things you don't love. I just mean for six weeks.

It's not that I disagree with you. I'm just saying that there will be people who get what you're saying and there will be people who aren't willing to do it. And they want to fight for a better day and that better day may come after a bunch of bad days like the ones we're having now where there were definitely people who were like,

look, so by it's terrible. But we can't get worse. You've been saying that. And it keeps getting worse. No, but it can't. But I think it can't. By the way, I think it can't. Yeah, but we're coming up to the line of can't come back once it gets much worse.

Like we're going with AI. No, no, no, there's still much. Do you guys want to play? No, I mean the coming back. Respondani responding to Netanyahu? Yeah, it's quick. Mondani's response is really quick, wasn't it? It was just like, yeah, you're criminal.

We all know that what the prime minister has said in that video is not true. Shame on you, Mr. Mandani. Shame on you for supporting the Hamas terrorist, monsters who butchered our people. Shame on you for inciting riots against New York Jews. I'm coming to the UN. I'm going to tell the truth about our heroic soldiers, and I'm going to tell the truth about you.

All right, Michael. What we do know to actually be the truth when it comes to the Prime Minister is that he is the subject of an international criminal court arrest warrant for alleged war crimes and crimes against humanity, and as the Prime Minister, he is the architect of a horrific genocide against Palestinians. Yeah, it was his response to what he's been saying, which is just the truth. Yes, Griff. You got phone, call. Stephanie.

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Good morning. Long-time listener. What's up, Steph? I love you guys. I actually do agree with Rosenberg. I think that Assam Hiker, we were expecting him to be the Rogan for. the Democrats, right? I think that he took up that mantle. He took it up

to be the common guy to to talk to, to have the common language, to speak the way Rogan spoke to the white trash. You know what I'm trying to say. To speak to the folks that have no teeth. To speak to the folks that are the lower

base that love that love Trump. Stephanie, your candor is discrediting your Yeah, this is why, this is what people think of people on the left, by the way. This is how progressives talk about everybody else. But keep going with your overall point about what they expect to be. I think Rogan talks to more people than the teethless.

He has like 10 million regular listeners, but go ahead. But keep going. The bottom line is, the bottom line is the Democrats don't have a way of speaking to the folks that Trump says vote for him. Trump says that he loves uneducated people. Trump says those are the people that vote for him. Democrats go out and Democrats, for some reason, everyone thinks that they only appeal to the elite, right? Piker was pretty much appealing to everyone, right?

And then he switched it up and is now being in the middle, talking to this one, not that one, but not so much. No, the Democrats need someone that's going to go out there and speak to everyone. Speak to a person that has no teeth. Speak to the one that has education, no education. Listen, Stephanie, with the dental talk. Thank you, Stephanie. Appreciate you, Stephanie, for calling and listening. If you were expecting, I just had no expectation that Piker was that person.

That's all I'm saying. He doesn't speak to regular people. I can barely understand what he's talking about. I'm sorry, he doesn't speak to regular people. Who's at, Hassan? Yes. Have you tried to really listen to his conversations? He's a very highfalutant do. He isn't speaking to everybody.

It ain't Rogan. It's not that. No, he's not every, you know. But also, if that was the narrative that was shaped around Hassan Piker and that's how Stephanie received, I got news for you guys. Like, no. Congratulations. You plagued yourself.

And I like, I still like what he does. I think it's a necessary conversation. I just think that, you know, if you're looking for someone who's going to be this, like, Democratic talking head unifier, not the guy. That's all I'm saying. Yeah. And by the way, and I see P. I got a lot of hate in the comments here because you guys are a bunch of fucking sheep and

don't like that I don't say it the exact same way you do and I don't line up exactly like you do because that's how we're going to get things done. No, bro, I've been doing this longer than you. I've been watching these elections longer than you. I'm not saying Hassan needs to change who he is. That's not what I'm saying at all. I'm saying at this moment in time, what is your point? priority. For the next month,

what are you focusing on? That's all. And I think the focus should be, maybe he is. Guys, I don't watch 12 hours of streaming a day. And really not that many people do. So what are we getting? Soundbites that make it out of the streams. Let's focus on getting, on flipping the seats we need to flip.

Well, and I think for the individual watching right now is really, you can't vote for Tallinniko. There's nothing. You Roan. And probably most of the people in this chat, y'all can't vote for Tala Rico

if you're going to share something about Tala Rico we can't vote for LSAA. No, we can't. You can't vote for these people. No. It's not our election.

And so to argue over those things as if we can is also a waste of energy. I think most people right now you should be focused on your local elections. If you're,

if you love what the DSA is doing, there's tons of DSA candidates, mayors, all types of people run all over the way. Well, you can also give money to the candidates you can donate to the candidates. You can still give money.

You can still give money. give Al-Sayed and Tolericolorie government. And then there will come a time where we all get to vote on a national level. And what you do on a local level and like, you know, what was able to happen here in New York City with Mom Donnie, I think is a great narrative shaper, right? Because you're seeing someone who represents a movement that people were questioning. But here in New York City, tons of enthusiasm and tons of, and people are seeing results and transparency and conversation. I think that's the best, like, you know, if you're looking for something that's going to, like, say, hey, God, and you see a meeting with Trump. And how often does the mayor of New York City have a great relationship with the governor, the moderate Democrat governor of New York State?

Like, we've sat through many, many mayors where there's just like, they're in the newspaper and the governor of the state saying XYZ and the mayor's doing this and they're at odds over the MTA or they're at odds over this. They've been moving together. Mom Dani's doing a great job trying to, you know, hold his principles while also saying, hey, we need to figure out ways to work together to get things and make things better for New Yorkers. I think Mom Dani, I don't expect that from a, you know what I mean? I'll reiterate it. I don't expect that from Hassan Piker. He's never been that person. It's not what his brand was built on.

It's not all about Hassan Piper. This is a broader conversation to me about Democrats when we get into crunch time. lining up as best humanly possible. Not building new candidates who are middle of the road and suck, okay? I'm not a Gavin Newsom guy. I am off of Gavin Newsom. I thought there was hope at the beginning.

I don't really think there is. So I'm not about us building up new people who don't stand for anything. I'm about really focusing though at this moment on making sure if we are able to somehow gain control of the House and Senate, it completely changes our children's hit future. Yes.

versus not. We are talking about the future of, yo, the amount of illnesses that we are going to see because of the regulations being stripped at this moment. Like, that's why we used to talk about what might happen.

It's now happened. No, no, no. The food is unhealthy. We can't eat more. I know. I know. And I don't think people really understand

truly what's at stake, though. That's what I'm saying. They don't see it. This isn't just another election where it's like, yeah, but things could always get worse. Yeah. But right now.

Right now is bad. Hundreds of thousands, if not millions, will die because of the population. policies right now. We will die. We will all know people who will die of diseases they wouldn't have died from because of Maha and Maga. People are being killed in our future right now. So I just don't have time for the yo-yo games of like over the next four weeks this candidate's cool, but it could be, can it get out a Republican right now? And then once this election is over, let's continue to push DSA candidates.

Let's continue to push further left. I'm all for it. Let's just get this done right. now yeah i think most people when you know it's tough to look at social media or wherever you're consuming information and and disconnect from whether or not the commentary that you see in the comments is real or fake um we know because we deal with a lot of online shit like 99% of the time the conversations and the content you see online isn't real in in real life content. It's not in real life conversations. The vitriol, the negativity, like, do you guys see it?

Have you ever seen it? Has anybody ever come up to you? Has anybody ever, has anybody ever said anything to you? Is anybody, like how often does that actually happen? That dude got choked out on the street. You know what I mean? Who's next? But that's why I said 99.

I didn't say 100%. The sad party, but a lot of people don't know the difference. Well, that's why I started by saying, I know it's tough for most people to discern the difference between what's real and what's fake. Isn't that back to what we were talking about at the beginning with our friend who is reaching out to me? Yes. And that's why I went back to that because what you're saying, we're seeing most people are supporting common sense policies, whether it's called DSA or something else. If it's supporting better wages.

Well, I wouldn't say most people are supporting it. Most people we know are support. Well, no, I'm saying in the elections that we've seen like here in New York City, right? But we are, like the Al-Sayette election is going to require. such work to get that done. He's going to have to fight for every vote. The guy he's up against isn't, didn't even show up to the debate. Did you see El-Sai-ed was on the news?

I saw. They had a whole debate. He's standing at the podium. By himself. By himself, there was an empty podium next to the guy. Yeah, but guess what? El-Sayette is leading in the polls as far as, I mean, like, he's got the momentum. Like, everything that could be going right for him is going right.

Now, people don't show up to vote enough. if people you know whatever happens at the actual what percentage of michigan let me ask you a question what percentage of michigan would rather vote for an empty podium than a big strong brown muslim who stands for socialist democratic no but remember in detroit in detroit in detroit in in detroit in detroit in detroit and dearborn you have a lot of muslims right which is a lot of the population of the community in the country you have a democratic mayor right remember gretchen is democratic mayor in the state so else i has the democratic can't So if you're going to vote for a Democrat.

But I'm asking, but my question is, what percentage overall in the state do you think would prefer the empty podium? I don't know, but I just know that Michigan has a tradition of a working class voting for Democrat in that state. That's all I know. They do. I would say in America, no matter what state you're in, 35%. Oh, of course there's a fraction. Prefer the empty podium. And for the purpose of this conversation, one of the first people supporting El-Sayed was.

Hassan Piker. But that is also now created a bit of an issue between them too. Because people have allowed the Hassan Piker narrative to supersede the policy conversation of El Sayed. And we fell into it even on its show where we're talking more about Hassan Piker as if he's running for office. I know. Like he's not even running. He's not even. Yeah, well, I mean, in terms of the outside.

But my point is, is we're falling for the same thing where we're having conversations about entertainers, basically, commentators. more than we're having conversation about policy, more than we're having a conversation about the people who actually have to get into the office and do the job. El-Sayed, from what we can tell, it is leading in that state. But this specific conversation that we're having, you and I are disagreeing on this moment is like,

I guess I'm more worried. You're pointing out all the Democratic things that potentially exist in that state, how they voted in other places. What I looked at is he squeaked by in the Democratic election. By the way, I love him. Like, I think Al-Sayed is, he's Maldanei-A-Jaced to me.

me. I think he has, you know, he could end up being Mom Dani Plus. He's that good. Like, I think he's incredible. But I'm just not going to forget that he's in the middle of America. Like, yeah, for sure. And then, so he squeezed by in the Democratic primary. He needs all the Democrats. He needs an entire coalition to try to beat the Republican, even if the Republicans a deadby. And by the way, and guess who is stands in the way from what we've seen so far, most frequently from these brown candidates getting support from Amman Dhani and El Sayed. Who has actually been in the way? Oftentimes, Democrat.

Democratic is not Hassan Piker. Chuck Schumer, Hakeem Jeffries, James Carville. James Carville, actual Democrats with a position in a Democratic Party and actual budget to spend on these individuals. And have influence. Like cats like James Carville go on TV. and have influence on old. And by the way, James Carville's been going on Fox and defaming and speaking. The actual, once again, Hassan Pikes are not even in there.

No, no, I'm glad you brought that up. These people need to be held accountable. James Carville said, they treasonous pig. Fuck James Carville. You know what I'm saying, though? These people need, and I guess people, they don't get as much hype because they're not currently hot. Well, no, they're just not streamers.

They're not entertainers. But guess what? The interesting part about what you're bringing up is they, they, people like him probably affect more of the voting populace than of Hassan Piper. That's right. Because mostly streamers kids ain't even going out of the vote. So when your dad is bringing up Hassan Piker being the problem. He's getting caught up in the hype of it all too.

No, no, no. James Carville is the problem. Hakeem Jeffries is the problem. Chuck Schumer's the problem. Yeah, but you don't understand. In the case of my dad, my dad has already hated those people for years. He loved Piker. He's a little disappointed.

Right. Those people he can't stand. I mean, they're dead to him. I get it. I get it. This is the net. Now he was like you had home for the new people. And I think there's something to be said for, because remember, Carville, Schumer and Hakeem

Jeffries are the just get in line types. They think the line. Except they don't get in line. No, but they think they're in line right now. No, but they're not. They are absolutely not. No, but they think they are holding the line for what the Democrats need. No, if they were holding the line, they would just be absolutely endorsing these great

Democratic candidates. They're not in line at all. They're selfish pigs. honestly Hakeem Jeffries is a complete fraud Schumers are for they're all frauds that bunch of particular you just mentioned Carville obviously isn't in an office he's just a

former policy guy But like a Democratic National Committee guy Yeah he's a he's a part of He's a true part of the old Democratic establishment yeah Yeah Griff We got to bring in Kev

Here's why Kev is in the building We got to get our Nolan Wells update going Yeah He was on the line real quick Who? Who? Hope Hope. There's hope on the line. I like the idea of that. Hope.

Give us Hope. Hope. Hey. Hey, Hope. Hi, Hope. So, yeah, this is Hope. I'm calling from Georgia. And listen, so I started the show a little bit late. So I may be a little bit behind, but I'm going to bring y'all back to the conversation around Hassan Piker. And like Rosenberg said, the dams lining up. I have a point to make about that. So, you know, as a black woman, and you know about just the black community, we've always done what we needed to do when it comes to voting and lining up. And it seems like the issues that we face as marginalized communities, our issues are never really brought to the center

or the forefront of politicians' agendas. And so I think we at this point have gotten to the point to where we are feeling like, hey, we are tired of just giving you our vote without you all really standing up for what we need in communities. And so I think at this point, we're like, okay, yeah, we are in this really crappy position now. And until the Democratic Party decides to center, you know, marginalized communities and actually give us something different from what the Republicans are doing, I think we are going to have to sacrifice, you know, hey, we're not going to just give our vote away for the sake of lining up. We have to tell the Democrats, like, listen, either y'all are going to listen to us and actually do for the communities what you're talking. tell us you're going to do instead of kicking our, you know, our issues down the road, we may have to, like Ebro said, you know, we may have to go through a whole lot of crappy

years before it gets better because the Democrats have to understand. Like, we're not just going to start giving our votes away right now. But do you, do you not feel that some of these new candidates are like the Mamdani's and the Al-Saiades and the Tolarikos? You don't feel that they're saying anything that would be of relevance to help marginalized communities? I'm sorry I can hardly hear you. Ibro, can you repeat my statement? Oh, no.

He was just at, Rose, can you hear me? Hope? It was my end, but it's breaking up a lot. Well, thank you for you, call. We'll address it. We'll address it. But that, listen. I was curious about, too, like, what are some of the issues that you care about? Yeah, and do you feel that

it's not being, because I feel like that became a thing that was being said over and over is we're not just giving our vote away unless you specifically line up what you're doing for us? I think before, I think first of all, black people on a monolith. So, you know, local community issues, whether if you live in a black community, uh, on a local, you know, uh, whether a city, state level, those issues are very specific. So I'm big,

I'm a big proponent of local voting. On a national level, on a federal voting level, I've always felt that Democrats, and you'll see it today, which is why you don't see the Hakeem Jeffries and the Schumers, um, and others on the Democratic side, lining up behind these, more progressive candidates. I believe the Democrats have always been more interested in attracting moderates and people on the right. And when you prioritize marginalized people's issues, whether that be black, LGBTQ, and otherwise, it's tough to attract those more conservative voters.

So you'll never see them generally put those things out in front. And that's been for the longest where when we get to the federal elections, there's these kind of like catch-all movements. But if we're being honest, that's what a federal political position is about. A federal political position is generally about things that are great for most of the country, right? Unless you are specifically in Congress

where you're representing a state or you're representing some sort of a local jurisdiction. Well, in which case you're dealing with both. Right. In which case you're bringing things that your constituents care about, but you're also voting for everything. for everything right now because people were on the fence or didn't support Kamala right which by the way that wasn't black folks it was other groups and it definitely wasn't black women right because 92%

of black women voted for Kamala right people tried to make the argument what are you what are the tangibles for the black community Kamala and or it was like what are the tangibles and you ain't even black or it was chauvinism or whatever the thing was there was all these you know, it was like death of a thousand cuts for Kamala. You know, you ran a bad campaign. Oh, well, they handed her over the campaign late. Like, it was all of this shit. But you're seeing how much a presidency that does not center marginalized people

and specifically defunds black museums, education, you know, banning books, targeting, you know, black immigrants. or even just black families who are born here or black and brown people because they don't even care about telling the difference between who's an immigrant and who is actually a citizen, just if you have darker, complexed skin.

And even with the dismantling of DEI, how many black women are unemployed right now? Right. And so you have hundreds of thousands. And then you have government employees down there in D.C., which is one of the largest black populations in the country. That's obviously tons of people out of work. So we're getting to see how things can slide to be worse

when you're talking about, hey, we're not going to vote for the Democratic candidate. We're going to allow somebody in office that either is more corporate interested or in this case, what we're seeing right now, corporate interested and has literal white supremacies in their, white supremacists in their cabinet. Which is why I don't understand the idea of waiting around to hear a candidate who's going to specifically address your group and say, I'm coming for your group and here's what I'm going to do. It's a nice thought. But like overall, aren't you looking for candidates who are going to talk about doing things for

working class people? for regular people. But people like to hear that it's going to help them. But people, you know. That's why Trump comes out. That's why Trump comes out and does what he believes black people care about, which is the gold plan and some flashy thing that makes it look like. Well, that's why people got to when he was talking about, you know, black jobs.

And people were like, what are black jobs? Well, then when he showed up at factories and started talking about AI, he was like, this would be great jobs. They wanted to put black people back in factories. That was, that's where their brain is at. Like black people don't have other interests or capabilities. No, no, those would be black jobs to him. So, yeah, so to hope who just called, it's going to be tough to find a Democratic candidate

that gets on a national platform and specifically addresses just one group, right? It's going to, it's just not, but when they get the job, like when Obama got the job or even Joe Biden had the job and the amount of money that they're giving to HBCUs and making sure that there's funding going to making sure that black home ownership and black business ownership and all of these things that can be specific to a certain group. But on a national scale when they're running, you generally don't see them having those conversations as a part of their overarching platform. So I wouldn't get caught up in that specifically, right?

But you're down in Georgia. You have John Ossoff running right now. You have Warnock running right now. You have an opportunity. I think they have a gubernatorial election coming down there in Georgia. or is it happening now or next year? It's right now. So you guys have an opportunity down in Georgia right now.

Is it up already again? Kemp, yeah, I think Kemp was there, guys. The Abrams one was that longer? Well, I could maybe some. Yeah. So anyway, do you guys want to get to the rundown before we bring in Kevin and get our Nolan Wells update?

Or is this the rundown? No, I think we should bring Kevin in. All right, Kev. Come get a seat, buddy, and let's get into this. Listen, if you guys want to email us as we get ready for Family Friday, Ebro-Laura Rosenberg at Gmail. If you want to get at the guru, same email.

Hey, Kav. So what's happening, sir? Thanks for joining the program. Can I? Yeah, sure. I've been here for a while. Can I respond to what two of you just said before we get to know a while?

Yeah, please do. All right. So you mentioned black voters holding out their votes and talking about wanting to hear from Democrats what they're going to tangibly get. Because that was a caller. Some of those tangibles,

yeah, yeah. Some of those tangibles are things like the John Lewis Voting Rights Act, which still has not been enacted as law. The George Floyd Justice and Policing Act, which has stalled in the Senate, addressing housing disparities, increasing the minimum wage,

and these are things that we can all say, yes, that stuff would benefit everyone. But the way to address black voters directly in a national campaign and win over those, like, so-called moderate swing voters, is to remind people, which no Democrats have had the audacity to say, the most marginalized and victimized group in this country are black people, black women specifically.

And when you help the people who are being impacted the most, it lifts everyone else up. That is the message that Democrats need to get on board with. When we help the people who this system places at the very bottom, everyone else gets an opportunity. And that is the message. By the way, I agree with you 100%. But isn't that what candidates like Al-Said are talking about? but you're saying they need to specifically say because it sounds like she's waiting for people

to specifically mention black voters black voters absolutely but by lifting up the working class in a lot of situations aren't you talking about black voters you're not talking about lifting up the black elite but after decades of black voters being the most reliable voting block in the country for Democrats they do owe them at some point to address their needs head on and to say exactly what I just said we will focus on helping black people

And then everyone else, by the way, for those listening to the fact, this will benefit you too. I don't disagree with that. I just think it a lot of times what it ends up being is that when they do do that, they're placating, right? They'd be like, let me mention something that's going to make you feel good like the George Floyd or voting rights, which is not being done is absolutely madness and shouldn't even be a conversation, obviously, in 2026, but it is, or lynching being a hate crime. All of these things that we know are incredibly obvious. I just worry that the second people start getting specific, they're doing it in a way that's just trying to.

to get your vote. Yeah. They're just trying to like, but to your point, people want to hear it. People do want to hear it. So if you want, if people need,

if people like hope need to hear it, let them hear it. And not in a way we're like, you're Hillary Clinton showing up at the breakfast club talking about how you have

hot sauce in your purse. Like that's not the way to attract black voters because that is pending. And even when you go look back at that moment, that was a piece of a larger convoy, right?

Like that was taken as if that's why she showed up and that was like, didn't they ask her? They asked her. Yeah. Every, like,

And by the way, she might like hot soft. Like, what do we even talk about? By the way, I didn't even, what does that even mean? But I hear what you're saying, Kevin. But no, but people took it. But to the narrative shaping, and this is what we have an opportunity right now to focus on. When you look back even at that moment, how did that become the headline? When she was up there talking about a litany of other things, we allowed and play into these things.

going back to the Hans-Assan Piker Convo. Like, well, the way it happened. The people who are really doing damage to these progressive candidates is not Hassan Piker. It's literally the democratic establishment. But we're talking about a streamer. But when you're talking about, like, marginalized groups and, like, black voters and stuff, the way that, not disinformation, but mal-information starts to spread online, like, the way that that became the headline for Haley-Linson, is because we have pages like the shade room,

who will wait and clip that. And that is- Well, because it is... So it is sort of... No, no, because it is entertaining, right? Like, there is some entertainment value there. But I guess what I'm saying is, is to regurgitate it over and over again

as if she showed up to placate to black voters by saying she had hot sauce in her back. No, she showed up to a show that is targeting a black audience. And they brought up topics. And they talked a wide range of... And one thing she said is like, She played. No, she showed up to literally have a conversation.

So you're saying I'm the problem. Yes, I am. In this scenario, yes. But real quick, you keep going back to the, we talk about Hassan Piker. He's a streamer. You're sort of like, you are right. Other people are making him a bigger deal than he's. I'm just encouraging us to try to.

But just don't, don't, you can't downplay that like he also made Al-Saiad in a lot of ways. He, his influence. Whoa. No, no, no, on a national scale? No. Yes, he did. I mean, on a national scale, he helped make him. I don't know that a national scale is what's going to benefit outside.

I actually think a national... I think a national scale is actually what's been harming him. Maybe so. Because of the connection to Hassan Piker. By the way... You're super connected, though, and in on everything. I'm speaking more as the casual. I'm telling...

Post-Piker, you don't think there was an impact? Well, casual relative to you. To you. Maybe not to everybody commenting, but to you, yes, I consider myself a casual. I do think that on a national scale, he played a big part for him. I do. I mean, I could be wrong. Listen, again, you know more than me.

To me, it kind of felt like that was in. But I also agree with the Ebro's point that he shouldn't be the number one conversation. Well, no, if we're talking about the algorithm hustle, which is we're all a part of, and you have a large entity and platform like Hassan's, who has a lot of reach, and he goes out with Al-Said and goes to the gym. And they went and, you know, maxed out on their bench press. And they stumped and went around and met people. And Hassan was out there and invited people out to see El-Sayed.

The clip farming of that, right, has more reach than Al-Sayed's own Instagram at that time, right? And so to his point, the algorithm and people who got exposed to El-Said outside of his community was probably that more vast because... Visit BetMGM Casino and check out the newest exclusive. The Price is Right Fortune Pick. BetMGM and GameSense remind you to play responsibly, 19 plus to wager. Ontario only. Please play responsibly. If you have questions or concerns about your gambling or someone close to you, please contact connects Ontario at 1-866-531-2,600 to speak to an advisor.

Free of charge. BetMGEM operates pursuant to an operating agreement with Eye Gaming Ontario. Hassan Piker has a large way. I don't want to take away the work that he did to earn. But, right, but El-Said doing what he did as a physician, when he was on the Health Commission in Detroit and like all of the work, he actually has done to create, you know, the platform

and the connections that he has in the community. No, Hassan Pikes. We know all that real stuff and that work shit doesn't know. You know the actual work? Yeah, that actual work. Like, he's talking about black maternal health with Kamala Harris and people are saying

like he's pandering and like if you look at his actual record, he's been talking about black maternal health for almost a decade at the time. Yes, yes, yes, yes. Anyway, sorry, I feel like I'm taking. All right. No, no, we got to us. So the latest we saw is that they came out,

the corner's office came out and ruled that it was not. No criminal. charges should be no charges now we have a clip of the autopsy press conference do you do you want us to show it or do you want to autopsy or are you talking the one that came out yesterday that's his mother okay do you mean nolan's mother no this was a doctor talking about oh yes yes yes dr mitchell i think yeah sure we also have this when dr mitchell says it happened close to the time of death how do we know that we know that because because Nolan Wells' body had not started to make white blood cells yet.

He had started to bleed, he had blood force trauma, it was serious, but only red blood cells were found on his body, not white. If you all remember from your biology days back in school, red blood cells come first, white blood cells come later. So we know because there are no white blood cells that this injury happened within about four hours of his death. Now, was this the independent autopsy? So this is, this is not a doctor. This is one of the partners at Ben Crump's law firm.

So she's one of the attorneys on the case. I'll circle back to what she was just talking about, but there's some details about the grand jury that I sort of want to make sure that people understand. So the grand jury returned a no true bill, which means that the evidence, the data, the testimony that they all reviewed, there's 23 jurors on a grand jury. They say that what they were presented did not meet the threshold to pursue any criminal charges. They did not, in their report, say that he definitively drowned. Neither his death certificate, the first or second autopsy, have a cause of death. It says undetermined. What they did say is that the manner in which his body was found, the location, the timing, that all those details are consistent with an accidental drowning as far as they know.

And from the testimony that they heard, including the doctor who performed the original autopsy down in Mississippi. So what they reviewed, there were 132 subpoenas sent out. There were 43 witness testimonies. They got GPS data, cell phone data, and basically they got to the conclusion that I just shared. with you. So Ben Crump's team is saying that the case should remain open and now they are trying to petition the federal government of DOJ to take on the case independently in order to get more details. And so what she was just talking about is the first time we talked about the autopsy, we mentioned that there was blunt force trauma to the back of his head. That was consistent

throughout the reports. And then there was also a mention of like red discoloration in the report. And so about two weeks ago or so, the doctor, the independence physician who did the second autopsy for the family, traveled to Mississippi and met with the physician who did the original one and was able to look at some of those reports. And so what they found is that the red discoloration was actually dried up blood. And he also said that there were no photos of the back of Nolan Wells' head included in the first autopsy. So they're saying this was sort of not handled properly because if you see blood and a blunt force trauma, you should photograph that because the body is going to continue to decompose by the time we get it to do the second autopsy. So it was dried up blood and what she's explaining is that because there were only red blood cells and his body had not begun to produce white blood cells, that means that he died within three or four hours of that bleeding. And so we cannot definitively say that's injury, however big. it might have been that that resulted in his death or that it was a part of how he died, but we know that it happened close to when he died. So meaning, I guess what we're picturing would be potentially some sort of someone hitting him

in the back of the head, potentially, at him falling into the water, maybe and then drowning after being hit in the head or something. Or even pushing him and him falling backwards and hitting his head. Right. They're also saying that he drowned in shallow water or if he drowned it happened in shallow water. Really? How can they determine that? Because of where he was found. Okay.

Now, was there a... Why would one drown in shallow water unless there was some sort of trauma? Well, I was going to ask, and the toxicology report, do we... Is there any intent? So the toxicology report did show that he did have nicotine in his blood system. He also did have... The original test said that there was some sort of THC and the second one could not confirm it. So that's unclear.

As far as alcohol, we know. from photos of that day that Nolan Wells was drinking. And some of his friends were trying to sort of suggest that he was very drunk and maybe that was a reason. So the toxicology report did show a 27% blood alcohol level, which in a living person would be extremely high. It leads to concussion and injury and all sorts of things. But Ben Crump's team is sort of arguing

that that number can't be trusted because it did not come from his blood. Instead, the tests relied on. decomposition fluid, which can be mixed. It can be a bunch of different parts of his body that sort of mixed together. And so it's not a clear blood sample. And so they're saying, they're saying we shouldn't trust that number. They're saying point, that would be a point two seven.

Point two seven, yeah. That'll be like you're blowing a point two seven. Correct. And so the legal driving limit is zero, is zero point zero eight percent. It's point zero eight. That's so it's three times the legal driving limit. Yeah. And so like, although, again, maybe that's the drugness people get to me.

27 people do get that drunk and 27% is pretty high. But what they what the physician who did the independent autopsy is saying is that after you die, your body can produce ethanol or alcohol because of the decomposition. That's known as micro bio fermentation. And so your body does start to develop alcohol after you've passed away. And it took two days to find his body. So what we know today is the state of Mississippi is consistent with their history, which is they can't be trusted. So we know that. We can confirm that.

Am I speaking out of turn there? Well, I think you'll be interested in the racial makeup of the grand jury. Well, even before we get to that, I just want to kind of recap where we are today. Sure. Mississippi's bungled this. Well, I mean. From what I just heard you say, they've bungled so much of this that like, A, we don't have a clear toxicology report. B, we didn't have photographs at the back of his head.

C, there was some blood there. Well, they couldn't have a clear of a clear toxicology report, right? Correct. It's not about that they bungled that. You just couldn't. It's not possible. It's not possible. They just missed the photography in the back of his head. That, well, no, that part, it sounds like is a ball drop. And also, the other one sounds like because of where his body was, you couldn't get a great time.

We did keep hearing about delays when it came to that first autopsy from Mississippi officials. And we found out when the independent physician traveled down to Mississippi that that autopsy was done within a couple days of Nolan Wells passing, like three or four days. but what I would say is I'm not surprised because I said this on the show the last time we talked about Nolan Wells, which was we are not going to see these reports. We're never going to see the autopsy because it is sealed as part of the grand jury. And so I'm not surprised at these results because this is what I said was going to happen. Well, so now the next, I wrote down here as soon as you brought up, they're going to try to get the federal government and the DOJ involved. That's great. So this is why federal elections, you know, if you're holding out for tangibles, right, which fine, if that's what you want to do.

But if you end up with a white supremacist in there who doesn't value civil rights, doesn't value in justice. Doesn't investigate civil rights. Matter of fact, disbanded the, I read the whole department at the DOJ that would address something like this. Yeah. Now you have a black family in a shitty state that has a history of shitty racism. federal government to come help them. Who would need the federal government's protection. Yeah. So how do we think that's going to go, Kiv?

I don't see the DOJ taking this up. The NWACP and Ben Crump are calling for the states to release the original autopsy along with their grand jury report details. But a grand jury report and all of the information they reviewed, the testimony, all of that is protected by grand jury secrecy law. It is almost impossible to get that. And if they were to attain. in any of it, it would be heavily redacted

and only parts of it. So what I would advise them if I got the opportunity to speak to them is you have to be very specific about what you ask a federal judge. They would have to go to a circuit judge in Mississippi and ask them to And these are the same judges appointed by presidents and things like that, right?

Yes, Ebro. Cool. Just trying to put it all together for everybody, how this? So the grand jury, there are 23 jurors on a grand jury. this grand jury the makeup is 12 white jurors five black jurors one Asian juror two Hispanic two native one other okay so

more than half of the jury was and they're and by the way how many people do they need well I would that's what I was gonna say you need 12 votes in order to indicts but this was unanimous oh it was unanimous it was zero to 23 well because here's my question it doesn't sound like we can all hear this story and go, this sounds very fishy. Feels like something happened here. No one knows anything about this boy

who was friends with all of these people. And now all the other boys, nobody knows anything. Everybody ran out, got lawyers, deleted things off their phones. Went on specific podcasts to spread a narrative. Feels insane. But what I guess what I'm asking is,

what was presented to where, like, did they have enough presented to where the grand jury would say, Oh, yeah, we need to, who are you even pursuing? That's the question. Who are you pursuing? That's the question that I've had this whole time. My question, when people say that they are surprised that there's no indictment because, like, they say, like, oh, you can indict a ham sandwich.

Who? Who's the ham sandwich? Someone's got to be the ham sandwich, though. He was with, like, 15 people that day. So who is it that we're expecting? And somebody's watching going, indict them all, but based on the report. Then you're not going to win if you try to indict them all, because half of them will have an alibi and be completely ruled out. So there's no more specific story.

they don't have any like there was nothing about an inter like an altercation with anyone not that we know what about what about the boys who went on the podcast they all gave testimony okay a grand jury is decided this was decided to go through grand jury is that the normal process for this sort of thing in the state of mississippi there are always grand juries uh in any death that is unexplained or mysterious always it always goes to a grand jury for them to decide whether or not there are criminal charges to proceed with. What I will say is that the AG did point out, I'm sorry, the DA did point out that Mississippi does not have a statute of limitations

when it comes to murder or homicide. And so if there is new evidence presented, if Ben Crump and their investigators are able to uncover anything else, this can be represented. Or if we get a new DOJ and a new president. Correct. So this case does not stop here because it can be represented if there is new evidence to be found.

My question is how they're going to find new evidence. I know that Ben Crump's team today is actually headed down to Florida, where they're going to do another press conference about, like, the findings of the boat when they got the boat and were able to do some sort of inspection. I'm not really sure what. And then is there the other conversation? So yeah, this conversation where it's like, okay, who are you going to actually indict? All right, who actually did this and who's accountable to Nolan Wells' death?

So there's that. But then there's also when a state or local jurisdiction doesn't handle these things right. Doesn't the family also have recourse in the future to say, hey, because of this, you know, fumbling of this, fumbling of that, the handling of this, if there was corruption involved, if there was hiding of information, there's other avenues that the family, it's not going to, nothing's going to bring their son back. But they might be able to actually sue the state or local. Is that a thing too? They could potentially pursue charges or legal action against like the doctor-physician who performed the autopsy. But the jurors are protected because they are not making any determinations about what happened. All they are saying is what you have presented us.

We do not have evidence to file charges against any particular person. So why wouldn't so. So even if this went to like the Mississippi Supreme Court, that ruling would be. be whether or not to release information. That's right. It would not be to determine that like the jurors did anything wrong. So back to Ebro's point of maybe who dropped the ball like really bungled this. Is it on investigators and the DA to have found someone who they think you could actually

be trying to pursue here? I would say if they were under the impression that there was foul play, it would be on the investigators to sort of find persons of interest. and focus on them, but I think it was clear from the beginning that that was not the case, that they did not think that there was file play involved. That's my interpretation of what happened. And I guess there's no text. I'm sorry, Kevin.

And there's no text messages between people. I assume they got subpoenaed and got every text message. They got cell phone data off of everyone's phones. So I'm not sure what they saw. But obviously no one said like, oh my God, did you hear about, like nothing secretive was said that would have given them anything. Because I believe even Snapchat records were pulled. Wow.

They did social media. they did everything. So yeah, I was curious about that too. I just, I think what fumbled this, if I'm going to be honest, is social media.

I think that the constant, constant influx of like misinformation, falsified stories, conspiracy theories, fake Facebook posts, pictures from a freaking like pool party that had happened almost a month prior.

That doesn't help because everyone's online. And you're not going to convince me that the people who are on this grand jury were not watching all of that. Of course. And so it taints it because you're like, okay, well, you're telling us he was murdered at a pool party and then thrown back in the water.

And we know that that's not what happened. There was a crazy conspiracy theory that, like, Nolan Wells was like, I won't even repeat what it was. But like, that they did like horrible, malicious things to his body. And like, that was not true. Right, right, right, right. So, yeah, it's, uh, I just feel for his parents, man. Yeah, you feel for his parents to have to go through this and also not have any idea of what happened. Yeah.

Well, and I feel for anybody who's triggered by this because, you know, how many times? times have you seen a black death of a young person and there's just no answers and nobody gets held accountable? And the DA texted Nolan Wells's mother moments before releasing the grand jury report and they released it on like Facebook and she said during the press conference yesterday that it felt like they were just trying to wash their hands of it. They were like, hey, by the way, the reports coming out and they've just posted it on Facebook. There's no like official site to like go read it. You have to go to Facebook and read like the screenshots that she posted. So it felt very like, let's get this over with.

I mean, that's what it feels like. Yeah. Thank you, Kev. You're welcome. And that's back to how we feel about, you know, trust for a state that has a history that has. Well, trust for a nation that has a history, right? Like, I mean, in any, listen, Mississippi is obviously that. But if we were reading about this and it was taking place in New York State, you know what I mean?

Yeah. We would feel much different. We would be talking about the history of America nonetheless. And, you know, black people dying and they're not being any recourse or anyone being, held accountable. Kevin Ortega Rojas, thank you for your time. Thank you for the work that you do because the truth is these things just aren't getting covered without people like Kev on an international level.

That's how we stay up on these stories. Yeah, yeah. And ELR News, another episode with you and Kev this week, right, Laura Stout? Drops Fridays at 10 a.m. All right, man, we got to get a buy out of here. If you held on past nine. We have a Patreon today. Okay.

Patreon is a mixed bag. It is a fun. we talk about, you know, some real life stuff. Then we watch Drake videos. But then we watched the Drake FOMO movie, whatever it is. And together, as a family, we watch it and break that down. It's got a whole lot. What is it?

What is it check in at today's episode? Hour 15. So if you're not... And when you say break that down, I don't think... There was a lot that went over our head. Yeah, but we tried. Us trying to break it down and trying to understand. The Iron Man costume at the Carnival.

All I sent me. Well, I was curious throughout the day. Like, why isn't this registering? Did you figure it out? Yes. Well, you'll see us talk about it because it's recorded already. But kind of find out they actually showed up to a carnival in Iron Man costumes because they couldn't show up as themselves, obviously, because they wanted to show up when other people were just there. Got you.

Okay. So if you remember, we were looking at it and you're like, there would be cutaways of them with the mask up, him and Lowe Shimmy doing the song. But then the mask would be down when they're walking around. Because they want, you know how Michael Jackson used to put on costumes and going public? It was that. God, and that was the idea. Okay, okay. Patreonis, though, it's a good week to join Patreon.

So we'll see you over there. Don't call in a podcast.