The Eric Metaxas Show - Dinesh D’Souza introduces The Dragon’s Prophecy (Encore)

Episode Date: September 29, 2025

Dinesh D’Souza introduces The Dragon’s Prophecy, the powerful new film based on Jonathan Cahn’s international bestseller. With dramatic footage, biblical archeology, and interviews with world leaders, the film reveals October 7 as a prophetic echo of ancient battles—and asks whether we are now living in the End Times. Tickets on sale Sept 15, streaming on SalemNow Oct. 9 plus Ken Fish of Orbis Ministries shares updates from his worldwide ministry travels and invites listeners to the Illumination Conference in Brentwood, TN — October 8–11, 2025.

Welcome to the Eric Mataxis show. Do you like your gravy sick and rich and loaded with creamy mushrooms? If no one was looking, would you chug the whole gravy boat? Chug, chug, chug, chug, chug. Stay tuned. Here comes Mr. Chugg-a-lug-a-lug himself, Eric Mataxas. Folks, welcome back. I have the fun of being friends with a guy named Ken Fish.

The headline for now is that you're doing a conference in the Nashville area, Franklin, Tennessee, October 8th through 11th. People can find the details at kingdom illumination.org. And did you say to me that people get a discount code if they're watching this show and they put in Eric, there's a discount code? That's correct. What kind of a discount are we talking about? $20 off. Okay, folks, how easy is that? You type Eric into this discount code to get $20 off.

All right, kingdomillumination.org, Bethelworld Outreach Church, October 8th through 11th. That's the headline, but it's not even the headline. We're going to talk about all kinds of stuff. But you're particularly thoughtful, Ken, about what it is that you do. because a lot of people, maybe they have experience with deliverance or praying for healing, but you bring an uncommon level of thoughtfulness to it, which I really appreciate, because I think there are a lot of people that are put off by it, not by thoughtfulness, by this kind of stuff.

And they need to be helped to understand, is this real? Or, you know, what am I to make of it and stuff? So you said something about your thinking. along these lines, why you named this conference illumination. I know we've touched on this in previous shows, but you just did a conference recently with a different name. Right. So illumination is the third in a series of three. I don't know. Maybe there'll be a fourth, but at the moment I don't contemplate that. A series of three that started two years ago with a conference called Fusion. Last year, we called it ignition this year's illumination.

All of this language, and these are unusual titles, I admit, for a Christian event, all of this language is coming out of developments in the field of physics, specifically fusion physics, which is when they take the nuclei of hydrogen atoms, they fuse them together and great quantities of energy are released. So the first conference was called Fusion, and the subtitle was when prophecy and miracles converge. That was what we were after. At that conference, we saw, I would say, remarkable demonstrations of the gift of prophecy, as well as remarkable healings. And as an example, somebody in the crowd had had a lifelong condition with sciatica, that nothing seemed to touch.

and it was utterly debilitating. The person was called out from the stage. I wasn't the one ministering at that moment, and they were healed without anyone even laying hands on them, the power of God hit them, and they were fine. Last year, we went to the title Ignition, and this is because of a development in the field of physics that allowed for fusion to occur,

but actually more energy was coming out than was going in. Now, this almost sounds like the perpetual motion machine, but it is actually occurring in the field of physics. You could Google the term ignition, and you would see a whole series of news articles. The first instance of ignition occurred at Lawrence Livermore Laboratory east of San Francisco, but since then it's gone worldwide, and the French are doing it, the British are doing it. The Koreans were the first to hit a major milestone where a sustained. Dane fusion reaction went for 45 minutes. And it's not clear. Where is the energy coming from?

That I don't get. It's coming from the fusing of hydrogen nuclei into helium nuclei. And there are immense quantities of energy released. And there's so much energy released that it's producing more energy than is necessary to run the machine. So there's still a net positive energy flux. Now again, I'm simply on the language. Yeah, you haven't helped me at all.

Could this lead to having as much energy as we want? Is that the implication? Yes, that's where things are headed. And in fact, this last weekend, as you and I are recording this, just this past weekend, just a couple days ago, we did an Ignition Northwest conference because one of the prophecies that came forth at our second conference called Ignition. James Gull, who's a reasonably well-known prophetic minister, actually very well-known, reasonably he doesn't do it justice. James Gull said there's going to be an ignition on the West Coast and on the East Coast. Well, we don't have the East Coast when planned right now, but anyway, somebody in the Northwest contacted me and said, can we host an ignition conference? So we did that this weekend.

And do you know what? When I was there, somebody walked up to me and said, Do you know they're building a fusion reactor in Seattle in order to power the city? I said, I hadn't heard that. And he said, yeah, it's gotten that far. People are putting big dollars into building these kinds of reactors because this will effectively solve the energy crisis. It's clean energy. It only takes water to run it, a particular kind of water known as heavy water. And to anyone who knows anything about nuclear science, they would immediately recognize what heavy water is.

It involves an isotope of hydrogen. Anyway, they take that hydrogen and they fuse it and you get so much energy released. You can take some off and power the reactor to keep the cycle going. But there's enough left over that you can light the grid. And so now that ignition is, I would say, moving towards commercialization. That's not quite there yet. this third conference is called Illumination Light the World

and this is about really and we're letting the natural be indicative or speak of the invisible realm there's a massive outpouring of the spirit going on all over the world. People are coming to faith all over the planet in huge numbers. Of course this isn't being reported in the media. Why would they care?

And in fact, Paul even talks about how none of the rulers of this age even took notice of, you know, Jesus and his ministry. And so the outpouring that's going on, for example, it's being reported, I don't know if this is exactly correct, but it'll certainly be in the correct range. In Iran, about half the population of Iran is Christian right now. And we all know what the political problems are in Iran.

And most of those converts, most of those believers in Iran, they're under the age of 30. and so there's this explosion of Christian conversion going on in Iran, same in China, and in multiple parts of the world. I could tell different stories here and there, but bottom line is this is happening. And so we're going to talk about after you get fusion where prophecy and miracles converge, and you find sustainability in your spiritual life and in the various disciplines that go with being a servant of the Lord, now we actually might be able to carry something forward that has to do with the completion of the Great Commission. You know, it's interesting, too, just a couple weeks ago, I was in Athens for a conference called Jerusalem Council 2,

and the focus of that conference was complete the Great Commission. I was invited to go to it, but we had the name Illumination well before Jerusalem Council 2 was announced. And so our language is different, but our intent is much the same, but we're trying to do it with the power of the Holy Spirit, which includes both miraculous things as well as the prophetic. So let's go back to what happened last weekend when I was up in the Northwest. Yes, somebody told me they were building a fusion reactor in Seattle. but we had a display of prophecy that broke out from the stage, and there were 26 prophetic words, very specific, detailed prophetic words given every single one of them was correct. If you don't think that didn't create a level of both excitement, and I would say a reverential fear of the Lord,

that God really does know every single thing about us, you would be grossly mistaken. People really want to see this kind of thing. I know I do. We'll be right back, folks. Orbis Ministries is where you can find, Ken. It's ORBIS. OrBIS Ministries. We'll be right back. My Pillow is excited to announce they're having their biggest three-and-one sale ever with a limited edition product, a back-in-stock special and a close-out deal you won't find anywhere else. My Pillow Bedsheets only 2988. any color, any style, any size, even Kings regularly priced at 11998, now only 2988. Once they're gone, they're gone for good. Also, my towels are finally back in stock, but not for long. Get a six-piece my towel set regularly priced at 6998, now only 3998. And for the first and only time, get their limited edition premium my pillows made with Giza Cotton and a designer Guset, Queens 1798, Kings only 1999. Also, for a limited time, when your orders over $100, you'll

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Come on, get rhythm. When you get the blues. Welcome back. Folks, I get to talk to my friend, and maybe yours, Ken Fish. Ken, welcome back. Thanks for having me back, Eric. It's good to be with you. Well, I'm not doing you any favors.

I like, I enjoy talking to you. Every time I talk to you, I enjoy it. We learn things. You travel so much, so it gets confusing for me. You have just now, actually the headline. you're doing in the Nashville area a conference in October. Give us the details on that before we get in talking about all kinds of other stuff. Absolutely.

The upcoming conference is October 8 to 11, October 8 to 11. The suburb of Nashville is Franklin, but it's the Nashville area. That'd be the airport you'd use if you're flying in. And we're going to be at Bethel World Outreach Church. The name of the conference is illumination, subtitle, Light the World. And we're going to be talking about lighting the world with the light of Jesus. But we're also going to have an interesting theme woven into it that deals with human weakness, sorrow, suffering, and how the light shines in the darkness, but the darkness has not overcome it.

And so, you know, we're aware that there are people who have challenges in their lives. And while I love to talk about the miraculous works of God, the healings and more, there is always that group of people who it's not working for them, at least not yet. And a lot of people do ultimately find breakthroughs and touches from God. So we're going to have some conversation around the challenges of life as well as the victories that we find in the Lord. Okay, before I get into some stuff with you, what is the website for that? conference. Yeah, if people want to sign up, they can do so today at kingdom illumination.org.

Singular. Singular. Kingdom illumination. That's right. Exactly. Dot org. Okay. Kingdomillumillumination.org. Okay, folks, everything is there, so we don't have to repeat it over and over. Kingdomillumination.org. Okay, Ken, I had somebody right into the program recently. you know, we do ask me taxes, people writing their questions. And I interviewed somebody Beatty Carmichael who does a lot of the stuff that you do. He's really systematized this thing of, you know, going through an inventory. He's published a book where you go, you do an inventory in your life. And you go over things and you think, is there something, oh, yeah, maybe there's just somebody who I harbor a hatred against or I have to pray a prayer of forgiveness.

or whatever. And it's the standard idea that I have learned from you and others that we can give place in our lives to the enemy. If there's unforgiveness in my life, I'm providing a landing strip, a legal landing strip for a demonic entity. I'm saying, come on down. You can land right here because there's this unconfessed sin or unforgiveness or whatever it is. And I think you've talked about this over the decades. I've talked about it. There are people at bristle at that idea. They say, wait a minute, wait a minute.

You're saved. The Holy Spirit comes in. You're sealed. It's done. You're done. That can't happen. Well, you just said, Eric, can't happen. And it seems clear to me that it can happen and does happen.

And you have observed that, people that if you ask them, do they believe in Jesus? They absolutely believe in Jesus. They pray. They read the Bible. but unbeknownst to them, there is a landing strip. There's a place where they have given access. So that's biblical. But why do you suppose people bristle at that?

They kind of act like, no, no, no, once I'm saved, it's over. Like, I'm done. Like, the enemy can't touch me. You know, there's a lot of teaching that has been promulgated through the years. It's primarily coming from Protestant, Calvinist traditions, not exclusively, but primarily, that once you're saved, it's all done, which is what you just said. It's interesting, though, why then would Paul the Apostles say in Ephesians 427, neither give place to the devil? And then he goes on and he says, let him that stole,

steal no more, but rather let him labor working with his hands, the thing which is good that he may have to give to him the who is in need. And let no corrupt communication proceed from out of your mouth, but that which is good to the use of edification. I'm reading from the King James, because that's what popped up when I googled it as I began answering your question. And grieve not the Holy Spirit of God.

So it seems like Paul is enumerating three places. I don't think this is an exhaustive list, but it's representative, three places or three means or three ways, by which people can actually give place to the devil. And I think sometimes people think, well, I mean, you're just like, I don't know, it's not like you're opening doors to demons, you're just like giving the devil a foothold.

But the devil does most of his work through his lieutenants, just as God does most of his work through us and angels. And so why would this be different? And so what I've learned through the years is that, when there's demonic problems, demons like to attach to sin of some kind. But we need to talk for a second about that. And I'm not going to go into a deep dive here. I'll just kind of skim the tops of the waves.

But there's one word for sin in the Bible that means sin that I didn't even know was wrong. It's like, you know, I was a non-saved person and I got drunk all the time, or I slept with my girlfriend. Well, of course you did, because this is what people do when they're un-saved. save. You didn't even know it was wrong. When you get saved, you become sensitive to that, and you're like, oh, you shouldn't be doing that. Then there's a second category of sin, which is, I knew darn well this was wrong, but I did it anyway. David would be a good example of this with Bathsheba. He had the Ten Commandments. He even wrote Psalms talking about how wonderful God's law was, and yet he committed adultery, and then he committed murder. And by the way, there's a third

of the Ten Commandments that he violated as well, which is, You Shall Not covet neither your neighbor's ox nor your neighbor's wife. Well, he apparently was coveting Bathsheba. So David had three strikes and, as we say, you're out. David committed transgression. By the way, transgression can also be failing to do the good, which God commands us to do because, well, we don't feel like it. Or it might be embarrassing, say, to go make amends with somebody or whatever. And then there's a third category which deals with generational iniquity. I know a lot of people bristle at this one too, but hey, Ezra prayed about the iniquity of his fathers.

Nehemiah prayed about the iniquity of his fathers. Daniel prayed about the iniquity of his fathers, and we could say mothers here also. And so it seems to be a pattern that runs through biblical literature, but it's just often overlooked in our preaching and teaching. It's even in the New Testament because in John 9 there's a man who was born blind and the disciples say to Jesus, master, did this man sin or did his parents sin that he would be born blind? They were thinking about this tradition, this teaching that was prominent in Judaism of iniquity coming down to us. Jesus answered to them is not, what a ridiculous idea. Iniquity doesn't count. Instead he says, well, actually in this specific case, neither

one happened. That man obviously didn't sin. He was too young to sin when he was born blind. And neither in this case did his parent's sin causing his blindness. By the way, parenthetically, yes, his parents did sin because all of sin and fallen short of the glory of God. But whatever sin they committed wasn't the proximate cause of this man's blindness. Jesus goes on to say, in this case, this man's blindness was allowed to happen in order that God's glory would be revealed, and then Jesus heals the blind man. So we have these three categories. I didn't know it was wrong. I knew it was wrong. I did it anyway. And then I inherited something from my forefathers and four mothers. I didn't even know really about it until I became aware of it. Any or all of these could be entry points for people who come into trouble with demonic entities. Okay. So the idea is that you can be saved. You can accept Jesus. He comes to live inside you. But I mean, the third one, it's a fascinating concept. And you and I, we've talked about this a lot.

The idea that something that your parents or an ancestor did, which can somehow still be attached to you, you've just referred to that. That's the third of the things you referred to. You know, that's biblical. Now, it doesn't mean it's so easy to understand, But folks, the point is there may be something in your family line. Maybe your grandfather was a high-level Mason or this stuff attaches through the generations.

But people get very weird about that. And they're going, man, I don't. It's just sort of, this is just reality. Maybe your ancestors did something with the occult. Now, if you get saved, it seems to me, you now have the purpose. privilege of dealing with this, of ending it with your generation. But you don't have to. You can allow it to hang out there. But God invites you to do that. When we come back, we're going to talk about more, how to do that. If you want to know more about the upcoming

October 8th through 11th conference in Franklin, Tennessee, go to kingdomillumination.org. in my way. Folks, welcome back. I think I've mentioned it on the program before, but I'm friends with Dinesh D'Souza. And Dinesh has involved me in a project. I don't exactly have a big part, but it's exciting. It's a new film called The Dragons Prophecy,

and we have Dinesh on right now to talk about it. Deneh, welcome back. Eric, it's a pleasure. Great to join you. and yes, we're thrilled to have you in this film, and you don't have a small part. You have a significant and important part in the structure of the storyline.

And you should be clear with the audience because they won't believe this, but I did all my stunts in this, folks. So you're going to say, there's no way, yes, way. I did all the stunts. When you see the film, that is me. That is me. That's not a stunt double.

Most people would assume it's a stunt double, but it's actually me. Okay, Dinesh, the film is called the Dragon's Prophecy. The first question is, what is the film? It's based on Jonathan Kahn's international bestseller of that title. Khan draws on an image in the book of Revelation where the dragon representing the devil goes to war against a woman representing Israel, and the woman is in fact pregnant, representing, of course, the Messiah.

and but what Khan does is he says that the conflict between Israel and the Palestinians now is a replay, he calls it a resurrection, of an ancient conflict between the Israelites and the Philistines as described in the Bible. Now, there's a very subtle connection between the Philistines and the Palestinians. The name is in fact identical. It's the same name. And Khan's point is not so much that there's, these are genetic. the same people. His point is that the tactics that were used in October 7th have an iris resemblance to the tactics used by the Philistines. When Samson, for example, was captured

by the Philistine, Samson, of course, representing the power and the strength of Israel, he's blinded in the way Israel was blinded in October 7th. He's dragged where to Gaza, and what happens there? They strip him, they make him a public spectacle, they dance around him, celebrate his captivity. So in a way, what Khan says is, hey, who's the first hostage of Gaza? Answer, it's Samson in the Bible. So all of this, I think, is just a very fresh, interesting, and provocative way to interpret what's going on now, but through the light of biblical events. And of course, we add in, and this is where you come in, biblical archaeology, a hint of biblical prophecy. So this is a beautiful blending of history and the Bible and also politics.

I mean, it's extraordinary. Jonathan has just this outrageous gift, Jonathan Kahn, because it's all there, but he seems to see it. Nobody else sees it. And then he writes about it. And then you read it and you go, you know what? He got it right. How crazy. I mean, it really is.

It's extraordinary. And of course, we have to be clear. It's the Lord. the Lord created Jonathan Kahn and clearly wants this message to get out right now. When you mentioned Samson, the other thing that's so horrible is they blinded him. I mean, when you really think about the sick cruelty of Hamas, the sick cruelty of people through history, it's hard for us sometimes in the West to imagine this evil, this cruelty. And it needs to be underscored that this is real.

This is what Hamas did. They did things that are difficult even to talk about, really. I did an in-depth, of course, with Khan for the movie. But then we took our little film team, and off we went, just as a few weeks ago, to spend nine days in Israel. And people go, you're not going to Israel. There's a war over there, man. And I'm like, well, yeah, we are. And they're like, you're not going to go to Gaza, are you?

And I'm like, of course not. Sure enough, we go to Gaza. We go to the site of the Nova Festival. this film opens with about 10 minutes of unremitting, and it has a little bit of a graphic warning. It shows October 7th, and it puts you at the scene. The Israeli government, I think, made a tactical blunder early on where they decided we're not going to show the footage.

We're going to bring in some journalists from the BBC and Sky News and CNN and show it to them because their eyes will be opened. No, these are propagandists. they had no interest in any of that. We have all that footage. We have threaded it together into a riveting account. So when I'm talking to people, survivors of October 7th, I'm able to show you what happened to them and their families on October 7th in the background.

What do you make of this strange situation we find ourselves in where people seem to be more upset about Israel attacking Gaza, than they do about what Hamas did. I mean, I did find it fascinating on some level. It's very peculiar. Now, in fairness, I think that there should have been a much bigger public awareness of the details of October 7 than there is. It's almost like if you were to see the American bombing of Dresden

or even the American bombings of Japan without knowing anything about Pearl Harbor or just knowing about it in the abstract but not actually seeing it, you can get your perspective dislocated. And so part of what this film does is it sort of sets you right back into perspective, where it says, listen, if somebody were to do a home invasion on you and they were to, you know, rape your wife, kill your kids, and then they run away and you grab your gun and you go after them. And then what they do is they go to their car,

they grab their own wife and kids and stick them in front of themselves and go, don't shoot, we got civilians here. I mean, this is the macab comedy of the situation where it is Hamas that is endangering its own citizens for its own political benefit. And listen, folks, we have to be clear, it's diabolical. There's no other way around it. It is utterly diabolical. It's satanic. We're talking about a new film, The Dragon's Prophecy with Dinesh D'Souza.

We'll be right back. My guest is Dinesh D'Souza. We're talking about a brand new film called The Dragons Prophecy based on the book. by our friend Jonathan Kahn. And Dinesh, before we forget, where can people find the film? The film is out right around October 7th, so it's in theater. It's October 6th and October 8th, the two days around October 7th. It's also going to be streaming and on DVD the next day, October 9th.

And all tickets at the website, the Dragons Prophecy Film.com. The Dragons Prophecy Film.com. You can order streaming and DVD now. Look, this is a film kind of made for the second anniversary of October 7th, but it has an enlarged perspective that shows us what America's role is here and also what our role is. Because one of the points that Khan makes very profound, I think, is that, look, if battles are going back to the beginning,

if the Jews of today need to be tough and put on armor like the ancient Israelites did, then guess what? We who are those sort of spiritual Jews, we who are the spiritual Israelites, we the Christians, we need to go back to the way Christians were in the book of Acts. We need to have a kind of new fervor, a new dynamism to our faith and a recognition of the spiritual stakes involved.

That's what this film, it tries to help that process and help that kind of enlightenment. And what was it that led you, Dinesh D'Souza, to say, I want to make a film about this? Because I know you, I know Jonathan Kahn, but when I heard that you were making a film of his book, I thought, wow, what a great idea. What was your process in that?

Eric, I went to Israel for the first time with my wife, Debbie, in December of 22. I was exposed to biblical archaeology for the first time. In fact, right about that time I read your book, is atheism dead? I was blown away at this idea that as the world becomes more secular, and you and I talk about this in the film, God is speaking back, is whispering, if you will, through the tablets and the artifacts and the stones and the seals. So I knew about all that. And then comes October 7th. And I go, you know what? This is a very interesting topic. But I didn't realize it initially that the topic of biblical archaeology and October 7th were connected in that they

go back to the fundamental question of whose land is it. So I had the past, the archaeology, the present, October 7th. And then I encountered Jonathan Khan, who comes on my podcast and talks about prophecy and I'm like, whoa, we have the past, we have the present, we have the future. I think I can weave this together in a very interesting tapestry. And I'm very proud to say, I think this film delivers that in a big way. What do you make, Dinesh, of voices on the right? Like, I guess Tucker Carlson is a classic example that I've been on his show and I admire him. But he seems to see things differently. I guess I'm, you know, I always want to get stuff right.

You don't just want to be an apologist for Israel no matter what. But it really seems like there's this strange narrative out there that there are people that just a few years ago I would have agreed with them on everything. But they have some view that, you know, 1948 is meaningless. Israel becoming a country, the Jews coming together after thousands of years away. That's meaningless. Who cares? It doesn't. It's a strange thing to me because, I mean, I'm interested in one.

it's true, but I find it hard to believe that that idea makes any sense, that it's a meaningless thing that Israel has been reconstituted. Tucker has some real moral blind spots. This is one of them. I've known Tucker Carlson 30 years. He worked for me in his early career. The two of us were on a speaking tour together in Australia just last year. We got along just fine. But Tucker does not know or understand the Bible at all. Recently, I just saw him in one of his interviews, and he's said this phrase, what is Judea and Samaria? And he wasn't asking sort of rhetorically, he didn't know. Right. So you have a guy like Tucker who thinks somehow that there is a disconnect between the Jews in Israel today and the ancient Israelites. The big question he posed

to Ted Cruz was, are you really saying that the Jews of today are descended from the ancient Israelites? And the answer is, duh, yes, because it's not like some, the Jews were scattered in a diaspora and some other sneaky non-Jews came and, you know, impersonated the actual Jews and came to Israel and said, here we are. And the real Jews got lost somewhere in Ukraine or Lithuania. I mean, this is like madness. But it's being put out there with a straight face. Lots of people are falling for it. As well as the canard that a country of 10 million people with a tiny GDP relative to ours, no kind of weaponry comparable to ours is somehow controlled. us, almost as if someone would make a claim that the mosquito is controlling the elephant.

I mean, it's... I have to ask you, for some reason, on my Instagram feed, I have no idea why, but a couple days ago, all of this Nick Fuente's stuff kept coming up. And I thought, this is a diabolical figure. His hatred for the Jews, it actually frightened me, his racism. And I realized you debated him recently. What can you say? Well, Nick Fuentes has a kind of cult following, and it's on the right, and he was going out there basically saying, Charlie Kirk is a wimp, he won't debate me, you know, Shapiro, the Jew won't debate me. So I was like, you know what, I'll debate him. And I realized that Nick Fuentes, basically, to him, history begins

around like 2001, because his big point is like, regime change is bad. Look at what happened in Iraq. And I was like, well, yeah, but there was regime change in Germany, in Japan. There was, I I can give you 40 examples of regime change that turned out beautifully. So I just went through this, and you could just see his sort of startled face. I think we're dealing here with a generational gap of knowledge and understanding. Fuentes and Tucker have something in common is that they both like to take the thing that nobody likes to say and say it really loudly. And part of their idea of going after Israel is based on this kind of, I think, juvenile iconoclasm. juvenile iconoclasm. I think that's correct. I think that's correct. And I want to be really clear. I like Tucker. I can disagree with Tucker on some stuff, but I really like him. Nick Fuentes, honestly, what I see, I find frightening. The fact that he has a cult following among people who are too ignorant to understand what he's pushing. Because it is a really, you can feel the spiritual darkness of his hatred for the Jews. And he loves to take things in a really racist direction. And it's kind of

because, you know, people like you and me were accused sometimes of being racist, and we are absolutely not that. But because of figures like him who really is racist, people on the right kind of get lumped in with that. It's a frightening thing. We've got a final segment coming up with Dinesh.

The film is the Dragon's Prophecy. Folks, this is important. It's going to come out October 6th, 8th. Stay tuned for that. We'll be right back with Denech. Final segment with Dinesh D'Souza. Dinesh, you were in Israel recently, and you spoke directly with Prime Minister Netanyahu.

Tell us about it. Yeah, I got 30 minutes one-on-one with him, and there's about five minutes of him in the film. I'm saving the rest just to do on my podcast later. But I wanted to, you know, Netanyahu is so much under siege worldwide that when I've seen him in interviews, he's very kind of clipped. He's very stiff. He knows what he has to say, and he speaks in a very measured way.

So I wanted to throw him off his stride to bring out the real Netanyahu, which is like the real Trump. It's actually better than the canned Netanyahu. And so I unloaded some questions on him like, what do you think of Jesus? So right away, you can see his face. You know, he has to comment on Jesus. And he has very interesting things to say. And you have a very animated Netanyahu who is a friendly sparring partner for me. And I think this Netanyahu is someone that people were really like, because he's

been demonized, as you know, on the world stage. I think he's a hero. But very often, the Netanyahu that people need to see is not the Netanyahu that they do see. And so I try to bring a little snapshot of Netanyahu in the film where people go, wow, that guy is a real character. And guess what? We are America first. He's Israel first, and he has every right to be. Well, of course he does. So you got Dinesh D'Souza gets Benjamin Netanyahu to let his hair down. And you did it without vodka. You just did it by throwing some questions. I love that.

I'm looking forward to seeing that. Now, you invited me to be in the film to talk about biblical archaeology. And it is fascinating. Obviously, you read my book, is atheism dead. But when I discovered myself the evidence for the book. for the Bible from, from archaeology, it becomes open and shut. It's not like, well, there's some evidence. It is more and more and more coming out. And it really does feel like God's hand. It's like the Lord is saying, okay, now I want to bring this information out about science, pointing to God,

about archaeology, pointing to the Bible as history. We're living in historic times. And you do bring that out in the film, that this is not just, you know, kind of more of what we've grown up with. Something has changed. Yeah. Here. is your role in the film? You know, we have Jonathan Khan giving this kind of spirited biblical analysis, but our audience is not exclusively Christian. And so I have to step back and say, all right, but there are people who are going to say, well, how can we trust the Bible? It's maybe like Greek mythology, like King Arthur, maybe this stuff is all made up. So when you talk about Pontius Pilate, when you talk about the childhood home of Jesus, we went to all those places. And so we're

showing the audience straight up. Guess what? Here is Pontius Pilate. This is the first historical reference to Pontchus Pilate outside the Bible, and it's indisputable, and here it is. And so what we're doing with your section in the film is validating the historicity of the Bible as a kind of tool or template of analysis. And so it legitimizes where Jonathan Khan is going. It fits beautifully together. You're going to love this film, Eric. Once again, if I can say, the Dragons Prophecy Film.com, that's the website. you can order streaming now.

You can get your DVDs now, and it's in theater. Tickets will be up in a week or so. You can get your tickets for the theater on October 6th and on October 8th. And dare I say it's an important film. That's the point, folks. There's a lot of films. This is important. It's important that we understand this.

And it is important that we understand that the Bible is historical. And I can understand people who don't get that because they haven't been confronted with the more recent evidence. more and more and more evidence has come out. Obviously, I write about it in my book, and Dinesh talks to me about it in the film. It is a startling thing that we're alive at a time where we can see this. And so we can present this evidence

to people who aren't on the same page. And it's actually important we do, and it's important for ourselves, that we know this is not something we believe. It's just true. So the film, The Dragons Prophecy, you can find it at the Dragons Prophecy Film.com. Dinesh D'Souza, thank you so much.

Eric, always a pleasure. Thank you.