The Eric Metaxas Show - Douglas Wilson

Episode Date: March 31, 2023

Douglas Wilson highlights his upcoming book, "Mere Christendom," pointing out the failure of the church to effectively provide guidance and hope to a culture gone off the rails.

Folks, welcome to the Eric Mattaxas show, sponsored by Legacy Precious Metals. There's never been a better time to invest in precious metals. Visit legacy p.m.investments.com. That's legacy p.m.investments.com. Welcome to the Eric Mattaxas show. They say it's a thin line between love and hate, but we're working every day to thicken that line, or at least to make it a double or triple line. Now here's your line jumping host, Eric Mattaxas.

Hey folks, welcome to what I like to call Thursday. Thor's Day. I don't have the time to break that down for you, but it comes after Woden's Day, which was yesterday. In hour two, we'll begin with our standard Ask Metaxus segment, which is usually fun. Today it might not be. I don't know. I can't promise anything. But for most of today, I get to talk to someone.

I've wanted to talk to you for the longest time. His name is Douglas Wilson. Some of you know him. He lives in Moscow, Idaho. He's a pastor of Christchurch there, the writer of an almost infinite number of books, some of which I've had the joy of reading. Douglas Wilson, welcome to this program. Good to be with you. Thanks.

You're hard to sum up, sir, and that's a compliment. You've really written a ton of books. The new one we're going to talk about is called Mir Christendom, which is coming out very soon, mere Christendom. But I always want to know people's story. I know of you. I've had the privilege of knowing your son, Nate, N.D. Wilson over the years, had the privilege of meeting your grandson, who has attended Columbia University here in New York City. He's come to some of our Socrates in the city events. but I've not had the joy and privilege of meeting you in person,

but at least I get to talk to you finally on this program. How do you, I mean, I always want to ask people, where did you grow up, and what is your story before we get into the various books you've written and the new book? Sure. The short form is my hometown was Annapolis, Maryland. I grew up there. My dad was an academy graduate,

and after he got out of the fleet, he went to Annapolis to open up a Christian bookstore. So I grew up in a ministry environment to midshipman there, grew up in Annapolis. I joined the Navy, was in the submarine service for just under four years, came to the University of Idaho to study philosophy, got my master's degree in philosophy here, and found myself pastoring a Jesus people-like church while I was still in college. and it was a long story how that happened, but that church grew and developed into what it now is,

which is Christ Church here in Moscow, were Presbyterians who believe the Bible, basically. Ha! That was funny. That was good. Yes. So when did you leave Annapolis, Maryland? How long were you in that neck of the woods? Let's see. We left Annapolis in 1968, 1968. Okay.

So a little while ago. So, a little while ago. And where did you start your first church? Did you, how did you end up, you know, how do you end up in Moscow, Idaho? That's a good question. So my father, being a military man, back in the 60s, wrote a little book called Principles of War, where he applied the military principles of physical warfare to what he called strategic evangelism. And mobility, surprise, concentration, et cetera.

and he decided that the decisive points in North America were major universities in small towns. The small town made it a feasible target. The university made it an important target, evangelistically speaking. And he found out that Moscow, Idaho has the University of Idaho here. And eight miles away across the border is Pullman, Washington with Washington State University there. So two small towns, eight miles apart with the major university. university in both. So he moved here in order to establish his literature mission. I helped him move here, and then I went in the Navy and then came back here to go to school and wound up pastoring the first church

I've ever pastored and the last church, I'm still pastoring, here in Moscow. Well, it's extraordinary to me because you, you know, from what I've read, you're brilliant. You don't have to assent to that. I just declare it this program, but you're a brilliant man and writer and thinker and a biblical thinker. And it seems like your father was as well, because what he, what you just said that he determined was strategic, he was dead on. Obviously, the church didn't follow his lead in that, but he was dead on in what he said. Yeah, the lymph nodes from which America's cancer is spreading are the universities. Higher education in North America is diseased and is the source of almost all of our afflictions. It's, uh, higher education is kind of putting it mildly, you know,

cancerous, uh, we have to be clear. We're talking deadly disease. And that's, there's no doubt about that. There's no doubt. And through the decades, it has made its way. I was at Yale in the 80s. It was already there in spades in the 80s. But it made its way through the decades into all of the institutions so that now we have woke corporate culture. Every sports team, including hockey, has gone woke and pro-LGBQ, whatever. It's just a kind of a madness that has worked its way through the institutions, as you said, quoting Gramsci. And it's horrifying. but you've been battling this in books in all kinds of ways.

Now, people just want to find you. What's the website where they can find you just in case? Probably the best way the clearinghouse would be Doug Wills, D-O-G-W-I-L-S dot com. That's my blog, but from the front page there, you can get to pretty much everything I'm involved in, New St. Andrews College, Canon Press, and so on. So, Dougwills.com is the best place to go. Wills.com with one L, Dougwills.com. But yeah, so you're large.

You contain multitudes. So let's get going here. Let's, why don't we just start with the new book. Don't quote, don't quote Whitman at me. What did I ever do to you? I know, exactly. Well, a lot of Whitman is so wonderful. That's always the pity, right?

No, but it's, it's, you wrote a book about writing, which I read a couple of years ago. I don't remember the title of that. What's the title of that one? That's word smithy. Word smithy. Word smithy. That is an extraordinary book that you as a Christian wrote about writing. Fantastic.

I want to have you on just to talk about that. But the new book, which will be out very soon, is called Mere Christendom. So let's talk about that, Pastor Douglas Wilson. What is the book Mere Christendom? So mere Christendom is about how Christians should respond to the disintegration or the collapse of secularism. Secularism is not working. Secularism is on its last legs. People cannot function corporately or individually without reference to God.

We cannot afford to be Christless or godless. we have to order our lives around the revelation of God and Jesus Christ. Now, the first Christendom, from the conversion of Constantine down through the Reformation, let's say, the first Christendom had a long run of a thousand years. There were many missteps and things we did wrong, and bugs that needed to be worked out. So what I'm talking about is a reboot of Christendom, where we abandon secularism. We don't do a repeat of everything we did in the first Christenum. We don't want a Spanish Inquisition.

You know, we don't want to revisit certain things that were wrong and sinful and wicked in the first Christendom. And so that's why I qualify it with mere Christendom, riffing off of Lewis's mere Christianity. What I want to urge Christians to think of is that God has opinions about what we're doing. corporately. And this is something I learned from Abraham Kuiper. Societies are moral organisms. Societies can make decisions. And that means that we can declare war. We can conduct genocides. We can gather up virgins for harems. We can outlaw certain ethnicities. We can be guilty of ethnic cleansing, and we have a decision-making apparatus that makes us culpable or not culpable, depending on the decision we make.

I much enjoyed your letter to the American Church. It was really good because basically Germany of that era was a moral organism, and they made fatal decisions. And corporately, those fatal decisions had an aftermath that was just horrific. Let's pause. We'll be right back talking to Douglas. Wilson, don't go away. Legacy precious metals has a revolutionary new online platform that allows you to invest in real gold and silver online.

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A music special from Andrea Bichelli in theaters, April 2, 3rd, 4th, and 6th. Find out more at The Journey.movey. That's The Journey.com. Folks, welcome back. I have the great joy of speaking with Douglas Wilson. It's about time. I've admired him from afar, specifically from New York to Moscow, Idaho, pretty far. And I wanted to have you on.

And we're talking about a lot of things, but we're talking about your new book. Now, how many books have you written? It's really preposterous. How many books have you written? I don't know. About 100. About a hundred. Did you catch that?

About 100. So it's not 200. It's not zero. It's about 100. But this is not virtuous. I tell people that I write for the same reason that dogs bark. Yeah. Well, no, it's funny that way because it's not,

there's sometimes it's not wise to write too much because then people, you know, that's what publishers will tell you. but in any case, you've written a lot of wonderful books. The new one is called Mere Christendom. And what you were just saying, thank you for your kind words about my new book, Let it to the American Church. But what you're saying is something that I have been thinking about recently is this idea that when you take God out of the equation, everything falls apart.

Those of us who know God is real, who know that he is the source of all reality, and truth in the universe, know that that makes sense. But it's like we've been living in a dream, this secular dream, this ideological fantasy, this fiction, that we could somehow exist apart from God. And it's caught up with us. I think your average person is realizing like, uh, something's wrong. It's kind of like, you know, building a bridge and not using the right math. And when you get to the end of building the bridge, you realize that the sides aren't matching up.

Like, what went wrong? We failed. What is happening? How do we fix this? And then you realize, yes, you need to get the math right in the beginning. If you take God out of the equation, you're doomed from the start. But it's taken us, you know, depending on how you look at history, but where we've arrived at a kind of unprecedented moment in history. It seems to me, and it seems like that's what you're saying.

That's right. This bridge that we're on is way too bouncy. I don't want a bridge that bounces this much. And most Christians know you can't have creation without a creator. You can't have law without a legislator. Well, right now, America can't have salvation without a savior. We cannot save ourselves. This is Christianity 101.

We can't save ourselves. We can't forgive ourselves. We can't pull ourselves out of them. We are sinful, rebellious creatures be saved. And that means we need to turn away from our own resources, our own definitions. Because when we self-define, we define ourselves right out of existence. We can't Jackson, Katanji Brown Jackson, in her famous reply, what is a woman, she said, I'm not a biologist.

Well, if you don't know what a woman is, you don't know what a human being is. If you don't know what a human being is, then you don't know what murder is. How can you know what murder is when you don't know what a human being is? It's just that simple. We can't define ourselves without reference to the image of God. But we've just never been at a place where somebody who could become a Supreme Court justice could be so illogical and be so crippled by ideology that they are unable to state what everyone knows and has always known.

So it is a, it's kind of like a singularity in history that we've, we've come to a moment where some of the most educated, brilliant minds in the world are unable to think. It is really extraordinary. but average people, most of whom can think, are taking notice of this, and it ties into the larger thesis in mere Christendom that if you take God out, it all breaks down. There can be no logic. There can be no science. There can be no nothing. Right.

But see, the thing that I'm urging is that every society, this is a fallen world, every society has always had disturbed people and mentally unstable people and insane people. our problem, our affliction today is not that we have insane people or disturbed people, because every society has always had that. Our problem is that the sane people can't define what insanity is. The sane people can't say, this is a girl, this is a boy. This is, so you have the issue is not that Nixon couldn't answer that question. The issue is that she couldn't answer the question and got confirmed anyway, right? All the sane people waved her through.

All the sane people said this is okay. This is acceptable. But it simply is not. How can you live in a society where we define ourselves? That's like standing in a bucket in order to carry yourself upstairs. That's about right. And that is where we are. One simple way of summing up what we're saying, I think,

is to say that we need revival. We cannot continue as we have been going. We've achieved a time when we're out of room. We've had enough wiggle room over the decades, but we've finally come to the edge of a cliff, and there's nowhere to go. We need God. Yeah.

We're the prodigal son who has finally run out of money. The prodigal son didn't run out of money, on the first day. He gathered up his inheritance, went off and spent it and ride his living, and for a while, he could buy drinks for the house. For a while, he could be the party commando. But there came a time when he ran out of his father's money. And there came a time when he got a job staring at the pig food and wishing he could return to his father's house. We are in that position. When we abandoned God as a nation, we had our father's money for a time. We had moral capital. Yeah. And we spent, we spent that moral capital thinking that our secularism was working.

Now, that wasn't our secularism working. That was the prodigal son spending his father's money. Right. But now, but now we're out of money. Now the, the Piper is demanding to be paid. That's right. And so I said earlier, the simple answer is we need revival, real revival, because there is no other answer. God is the only answer. And even when I say God, I mean God and his reality and his truth, unless enough people return to that and are willing to pay the price to return to that, there's simply nowhere to go. When you have a Supreme Court justice unable to say, what a woman is. It's comedy and tragedy. We have never seen anything like this in the history of our nation. Never.

It's just a moment of madness. But I think the hope is that average people see it. Average people laugh and think, this is nuts. Are you kidding me? You're telling me that everything I've known my whole life, everything that everyone has known,

that borders are sensible, that there are men and there are women, that families are a good thing. Everything we have known is suddenly called into question. And then if you do dare to say, wait a minute, I have a different view. You're being told, shut up, you can't talk about that. So I think things are so bad that a lot of people are waking up at this moment, slowly. That's right.

There are a lot of people in what's called flyover country, a lot of ordinary people. Who when you make a reference to the last two years being clown world? Yeah. They know what you're talking about. Yeah. Yeah, this is clown world. And it's rapidly turning into creepy clown world. Yeah.

Well, I think that's also true. For me, the media is a big part of this in the sense that it doesn't matter that something's true. People have to know that it's true. People have to hear that it's true. And so we live in a country that you often hear that, oh, we're divided. Well, I would say actually we're not that divided. If you consider, you know, the crazy cultural elites as half of the country, then we're divided. But they're not half of the country.

They are a fraction, and they have controlled our ability to communicate and to get the truth out. So they give us this illusion that we're more divided than they are. And the crazier things get, I would say the less divided we get. more and more people are simply saying, this is preposterous. And I'm also fascinated by how many non-Christians are on-team reality. They find themselves bristling at the lunacy, whether it's Bill Maher or any number of people that wouldn't agree with us, theologically, on any level, but they seem to understand that things are going haywire, and I'm not going to have it. Right. Exactly right.

Well, I want to talk to you more about this book and more about what else you're doing. But this book is called Mir Christendom. And when we come back, I want to talk to you about the other things that you're involved in. Continue to talk about the book. But you have a publishing house and a college. You've done extraordinary things in Moscow, Idaho. We'll be right back. Tell me why Relief Factor is so sensitive.

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the writer of, oh, about 100 books. And I can't even begin to list them. So you're kind of a renaissance, man. You've been doing many, many things over the decades there in Moscow, Idaho, not just pastoring a church, but you founded a publishing company. You started a college. Tell me about these things. Yes, we started first Logos school, which is a K-12 classical Christian school. We started it for my oldest daughter's kindergarten year, and it's now a thriving school and sort of been the flagship school of the renewal of the classical Christian school movement in North America. Excuse me, I ought to have mentioned that up front. I forgot how central you, sir, have been in the classical Christian movement.

in America. And so I do want to talk to you about that because that is huge. Absolutely. If you've done nothing else, that is just huge. Do me a favor. Just tell me how many kids go to this school in Moscow, Idaho? About 650, which when you consider the size of Moscow, is that it's an enormous school for a town our size. So, and then the association of classical and Christian schools began here, and there are now hundreds of schools around the country, and some internationally, that are following this model of classical Christian education. And then we started New St. Andrews College, which has got a couple hundred students in it. It's a small liberal arts college that we patterned ourselves off of the curriculum that Harvard had

in the 1600s. So that was the baseline that we began with. and then adapted and modified for our era. So New St. Andrews College, and we have a graduate school with it and so on. We started Canon Press, and Canon Press has a major outreach with Canon Plus, which is a subscription service where you can get audiobooks and just a, there's a torrent of content on Canon Plus, which is, part of Canon Press. So there's that.

There is the ministries of the church, and we have sister churches that we've planted. The communion of Reformed Evangelical Churches is the denomination that our church is part of. So a lot of things have spun out of the ministry here. Over the decades, it's just wonderful to hear, and it's Canon with 1N, of course,

canonpress.com. people can find. I assume most, if not all of your books there. Yeah, yeah. So when you talk about classical Christian education, I was just a couple of days ago at the Linville Hill Christian School. It's in Lancaster, Pennsylvania. They have about 500 students, tremendously successful. I was so encouraged when I get to talk at schools like that,

or I guess I'm encouraged because you're not reading about this on the news, that there are outposts of civilization and wisdom and godliness around the nation. But again, if you watch the secular media, you would never know that such things exist, much less are a threat to the future of secularism in America. Right. That's very true. someone wants the sociologist Peter Berger

said just speaking of religious societies that Sweden is the most secular of all societies and India is the most religious of all societies India and he said America India India India he said America is a nation of

Indians governed by Swedes right so so we have we have the cosmopolitan atheistic materialistic elites who govern us according to a secular framework. And the natives are getting restless with all the insanity that's being handed down to us.

And we know that you can't govern people without reference to God. It just can't be done. Well, you can't do anything without reference to God. Ultimately, it breaks down. Why? Because God is real. He created the universe. Everything points to him.

it's inescapable. You don't have to like it. You don't even have to agree with it if you don't want because we live in a free country where you can believe anything you like. But the problem is you're kicking against the goads of reality itself. And that's kind of where we are. We were talking about that earlier that we've come to a moment where the madness has increased so that a lot of people are waking up.

They're simply saying, look, I don't know how somebody could say that they're more than two genders. That's patently crazy, but people are not only saying it, but they're trying to enforce this as a kind of a new way, really is like trying to establish a religion. They're insisting on this. And who insists on things that aren't true? Well, totalitarians and authoritarian's kind of where we are. Right. I call it totalotolerance. We're living in an era an era of total of tolerance where progressives have got so good they have to be mandatory say that again because you cut out progressives have ideas that okay so good that they have to be mandatory yeah yeah we've got to force them down your throat well all right so in the book

mere christendom actually we're going to a break folks uh i'm talking to douglas wilson you can find him at Doug Wills, that's W I-L-S-1-L, Dougwills.com. Dougwills.com. The new book is Mir Christendom. We'll be right back. Make like a Mr. Mumbles and you're a Mr. Big, they dig a hero. You've got to sound your A the day you're born. Doctor, my eyes have seen the year.

and the slow players without cry. Folks, welcome back. I'm talking to Douglas Wilson, whose latest book is Mirr Christendom. Douglas Wilson, so you have done many, many things. One of the things that you've done that we haven't even mentioned is you have a podcast. What is that called? It's called The Plodcast.

The What? I believe in the Plodcast. So I believe in plotting as a way. I wrote another book called Plot Activity, where the way to get things done is to systematically plod through them. And so I have a podcast where I just chip away at different things. And is it called Man Rampant or something like that? I can't remember the title. No, Man Rampant is an interview show that I have through Canon Press.

So Man Rampant is a video television show, a long-form interview show. The podcast is simply a regular podcast. That's a week later. Well, this is where I'm supposed to ask you, when do you sleep, sir? So, man rampant, because I know you invited me graciously to be on man rampant, and I realize this means that I have to travel to Moscow, Idaho. That wasn't really, that wasn't on my route to anything, but I'd like to figure out a way just to be with you.

We'd love to have you. and to do that. So we should figure it out. But so, but in the book, Mir Christendom, what are you suggesting is necessary for us to do, to deal with the current reality? One of the things I do in the book is I'm arguing that secularism is bankrupt. Secularism does not work. We have to acknowledge God. We have to return to God. And we have to base our laws and our reason for being on him. he is the reality. When you say this, one of the things that people who have been catechized with liberal dogmen will say is, oh, you want to take away our freedoms.

You want to set up an Ayatollah regime. You want to set up a theocracy. You Christian monsters want to set up a theocracy and take away our, not just our reproductive rights, but, you know, whatever. I mean, it's kind of, I always find it funny because it's exactly the opposite. We are, to quote Peter. To quote Peter Berger, we're a nation of Indians. ruled by Swedes, where all these religious people having to countow to the cultural elites who are dramatically secular and secular is a nice way of putting it. It's becoming increasingly clear that

it's atheistic nihilism, not just kind of benign secularism, but they always immediately raise the specter of theocracy when you begin saying that we need to bring God back in. So one of the sections that I have in the book is I show that liberty of conscience and religious liberty and freedom of speech are all Christian inventions. Don't tell me that we Christians are going to take away freedom. We're the ones who invented civic liberties. We're the ones who bequeath these civic liberties to you all. So liberty of conscience was something that grew out of the Reformation. religious liberty was something that grew out of a Christian consensus and worldview.

And so I have several chapters in this book where I say, look, we're not a threat to your liberties. The thing that's a threat to our liberties is what's going on now. People are being shut down now for what they think. People are being fired and canceled and fined for what they say now. If a CEO of a Fortune 500 company was secretly recorded telling a friend that he thought, but the boys and girls and they should grow up and get married to each other, he would be out of a job. There would be a hue and a cry.

He'd be chased down the street and they'd pelt him with rocks. So tell me, I would say to the progressive, tell me about this vaunted commitment to freedom of speech that you have. You don't have any commitment to freedom at all. We do. And we have a track record that proves it. So if you're the ones squandering our freedoms, we're the ones who built up the moral capital of our freedoms that they are throwing away.

Well, and they have to go back centuries, you know, to accuse us of things because just as you said, and I mean, and I've learned a lot of this recently in writing my book on Martin Luther, in writing my book, If You Can Keep It, about American Liberty. you realize that there is no way around it. Our liberties are a result of Christian faith. Think of the irony that we're being told the opposite every day and that our liberties, our concept of liberty, these things arise out of the Christian faith.

And of course, in centuries past, there are many Christians who didn't get this and were guilty of the opposite of it. But in centuries recent, it's just the opposite. It is Christians who've been at the forefront of liberty, the concept of liberty. You could say the same thing about racism. Where did we ever get the idea that that was wrong?

Oh, yeah, Christians came up with that idea, and it's the secularists who pretend that they invented it, but they have no basis on which even to make the case. So we're living in crazy times, as we keep saying, and we have to clarify these things, and I imagine that's a large part of what you do in the book, mere Christendom. Yeah.

So if you take one of the worst things that, the first Christendom ever did, which would be the Spanish Inquisition. Over the course of the entire Spanish Inquisition, over the course of many years, about 2,000 people were killed. 2,000 people, without justifying it at all, that was awful and horrific. It was bad. But that's Stalin on a slow afternoon. Right?

So when you look at the body count of communism, Mount Zitong and Pol Pot and Stalin, and it runs up to 100 million people. Somehow, secularism is never charged with the crimes of secularism. And in order to accuse Christians of the crimes of Christendom, the crimes of the Christian faith, they have to go back to the sack of Constantinople. And that was a bad deal. That was not a good thing.

Yeah, Christian sin and Christian societies. sin. But I'll put up to the track record of secularism any day. Yeah. Well, it's becoming clear and clearer. And that's kind of the beauty of the moment. We're seeing the fruits of of secularism. We are, it's taken some time, but it's becoming clear and clearer and clear to just about everyone, which gives me hope. I believe it's God's mercy, allowing some of these wicked things to be made plain. We'll be right back talking to Douglas Wilson in hour two. Hey folks, we are talking both hours today to Douglas Wilson. He is like a universe unto himself. And it's kind of weird that we haven't had on the program long before now because I've known

of him and his books. And so he's a big deal. So we're going to be talking to him plenty more in hour two. I just, there's certain people I want to introduce my audience to because they are valuable resources. And Douglas Wilson is at the top of the list. Okay. Yeah. After this segment, we're going to do our weekly Ask Metaxus. Ask Metaxus.

That is coming up right after this. And then plenty more with Douglas Wilson. Just so you know. Also got to mention tonight, Socrates in the city, folks, I'm telling you, you can live stream it. You have to go to Socratesin the city. dot com, click on the Yonemi Park event, and you can see where you can live stream it. I want to encourage anyone who can possibly do this. This is instructive for anybody that you can, I don't know if you have the kind of a TV where you can do this and invite friends over it. This is going

to be a big deal, I'm telling you. She is, her books have just totally, totally blown my mind. I really, there's nothing I can compare. Her story is just, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's an absolutely unique story. And tonight Socrates in the city, it starts 645 sharp, 645 sharp. You probably have to register an hour before that or something like that. So 645 sharp and it goes for about an hour and 10 minutes or something like that. So, I, so that's Socrates in the city. dot com.

And I already mentioned that in a few minutes. We've got Ask Metaxus and we're coming up with plenty more with Douglas Wilson. I should mention our sponsor, holyland.israel. Dot travel. Yes. Many people tell me that they've read my book as atheism dead and that they love the stories, the archaeological stories in there. And so I've said that we're going to be making a story.

streaming TV series based on the book. And I cannot wait to get to Israel and actually visit some of the sites that I write about. That was my favorite part of your book, by the way. The sites in Israel and Jerusalem and Hesakaya's Tunnel. Oh my goodness. I don't think I have the guts. If you've read the part of the book, I don't think I have the guts to go to walk through Hesokai's Tunnel because it's just too much. But Hesakia's Tunnel. Anyway, you can actually go to all these places. You can go to the childhood home of Jesus, not making that one up. If you've read, is atheism dead, you can get the details. And that almost nobody knows about this. Yeah, fascinating. You can go to holyland. Thatisrael.org. I just love it that Israel Ministry of Tourism is one of the sponsors

of this show. I'm really, really happy about that. Well, I know. And I can't, I just can't wait to go back. I don't know when I'm going back. Don't email us because we don't have the details yet. But So holyland.israel.travel will wet your appetite for that. And I will, we'll figure it out. I also should mention actually before we close, nutrometics.com this month only. So like today, what is today the last day or tomorrow? Tomorrow's last day, 25% off if you use the code. Eric, 25% off.

They give half of their profits to third world missions. These are, this is an amazing group, Nutrametics. It's N-U-T-R-A, and, excuse me. M-E-D-I-X. M-E-D-I-X.com, N-E-D-I-X.com. Nutrametics.com. But it's this month only 25% off if you use the code, Eric. I take vitamin C, vitamin D and K, I take zinc, I take magnesium, I take melatonin, and other things, all for your immune system.

You should be doing this. You will get sick, dramatic. less. That's at least what I believe and what I've experienced. And we'll be right back with AskMataxis and Doug Wilson.