The Entrepreneur DNA - [REPOST] Russell Brunson Breaks Down How to Sell Anything Online (After $1B in Sales) | Russell Brunson | EP 72

Episode Date: May 19, 2025

Join Russell's LIVE Selling Online Challenge May 20th -22nd. Go to sellingonline.come/DNA -- In this powerhouse episode of Entrepreneur DNA, I sit down with marketing legend Russell Brunson, co-founder of ClickFunnels and author of several best-selling books. Russell opens up about his recent injury, why he’s ending Funnel Hacking Live after 10 years, and how he’s preparing for his next evolution—possibly filling Madison Square Garden. He shares the behind-the-scenes psychology of selling online, the ROI-driven mindset that shaped his billion-dollar empire, and the secret to creating content that actually converts. Whether you’re a beginner or seasoned creator, this conversation will reframe how you think about offers, content, and building long-term impact online. -- About Russell Brunson: Russell Brunson is a digital marketing pioneer, bestselling author, and co-founder of ClickFunnels, a platform that has generated over $1 billion in sales. With a career spanning 20+ years, Russell has become a global authority on sales funnels, online persuasion, and entrepreneurship. He's the author of DotCom Secrets, Expert Secrets, and Traffic Secrets, and is behind the wildly successful Funnel Hacking Live event. A former competitive wrestler turned business mogul, Russell’s teachings have helped create thousands of millionaires around the world. Follow Russell Brunson Website: https://www.sellingonline.com Instagram: @russellbrunson YouTube: @russellbrunson Podcast: Marketing Secrets Books: DotCom Secrets, Expert Secrets, Traffic Secrets   -- Thank you to Mando for supporting today's podcast! Stay Fresh, Stay Confident with Mando! Tired of body odor? Mando Whole Body Deodorant keeps you fresh for up to 72 hours—pits, feet, and everywhere in between. Grab the Starter Pack and get $5 off (over 40% off!) with code [COLBY] at ShopMando.com. Smell fresher, stay drier, and boost your confidence. Get yours today! -- About Justin: After investing in real estate for over 18 years and almost 3000 deals done, Justin has created a business that generates 7 figures in active income through wholesaling and fix and flipping as well as accumulating millions of dollars of rental properties including 5 apartment buildings, 50+ single family homes, and 1 storage facility Justins longevity in real estate is due to his ability to look around the corners, adapt to changing markets, perfecting Raising private capital, and focusing on lead generation which allows him to not just wholesale and fix & flip, but also accumulate wealth through long term holds. His success in real estate led him to start The Entrepreneur DNA podcast and The Science Of Flipping podcast and education company, and REI LIVE where he’s actively doing deals with members. He has coached and mentored thousands of aspiring and active investors over the last decade. Connect with Justin: Instagram: @thejustincolby​ YouTube: Justin Colby​ TikTok: @justincolbytsof​ LinkedIn: Justin Colby  

But then it's crazy. Like I think about this. We launched Cliffhadles a decade ago. It feels like yesterday. Like I still remember sitting in the room with me and Todd like trying to figure out like what color the button should be, you know? And now it's a decade later. It's just like it goes so fast and we're always worried about, oh like I got to figure this out right now. Like no, just be consistent. Keep planting the seeds. Love the harvest. Plant the seeds. Nourish the seeds. Plant the seeds. Nourish the seeds. And faster than you will know you'll be where you want to be. Like Tony Robbins says, we always overestimate what we can do in a year,

and we underestimate what we can do in a decade. So think in decades instead of years, and be consistent, and that's the magic how you win this game. What is up, everybody? What is up? Welcome back to the Entrepreneur DNA podcast. I could not be more fired up about this.

I know I say that a lot, but I'm telling you, the guests are coming on to this show our top tier I mean literally the 1% of the 1% The guests that you are watching now on YouTube is what I would argue probably the best marketer of our time hands down Arguably the best sales person of our time. I mean this man is a three-time best-selling author He is giving away all his secrets. He has quite literally given them away in his three bestselling books.

We have Russell Brunson here. What is up, dude? I'm doing good, man. How you doing? I'm doing really good. Now, you're saying you're doing good, but I see a sling. Let's start with that.

I know we're saying- Like an elephant in the room, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, so I still, so growing up, I was a competitive wrestler. Wrestling in high school, wrestled at college levels, tried to compete for Olympics elephant in the room, yeah. Yeah, so I still, so growing up I was a competitive wrestler, wrestled in high school, wrestled at college levels, tried to compete for Olympics back in the day, and then took like two decades off,

and then started just once a year, there's a tournament for older guys to go wrestle at, so I work out for a week, I show up and go wrestle, and this time, I was two weeks ago, actually ended up tearing both my biceps. So my bicep on both arms, the bicep also ripped off the bone during my matches, which is kind of crazy. The first one happened in the first match and then the second one happened

the third. Anyway, I kept going because you know, who needs biceps when you're wrestling? And anyway, and then from there we had a family, we had spring breaks. I flew from the tournament to Hawaii. So for a week in Hawaii, I'm like something's wrong with my arms. Definitely. They're like swollen up like elephantitis. I couldn't curl, I couldn't lift my backpack. I was like, something's really wrong. So I got home in an MRI and they're like,

yeah, both of your biceps were ripped off of the bone. I'm like, oh. So I got the first one done last Friday and then they were gonna do both at the same time, but then I'd have no arms to be able to do anything. My wife, my wife's like, so how are you gonna go to the bathroom? Cause I don't wanna help with that.

I'm like, okay, let's do one. Then the other side, this one Friday and then I got this next one's next Friday. And then I told you I have an event three days after I get this one done. So I'll be on stage for four days with two slings, but I'm doing great. I'm feeling really good.

Recovery is going good. We're doing every biohack known to man to heal as fast as possible. So I'm feeling good overall. It's just kind of an annoyance at this point, you know? But he just talking about biohacks. Have you jumped kind of a, an annoyance at this point, you know, but he's just talking about biohacks. Have you jumped in as a wrestler and you've always been fit, right?

Like have you jumped into the peptide world? Oh yeah. I do now I'm doing the Wolverine protocol right now, twice a day to get this thing healed as fast as possible. So right before I showed up here, I was taking shots in my arm. So I, you know, it's funny at 43, I've always been somewhat fit, been an athlete my whole life and I'm sure you can relate. And then after my second child, I kind of leaned into eating too much of the donuts and pizza.

You know what? And dude, I'm telling you, peptides and just being disciplined to work out, like they can bounce you right back. I don't know if you've seen, I'm assuming you're going to see the same thing on your arms, but it's incredible. Yeah, I've only done them a couple of times. We got injured and it healed really fast. So I'm curious to see my biggest fear, Actually, my the doctor gives me a peptides. He's like his biggest fear is like that this one's going to reattach before they do surgery because of the peptides. I'm like, I didn't really that good. He's like, I don't know. So we'll find out. So let's let's dive into something. I think anyone who's already following

you through and I think most of my audience is probably following you. You are one of the leaders in the online space, online marketing, online selling. You've been around for a very long time. You just had your very last funnel hacking live. Many of my listeners probably have your products and have had them for a long, long time. Why did you end something that was so epic and so like monumental for our time in our online generation? Yeah, it's crazy. We ran it for a decade.

It's funny because I remember when I was, when I was an entrepreneur coming up, the big event at the time with Armand Morin he had a event called Big Seminar. And he ran like 10 of them and then he, for 10 years and he stopped. And I was like, what kind of moron would stop something like this?

And then Yannick Silver had the underground seminar. That was the next one. And anyway, when we started ours, I was like, after we started, I'm like, oh, I'll do this till the day I die. I'm never going to stop. But there's something about, you know, putting 5,000 people in the room is not a, it's not a light task, especially when it's not like they're not free tickets. Like everyone's paying a thousand bucks minimum to be in the room. You know, it's a, It's a 10 month cycle. So we get on Final Night Can Live, we get home, we breathe for, you know,

30 days, 45 days and all sorts of like, okay, start planning, start selling tickets. And it's just this long grind. And so 10 years of spending 10 months just filling the event, preparing the event, doing the event, like, it got to be a lot. And this last year as we were, you know, planning Final Night Can Live 10, the team's like, okay,

so, because they, as you're planning 10, you got to plan the next one. So like, hey, so where's next year going to be? What's it going to look like? And like, and like start getting all this stuff. And I was just like, I need a break. I don't know how to say this. And it's funny because like, I thought every our team was gonna be like, no, but most of the teams, especially guys who run our events, we're just like, we could use a break too. I was like, okay, because like, just thinking about most people on the team, especially guys who run our events, were just like, we could use a break too. I was like, okay. Cause like, just thinking about planning 11 while we're in the middle of selling 10 seems so much,

you know, and then the same time, if I look at when we launched Funnel Lack of Life, it was very unique. The way we did it was different. Cause events have been happening for a long time and we had a new formula, a new design and it was different and it's been amazing. And now 10 years into it, when I look at, events have been happening for a long time and we had a new formula, a new design, and it was different and it's been amazing. And now 10 years into it, when I look at most events,

most events have funnel hacked us, right? They modeled us, like the look, they feel, the promo videos, like everything looks and feels like funnel hacking live, even though they're not. And so, and part of it is like, you know, when you get so many copycats, eventually you can like incrementally keep doing new things or you can reset and then create something that they don't have no idea

was coming. And so that was kind of our thought was like, let's take a break. And I don't know if it's going to be a year or two years, five years, I don't know what that looks like. But I have an idea and a vision for something that's different that no one else is doing yet. And it looked different, it'll feel different. And I want to create that. And to create that, it needs just time and space to kind of think through, you know?

So we'll be doing something in the future. This is not, it was like my death retirement, like Russell's done. But it definitely was like the end of that version of it and trying to figure out the next, the next step. And so I have some ideas I I'm working on them ahead. I want an event that's bigger, I wanna be able to get, I wanna fill stadiums with people. I wanna, this is something really, really cool.

And so I just need some time to figure out what exactly it looks like. We have a mutual friend, Grant, right? And everyone knows your story about what you were able to do with Grant and the highest grossing sales hour, I think of all time, whatever it was, right? No, but he did. Yes.

No one's met you yet. But are you kind of leaning into that style of really big epic, you know, I mean, he literally filled Miami Stadium, right? And so is that kind of where you're where you're thinking? Potentially. There's pros and cons, right? When you see Tony Robbins, Tony does his big thinking? Potentially, there's pros and cons, right? When you see Tony Robbins, Tony does his big stadium tours and like,

there's difference, because like, if you're not careful, you lose a lot of it. Like when Grant's event was in Mandalay Bay, there was an intimacy that was still there, even though it was big, but it went to the Mariner Stadium. It was different.

Like, it was just like, everyone's like out getting hot dogs. It was not the same energy. And so, um, actually kind of funny story. So the, the weekend of my Tyson fight, I took my kids to Tyson fight to my kids and watch that. And then halfway through Tyson fight, I was like, John Jones is fighting in New York tomorrow. I'm like, how crazy do you see Mike Tyson, John Jones fighting the same weekend? My kids like, yeah, we should go. And I was like, ah, so I booked tickets during the Tyson fight for the John Jones. We

had to shift our flights. We drove directly to the airport. Anyway so we get to we did the whole went to Madison Square Garden which is where the Jones fight was at and like the feeling I felt in that fight, UFC does a great job anyway obviously but just like the venue the it was it was big but it was intimate and it was like I don know, like that feeling that we had at, and maybe it was because we were right next to where all the fighters walk out. It's like, we're there with my kids 15 minutes and Trump walks out, Elon walks out, my kids are freaking.

I was like, that was pretty special too. But like, but like that, so like, it's a version, like yes, it probably looked, something looked like what Grant did, but I want it to feel different. You know, I want it to feel very like, well, Final Hacking Live always felt like, like you there, it's like a family reunion, it's tight and it different. You know, I want to feel very like what final hacking live always felt like, like you there's like a family reunion.

It's tight and it's close. Like how do you get that? So my, my, my vision right now, I want the next thing to be in Madison Square Garden. Cause like that venue was where I felt that I was like, I want this, like how do I, so I don't know again. Tell them more. What we all, we already want to know.

What are we doing here? What are we doing in Madison Square Garden? What do we sell tickets? What do we buy? Yeah. I'm not sure. Yeah. Really find not sure. Yeah. Really find out.

You're talking about a chapter ending and I think, you know, you've done that for, you know, obviously anyone who's been following you has been a decade plus, right? 10 years. 10 years ClickFunnels and then 12, 13 years prior to ClickFunnels. So I've been doing this game for a long time, yeah.

Oh, you've been doing it. You're like one of the OGs, right? ClickFunnels is what essentially kind of put everyone on the map. I bought clip funnels fucking eight years ago. I've been your webinar strategy and everything you've been teaching. I mean, again, just brilliant, by the way, just you should be very proud of what you've done in a sense of like you're changed people's lives.

You've literally created millionaires, Deca millionaires. I've interviewed many people that have your plaques on their walls, right? Tanner Chidister was just on just the other day. And so you should be very proud of what you've been able to do on the earth so far. And you have a long ways to go because then let's talk about this next chapter, right? We're talking about selling online. So you kind of say, okay, I need a break, but I'm not done. I'm not retired.

And you are one of the master. I mean, we've already talked about what you were one of the master, I mean, we we've already talked about what you were able to do in person live with grant highest sales revenue within an hour. But brother, I've been following you for a decade teaching online sales, right? And now you're really leaning into that. So let's just maybe talk to the people about that.

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technology and there's the strategy, right? And the technology by itself does okay, the strategy by itself, and then the combination of two is what made my business blow up, you know, be able to teach and also have the software together. But you know, know, like when all said and done, it's funny because a lot of people know me as a funnel guy. But you're like, what are funnels? Like funnels are just a set of pages. And what's the goal of the pages? The goal of the pages literally is to deliver, deliver a presentation

that makes an offer. Like when you, you cut it all down to like get her all that. The techno babble and all this stuff. It's just like their pages, it deliver a presentation, it sell an offer. That's all right. There's different versions. There's like there's a webinar which is the webinar funnel, which is the funnel which gets people to show up to a presentation where you can give a presentation and make an offer. Or there's a challenge funnel is you get people to register for a challenge to watch you deliver a presentation

to make it offer or there's a VSL funnel or there's a book for like they're all the same. They all cut us down to it's like that's the VSL funnel or there's a book funnel. They're all the same. They all cut down to it. It's like that's the one piece. It was interesting like when we first launched ClickFunnels, my first book came out, Dotcom Secrets, which is all teaching funnels, and funnel psychology and that helped people to understand the strategy of funnels. And that's when ClickFunnels kind of took off. They had the strategy book and then they had the software.

But the thing that I noticed, a lot of people got good at like technically building the pay. Yes, your funnel looks like another funnel, but it's not making money. They couldn't figure it out. And that's when I wrote my second book, which was called Expert Seekers. And the Expert Seekers, when you read that, it's all about how to deliver the presentation.

How do you create, you know, I never called it a copywriting book because copywriting books don't sell very well, but it's like, copyright, how do you, like what are the words and the phrases and the way you say them? And so that book became this really integral part in our customer's journey of just like learning

how to actually sell. And they learned how to sell and they plug it into a funnel. Then the funnel thought, like my phone's working. I didn't change anything. I'm like, except for the selling part, which is like. Except for every, except for the selling part. It's funny, cause I see people, I see people, especially like our competitors are fighting

like, oh, we, you know, we can do this. And they get like, they have all the, everyone's fighting, like, oh, we can do this and they get like, they have all the, everyone's fighting over like the features and benefits they have. And I was like, you guys are all ridiculous. Only thing that matters is the sales presentation. That's it. The rest of the technology is just there to get people

to watch the sales presentation. Like it's all human psychology. And so, yeah, so I, again, I wrote the expert seekers book, two years I wrote traffic seekers, helping you book two years ago, Traffic Seekers, helping you get traffic to their funnels. And then I didn't talk about this stuff for a long time. And then recently, I can't remember, probably a year ago or so,

cause in my head, I'm like, I wrote a book about it, everyone knows what this stuff's about. And so a year ago, we kind of relaunched the Expert Seekers book funnel and all these new people started buying it and they were freaking out about it. And I was like, don't you guys already know this stuff? And they're like, no. And so I started talking more about it in my podcast

and stuff talking about selling, about persuasion and people started freaking out. Like they'd never heard any of this stuff before. And I, you know, for me, it's like when I wrote a book I stopped talking about it. And I was like, this is something that I forgot was in the you know, the decade of ClickFunnels was the most integral part where people had the most successes

when they mastered this piece. I look at our biggest success stories, you know like Brandon, Kaylen, Poland, like all these people in the decade of ClickFunnels was the most integral part where people had the most successes when they mastered this piece. I look at our biggest success stories, Brandon and Katelyn Polin, all these people, the thing they got really good at was the one to many presentation that plugs into a funnel. And so about that time I was like, we should do an event just,

it was between Funnel Hacking Lives, I had a free weekend, I was like, we should do a virtual event where we just teach all this stuff. And I was able to buy the domain selling online. So I was like, this domain's awesome. And so we threw together a virtual event where we just teach all this stuff. And I was able to buy the domain selling online. So I was like, I was like, this domain's awesome. And so we put on it, we threw together a three day event and I wanted it to be. I want it to be like, when someone's just beginning, like it walks them through

stuff, but also I want to be able to go deep and share like the deep psychology stuff for those who already know this stuff and so they can go really deep. So, so anyway, I spent, I spent a couple of weeks crafting this event and it's fun, like we need an event, it's like writing a book, right? Like I'm writing a three day event where I'm basically the only, I have a couple others to guess because for most parts, me teaching eight hours a day.

And we put it out there, I think seven months ago was the first time we did the event. And it was insane, people went crazy. What was fascinating to me is the people who registered for the event. Like the first two times registered for the event. The first two times we did the event, the guest list of people, it was like every guru you know and was in it.

It was really cool. I was just like, oh my gosh, this gives me my mind. I'm like, oh, they already know this stuff. They're fine. But they were all lining up. They were sitting there. They were there three. I had people texting me.

They're like, I've not sat through an event ever, in a decade a decade, right? And they're like, I've been here all three days, like, do you know the value of my time? Like, I should be charging you for, I'm like, dude, you bought the ticket, I didn't even, I don't know, you're not on the targeting list, but you know, so it's, it's, it's, I think it's my finest work. It's something we spent a lot of time on, but it's teaching people that like, how do you craft a presentation, right? Because a lot of people talk about sales and most sales you're talking about face to face, like one-on-one sales, right? Where I can ask you questions and I can see your,

I can see your, you know, how you respond and I can change my presentation, my pitch and you can shift things based on the interaction with the person, right? And extroverts are great at this and they love it. But introverts like me, it scares them to death. I don't wanna talk to you face to face, you know? And so selling one to many is different

because I don't have the talk to you face to face, you know? And so selling one to many is different because I don't have the ability to just read your face and ask you different questions to get to your concern. So how do you create a presentation when everyone, men and women, women are seeing it, people in America, people in Africa, be like, everyone's seeing the same presentation. How do you craft it in a way that resolves the core concerns that the majority of the people are going to have so you can get 10, 15, 20% of people who actually watch this thing to buy. And that's the art, right?

Because it's fun because you don't have the ability to just interact. You have to create stories in a way that break false beliefs. You have to lead people places. You have to believe things. It's just like the coolest art form I think in the world. And after you learn it, it becomes it becomes really powerful. Like what we teach during the selling online event is how to do like a 90 minute presentation. But that same presentation, when you learn the you learn the strategy behind it, we have one of our friends, Jamie Cross runs a soap

company. And so she took the presentation formula and then shrunk it down to a five minute version, same psychology,, same beats it hits. And she built a multi- like an eight figure year soap company using a, you know, we call the webinar, but a little mini webinar selling soap. You know, we've had people using it. Cody Sanchez, she, she, she went through it and she, she was pitching a VC or something on some, well, she, I have a video clip of her telling the story, but she was like pitching like financials or some or some big VC,

whatever, some big thing, right? And she tried to sell it, and she's like, it wasn't working, so I got Brunson's script and I tried that, and she's like, I pitched it and we closed the deal. She's like, it worked for anything. Because this human psychology, you're just learning how to do those things.

And so when you learn it, it's really cool. As we train people, it becomes part of your, like how you speak, you know? start learning the the things and you become better persuading anywhere if you're in Facebook live or a podcast or like whatever you're doing like when you master those skill sets and you start learning how to weave into your language patterns they help everything you're doing across the board grow so yeah selling online is my favorite stuff I love just talking about and geeking out about it because the human psychology

side of it is so fascinating. So much fun. Well, right now, let's plug it. Sellingonline.com forward slash DNA, sellingonline.com forward slash DNA. Get it, take it. I'm going to be there everybody. So if it's good enough for me, just answer good enough for you. You're listening to me and my podcast because of Russell. Get there right now.

Not hard. It's the cheapest thing you sell. It's a hundred bucks. So it's a hundred bucks. You get three days with me. It's the equivalent of like, I think it's like $4 an hour. So it's the cheapest thing you sell. It's a hundred bucks. So it's a hundred bucks. You get three days with me. It's the equivalent of like, it's like four dollars an hour. So it's a, it's the cheapest consulting I do.

No doubt. There is no doubt about that, my friend. So let's keep talking about selling. You know, you and I were talking off offline a little bit, like I'm really passionate about all these content creators are out there. And you just said, it wasn't Cody, I think the reference before you said someone took your entire 90 minute, shrunk it into five minutes and has this incredible eight figure business on basically a five minute pitch deck.

And the idea that I want to go, yeah, yes, I'm so by the way, right? Like, um, the, what I want to lean into on this episode now is this understanding that there's all these people out there trying to create content. We have a mutual friend, Dean, right? They run a program about like the genius in here all these people out there trying to create content. We have a mutual friend Dean, right? They run a program about like the genius in here should be going out there. And I think there's people that just don't understand all this stuff. And if you're watching this, you see I have my phone up and all the content, all this stuff.

If you don't have someone like Russell teaching you what to say, how to say your language pattern, the framing of what you're saying, you could be doing all this making all that much money, right? And I think that's just silly. I think if you're going to spend the time to create any level of content, podcast, a webinar, Instagram, YouTube, Twitter, TikTok, and you are not monetizing it, I just believe you are selling yourself short because most of you out there and I would bet you agree. You're creating the content because you have something to offer of value. I understand there's TikTokers that point and make money. But for the most of us listening this watching this, Russell, you are a great example of this.

You and I both started well before social media. Like we didn't have social media when you and I both started well before social media. Like we didn't have social media when you and I started in our businesses, but we do now right and you have millions and millions and millions of followers across all your platforms, right? But you also have the opportunity to offer the value of the genius that is in there and finding ways to monetize it. So you have a business without having to work, right? And so I say that because there's so many people

that like just create content, just to create content with no idea. I would like you to kind of talk about the power of understanding your language power, your framing, like even in a 90 second frame, right? Where you could, how do you offer it to them? Because everything is online right now. Yeah, yeah, I think that's it's um

It's what most people miss because they see the big influencers, you know, and they I'm gonna do what they do They copy him. It's almost like I like I like Gary V a lot But it's interesting because everyone sees what he's doing and then they try to model it It's like you understand if you look at like Gary's actual business model He's spending millions on his own social media without trying to get a return of S Because he's just trying to prove that he knows social media so he can sign up Ford and GMC to pay him, you know, $500,000 a month to do their social media. So that's his back end. Like he's got a back end, but they see what Gary's on doing

on the front. They're all trying to copy it. They're like, oh, I'm just giving you, I'm just serving him, just doing nothing. And then they're broke. It's like, you guys, Gary doesn't tell you the whole model, but if you look at the whole model, that's what it is. Like he's able to spend $10 million a year promoting himself on the front end because he's closing $500 a month, $500,000 a month, you know, big social media clients. Like that's the business model. And so like that's a lot of times they're, they're funnel hacking the wrong piece. Like, you know, I think Gary's like, Oh, don't sell courses. It's stupid. It's like, Gary, these people need to sell courses because they don't have a $500 a month offer. A $500,000 a month offer they can offer to GMC.

I guess those things are having crazy. It's like, I understand what people are actually doing. Like I'm a big believer in step mechanisms, looking at what people are doing, why they're doing, trying to understand it. Where most people just look at the mic, the micro and just copy it. Right? So it's like trying to understand what are they actually doing? And I had, I'm in a mastermind.

I won't tell you who's in it because you know most of them and it would be awkward for them. But in the group, there's half and half. Half of us are marketers who use content social to build our businesses. And the other half are content people who do content. And this half over here in the group, and they're literally like the who's who's, like they're getting billions of views a year. Billions would be, right?

Like stuff I would like, I had Dave dreams about. And then over here, you know, we get millions, you know, tens of whatever, hundreds of millions of views. And you look at like the income disparity, it's huge. Like how much we make versus them. It's like they're legit famous. We're not they're legit famous. And it's funny because they have these arguments where they're like, well, we don't want to sell. We don't want to. I'm like, you guys like you're selling anyway, you're just doing it wrong. You understand, like it's the same thing. But they have this like weird belief that selling is bad or selling that something's wrong is gonna happen.

You know, they have this weird belief patterns. And so what we try to like, and it's funny because then a lot of the more direct response guys are like, you guys are wrong because you're not, you know, and I'm like, I'm in the middle. I'm like, you're both right. Let's use both superpowers. Like, like how do we harness these things? Because if everything you're doing is an ad direct response style, like ads don't go viral, ads don't get shared, like it's, I mean they can, but it's harder,

right? The very thing is just like content, content, like those go viral. It's like there's this blend. And when, again, when you learn to, when you learn how to do it where it's not just a sales script, right? But you're learning how to do it where it's part of your language patterns. And it's constantly moving people towards something. Like that's the sweet spot in the middle where all the money's made, right? And so it's learning. It's like, okay, something. Like that's the sweet spot in the middle where all the money's made, right? And so it's learning, it's like, okay, I'm doing this video, my goal is to go viral, but they're still called action.

Maybe it's not go buy my book, you know? But what's the call to action? It's like, I need them to do, like I'm trying to get them, I'm moving them towards something. It's not just content for content, saying it's all knowing like the purpose. It's like, okay, I'm doing this because I'm trying to bring this,

like I'm creating this piece specifically to bring this segment of the audience in. I'm doing this because I'm trying to bring this, like I'm creating this piece specifically to bring this segment of the audience in. I'm doing this piece to get people to believe this because I know that next week we got an email campaign that's coming out. Next week we have this is happening. And so I'm using just like, again, if you go through my, my training, like we're doing a webinar or a challenge, like, like before I ever make an offer, you know, like in a 90 minute webinar at minute 60 is my transition

to the offer. So the first 60 minutes is content. But the way I'm doing the content is all about I'm figuring out like what are the false beliefs that they have that are holding them back from from eventually buying the thing I have, right? And so that I'm telling stories, I'm doing things in a way to break these false beliefs, right? And so there's a purpose.

So you may sit through the first hour Russell's webinar, like Russell's on a lot of stories. I understand what the point is. Like it's good. I feel happy. I have this fun. Like what's the point of it? And you don't know that what I'm doing is I'm speaking to you consciously, but I'm subconsciously rewriting false beliefs that you have so that when I make an offer, you're more likely to buy it. When you actually buy the course, you're more likely to succeed with it because I'm doing this. And so when I know that I'm structuring my content, it's like, okay, what are the false beliefs? I got to break these false beliefs. I'm breaking these things. And I'm doing this in a way where it's like when I know that I'm structuring my content, it's like, okay, what are the false beliefs? I got to break these false beliefs. I'm breaking these things and I'm doing this in a way where it's like when I so that when

I make an offer, like they're ready for like they're not going to there's not going to be resistance, right? I'm building rapport. And so it's just it's looking at things strategically differently versus I'm thinking, you know, this video is going to crush. I'm going to get 10 million views on this video. And they're creating just for that versus like, all right, what are the false beliefs that are holding my person back right now?

What I need to create to break that false belief? So they will be ready in the future. That, you know, in five days from now, when we do an ad campaign or we follow them up, you know, they're watching this content and we hit them with ads a week later that like they're prepared and we're ready. It's like learning how to use those things.

And like, that's the magic, that's the art in this game is that part of it, right? And that's the difference. You're talking so brilliantly, right? Like even in, I think it's so, what you've been able to do with, you are like the blend of both, which is so brilliant. Like you said, you're like the guy in the middle of that. And I know the-

Like you're both right. And you're sitting there like, guys, I'm, you're both right, right? But it's because the person who just creates content to create content, in my opinion, most of them don't understand the business side. They've never been taught business. Like they actually should hire you as a coach just for the business, not as selling out the online.

It's like how do you create this genius and turn it into the business? But they've created something that a lot of people don't have the gumption to create, which is brand of their own, the personal brand, right? And they have billions of views or how, you know what I mean? And that's both of those sides are really, really difficult. Your magic sauce, honestly, is you live right in the middle of that. I mean, you really have created this incredible brand.

Everyone in the entrepreneur space knows you. And if they don't, they do now on this episode. We got the rest of them now they all know that now we're done. But you also have this brilliant mind that says, okay, if I put out five pieces of content, it could be email like people underestimate the value of email for some people underestimate the value of doing reels on Instagram people underestimate

the value of tik-tok because they don't think like the way you're talking about is if you think out a pattern of seven posts, let's just use Instagram. You go through a pattern that Russell will be teaching on selling online. Cause it's just about your framing and how you walk through these stories. And on the seventh post is your ask. But most people don't get to the seventh post of an ask. They just keep doing posts about stuff that don't have a call to action. And so you're just speaking the language of what I believe all content creators.

This is why I'm putting on my event is like you are the epitome of what people what sellingonline.com for slash DNA everybody like this is it. This is what everyone needs. Regardless of you being a TikToker or, and if you're putting it out, you need to know what Russell knows. Yeah. I think one of the things for me that, so I'm obsessed with personality profiles.

Like I have a company where we just take every personality profile, and then from there we can learn everything about you, which is really fun. But one of my, so if you look at my, there's discs and there's one called values, and the value one, everyone's got different values. My number one value is ROI.

And I first thought I was like, that's weird. I'm like, I don't really, like, I actually am not a big, it's funny because like I love business and I love the art of it, but I don't know what's my bank account. So I was like, I didn't resonate with that first. And then one of my coaches who, who's, who's even more obsessed with personality profiles, they go ROI means like in every situation, like what's the ROI you're getting in that moment? Like that's what you worry about. And so for me, it's like, that's why I struggle in school.

I'm sitting in school, I'm like, what am I doing? Like, what's the point of this, right? Or if I'm in a conversation, like that I wanna get out, I'm like, what's the ROI? My brain's always trying to figure out what's the ROI of this. And it's like, if I'm wasting time, I get all anxious and stuff. So for me, when I started,

getting social media first came out, it was hard. Like I was, everyone's doing stuff. So I'm like, I'm trying to do that. And I was just like, what is the ROI of this? Like I spent an hour and a half filming this, three minute video that's gonna go online and like we have 5,000 people see it and then it disappears and it's gone forever.

I'm like, oh, like what's the ROI? I get stresses me out. Right? So for me, it's like, I'm an ROI person. And so I think that's why a lot of it, this happened for me. Cause like, I'm gonna spend time doing something. I need to know what the ROI is gonna be or if I don't wanna do it, right?

Like I'm not gonna spend time on Instagram unless I see an ROI. So how do I see the ROI? Like, and the ROI is not gonna be, I got going to spend time doing something. I need to know what the ROI is going to be or if I don't want to do it. Right. Like I'm not going to spend time on Instagram unless I see an ROI. So how do I see the ROI? Like, and the ROI is not going to be, I got 500,000 views. It's going to be, how many of those people decided for ClickFunnels? How many of those people bought a book? How many of those people, you know, let's go, that becomes the game now. Now it's like, okay, now we're creating stuff, but we're doing it through this lens of like, what's the ROI?

Like if I'm going to spend an hour today doing these, these things, like, how does that look like, you know? And so I think that's why I geek out a lot because it's the thing that keeps me engaged in the game is trying to figure out what the ROI is gonna be on it. And then it becomes fun. And then we create these five videos and from that we sold 300 copies of the book.

That's exciting. That's a fun game to play. And by the way, just as a side note, you said some people, you said something about email, the way you said it, I was like, just as a side note, you said some people, you said something about email, the way you said it, I was like, just so you guys understand, like in our business still, I'd say, man, I mean, we're spending, man, we spend over a million dollars a month

on the ClickFunnels brand, we spend over a million dollars a month on Rost, we're at two, two and a half million dollars a month in ad spends, we're spending a lot of money consistently, right? The majority of my revenue still comes from email. Like not even, it's like 85 to 15%. So don't worry, it's all good.

It's still worth it. I just think people, if you're an internet marketer and understand what you know and what I know, the email is very, very valuable. Oh yeah, that's half the goal of social is to get them off social. That's right, that's exactly right. And that again, are you gonna be going over

some of this stuff when selling online? Yeah, we show everything, yeah. I mean, the biggest keys, we talk about a lot of stuff, but the three core things are like, how do you create an offer? Cause that's the biggest thing. You get to have, I call it level 10 offers. A level 10 offer is the kind of offer where

if you're a seminar and you promote it, people are running to the back of the room, they're jumping over to like give you their credit card. Or if they're at their house, they're running around trying to find their wall, begging their spouse I could just give me I just allow me to buy this thing like yeah create that kind of offers That's the first one cover. Well, the second thing we cover is the presentation

What's the presentation we need to create now to sell that offer? Yeah, right That's number two and then third thing is and what are the funnels we need to create to be able to show that presentation I had the funnels and the traffic and all kind of stuff So that those are the steps we walk through during the event. So the time it's done, you've got the offer figured out, you've got the presentation figured out, you've got the funnel figured out,

you've got traffic coming into it from social and from everywhere. So yeah, it's the best. Dude, this is so great. And so I think what most people need to understand is you need to be able to take them off of the social media and bring them into your world to create value. So the thing where I wanna kind of maybe wrap up this episode is helping

people understand what you've done and what I've done over for me, I've been an entrepreneur for 20 straight years, right? And you about the same. None of this is a short-term fix. Like you might be able to create an offer right now and go get 50 grand. That is a reality. You could go do that, but to create something of something of value something special you need runway, right? I mean you you yourself didn't click create click funnels in a year to the level

Is that today you needed a decade of running that thing to where now it is the premier top of the top The brand Russell Brunson year one is not the brand Russell Brunson. It is a decade later, right? But people want everything right now. And I want you to talk to them about that, about giving yourself enough runway to create the epic, amazing thing that offers value to everybody and is important versus this idea of like,

hey, Russell, teach me how to go make 100 grand. I mean, you can do that and you will do that, but like you wanna create something special. For sure, it's the law of the harvest, right? Like you look at your life today, your life today is literally, it's the image of the seed you planted five years ago. Like for all of us, like it literally is all it is.

It's the law of the harvest. We plant seeds, they grow, we harvest them, right? And it happens over and over and over again. So wherever you are in your life, if you're happy, you're like, this is my life is flawless. It's all it is, all it is. It's the law of the harvest. We plant seeds, they grow, we harvest them, right? And it happens over and over and over again. So wherever you are in your life, if you're happy, you're like, this is my life. It's flawless, it's like sweets, because you planted good seeds five years ago. And this is all areas of your life,

you get a relationship, right? You and your spouse are doing good, if you planted good seeds five years ago. It's not like all of a sudden one day, hey, we fixed our marriage last night. Like, well, you did, that's amazing. No, you maybe had a good night, one good night, right? But great happiness comes from planting seeds consistently.

All right, it's harvest. Like you plant the seeds, you nurture the seeds, you grow the seeds. And so that's what's that. So yes, there's going to be, there's home runs, there's big hits, there's things you can do. We can speed up. We can speed up. We can put things at the seed to help it grow faster. Miracle grow and stuff like that. That's what all the coaching stuff's about. But the reality is, like you said, if you aren't built on the amazing, it's planting seeds consistently, right? And it's always happening. I remember before we launched ClickFunnels, this is when podcasting was just kind of coming out. I thought it was a dorky thing.

I'm like, I'm gonna start a podcast because everyone's, it's becoming a thing, right? And I remember it was in the back of like, one of my businesses had failed. I fired like a hundred employees. I was like, I was in the, like actually like probably the lowest period of my life. And for some reason I felt this calling like,

hey, you should start a podcast. Like, what? Like, what am I going to talk about? I just failed really big in front of everybody. And so I started this podcast. I had it, I remember from my house to my new little office at a four minute drive. And so I would take my phone, I click record and I would do a four minute podcast. It was called marketing in your car and my four minute commute to the office. And all I did was I started talking about like, all right, today we're going to try this out. Okay, we did this. Oh my gosh, I did. And I just started just like documenting right, today we're gonna try this out. Okay, we did this. Oh my gosh, I did. And I started just like documenting this journey

of what I was doing over time. And we started posting them online. And what's crazy is as back then, nowadays there's like all these cool podcasts, apps, you can see stats and graphs. Like we didn't know, we put it online, I had no idea. And I'm grateful because I had no idea if anyone was ever listening.

And it was probably like two or three years into it when my brother like figured, he's like, I hooked up a thing, we can see people downloading or not I'm like, oh, we're so excited and we looked back and was like nobody listened to the first I don't know how long how long it was and then um, I remember It's one of my favorite things I don't feel Steve Larson, but Steve Larson came and he worked for me for two years Before he went on his own and I'm only came and he's like, I'm gonna learn everything about you

so he like he bins listen to every episode I had ever done and after he had gone through the whole like oh Seven or eight hundred episodes of time he came back. He's like dude. You know, it's crazy He's like the first thirty five forty eight forty five episodes. Like you were not good He's like these are painful listen to be like by 45 50 like you started getting it and started like and then now he's like This it's amazing. And um, and I had this weird epiphany. I was like, by 45, 50, like you started getting it and it started like, and then now he's like this, it's amazing. And I had this weird epiphany. I was like, oh my gosh, first off, had I known no one's listening,

I probably would have stopped, right? So I'm grateful I didn't know. But number two, it's like for all of us, like when you first start publishing, people are always like, what if I'm no good? And the reality is you are not gonna be good. I got through, like, this is you planting the seeds. Like you are gonna be really bad at first, right?

But what you have to do is you have to publish long enough. Nathan Barry wrote an article about this. I quote it in my Traffic Secrets book. But basically, you have to publish long enough for your audience to find you. In this article, he talked about how, you know, most TV shows, you don't start like episode one, because you have no idea if it's going to be good or not. You wait until something's been around for three or four years and everyone's talking about it, then you go and you binge watch all of it, right?

It's like people are waiting for the best content to rise to the top. And so like the reality is that you have to be willing to keep planning a season, doing consistently enough. And two things will happen. Number one is by doing that consistently over time, you will find your voice and you actually become good. That's number one, because right now you suck. And the only way to get better is to do it a lot.

And then number two is it gives your audience the time to find you. By the time they find you, there's gonna be a cross section of you actually learning how to do it okay and then finding you. And that's like, that's when this thing starts blossoming. It's kind of like, I visualize in my head, starting one of these businesses, like you're pushing this rock up the hill. It's like, ah, this is so hard. Like, no one's listening.

What's happening? You get to the top of the hill and all of a sudden, you go over the hill and all of a sudden then the big bowl just like starts speeding up right and that's where you see people who rapidly grow these businesses but it's putting in the time ahead of time so it could be anything, could be publishing, could be reels, could be blogging, whatever it is, it's like it's picking a platform and just starting to talk even if you don't talk about just documenting your journey and like what

you're learning and why you're learning it and by by doing that, it helps you to find your voice. And if you do it consistently for long, that's when your audience will find you. And that's when this game becomes really easy. But there's a season of planting the seeds, putting in the time, putting the effort. But then it's crazy. I think about this. We launched ClickFunnels a decade ago. It feels like yesterday. I still remember sitting in the room with me and Todd, trying to figure out what color the button should be.

And now it's a decade later. It's just like, it goes so fast. And we're always worried about, oh, like I got to figure this out right now. Like, no, just be consistent. Keep planting the seeds, love the harvest, plant the seeds, nourish the seeds, plant the seeds, nourish the seeds.

And faster than you will know, you'll be where you want to be. Like Tony Robbins says, like we always overestimate what we can do in a year. And we underestimate what we can do in a decade. So think in decades instead of years and be consistent. And that's the magic, how you win this game. And you really will be able to look backwards

and connect the dots. Like what were the things that were able to get me there? And one of those dots usually is you just kept fucking going. You just kept going, right? And you didn't give up. Stop, stop. I appreciate your time. You are incredible.

And by the way, just as a, just so we know what this man has done, if you really genuinely have not heard of Russell, you have been under, but if you have a rough number of sales over your last decade, would you be able to throw a number so people know, oh, this guy fucking knows what he's doing?

Yeah, last October, just the ClickFunnels brand passed a billion dollars in sales. That's it. There you are. He should be so proud, man. That is phenomenal. That is phenomenal, dude. It's been a lot of fun. It's crazy. I remember four or five years in,

some day we were making a billion dollars, and we said that thing, so we kept watching it, watching it, and sure enough, last October we passed it. We're like, that's insane. That doesn't make any sense. There are countries that are making a billion dollars. We did it in less than a decade. So it's pretty cool. Dude, that is wild. Like he gives me shivers right now. That is, that is, dude, you should be, that is awesome.

A, go follow Russell. B, sellingonline.com forward slash DNA. All things Russell, get his books, follow him on social media. This man is a genius. He's a server, he's a servant, he's here to help all of us entrepreneurs. He's been doing it at the highest of eye levels.

I appreciate your time today, brother. Thanks, Matt, I'd find I appreciate you too. All right, if this was helpful and you think two more people need to find Russell, go to sellingonline.com and all things. I wanna make sure you share this with at least two of your friends. We'll see you on the next episode.

Peace.