The Eric Metaxas Show - CMMWednesday Hour 2 (Mike Lindell-Mclure 210105)

Episode Date: January 6, 2022

Pastor Mike McClure, whose church in San Jose has the dubious distinction of being the most sued for staying open during Covid lockdown mandates, has an update.

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Eric Met Texas. Folks, welcome to hour two. Traditionally, it follows hour one, but whatever. I'm talking to our friend Mike Lindell. So Mike, uh, let's keep going. You said that you have people that would have spoken the truth that we trusted. They've gone silent. So in order to hear about this kind of thing, you have to listen to my show.

You have to listen to my show. And that know that you have been working behind the scenes with attorneys general across the country. Amazing. How can that not be a story? How can the New York Times not be writing about this? Eric, think of this. how is this not a story? Let's go back in time.

Let's go back to November, December of a year ago. Remember, they have four conferences, I was going to say before the break. They had four evidence conferences. I remember Arizona completely, Jenna Ellis and Rudy Giuliani. Do you know who was there to film them? One of them was only right-side broadcasting. There wasn't Fox. Where was Fox?

Would that be news when you were disclosing all the evidence? Remember, in Arizona, they did it for 10 hours, poured the evidence out. Do you know what Ducey did? Doug Ducey, their governor, the first hour he called in his electors before even hearing the evidence. Why? Because he could, because nobody even knew that conference was going on, half the people in the country, because Fox wasn't covering it.

They went Fox on. Fox is the biggest. It's not even controlled opposition. They're in on it. They have to be, or they wouldn't have done called Arizona, really and done this. So Eric, I've seen the importance last spring by setting up frankspeech.com and for all people that have been canceled, people that have been canceled to come over here because I knew even there would come a time where even the bad media would not talk about me

anymore. Every time something comes out, you guys, let's say the Cyber Symposium, after that ended, for 11 days, you couldn't find a story about it, or me. And then it came out 11 days later, the first story came out, Mike Lindell had to sell his plane. It's all been bunked and going, as I was flying in my plane, you know. And what they do is as soon as you're getting, like with the Supreme Court case,

that didn't come out in the news anywhere. Wouldn't that be news? When this thing drops before the Supreme Court, do you think Fox will cover that? No, everybody. It's not going to happen. They're not even going to report it. That's just news.

When the Racing County Sheriff's Department press charges against the WEC and Wisconsin. Did anybody out there hear about it? No. When a gal got her, and now I'm going to get into the fourth thing here, I want to tell you. In Colorado, there was a county clerk.

Her name is Tina Peters. Eric, I don't know if you know any about that story, but she was a county clerk, and Dominion came in with the Secretary of State to delete all the evidence of the 2020 election. They called it the trusted business. They recalled all the machines to come in. If you didn't let Dominion come out and delete it,

they called it maintenance. Well, they came in. Well, Tina took a before and after, or she took it before. She goes, I'm going to back up my computer like you should as a county clerk, backed it up. Now, since that time, this was a, this was huge stories. She got raided her house now for the second time, a gal, the Sharona Bishop, that was just a friend that got behind her going,

This is crazy. And Sharona also was upset with their school district, making them do things for their kids, these mandates and stuff. So she was homeschooling. Just a month ago, the FBI bashed her door down with a battering ram. 20 FBI came in, where she's homeschooling at 9.30 in the morning,

ripped her daughter down the stairs by a hoodie with guns drawn, handcuffed her. Get this, everybody. She didn't get charged with anything. They just left. They didn't even tell her what they were there for. I mean, this is just, disgusting. It's happened. We have over 10 different grades that have happened. Okay. Now,

here's where we're at, Eric. I'm announcing this on your show. Okay. What we've done, now, I did a Facebook live today or yesterday. I did a Facebook live, and I'm going to, and I told what I'm going to tell you right now. I said, you know what, Dominion deleted, is deleting the whole 2020 election, and they have to preserve evidence. Tina Peters has a before and after. they have to preserve evidence in any lawsuits. There's been over 200 lawsuits and threatening letters from Dominion in this country. Now, they have to preserve evidence. It's a felony.

You have to keep stuff in the machines. It's a federal crime because you didn't keep it for 22 months. It's a state, Colorado state crime, and other states do. We've got them in all the states. Well, also, they didn't preserve evidence in my case. In my cases, and my pillow sued them, remember, and Smartmatic. They didn't preserve evidence. We've been sending him preservation of evidence things for months.

You know, what they did, Eric, is they threw the guns into the river after they committed a murder. Now, I told this story yesterday. Now, here's what I'm breaking on your thing. Alan Duke, everybody, is the head of the Facebook fact checker. There's five of them. It's a company. He's co-owner with a guy named Martin overseas. He's overseas.

We went head-to-head in battles with him. They're the Facebook fact-checkers called Lead Stories. A very famous episode on Frank Speech. I went, shame on you, Alan Duke. That's where that saying came from. Alan Duke has covered up more stuff on Facebook. Now remember, Mark Zuckerbach came out three weeks ago and said, the Facebook fact checkers are just opinions.

He said it in court. He said they're just opinions. No, you didn't hear about that, everybody. To cover his own butt, he said they're just opinions. But when Alan Duke, he's been late, he's been staying away from me. Eric until yesterday. When I announced this that we, that this deletion, this stuff that Tina Peters has, he put a Facebook fact check over it and said, and stopped all the live stream.

And it says, you click on it and it says, here's why it's partially false. It says partially false information. At the cyber symposium, we put up on the board what Tina Peters found, you know, what they deleted, but it was just like the, you know, it takes months of cyber guys to dig into that. We put it up there and two guys at the symposium made comments, yep, that's just not true. It looks like it came out of two machines. So he put this Facebook fact check over it yesterday.

Well, I got news for you, Alan Duke. Since then, five different cyber teams or cyber people, independent of each other, have dug into what was deleted. It's over for Dominion. We're going to get this to Alan Duke, too. So he's going to do a public apology to the whole country and say, yes, this is true. But Eric, you know what we're doing with this? We're bringing it to the judge in D.C. and saying, hey, they deleted the, they didn't preserve evidence in this case. And in any case, it's called,

there's a word for it. It escapes me right now. But word is you can't, you have to preserve evidence. If you don't, they consider it that you're hiding something that you criminally buried something. Well, sure. Well, sure. It's like, you know, Nixon. burning the tapes. It's like Hillary destroying her. And what should manifest out of this in a normal world, everybody, any judge

ever would say, you're out, Dominion, case dismissed. How dare you not preserve evidence? Especially, remember, they ordered all these mother and fathers that were just poll watchers. They ordered them to preserve evidence. Sent them threatening letters. All of them have a

lawsuit against Dominion, now a class action lawsuit, which Alan Dershowitz says, the most important case ever for our First Amendment right to free speech. If this goes right, Eric, that judge should drop that case. And my case with my pillow suing them should still be going on and Mike Lindale. Because I sued them. My pillow sued them. They are the, it's the biggest criminal thing done in history to cover up the biggest crime in history.

And if they drop that, guess what? All of them will fall like dominoes. anyone that's been sued by smart medic or dominion, they should all just fall. Because you know what? The evidence that's going to go there to show the judge, hey, here's the evidence that they deleted. Guess what?

In that evidence is the algorithm. It shows everything I had in those 30-some terabytes of information that, by the way, these guys went to the, as far as I know, the Cyber 15 Act of 2015. Everything's in there, Eric. I've seen one of the reports. It's disgusting. And it went all across every single state in this country.

Remember, the most votes stole. We're in California, $1.5 million. What was second in our country, everybody? Texas and Florida tied for 900-some-thousand-votes each from Trump to Biden. Folks, we'll be right back. Hey, folks, I've got to tell you a secret about relief factor that the father, son owners, Pete and Seth Talbot, have never made a big deal about, but I think it is a big deal. I really do. They sell the three-week quick start pack for just 1995 to anyone struggling from pain

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Go to relieffactor.com. Relieffactor.com or call 800-500-384-800-50-50-800-3-834. Relieffactor.com. I use it. It works. Hey there, folks. As promised, we have on the program right now, somebody that I consider a friend, but who's really a hero. I've had the privilege over the last

year and a half to speak in churches that have pastors that have been in defiance of preposterous orders that they shut their churches. One of those heroes, one of those pastors is Pastor Mike McClure from Calvary Chapel, San Jose, where I've had the privilege to speak a couple of times. Mike, welcome to this program. Thank you so much for having me, Eric, and thank you. You're really an inspiration in a hero, I think, with the books you put out and the things you've been doing. So thank you for what you're doing. Well, you're really too kind. You have been through something that I just, my blood boils, I almost avoid the subject because I get so upset at the injustice. But I want my audience to know

whatever you're willing to tell them. But you have a glorious church, San Jose, California, Calvary Chapel, as I said, I've been there. What is your story? Tell my audience your story. You know, I've just been pastored in a church for 23, almost, well, I've been here 23 years pastoring full-time 20 years, and I have basically just been teaching God's word doing the same thing that we do every week, like every pastor's done. But a few years back, I read a book called If You Can Keep It. And I think what I looked at in our culture today is how important it is that people hear the gospel because that's what it's come down to is it's the gospel.

And I mentioned earlier, that book, if you can keep it, is such a great book that you put out, Eric. I think I've given that out to so many people. And it's what's needed right now. We need a Jonathan Edwards to preach the gospel. And so we've been doing that. And about a year and a half ago, when COVID broke out, we basically had, you know, closed the church like President Trump had asked, you know, for two weeks to slow the spread. We didn't think it would turn into two years. And after doing that, we had a call from the county and from just the local, not the sheriff or the police. We called them and asked, you know, what their thoughts were, but what we had is these mandates. We looked up the word mandate. Most people don't know. It just means recommendation. And as we saw the need in the church, people hurting, we had suicide rates begin to.

rise. We had depression, discouragement, all the things that were going on with, you know, the whole COVID crisis. We opened up the church and let people come in. And we had the police and the sheriff come to attend church. And no one came to stop us, but soon after we had, the county began to put papers up all over our walls, our exterior walls. So all the glass from outside, it became dark within the church. It's kind of a picture of what was happening. Why would they do that? I'm not really clear. I'm not clear on that. They were finding us. So they told us you can't meet. And if you meet inside a building and you're not following these, you know, guidelines, then we're going to find you. So they begin to find us about $5,000, which is the max they could do. Anytime they would show up, they would give us a firing. And they print out, you know, two, three pages of this far oning. And then they tape it up on the windows for everyone to see. And so literally every day, they would. would show up and we'd have something at the church, meeting someone not wearing a mask proper or whatever,

whatever they could fine us for. They began to put these papers out. And that's when we had, we called a lawyer and we've been basically fighting this ever since. So they gave us fines up to, it was always $3.9 million. And you're not a big enough church where $3.9 million is doable.

I mean, I want people to understand how sick. and devastating this is that here you are simply saying we're going to have church. We're going to keep our doors open. If you don't want to come, don't come. If you're, if you're scared, stay home. But if you want to come, our doors are open. This is the church. And you're telling me that your county has fined you literally millions of dollars. They have fined us millions of dollars. So the only way we can really pay the fines is by selling the funds. property. So, I mean, I look at our amendments. I look at our bill of rights. And we have lost all of those, really except the second amendment, which, you know, I think if we lose that, then we lose

everything altogether. But the First Amendment, we've had the Eighth Amendment, which is the excessive fines. I've had in court my Fifth Amendment taken away. So in one sense, we're looking good, according to the law. You know, we haven't violated it. What is the Fifth Amendment? You think everybody has the Bill of Rights memorized, Pastor McCleur? Come on. What's the Fifth Amendment? That you have a right to defend yourself, that they can't accuse you without you ability to face your accusers. And that's what we, you know, we were in court and I was accused of things without being able to defend myself. And they had things that they would say to the judge. And the judge didn't, he didn't follow the Fifth Amendment. And so it's not just that I can plead the Fifth Amendment and not

say anything. It means I have the right to defend myself or not to defend myself. And so we've had basically all these amendments that our lawyers have found to be in violation. And yet we're in this court that's been going on and on and on. Now, John McArthur was in court, but it wasn't like what we were in. I mean, we were actually in, we had, they put a restraining order against anyone who came into the church at first. And then they just held it against another assistant pastor and myself. We have fines personally by the court up to $100,000. What is the difference between your story and, and, and, you know,

Now, by the way, there's so many heroic pastors in California, or I should say there's so few, but there are a few. Rob McClure, Jack Hibbs, you and John MacArthur, who have stood bravely and heroically. What is the difference between your story and the story of a Che-Anne or the story of a John MacArthur? because John MacArthur won in court. Our friend Jenna Ellis was involved representing him. What is the difference? I don't really understand what is happening with you guys. The main difference is the counties we live in.

So in Jura County, which we mentioned Rob McCoy, and L.A. County where you have John MacArthur and then Jack Hibbs, I think, is in San Bernardino County. Those counties are much more lenient, you might say. what our county really is, and this is what I've come to find out and to realize through our lawyers and through part of the deposition that we're through, is that our county literally is running our state. It's running the White House. Our county was the first to lock down.

They have the craziest laws. Now, San Jose, for people who don't know this, it's right outside. It's near San Francisco. So it's northern, more northern than the other churches that I was mentioning earlier. and that's part of it, isn't it, that San Francisco is notoriously left-leaning? It is the most expensive city to live in and they have the highest homeless crisis. You know, it's flooding its way down here. You know, there as a county, San Francisco, the Bay Area as a whole, they really have said this.

You know, people in political leadership, they said that, you know, the Constitution doesn't apply here. So that's the kind of place we live where the Constitution in a lot of the people's minds here, doesn't apply. And it's almost as if, like, the globalist mentality and these tech companies and the big pharma companies, they are bigger than the United States. And so that's what I have seen is that these people that live here, whether it be Twitter or Google or Facebook or Apple, they literally believe in their own minds. I've been in the room with these guys, that they are bigger than the president, than the governor. And they're calling the shots. And so I had a friend of mine who's a lawyer in town and call me over a year and a half ago when this all started.

And he said, he said, Mike, they want to take the church in the property and they want to get you and everybody out of there. They just want to, you're in their backyard and they don't want a church standing up. And it's like, you know, it's like 1933 and we're in Germany and or Poland. And we're seeing the things that are happening and they're not stopping. They're not capitulating. So back to like with John McArthur, they settled because John's a big name. He's effective down there. but also he has a huge impact.

And the county is not as crazy as ours. And so all of these other counties have settled. They have basically removed all the fines. And ours is the only county. We're the highest fined, I think, institution in the United States. And they have not backed down. So I think that's a difference is really the county that we're in versus where those guys are in Southern California, which is, you know, it's much more open.

There's a lot more Christians. a lot more church attendance. Have you been on any major media talking about this? Early on I was, but I haven't been. I mean, I think the last several months, nothing major. I mean, because where do things stand now, right now for you and your church? Well, they have us in court. We're in federal court, state court, we're in the county court.

So we had, I don't know how many different appeals and all the paperwork we did a deposition. They have to do their deposition. We did ours in the timely manner they asked, which a deposition is basically I have to sit down with the prosecuting attorney from the county, with a court, you know, taking notes on everything and them asking questions. and then they're supposed to do their side of the deposition where now our health department and the county actually has to sit down with our attorneys. They've refused to do that. They put it off several months. Hang on a second.

We're going to go to break. We're going to follow up. Keep talking to Pastor Mike McClure, Calvary Chapel, San Jose. In case you haven't been paying attention, the Biden administration has caused a financial crisis and they have no clue how to fix it. Oil prices have skyrocketed. And when oil prices go up, the cost of transportation and shipping, spikes, leading the prices of goods to rise. And when we're already seeing record inflation,

that's the last thing we need. Our economy is in trouble and you need to take steps to protect yourself. If all your money is tied up in stocks, bonds, and traditional markets, you are vulnerable. Gold is one of the best ways to protect your retirement. No matter what happens, you own your gold. It is real, it is physical, it's always been valuable since the dawn of time. Legacy precious metals is the company I trust for investing in gold. They can help you roll your retirement account into a gold-backed IRA where you still own the physical gold. They can also ship gold and precious metals safely and securely to your house. Call Legacy at 866-528-1903 or visit them online at legacy p.m. Investments.com. Folks, I'm talking to my friend Pastor Mike McClure, Calvary

Chapel, San Jose, California. Mike, I still want my own. audience to understand what's happening. In other words, this goes way back. A year ago, our friend Charlie Kirk announced that you guys are facing $1.2 million in fines that are going up. You won't budge. You are now facing like $4 million in fines. Is that the amount? They reduced it to 2.8 because it looks so bad for them. I don't know. They just say we'll go down. 2.8 million dollars in fines, which I know your church cannot afford. Now, I know that last summer, a bank canceled you. They said, we don't want to do business with you.

This is right out of Nazi Germany that a bank says, we don't want to do business with you. So suddenly, you can't function. You can't find a bank willing to do business with you because you're so dangerous. and so horrible and so anti-Marxist and so Christian that they don't want to do business with you. What's the name of the bank that decided to cancel you? Well, I would like to say the bank came back and apologized. They were put in a really hard place. They were threatened themselves.

So it's Cass Bank, Cass Commercial Bank. And the president himself came and met with me, and he apologized. And they had to go back and count the costs. So this is very interesting. I'm glad I brought this up. Cass Bank, C-A-S-S-S-Bank. Canceled you, but they then apologized. Listen, when somebody does the wrong thing, I want to shout it from the rooftops.

When they do the right thing, I want to shout it from the rooftop. So it's very interesting to me what is going on and how good people are succumbing to pressure. But sometimes they repent and they say, we've done wrong. So that's a good thing. So Cass Bank, C-A-W-S bank did the right thing. But you guys have just been through it. It's amazing to me that you guys have been through it. And I was asking you in the previous segment, where are you now?

And you're kind of bringing us into the weeds. We don't need to go into the weeds, really. I just want to know where do you stand? What are you facing? How can we help? I mean, the world needs to know that just because John MacArthur won his lawsuit and other than, there are still horrific, unacceptable, un-American things happening in this country. certainly in San Jose, California. So where are you right now? And why do you want your story to get out?

Well, what's going to happen, I think, all over the country and a lot of people who live in places and nice states and open places that are free, they don't understand what's coming. So OSHA, California, OSHA, is now at our doors. They're going through our facility. They're threatening to shut us down. So they're using OSHA now to find us and to potentially, this is what's coming. I'm told by our lawyers that even this week they can close our school. We have a preschool through 12th grade and they have gone through and interviewed teachers. I had to actually escort them off the facility three times because I didn't know who they were, whether, you know, why they were here and come to find out now that, you know, they've been sent here, whether it be by the county

or the state, they work for the state, but they're staying, they're going to, basically, they can close lock our doors. And so, I think, this is something that our lawyers believe they're going to do. And so the world needs to know in the United States, like this is not you can just live your Christian life or enjoy your freedom and just think we're going to get through this and it'll be okay. I don't think that the other side that's pushing so hard, and this is really a spiritual battle, that they're going to let go. They're going to stop. And we can't acquiesce our constitutional rights. But we have to be, I think, as pastors, especially today, bolder than we ever have been with the gospel, because this is

what's going to change the nation. Like in your book, I keep her, I've just been so blessed by just seeing the revivals in the past that changed politics. It's really the gospel that changes the heart, and then the result is a change in a country. And this is what we need. We need to have that. If we don't do it now, I think that we are going to lose, I mean, Marxism will win. We will not have a country. country anymore. We will go underground. They will succeed in what they want to do and take over churches. And that's what they're trying to do literally with us. They've done everything they can possibly do in court before the judge, all the threats to arrest people, to take our property.

All these things are there. They're real threats. OSHA's here. And they don't want the church. They want to take over the church. And they definitely don't want pastors to speak out. And they don't want people to, they don't want people to be healthy. You know, now I'm fighting with doctors that, take people and they put them in the hospital and they won't give them things that we know that work like ivermectin or hydroxychloricin or vitamin D or vitamin C. So we now as a church are having to basically mediate between the institutions and the doctors and their health. So I mean our area, I don't know what it's like the rest of the United States, but I would say we're a testing ground for what's coming to the rest of the United States. And I want to keep you on

the next segment because there's more to talk about. But is there a way people can help? Is there a place they can give money? If somebody wants to help you, how can they find you? You know, I would say the best thing you could do is just pray for us. You know what people ask, they'll come to the church and they'll say, what can I do to help? Should I go March?

You're going to send money? And I say, you know what? Just pray for Calvary Chapel San Jose. But pray for yourself and to be holy, to be set apart. That's what's going to change. I don't really want money. I don't think that's not going to solve the problem. I'd rather see an awakening and a revival.

And I think if people just know what's going on, they can pray. And that's the best thing they can do. Calling the politicians isn't going to do much. It's really at the point now where only God can help. Okay, we're going to spend days in court. We're going to come back, folks. I'm talking to Pastor Mike McClure, Calvary Chapel, San Jose. The whole country needs to be aware of this.

And if your church doesn't care about this, folks, you might want to find another church. We're in a horrible battle right now. We need to be fighting, at least fighting. Folks, Eric Matakas here. Somebody just handed me a piece of paper with insane information on it. But I know it's true because the other day I literally got a phone call from Mike Lindell telling me, Eric, you got to check out. And then he tells me about this towel special, right? And he says, you've got to tell your audience.

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click on the new radio listener specials, or you can call 800-978-3057, 800-8-3057. Use the code, Eric. Folks, I'm talking to Pastor Mike McClure at Calvary Chapel, San Jose, California, not very far from San Francisco. Mike, I, you know, I want to, you're still doing church every Sunday, yes? We are, and we need to have you come back and share. share again. It was just powerful. Well, look, I'd be delighted to come back. When this interview's over, we can

look at dates. But you are just one of these heroes, and I have to say that fighting the battle that you're fighting, and you're fighting for every American. And that's why people who look the other way, or who think, well, that's not my fight, folks, I want to tell you, shame on you.

This is your fight. If you care about what is right and wrong, if you care about what is American and pro-freedom, you need to care about this story. And so the media blackout that most people, you should be a household name in America because this is something that you see it happening in Canada and it's horrifying.

You see it happening in other countries. But when this happens in America, I want to ask you, Mike, you know, right now, when I spoke at your church, I think maybe the first time, you were telling me that suicide rates are going up. In other words, if you care about life, forget about COVID for five minutes. What about suicide?

What about people who they want to worship in a church? They need human fellowship to be with their fellow brothers and sisters in Christ, and the government is saying you can't have that. The fact that people are going along with this, this is what horrifies me. Americans need to wake up and understand, folks, this is your battle. And if you look the other way now, it's on you. I just want to say it's on you. and just like you can read a book like Bonhoeffer and say, oh, you know, I wouldn't have done that back then.

I would have been on the right side. That is complete baloney. It is a lie unless you're on the right side right now, unless you're doing something about this right now, getting this interview out on social media, praying for Pastor McClure and for his church. We're just going through dark times. Now, what is happening, I guess, with other pastors in your area? Are there any pastors in the San Jose area that are standing with you, or is yours literally the only church going through this? We're the only church going through it. I mean, I would say there's other churches that are open, but it's been challenging, I think, for me personally, just watching the church. As you read in like Second Thessalonians chapter 2, you know, it says that there's going to be an apostasy at the departing of the faith in the end times. And I just think that's what's happening today.

Maybe you can concur to this too. I think the lukewarm church in America, God is spewing out. He's vomiting out. He's saying, I'm done with this. I want you to be hot. I want you to be cold. And I think what we're going to see is this global, you know, government beginning to rise. And that's what it says as well.

Paul says in Second Thessalonians, too, that there's going to be an antichrist. There's going to be this wicked one that's going to sway the world. He's going to deceive the world. And those that reject the truth, the love of the truth, they're going to then be taking hold of a lie. They're going to believe a lie. And I think that's what's going on right now. As churches or pastors are no different.

I think than anybody else in the sense that we're all human, but we need a savior. And we're either going to look to government and believe the lies of government that man can save us or we're going to finally look to God in a fresh way the way God wants us to look to him. And by looking to him and loving the truth, and it really comes down to truth.

There's not like multiple truth. There's just one. So we have in our area, too, CRT is being infiltrated into our schools. And there's no vacuum. When the church was removed from society, the Bible, prayer, 1962, 1963, the vacuum then was there. So in our schools today, right a mile and a half away from our church, we have a school, Brandon High School, that's teaching kids to cast spells on anyone who say that all lives matter. They're teaching witchcraft to hate Christianity.

And so they're promoting everything to me is just evil. And to trust government and all these things that, you know, that they're coming into society, harming people with a church. We want to help people. And I think that's what pastors have to decide. That's what churches really have to decide. Are you here to help yourself? Are you here to glorify God, obey God, and help people?

How many churches are just not talking about this? again, I want to say this. These are people that many of them, I would say, these are friends, these are good people. But there comes a time, folks, when if you do not speak up, you are part of the problem. The famous quote attributed to Bonhofer, I don't think he actually said it, but silence in the face of evil is itself evil. Not to speak, is to speak, not to act, is to act. God will not hold us guiltless. So if you think, you can say, well, we're just going to Bible studies and we're just going to, quote, unquote, preach the gospel in our church.

Folks, if slavery is happening in front of you, if injustice is happening, and you don't deal with it, I want to know what kind of dead, empty gospel are you preaching. And I think that's exactly what happened. You know, the reason, Mike, that I find it fascinating, when I wrote my Bonhofer book, I wasn't thinking about this stuff. but it's so interesting that people read his story and they say, oh, oh, if I were alive then, I would have been on the good side. Well, folks, are you on the good side now?

Are you speaking up now? If it costs you something now, are you just shrinking away? And I think, Mike, that's why folks like you stick out like a sore thumb, because everybody else has just taken a step backward and said, you know, we don't, we don't want to fight. We want to play Patty Cake with, you know, the local authorities. and we want to be Christian and lie down and let Goliath win because we believe that's what Jesus would do. Frankly, that's bad theology.

It's a scandal. And one of the reasons I wanted to have you on is because I think people don't know. They're not hearing your story. They're not hearing that there's a church in San Jose that's been preaching the gospel for decades that suddenly is facing Marxist government, which is atheistic, which is anti-church, which is Antichrist, and nobody is doing anything about it. They're letting you stand alone. And I want to say to your fellow pastors in the San Jose area, folks, this is it.

You're going to be judged for how you behaved now. And I'd like anybody in that area to know your story. I hope that as a result of this, you will get on more major media, a mic. We've just got seconds left. Just what can people do? How can people find you if they want to encourage you? where can they find you? You can go to our website.

It's calvrysj.org or call the church. Numbers 408, 269, 8331. But, you know, just go straight to the Lord, pray for us. I think of the last days. You know, we're living in a time where people talk about this. What's the last days? What's the Bible talk about the last days? And I just think there's so much happening today that the Bible has given us encouragement for.

And like Paul said, and to Timothy, and I think the Second Timothy, and I think the second Timothy 3, he says, you know, out of all of the persecutions, the Lord delivered me out of them all. And I just think God wants to see the David's out there. Hang on. We're going to drag you into the next segment. Hold on there, folks. Be right back. Mike, just keep saying what you were saying a moment ago.

It's way too important to cut off. Just the day in which we're living with the persecution and the tribulation, the things that we see that we hope are just going to end. And they may not. We may continue to see these things get worse and worse. In fact, it says in 2 Timothy 3 that those that are doing evil are going to wax worse and worse. They're going to be deceived and deceiving others. And so we're seeing that today. And Paul said this in the midst of all of these, the things that we see happening today,

because he says in the last days in 2 Timothy 3, that perilous times will come, that men are going to be lovers and themselves. And he gives a list of just describing our world today. But he says this to Timothy. He says, the Lord delivered me out of all of these persons. persecutions, he delivered me out of them all. And I really believe that God is going to be with us in the fiery furnace. And my encouragement to the pastors is to be bold and to stand up and to political leaders and to police officers and military. Remember your oath. This is the United States.

This is a wonderful country. And what's being taught are just wise. But the truth of God's word is what's to set us free. And that's what we need to, we need to get the gospel out. We need to get the message of the truth. And it's God's Word that Paul goes on to talk about in 2 Timothy 3, that it's just scriptures that are inspired. And if we hold on to those things, that's what's going to save us. That's what's going to save others. It's God's word. It's the truth of who God is. It's the gospel of Jesus Christ. That's what a lost and dying world needs to hear today. Not big government. Government is not here to save us. Government's the problem. But God is the answer. And if we can see that and hear that, we're going to be able to endure the

persecutions knowing that God's going to deliver us, even if we're facing the fiery furnace. And I think that's what's hard. It's hot. It's not easy. I had to count the cost myself. We had to look at, hey, they're going to put us in jail. That was a real thing. Take the house, take the property, take everything I have. But if I already have given it to the Lord, like what Bonhofer said, you know, what it is to be a disciple, the cost of discipleship is to come and die. And if we're not willing to die, then we're never going to know what it is to truly live. And that's what Christ exemplified. Well, that's, it's what I find funny is that you want to say to people who claim to be Christians, are you? Do you believe that Jesus defeated death? Because

if you're afraid of death, you clearly don't believe he defeated death. You're lying. You're a hypocrite. If you believe it, you will live in a way that people will see that person's not afraid of death. They're not afraid of anything. They're only a of displeasing the God who died for them, who loves them. And I think it's just a beautiful thing that we get to experience this kind of faith in our lifetime, that we get to see that you have to count the cost. You have to say, where will I stand? And in the future, you will say, where did I stand when that happened? Did I look the other way? One of the reasons I wanted to have you on, Mike, as I said earlier, is like, I want people to know this is happening,

not in Canada in the United States of America. It's happening to someone that I know personally who is not some loudmouth firebrand. You are a humble man of God doing what God has called you to do faithfully. And circumstances have brought you to this place. You didn't seek this out. And the major news media should be covering this story. This is a story at the heart. If you want to know what's happening in America right now, this.

This is what's happening in America right now. This is the battle. It's a spiritual battle. And Mike, to get to meet you and your wife and your kids and just to know who you really are, it's just a joy that I get to use this program to get the word out a little bit. I believe that people who are watching this, that many of them will want to share this with their neighbors. I hope they will share this. Folks, please, do what you can.

You can pray, you can share this story on social media. We'll put it on Rumble. If you sign up from my newsletter, if you get my newsletter, Eric Mataxis.com, we'll send this to you. We have to get the word out. Pastor Mike McClure, Calvary Chapel, San Jose. God bless you, my brother, to be continued. God bless you, Eric.

Thank you so much for having me, and thank you for what you're doing. It's my honor. Thank you. Are the feasts by Kim, with every year unique kerstversiering in the whole the house.

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