THE ED MYLETT SHOW - Nick Kyrgios: Grand Slam Mentality

Episode Date: March 26, 2024

Nick Kyrgios reveals all: battling demons, chasing glory, and finding strength in vulnerability. I’m serving up an important talk about peak performance and MENTAL HEALTH issues this week with NICK KYRGIOS, one of the most fascinating, and complex athletes in the world today and a powerhouse in the tennis arena known not just for his explosive talent but for navigating the complexities of mental health in the glaring spotlight. Originally from Greece, Nick moved to Australia at a young age and became one of the TOP TENNIS PLAYERS IN THE WORLD. He is known for a mercurial, aggressive style of play, including his fiery on-court rants, fines, suspensions, and other colorful displays. He has developed a legion of devoted fans, and a fair number of critics as well. But as you’ll hear, there’s a lot more to Nick than what you see in on the court. As Nick steps back to rehab from an injury, he's hitting pause to reflect on his whirlwind of achievements and the road ahead. For anyone standing at their own life's crossroads, Nick's candid exploration of his triumphs, trials, and mental health offers invaluable insights. In this episode we dive into: Overcoming imposter syndrome and building a foundation of self-worth amidst the pressures of professional sports. From battling substance abuse to confronting suicidal thoughts, Nick shares his journey through the mental health challenges that shadow athletic excellence The Weight of Expectations of others while staying true to your path The Cost of Victory and the all-consuming drive to win and the personal toll it exacts Knowing when to step back for self-preservation and the courage it takes to make that choice Hear what facing giants like Nikola Djokovic on the court reveals about competing with the elite Nick discusses his proudest moments, deepest regrets, and the lessons learned along the way Nick’s story is more than a sports narrative; it's a powerful reminder of the importance of authenticity, resilience, and the ongoing battle for mental well-being in the face of extraordinary pressure. His openness and honesty provide not only a rare glimpse into the life of a top athlete but also lessons on staying true to oneself despite the challenges. This episode transcends tennis, touching on the universal themes of ambition, adversity, and the unyielding quest for personal peace and fulfillment. Nick Kyrgios reminds us that even in the loneliest battles, there’s strength to be found in vulnerability and immense power in authenticity. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Roll your way into prizes like coffee, donuts, and even $60 Tim's gift cards. Play now on the Tim's app. Rules apply, Canada only, no purchase necessary. Visit the Tim's app for details. This is the Enmirel show. All right, welcome back to the show, everybody. So I'm so excited about today. This gentleman that we're gonna visit with, to me,

he may be the most famous person in the world, but he's also the most famous person in the world. He's the most famous person in the world. He's the most famous person in the world. may be the most fascinating athlete of my lifetime. He's a compelling figure. He's an interesting man. I'd call him, you know, on the surface, he's a very complex person. We'll see today when we talk with him. He's also, I would tell you, I think the most gifted tennis player that I've ever seen, talented or gifted, but between the two, he can do things on a tennis court that almost no one who has ever lived has been able to do. And he's going to be an interesting conversation today about success, about what really matters, mental health, performing

under pressure, humility. I think you're going to see a side to him today if you're familiar with him that you've never seen before. Mutual friends of ours rave about him just as a human being. So Nick Kyrgios, welcome to the show. I appreciate that, Ed. Thanks for having me. I'm looking forward to it. Oh my man! So, let's look at tennis just real quick. Although I don't want to spend a lot of time today talking about tennis. I want to talk about you as a person, but I've watched you over the years and probably like a lot of people, sometimes you frustrate me if I can be candid because I see this immensely talented and gifted man. And then sometimes, I don't know if you feel this way, but there's been times where, by the way, I root for you in every match you're in. Literally every match you're in. I find myself, I don't care if it's against Djokovic,

whoever it is, I root for you. But sometimes I wonder if you're even rooting for yourself when you're out there. Is that a fair question to ask you? Yeah, I think, I mean, look, I've always had a bit of a love-hate relationship with tennis. I played basketball when I was a kid as well,

and that was my true passion and at 14, obviously, picked the tennis kind of journey. My parents pushed me heavily towards tennis. So I guess I never really completely loved the sport and I didn't really have passion for it. So every time I kind of stepped out, there was always a battle of being completely vulnerable and going out there and giving my best effort all the time. Even though I'm a really sick obsession and I hate losing and I'm a true competitor, that's for sure, but tennis has always been not even my true passion. So that's been a hard struggle my whole career as well. What about now that you're injured, you're telling me you're in a tough rehab right now. Has distance made your heart grow fonder or has this distance told you, you know

what, I really like my life away from the game and the things I'm enjoying, not having to deal with the pressure, the expectations, the haters, the, whatever it is. Where are you at now? Um, I'm still dealing with the haters daily. Um, it's like I've had, I've had two surgeries now in a year. And as an athlete, it's incredibly hard because rehab is not a fun place to be. It's almost harder on a day-to-day basis

than it is playing and when you're healthy. You gotta do two sessions a day, two gym sessions a day. Gotta make sure your diet's good. You gotta just be like really knuckling down to getting back to that full health. But in a way, it's been, you know, a really crucial time for my, I think, just as a human outside of tennis, because I was from Australia and I was traveling six, seven months a year away from my family. Because in Australia,

we have barely any tournaments here. So the rest of the tour is always overseas. So I guess now being injured, it has given me to really spend that quality time with my family. I felt like I hadn't seen them in the last 10 years of my life, because I was always traveling, playing, and just grinding, I guess. So now it's been good to be back home and spending time with them,

and just being able to build so many other things off the court as well, which I think is so crucial for an athlete. Athletes struggle with that so much because they don't know what else to do after they finish. So, you know, that's been really a challenge for me too, but I've fallen in love with so many things outside of the sport of tennis.

And just like having a conversation with you, you know, this would never have come if I wasn't injured as well. So I know it's all a bonus and I just gotta change my perspective on it all. Do you want to come back and play? For sure. You know, I definitely think I've got so much more to give and I've got millions

of fans out there who want me to come go out there and play and, and try and take it to these, I guess, gods of the sport, like Djokovic, like a normal guy like me, like that will go out there and give these guys a good run. And I think, you know, that's special. And I think my body's got a little bit left and I feel like I've still got fire in the belly. You know, I've been putting in some hard yards the last month. So I definitely feel like I'll be back. And I just, yeah, I think I just don't want my fans and everyone to expect, you know, five more years of this circus that takes the court. Yeah. I want you to tell us about top level athletics that we wouldn't know. know, five more years of this circus that takes the takes the court.

Yeah. I want you to tell us about top level athletics that we wouldn't know. So I'm always fascinated. You're going out before a final at Wimbledon and it's you and Djokovic in the tunnel. You're both standing there. It's the, it's the day of it's a, it's a match against an adult or just another really great player. So, I mean, people don't realize this.

Look, there's tennis, there's junior tennis, there's high school tennis, there's college tennis, and there's all these levels of tennis, then there's professional tennis, then there's the majors, then there's, you know, getting to the quarterfinals, then there's getting to the semi-finals. You're talking about on spinning planet Earth. Really two, three, four human beings experience this at every tournament, right? What, what would we not know about that Nick? Like when you're back there in the tunnel and it's you and Djokovic or warming up,

tell us something we don't know about the highest level that might surprise us or some insights into the top of the top. So tennis is probably the only sport in the world that so basically me and Djokovic, we were, Wimbledon is a little bit different. So let me say the US Open. So in New York, so I'm playing Danil Medvedev. He's the number one player at the world at the time. And he's a reigning US Open champion.

So 10 minutes before we walk out to the center court Arthur Ash Stadium, I think it holds like something crazy, 60,000 or something. So five minutes before about to walk out and play in front of all those people and millions worldwide watching, man, this guy, my opponent could be Jock, which could be Raphael. We're all in the same locker room. So I shower next to these guys. Like we're in the same locker room and we ate next to each other. And then we have to go out and play against each other for four and a half hours. And then after we finish, we come back into the same locker room. And we sit next to each other.

It's like unheard of in sport, like everyone has separate locker rooms like NBA, NFL, NHL, they'll have separate locker rooms. You don't see the person like hours before. I literally see these guys for hours and hours before the match and we're walking out together and we walk back. It's crazy. Wow. I never knew that. Like literally, I saw you in the tunnel, but I did not know that.

We're all in the same locker room. We all showered together. We all ate together. It's crazy. Whoa. So what's that like? Like are certain guys playing some little bit mental warfare in there?

Like they're keeping their distance or? Really? Yeah, some people are really quiet in there and some people just keep their distance. Like me, I'm always in the locker room with a couple of my mates, like me and Novak or me and Andy Murray. We will always be quite like a joker

in the locker room and stuff. So people could look at that as like mental warfare too, like me just like clowning around, but there are definitely some people in there who don't give away anything, like they get their business done and just leave. But yeah, I mean, before Wimbledon, me and Novak just walked out of the locker room together.

We walked through the tunnel. There's the Royal Family's on the left, like there's guards there on the right. And I'm walking in front of Novak and I'm like, a kid from Canberra who was suicidal who was struggling with his own confidence and own identity. He's now playing in front of the royal family walking in front of Novak to the biggest stage in world tennis and I was like this is nuts and the doors like slowly open every blade of grass is even and I'm like Nick Kirios

isn't supposed to be here. Wow damn that's cool right there man that's super cool. When you're uh I'm really glad I asked you that. Let me ask you this what if you don't like the guy? There's got to be a guy you don't like like if you're back there's like. Yeah yeah I mean there's heaps of people that I didn't get along with great in the locker room and we didn't like each other at all but I'd shower next to that guy and I ate with that guy and we'd just go out on court and compete for four hours. When you're in a match and you,

you're starting to wear a dude out, right? Are there, can you feel it? Like, you feel like he's losing it. I can, has there been a time like they have to say who, if you don't want to, but like, can you begin to feel I am, he's losing his his will I'm outwilling this dude right now I'm too much for this dude right now is that happen can you feel it yeah in grand slam tennis I mean it's best of five sets obviously so you can literally my longest match I've ever played is four hours and 58 minutes um like absolute

battle in uh down in Australia. But yeah, you can I think mentally, when you're out there for that long on your own, you got no teammates, you got nothing, you have some serious conversations with yourself, you know, on the change events, like, it's it's a mental warfare, usually people have signs physically in that long that they're starting to kind of slow down a bit, you know, I've played a couple of top people in five sets, and I look at them, and I look at them, they're looking at their team, and they know that they're starting to kind of slow down a bit. You know, I've played a couple people in five sets

and I look at them and I look at them and they're looking at their team and they know that they're physically starting to slow down. But I mean, the lesson I learned physically was early. I was 19 and I was playing in Australian Open and I was one set away from winning and I wasn't physically conditioned yet to win these long matches.

And I full, my quads started cramping, my whole legs started cramping up and I actually wasn't able to play. And I ended up losing the match. And I was like, that was the conversation I had to do. I'm like, f**k, I'm never gonna ever lose a match again because I'm physically not ready to win these long, long matches.

So it starts with, if you're physically in good shape, I think that actually adds to your mental strength. I think people think that, oh, you've got to be mentally happy first. And I think it's actually incorrect. I think looking after your physical shape is more important first, because I think that links to you being like, okay, cool. Like I feel good, I look good, and I'm ready to keep going and I feel better about myself. I think physicality is more important in my opinion.

I a million percent agree with you even when it comes to mental health. I think it's hard to talk yourself and think yourself out of a mental situation you're in. I think it's a physical moving your body, taking a walk, as you said earlier, 100% Working out, you agree with that? I'm big time, I feel like which more important, the physical or the mental? That's a really hard thing.

But if I had to pick one, it would probably be to move my body physically. That changes my state. For sure, definitely. But you just like, if you feel good and you look good and you're happy with the way you're just functioning, I think mentally, that's just gonna roll on as well. So most of the people that watch my show,

they may or may not know tennis. In fact, I bet 20% know tennis. But they're all people who, they're trying to make their dreams come true. They're trying to figure out how do they win? What really makes them happy? You know, would getting to the top of something truly make them happy?

How do they get to the top? So let's unpack that for a minute. I'm curious as to your insights about this. So you reference Djokovic, arguably the greatest ever. I'm a Federer guy, but like, you know, there's something about the mental toughness of Djokovic that strikes me. You know, he can be down two sets and to watch this guy come back and rattle off the next three sets, you're like, this guy is getting killed the first two sets. There's something about him. And I'm curious as your answer, because you said a God like him, but I think most people would say

talent wise, giftedness wise, you can hit shots that even he can't hit, that you're that type of a level of a physically gifted talented. So like, let's say someone's listening to this in sales right now, they're just really good at sales or they're really... But is the separator, do you think Nick, when it under pressure, is the love of the game? Like when you're playing someone like that, what is the difference? He's reached a potential of the most majors ever and that doesn't seem to have been a priority for you. I'm just curious your insight. Like what is the difference between And that doesn't seem to have been a priority for you. I'm just curious your insight, like what is the difference between, you know, your level of love for the game potentially under pressure and his,

do you feel it when you're playing someone like that? And what are your insights about that? If you were to give someone the lesson about passion to reach their full potential, what would you say? Yeah. Well, I mean, look, I mean, we, we, we, me and Djokovic, we, we played on the biggest stage in the world. You know, we played on the center court of Wimbledon in the biggest, probably most historic and biggest event tennis has to offer.

And I feel like the one thing in my experience for that three and a half hours we were on court together was just his, I almost felt the consistency of his work over the course of his career. I felt like, and I didn't like, I felt like I actually, like from a talent standpoint, I was better at it than him at tennis that day, but I still lost.

And I felt as if he didn't do anything unbelievably well that day. He just was super composed and he just, I could feel as if the whole lifetime of his work was involved in that match. You know, I won the first set and he didn't seem fazed. And as you said, he's been thrown in so many different scenarios, pretty much every different scenario he's been in and he's come out on top. So his experience, he's been in some like 30 Grand Slam finals where that was my first

one. And I felt like his ability to stay in the moment and really trust the process of, you know, this hot headed Australian's come out hot, but I've been here before and I've, I'm going to steady the ship and I'll put the consistent work in. I feel like that for me was the biggest difference. His ability to just stay composed and, and, and have faith in the body of work that he put in for, for two decades. So I feel like that was the biggest separator. That's exactly why I love this man right there, you guys.

What he just did. His level of honesty and frankly, humility. It's the thing about you that I didn't see on the surface when I'm like, this dude's cocky, he's out. And then as I've listened to you, and some of our friends have told me, it takes great humility to say what you just said, brother. Because I know you're a competitor.

You know, everyone kind of just sees what they see on the court. And I'm definitely, I'll be the first to admit, like I'm psychotic and I have an obsessive personality to win and to win dirty, like I don't care. Like I was just taught in my, when I was upbringing, like losing was not accepted at all. So it was just like, you either win or you lose.

There's no like good effort or anything. It's just so when I'm on court, I'm two different people. I'm super competitive and I do twist the boundaries and I may cross the line on the court, but off the court, I don't really, like I'm like two different people. It's quite scary. So, hey guys, as you know,

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potential yet is I want to make sure I understand what you said do you think that under pressure at the highest level of business or life, that there's a confidence that came from a dude like him where I've put all this work in behind the scenes, and maybe there's a part of you in your case where you're like, I know he has and maybe I didn't. And so under pressure, don't let me speak for you, but under pressure, that was the confidence separator. don't let me speak for you, but under pressure that that was the confidence separator. I definitely felt that like a zin. Yeah, I mean I put in the work like I was not athletically gifted at all from a young age, like not at all. Like I was overweight and I constantly was felt insecure about you know my fitness levels when I was in the And I constantly was felt insecure about,

my fitness levels when I was in the academy in Australia and I wasn't able to pass any fitness tests. So I knew that I worked extremely hard to get there. But I think what I was thinking about, like, yeah, I was, there was a period of my life in 2019 where I was self-harming and suicidal and I was partying a lot and I was drinking a lot. And I was also competing at the highest level, you know, against, you know, there was a night

where I was out till 4am against Rafael Nadal. It was a pretty dark time. So I felt like for me, it was just a bonus to get to that point. Like to make the final at Wimbledon against Djokovic was like a bonus for him. It was just like, I was just another ant like in his journey to chase a legacy and be one of the best players to ever live. Where for me, like getting there was already the bonus. You know what I'm saying? Like everything after that year was just like, I made it out of that such a dark period of my life that now I'm like, I'm in the finals of Wimbledon. Like this is what like being getting yourself out of a big mental

struggle can lead to where for him, it was just like he was chasing, like not every person and every athlete can be like the greatest of all time. That's just not how it works. You're on the area I want to go. I think this is the part of the interview, everybody, where you share it, what we're about to talk about. Uh, I think this is where Nick helps people in ways that most people don't give them enough credit for,

which is I want to talk about mental health with you and pressure. So I watched that Netflix documentary you're in, and I was surprised you did grow up as a chubby kid, right? Because I see this dude that's got swag. He's got just this cachet about him, Nick does, the way he moves, the way he talks. He comes across this unbelievably self-confident person. And then as I dug into it, I'm like, wow, and by the way, correct me if I'm wrong about the severity of it, but I'd like you to speak to this for a minute. You actually have struggled with mental health to the extent where like you actually had an alcohol and drug thing you think you had going there for a while.

Is it true that you actually played in Wimbledon after you had harmed yourself where you had to wear a wrap around your arm? In a tennis match because there was some self-harming going on and what other things have you struggled with? Is that accurate by the way what I just said that that is true? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's amazing to me, bro That's amazing. Yeah, the world did not know that was going on No, not at all. Um Yeah, that was the that was the main thing I felt like when I was playing Yeah, that was the main thing I felt like when I was playing at the top of the sport and I guess living like an athlete should live at that point.

No one really expected me to be going through that. So it was hard because my right arm was covered with it and I was playing on center court women against Rafael Nadal and I was like, I can't go out here with mom looking like this. So I wore like a sleeve to cover it all up. But yeah, like it was just, it was such a hard process because I knew how I was feeling internally and I didn't wanna play. And I knew that I was struggling,

even just to wake up and go outside was a task. But then I had to like, kind of just, I had the avatar that I had to live up to as well on the other side of it where I had to go out there and play. And it was, it was, it was hard. Yeah, it was really, really hard. Was there a part of you brother that you didn't want to be here anymore, that you were suicidal?

Oh, definitely. Big time. I felt like no one, I mean, to this day, you know, people still only really want to talk to me because, you know, Nick Kyrgios, the tennis player, the crazy guy who does all this crazy stuff, the talented person. And it took me a while to understand that

that was just the vehicle and one way of communicating who I am as a person. And then I sit down and they get to meet me and it's cool. But I really struggled with the fact that I felt like my, how I was all the time, like 95% of the time wasn't enough. It was like no one really gave a s*** about who I was and what I had to offer just as a normal human. It was only just about that guy that they saw on the court. And you know, my family

started like, you know, we grew up in a pretty quiet area in Canberra. You know, we weren't rich at all. So it was like, obviously when I started being successful, my family didn't really know how, you know, to approach things and how to handle things as well. So things got different in my family and it was just all a bit like, it was all just a big curve ball for me. Like I wasn't ready to handle that type of success in a way and the fame.

So I really struggled with it, yeah. You know, I'm the blessing that I work with several athletes in different sports golf MMA boxers NFL MLB, I just working with an MLB guy now and I gotta tell the audience this because Nick is not unique in this that at the top of everything even in business the pressure that comes with that can create or exaggerate mental health issues for a lot of people.

It really can. And Nick, I'm sure since you've shared this, you would privately, we would never say who, but I bet other athletes have told you they've struggled with it as well. And it comes with the pressure of doing something great. So a lot of people listening to this, even if they haven't done that yet,

they're down right now They're there they feel isolated and alone or misunderstood or even invisible, right? What would you say to somebody who's going through a time like that or has a loved one in their life? Who is going through which by the way, I think is The majority of people not the minority of people. I think mental health is a crisis right now in the world today. What counsel words would you speak to somebody who's just, they're just not feeling very good right now?

Yeah, I mean, look, life's f***ing hard. It actually is brutal. And I feel like the one thing I did that made it worse was block people out and try and do it on my own. I feel like as humans with that, that's not even how we're supposed to function. I think I blocked out my family. I was very short with my good friends that genuinely cared about my well-being and I tried to take it alone head on and it was just worse.

It was like I was heading into a storm where the outcome was never going to be good and I was in a psych ward in London. And the day before I played Nadal, and they wanted me to be admitted into this place for a couple of weeks. And I was like, I can't, I have to play in Raffaell Nadal in Wimbledon tomorrow. That's how bad it was.

And then I proceeded to lose that match. It was very close, I nearly won somehow. And then I was partying for like three days straight and I was in bed and my dad sat next to me and he was full blown crying saying, I can't see my son like this anymore. Like it was really bad. And then I basically just, you have to want to fix it. Like I knew that it was an issue. I knew that I was causing stress on my family, my friends, everyone that cared about me.

And I knew that I had to fix my habits. And it started with getting up in the morning, like something small, like going for a walk, like, you know, just like really break it down into how am I gonna just change? It's not gonna happen overnight. It took me two years to reach a level where I wanted to actually wake up early in the morning

and go for a walk. Like it didn't just happen overnight, but fixing my relationship with my family, my friends, I've got an incredible partner now who's super supportive of me and we have a great relationship. And it stemmed, like I was in my last relationship, my partner was so toxic and that was also feeding into it.

Like you just, I can't put enough emphasis on the closest five people around you have to be incredibly positive and want the best out of you. And they might make you feel uncomfortable sometimes in the sense like holding you accountable or like wanting you to improve to a sense of being uncomfortable sometimes. But those are the only people I have around me now. And if they see me slipping back into these habits of doing some drugs or any of these types of stuff like every now and then, like they hold me accountable

because I know that a personality like me can slip back into these dark habits and it's not fun. Wow, bro, I'm like blown away. This is real, just so you know, when tennis is over, this is your calling. Like part of what you should be doing is this right here, impacting people's lives because, I don't know know if you all hear what he just said. He was in a psych ward the night before. He's playing Rafa'an al-Dadaal, like

Rafa'an al-Dadaal. That's insane to me. And so if he can come from where he did and make improvements, and by the way I think you'd acknowledge this, I by the way have struggled with when to quit something. I'm reading, I'm actually, I can't remember the title of the book, but I'm actually reading a book about right now. Essentially it's how do you know when to quit or quitting I'm reading, I'm actually, I can't remember the title of the book, but I'm actually reading a book about right now, it's essentially it's, how do you know when to quit, we're quitting. And for me, it's physical health. I'm just doing too many things that have impacted my life physically to the point where something has to go away, right? And this is in my life. I'm being real honest with everybody here today and that's affected, you know, different areas of my life. I wonder if

you've navigated that question like, when is it okay to quit? You know, when is it okay to take a break and how do you know that? And it's one of the great questions in life, you know, is that we're always climbing for more and more and more and sometimes I think you have to audit whether your original dream is your dream anymore. And if you're going about it the right way, I'm just curious your thoughts about that. You're smiling.

It's just like, I guess that's the common kind of struggle that I guess you've dealt with it, I've dealt with it. And I actually asked, you know, Gary this, Jay Shetty this, Gordon Ramsey, all of these amazingly successful people that have insane work ethics, by the way, like, and I go to them, do you ever just like,

sit back and actually just pause for a second and see what you've achieved and what you've done. And none of them like say like, no, they just do it. And then they don't even like have time to appreciate what they do. They just go to the next thing and they do it. And I'm just like, and I sit there internally, I'm like, man, that's just like, when's enough enough

as in like, you know, you've probably got enough money to be good for your future generation. It's just like now, like, but you just, there's something inside you. I'm sure it's the same with you. You just want to like go to, you want to wake up tomorrow and keep going to the gym. Like you want to stay motivated.

And I just don't know, like, if work-life balance exists, like I don't have the answers for this question because it's like, the more successful or the more things I achieve or the more things I'm able to dabble in, and I want to do more. And it's just like, I don't know, it's an addiction. I'm not sure. I don't have the answers for it,

so I can't help you with that one. But as I'm learning. Well, I'm addicted to the expansion of my being. I'm addicted to the expansion of my being. I think, I don't even think you have to have the answer. The reason I asked it to you is I think it's powerful to ask yourself the question, though. And just contemplating in your life,

is this where I wanna be? Is this what I wanna to continue to do? And I think that's a healthy thing. I think sometimes we think it's a weakness to ask. It's a weakness to inquire. I'm 53 years old in a month. I've made lots of money in my life. I've had the ability to achieve a lot of different things. Yeah, there is a point in your life where priorities change.

And it's just worth checking in with yourself. Are these still my priorities? I think is the is the question it's it's different for every single person and I wanted to ask you that today because it's something that I know a lot of people ask themselves it's true in the relationship they're in it's true in the business they started it could be in a sport that they're in I get asked this by athletes all the time and you don't want to ever get outside of something and go man I could have gotten more out of that. I regret I didn't go a little bit more.

Yep. Right? There's a part of that. There's a part of me though, that I've also struggled with as I've climbed higher and higher. There's been a, I think I just, I'm the son of an alcoholic. And so I think I've always struggled

with a little bit of imposter syndrome in the sense that I'm sort of Do you? Yeah, just like I never I never feel like I never feel like I'd like it's very strange for me to even be talking to you or something like I just I don't feel as if I don't take myself seriously at all in the sense like I just Yeah, I feel like every every time i'm in a room with someone that's, you know, that have achieved something great, or like, I don't feel like I deserve to be there either.

I don't know. It's a weird feeling. What do you think it comes from being a heavy kid? Do you think it's how you grew up? Yeah, I think so. I mean, I, I just, the only reason I ever wanted to start playing tennis and, and become one of the best was just to show that an average person like me, like an overweight kid that lived in

Canberra, Australia, was able to go out there and beat some of the greatest of all time. That's all I wanted to show. I just wanted to show that the average person, like if you really just put your mind onto something, you can, you can do it. That's it. That was my, that was my goal. Sabotage yourself a little bit with that belief, Nick. Like, do you think there's been some sabotaging unconsciously that took place

either where, whether your preparation or something on the court or just a thought when you're out there, if you're being honest, that affected your performance based on that imposter syndrome? I think so. I think if I was a bit more, like honestly, if I was a bit more selfish

and I was a bit more like, I guess, more orientated to doing the best for my career, my training and not like helping other people or being there for others as much. I definitely feel like I could have had way more success in my career. But that success doesn't outweigh for me the success like yesterday, two days ago had a foundation day in my hometown. And there was over 1200 kids in my tennis center that I grew up in. For me, that success outweighs the success of winning a grand

slam and being more selfish and being more involved in my own career. Because one of the best things when I opened up about my self-harming and my suicidal thoughts was the amount of people that messaged me on social media that I've got their numbers now, I stay in contact with, I call them. And it's like, that for me has been the most powerful thing in my career. It's not about the trophies. It's about, and that's my point. I think that's the answer of why, when, when are we going to stop? When are we going to quit? And I think you shouldn't because of all these things that you're doing and achieving and your platform and you're growing, you're being, you're, you're, you're just spreading your awareness

of helping others and I think that is for me. Like that's what keeps me going to be honest. Like me being able to show up for two hours at a tennis center and kids are going crazy and gets them to want to be active and play tennis and who cares about if they're good or not. It's the fact that they feel like they mean something for that little period of time.

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I had Deon Sanders on a few weeks ago, Coach Prime, and he was talking about a stage of his life where he was suicidal, believe it or not. Maybe the greatest defensive player to ever play football, right? And he was talking about that, you know, he had had everything he wanted. He had a bunch of money. He had, you know, the mansion. He had this success. He had all these things. And he said, and then I just was miserable. And I said the power in sharing that, and this is a lesson for everybody, as I said, in life, we're most qualified to help the person we used to be. And if you're willing to share, this is who I used to be, or even him sometimes still. But I'm a work in progress. Being willing to reveal your imperfections with people is

what really connects with you. And to be honest with you, I'm a big fan of Federer. I'm a big fan. I loved Bjorn Borg when he played and, you know, a a huge tennis fan but there's something about you and your vulnerability and your authenticity that connects me with you differently that they're not you're not Superman you're a real man yeah and and and to me that you've stumbling on to the greatest part of your life right now bro and the other people that are listening to this if you're willing to be vulnerable and authentic with who you really are whatever you whatever you really believe in whatever you really stand for whatever your fears are your weaknesses your failures your shortcomings

you're going to find that the more you reveal that the more you connect with people and the more that you can help them and the more you improve as well like you improve like there's no like i go into places sometimes and I, the person I'm in the room with can be rich, powerful, whatever, famous, but they're not willing to even just admit where they have flaws. And, and I just know like he's stunting the growth of becoming more of who he is as a person. And I just like, I love it. Like when I'll be the first, like people think, like I love it for the first, people think that

I'm like super confident all the time, like whatever, all these great things. And I'm like, bro, they're like, that's not me at all. Like this is what I'm good at. These are my points where I can improve on. And that's how you can, you just said it, that's how you connect with people. And that's why I love doing these things now

because I think people are starting to understand that I'm completely different for how, you know, the image has been painted out for so long. The thing that worries me is when you have somebody who's already struggling with their self-belief, this is you here. I want you to talk about this. So you're already struggling. Like when I was coming up in business, I already, my main struggle was working on me to the point where I believed in myself enough so that I could achieve. I always say that your identity, and I've watched this with you brother, I think you relate to this, your identity, your self-worth, the things you really truly believe about yourself, it's like a thermostat setting on your life. So like in the theater right now in my studio, it's 72 degrees in here. And what happens in life that if your results start to heat up past what you believe

in yourself, so you get 80, 90, 95, you subconsciously turn the air conditioners on of your life and cool it back down to what you believe you're worth. And I really believe in your case, like this is a man with 150 degrees worth of ability and potential, but there's this kid in there still that sometimes it's 72 and 75 degrees and that thermostat setting comes back on. So I spent most of my time working on that. I still work on it. And when you lump onto that person who's already struggling. So it's a lot of people listening to this.

They're already struggling with their self-belief and then they have criticism. In your case, like flat out haters. So that combination is like for me coming up, it was the worst possible con. I'm already trying to increase my thermostat setting. I'm not one of these naturally confident guys, right? So I'm already working on that. And then you heap onto me some form of criticism. It was like massively difficult combination for me. And then in your case, it's public criticism. So how do you, how do you deal with that brother? Cause you're already struggling internally as this guy who's like, man, I'm this heavy set kid. I'm from a regular place. I'm an average dude.

And then now there's criticism and haters educate us on how you have tried to deal with that and what advice you would give to any human being who's dealing. It might even just be their boyfriend or girlfriend like you can't do this. What's wrong with you? Why are you trying to change? Yeah, it could be family, could be anyone close to you. I mean, like, I don't think my family genuinely believed that I was going to be one of the best tennis players in the world from like, just I don't think it's realistic. Like they weren't programmed to think like that. And that's why you myself, we do achieve because there's a part of us like, Oh, what if like, what if we do push the boundaries a little bit? What if we do, you know, ask the question. But I mean, this, this day and age for

me is, is very hard, because like, I'm a bit old school in the sense like social media, and all of these things that are happening now, like for me, like, like, like, I wake up, and I can go on my Instagram, and I see thousands of negative comments. And like, I don't really take them personally, but subconsciously they're going into my head. And when things get tough, like when I'm about to do this gym session, like in here,

it's like, we go to the point of failure. It's like, I start thinking about, oh, am I this, am I this? Like, and it beats you down so much. That's what I struggled with in 2019. It got to a point where I actually started believing these comments and then I started hating myself. I was waking up in Shanghai playing a tournament at like 3 p.m. I played, and I was literally waking up

to like alcohol, like I wasn't even drinking. It was just to the point of like I hated myself and I started just believing all these people. I didn't even know what these people look like. But I started believing the comments. And now I have to seriously like every day, really invest in just like, not fading into and not even trying to read it and just trying to like self affirmations, like trying to tell myself like, I'm a good dude, like I train hard, like I've really put an effort in that and

people will maybe watch this and say like, I'm not going to do that. But it goes such a long way. But now I wake up, I try and like, you know, just that like have just positive words because words, words, words can kill can kill people in this day and age. That's how brutal it is. Like I've seen people like, like commit suicide just because of what someone said to them and what they say on social media

and all this comparison and it's really bad. By the way, I want everyone to hear that. Words can kill people. I can tell you definitively in my work because of all the messages that I get from different people around the world, but as a fact, please extend more kindness to one another. Please be careful of keeping criticism on to somebody, deserving or undeserving. You could

be contributing to something so harmful in somebody's life, and I strongly urge everybody just to extend a little bit more grace and a little bit more kindness to people. Brother, your work is profound what you're doing now and I'm wondering in your career if you looked back since you're so honest is there something particularly that you're proud of and is there something particularly that you you know you really regret? What's the thing you're really really proud of and then what's the thing if you looked back so far that you regret?

I'm proud of the way I've been able to provide for my family and, and my friend, like my friends and my partner, like that's for me, I think as a man, that was my main goal. Like when I was young, I watched my family struggle with with bills, we had no money to kind of do anything. And now I'm able to, you know, make them all, you know, enjoy their life. And there's no stress of that. And everyone's just, I think, really happy in my household. And when I take my friends out to dinner, I'm very lucky that I'm able to take care of them and my partner lives a great life. So I think for me, that's what I'm most proud of. I'm most

proud of that I've taken the pressure off my family. That's like, and I feel like that's what you should be most proud of. Like every, like everyone that's really like out here grinding and waking up early and doing this, like that's the main goal. It's like your, that's what people are hating on on social media that they probably can't, they're not able to take care of their people. Like you take care of your people. And that's what, that's what, that's what I've broken it down to. It's like, how can someone call me like any sort of names or you didn't achieve this, you didn't do this. It's like, bro, I'm able to take care of my people the best I can do. That's so, so sick. And regret, I mean, I've

thought about this for so long, like, well, things I would do differently and change. But I think the more I reflect on it, I don't think I regret anything in my career because I think the person I am today, and as you said, I think I'm transitioning and stepping into the best part of my life now with all my hands in different sort of areas. And it's not just tennis and it's really exciting. And I'm waking up with all different types of stimulation.

I'm here talking to you and it's just so cool. And I don't think if anything changed prior to this moment, I don't think, I don't know if it would be the same. So I don't think there's time to regret anything. I think like you can say like, oh, maybe that wasn't the right decision and I didn't move in the right direction, but I don't think you would take that away

because I've f**ked up so many times and I've made the worst decision possible. Not even a bad decision, like the worst possible decision at times. And I'm still managed to navigate through all of it and be here and have good habits now. And that's what I'm saying. I don't think I regret anything, to be honest.

The other thing that people deal with is, by the way, what a great conversation. I'm really grateful we're doing this. I'm really, really, really grateful. All these years I've watched you, and then I introduced you this way, and I mean it. There's a depth and a dimension to you that's really compelling,

and I'm just really impressed with you. The other thing that you've had to deal with, that people deal with in different ways, and this is a real thing in life, I did, it's other people's expectations. So like in my case, I went to college and I remember when I decided to become an entrepreneur, the disappointment kind of on my dad's face initially. Like he loved me, but it was almost like he was so worried for me, you know, that I had made this particular choice.

So it was the expectations, almost like I had disappointed my dad with the choices that I made. And I just, you know, I never wanted to disappoint. It wasn't that my dad was a hater by no means. I think in life sometimes you have to distinguish between people who are genuinely concerned for you, even if they're wrong, and someone who's antagonistic towards you right in my dad's case he wasn't antagonistic he's my dad but he was certainly concerned and disappointed and i remember thinking man i've my dad's expectations i've let him down i think a lot of people their spouse has certain expectations their family have certain expectations

their friends are used to them being a particular way and And man, in your case, I don't know there's been a lot of athletes that had more expectations poured onto them than you. And that's something really to deal with, to escape that, to navigate that. It's one of the keys to becoming a blissful human being. It's almost like, in your case, I think no matter how much you had won, people would have expected more winning, right? It would never be enough. So how would, how do you recommend people deal with other people's expectation and am I right that you had to deal with that? I think you just, it just, yeah, you never can please anyone. I guess everyone's going to know this. Like everyone's going to have opinions. Like in my eyes now, I think I've had a really good career. Like there's only been a couple hundred human beings since the beginning of time that have made

a Grand Slam final. And like, if I look about the chances of me doing it, it was so slim. And now I've done it. So like, I'm not going to sit here and talk about achievements and stuff, but I feel like, yeah, I mean, I wake up still to this day and I haven't achieved enough or curiosity is the biggest waste of talent to ever touch a tennis track. Like that's a that's something that I've literally dealt with every single day for the last 15 years of my life. Like since I touched the tennis track and I was on tour, I continually deal with it. So yeah, you just have to go back to the basics and think like, am I trying to still move

in the right direction? Like, yes, I'm trying to train hard. I'm trying to eat well. I'm trying to maintain a level of lifestyle where I'm even going to improve. I'm still looking to improve in different areas. And it's just, it's hard because I know that my family wants me to continue to play for a couple more years and have a year where I'm competing for Grand Slams. Like I know that my fans want me to win the Grand Slams. And I know that I'm, if I look myself in the mirror,

like my chance to win the Grand Slams is slim. It's possible, but if I don't win a Grand Slam, I've already had a conversation with myself. I'm okay with that. I know I'm a good person. I know that I tried my best in like helping other people. And if I don't win a Grand Slam, that's fine. I'm not gonna let that define me me but I know that I've already accepted that people

are gonna be disappointed like if I don't win one everyone around me will be disappointed and it's just you just have to be okay with it like as long as you're okay with the path you're on that's all that matters because I already know that at the end of my career there's gonna be a lot of disappointed people. Hey guys so I'm hearing from so many of you right now about how tight money can be, you know, you end up filling up your gas tank, you go to the grocery store, everything after that for some of you, it's you're swiping the credit card just to pay for things. I got a message the other day from a lady on social media who said to me she goes I end up having more month than I have money. And so I know some of you can really relate to that. Now the good news is interest rates have dropped into the fives again for the most part which is a lot lower than credit cards and so if you're swiping that credit card I think maybe American Financing can give you some help. Right now they've saved about eight hundred and fifty four dollars a

month or about ten grand per customer they've been saving on average right now. So give them a try. Call 888-995-2440. 888-995-2440. Or visit AmericanFinancing.net. NMLS 182-334. NMLSConsumerAccess.org. APR for rates in the 5 start at 6.406% for well qualified borrowers. Call 888-995-2440 for details about credit costs and terms. That's a really profound thing. I'm on this thing right now I'm speaking about and I think of certain people when I describe this and you're one of them. I have this theory that the reason I always say conformity is the, I didn't make this up by the way, I heard it somewhere years ago, but conformity is the ultimate form of cowardice.

Meaning conforming to what the world expects you to be, be a particular way. It's sort of a cowardly approach to life. And I think we're taught this as kids, the kind of color within the lines. You know, that was one of the things you're taught in school. And I'm talking a lot about this on stage right now, color within the lines. Don't go that was one of the things you're taught in school. And I'm talking a lot about this on stage right now. Color within the lines, don't go outside the lines. That's a bad thing. And I remember I'm so uncoordinated and I'm left-handed

that I could never color like the other kids. I was always outside the lines a little bit. You look at old pictures of me and like, kindergarteners like, my gosh, it's terrible. And as I've gotten older, I'm like, actually that's one of my great traits is I don't color within the lines. I've decided to have a life that doesn't color within the lines like everybody else.

And if you think about someone in sports who is not always colored within the lines, maybe sometimes it was own detriment, but it's you. I want you to talk about it because like, are you intentionally that way? You think you were born like I'm not a Conformist I'm not a lot of hate comes with it a lot of Criticism comes with it But you are really dude who does not color within the lines in your life And I think that I actually think those are usually the people in life We admire Martin Luther King didn't color within the lines, right?

He didn't color within the lines you right? He didn't color within the lines. You think of someone that's a hero of yours, or a person of faith, like they didn't color within the lines. They went outside of what everybody's expectations or what the norm is. They weren't part of the pack. People in the pack seemed never really accomplished very much in life. So I just wondering your thoughts on that. Well yeah, you asked me, do I intentionally try to cut out sidelines? No, like one of my childhood friends, like we literally grew up since seven years old from my hometown and he's, I was exactly the same way at that age that I am today.

The way I play tennis, I'm on the court, I'm very emotional, I wear my heart on my sleeve, like emotions, like I used to cry on court as a little kid, like when I was losing, like I was always very emotional on court. And I guess someone like me, I was already against the eight ball, you know, with tennis. Tennis is a very white, old traditional like sport where it's very respectful, it's a gentleman's game. People used to wear vests on court. And I feel like if I was thrown into like an NBA sort of team or, you know, we have rugby in Australia, like I would be probably one of the nicest guys on court. I

wouldn't like do anything crazy. I'd be like, oh, he's like, he's, he's a softie. He's, he's not one to worry about. If I played any else ball because it's tennis, it's like, oh, this guy is an abomination because I walk differently and I dress differently and I speak differently than I wear a red Jordan hat at Wimbledon. It's like, Oh my God, this guy is a criminal. So it's like, I guess I was always seen to be a person really is against the grain, which I am. I'm not, I wouldn't say I'm like, I'm like, I'm a rule breaker for sure, but I'm not like someone who's crazy, crazy. Like there are people in Australia who will just walk past me

and their mouth will be on the ground waiting for me to do something crazy. Like that's how bad this whole media thing has gotten. They think that I'm a nutcase. Like they'll just look at me and be like, do something, like do something crazy. But no, I think me playing tennis and the way I am that created the kind of thing that I was just like,

I wasn't even coloring the page that they want me to color. I was doing something else. I think that's why you can actually make mistakes and not have regrets. I think the regrets at the end of the life is someone who just colored within the lines the whole time and goes, man, I blew it. I never found out who I was. They're scared to take the chance. They're scared to do something that is against the grain because that's where the best things happen in my life. Like nothing good in my life has actually come

and by sticking to a plan that someone else gave me. Like I made a decision of doing something crazy or like doing something spontaneous or instinctively, that's where all my best successes come. that's that's just i don't know if it's dangerous word of advice for everyone to do it because i think like it doesn't work for everyone too some people need to be measured and have a nice plan and have goals i think that works as well but for my personality my best moments have come um just

doing things instinctively okay two more things last two things the other thing people don't know about tennis and i watched you in that Wimbledon when you ended up in the finals against Djokovic. I just wanted to be in I wanted to ask you this while I was watching it. So the other thing the most people don't know is you have a team in a box that's up there right and even in matches that you were winning. Yep. I was watching you sort of like I thought at least it looked to me like kind of yelling up there at him a little bit right. Giving him some s***. Yeah I was wondering is that what you're doing are you trying to fire yourself up are they are they giving you instructions that you don't want like because people that usually win have a team that might be in their office maybe somewhere else but

like yours is like right there in the box you just you know you didn't win a game or you missed a forehand or the backhand and I'm watching you and other players seem to be like kind of calm when they're doing that. That's their formula. You look like, were you yelling at them, yelling at yourself? Like what's happening then with you and your team? So we, so I mean, I'm very talkative on the court. Like other players, they don't like to talk, they like to get in their zone. But for me, an outlet of pressure is having conversations with people that I know

I've put in a decade of work in. And their insight to me is very important. I don't always like to, if I'm in the heat of the moment, they might see something from that view that could be worth something to me. So I'll always ask them, say something to me, like, as in like what you're saying,

like just say anything, could be anything to just take my mind off what I could be missing something. And then like, we have, I mean, look, at times, like I'm just talking just an outlet pressure. Like I'll say something that's not even relevant to tennis and they just look at each other like, why is he talking about that right now?

They're like, this guy's got serious mental issues on the court. And then we get off the court, they're like, you're nuts. And I'm like, yeah, no, I'm so sorry. Like that wasn't even me. I don't even know who that person was. But yeah, these are, these are my like my childhood friends and my agent now, like we went to school together. You know, my physio, my physiotherapist, we've been, you have been working together for almost 11 years, he's in the gym with me every day. These are my people that we've literally created this whole journey with. So I just wanna win so bad, not only for me,

but for them too, I want my whole team to, and ultimately the better I do, the better that they do as well. So it's like, I just want us all to have success basically. I love you. This is so good. So a couple things guys, follow Nick on social media. He's also got a new show out that he's doing. What's the name of the show Nick? Good Trouble. It's called Good Trouble. Good Trouble. Good Trouble. Check that out. He's already had it. Fit right in. Yeah, I'll be on there for you brother. And he's got a bunch of great guests on there already that he's been telling me about. So go check that out question. I got a friend named tim grover. I'm sure you know who tim is you work with jordan and coby And i've had other athletes and athletes will ask me this in fact. I just had a ufc guy here last week

and he's like, you know i'm debating whether to I'll call it the evander holyfield come into the ring and peace and worship music's playing and I'm going to leverage the light. That's my motivation, my dream, the light, my vision. Or am I coming in there like Kobe or, you know, the black mama and I'm going to leverage what Tim calls the dark side, almost like leveraging pain, going to that dark place to win.

I'm curious in your case, what works for you and what you would recommend to other people. Are you more of a like chase the light and the thrill of victory type guy and the vision if we win the dream or are you like kind of leveraging that dark stuff? I'm a fat kid. They don't think I've got this. You know, I'm the guy who always screws off. I'm the guy who's doesn't reach his potential. I'll show you blah, blah, blah.

Which one do you leverage? I mean, I think I definitely get more into a competitive zone if I'm thinking about the dark energy that's been thrown my way. I kind of like, I love proving people wrong. I love, you know, spoiling someone's day or really trying to, you know, play the villain role going out there in front of, you know, I played Roger and I played Rafa, I played Novak and I was always the villain. Like I played them all around the world and I never had the crowd on my side.

So I guess I've kind of been thrown into that energy already. I didn't really have a choice. So I had to hone in on like, no one in this stadium wants me to win. Like there's 50,000 people in there all chanting Roger's name. And I got goosebumps for him. So I'm like, that I'm going in there and I'm going to like, I'm going to be the, I'm going to, I'm going to, I'm going gonna screw this story up so that's how I am big time I got news for you man the more people see these interviews that's gonna change

and they're gonna be ready I want I know you don't like I know you're gonna have a problem because you're too likeable and you're too good of a man who's the goat Federer Djokovic Borg the, Nadal? You gotta pick one man. I don't know if you want me to answer this bro. I want you to answer it. I want the real truth. Who is? Novak. It's Novak. Novak is. Yeah. And you play against all three. What's that?

I know that you're a Federer guy, but it's Novak. It is Novak. Okay everybody, you heard it here first. That's gonna make TMZ sports for sure right there but I always wanted you've been on the court so you would know you've played against them. For me in terms of helping people you're the new goat of tennis because you're contributing to people's lives and I want you to get healthy physically I know mentally you're improving and growing and I'm here to help you anyway I can when we get offline here I'm gonna give you my number and man I growing and I'm here to help you any way I can. When we get offline here, I'm gonna give you my number.

And man, I love you. I'm impressed with you. And you made a big difference in people's lives today, bro. Thank you. We did it together. I appreciate it. Thank you. All right, everybody. God bless you. Max out your life. Share this episode. This is The Edmirer Show. Hi there. Sorry for the interruption, but are you enjoying this show on Google Podcasts? You should know that the Google Podcasts app is going away this spring.

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