THE ED MYLETT SHOW - The Man Who DID NOT Want to be Elected Feat. Dr. Ben Carson

Episode Date: September 8, 2026

What does America look like from inside the Oval Office, and what do you learn about leadership when you've actually run for President of the United States? I don't normally talk politics on this show, but when I got the opportunity to sit down with Dr. Ben Carson, I couldn't pass it up. This isn't a political conversation. It's a rare opportunity to hear from someone who's run for President and had a front-row seat inside the most powerful office in the world. Dr. Ben Carson has occupied seats very few human beings ever will. He went from growing up in poverty in Detroit to becoming one of the most accomplished neurosurgeons in the world, then stepped into an entirely different arena and ran for President of the United States. What surprised me in this conversation is that he told me he never really wanted to be President. He entered the race because he was deeply concerned about where he believed the country was heading and felt called to do whatever he could to make a difference. Along the way, he competed against Donald Trump, developed a friendship with him, and ultimately went on to serve as Secretary of Housing and Urban Development. Today, Dr. Carson gives us a rare look at what he saw from inside presidential politics and the highest levels of our government. I wanted to know what happens when the cameras turn off. What is it actually like inside an administration? What surprised him about being that close to the Oval Office? Dr. Carson talks about the competing personalities and opinions inside government, the intense energy required at that level of leadership, and why disagreement behind closed doors can actually be healthy. We also have a fascinating conversation about President Trump, including what Dr. Carson told him while they were still competing for the Republican nomination, why he believed Trump was going to become President, and what he observed working alongside him once he was in office. Whatever your politics are, this is a perspective very few people can give you firsthand. But what struck me most is the temperament Dr. Carson brought into an arena that rewards conflict. We talk about how divided the country has become and why he believes we've lost the ability to disagree with someone without treating them like an enemy. He shares why leadership requires listening to different viewpoints, why a "my way or the highway" mentality doesn't work in a country as diverse as ours, and why our ability to see each other as neighbors again may matter more than any political label. We also get into home ownership, the expectations of the next generation, AI, parenting in a rapidly changing technological world, and what he believes families can do instead of waiting for Washington to solve their problems. And then you hear the story behind the man. This calm, measured former presidential candidate was once an angry teenager who tried to stab another young man. The knife struck a metal belt buckle and broke. Dr. Carson went home, locked himself in a room, turned to God, and experienced a transformation that changed his entire future. As he told me, God took the knife out of the hand of an angry teenager and replaced it with a scalpel that would save lives. When you hear about his mother, his childhood, his faith, his journey into medicine, his run for President, and eventually his time inside a presidential administration, you begin to understand why his perspective on leadership is so different. Key Takeaways: Why Dr. Carson says he entered the presidential race even though he didn't really want to become President What happened between Dr. Carson and Donald Trump while they were competing for the Republican nomination What surprised him after getting an inside view of a presidential administration What he learned about leadership, disagreement, and decision making at the highest levels of government Why he believes Americans must relearn how to disagree without treating each other as enemies His concerns about AI, parenting, home ownership, and the future facing the next generation How faith transformed him from an angry teenager who nearly took a life into a surgeon who spent his career saving them There are very few people who can tell you what it's like to operate on the human brain, run for President, serve in a presidential cabinet, and sit inside the rooms where decisions affecting millions of people are made. Dr. Carson can. Regardless of your politics, this conversation is about something bigger: leadership, faith, character, family, and what each of us can do to build a better future. This is one I genuinely didn't want to end. God bless you. Max Out your life. Visit Upwork.com today to post your job for free, and connect with top talent ready to grow your business. Go to ButcherBox.com/MYLETT to get $20 off your first box, plus your choice of free ribeye, new york strip, or filet mignon in every box for a year — with free shipping always. 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This is the Edmireland show. All right, welcome back to the show, everybody. I have to tell you, the man to my left today, first off, there's two dress codes, one for the smart person and one for the idiot. And so I'm the one of the jeans. We're both speaking at an event here today. He came appropriately dressed.

I came for the podcast. So I have to tell you, there's a short list of people that I've wanted to meet in my life because from a distance I've had such admiration for them. And not only the things that he's accomplished, but the method. in which he's conducted himself publicly is something that I admire greatly.

And so he's really, he is truly one of the most remarkable people alive today in my book. And his story, there is no better story you're going to hear than the one you're going to hear today. Let me tell you a little bit about him. It grows up in poverty in Detroit with a single mother, ends up becoming one of the top neurosurgeons on the planet. That wasn't enough. So then he decides he's going to run for president. And a lot of people were behind him doing that.

Then he becomes the HUD secretary. And he's also got an unbelievable think tank. and his philanthropic work is unbelievable. And the IQ disparity today is going to be very obvious as we kick this thing off. Dr. Ben Carson, thank you for being here. Well, thank you for having me. I'm delighted to be here.

I want to know about your mom. I've always wanted to know about your mom. Well, she's probably the wisest person I ever met. She didn't have much in the way of education. She came from a huge family in rural Tennessee. Okay. achieved less than a third grade education, bounced around from house to house,

got married at age 13, trying to escape poverty. And they moved to Detroit. Is that where you go to escape poverty at that time? Well, actually, Detroit was kind of booming. At that time. Automobile capital of the world. True.

And not long before that, Detroit had proclaimed the most prosperous city in Detroit. I mean, in the Ninth State. So the factory jobs were what made it that way. My father had one of those. But some years later, she discovered that he also had another family. So that resulted in a divorce. She was trying to care for my brother and myself with a little in a way of education.

We ended up moving to Boston to live with her older sister and brother-in-law. typical tenement large multifamily dwelling boarded up windows and doors sirens and gangs roaches every place first time i saw a water ride i thought it was a dog this was so big but that that was the environment both of my older cousins who we adored were killed a lot of drugs and it was that kind of a place And my mother worked hard because she wanted to get us out of the environment back to Detroit. She worked as a domestic cleaning people's houses, going from one job to the next job to the next job. But it worked, and after a couple of years, we were able to move back to Detroit. Still in a multifamily dwelling, still with plenty of wildlife.

But nevertheless, she was independent at that point. and I was just the worst student you can imagine. Oh, you weren't. I was terrible. Okay. And in the fifth grade, we had eye exams done. Oh, okay. And that was amazing because I didn't know that anybody could see the board.

You thought everybody was like you. Okay. So once I got glasses, I had an amazing transformation. I went from an F student to a D student. But, you know, my mother was still very unhappy. Because, you know, she saw the beautiful homes that she claimed. And then she saw where we live. And she says, what is the difference?

So she became a spy. And she said, you know, these people, they read a lot of books. And they don't watch much TV. So she came home one day and imposed that on me and my brother. And we were not happy campers. But we had to read. And that's where the real transformation began. Reading.

Reading. Because all of a sudden, my world went from the streets of Detroit to the streets of the world. And I began to learn so much stuff. And I got excited about learning. And if I had five minutes, I was reading a book. And within a year and a half, I went from the bottom of the class to the top of the class. And that really changed the way I thought about things. Did it change the way you thought about yourself also?

Definitely the way I thought about myself. And won a scholarship to Yale at that point. I thought I was the smartest person in the world. but if not, certainly, in the top five. By the end of that first semester, I was wondering what I was doing there at all. Really? Yeah.

Because, you know, the way I operated at Southwestern High School in the city of Detroit, I could study for an hour before the tests and get a, hey, you know, it was not a problem, but wouldn't quite like that. Yeah, standard changes. Very, very different. And, you know, the Lord got me through

that I was failing freshman chemistry. He got me through that. I really did. And I realized at that point that he really had a mission for me and that it was in medicine. But none of that would have

been possible if he hadn't had such a relationship with my mother. If the Lord and your mother didn't have such a great relationship. Right. So education, reading, this is part of the formula. By the way, her son ends up growing up to get the presidential Medal of Freedom,

which is the highest honor you can get as a civilian on the planet. So that's, she did something right. She did, even though she got a lot of complaints from her friends. From your friends. From her friends. Okay. You can't make boys stay in the house and read books. They'll grow up and they'll hate you. And I used to overhear them and I say, you know they're right, brother. We still had to do it. What about? So I'm trying to pick apart the recipe because there's not a pair of listening to the show. But let me just say this.

She got the last laugh, her friends, because one son became a brain surgeon and the other became a rocket scientist. I wanted to ask about your brother. Is that what your brother? Really? That is unbelievable from the circumstances that end up with both turning out like that. But it shows that this really is a land of opportunity. that we live in, we just have to create the right pathway.

As you might say, the right life surge. The right life surge. On that, one of the things I'm going to spin all over the place with you, because I want to ask you a bunch of different things. But you were the head of HUD, housing and urban development, and one of the paths that worries me in the world today, my son's in the room here today, you met him, is the difficulty of this next generation of able to,

afford a home. There was a time when I was growing up that even on one income, somebody could at some point make enough money to own a family home. This is almost non-existent now. Does that worry you? Is there a path for that that could be changed? It is worrisome, but also remember when I was a youngster in Detroit, there were GI homes. There were 700 square feet. They had two bedrooms, one bathroom, a living room, and a kitchen eating area. All in 700 square feet. Now you tell people, you're going to live in the 700. They say, what are you talking about?

It's got to be at least 2,000 square feet. So, downsizing, downsizing one's expectations. Because what we have to remember is that it's a climb. It's not a declaration. You finish school and you get to be here. You finish school and you get to start at the bottom and climb your way up. And people want to get a bachelor's degree and they want to be executive vice president. That should be their first job.

It's not like that. So that has to change. No question about it. But I think we also have to start thinking of new and different ways to do things. Remember the Vietnamese boat people when they came here? They couldn't afford houses either. What did they do? Three or four families in one house.

And then as they became gayfully employed, that would move out. Then there'd only be three families. but the other ones will be making more money. And then there'd be two families and other ones would be making more money. And, you know, you envision an end point, you envision a strategy to get there. You don't just sit there and complain

about what's going on. Do you feel like there's too much of that? There's way too much of it. You said something interesting. So I've been doing the show for 10 years, so probably about almost 1,000 episodes. No one's ever said, downsize your expectations before.

By the way, you'll catch some flag for that. as you know. I'm wondering, I want to merge the two worlds. This woman's raising you. She ends up with two sons with his extraordinary success, reading standards, faith, God, all of that's part of the mixture. But what about expectations or dreams? Was that never part of the conversation? Well, our expectations were that we would do very well. But we knew there was a pathway to get there. It wasn't just wishing that you're going to be there and boom, you're there. Okay. Not a magic wand.

Do you mean that I want to understand, do you think that there's too much immediate gratification with this Instagram, click world? We think we should have the house everything now. That's the problem. Everybody wants everything immediately. Okay. And there is a pathway to get there. I think this country probably is the best country in the world to do it. You'll notice that there are a lot of people who come here from disadvantaged areas, places like Cuba.

and they do very well. Yes. They say, why do they do so well? Because they have a plan. They have a vision. They know they have to start down here and work their way up. That's the difference. So it's not really so much downsizing your expectations as it is being realistic

and the approach that gets you where you want to be. I do think about that a lot. The people that come here with no advantages, that it's their second language. And so many do find their ways I think of all different groups of people. Cubans are Asian friends that have immigrated here. I mean, for people from every country, we should probably name countries. But I do think about that. I also think about you.

I've always wanted to ask you this. I almost picture your mother with these two boys, though. What an amazing accomplishment. But I also, when you were running the first time, I didn't know who you were before. And I had heard the story about you separating the twins. And I knew this legendary story, but I didn't know that it was. you. Right. I mean, you know, unbelievable career as a neurosurgeon. Then you're running and immediately you stand out. You stand out for a lot of reasons, but the main reason was, oh my gosh,

this appears to be a kind man, obviously of high intellect, but he is not doing that thing where he's going to tell you everything that's wrong with everybody else. He's doing that thing where he's painting a vision for what he thinks it should look like. Let's just be real. There's a way you conduct yourself that is very different than our politics. Honest answer, please. Do you think there's any room for a guy like you in the political arena nowadays? You know exactly what I mean. Probably to help people think about things.

Meaning move the conversation, but not get elected. Well, I didn't really want to be elected. You didn't want to be elected. No. The reason I got into it is because I was, afraid of where the country was going. So you wanted to... I was afraid we were going to go off the cliff.

And I was willing to do whatever needed to be done in order to keep it from going off the cliff. But during the campaigning, Donald Trump and I became friends. And he really wanted to be president, and I really didn't. This is so interesting to hear. Okay.

And we actually were both doing very well. I think after the first debate, you were in front of him and everybody else. Well, it was actually in August when I first hit the lead position. When that happened, were you going, oh, my gosh, I'm out over my, I don't really want to do this. Well, I tell him that he was going to be president. I said, because that is something that God has ordained because of the position. that are countries in right now, not because you're a wonderful person,

but because you're the right kind of personality to get done what needs to be done to save this country. You know, God used a lot of interesting personalities in the Bible. So he knows the end from the beginning. But he always remembers, you know, that I tell them that.

But I, philosophically, we had a lot of the same philosophies. We have very different personalities. But I still talk to him. And, you know, he really does want to save this country. But, you know, his personality grades against a lot of people. I wish there were more men and women with your personality. I really do.

And by the way, everybody watching this, regardless of their politics, which is the temperament of our country would change. Because I do think that what comes from the top in leadership, whatever you believe politically, this has nothing to do with politics. And even having you on the show, I know there's a tone and there's a culture that of how we treat one another day to day that I believe the leader sets that tone. My preference would be your tone. Well, you know, what does the Bible tell you that says to love your neighbor?

Not to cancel your neighbor if they disagree with you. We've changed considerably from who we used to be when we were a country that was a large community. And we didn't so much to say, are you a Democrat or Republican, and if I can talk to you? Right. It was, you're my neighbor. You need help? Hey, I'm here. That's a real problem right now because there are those who really want to divide in this country.

You have to divide this country. It's too strong because of our faith and our families. So if you want to overcome it with communism, Marxism, whatever, you have to divide the people on the basis of race, age, income, gender, political affiliation, religion. You've got to get them fighting each other. And it was Lenin who said, you'll never change a country like America. They're too strong.

unless you can get them to destroy their own future with useful idiots, people who will fight against their own well-being and out of their children without thinking. Interesting. This rise of socialism in the country is there's a backdrop to it. And one of the reasons there's a rise

is that people don't see that path for themselves. Whether they're right or wrong, they don't see that path for themselves. And so that's an appeal. healing path to some people. The other thing that's risen, whether that's the leadership tone or just frustration in life is anger. People are angry. It surprised me to read, correct me if I'm wrong, that you struggled with like an anger thing as a young man. And so if that's true, tell us about it. And then how do we change that and how did you change it? Well, I would get so angry that I would

become irrational. Like once the fella hit me with a pebble, it didn't hurt. But I was angry that he would hit me. He would dare hit me. I picked up a big rock hurled at his face, broke his glasses. I almost put his eye up. Wow. Philo was trying to close my locker at school.

I didn't want to close. I struck him in the forehead with my fist. Unfortunately, he still had the lock in my hand, put a three-inch gash in his forehead. But my mother was trying to get me to wear something. I didn't want to wear it. I picked up a hammer, went to hit her in the head with it. Oh, my brother caught it from behind. You can see, other than that, I was a pretty good kid.

That's shocking to hear based on your... No, but when I was 14, another teenager angered me, and I had a large camping knife, and I tried to stab them in the abdomen. And fortunately, he had a large metal... belt buckle on under his clothing. And the knife blade struck it and broke. You're kidding me. Your life could be totally different.

Just like Camillo Anthony, the kid down in Texas. I mean, it's just that anger and boom and your life is completely gone at that point. But long story short, God

took the knife out of the hand of an angry teenager and replaced it with a scalpel to save lives. That's what he does, you know? That's this specialty. I wish everybody was watching us. It's not audio just to see your face change right there.

Why is that so emotional for you? The part when you talked about God, you have this thing that I respect in men when I'm with them. You have a tender heart for God. What is that, that thing I just saw in your face? Well, just because, you know, he can see the end from the beginning and he can see the good in us.

And he can see what our strengths are and what our weaknesses are. And he can take them and fashion them into something that will be extraordinarily successful if you allow it. But you have to allow them to do it. You know, with my anger issue, after I tried to stab the youngster, I locked myself in a room. And I started contemplating my life. I had changed academically by that time. I was a straight-A student. But I said, you'll never become a doctor with a temper like that.

Your options are reform school, jail, or the grave. And none of those appealed to me. And I was saying, Lord, if you don't change me, I'm not going to make it. There's just no possibility. I was reading psychology today. I was thinking I was going to be a psychiatrist at that point. And reading about behavioral modification and all these things. But I knew we didn't have the money for that.

And I just said, unless you change me, this is it for me. And I pick up a Bible, open it to the book of Proverbs. There were all these verses about anger. Like Proverbs 1919, there's no point. getting an angry man out of trouble because he's just going to get right back into it. But Proverbs 1632, mightier is the man who can control this temper than the man who can conquer a city. I mean, it spoke to me. And then there were all these verses about fools also, but spoke to me too.

And the spirit helped me to understand while I was sitting in that room that the reason I was angry all the time is because, because I was selfish. Because it was always about me. Me, my, and I. Somebody did this to me. Somebody took my space or they're in my space. I want this. And if you learn how to take yourself

out of the center of the circle, you wouldn't be angry. That was the last angry outbursts. The last angry outburst. That was the last one. And some people say, you just learn how to hide it. Yeah.

But no. God, when he fixes it, he doesn't do a paint shop, he fixes it. That is so good. But let me tell you a little more about God there, though. Please give it to me. You know, from that day until this day, I start every day reading from the book of Proverbs. You do. Who wrote the Book of Proverbs?

Solomon. Solomon wrote the Book of Proverbs. My middle name is Solomon. God must have known that was going to happen. But what was the first thing that Solomon did when he became the king that brought him great fame? Two women came to him claiming to be the mother of the same baby. What did he advocate? Divide the baby.

That's when I became very well known when I divided babies. Oh, my God. He has a sense of humor, too. Oh, my God. Did you? Let's stay in faith for a second. I feel like the students there. I want to stay in there.

You also have a very scientific mind. And as a neurosurgeon, I'm sure you saw a lot of things that were heartbreaking as well. And so a lot of people have a hard time, you know this, reconciling a lot of very smart people, so to speak. Sometimes look at people of faith like, oh, that's cute. Or people that have seen a lot of hardship in their lives. And they say, why can that happen if God is a loving God? Correct. What would you say to them?

I would say that God loves us so much that he doesn't force us. He gives us choices. And we are on this earth living out those choices. It started with the first man and woman. And everybody will have an opportunity to see where those choices lead. And I think it's becoming increasingly apparent in the world that we live in now. And I think he will come back as he said he would. I have total faith in that.

But he did tell us what would be going on. And he said before he came back, the world would be like it was in the days of Noah. Evil everywhere. It's coming. And, you know, I'm particularly concerned about AI. When people have hard time deciphering between what's real and what's not real.

And so I don't think it's going to be that long before it comes back. You don't think it's that long? I don't think so. Amen. Let's stay on AI. Big topic on my show. Big topic.

You'll look at it from a different perspective. I just listened to something yesterday about this, too. Pretty good debate about the, here we go, because I know you're also conservative as well. So the regulating of it. and how should there be regulation of it? If so, how much, also who. But this notion that we were a year or two away from, you know,

the idea that it is smarter than all of the collective minds in the world, whether or not that's true or not, I don't know. But the fact that it could begin to shape culture and tone, and that's deeply concerning to me. So how do you feel about regulating it? Well, I'm not conservative or liberal. I'm logical. But, you know, I recognize that once it's out of the box, you can't put it back in the box.

Okay, so it's coming. So what we have to do is figure out how do we use it and how do we make sure it doesn't destroy us. That should be of interest to people from both sides of the aisle. I think it is. Yeah. But I'm surprised I don't hear much about it from either side. It's the greatest change of our time, right? And of all the things that are discussed.

It's like the Internet. I mean, see how that changed everything. Right. It may be much more so than the Internet. So we have to take it seriously. the real challenge is going to be for parents whose children are growing up in the world of AI and virtual reality.

I mean, it's hard enough to get kids off the Nintendo's and the PlayStation. Can you imagine when they can disappear into their own world? And if parents don't exercise significant control, parental control, those kids aren't going to have a change. That's scary and sad at the same time.

Yeah. I see it on your face, too, when you talk about it. What's it like inside? I'm just curious. So we're talking about, you know, you're logical. You're not left or right or conservative or liberal. By the way, I don't know that I'm even logical, but I'm certainly not left. The logic part sometimes escapes me, too.

But give us a peek. You've had a very rare seat in your life to a lot of different seats in your life. but inside the Oval Office, inside the operating system of our country, which is really that of the world as well, what would surprise most of us that you saw or that surprised you? Is it the bureaucracy? Is it the, what about it? I don't want to lead you in a direction. Well, I think what might surprise people is how involved the president was.

I don't know where he got the energy I really did not understand I asked them once I said that's when he was 78 he's 80 now I said most people 78 years old

are sitting on a porch in a rocking chair and here you are doing that where are you getting all this energy and he said God he said that that's what he said

And I don't think it was just because he thought I wanted to hear that. That was my first thought. My first thought. But, you know, he was deeply touched by what happened in Butler, PA. He thinks about that every day. And he does have an inordinate amount of energy. I think most people would be shocked. you know, he's up at 2 in the morning.

If there's something going on it or, I mean, it's just unbelievable. But I think most people might be surprised to know that inside, it's just like it is outside. In a sense that you have different opinions, people feeling very strongly about their opinions. And that's why there's always turmoil in any administration. You're never going to find everybody on the same march. But in a way, that's a good thing. Some dynamic tension. Because you need to always consider all the different viewpoints.

In a country like ours, which is composed of so many diverse components, my way or the highway is not the right way. You always have to be willing to sit down and talk. And that's what has not happened historically. And societies that have the conflicts that are going on with us right now. One side of the other side, and they want to obliterate the other side. And the record has not been good at the number. world. We did well for the first 250 years based on our Constitution. Now we have people who want to

get rid of the Constitution, who want to rewrite the Constitution, you know, who want to do all kinds of things that make absolutely no sense. If you have something that's working but is not perfect. You don't destroy it and start all over again. It just doesn't work that way. You say, what can we learn and what can we do together so that we all can live with us? And I think we're capable of that. Well, I'm glad that you have some optimism about it. Because when I sit in a seat nowhere near as close to that as yours, and I think most people listening to this are watching it, I don't know. There's some angst, some fret, some real concern about where the world is heading.

And it's not just the decisions. It's the way we are treating one another. The thing you said about energy, I want to go back to that just for a second. I've had the good fortune. I've met President Trump a couple times. I'm fortunate that I, you know, had a relationship with President Obama. I had a friendship with George W. I've met Bill Clinton.

They all, there is a commonality and you're right about something, even though their ideology may be different. These people when you're around them as a leader have an energy, a frequency, a vibration about them somehow. Have you noticed that in leaders you've encountered in your life that just literally energetically, there's something about them that is a little bit different and they're conscious of it almost, it would seem to me. I think that's the thing that brings them to the point of leadership. That's why it was, you know, the previous president to this one. was sort of not energetic, to say the least. But that was a very unfortunate episode

in our chain of leadership, which had unfortunately some severe ramifications, but we'll get through those things. Hopefully, as long as we have that kind of energy and a desire to actually resolved the issues. And, you know, the next president and the next administration, be it Republican or Democrat, if they have that desire for healing, I think good things could potentially happen. Let's assume for somebody, the last question. First off, I would do 25 hours with you,

but you're going to be on stage in a few minutes. There's all these things I want to know. from inside of you and I've got some of them today. So you've talked the last part there about, you know, what maybe the government can do to help, you know, the next leader, whoever it is, to create healing and bring people together and those things. And that's, hopefully, I think everybody would pray that that would be the case. But let's assume that someone's not going to wait around for the government

to do that or change that. And you would speak to somebody right now who's the head of a family. And they said, Dr. Carson, I want to take my family to a better place like your mom and your brother and you took your family. And what should I be focusing on? What should I be doing to change my family's stage in this world and have us make a bigger difference, make a bigger impact, a little bit more abundance and freedom in our family to change?

Well, there is no better place that you can take them on this earth, but there is a better place you can take them spiritually. It's that relationship with God. that's what really brings peace. As it says in the book of Isaiah 263, that will keep him in perfect peace, whose mind is stayed on the day because he trusts him thee.

I found that to be the case. When, you know, I've faced tension and troubles, I just turn back to God. You know, it's so easy to forget about him. Start trying to do things our way. And he's always, there, he's not going to force himself on you. But if you want to call upon Him, with faith,

trust in the Lord with all your heart and lean not into your own understanding in all your ways, acknowledge him, and he shall direct your path. That's the better place. I feel like I don't want to let you go. Can I just sit here with you for another hour? I have to tell you, you know what's great in life, you see somebody from a distance and you hold them in high regard and then you meet them and they exceed your expectations

that there's a, there's a kindness, a gentleness, but yet there's some strength about you at the same time that makes me just want to sit with you. Praise the Lord. You know what they used to call me in the hospital? What was that? Gentle Ben. Gentle.

I can see that. Thank you for today. Absolutely. This was like just remarkable. You guys, you don't get a chance to sit in on a conversation like this very often. Whatever your politics are, he's a treasure. And there's so many lessons that came out of this last 45, 50 minutes together that I hope you feel compelled to share this with somebody that you love, that you care about, and that you believe in. Dr. Carson, thank you for today.

Thank you. God bless you, everybody. Max out your life. This is the Edmireland Shaw.