The Eric Metaxas Show - Charlie Kirk (continued)

Episode Date: March 4, 2020

Charlie Kirk continues his in-studio interview providing insight into the current political turmoil and also shares a silver lining for the future of the country, thoughts expressed in his new book, "The MAGA Doctrine: The Only Ideas that Will Win the Future."

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I tell all my relatives to take it. relief factor.com. Welcome to the Eric Mattaxas show. Beats the show about everything. And we do mean everything. Yes. Even that. Yep.

And that too. Oh, you bet. Definitely that. Now here's everything you want to host, Eric Mataxis. Hey there, folks. This is Hour 2. Hour 2. Of the Eric Mattaxas show.

Hour 1 went pretty well. And I've got my fingers crossed for hour 2. We're continuing the conversation with my friend, Charlie Kirk. If Charlie continues at this level, I will officially give him permission to propose marriage to my daughter. Yeah, he's that impressive as a young man, folks. He's 25. Unbelievable. And he is so, no, he is just, I think I said this in the first segment. He gives us hope for the future. I apologize. I'm over-caffeinated today. So I, you know, I interrupt even more than usual. And I apologize in general, because when I get excited, I can't shut up. Well, and it's a problem.

For some reason, I mentioned a name Jane Austen in last opening 10 minutes. I don't know why I said that. You know, I noticed that an hour ago. I just threw out the name Jane Austin. I was thinking of great authors, I guess, in there among Metaxus and Sagar. That we're going to send something. Well, we were talking about food. That's food for the poor.

I will use that as a segue. Yes. We're doing a fundraiser with food for the poor, and we want 100% participation. So therefore, we're telling you, listeners, that it's, It doesn't matter what you give. Whoever gives anything, we're entering you in our grand prize contest. We're doing the contest every week for four weeks. This means that, maybe we'll do it for five weeks, we'll have to see.

But it means that every single week, somebody who gave that week will win a ton of signed books signed by Eric Matakse's the author. Not me, the radio host, the author. He will sign them. The radio host doesn't sign books. I, the author, no, the radio host, sorry, I'm confusing myself, I will sign the books, Albin, you will sign books that you have written, and the grand prize winner gets all these signed books plus the opportunity to visit the studio. With Jane Austen. Well, whatever that means. To visit the studio in New York City, which is where we are right now. And it really sounds like we took too much cold medicine today.

We're just like, it's so weird. Crazy. Let me backtrack. We're doing a fundraiser for Food for the Poor. The Grand Prize winner every single week. We announce it on Friday, okay? So this Friday we got John Zmirak. We got Ask Mataxis.

And in there someplace, we will announce this week's grand prize winner who wins a ton of signed books, autographed books, and a chance to visit the studio. Now, when you visit the studio, I want to be very clear, you can bring friends, you can bring your family. The winner isn't the only person who can come to the studio. If you want to bring 10 friends, feel free. There's food for you. You can hang out. It's really, it's always fun. Let me go one step further and say that if you want to come to the studio, all you have to do is give $500 to food for the poor.

You don't have to win the grand prize. The grand prize winner will get invited to the studio. But let's say, you know, you want to increase the odds to 100%. All you have to do is give $500. If you give $500, you are invited. to come to the studio to visit us whenever you're in New York. And by the way, if you can't do it, you can say to a friend who's going to be visiting New York or who lives in this area, you can go to the studio and eat Eric and Albans food and hang out and sit there while they interview their fun guests and stuff.

So it's a win-win. Okay. So you have to go to metaxis talk.com and you have to, you'll see the banner. It's food for the poor is the banner. And they are just a tremendous organization. They're feeding families in Guatemala. Now, I just want to make it clear. Guatemala has the highest malnutrition in the Western hemisphere.

Hard to believe that not far from the United States, there are people who are malnourished. Some of them dying of starvation. It's really horrible. But the good news is that your American dollars can go extremely far because of their economy is so oppressed, so depressed, that we can give $80 of our American dollars, and it will help feed, no, it will feed someone for an entire year, plus drinking water for life. That's $80, okay? So if you can give $80, we're asking that. If you can give $320, or you can also give $27 a month, which is a great way to give, that will feed a family of four for an entire year and water for life. Now,

Let me say this is a great way to get your family involved, your kids involved. If you think about this, if you want to teach your kids about what your values are, and you say, we're going to give $27 as a family per month, and that's going to feed a family of four in Guatemala. Our $27 will go that far. It teaches your kids about money. It teaches your kids about your values. And if you think about it, it's an extraordinary opportunity to get your kids involved where they would say, you know, I don't know how many kids. kids you have, but let's say, mom and dad say, well, we're going to put in $15, and the rest of it,

you kids are going to put in. That's a kind of a, it's an amazing way to get your kids invested in, in doing God's will and helping people that don't have what we are blessed to have in teaching your kids that we're blessed to be a blessing. Why should we have all this money and extra money? And there's a family who for $27 a month will be able to eat. I mean, why wouldn't we want to do that and bless them? So I just want to say get your kids involved, get your family involved, $27 a month ends up being $320 a year.

That's a family of four. So as we said, we have a grand prize winner every single week. And we just want to do that to get you all involved in this. It's a wonderful opportunity. Let me give you the phone number. Some people want to call. Yes. 844-863 Hope.

That's 844-863 Hope. again 844-8-6-3 hope okay when we come back we have Charlie Kirk that's today right tomorrow we have Ross Douthett I love Ross Douthit he's just brilliant he's a columnist for the New York Times a young man of faith and um on Friday we have John Zmirak oh yeah right yeah oh you know what alban I should mention I'm coming to Spokane Washington oh the last time I was in Spokane, I learned how to pronounce Spokane. Okay. Up to that point in my life, I'd been saying Spokane.

What? It's Spokane, Washington. I'm coming to Spokane, Washington, and I want to say to people, if you know anybody in Spokane, please tell them about this. Go to my website, Eric Mataxis.com, and you'll see when you go under speaking, it tells you where I'm going to be. I'm going to be everywhere this year. Like, it's crazy.

I have a book coming out. So whenever a book's coming out, there's a lot more traveling. and speaking, my book is titled Seven More Men. It's a sequel to Seven Men. Did you guess that? I think. We have a book coming out next year called Seven More Women. That's a sequel to, can you guess?

Seven Women? Correct. So anyway, but I'm going to be doing a lot of traveling, but I'm coming. My next stop is in Spokane. Formerly Spokane. Washington. Formerly Spokane, right. And before we actually go to the break and come back with Charlie Kirk, I want to remind our listeners as well,

our newest sponsor on the program is honor bound coffee every morning i wake up and every night i go to sleep there you go but when i wake up i'm not getting out of bed really for any long period of time until i've had my honor bound coffee right but you know what honor bound coffee is spectacular tasting coffee and every dime of the profits goes to helping military families that's just nuts A hundred percent of the profits of honorbound coffee, honorbound coffee.com is how you find it, goes to helping military families. And I was thinking, I went online this weekend and I was reading about the progressive causes that Starbucks gives to. A lot of people buy Starbucks coffee, a lot of people. And I thought, you know what, folks, every dollar you spend, if you have a choice, it's really nice to be able to spend your money in places that are going to support things.

you believe in. Starbucks is really committed to some progressive causes that a lot of people listening to this program would say no, I don't want to give to those things. When you can give to help military families, I mean, you're getting, by the way, you're getting spectacular gourmet coffee. It's the best coffee.

I've got to say that because we're coffee fanatics in our household. And here too. And you guys know, like, we're not going to drink just anything. It's got to be, you know. And so Honor Brown coffee is gourmet coffee conno coffee conno. coffee. But in addition to that, 100% of their profits goes to help military families. That's the kind

of company there. We're at a time when we come back. More with Charlie Kirk. Don't go win. It's hour two on the Erkman Texas show. That can only mean one thing that we've already done hour one. Hour one, I talked to Charlie Kirk about his super bestseller, The Maga Doctrine. in hour two, I will continue to talk to Charlie Kirk about the MAGA doctor. Now, is it still selling well, Charlie? I believe so. God willing. It was number one.

Well, it's selling better, thanks to you. All right, as long as I'm doing something to help. The ideas in this book are very important, and the way you frame these ideas is important because, look, I've been saying this for years. I think Andrew Breitbart stole from me, you know, that the politics is downstream of culture. I'm only half joking because people, have said this for many years long before Andrew Breitbart. It's a fact. So when evangelical Christians around 1980 got involved in politics, they got all excited about politics. And I always say that's great.

But we're supposed to bring the gospel and our faith into every sphere, not just politics. That's correct. We've got to be involved in politics, but we ought to be involved in the culture. Yes. Sitcoms, talk shows, movies. Every single part of the culture should. be confused with the reality of the God of the Bible. It's not just like we're going to do theology and politics. And you've touched on that because this president seems to have an innate sense of this. Yeah. And so I have a theory and I see it happening in real time. So what we do at Turning Point USA is secular. I'm a Christian. It's the most important thing in my life. But Turning Point USA is a secular organization. However, we're bringing people to Christ because of what Galatians 3 says.

The law is a school teacher to Christ. So when people start to see organizing, thinking. They see people with organized lives. They see people with direction. People that are outside of chaos. All of a sudden, they're going to find Christ. And I think Galatians 3 is going to be the new revival in America. It's exactly the opposite of what the church has been pointing us to in the last 30 years, which is... And what is Galatians 3? Well, Galatians 3 basically is Paul's letter to the Galatians, and he talks about in it is that the law is a school teacher to Christ, is that if we embrace the teachings of the Torah, which of course we should not turn our back on, That's going to lead more people to Christ that if we actually, and I use it more from governmental standpoint and more civic standpoint and a more.

So for example, when I tell somebody, can you go a month without drinking on a college campus? And they say, I don't know. I'll say, you have no sovereignty over your being. And they say, do it for one month and tell me how you feel. And all of a sudden they say, yeah, that was great. I'll say, do you want to know what's deeper than that? Surrender your entire self to something that's higher than you? All of a sudden, it's a school teacher.

It's a gateway to Jesus Christ, which is the old. ultimate answer. And I think that what we're seeing right now is people say, Charlie, they come up to me in record numbers, and I get thousands of messages a week and a month. Again, I'm a secular organization writing a secular book, but a Christian writing both. And I see myself leading people to Christ and see my people, see people go into church attendance in record numbers. And it's completely contrary to what some missionaries, not all, and some people in Christiandom would say, because they'd say you have to stay out of civics, you have to stay out of politics, you have to stay out of this fight. It's dirty. it's nasty, only focus on rebirth, revival, gospel, four books, Matthew, Mark, Luke,

and John, don't get outside of it. And I say, you have something wrong. And Jordan Peterson taught me this. Jordan Peterson brought people out of the wilderness up to the gate of Christ. And now people are able to walk through because Jordan Peterson said, here's 12 very simple things. Guess what? Every single 12 of those rules for life is biblical. Every single one of them. Listen, truth, I mean, I talk about this all the time. Truth is truth. If Jesus is the truth, if the Bible is true and the God of the scripture is the God of all reality, there is nothing that doesn't touch him. That's exactly right.

All truth will lead to him. So it doesn't matter where you begin. I actually find it very funny. When I was at Dennis Prager was doing a big thing for Prager University and I spoke at it. They're wonderful. And Dennis Prager is not a Christian, but Prager You is inadvertently because it talks about all kinds of truth, leading people. That's Galatians 3.

Well, that's right. leading people to Jesus. And I find this, it's just, I mean, you have to understand it's kind of funny. Well, it's kind of funny. It's awfully ironic because I would make an, I would make a argument. And I mean this in no way to castigate or to demean the type of person I'm talking about. But the Christian famous Instagram celebrity is not going to bring as many people to Christ in this culture as Dennis Prager and Jordan Peterson will. What?

Jordan Peterson, secular clinical psychologist from Canada. Dennis Prager, Orthodox Jew. from Manhattan, went to Brooklyn College, and I lives in Los Angeles, who talks about living a better life. But when Dennis Prager says something as important as, God cares about what you do and how you do it, and if you live a good life, you're going to be happier. That message right there, when Dennis Prager says, you should care much more about self-control than self-esteem. All of a sudden, a student who's been living in a self-indulgent, chaotic, left-wing culture, is going to use that as a gateway, as a schoolteacher, as an upward-looking,

light towards Jesus Christ, which is the ultimate truth, the way, the truth in the life. And I see this happening. And I think Christianity can learn a lot. And I think there's so much to be said about the cowardice of the pastors in this country. Oh, look, Charlie, I just want to say what you just said. Think of the irony and the hilarity. No, it's true. I find it.

Orthodox Jews are bringing people to Jesus. And the joy. But here's the key is that if you don't understand that God is over everything, you you will participate in the secular left war on real faith. And what they want to do and what Christians have participated in is putting ourselves in this little religious corner and saying that... This is such an important point. If I talk about anything outside of theology and salvation, I'm beyond what God.

God just doesn't want me to focus on politics. He wants me to focus on it. And I would say to that, not only is that wrong, it's anti-biased. It's anti-God. Well, it's anti-Jesus. It's not just an impression that I have that it's wrong. It's fundamentally antithetical to what the scripture says. Think of the irony.

Well, Jesus had a day job, and that's what he did. Jesus was a carpenter. I mean... Isn't that before he became Christian? He repented to that, right? I'm pretty sure you repented of that. But the point being is that you should be a Christian in all things that you do. And there's this growing sense in Christianity.

And I want to stifle it wherever I come across that Christianity should be some sort of monk monost. in the hills where we're correct about everything, but we don't talk to anybody else. And every- Look, people who didn't vote in the election. Let's just go there for a second. People said, I am too holy to vote for that man, right? In other words, their worldview is so parochial, so- That's the right word for it.

That they are unable to understand things, really with any, how do I put it? It's not a three-dimensional understanding of the world. It's a very pinched understanding of the world. Yeah, I don't mean interrupt. No, no, you're not. There's people out there. I don't want to single them out. But there are leading evangelicals out there that still are so pathologically against Donald Trump.

Not a lot of them, but there's a fair amount. And you could say the names. I'm not going to give them the platform. But you know exactly who I'm talking about. I won't say the names. But, no, look, it makes me sad because it's not like I don't understand their points. They make really wonderful points. But the conclusion is fundamentally wrong.

That's correct. It's that simple. And so I look at God cares about everything you do. And so I come at it from this perspective. And some people in Protestantism don't agree with this completely. But theologically, I think God cares about how you dress. I think God cares about how you eat. God cares about how you speak. God cares about your thoughts.

And I think it cares about all of it. And that includes God cares about how you vote. Okay, just because I can hear people thinking this right now, so I have to respond to it, when you say those things or when you say what Dennis Pratt, There are lots of people that it would immediately leap up and say, ah, that's works, right? Ladies and gentlemen, we have to stop doing this. When you're talking about behavior, it doesn't, you don't always have to be talking along these salvific lines, meaning that we're saying do this and this and this, this because you

will get saved. I never said that. That's exactly right. And neither did I. And neither even is Dennis Prager, because I've talked to him about this. The point is just because I tell my. daughter do this and don't do that. That is nothing to do with how you get to heaven. That's correct. Frankly, you could already be a Christian and this is how you worship God. You worship God by doing

all of these things. You thank him. You express your gratitude to what he's already done on the cross by saving you. You thank him in your behavior. And you don't, and this is the best way to describe it is you don't do good works. To get saved, you do good works because you are saved. So you're reborn in Christ. You have a new life. You're work. worldview is hopefully correctly oriented, you should be worshipping in every single thing that you do. And so maybe that means removing swearing for your life. Maybe that means freeing yourself from an alcohol addiction or hopefully voting correctly, voting for life, voting for sovereignty of the individual, voting for sovereignty of borders. Remember you said before that Trump has put the left on their heels,

on the defensive for the first time, okay? We need to do this when we're talking about the poor, okay? We need to be more, and I know you've done this, but whenever, conservatives semi-apologize. I just want to say if you really care about the poor, if you really care about the urban poor in America, if you care about people of color in urban communities that are suffering, if you actually care about them, there is no way you could ever vote for anybody who is not fiscally conservative. That's right. Who doesn't believe in all this stuff. If you vote for progressive or if you vote for a socialist, I want to say to you bluntly, you are enacting racist policies. We're basically at a time in

this segment. We'll be right back. But I just want to finish that sentence, if you vote for progressive or a socialist, you are harming the poor. Your virtue signaling, so your progressive friends will give you high marks. But if you actually care, not about how you look to your progressive friends, but if you actually care about the poor themselves, you cannot vote for socialists or high-tax Democrats. We'll be right back with Charlie Kirk. I'm talking to Charlie Kirk. The book is the maga doctrine. Charlie, what's going on? Well, I had a comment based on what you've mentioned, which is one of my favorite parables of Christ is the parable of the talents. And I think it gets pretty good interpretation, not good, correct interpretation at times. But I look at it, I try to divide

certain parables into one or two words summaries of what Jesus was trying to express. And one of the recurring themes of Jesus' parables or his miracles was multiplication, feeding the 5,000, parable of the talents, go forth and multiply. It was about you have a certain subset right now in a box and break outside that box and create more. We now know through the law of economics that there's only one way to multiply, and that's through trade. It's been proven. It's been verifiably proven. And so if we are called to multiply, multiply spiritually, multiply through the church, multiply through the family, multiply culturally, multiply, yes, economically, then there's only one system of governance.

And that is one that protects private property rights. Unless let's not forget, Jesus Christ never condemn the idea of private property. And he could have, because that idea was floated by Plato prior to Christ. Now, this is really important because I can make the argument that Jesus read the classics. And I know this puts me maybe in a minority opinion. No, you mean that he actually did read some of the Greeks? Yes. That's really interesting.

Wow. I don't know if I've ever thought of that. What a big idea? That's a big idea. It's a big idea. It's very heady. It's a nice. But they were floating around the region prior to Christ.

No question about it. But the disagreement between Plato and Aristotle was fundamental, a lot of it. But one of the biggest was the idea of private property. Aristotle, no more private property. Played out no more private property. Aristotle thought private property was fine and was needed and was actually necessary. Christ never went out of his way to critique the idea of private property. In fact, private property goes all the back to Abraham, buying the plot of land to bury his wife in Hebron for, of course, what we now call, I believe it's called the Hall of the Patriarchs in Hebron in Hebron in Judea and Samaria. what's the point here is that I think private property serves a very, very important role. We look at this politically now and philosophically. You have an entire political party that wants to abolish private property in America.

Oh, listen. I mean, even before we go there, and I want to touch on John Locke, but basically... Oh, my favorite. No, I know. Now we're talking. I want to talk about Locke. But before we get there, what you said earlier, and again, this is stuff to be perfectly candid, right? I discovered these things later in life.

And when you begin to see how Luther, in effect, unleashes the gospel beyond, again, it's kind of circumscribed in this little theological cage, and he unleashes it into the culture itself, not necessarily consciously, he just ends up doing that. Yes. It goes into the culture. It leads to political, sorry, to religious liberty. it leads to all kinds of things, which it seems to me clearly is God's plan in history, right? And you see that we could not have the idea of virtuous capitalism, growing wealth, helping more people, this multiplication idea, it's the antithesis of redistributing wealth. That's exactly right. So you see the gospel working its way through history and precisely the way that you're talking about.

It's not something that is meant to be kept in this little narrow religious circle. It's meant to break out and to touch every part of the culture. And so the self-governance, the idea of self-governance is biblical. The idea, and you know this, but in the Bible, Israel was able to have self-governance because they had the law as the center of their community, and everyone knew the law, and they self-enforce the law. And then they said, God give us a king, and God basically said the first time ever, be careful what you wish for. And as we know, the rest is history of murderous, self-righteous, sinful kings, as

human beings are. But the law, if they would have just kept the laws, the center point, people would be able to self-enforce it. The founding fathers understood this, and they were inspired by Locke, probably the most important thinker in Western society that gets very little credit for it. And Cicero begot Locke, and so in Cicero was a Roman council for one year

and was the best-selling author prior to Julius Caesar, who actually came up with the three branches of government, legislative, executive, and judicial. But it was so interesting the founding fathers realized that you need some form of governance, but were the big differentiation between the French Revolution, American Revolution, is where do rights come from? The French Revolution never recognized natural rights, ever. It was Ressauian. Social Contract Theory. There is no God. We're going to try to create utopia.

Founding fathers recognize a lock natural rights interpretation. Rights come from God, not from government. Our country, America was founded by people who read the Bible, people that fought for the Bible, founded by people who fled Europe to be able to practice the Bible. We're an American. The American experiment's a Christian experiment. And you have to ask yourself the question, is the world a better place because of America? And more importantly, is the kingdom in a better place because of America. And the answer is absolutely yes.

Isn't that amazing? Based on what you've just said, you've got my permission to propose to my daughter. Oh, that's very funny. I know. I know. Seriously, though, it blesses me to hear a young man understand this. And thank God you didn't go to college, because if you had, you wouldn't understand any of this. Maybe, maybe if you've gone to liberty.

Liberty is the one. I'm just saying. But what you're explicating, my question is why aren't we teaching these things? Why haven't we been teaching these things in the public schools for the last 60 years? If we don't teach these things, which are actually true, this is not just our interpretation, this is truth, we forfeit the founder's vision of America. And we are long in the process of doing that. It is why we have this president now. Because if we had gone another four years, or God forbid eight, in the direction we were going in,

it's game over for American-style self-government and for the torch of liberty that the whole world is looking to. Hang on a second. We're going to go to break. Folks, I'm talking to Charlie Kirk. The book is The Maga Doctrine. Hey, folks, talking to Charlie Kirk. The book is The Maga Doctrine. Maga Doctrine. Charlie, you were just about to say something.

I believe we were talking about why have we stopped teaching these things over the last 60 years. And I have a story that is an example of this that I think embodies it pretty well. I asked an atheist professor why he doesn't teach the Bible in his historical text class. And he was dancing around the issue. And I said, well, hold on a second. I said, let's just pretend I'm not a Christian. Let's just pretend I'm a student of history. wouldn't I want to read the Bible? It has a phenomenal amount of data that has been proven correct by third and fourth part, third and fourth party analysis of archaeological evidence, the creation and destruction of two temples, King David, King Hezekiah, not to mention the most important person ever to exist in the history of the world of it, whether or not you believe he's the Messiah or a deity or just the charismatic guy that had a bunch of followers, pretty important that people know he existed. And finally,

privately he confided in something. He said, the problem is if I teach the Bible, people might believe it's true. And that was it. But I mean, we already knew that, but you got him to say it. I got him to admit it, which is the, and I make an argument, and I don't do this to be provocative. I think the Bible should be taught in every single public school across the country. And if they don't, I think the federal funding should be withheld. And the argument I make, people say separation of church and state. First of all, that's nowhere in the Constitution. Second of all, that was written by a singular letter by Thomas Jefferson, I believe, in 1803. But Thomas Jefferson didn't even embody that.

But first of all, but let's- There's so much there to untangle. What he said, the separation of church and state is absolutely correct, provided you understand what he meant by it. That's correct. What he meant by it has nothing to do with what we're talking about. He was talking about state-run religion. I mean, that's the, that's the point.

And look, let's be clear, he was saying that the state, because this is why they created this great country, they understood that it was always. the temptation of the state to take over the church. Yes. So when he says separation, it's to protect the church, not protect the state. And it was also between quarreling sects of Protestants and Catholics, and he was trying to say, it's never going to be a majoritarian Protestant or Catholic country. Take it easy.

People forget Thomas Jefferson brought in Baptist to perform musical ceremonies in the Supreme Court, okay? Could you imagine if they did that? Oh, do you know that under him they had church services in the Capitol. Precisely, yeah, exactly. So the point you're making, which I agree with, is that the Bible ought to be taught in public school. Well, because so here's the argument I make. It goes a level deeper than that.

It should be taught in public schools. It's the greatest book ever to exist in the history of the world. You and I both believe it. But even from an objective secular analysis, the fact that this book even exists is absolutely incredible. It has the moral order for everything that we teach our kids. Don't steal, don't kill, don't cheat on your, you know, don't cheat in your relationships. But here's the argument I make is that. the absence of the Bible is you imposing your leftist religion. Well, okay, now what you've just said,

again, this is maybe I love you because you're just saying stuff that I've already thought of, but seriously, Charlie, what you just said is happening. And when the founders talk that about the idea that we're not supposed to have the establishment of a religion, we have it. What we have now is the establishment of a secular leftist religion. And it seems to me that it's incumbent on those who have the ability to make the case that this is happening and it must stop. So when you impose a pansexual view of things, these are religious issues. So the idea that's right. You don't define religion by what. Those are the congregationalists. Whenever you're touching on these largest of all issues, on ultimate things, they are by definition religious issues. And the imposition of a religion

is happening in our time. Yes. And so you take New York public schools where we're recording this right now. Are they teaching the Bible in every fourth and fifth grade class when they talk about world religions. I doubt it. In fact, so the absence of teaching that book is actually a religious statement because that is a leftist saying, I don't want the Bible to be taught. Well, I believe leftism is a religion. In fact, I go as far to say that atheism in certain senses can be a religion. And people disagree at this. They say, well, Charlie, they have no theology. I say, hold on a second. Atheists have a agreed upon belief in afterlife, nothing. They've agreed upon belief in the deity, nothing. And they proselytize and evangelize more so than Christians do. I get more people

approaching me to try to convert to atheism than a Christian does. And there's a lot of different reasons for this. But I always challenge the atheist. I say, if you actually believed what you say you believe, why does it matter? You got like 38 years and five days left. And then you're just clump a cell's dust and you're going to deteriorate into the abyss. You should live it up. You should do as much drugs and indulgence as you possibly can. And atheists are divided into two different buckets. There's agnostics who call themselves atheist because they think it's punk rock. And then there's deeply unhappy people that have been scarred by religion and they think they're too smart for religion. And I say I don't have enough faith to be an atheist.

I think it takes unbelievable philosophical calishtetics to believe this is all just an act of randomness. In fact, I think it's actually rooted in hubris. Actually, I have been talking about this a lot lately. I actually believe it's, let's put it this way. If God created the universe, which he did, and if he created us in his image, which he did, it is effectively demonel. impossible to live as though he didn't exist. So when people talk about that, it's a lot of words. There is no one who has the ability to actually live that way.

And I don't just mean because he gave us the oxygen to breathe. But what I'm saying is that when you have people talking about that and they're implying that everything is random, life has no meaning, there is no good and evil. They don't live that way and they don't dare live that way. So they come up with some sophistry about how I create my own meaning. It's utterly meaning. Well, and it's something very simple as this. And college atheists aren't prepared for this sort of cross-examination because colleges don't teach people to think.

They turn them into activists. They say, there's no such thing as absolute truth. They say, apply that logic to what you just said. Right. Do you believe that absolutely? Boom. And all of a sudden, their entire worldview has been shattered. I mean, I believe in absolute truth.

I believe in a divine being who sent his son to die for us. Yeah. I believe in the authenticity of the greatest book ever to exist in the history of the world. And look, there's one thing to be questioned. One thing to be fervent in your belief in nothingness. And there is a direct connection. And Eric, you've done a great job of articulating this. The rise of secular society and the rise of Marxism are directly connected together because people still need meaning.

People need something to believe and they need something to connect into. And if you get rid of the church, you get rid of the family, get rid of friends, you get rid of belief in a higher power. People are still going to need to believe in something. And unfortunately, that something is an environmental protest or some sort of leftist cause that they can wear in a t-shirt or a bumper sticker. That becomes their religion. we as human beings are oriented towards the vertical. And if you remove that, it's not going to get rid of the yearning for that vertical connection. Well, that's what I was saying earlier is that because we're creating God's image, it is impossible for any human being not to behave that way.

That's correct. In other words, you will simply find a cheap substitute and fool yourself into thinking it's the real thing. But no one can live consistently as though there is no God, as though the world. has no meaning. Going to another break. We'll be right back with Charlie Kirk. Hey folks. It's here at a talk to talk to Charlie Kirk. Charlie, we just got a few minutes left. It kills me because it's probably too much fun for me to talk to you. And this is God is, he's trying to humble me. You wrote this book, The Maga Doctrine, but you're doing so many things right now. Let me just ask you a pointed question. It seems to me clear that this president will be reelected and that we'll probably

take this. No, we've got to fight hard, but I think, here's my big question. After this president's second term, what do you see happening? Well, so I'll challenge it a little bit. I don't see it as clearly as you do. Yeah. I'm worried. I see a lot of Democrat enthusiasm, despite what the media might tell you. But we'll table that. Post-Trump, I see a collision happening in the conservative movement that will be the ruling class trying to, it's be the Empire Strikes Back. You know, episode five is Star Wars.

And we need to win that fight. When the ruling class Republicans try to take back this party, we need to stay grassroots focused and we need to empower voices that understood this moment to turn it into a movement. They're never going to get it back.

I'm just here to tell you, even though it's going to be a fight, they're not going to get it back. Because people have woken up. there is there has never been anything like this we talked about this at the beginning of the first hour but there really has never been anything quite like that no this is this is absolutely unique and exceptional and look the democrats are terrified because they were always worried about a republican conservative movement that could unite the cultural aspects together into a political movement right the church continues to wake up which

god willing and will half evangelicals don't vote which just is stunning to me And by the way, it's one of two ways to categorize that. If you're an evangelical Christian who believes Jesus Christ is king of the world and you're not voting, it's either that you willingly don't care or you think that your voice is not going to be heard. And neither are true, by the way, neither are correct. The left's biggest bet is a silent church. The left's biggest play to take over America is a silent church that stays in its corner and comes to routine quarterly visits to Capitol Hill and takes a snapshot with the senators.

That's what they want. They do not want a raucous, energized church that is involved in public policy and involved in these issues. Well, what I always say is that in the same way that the Democrats have taken the black vote totally for granted and done nothing for blacks in America because they feel like we're guaranteed that vote. Similarly, the GOP has taken serious evangelicals totally for granted and done nothing until this president. And so that, to me, there's a sea change happening. No doubt. And look, there are victories and battles to come. There will be more Supreme Court justices that will determine the future of religious liberty in our country.

They are floating out ideas in the Democrat Party to penalize churches and to shut them down if they do not practice same-sex marriages, which was always a promise that we were guaranteed by the left, which they violated. You and I predicted that wouldn't happen. Of course. We said, oh, no, they're going to come in and they're going to program and they're going to tell people what to say and what to believe. and we've learned that that obviously is the opposite of the case. Here's the fundamental point is for your listeners that are followers of Christ, what are we going to do to make sure the most of, here's how I break it into in 30 seconds or less.

Number one, most important thing you can do in your life is accept Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior. The second most important thing is to make sure you can do the first thing. That's it. And what that means is you need to worry about the kind of government you have so that it really, understands religious liberty because if you do not have that and you wouldn't have that under Hillary Clinton administration much less you know Kim Jong-un administration that's right if you don't have that then everything follows we're at a time Charlie Charlie you got to come back it's a little bit too much it's too much fun to talk to you the book is the maga doctrine

praise the Lord thank you my friend thank you Eric