The Eric Metaxas Show - General Keith Kellogg

Episode Date: October 30, 2021

General Keith Kellogg, who served in the Trump White House, has a few things to say about the Afghanistan withdrawal disaster and national security, sharing ideas from "War by Other Means."

to the Eric Mettaxas show with your host, Eric Mettaxas. Hey there, folks. I'm still trapped on the left coast of the American continent. I can see the Pacific Ocean. And Chris Heim's, my co-host today, Chris, Pacific Ocean has grown on me. Yeah, it's nice out there. It's really beautiful.

And I got to tell you, I can see a container ship, not a joke. Yeah. Not a joke. I can see containerships stuck out there. when we flew here, when Suzanne and I, when the plane was landing in San Diego, I looked down and I saw, we saw dozens and dozens of the container ships

trapped that they can't get their goods into the United States. And I said, you know how Trump used to have all those boat parades? Yeah, yeah, yeah. This is Biden's boat parade. Yes, yeah. Absolutely unbelievable. Yeah, super depressing. It's mind bending to see the containerships.

Each one contains like the stuff that you could put in three small sits and they're all out there trapped. And I just want to say if you didn't, if you didn't vote for Trump in the last election, I want to say thank you for destroying America. Thank you. Hey, we've got some great news. I'm appearing at the comedy club and at Juckles down the street. No, actually, it's not true. I'm appearing in Thousand Oaks at Rob McCoy's church. It's, let's see, tomorrow night I'm speaking there.

And Sunday, I'm doing three services on Sunday. It's like vaudeville. Who does three services? Like, I'm ready to sleep just thinking about how much energy. But the Lord will meet me. And I'm looking forward to it. It's Rob McCoy's church. I always forget the name of his church.

He's got a really catchy name. It's like, God, watch. What is it? I can't remember anymore. It's terrible. It's called. Don't tell me now. Don't tell me exactly.

I can't think of it. But anyway, it's Thousand Oaks, Rob McCoy's Church, and everything is on social media. And this is simply an opportunity for me to say, ladies and gentlemen, please go to my website, ericmetaxis.com. I say this all the time. There is so much information that we're able to share with you there that we can't share on this program. fun stuff, pictures, videos. Ericmataxis.com.

It's free. There's no advertisement. Ericmataxis.com. And you'll get all the stuff. I'm speaking all over the country. Okay. Today, in hour two today, I'm talking to the author of a book

called Capote's Women. If you're interested in Truman Capote and the social milieu of Manhattan in the 60s, and I know there's got to be dozens of you out there in the world who care about this the way I do. This is the show for you.

That is in hour two. In hour one, we're talking to General Kellogg who invented Frosted Flakes, and he's a, no, it's a different Kellogg. Chris, it's a different Kellogg. Oh, I thought it was Tony the Tiger Kellogg. No, no. This guy is a general.

He was a general. pro-Trump general amazing story. Wait until you hear this, folks. I shouldn't even joke about this stuff. God speak Calvary, by the way, is Rob McCoy's church. What is it? God speak Calvary. That's it.

God speak Calvary. Tomorrow night, that's Saturday night, and three services Sunday morning, okay? This is like the old vaudeville circuit, all right? We've got Fannie Bryce. We've got a dog act. we've got singing pigeons. It's all there.

And then I appear. So we'd love you to be a part of that. I'm going to do some of my acrobatic stuff that you haven't seen. So that's going to be Godspeak, Thousand Oaks, California, or it's next to Thousand Oaks. But then I'm going to be in Atlanta. I'm going to be in Dallas. I'm going to be everywhere around the country. So you have to go to our website, Ericmataxis.com.

All right. I got to tell you what happened. last night. And then I got to tell you what happened 20 minutes ago. Last night I was in Valley Center, California. Okay. Yesterday we went to In-N-Out Burger twice for lunch and for dinner. For lunch and then for dinner.

Oh my gosh. My new best friend, Greg Denham, who has a church in San Marcos called Rise Church. I spoke there, I guess on Tuesday. he's like he's serving as like a tutor to me and to Suzanne on what burgers to order, what to think about when you're ordering. He's very, very thoughtful about this, really too thoughtful, way too thoughtful. And so we got the burger with the peppers. That took it to the next level.

Both of us wept. Okay. So while it was the Valley Center yesterday, a woman, the woman who arranged my invitation to come there and to speak, to be interviewed by their pastor last night, opens up a box and it's a Bonhofer poster. It's one of the posters you can get from my store.com. And I want to tell you, folks, it is so beautiful. She opened it up and she asked me to sign it. And it really is so beautiful and so inspiring because the quote is there, silence in the face of evil. This is what I talk about wherever I go. Silence in the face of evil

is itself evil. If you just sit this one out, you say, I don't want to get involved in this. Folks, God wants us to get involved for this nation, for freedom, for religious liberty, for the gospel. And so when she pulled out this poster, she asked me to sign it, I looked at it, I said, Suzanne hadn't seen it. I said, look at this. People need to go to my store.com. You got to use the code Eric. Otherwise, they will price gouge you. But it is so beautiful. All of my my books are available at my store.com with the code Eric. The new book is atheism dead. I'm traveling and speaking about that wherever I go. I'm doing all these interviews. There's been some shipping problems because so many people ordered it. And then it turns out that some of the

gigantic, I don't know, Amazon Barnes & Noble, they ordered like a million copies. And then the small stores didn't get it. So there's been some issues. I don't know. But if you subscribe to my newsletter, Eric Mataxis.com, we will, explain to you all of that. We've already explained it, but we'll keep putting that out in case you didn't know. Well, okay, so last night, another guy came up to me in line while I'm signing books, and he was dressed as me. And this was an adult man, probably 10 years older than I am, investment banker. He was wearing a double-breasted blue blazer. He had, I won't go into it, but it was so funny, and he was so funny.

It was so wonderful to meet him. Then another guy came up to me, a Greek guy, that Suzanne and I met at a ramen shop. We got some noodles, and this guy waved over to me. A Greek guy goes to a Greek church here. He's been following my stuff. His name is Sotidis. And he came last night to hear me because we bumped into each other in the ramen shop. So he came, he drove to Valley Center.

So we just had an amazing time last night. But one thing that happened to me 20 minutes ago, I have to share this. Jim Baker, we know that he was the PTL empire that fell, he went to prison. It's a heartbreaking story, but a beautiful story. And he has a number of shows in the new PTL network. and I'm going to be on the Jim Baker show,

but I'm also, this morning I was on the Mondo show. And Mondo, he was a former, you know, East L.A. gangbanger, became Christian. He told me something I've never heard before, and I got tears in my eyes. I'm still slightly choked up over this, and I'm not joking. He said that Jim Baker, when he was in prison, that my Bonhofer book got him through it. and I've never heard that for and all I could tell you it says

if I wrote my book for one person for one reason, the idea that this sweet man got through that difficult time I'm going to be on his show and I'm going to have him on my show to talk about it on this show but when I heard the story

I cannot tell you, I'm not giving you the details but I just thought you talk about being humbled wow Anyway, okay, so folks, we need you. Today's the last day for ADF, Alliance Defending Freedom. If you care about religious liberty in America, we need you, please, to go to our website, metaxis talk.com. Chris, we're going to talk again at the end of this hour, correct?

Yes. After General Kellogg, we're going to have on Captain Crunch. And we'll be, so we'll be right back with General Kellogg. I wouldn't let my dear savior in. Hey, folks, I've got to tell you a secret about relief factor that the father, son, owners Pete and Seth Talbot, have never made a big deal about, but I think it is a big deal. I really do. They sell the three-week quick start pack for just 1995 to anyone struggling from pain like neck,

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He was former national security advisor to President Trump. We know that, well, the book purports to reveal the politics at play within our highest ranking military leadership and how caving to the leftist agenda and cultural pressure by those in the top ranks of America's military has left America more vulnerable to national security threats than ever. Unfortunately, I don't need any convincing on that score, but it is a real pleasure to have General Keith Kellogg on the program to talk about his new book, War by Other Means. General, welcome to this program. Thanks, Eric. Thanks for having me today. Well, let's jump right into it.

What you say, unfortunately, is something that seems to be pretty clear to those who are paying attention to what's going on. How is it possible that this could happen? You always think that there are firewalls put up by the founders in the Constitution so that this kind of thing cannot happen. I mean, the military is supposed to be the military. They're not supposed to be about transgender. policies or about white nationalist threats. What in the world enabled this kind of thing to happen? Because when I think of a general, whether it's General Mattis or Millie, it's hard for

me to process that they have, you know, to cut to the chase, gone over to the dark side, that something has happened in their careers or at some point to allow them to be used by the, I will call it, the anti-American left. At least that's how I see it. What do you suppose has happened that this was made possible? Yeah, thanks, Eric. I think it's a great question. I think that the military, the senior levels, has become really politicized. And I think part of that, very honestly, was it because of 20 years of war in Afghanistan. And that's one of the reason And by the way, I wanted to get out of Afghanistan with the president as well, because the military became too politically aligned going forward. And they saw where the money was coming from and the philosophies they had behind it.

And they had reached a point with Mark Milley, where you see him today. And, you know, very candidly, Mark and I have known each other for over 25 years. But he has put himself in a position in the way he's talking right now that you never saw General Meyer, former chairman, General Meyer, Pete Pace, Hugh Shelton, Colin Powell, Joe Dunford. None of them spoke the way he speaks now. And he's become very, very politicized on his approach to the military. And I think it's a huge mistake, and I think it's a mistake for the military. And I've reminded a lot of people, people forgot what Article 2, Section 2 of the Constitution talks about.

And there's one unitary commander-in-chev and a civilian-elected commander-in-chief. So I just think it's been over time. It's become that way, and it's unfortunate. And I think 20 years of war has allowed that to happen. When you say 20 years of war have allowed that to happen, tell us more about that. In other words, why are things so different under, you know, I mean, the war in Afghanistan, it's not quite World War II. It's not quite Vietnam. I mean, why would what's been going on there have allowed this to happen?

Just explain that for those of us who are less familiar with the situation. I think what's happened is it's influence. And what I mean by influence, its ability to operate at senior levels. It used to be where the senior general officers were always in the background. You never heard them. You saw them, but you never heard them out front. But through 20 years of war, the generals came more and more to the forefront.

And you saw them in a much more political environment. They were much more visible out there. You know, you have to kind of go back in time. And the time that you, for example, you only saw General Colin Powell when he was chairman, was during the first war in the Gulf when he was stood next side by side with SACDF Cheney and talked about it. But they become front and center in the Washington Post or the New York Times or decision-making. And my point with civilian or control of the military is the military leadership should be behind the scenes. They should never be out front.

In over 20 years of war, a constant war that's being fought. even though it wasn't a big war, they seemed to have had an undue influence on it. And my preferences, they go back to sitting, you know, behind the desk and give their advice in private. And I don't think that's happened at all. And I saw it firsthand in four years in the White House and saw how they became very not only politically attuned, but also working with the press. The press is always able to reach out to him. Was President Trump aware of this, let's call it a threat? Was he aware of this?

Yeah, he was. And I used to tell him about it. Here's one thing with Donald Trump. Donald Trump is a, you know, it's a great American and really believed in the military. And I used to tell him, you know, once in a while you have to kind of trust your instincts and that, you know, not all everybody is with you on this. And the story I told them was try to get him in Tulane on this. I said, you know, in World War II, you had George C. Marshall and all of the senior military chiefs. He was telling FDR not to invade North Africa because Franklin Roosevelt wanted to invade North

Africa as a prelude to what was going to eventually happen in Normandy, the Normandy invasion. And they kept saying, no, no, you don't want to do it. It was the only order that FDR signed in World War II that said Roosevelt commander chief. It's sort of like I'm the guy in charge by the Constitution. This is the way it's going to be. And I think the president Trump, it took him a while to realize that sometimes he just had to put his foot down. he was the commander chief going forward. But when you have all of your generals aligned, when I said aligned against you,

all kind of pushing something and nobody really saying the opposite. You almost see it's like it's group thing with them. And he finally said to me with Afghanistan, why are they all saying it? And I said, it's happened. There's just so used to saying it, one after the other, keep going forward. And sometimes you have to sit back and realize, hey, this isn't the way it's supposed to be. You know, every single commander in Afghanistan, four-star commander, I think there was 12 of them.

Every one of them that said during their time in Afghanistan, they were making progress, making progress, making progress. They weren't making progress. They were losing ground. So I think my take with the president with him is he had to make sure they understood who the commander-in-chief was. And sometimes after 20 years of war, they kind of said, well, we have more influence than you do. And it wasn't true. Well, I mean, it's a funny thing because if you've got somebody like a Patton or MacArthur,

and they have strong opinions. Sometimes their opinions went against the commander-in-chief to some extent. But today, if we heard them, we'd say, well, I agree with the general, not with the commander-in-chief. So that at least you felt that those disagreements were honest and that they were trying to help the country. What I have seen more recently with Mattis, with Millie, with others, they seem to have an animus. against Donald Trump. They seem to be working with the deep state. To my mind, that makes them the enemies of America. They are no longer who we thought they were. I mean, a number of them signed that ridiculous thing calling the Hunter Biden laptop. That was Russian disinformation.

I mean, it just strikes me that many of them, as I put it earlier, have effectively gone over to the dark side. So this is not a patent or a Macron. Arthur, these are our men who really just seem to hate Trump and the make America great again agenda who seemed to be suspicious in the way that General Millie was about supporters of Trump, worried about white nationalism and white supremacy. I mean, you just think, who are these people? These are not the generals that we've had in our past. Yeah, you know, here's where I think a lot of people have a, I think, a wrong view of Donald J. Trump.

You know, I originally was thinking about writing the book and titling it behind closed doors. Donald Trump is a true patriot. I mean, he really believes in America. He believes in America first. And what's good for America will be, once our, you know, we're set well here in the United States, then we're good externally as well with all of our allies going forward. He's a big believer in the American ideal in going forward. And I saw that with him. And I saw when he was in private. We'd sit down and just talk about America and the way it was when I was with him on the 2015-2016 campaign. I saw that with him in the way he was.

And he's just a, he's a uniquely an American individual and what he wants for America. And I think when he came into Washington, D.C., I think he'd been into Washington, D.C., a total of 17 times. He never spent his night in his entire life here until he became president. Remember, he was a guy who wasn't even student body president. First time he became president of anything was when he's president of the United States. And I think a lot of people that are in the Washington environment resented it or feared that because we had somebody who was a true outsider, a true populist who would come in. And I think people were, so because of that, people were time taking pot shots at him.

I mean, not supporting what he wanted to do. And when I say he's uniquely American, you know, he just wanted to do what was right for America. You know, let me see you a quick story. Actually, we're going to go to a break. Forgive me. When we come back, I want to hear this story. Folks, we're talking to General Keith Kellogg, the book, brand new book, War by Other Means. This is the Eric Mattaxas show.

Hey, folks, Eric Mattaxas here. Joe Biden and the Democrats have laid out the most socialist agenda our country has ever seen. Instead of following President Trump's blueprint, had the economy booming. The Dems are going to raise taxes, increase regulations, and skyrocket and already outrageous national debt. If your retirement is in traditional investments, it is in jeopardy. Americans should be diversifying their investments with gold and precious metals. Gold gives you control over your wealth and protects you from market volatility, inflation, and a weakening dollar. When investing in gold, I turn to legacy precious metals. Legacy precious

Metals has over 40 years of experience in helping Americans protect their finances, and this team is prepared to patiently consider your own personal financial needs. If you're looking to invest in gold, call the good folks at Legacy Precious Metals today at 866 473-6204 or visit them online at Legacy p.m. Investments.com. Don't leave your retirement to chance friends. Contact Legacy precious metals today. That's 866473-6204. Hey there, folks. I am talking to General Keith Kellogg, former National Security Advisor to President Trump. The new book is War by other means, a general in the Trump White House. General, you were just about to share a story with us. Please go ahead. Yeah, when I was talking about President Trump being uniquely American and now, and he really loved America. I remember during the, during the middle of the COVID crisis, we were sitting in the Oval Office and he was just talking about it. And he made a comment to me, and it was just a low-key comment. He said, you know, I just want Americans to get better. And I said, why don't you go out and tell the American people that? Just exactly the way

you said it to me, just go out there and say that to the people in the press. He said, no, because that can show weakness. And they said, weakness. He said, yeah, because you need a prime executive of the President of the United States to be very, very strong going forward. And I said, yeah, I see where you're coming from. But he really believed in the American, the American way of life and the American people out there. And they really cared more about the people in Washington, Kansas than he did about the people in Washington, D.C., because he thought this was kind of a closed house here in D.C., and he's probably right.

And so one of the reasons, Eric, I wanted to write the book is I wanted to make sure people said, look, you need to see what this guy was like when the doors were shut and when you sit down, just sat and talked, and how decisive he was as a president. And he made some really hard decisions. You know, everything from killing Soleimani to going after Baghdadi to the defeat of the caliphate, the ISIS caliphate, how he worked with the Chinese. The fact is how he worked hard on the NATO alliance. And there was a lot of people who said, well, he was anti-NATO. No, he wasn't.

I said, look, everybody knew what Article 5 was, an attack on one was an attack on all in NATO. But everybody forgot what Article 3 said. Everybody said, what do you mean Article 3? Article 3 is the funding article. And that's as you fund your own defense and the defense of the alliance as well. And there was an agreement and the Wales agreement, the Wales Declaration, that every country in NATO would have 2% of GDP towards defense, of which 20% was modernization. So why is the United States spending 3% and only 6 NATO allies are spending 2%?

So he would push people on that. He'd say, no, they kind of use the bully pulpit of the presidency to get on the Native alliance and people said he was anti-NATO. No, he just wanted to pay a fair and equitable share of what they all agreed to. And he did that with other nations as well. He was always defending America. It was a very transactional approach to the world. That is, if it's good for America, it'll be good for you. And frankly, if it's good for America, it will be good for the world. Let's stop kidding ourselves. When we say America first, that doesn't mean we believe in a zero-sum game. And we believe that the stronger America is, the stronger America is, the more freedom there will be around the world, the more opportunity for freedom there will be around the world.

We've always been that kind of a country. And I think the left really has a socialist, communist, communist, zero-sum game approach to power, to the economy. It's fundamentally wrong. And that's one of the reasons they couldn't understand Trump. But let me just ask you, it seems to me that, uh, We have a new elite ruling class in D.C. and in places like Hollywood and New York who have genuine contempt for the American people and for the hero of those American people, namely Donald Trump. Their contempt for the American people has been on full view since Biden was installed as president. that contempt it strikes me is it's particularly ugly when you see it when it's hidden

it's just something you can pretend doesn't exist but what I have seen with folks like Millie and even with Mattis it's quite striking they seem to almost feel that the American people are stepping on their toes as though they're the ones in power and that if we dare to try to exert our influence by electing a vulgarian like Trump or by voting for somebody who has our economy at the forefront of his agenda, they really, they were never quite as open about their contempt for, you know, the unwashed middle and working classes. And that is a new thing because I think many of us think of the military, I know that. you know, most of the folks in the military are not that way. But I guess this ties into what you're saying about this, this kind of ruling class of,

a new kind of ruling class in the military. That's at least how I read it. Yeah. You know, Eric, you're right on this one. Somebody said to me, well, what would you, if you had a chance, what would you do when it came to the defense establishment? I said, I'd probably do the same thing that George C. Marshall did in 1940. when he looked at the United States military, especially the Army, and said, you know, he questioned, were they ready for the next war?

And what he did is he virtually eliminated all the senior officers. In fact, that's why Dwight D. Eisenhower was jumped, jumped 350 people because he eliminated the more senior leadership. And I think maybe that's what, and I know it sounds like it's an extreme position. And it probably is, but maybe you ought to start by calling out the herd and just say, we need to get rid of a lot of the senior officers that are out. there and start all over again and realize this is what they need to be doing and their and their primary job and they didn't need to be reminded of it. Their job is to deter threats on the United States and if deterrence fails, fight and win our nation's wars instead of just kind of moving along and getting involved in a very very political environment.

And I think that just needs to be said really hard. I'm a firm believer in civilian control of the military. But once that starts to break down, then you're asking for major problems I think in the nation going forward. You're starting to see that with a lot of authoritarianism that's even coming out of it. Look, I just saw, I think, something today where they're talking about the Justice Department trying to crack down on school board meetings and parents. We're going to go to a break. When we come back, I want to talk to you about that. I want to talk to you about January 6th. We'll be right back, folks. He went down, but for my surprise, come up with a knife and cut off a piece of my ear. Hey folks, you've all helped build My Pillo into the amazing company it is today. Mike Lundell has an amazing offer for my listeners on his standard My Pillows.

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Use promo code Eric to take advantage of Mike's special offer on his standard MyPillow. That's MyPillow.com promo code Eric or 1-800-9778-3057 MyPillow.com promo code Eric. We used to laugh, we used to cry, used to bow or it's there. Hey there, folks. We're talking to General Keith Kellogg, brand new book, War by other means, a general in the Trump White House, behind the scenes look at the Trump White House. And you were just about to talk, General Kellogg, about the politicization of a lot of these government agencies,

branches that they're meant to work for the people. Horrifyingly, as though we're no longer a free country, they seem to be working against the people, the idea that parents shouldn't be protesting at school boards. I can't think of anything more offensive and anti-American than even that sentiment. I'm shocked as an American that anyone could think that they could even suggest something so wicked. And yet here we are. Yeah, when I started seeing that, that's a crackdown.

It's almost like it's becoming very authoritarian. And when you look at trying to crack down on parents being concerned about what's being taught in their schools, you know, as a grandparent, you know, I kind of watch. what's happening with my four grandchildren. I get worried about it. And I just think it's wrong. You know, it's, I think, I'm glad that the parents are really speaking up out there. It's something that I see with this administration they kind of accept out there. And it's sort of saw that, you know, actually the way 6th January was treated, then the Black Lives Matters riots that happened the summer before that. There's all the difference that people were treated in that regard. You know, we talked a bit a second ago about the 6th January, you know, riots that were out there. Look, I was at the 6th January rally. I'd remind everybody in the entire time we had had rallies with the Trump administration. And before that, when it was on the campaign, we never had a single incident of violence in any single rally we had in over five years. And what happened is it looks like some people got out of control. It was not an insurrection. I think that's foolish.

for people to say that. I mean, if it was an insurrection, who was killed? I mean, let's be honest. If you or I said, hey, we want to kill some people, we're going into the Capitol, some people would have died. Nobody died. There was no intention for an insurrection. We also don't know, I have to be honest, who was involved in this?

In other words, it strikes me that there were people on the inside, the very same FBI that got involved in trying to, you know, create a sting operation to kidnap Governor Whitmer. These are political actors. We don't know what happened, but the media has participated and the left, the Democrats, have participated in trying to create a narrative about this that anybody paying the slightest attention knows is preposterous. You were there.

So tell us, what did you see? Well, let me back up just for a minute. You know, there was somebody killed. It was Ashley Babbitt. She was a protester who got inside the building. She was an unarmed female shot by a Capitol Hill policeman out there. Nobody's ever talked about Ashley Babbitt and her being killed. It's amazing because normally if somebody had been killed like that,

it would have been all over the front pages, but nobody talked about her. And again, she was totally unarmed and shot to death. I was there on the 6th. I was in the Oval Office on the 6th of January. And I went out to the ellipse and also during the rally that was there. And we didn't, when we went out to the ellipse and the president spoke, there was no indication of violence or concern. When I drove into the White House that day, the Secret Service was not uparmed. They weren't in body armor.

They called the inaugural fence. That's something that's 20 foot high. Normally put about the White House on inauguration, that wasn't up. It was just another day at the office. And then we went out to the rally, had a rally out there. people marched down to Capitol Hill and frankly some of them got out of control and my experience in riot control

was once a riot or a mob gets out of control you got a major problem with it they didn't have the security forces they probably should have had either the Capitol Police or Marshals or anybody else and we didn't realize what was actually happening inside the White House until about 1 o'clock in the afternoon

and we saw what was going on but for anybody to say that was insurrection or driven by the president's absolutely foolish they weren't there they didn't understand it They didn't see it. And I was somebody who watched it to go down the whole day. But it seems that even Vice President Pence and others kind of played into this narrative that the president was somehow guilty. Yeah, I think it's in a way the vice president has been cast that light by the media out there.

And I was in constant contact with the vice president because I was worried about his security because I was also his national security advisor as well. And I was talking to the chief of staff. to him, Mark Short. We were on constant contact. And the president asked about him. I mean, a lot of people said, well, the president wasn't concerned about Mike Pence being down there. The president looked at me on several occasions. And I never called Vice President Pence Mike.

The president did. He said, you know, how's Mike? He said, sir, he's okay. The Secret Service has him. They've got him in the basement. He has his team around him. They've got the hard cars there. He's not in under danger out there.

They're all okay. So we would always ask what Mike was doing, how Mike was, you know, Mike Pence was doing during the entire process. And then Mike was trying, Vice President Pence was doing what he believed to be, what he believed was his constitutional duty and to sit up, sit there and get the votes counted. What I wish he would have done very honestly, Eric, is turn to the parliamentarian and ask the parliamentarian what the rule was. Because the real key in there, when you've got any issues in the Senate chamber, the real

person that anybody should ask is you always have to. the Senate parliamentarian, what is the issue of the day and do I have an authority to do something? And that's one of the things I wish he had done that day and he didn't do it. Because I think that would have diffused a lot. But, you know, he and the president have been talking. They've talked several times since January 20th. They had a great relationship for four years, an exceptionally loyal vice president with the president out there. And I think a lot of it is the mainstream media wants to create this schism.

and they're pushing this schism because it helps their cause. And I think it's a fracture that really isn't there between two people who worked very closely for years. I mean, listen, I always loved the vice president and knew him, but I do think that he made a fatal error when he didn't send things back to the states on that day. I think that that's what he was able to do. And by not doing that, he brought about a lot of the difficulties we have in the country. this time with regard to wondering whether this was a legitimate election. So I'm deeply sorry that he didn't do what I thought he might have done on that day.

Nonetheless, it's so wonderful that you've written this book, folks. It's called War by Other Means, a general in the Trump White House. General Kellogg, God bless you, and thanks for your service. Hey there, folks. I hope you, I can't speak English too good. Good. I hope you enjoyed my conversation with General Kellogg from Battle Creek, Michigan. The idea that he invented breakfast cereal is just one of those things. It's very hard to imagine that before General Kellogg. He had some help. He had some help. Three diminutive helpers who go by the street name Snap, Crackle, and Pop. Those are their streets. Nobody knows their real names because they're on the down low. You know what I'm saying? They got to keep out of trouble.

But there's so much going on. Hey, here's one thing we can mention, Chris. If you go to SalemNewsnetwork.com, is that it? What is it? Yep, Salem News Channel. Salem News Channel.com. Is that it? Folks, the fact that we don't know what this is tells you how busy we are.

I mean, that's how new it is. Salem Newsnetcom. So if you go to Salem News.com, you'll... SalemNews.com. Oh, geez. We still don't know. We still don't know.

SalemNews.com. Hold on. Yeah, you find that while I'll just talk. No, but okay, here's the bottom line. Something has been happening behind the scenes. No joke. Salem Media, which is, you know, it does this program. It does Dennis Prager.

It does Sebastian Gorka. It does basically all of these radio programs. is creating a TV network. And you can go there now as of what today. You know, not like in two days or something like that. But it is Salem. What is it? Salem, we still don't know.

This is pathetic. Unpathetic. It's pathetic. It's Pacific Ocean to be inspired. It's Salem News Channel. It's Salem News Channel. That's what I said the first time. Salem News Channel.com.

That's it. folks, this is a big deal. This show is going to be on there. Actually, this show is sort of already on there, but check out Salem News Channel. And we are going to- So the deal is you can get an app. You can watch it on Roku, Apple or Android device. But what is the website?

It's SalemNewschannel.com. Okay. Folks, check it out. We've done a very poor job of describing it. but you go to Salem Newschannel.com and you're going to see that this is a very big deal. There's no way I can really explain it because what they've done behind the scenes, they really haven't even told us until like yesterday. It's huge.

It's a big deal. You're going to be able to watch this program. Very, very exciting. So we want you to go there. And I want to say really that those of you who pre-ordered my book is atheism dead. those of you who've ordered it. You made it possible for this book to appear on the publisher's weekly bestseller list. That's the industry, folks.

Number 11 on the publisher's weekly bestseller list. It is also on the USA Today bestseller list this week. That is huge. And it is because of you that the ideas in this book will reach people that never would be reached. There are many people out there. They're hungry for truth. They don't know whether it's possible to believe in science and in God. Well, they're going to find out because of you, because you have helped push this book out there.

We need to keep doing that. I'm appearing all over the country. I'm going to be on the Ruben Report. As soon as this shows over, I'm going to the Rubin Report. I'm going to be on there with Sean Spicer and Rip Taylor. and we're going to dance together and just like dancing with the stars in that orange.

No, what was it, the green costume? Actually, no, Ruth Taylor passed away. So it's just going to be me and Sean Spicer. But I want to tell you, the Rubin Report, I'm doing all kinds of TV. I've been on Newsmax a lot. I have a piece at foxnews.com about atheism. A lot of good things happening.

But the main thing is I want to thank you, folks. Don't forget to sign up for our newsletter. Go to Eric Mattie. access.com. Please go to ericmetaxis.com. Chris, my friend, thank you for being my co-host. You got it. Anytime.