The Eric Metaxas Show - #114 - Daniel Darling

Episode Date: May 8, 2026

Today On The Eric Metaxas Show, Eric talks with Daniel Darling about his book In Defense Of Christian Patriotism and why Christians do not have to choose between loving God and loving their country. They discuss gratitude, ordered loves, America’s founding, civic duty, the dangers of cynicism, and why patriotism is essential if the republic is going to be preserved. Eric also speaks with Todd Chatman from Christian Solidarity International about freeing slaves in Sudan, and later talks with Papa Tom Clark about fatherhood, America’s covenant roots, and the May 17th rededication of the nation to God. Subscribe for clips from The Eric Metaxas Show to hear politics and culture from a Christian perspective.⭐ PRE-ORDER TODAY:Revolution: The Birth of the Greatest Nation in the History of the World📕: https://a.co/d/0ir3NlapTODAY'S SPONSORS:⭐ FREE SLAVES with CSI: https://csi-usa.org/metaxas/⭐️ BlockTrust IRA: https://www.metaxascrypto.com/⚖️ Legal Help Center - Get Free Legal Help Today: https://www.legalhelpcenter.com/🛏️ MyPillow — Save BIG with code ERIC: https://www.mypillow.com/☀️ Honest, fast, and free Medicare plan guidance: https://askchapter.com/metaxas/💧 Sentry H2O: https://sentryh2o.com/

Hey, the folks, welcome back. It's my privilege right now to have on as my guest. Somebody's been on the program before. Daniel Darling is a pastor. He's the author of many books, the most recent of which you could just see this is so up my alley. I could spit, but I won't. The title of the book is In Defense of Christian Patriotism. Daniel Darling, welcome back. Well, Eric, thank you for having me on. It's been a while, but glad to be on here having a conversation with you about why we love our country. Well, people need to understand this, and I talk about this all the time.

People act like we bought into this Marxist view of the world, a godless Marxist view, that it's a zero-sum game, that the more I love my country, the less I love God. But would you say the more I love my wife, the more I love my children, the less I love God. No, love is not a zero-sum game. God does not operate on Marxist principles. So loving our country is something which I write about in depth in my book.

If you can keep it, when I really understood this, it really affected me. And so I'm glad you've written a book about this. So in a nutshell, what do we talk about? What do you talk about in your book in defense of Christian patriotism? Well, it's exactly what you said. I think a lot of American Christians have been made to believe that they have to choose between loving God and loving their country. And really, it's not a binary choice. I mean, there are times, you know, where you have to say no to your country.

If, you know, Peter said, we'll preach the, you know, when they told them not to preach the gospel, we obey God rather than man. But most of the time it's about ordering our loves, you know, and C.S. Lewis talked about this in the four loves where we sort of order our loves. If we love God supremely, it allows us to love these other allegiances, these lesser allegiances, in a better way. And G.K. Chesterton talks about this in his essay on patriotism. that actually loving what's closer to you, like loving your country, allows you to love the things that are farther away, like loving the world, for instance. And so it's not a binary choice.

Augustine talked about this as well, ordering our loves. And, you know, when I walked, when I stood at the altar 23 years ago and pledged allegiance to my wife, the pastor didn't say, hey, Dan, you have to choose between loving God and loving your wife. No, if you love God well, you'll be able to love your wife. wife well and same thing with our country and i don't just think it's okay to love your country eric i think it's a duty i think it's as richard john newhouse said 40 years ago that patriotism is a species of discipleship i have to tell you i mean i i referenced my book came out 10 years ago called uh if you

can keep it and that was my conclusion was that this is not avoidable we must love our country And that operates on two levels. I don't care what country you love in. You must love the country, your people, your culture. There's an appropriate love. So even as somebody who is raised growing up in the Greek community, I love the Greek people and the Greek heritage. There's something healthy about that.

But when it comes to America, it's even more important. If we do not love America, America ceases to exist. And it has been ceasing to exist. in the last 50 or so years because we have not been speaking about patriotism, how central it is to love the form of government we have, which is a gift from God, a gift from the founders.

It is a outrageous gift. But Daniel, the problem is most people are unaware. So if you're not aware of what it is that you have, you're not going to love it. You just think, well, what? Everybody has this, right? No, everybody doesn't have it. People are dying to get it.

and we need to be stewards of it and loving it. And what that means is at the heart of it. That's exactly right. I think, Eric, when this is all you see, all you see are the problems, right? You see, oh, look at all these problems in the country. But if you zoom out and you look at the rest of the world, the way most of the rest of the world lives, you realize how good we have it. Then you look at history. And, you know, the late historian David McCullough said that nothing like this had ever been tried before, this kind of government.

at the consent of the govern, this idea of religious liberty and religious freedom. And I just think we don't understand what we have. If you look at a lot of the polls, a lot of the polls show that patriotism is down. People think of it as cringe or cheesy or even wrong or bad. I mean, we have a lot of cynicism. On the left, you have the sort of Hassan Pikers who say, you know, this is a deeply white supremacist country. On the far, you know, sort of Tucker Carlson, right, you have people like Tucker, you know, saying that Moscow is better because they have coin operated grocery cards or, you know, he's saying

how terrible we are. And the truth is we have something profoundly good. And here's the thing, Eric, patriotism doesn't preclude you from working for change. In fact, it's required. If you look at all the great social performers in American history from Frederick Douglass to Martin Luther King, you know, they operated from a deep love of the country and its ideals, but they called it to live up to that. And if you're deeply cynical and you think the whole project is working, worthless, well, you're not going to be motivated for change. But if you only want to repair something that you deeply love, the book is in defense of Christian patriotism. I'm talking to pastor and author Daniel Darling. So what is in your book? What led you, Daniel, to write a book with a title

in defense of Christian patriotism? Well, really, three things. One, I've always been, I've always loved the country. Ever since I was a kid, and my parents packed our station wagon and went from Chicago to took a trip to Washington, D.C. And I got to see the Lincoln Memorial in the White House and all the monuments. She just had a profound love for the country. I had a grandfather who fought in World War II and would tell us stories about fighting in the Pacific and fighting for the country. Secondly, I sense among my peers, among the country that there's a sort of cynicism. There's not a deep civic pride in the country. And I think it's really unfortunate.

I think a lot of Christians have been conditioned, have been made to feel that patriotism is wrong somehow or it's illegitimate. And so I wanted to give Christians a guide for thinking about how to love their country in a way that's healthy.

And I think the third thing is, as we approach our 250th anniversary, as you know, Eric, how important it is for us to to really renew the principles that we were founded on to preserve this country for the next 250 years for our children and grandchildren. I, you know, obviously I agree violently. And I think that part of what I, you know,

in my version of your book is called If You Can Keep It, I really did come to the conclusion that it's because of what I, I'm always quoting Oz Guinness. He wrote a book where he talks about the gold. golden triangle of freedom. And what you realize is there's a paradox at the heart of freedom. It doesn't, there's nothing you can do to guarantee freedom. It's up to we, the people, to teach our kids and to remind each other of what does it mean to be free? What is the price of freedom? How do we get freedom? What does freedom look like? What does license look like?

That's different from freedom. If we do not do that, and that's part of what it means to love the country, it goes away. If we don't celebrate our heroes, that's why I wrote, part of the reason I wrote my book on the American Revolution, we need to celebrate this nation and the narrative and the stories

and get excited about it and understand how wonderful it is. And if you don't, you are ripe for deception. And you've been talking about that. So many people just don't understand that patriotism is a beautiful thing. It ought to be a beautiful thing.

They really didn't get that memo. Yeah, it's really, about gratitude for what we've been given. I think of Ben Franklin's plea for prayer at the Continental Congress to say, and Ben Franklin was not what we consider an Orthodox evangelical. He was probably Unitarian, but even he said, we have to be thankful for this miracle of this country. And as you know, Eric, many revolutions have been tried through human history, and most of them fail. The fact that we had a revolution and that what replaced what we had was better is really significant and we should appreciate it. And even if you see a lot of deep problems in the country

as you and I do, you cannot fix those with cynicism. You cannot fix those if you think the whole project is worthless. You can only fix that by loving your country. And by appealing to our complaining and smoking weed is not a positive thing. Is that what you're telling me? That's right. And it strikes me too, Eric, that, you know, it's mostly on the left, but you see some of this on the far right with the Tucker Carlson world of this idea that America is fundamentally flawed, that the whole project's terrible, that, you know, we're at our core white supremacist or racist or at our core were corrupt. First of all, it's not true, but second of all, it's deeply damaging. A country cannot survive if it doesn't have civic pride, if it doesn't have belief in

itself. Well, I believe that the enemies of liberty, the enemies of America, the enemies of America, enemies of God are saying these things to undermine the joy and the love that we ought to have for the country. And they've been very successful in many ways. But that's why we're having this conversation right now to say, ladies and gentlemen, don't buy the lies. You have been sold lies. I bought them for a season. I repent. We'll be right back.

While the corrupt federal elites have been quietly building wealth through cryptocurrency, hardworking American patriots have been left behind. Today, I want to tell you about metaxis crypto.com. They're bringing access to cryptocurrency wealth to real Americans. Crypto is supercharging President Trump's America First Economic Miracle, and now you can be a part of it. I've partnered with Block Trust IRA because their mission perfectly aligns with President Trump's Make America Great Again agenda, smashing down the barriers between loyal patriots and the financial freedom they deserve. Their animus AI trading platform works 24-7 analyzing market.

market data and executing advanced crypto strategies that are beyond simply buy and hold, helping true American patriots build impressive wealth in Trump's historic economic boom. There's a reason their system was named the number one crypto technology platform by Bitcoin magazine from over 1,500 global competitors. Whether you're a teacher, truck driver, small business owner, or retiree, watching inflation, eat away your 401k, Block Trust IRA's advanced animus AI gives red-blooded Americans the same advantages as those coastal elites. Right now, their clients are seeing over 250% returns on their investments, and with military-grade security investments are protected by up to $200 million

in insurance. Don't wait, visit metaxis crypto.com and find out how they can help you join the Trump Crusade Financial Revolution that's finally giving forgotten Americans access to the greatest crypto wealth opportunity in history. For a limited time, they're offering my viewers up to 25 hundred dollars in bonus crypto when you open an account. Crypto created 80,000 new millionaires last year under Trump's phenomenal economic leadership. Why not you next? Welcome back, folks. We're talking to Pastor Daniel Darling, who is in Fort Worth, Texas.

Now, Daniel Darling, you know, as somebody lives in New York City and I get around the country, when I go to Fort Worth, which I love or nearby Dallas, culturally, it's acceptable mostly to love America. But there are many places and many churches in America where it's just not the thing. And I think our job, your job, my job, is to get this memo to all of these pastors and Christians in particular

who don't understand that loving your country, it's a beautiful thing, but it's not just a beautiful thing. It's actually an important thing. It's really like saying, like being so pious and saying, well, I don't love my wife because I love Jesus. We talked about that. But a lot of people have really bought that lie, that a healthy love of the country,

that a love of the country is not healthy. And that as you were saying before, that my job is to kind of piously focus on the sins of America. And I guess the way I have put it, and I want to say it, it would be no different than if you have a kid and you say to that kid, you're bad. You're never going to amount to anything. You are cursing them.

That's the opposite of loving them, speaking life and speaking, you know, activating the goodness in them so that it comes alive and they aspire to be better than they are. But by damning them and cursing them with your words, that's what people have done with America. People say that America is inherently racist, inherently this, inherently that Dr. King didn't agree with that. He said the founding documents are promissory notes. But that lie, it's so attractive, has been spoken. from pulpits and, you know, from people who they think they're doing us a favor by reminding us of the sins of the country. And, you know, at some point that becomes part of the problem. It's not the solution. If you just are complaining and speaking these negative things,

to some extent you're damning the country, which is the opposite, as I just said, of loving the country. That's right. I mean, and again, we're not calling for pastors to be pundits and to turn into new shows on Sunday, but to help, you know, people steward their citizenship well. And I think that's a part of discipleship. And as you said, it is a feature of gratitude. It's a feature of look at what we have. I think what's interesting, Eric, some of the most patriotic people I know are some of the immigrants or children of immigrants that I teach here at Southwestern. Last year at the election, the day of the election, I talked to each of them and said, how are you feeling? You know, what are you, what are you thinking? All of them vote conservatively. And they say, man, our parents,

our immigrant parents love this country. They're playing Lee Greenwood all the time. They're flags up because they've seen the contrast, right? If you've fled here from Cuba under communism or from some other place, you see how good the country is. And sometimes when all you've seen is America, all you see are the problems. Instead of really saying historically, we're, you know, by every measure, we're the greatest country on earth. This is not bragging. This is just fact. And this system of government is unique. It's, as Jonah Goldberg said, it's not natural. And yet, uh, it's been preserved for 250 years. And I think it's a stewardship. It's incumbent on us. If we want to obey what Jeremiah says to seek the welfare, the flourishing of our city,

we have a responsibility with, with whatever calling we have, with whatever resources we have, to try to preserve it for our children and our grandchildren. Well, it's funny because the late Tim Keller would often talk about it's our job to love the city. We're in, and here we're in New York City. And in other words, to try to bless the place where you are, including the country where you are, to bless it, to speak blessing over it, to try to work to make it a better place, to try to vote in such a way to make it a better place, more in line with God's values, to try to put forth candidates who are going to bring God's kingdom into government

for God's purposes, to bless the poor and to bless people who have less of a voice than we do. This is not optional. This is part of what it is to keep the Republic, quoting Benjamin Franklin, is utterly central. Can we see a copy of your book? Can you hold it up to the camera, Daniel? Yes, absolutely. Here it is. In defense of Christian patriotism, endorsed by Hugh Hewitt.

Mark David Hall, as I know you appreciate his history and Tim Gaglan, focus on the family. And Eric Mataxis, listening to the author now speaking endorsed by Eric McAxas. I got to say, really, it's just such important, it's such an important thing. We can't talk about this too much because we've talked about it far too little. We haven't just talked about it far too little. We've talked against it. And I was saying earlier, I was guilty of that. I really didn't understand this for much of my adult life.

Even as a Christian, I did not understand this really until about 2015 when I read Oz Guinness's book. and I began thinking about this, and I wrote my own book, if you can keep it. And I think that this is central, ladies and gentlemen, this is absolutely central. So Daniel Darneling,

congratulations on the book. Folks, it's called In Defense of Christian Patriotism. God bless you, Daniel. Thanks for coming on. Thank you, Eric. Thank you for having me. I really appreciate it.

Hey there, folks. We break into a regular programming. We kind of have a news flash here. In case you didn't know, I'm excited to get for a few minutes at least Todd Chapman on the program. He's a spokesperson for CSI Christian Solidarity International. Some of you know that we are right now doing a campaign to free slaves literally.

This is a big deal. I see it as a great opportunity for people who believe in truth and justice to be able to act on those values. And Todd, we're just always grateful when you can come on and give us a little more explanation of what it is. talking about. Yeah, Eric, grateful to be back. And I got to tell you, this is, it's always a highlight of my schedule of my year when I get to come before you and your audience and give an update, first of all, as to the incredible difference that the Eric Pataxus audience is making in the lives of so many individuals that, frankly, the world doesn't know about or has largely forgotten about. And I'm talking about women and children who have been enslaved for literally decades, well, at least the women.

The kids, not so much because they're still very young. But these women, they've been enslaved in Sudan since the 1990s. And CSI, in partnership with Eric Metaxus, thanks to your generosity, has been able to free literally tens of thousands of those individuals and bring them back into a new life of freedom. So we're so excited to be here and invite you to help us free even more slaves this month. Please. Please. I mean, the problem, Todd, is it's almost unbelievable. even to me, you know, when you say things like this that we freed, you know,

1,300 human beings, I just think, can it, can it be? I mean, and I know it's true, but it is very hard to get my head around. So for people who aren't familiar with what it is we're talking about, talk to them. Go ahead. Yeah, this is something that most people, and I have this conversation a lot, when people ask about CSI and then we inevitably talk about, you know, what is, CSI does a lot of things, but the freeing of these Sudanese slaves is their primary focus. The only organization in the world that's actually focused on liberating these precious women

and children. And people are shocked. They're like, I've never even heard about this. So what happened was back in the late 1980s, Muslim marauders were basically allowed to do a bit of a kind of like a religious cleansing against Christians living in what is now South Sudan. And when I say they were allowed to do a cleansing, they were armed. armed by the government, allowed to go in and ruthlessly murder men and, you know, take enslave the women and children in these Christian villages.

And they took them up into the north, what's now North Sudan, and they've been held enslaved ever since then. And it became evident as CSI was working with the governments there to, you know, to get these slaves freed, that the governments had no inclination to do that. So CSI just said, well, we'll see what we can do. and brought it to their supporters, and we've been bringing it to Eric Metaxus listeners now for a number of years. And what's all said and done,

over 100,000 of the Sudanese slaves, now grown women, many of them, most of them were taken captive when they were children, and now they're grown women, but they've lived their entire life in slavery. We're setting them free, bringing them back into South Sudan, reuniting them, reintegrating them into their home village whenever we can, and setting them up in a brand new life of freedom. And it's just a really beautiful opportunity for you,

if you've never heard about this before, to step in and give a gift that literally will set a human being free. It's awesome. Well, again, it seems almost unbelievable, but I want to encourage my audience, folks, this is true. We've been doing this for a number of years. Without you and your support, we don't do this. We can't do this.

So it is up to you. The easiest way to do it is go to my website is just Ericmetaxis.com. The banner will pop up. And there are all the details there. But I have someplace here. Maybe I don't even have it with me today. But there's a phone number, which we're going to get to you. But I have to say, it is almost crazy that this is happening that in this day and age,

we have this kind of thing going on on the globe. It sounds like something out of history. Unfortunately, evil and slavery. are alive and well on the globe today. But the good news is that Christian faith has entered the equation, and people of Christian faith know slavery is evil and have the ability, thanks to CSI, to do something about it right now.

So it's a tremendous opportunity. The $250, now, by the way, if you can't give that, give whatever you can because it all goes to the same thing. But for every $250, it doesn't just free, someone. And Chris, I don't know if you can get us the phone number, but it doesn't just free someone from slavery. It sets them up in a life of freedom. That's what Todd was just talking about. So it's the whole package. Every $250 sets someone free. It is really just, I guess the way I see it, Todd, is this is faith in action. If anybody else, you know, what can I do? What can I do?

You can do this. Everybody can participate in this. Again, the easy way to do it is go to Ericmetaxis.com. The banner comes up. All the details are there. I beg you, folks, please participate and thank you. Hey there, folks. Welcome back. Right now, I want to talk about at least two things. And with the subject of those two things, that's going to be a secret. But my guest is not a secret. It is, his name is Tom Clark. We call him Papa Tom Clark for reasons we may go into, but Papa Tom Clark, welcome back. Thank you.

Great to be on your show, Eric. Great to be talking to you. Well, great to have you. And I'm trying to think, I just saw you someplace. I travel around and I get, like, confused. What city did I see you in? I can't remember. Well, I think last time I saw you was down in Apka, Florida, with, it was a conference that Paula White put on.

Was that it? No, I thought it was. Anyway, I get around, you get around. That's the good news is we bump into each other. So you talk a lot about God as a father. And so I want to touch on that as relates to our country. And I guess I want to talk to you also. But actually, why don't we do this?

Why don't we announce this before we start this other stuff? We're doing these Socrates and the city book clubs. I've mentioned this, and we're doing them around the country. People are starting them all around the country. And you, sir, have started one in North Carolina, in Lake Norman, which is not far from Charlotte. Correct. North Carolina. Fort of Charlotte.

50 miles? 15, 15, 15. Oh, so you're right there. Yeah. But if anybody doesn't know this, folks, if you want to start a Socrates and City Book Club, This is kind of a great deal. I don't know why people wouldn't do it. You get the book sent to you at no cost.

This is like we got a grant, and it's a beautiful thing. I mean, even my revolution book, my goodness, if you start a book club and you read the book together where somebody reads it actually in my case, if it's the revolution book, it'll be my voice on the audio because I'm doing the audiobook now. But we've got these book clubs all

over the country and you have just started one in Lake Norman, North Carolina. What book are you reading right now? Is it the abolition of, no, is it the great divorce by C.S. Lewis? Nope. G.K. Chesterton, orthodoxy. Ah. It's a hard book. You got to struggle a little bit through it. Well, this is the whole idea. Like, some of these are going to be harder than others. It's kind of like exercise your mind. That's the whole idea of Soxies and City, the life and the mind. We can do it, Tom. We can do it. Orthodoxy is so great. I think my favorite chapter in that book is a very short book but my favorite chapter is called the Ethics of Elf Land. Did you get to that yet?

We haven't got to that yet. No. I just, I absolutely love it. Yeah, Chesterton is, he's tough. He's tough. CS Lewis is not as tough, but, and of course, I'm easy. I'm real easy. But I just wanted to say thank you for starting the book club in Lake Norman, North Carolina.

And folks, you want information on how to do that. It really is kind of an amazing thing. go to Socrates in the city.com. But let's talk about we dedicating the nation to God on May 17th. I will be a speaker. What are your thoughts on that, Tom? Yeah, I want to finish the thing about Socrates

in the city for a moment. You mentioned the book and so forth. We would love to have you down here in North Carolina. I'm trying to make arrangements with it. It could combine it with your book, you know, talking about a new book about revolution. And I'm lining it up maybe with Freedom House,

which is run by Troy and Penny Maxwell. They've had Charlie Kirk there a number of times. Oh, no, they've had me speak at their church. I've spoken at their church. I was there with the Venom brothers, John Amun Chukwu. That's last year sometime. But we love Troy and Penny Maxwell. It's a great church.

They also love you. And I think there could be something, can be or make arrangements there where we could do something with the church and then also talk to the book club, probably in, possibly in June. That would be great. That would be great. We have some openings, not a lot. It's kind of like getting narrow.

So when we get off the year, we should circle back on that. But yeah, that's the fun thing is getting to talk about the American Revolution and the nation around the country. And I hope to get to Charlotte. That would be fun. But let me say that May 17th, in case anybody. he doesn't know it, folks. On the mall in D.C., we are rededicating the nation to God.

Think about that. Think about the fact that we have a president willing to do that, to talk like that. It's the exact 250th anniversary to the day of when Washington, when Washington asked Congress to have a day of fasting and prayer for the nation, 250 years. to the day. We're going to be doing that on the mall in D.C. May 17th. So I know you wanted to say

something about that, Tom. Yes, I did. First of all, I'll be there as well with my wife. And it's strange to me, or I shouldn't be strange to me. The media doesn't promote this at all. But, and I say this,

but be there, Dave Kubal has been announcing it with Interestances for America. And we've registered to be with his group. My wife spends a lot of time with Intercesses for America out of North Carolina.

Carolina. So we registered. So we'll be on the mall. We're not going to be a guest speaker. So we'll be listening to you. But that's a, yeah, it's a very important day in the history of our country. And, you know, since I've been involved with media, by the way, I've come to a term I'd like to put on the air, which is called Media Missionary. And I started out as a hobby doing shows, podcast, jokes. And I said, wait a second, this hobbyist morphed into a ministry. And the ministry is like a media missionary. I have a mission to get onto the media things about, in my perspective, of God the Father and also fathers. But it's the idea of when God told me and wants me to put me into the media, he says, I wanted to do battle against Prince of the Power of the Air. So since you're

an Air Force doing battle against the Prince of the Power of the Air and you are in media. And you have actually a missionary media. We're trying to bring forth in the media space. God's truth. We just wrote what the word is saying, and so forth, maybe Rima, Revelation, all sorts of things, but it's from God. It's always about God. Promoting that because the enemy is always permitting lies with the intention of resulting fear, God always wants us to promote the truth, but the intent after you are describing the truth, the effect is you can feel the love of God.

So, anyway, getting back to May 17th, right? May 17th is the time when they dedicate, as you actually said, and Dave Kubal brought this up. I don't think they knew it at the time they said it up as May 17th in 2026 that exactly 200 years, 2050 years before to the day is what George Washington, the first father of America, is doing the fasting. And we've talked about this before in previous shows, Eric, that we thought that Donald Trump is the third father of America. So the first father of America is calling for fasting and prayer. And the third father of America, who will be there, right? Is Trump going to be at that dedication on May 17? I don't know.

I certainly hope so. I believe he's going to be there. But I don't know for sure. I'm looking in my book for the mention of the dedication. Because I mentioned it in my book, here it is. I just found it. So just for context, folks, it was, you know, some of you know, some of you know,

this and some of you if you read the book, you'll get it. But it's an important thing that we chased the British out of Boston in March of 1776. They finally left. They skedaddled. It was a huge victory, basically. Thanks to Henry Knox. That's an amazing story. But Washington was so thrilled that I write, I'll read what I wrote on page 298 of my book. Like Washington, like Washington, Congress felt an obligation to publicly acknowledge God, to public acknowledge God. And on March 16th, declared a National Day of Fasting and Humiliation for May 17. So this is Congress now, saying that it was the, quote, indispensable duty of these hitherto free and happy colonies. This is Congress with true penitence of heart and the most reverent devotion to confess and deplore our offenses against God.

This is Congress speaking. And to supplicate his interposition for averting the threatened danger and prospering our straining use efforts in the cause of freedom, virtue, and posterity. And Congress in this proclamation exhorted every American toward a solemn sense of God's superintending providence and of their duty devoutly to rely in all their lawful enterprises on his aid and direction. again, this is Congress, folks. Anybody talks about, oh, yeah, we can't have religion in our government? Yeah, this is Congress in 1776. To exhort Americans toward a solemn sense of gods and of their duty devoutly to rely on all the law for in the Zayden direction,

and to confess and bewail or manifold sins and transgressions, and by a sincere repentance and amendment of life, have I mentioned this is Congress, appease his righteous displeasure, and through the merits, and mediation of Jesus Christ. Hello? Obtain his pardon and forgiveness,

humbly imploring his assistance to frustrate the cruel purposes of our unnatural enemies and asking God to grant that a spirit of incorruptible patriotism and of pure undefiled religion may universally prevail and this continent be speedily restored

to the blessings of peace and liberty and enabled to transmit them in violate to the latest posterity. I'm just and it recommended that Christians of all denominations assembled through public worship of staying from servile labor

on the said date. Ladies and gentlemen, this was Congress thanking God proclaiming this in 17th. We're going to mark it on May 17th in D.C. Do not miss it. We'll be right back. It's finally here our second annual mega sale.

This sale only comes around once a year, so take advantage of the best offers ever while you can. For example, save 50% on our Giza Dream bed sheets as low as 2998. And for the first time ever on TV, My Pillo Mattresses and My Pillo Mattress Stoppers as low as 9998.

And you save 50% on our Luxpeer six piece towel sets. Regular 6998, now only 3998. And our best selling standard, My Pillows, regular 49998, on sale for 1798. Way not. Mega sale only 1498. So go to Mypillar.com or call the number on your screen.

Use this promo code to take advantage of our second annual mega sale. But wait, there's more. To make the mega sale even more special when you order right now, your order's going to ship absolutely free. So welcome back, folks. I'm talking to Papa Tom Clark. His podcast is called The Father's Heart. You talk a lot about fatherhood and your hat says make men fathers again.

Fatherhood is a sacred thing, just as motherhood is a sacred thing ordained by God. And you were talking about President Washington being a father of the country and how you see President Trump as being the third father of the country. So what do you mean by that? Well, it's interesting. You know, when I was a younger, a younger man, I had a one-track mind, and I won't have to tell you what that one-track was about. As I've got older, I've got another one-track mind, and the track is different, but it's still driven almost by the same energy, and that's the track of understanding fathers.

It's just everything, it's the filter to which I read the word. It's the filter to which I see things. God teaches me things in the word through this idea of the father's heart and how his perception of things are, not only from his heart, but also how he infuses his heart into people. Now, having a father's heart is that gender specific. You don't have to be a male to have his father's heart. However, that being said, God still wants men to be fathers. He puts them ahead of family. He puts them ahead of different parts of this design. It's always in God's design to use fathers. And I began to understand more as I began to read the word, because another

aspect he's showing me is about seed. Right from the beginning of Genesis, God says to be fruitful and multiply. When he says to be fruitful and multiply, he says he gave, in order to be a multiply, plants have to have seed. Animals have to have seed. Human beings have to have seed in order to multiply. Guess who the seed bearers are. Let me guess.

The fathers. The fathers, right? And he uses fathers and seed bearers not only biologically or naturally, he also uses them spiritually. And what is he using them spiritually? spiritually for, he's using them spiritually to birth something. You can't birth something without seed. You can't birth something without men.

Men in the likeness of fathers have to be part of the birthing process. And so when you looked at what happened in America in 1776, the nation was birthed by a father. George Washington. God used him. there was a rebirth thing and let's skip Abraham Lincoln for the moment and go to 250 years later just let's talk about Washington and Donald Trump

he's using Donald Trump the man as an instrument in God's hand to rebirth America back to the way the founding fathers originally had designed the country and God uses fathers to do that he has a father's heart I think I shared one of your previous programs

I first got into this 10 years ago in 2016. I mentioned this before in one of the previous shows. God said me that Donald Trump was less Jacob. Now, Jacob is the third father in the Bible, Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. He used Jacob through which the seed of the Messiah was coming through. We know that Jacob from the scripture had 12 sons. One of those sons was Judah, and Jesus came from the tribe of Judah. So he's using Jacob in that sense.

However, Jacob was not a very good character, as you know, from the Bible. Bible story. His name means twister, deceiver, really bad guy. Until he wrestled with the angel. And he wrestled with the angel, we know God changed his name from Jacob to Israel. I shared part of this before in a previous show. Yeah, but feel free to share it again because we forget stuff. Similarly, you have Donald Trump, who in his natural flesh.

is a connivor, a deceiver, a manipulator. In all the worldly sense, he's got those, I'll call skilts, right? But he has a place in his heart, which is soft. He's honored his father and mother. He loves his children. He loves his grandchildren. And God can touch his heart because God can use him to love America. And that's what God is using in his heart

because he wants to make America great again. One of my shows I had is MAGA, 2.0, make America godly again. Not just make America great again, but make it again God again. America can't become great again if it's not godly again. It has to turn their hearts back to the father. And he's using Donald Trump as an instrument in his hands. I don't know if he's wrestled with the angel yet. I don't know if that actually happened in his personal life.

I gave a story of this to his son back 10 years ago to Donald Trump Jr. and I don't know if it's occurred in reality. I'm just seeing, like, as an Amiridimly, God shows me different pieces. But the different pieces of the different glimpses of it is he's using fathers, just as he used the fathers of faith, Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. He's using George Washington, Abraham, Lincoln, and Donald Trump as fathers in America for his purposes and his plan in America. And he uses fathers to do it.

Now, the enemy knows that. And the NMA has straught over backwards the last 60 years with the feminist movement, the national organization of women. And all of us, Nagan, folks, we're going to be right back talking to Papa Tom Clark. I've been saying that 2026 must be the year of accountability, whether talking about government spending or the way we steward our own families, we have a moral duty to seek the truth. But let's be honest, in the world of Medicare, truth is often the first casualty.

Seniors, like my 91-year-old mom, are bombarded with mailers. and pushy phone calls that feel more like propaganda than helpful guidance. This is why I value my partners at Chapter. They operate on a different principle, independence. Chapter is the only national advisor that reviews every single plan available to ensure you have the coverage that actually fits your needs. They've helped people find clarity, and on average have historically helped members save an average of $1,100 a year on health care costs.

Their support is completely free and takes under 20 minutes. If you have questions about your Medicare or want to ensure you're a good steward of your resources, please call Chapter at 571-421-1-2-5-3. That's Chapter at 571-4-2-1-2-3. Talk to a real person and get the honest answers you deserve. Welcome back, folks, talking to Papa Tom Clark. We're talking about fatherhood. We're talking about how God uses fathers.

perhaps you've heard the phrase, God, the Father. We just made that up. Oh, no, it's in Scripture. Aba Father, what a concept. So Papa Tom Clark, this is, God has given this to you really as a message. So you were just saying some things about that.

Keep going. Yeah. I think of what I was talking about was God uses fathers to birth things and to do his purposes. Now, God always wants to multiply. Be fruitful, multiply. told Adam and Eve. And multiplication is part of God's word. In fact, he associates that

if you look at the talents, the one, the one talent, the two talents, the two talents, the two that multiplied, God said they were faithful, and the one that didn't multiply was not faithful. So he wants to multiply, and what he wants to multiply is the progeny of his kingdom on the earth, and he uses fathers to do that. In the case, when you move into the natural world, and you're moving into governments and things like that. America was a unique idea, as you know. You've studied this thing left and right. The whole purpose of America was to bring freedom to people. Freedom is God's idea. He used George Washington to break the tyranny with King George. He's using Donald Trump to break the tyranny of the deep state. And how do you break the tyranny of the deep state?

You go back to our founding documents. You go back to what we did in May 17, 1976, and you fast and pray. Why? Because you're trying to break the stronghold of the powers and principalities of evil that have taken over our country and have basically formed the deep state to take our freedoms, all our freedoms away from us. Donald Trump is the edge of restore freedom back to America. In his first inaugural address, he held up the Bible and said, I'm going to give the power back to weed the people. And look at the faces of the people behind them. They go, oh, Lord, we've got to get rid of this guy.

It's amazing with God's protection, he's been protected because his intent to bring freedom to America and to bring the power back to we the people, which is God's idea, their freedom, is against what the powers of principalies want to perform. Do you have a prophetic sense as I do, I don't mean to cut you off, but that God will prevail in this, that this is something that God has ordained? Yes. He has ordained it to happen because he has a covenant relationship with America. And that covenant relationship starts in 1620, which you know very well. And you're having a little event happening in May back in Plymouth Rock, correct?

I'm not aware of an – I'm not invited to an event in – I thought you were how they went. In Plymouth Rock. No, no, you're thinking of we're doing a Socrates in the city retreat. that's already next week in Concord and Lexington and Boston and stuff like that. But yes, going back to the roots, very important. Going back to the roots, the Mayflower Compact is what I was referred to. I thought you were covering that.

The Mayflower Compact, which has to do with the original covenant God made with America. And through that, he's got to use fathers. And the Compact from 1620 moved forward in time to 1776. Well, what I write about in my book, Revolution, I talk about when they were about to sign the Declaration of Independence, which was actually August 2nd, not July 4th. That's a story in the book. But Samuel Adams preached a sermon from the steps outside in Independence Hall in Philadelphia. And he said, we have this day restored the sovereign. We are going back to the Sinai covenant and the God.

We've restored the king who is God. We're looking directly to God as the Israelites did in the wilderness. It's an amazing moment. Jefferson and Franklin and all of them understood the narrative. We're going back to the Sinai covenant to look directly to God. It's an amazing thing that they all got that. And suddenly now we in America, 200, 50 years later, are going back to that moment.

It's just very, very exciting to live now and to see this happening. Isn't it interesting that the left is promoting a no-kings, no-kings movement? Yes, I'm for no kings also, except one king, the Lord. So it's kind of fascinating, isn't it? Well, the left is pushing back very, very hard. They're trying to demonize all this. This is Christian nationalism, whatever, whatever. They don't get it.

And some of that is malicious. some of that is just ignorance, but we just have to lovingly do what we think is right. Ten seconds left. Final comments, Tom. Anyway, we're looking forward to seeing people on May 17th down on the mall, the 1776, and keep your eyes on what God's doing with fathers in this nation to bring our freedom back. It's beautiful. Your podcast is The Father's Heart with Papa Tom.

And of course, if you want to join Socrates and City Book Club, go to Soxeclton City.com. And thank you very much, sir. You're welcome.