THE ED MYLETT SHOW - Life or Death of an Entrepreneur with Marc Lore

Episode Date: February 25, 2020

If your dream is to WIN you have to be willing to take RISKS! In this interview, I sat down with Marc Lore, one of the most diversified and successful entrepreneurs on the planet. Marc is a serial entrepreneur. Having sold business to Amazon, Topps Trading Cards, Walmart and more. He is now the CEO of Walmart e-commerce ...But get this, he started off just like many of you guys have….selling lemonade or baseball cards as a kid. If you have been waiting for a sign to start your business...to go all in... to follow your DREAMS, then Marc's story is that sign. At 24 years old, Marc was working a fantastic banking job. He woke up one day with determination in his heart and told his boss he was resigning to become an entrepreneur. Marc is a prime example of how the most successful people I know are the ones who are willing to step into the places they feel ill-prepared for and EXECUTED anyway. He gets very transparent about his failures and how they bred doubt and depression. He opens up about his childhood and how they need to meet his father's standards strained their relationship. But through it all, you'll hear how Marc used his circumstance as a catalyst to ignite his passion and drive to succeed. From someone who has mastered the field of entrepreneurship, he gives concrete information on how to develop the heart of an entrepreneur and breaks down core values of a start-up including: HOW to start The importance of TIMING and Investing Seriously, guys….this interview is LOADED with major principles to grow your business and hear what it TRULY takes amongst all odds to become successful. To Marc, it’s life or death because he was willing to risk it all.

This is the Edmmerwood Show. Welcome back to Max out everybody. We're going to talk entrepreneurship today. We're going to talk business. And the man to my left is impeccably qualified. He's a CEO of Walmart e-commerce. He's built and sold multiple different companies, sold one of them to Amazon, sold another one to Walmart. This man knows an awful lot about building businesses, starting businesses, scaling businesses,

selling businesses. And so we're going to get a chance to talk about all that today. So Mark Laurie, thank you for being here really. Thanks, Ed. Great to be here. It's going to be good, man. If you guys want business, you got two guys to talk to today. So I want to start out a little bit, just give them context, because you haven't just done this once. You've had multiple successes. Just give them a little bit of your background, because I don't think that was an adequate introduction about the business you've built in what you did with them. Yeah, so you know, I started my career actually in banking. So, you know, there wasn't really the start-up scene back when I was in high school, you know, I graduated high school in 1989.

Me too. Oh, did you? Okay, great. College in 93. Yeah, there wasn't really this start-up scene. And so, you know, being from New York and the stock market and stuff was kind of a hot thing to think about as a kid. And I got in a stock at a young age, from 10 years old, I had a little book

that I would look in the newspaper every day and write down the stock prices Kellogg. Here's what it was, it was up there, to track them and read about stocks as a kid and started getting and reading books on derivatives when I was in like seventh grade, eighth grade. Wow. But my whole childhood was filled

with all these entrepreneurial things that I did. Not realizing that that could be like a thing. Like it could actually be an entrepreneur and start something. Never even occurred to me. Don't you also think though, like if you're a parent too, let's say this, because I had that entrepreneur bug

and I didn't know as a kid too. We both had baseball card businesses. And you and I both had lemonade bug and I didn't know as a kid too. We both had baseball card businesses and you and I both had lemonade stands and I had an auto detailing business. And I think if your kid shows that perclivity early, you should be feeding that because we are in that world today. So in your case though, it's fascinating. So you kind of have this entrepreneurial spirit,

you go to college, first do it in your family really to do that. You do well, you're doing very well in the banking space. Yeah. And then, but you've got this entrepreneurial bug do that, you do well, you're doing very well in the banking space. And then, but you've got this entrepreneurial bug sort of floating in you the whole time. And there's a lot of people listening to this that want to be entrepreneurs, but they're out of job right now. They're winning where they're planted for now, but they've always wanted to have their

own thing or start something. And in your case, what I love is, you don't even know what the hell it was. Right? So one day, Tom, you just basically walk into your boss and go, Hey, what did you say? Yeah, I just walked into my boss's office one day. This is like almost seven years into my banking career and I was executive vice president, chief risk officer for this bank, making a ton of money. Never thought I'd make that much money, you know, just because, you know, it just wasn't a thing, you know, growing up, thinking that that was possible

at that age. And, but I knew I wanted to be an entrepreneur, I knew I had to just go all in. And so I went in my boss's office and just said, has he was Jerry Goldstein? And I said, Jerry, hey, I just want to tell you that I'm going to resign. And he goes, he laughed, he goes, come on.

What do you mean? Nobody's going to pay you more than I'm paying you. And I said, no, I'm gonna be an entrepreneur. I'm gonna do a startup. And he's like, really? Well, you must have a great idea. I said, well, I don't really have the idea yet, but I love, but I need time to think about it,

because I need to go all in and do it. Didn't people think you were crazy? He thought I was crazy. He really thought I was crazy. But I mean, the people around you, like you're gonna leave this really good job, but you don't even know the idea. Everybody thought I was crazy. No capital either, the people around you, like you're gonna leave this really good job, but you don't even know the idea. Yeah, everybody thought I was crazy.

No capital either, right? Like not a lot of capital. Well, he thought I was so crazy. He said, you know what, put me down for your first, I think it was 50 grand. No way. As an investor, 25 or 50. The guy you're resigning from goes,

well, when you figure it out, I'll give you 50,000 dollars. And so I didn't know nobody. It wasn't like, you know, we had family, friends, and things that had money, because, and I started with angel investors. It was that first bit of money. And then he basically introduced me to two people, and said, you should go talk to these two people.

And then from that seed, I wound up talking to, I don't know, maybe 200 angel investors, and I got 60 investors to invest a total of five million bucks. No. No venture. I didn't know any VC. I didn't know anything bucks. No venture, I didn't know any VC, I didn't know anything about the startup world. I didn't know what a cap table was. You got a deal.

It was like, I knew nothing. I just, but I got 60 angel investors to give on average what, you know, about 80 grand each and it was like five million bucks. And that was the thing. I tried to tell people all the time that you don't have to have everything buttoned up and know exactly what you can do.

You kind of just go all in. And a great example of this was, we started, there's like a CPA, like Chartered, you know, accountant, and there's the CFA, Chartered Financial Analyst. There was nothing for financial risk managers. You couldn't get certified. So I was talking to my boss and became a friend

and I was like, you know, why don't we just kind of create an exam for risk managers because it doesn't exist. And he was kind of like, yeah. You literally created an industry. Yeah, how do you create an exam? And so we started talking to people. And basically they're like, well, you can't just create a certification. They're like, who are you?

You're like 24 years old. You can't just start an exam. Who's gonna like credit it or who's gonna, and I said, no, no, we're just gonna start an association. And not for profit association, that association will credit it, and then we'll kinda do the exam. And so everyone's like, no, that's crazy.

You can't do it. So I said, forget know, forget it. I'm jumping in. What we're gonna do is we're gonna set up a website. We're gonna put up a date for the exam. The first thing we do is a date. We just picked a date. Like it's made, you know, whatever.

I don't remember the year, 98. Here's the date, it's New York City, actual date. And here's the outline of all the things that are gonna be on the exam. Senate check for 500 bucks and you got your seat and then that's it and so we just put it up there and all of a sudden we started getting checks. People started sending checks and we're just like so we looked at each other like I think we need to write this exam now.

Oh my gosh there was no exam at the time. No it was just started with the date and the agenda for the topics. We started getting all these texts and we got 34 checks, $17,000 and 34 people. And so we decided, so me and Lev sat down and we spent weekend after weekend nights and things, writing this entire exam on every topic. And we gave, also also recommended readings as well. And then we went to New York City, we rented our place, and we administered this exam

to 34 people, and then we went home and corrected it. We decided where the pass fell was. We censored certificates of the people that passed. And now today it's still in like 50 countries around the world, there's like thousands of people taking this exam. You're a trip, man. Like, no, but it's still in like 50 countries around the world. There's like thousands of people taking this exam. You're a trip man. Like, no, but it's just a great, and I'm just saying that only because people think that

when you start something, it has to be like buttoned up or you need to have a plan or you need to know your next step or whatever. And what I always say is, you know, just take the biggest step you can with your next move. Yeah. And that's it, like toward your vision. You have the vision, and just take the biggest step you can. And for us, the biggest step we can take was here's the date. I believe that. Here's the...

Common line of the Entrepreneurship on the show or my friends and entrepreneurs is they're willing to step into space as they're ill-prepared for. And they go, when I get in there, I'll figure it out. And then when I get in there, I'll figure it out. When I get in there, I'll figure it out. And then when I get in there, I'll figure it out. When I get in there, I'll figure it out. And in your case, and then I wanna go to some clues,

cause success leaves clues. And what I wanna spend our time today on, are those clues, are those lessons you've learned? But just for everybody to give some context, what made me attracted having you on was the diversity of your success. So this is an exam for risk managers, right? Success in that space.

You take diapers.com, sell it to Amazon. I think even in your own case, because it's your story, I think even in your own case, you don't have a quite the appreciation for how remarkable it is. So you take diapers.com, sell it to this little company called Amazon, right? I'm kidding.

And then you build jet.com, you sell that to Walmart. Like, you've had a really crazy career for a dude who literally walks out of a job one day that's really successful. It doesn't even have the damn idea yet. Like, it's remarkable. And I want people to know, how can I be like you in my own small way?

So I'm gonna go through a list of sort of rapid fire stuff. Number one, do you think entrepreneurship is for everybody? No. And why? I don't. I think you have to be, I'd say the key mindset is the ability to take risk and be comfortable with taking risk.

A lot of people, I find that the different people in doing it and not doing it, as a lot of time comes down to risk, when you do something there are so many unknowns, you have to be comfortable with that. And you have to be comfortable with the fact that there's a really high probability that you're gonna fail. Most people just aren't comfortable like thinking about,

imagine this, somebody comes to you and says, listen, I want you to absolutely dedicate your entire life, kill yourself, give up family, friends, everything. And yeah, there's a good chance it's not going to work. It's like, that's a tough sell. That's a tough sell for most people. Do you think that you know that? It's the combination of both.

You have to do both though, you have to go all in and you have to like just like work out work, you know. So everybody, well the reason I ask you that is, I was reading some stuff you said about the all-in thing. So you led right where I wanted to go. And you had a business you would invest it in, where the people looking at you were like, well why is there $390,000 of your money

in this investment or in this business? Like why is that the number, right? And I thought it's genius what you're going to share here. So what did you tell them? And why did that really matter at the time? Yeah, and I have a follow up to that too. So, yes, so the pit.com, which is the business that I quit, the banking to go do, which was a sports stock market

that I sold to tops, the baseball court company. I invested on the cap table, 390,000, which I had saved from banking over those years. And they said, you know, why 390,000? You invest, why didn't you just invest 400? And I said, because I only have 390,000. I literally took the entire bank balance that I had saved over those seven years,

390,000 in cash after tax. And I just boom, put that into the business. And the one was, you know, needed some extra capital, so that was kind of good. But the primary reason was one to show people how serious and dedicated I was, like investors, which worked by the way. You don't get 60 angel investors to put 80 grand in

for somebody who's never done a startup before unless they truly believe that this person is going to do whatever it takes and I think that was the signal. It was like, yeah, he's got every penny of money he's made into it. And then also for me, knowing that I had every penny into it was like there's no turning back. It was life or death. I put myself in a situation where I could not fail. Just couldn't fail. I think that that's where most people aren't willing to go to make your point earlier.

Even if it's not $390, if it's $39,000, or if it's quitting your job, or if it's having to sell your home to start your company. Most people aren't willing to go to that extreme. One of the things, I've not heard it said this way before, but I agree with it is, you said, when you're even evaluating if you're going to invest, everyone that's out there that's listening,

this is a very important thing that Mark says better than anybody, you say that when you had that 390 in there, because that's exactly all you had, it was everything you were in there, that that being all in helped you find a gear in you that didn't exist had you not gone all the way in, right? So the irony is the risk you're taking to start the business, maybe the very thing

that helps you find things in you, you didn't know you had. And I, I, well, I don't believe that. I mean, I think I tell everybody, you have to think life or death because in every one of the startups, even in all four of the startups I've done, if I wasn't in that extra

gear, they would have failed. Like, there was none of them were like easy codes, you know, you just sort of go, go, go, and everything's great. They all ran into a situation where you had to go to the extra gear to make it, to make it real. Or you were going to fail. Or you were going to fail. So all four of your big successes, there was a point where you were almost out of business. Yeah. All four of them. All four of your big successes, there was a point where you were almost out of business. Yeah, all four of them. All four of them. Yeah. Man, why is that invaluable? Because there's millions of people that are listening to this or

watching it, that they may be in that state right now. Yeah. You know, if you're an entrepreneur, the chances are, as you're listening to this or watching this, you're in failure still. Yeah. The chances are, and just raising money too, you know, when now being on the other side and doing investments and things, that is the primary thing that I look for. Is this person, is this team all in? You know, like, do they have something at stake here that's going to push the limits of what they're capable of doing? I think humans are capable of doing so much more than they think they are capable of doing.

You know, it's just, it's that mentality. And I've seen it in myself. I've seen, I've done things I didn't think were possible, you know, work at a pace that I didn't think was possible. You know, and you think that's because you had to, because you had to. Yeah, you had to, and all in, I mean, all in with certainly,

I'm not a tarly, the 390, but then in each of my businesses, I've had every friend and family member involved and they have their money at stake and people that don't have money, there's that part of added pressure and just knowing that you don't want to let people down, not only yourself, but you don't want to let people down. See, I share holders and things. I think for someone who's sold had four hits like you've had significant hits big businesses that is sold for someone

Listen to this to hear that hey man. I was almost out all four times I went all in with my cash. I didn't have it all figured out when I started These are huge things and that if you want if you're not going to tolerate risk You shouldn't be an entrepreneur. I was go back and kind of summarize lessons as we're going Now, let's go to some of the things that worked in all of them that I think that that are principles So I want to ask you a first about Core values Now let's go to some of the things that worked in all of them that I think that are principles. So I want to ask you at first about core values. Okay.

So this is something I talk a lot about when I'm teaching entrepreneurs. I'm just curious as you're taking on how important it is to establish core values in any company as any entrepreneur. Any organization. Yeah, I think the comment theme across all startups, and if I would ever do one again, the first thing I think about is the culture of the organization, because people are everything. You cannot build a big successful business

without having great people work there. And to hire great people into a startup that's unproven, that has risk, it doesn't, you know, that has risk, it's uncertain, it's hard, you know. I think you're inspiring. Yeah. I think people smile differently. I mean this. Like, you guys, you take Walmart for a minute, 4700, I'm giving you rough figures, 4700 stores that are within 10 miles of 90% of all the people in the United States. Like, this is remarkable.

I mean, it's remarkable. Say that again. 4700 stores that are within 10 miles of 90% of the humans in the United States. Like, that's a pretty big deal. And the dude leading the e-commerce side of that now, trying to match that hardware up with the virtual world. He's a dude who walks into his boss at a bank one day and goes,

I just gonna be an entrepreneur. And he goes, what are you gonna do? I don't know. You got an idea? I don't have an idea. You got a lot of money. I don't have any money. And it turns into that.

That's just crazy. And that's you can so many people hope that are sitting in a cubicle somewhere right now or drive it in their car. They're on the treadmill. They're like, I don't know if my life's ever going to a mount to anything. Look what's happened to this man in his life, it's remarkable.

And that's, guys, you have to start to connect that most of your biggest dreams, most, not all, not all. But most are going to come through you taking on some risk. That's what we started with here today. That could be for you to get into the relationship you want, if the risk getting hurt, for you to get into the relationship you want, if the risk getting hurt, for you to get into the body you want, you're going to have to risk changing the way you live. If you're going to get wealthy and change how you feel about yourself, you might have to risk your career or risk your capital. These things are all correlated,

but it's just remarkable what you've achieved. Now, I'm curious if you were to advise someone who goes, all right, I'm not an entrepreneur yet. Or I'm in one kind, but I might not be my dream one. There's just some piece of advice. Where do I start? Do I try to solve people's problems? Do I try to go where my passions are? You know, you hear all this quick thing? I think that's right. Yeah, no, it's true. What do you think? I can ask this question all the time. I think there's a misunderstanding that when you start a business that you need to do something that's never been done. What do you think? I can ask this question all the time. I think there's a misunderstanding that when you start a business that you need to do something that's never been done.

I think that is the critical mistake that people make. It's like they're looking and they, and when you find something that's never been done, it's usually kind of niche. It's like small. It's like, yeah, there's a reason why nobody's doing that. Usually, usually. Sometimes it's a true invention. It's a. Usually, sometimes it's a true invention.

It's a good point. Sometimes it's a true invention. But I just hear these ideas all the time and they're a little bit, they're just kind of small. The biggest ideas are just take something in the world that's already big and proven, the demands they are, and just say, you know what, I can do it better. I can do it better.

There's something that's a little bit off here. Like it's just not done quite right, you know? You can pick any business you want and look at it and say like, is there an opening here? Is there a way to just rub this kind of industry or business? Is there something here? And yeah, and then just do it a better way.

Start small and just, you know, that is a foot in front of the other. No one's ever said that on here. No one's ever said that and I totally agree. Now by the way, if someone comes to you with a some brilliant idea. Yeah, exactly. That happens some time to time.

But you are so right that entrepreneurship has become this sort of like angel investing dream pitch. I have an idea, nobody has. And then it makes everybody else think that they'll have these ideas. I'm not that smart of a dude. I don't have ideas other people don't have, but I know how to disrupt places. I know how to build counter culture. I know that when I walk into a business and I go, this could be done better,

or said better, or presented better, or the experience to be. That is great advice right there for an entrepreneur. And I think, so one other thing I just add to that, that I've only really appreciated in the last few years, is the importance of timing, of like a segment of the market in industry. There's kind of a right time to kind of enter a segment. And if you look back in history, it's kind of interesting how things happen in groups. So like if you look back to you mentioned McDonald's

before, McDonald's, Burger King, Wendy's, Kentucky Fried Chicken, all started within a similar years. Why is that? Why did fast food happen then? Why did Target and Kmart and Walmart all start around the same time? Like it's because there are trends in society

that make businesses, you know, be the right time. And as an entrepreneur, if you're thinking about like, you're open to doing anything, there's two different kinds. I have this passion in this area, and I know this area well, and I think I can do it better, great, and follow that passion. if you don't have

Nestle a passion and you just say I really want to start a business and I'm excited I want to be an entrepreneur and I'm looking the first thing I would say is look Broadly at sort of the world and see where the where the mega trends happening and then and and get into A moving train you know get on a moving train because that's the easiest way to to raise capital is to get on a on a trend that's already already sort of in motion. I'm also curious to about I get asked a lot and I don't know he's not what the right answer is. You sound to me like you've raised a lot of money in the businesses you've done but I have entrepreneurs asked me often. I don't know whether I should go borrow money because money's cheap right now, or should I be giving equity away in my business.

Do you have a theory about when one is better than the other? Should they be going to get cheap money and leveraging their way to success, or should they be giving equity away? Do you have a theory about that? I do. I mean, you can make a case for either way. I like the idea of giving away equity.

One, because you just don't have, if you're raising debt, depending on this usually covenants, usually a time frame, and you could have a good business, and it could fail just because you can't meet the debt obligations, like that kind of thing. I never want that to be an issue. Never want a good business to potentially fail

because it wasn't financed correctly. If you raise equity, you always have the ability to lay your debt on. If you get into trouble, you can't. If you already have debt, you can't get in trouble. There's no more debt, right? And it goes the other way. When you get in trouble, the covenants kick in and you have to repay the debt. So I definitely think equity is the way to go.

Now a lot of people say, I don't want to give away a percent of my business or they're scared to lose control. One thing I tell entrepreneurs is a really important thing to know is that there's a difference between selling a piece of your business and giving away control. You can control the board of directors. Control every decision, make it so that you can't be fired, and still not on 100% of the company. And there's lots of like in-between nuance. Yeah, there's nuances.

I mean, it's hard to get like zero or 100% control, but there is, you can have 95% or 90 or 85, and feel really good about the control piece, and still only on 20% of the company, or 10% of the company. So the ownership needs to be thought of differently than control. So people worried about control.

You can solve for control and still sell a piece of the company. I think that's a really important lesson. And then in terms of the percentage ownership, some people are like, hey, I wanna own this whole thing. I don't want to just own 20% or 10% or so. Yeah, well, at the end of the day, it's 10% of a billion dollar business.

That's 100 million. That's a lot better than 100% of a 10 million dollar business. So as you're raising capital, all you have to think about is that this is a stock, and if you raise capital, can with you with this capital increase the stock share price by more than you could without the capital? It's actually just a simple equation. And so you would have somebody and say, okay, your business is worth a million bucks.

Okay, great. If you don't do anything, raise any money. What's going to work next year? Like, well, I hope it's worth two million. Great. If you raise ten million, if we were fifty, yeah, that seems better. You know, like it's sort of- So, wait a minute.

This is so good, because I'm gonna ask you this, what you're saying right now, because, and this is interesting, because you do think that way. Like I don't, I get the sense that you want a big place, and you've had some big successes. So this is so fascinating. What if I do have a million dollar business?

I wanna know how you really feel about this. I'm an entrepreneur, because that's the majority of people probably listening to this, right? They are an entrepreneur. They've got a business worth a million bucks. Maybe they're pulling 150, 200 grand a year out of it. And they're saying to themselves,

this is a lot better than when I used to work at a bank. When I was making 90, they weren't like you were a year bank. I was making 90. You know, I had to be somewhere every single day. Now, I'm making a couple hundred grand. I've got a business, we've got a dream. I kind of like the way that it is. Is your advice like, hey, you have to go play big,

because there's a lot of people in the space that are saying that now. Like if you've got a two million dollar business, it could be a 20 million dollar business. You should be thinking that way, or is it okay? Yeah, I think it's, I think it's perfectly okay. This is where it comes back to not everybody's got the appetite to take risk and go for it. If you're happy then a day, hey, we're all trying to just be happy in the end day, right?

It's like happiness. If somebody says to me, hey, I want your advice, Mark, I got this million dollars, I'm making 200,000 a year. I don't know what to do. And I ask them, like, are you happy? Oh, I love it. It's great. I have some time with my kids, I'm able to do this. I'm so happy. Did your answer. I love this answer. I'm so glad you said that. Because I feel the exact same way.

Yeah. Like I think everything we do comes back to one thing, wanting to be happier. Yeah. I actually also think some of the best entrepreneurs in the world understand that. And their subliminal message they sell for all their businesses is it's somehow being involved with us and make you happier.

Yeah. I think that's the subliminal message. Look at all their businesses is it somehow being involved with us will make you happier. Yeah. I think that's the subliminal message. Look at Ray Crock with McDonald's. Yeah. Guy sold hamburgers based on happiness. His number one meal is a happy meal. He's got a clown as a mascot. They sell meat in burgers.

It's unrelated, but they are related, right? Have you had any failures? I've had, I mean, I've been really fortunate that the final exit has always been a good story, but lots of failures along the way, yeah. Many failures, but you haven't had a business fail. I haven't had, no. That's awesome.

I haven't. I just, I've always put myself in a position where it was like life or death, if failure meant death. So I just, yeah, I had to go into like, six, seventh gear, eighth gear, you know. You know that you said that almost four times? Yeah, I just, go into like, you said that. Six, seventh gear, eighth gear. You know what I mean? You know that you've said that almost four times like her death.

I just, I really feel like it. And it felt like it every time. You know, it really felt like it. I think that really successful people do a lot of things really well unconsciously. And the reason I really listen to them closely in the interviews is they actually will tell you things about themselves that maybe they're not even aware

of sometimes. And this idea of your business being life or death for you is really real. You've set it multiple times, your face changes when you say it. And I think that's why you've not failed. Because to you at these stages where maybe some people would have given in or couldn't get resourceful or didn't find a way out for you,

it was literally death for you if you didn't do it. And that's something I want just to tell you that I see in you. That goes back to, I mean, it's probably not the healthiest thing. It's not like something I'd recommend. It's probably childhood sort of trauma-related kind of thing. You know, where, you know, just growing up, you know, my dad was, you know, not as present as, you know,

most dads are kind of thing. And, you know, the way to get his attention was to do something spectacular. And it's like, oh, interesting. You won the New Jersey State Championship. Hey, my son just went, I was like, oh, I got it. That's how you get attention. I get it. You got to do something significant.

And that's kind of interesting. Because I've thought about this a lot. You don't know what drives you as you sort of go. But then when you kind of reflect on it, you know, and that's kind of interesting. Because I've thought about this a lot, you know, you don't know what drives you as you know, sort of go. But then when you kind of reflect on it, you're like, huh, wait, why is it? Why do I feel happy? Because that's happiness. I'm not happy with this like million dollar business making 200 grand a year.

It's not happy. I'm happy doing big things, building things, and watching them become something big, you know, why? That's ultimately the question. I mean, it does make me happy, but it comes from somewhere. Yeah, that's probably where it comes from. So it's not like the healthiest thing. It's not like I would tell somebody you

should set up your childhood this way. This way, right. Yeah, but however, having said that, I think a lot of people use their childhoods. I've had, I have mine too. My audience is very well aware of mine. They can use those things as excuses to never achieve anything. What you did is you took those things

and you've leveraged them as some sort of fuel. Is it the healthiest thing in the world? I don't know, you've made lots of people very happy with the businesses you've built. You're happy, they're happier today that we get the chance to talk. Your family's happier, a lot of people have consumed these products and been happier.

So maybe it was worth it. But speaking of happiness, I've not ever heard an entrepreneur say this, the way that I heard you say this, and I think people should hear this. And that is that I was shocked when you were willing to be vulnerable and admit that after one of your significant exits, you actually became depressed. And that was because you have this analogy, I love of the difference between selling your company and selling out. Gosh, man, it's so talk to that person.

Yeah, this is so good. No, it's too. People often conflate the two, selling a company and selling out. Gosh, man, so talk to that. Yeah, yeah. This is so good. No, it's too. People often conflate the two, selling a company and selling out. And now I've been able to differentiate because I've seen it go both ways. When you start a company, like I said, the vision was the most important. You have a vision for what you want to become. You have a set of values.

You have a mission statement. And it becomes really a part of you, and people that come to the company come there for that reason because they believe in the mission, they believe in the vision and what you're trying to do. And if you wind up selling the company and that vision and mission becomes no longer valid, then I feel like you've kind of sold out.

And if you sell your company and you're able to accelerate, getting to that vision quicker, having a higher chance of success because you've got more capital, yeah, you sold the business, but you didn't sell, you still have the, what the reason why you started the company and the mission and the people that came there,

the reason they came is still valid after you sold it, it's just a different owner. Because you have owners when venture capital is owned your business, they own a percentage, they own it, and then you sell it to them, then they own it. So it's not really any different, the difference is whether or not the vision and mission stays intact.

Oh, it's okay. And I think, you know, when I first sold diapers.com to Amazon, that wasn't the case. The vision we had set out, the old diapers.com to Amazon, that wasn't the case. The vision we had set out, the mission was not validated after the sale. And it was very depressing, you know, and we were subsidiary of Amazon. And we had this incredible sort of baby business in baby and other verticals too, but primarily baby.

And Amazon said, you know, hey, just keep doing that baby business over here on the side. And you're going to compete with us, the mother ship Amazon, and we're going to compete, and we're not going to work together and build something great. That was really depressing. This idea, many people think, oh entrepreneurs, they just want to be left alone. They don't just want to be left alone. They want to be part of something bigger. And so I think with Walmart, the thing that was so interesting

and why we sold, but we weren't selling out, is because when I talked to Doug with Bill and the CEO and we started talking, we had a shared vision for the future. That is we wanted to create a formidable competitor to Amazon and we felt like there was a really big opportunity to leverage the assets of Walmart, the assets we had created a jet, the people bringing it all together and go after this big vision together. And here the key is Mark, you know, you're gonna lead this thing. I got to ask you this. You seem like a very

confident dude to me. Yeah. If we went back to the beginning of your entrepreneurship space, did you have doubts, fears, anxieties? You just seemed to me now, you'd be a dude I'd bet on. Multiple track records, we were talking off camera about some stuff you got going, I'm like, hey, loop me in. And I'm not getting looped in because the idea necessarily was incredible, although it was, it was more like, you think it's a great idea.

So there's this confidence you have about you. Was that always a key to your success, or is this something you've developed over your lifetime? And you didn't always have confidence and struggle with self-doubt and things like that. I think it's always developed, but I think that's probably one of the key strengths probably is just that I do get really passionate,

and I do think about stuff over and over and over and over and over and I finally mold that piece of clay and feel like it's in a good position. I go all into my mind believing that and the ability to sell that, well, to bring capital in and to bring great people in. It's really the ultimate key. So I do think you need to get whatever you're doing.

You need to get in a position where you feel so bought in yourself. And if you're not so bought in, like think that this is definitely gonna work, then you got more work to do to kind of mold it. You need to believe it's definitely going to work. If we execute, it's going to work. And then you always want to put the if on execution

because then that's something you control. It's people, it's work ethic, you can make it happen. Yeah, right. But you need in your head to believe that it's an execution game. How do you make it an execution game? You have to work that idea and think about it every which way. You love this. I love it.

Yeah, you do love it so much. You love it so much. What about the, I want to ask you this. You said something about trends earlier. Yeah. And, you know, I'm curious what you think some of them are. In other words, if you were looking at the world today and there was a trend line year looking at, multiple ones, sectors that you think are,

you should pay attention to these sectors. And these are ones that I think their best days have passed them by. Yeah, like, you know, too, I mean, I think their best days have passed them by. You have been interested in that. I mean, I don't make a lot of investments, but I made a couple investments in the last couple years, and each one of them is in a segment of the market, where I think it's kind of like,

it's on a good trajectory. One is EVTALS, which is the electric vertical takeoff in landings. It's been 10 years in the making, the battery power is getting to a point now where I do think in the next five been 10 years in the making, you know, the battery power is getting to a point now where I do think in the next five to 10 years that we will have autonomous flying sort of drones with people in them, it's the thing, it's gonna happen.

And it's like a good point to get in. And it doesn't mean you have to get into that. Well, what does it mean? If that does happen, what are all the other business opportunities that open up as a result? You know, and just thinking through that, I think this whole Uber Eats, Postmates, Delivering Food to People's Homes,

I think people don't like to cook anymore, especially the younger generations. That's sort of a trend I see. If you just spend time thinking about the world, you can see these trends and where things are going. I wouldn't want to, as an entrepreneur, with a clean slate, start something, that's either way too early, way ahead of its time,

where you just know this is the decade of learning, and a lot of people are going to get beat up for it. And you don't want to be late. I think in retail, starting retail, even when I did, was too late. And like there was a lesson learned. It was too late. Amazon had already been a very disruptive force by that time.

And so you learn these lessons, and I'm just want to share them with people. Because if I had to do it all over again, I probably would have been thinking about the market and where we were and where to sort of... I think it's two, I just want to tell you, I think it was two incredibly good pieces of advice. Number one, certainly the world is moving towards this ease of not cooking in Uber Eats and home delivery and all that.

I hadn't thought of it in that context, that's at 100% sure. And then you look at just what people seem interested in, which is this drone space, this Tesla thing, this community, this, you know, the driverless vehicles and air travel, and that whole combination of what you're describing there, those are certainly areas that the vast majority of people are interested in, and that's, there's a-

And I was told when they were with EBITOS, I was told when they're autonomous vehicles as well. Like, people felt, the way people talk about autonomous vehicles today was not that dissimilar than it was 10 years ago, but totally different from an investment point of view. It's so much more real, like now going forward than it was back then going forward. Back then it was that 10 year thing

you were talking about as it could beat up. Exactly, really, really great advice. All right, last thing because people are gonna be blown away by this, you're getting ready to race Jerry Rice. Yeah. So this has nothing to do with being an entrepreneur, really. But how the hell did this even happen? And why are you doing this?

This Hall of Fame? But by the way, I think Tom Brady is the greatest football player to ever play. But you could certainly argue a lot of people will tell you that it's Jerry Rice. Certainly the greatest wide receiver of all time is Jerry Rice. Why is the dude who walks out of the bank, who builds diapers.com and jet.com and sells a company to tops? Why is that dude racing Jerry Rice? Yeah, it's a long story. I'll give him the short. And are you going to win? Well, it gets it. Okay. It's a long story. But basically last year, you know, Rich Eisen, he does this 40-yard dash for St. Jude's every year at the Combine.

And last year, I was just researching, I was looking at kids' charities to donate to. And St. Jude's popped up and was like, oh, this is a great charity. I think this is, and then I saw Rich Eisen race the 40 year. And I thought, oh, wouldn't that be fun to go down to the Combine with Rich and run the 40. And so I just, you know, threw out there and made a bet. I said, hey Rich, I'll donate 100 grand if you beat me in the thing there.

And then of course, we went there and did it. And I beat him, but I made the donation anyway. And we were talking Rich was talking, and we were talking, oh, next year we should make this a bigger thing. Maybe if we got, you know, a professional athletes or other people involved, we can raise more money for St. Jude. So I just want to help Rich. Rich has done an amazing job of really, you know,

every year increasing the amount that he's been able to raise for St. Jude. And I thought it's a great cause, and I wanted to help. And so I just kind of threw out there. I think I threw out there. I was like, you know, like, what if I raised someone, you know, like Jerry Rice or something. And then of threw out there. I think I threw out there. I was like, you know, what if I raised someone, like Jerry Rice or something? And then of course the laughter.

And then it just like had momentum because Michael Rubin, who he's owner of fanatics, and he's a friend of mine. And we just made a bet that on this race, and he said, well, if you beat Jerry Rice, I'll donate 250 grand to St. Jude's, which is amazing. And I said, well, if he beats me, I'll donate it. So now we have this $250,000 on St. Jude's.

I prefer he donating, but I'm happy too if I lose. But we're hoping to get other people to kind of join in. And yeah, so that's kind of what we're doing. Well, you can follow Mark on LinkedIn, you guys, to get updates on the race, to get updates on entrepreneurship, and all the different things that we've covered today. I enjoyed today a lot, bro.

Yeah, me too, Ed. Really, really good. So good to meet you. Thank you. Great to have you. Hey, everybody, remind you too. You don't want to engage with you more deeply. I do it every single day on Instagram,

I run the max out two-minute drill. We had people here yesterday that want to contest to meet with me to get coached all day, a few weeks ago, people were on the jet. I give away max out gear, I give away tickets to come see me speak, one-on-one coaching, all kinds of cool stuff. And you can win every day. All you got to do is make a comment when I make a post on Instagram. I post every day at 730 Pacific, 1030 Eastern.

Make a comment on my post. We pick a winner every day. We also pick winners who make comments on other people's comments. So engage with other people. And lastly, if you missed the first couple minutes, no big deal, just comment every day. At the end of the week, we look at everybody

who commented on every post, and we pick winners from there as well, because I'd love to engage and connect with you more deeply. God bless you, max out. [♪ Music playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background, playing in the background