The Eric Metaxas Show - Howard Blum

Episode Date: June 9, 2020

Historian Howard Blum takes us inside the Nazi plot to execute three of the most powerful and well-guarded leaders of the world with stories found in his new book, "Night of the Assassins."

Welcome to the Eric Mattaxas show. Beech the show about everything. And we do mean everything. Yes, even that. Yep. And that too. Oh, you bet. Definitely that.

Now, here's everything you want to know, host, Eric Mattaxas. Hey, folks, welcome to the Eric Mattaxas show. Oh, my goodness. Oh, my goodness. What a show we have today. In hour one, if you miss it, folks, stop everything. Rewind. Victor Davis Hansen from his boyhood home.

amidst the almond orchards of rural California, there are very few people who have the wisdom of Victor Davis-Hanson. Chris Heimes, Albin, myself, and Victor. That's really about it, the four of us. So Victor Davis-Hanson was my guest for the first hour today. And in all seriousness, what he has to say, it's more than worth hearing and watching.

We'll put the video up today. I hope on our YouTube channel, Eric Metaxus show. But it's worth sharing. We've been doing a number of really spectacular interviews lately, not because of me, but because of my guests who talk when I don't talk, when I give them a chance. And I've got to tell you, Victor Davis Hanson and Bob Woodson and a few others. We've got more coming up this week.

But hour one today was Victor Davis Hansen. Coming up in this hour, we're going to take a break from the current events. and have a conversation about something. It's not as though it is unrelated to current events, but it has to do with the Nazis' plot to murder Stalin, FDR, and Churchill when they were all together in Tehran. It's kind of an amazing story. It is an amazing story.

And we're speaking to the author, Howard Blum, in a couple of seconds. But before we go to that, he's written a fascinating book called Night of the Assassins. But before we go to that, we want to remind us, mind you again, in our one today, we had Victor Davis Hansen. We're going to be talking to Pat Boone. We've got some surprises there. I don't want to blow those surprises, but let me just say that I found something out about him this morning that I never heard before, and I think it's very significant, and I want to talk to him about that. Tomorrow, we're going to be airing a conversation I had with two gentlemen, one black, one white, who experienced what can only

be described in my estimation as a profound series of miracles that has to do with God's hand in wanting to bring reconciliation to the races in America. Now, when I say miracle, I think, you know, I wrote a book on Miracles, and I don't use that word lightly. I don't mean it was a blessing or it was interesting or fascinating. I mean genuinely miraculous. When you hear the story, we will air it on this program. But if you want to see the video, you have to wait until next Monday, which is Miracle Monday on this program, or better yet, you can watch it on TBN this weekend.

Find TBN on your dial. Our program is on 6 p.m. Eastern Time. on Friday and 10 p.m. Eastern time on Sunday. Trust me, when I tell you that it was a privilege for me to get to talk to these gentlemen and to hear their story. And when you hear their story, you'll know what I mean. There's simply nothing like it. I've never heard anything like it. It's a miracle of God. If you don't believe in God, I know a lot of people listen to this program say, I'm not sure what I believe. When you hear this story, you'll see what I mean. when I talk about how, that there's no other way to explain what happened.

What happened to them is so profound and so significant to the history of this country and the race relations in this country that it's just extremely moving. So I want to just tell you tomorrow on this program, we're going to air my hour with the two of them and it will be on TBN this weekend if you want to see the video, which of course I recommend. And the next Monday, we will air it on this program. But Friday night, 6 p.m. Eastern Time, you can check it out. And Sunday, 10 p.m. Eastern time. Gentlemen, when I say gentlemen, I use the term loosely because I'm talking to you guys. But I want to make another announcement. People didn't know this, but I have a new Donald the Caveman book coming out.

It's called Donald and the Fake News. I'm pretty sure it's the best of the three. And you can pre-order it, but this is political satire. So people who think, like, I've gone from writing about Bonhoeffer to, like, writing propagandistic children's books, you know, if they want to believe that, of course they can. But it's political satire in the form of a kid's book, right? And, of course, it's innocent and sweet enough that you can give it to kids who will find it funny.

But adults will find it funnier because they will get all the political jokes. and it's loaded with political jokes. There's a sorceress who goes by the name Madam Miss Speaker. She misspeaks, generally speaking. And anyway, but you can go to Donald and the fake news, you can go on Amazon or whatever and get it right now. But it's going to be available, actually available in like a month and a half, I think, or something like that. But I wanted to say that. How much time do we have?

Because I forgot to run my clock. Oh, we got about four minutes left. Okay, well, we've got to share that Mike Lindell makes all of his products here in America. It's one of the reasons we believe in going to Mypillow.com and ordering from there. Listen, we've all got friends, right, who they would be blessed by super high quality sheets. Again, I rave about the mattress top. It's not just about pillows, because some people say, They're like, I don't need a pillow.

I'm one of those people. I don't need a new pillow. I've never had pillow issues, but MyPillow.com doesn't just sell pillows. They sell everything. They sell all kinds of stuff. And it's all made in America by someone who believes in America, Mike Lindell. And it's space age technology, folks.

You'll be hearing about that later this week. We also want to tell you, honorbound coffee.com. Honorbound coffee, they give 20%, I'm sorry, 100% of their profits to military families. If you love great coffee, go to honorbound coffee.com. Use the code, Eric, what can I tell you? Albin, we had a couple of the things we wanted to share before we go to the night of the assassins. Yeah.

Well, we're going to try to get to some letters here, if not probably tomorrow or the next day. and I always want to remind people, and we're going to try to do this as a separate video to check out Charlie Kirk and the last five minutes of that video from last week on YouTube. I mean, he really addresses some things very poignantly.

I mean, like, concisely, so if you ever want to use an argument, because I hate to say we should be arguing with our friends. We should come, let us reason together. We should reason with our friends about some of these things. But we have to be bold. I don't know if you guys caught Tucker Carlson last night, but he spoke words that I have spoken similar words many times in my speaking engagement

that we must speak the truth. Alex And just Solzhenitsyn said, A word of truth outweighs the world. This is the time when we have to speak the truth. For example, we have to say that I know that Black Lives Matter, and I know that the organization and the movement called Black Lives Matter is harming blacks.

And we need to say that. If you actually care about Black Americans, you must speak this truth. you must be willing to say that the movement Black Lives Matter and the organization Black Lives Matter is a Marxist, anarchist, horrible, anti-American organization that is harming American blacks. So we're not going to get behind them. I have a thought of the day based on that, and I'm glad you brought it up. Here's my thought of the day. I wonder when Black Lives Matter will be tearing down the statue of the Reverend Martin Luther King in Washington, D.C., because Reverend King said that character matters.

not the color of someone's skin. Albin, you are so pithy, it kills me. You've summed it up because, first of all, the monument to Dr. King in D.C. is gorgeous. It is so beautiful. And he said 100 things that the BLM movement despises. They hate. So it's only a matter of time.

Same thing with Rosa Parks, Jackie Robinson. I think we're out of time. Is that right? Yeah. All right, folks, stick around. Thanks for tuning in. Hey there, folks. Welcome to the Eric Metaxis show. As you know, I consider myself a history buff. That's right. I consider myself a buff. I don't know what a buff is, but I consider myself one. You know that I've written a number of biographies on historical figures and the one that I keep getting attention for. Wherever I go places, people say, oh, I love your book. And they seem to always mean the Bonhofer biography, which is about World War II and the resistance to Hitler. I am very fascinated with that period, as you probably already know.

My mother grew up in Germany during that period. I dedicate my book to my grandfather. It's something that has shaped my life that period, just because my parents experienced it in Europe. And anytime anybody has information on that period, I get excited. I want to know about the book. And we happen to have, yes, we happen to have an author on the program

twice nominated for the Pulitzer Prize. His name is Howard Bloom. He has a fantastic brand new book titled Night of the Assassins. I can't wait to hear more. Howard Bloom, welcome to the program. Nice to speak with you. Look, it doesn't get too much more fascinating. Give us the one-sentence version so people know what they're missing if they tune out.

This is amazing. The Nazis during World War II launched a secret plot to assassinate FDR, Churchill, and Stalin at the Tehran conference. First of all, it's hard to believe in this day and age that there was a conference in Tehran, how the world has changed, right? But I have to say I'm no fan of Joseph Stalin, how I wish they would have succeeded there. But this is one of those things. My first question, when I hear about something like this, and I know you're a serious historian, this is not some kooky story you made up.

How is it possible, Howard, that most people aren't aware of this? Well, in fact, a great many people are. I begin the book with a sort of prologue, which is a press conference in the Oval Office of the White House where FDR talks to the assembled press and he says, you know, when we were in Tehran, the Germans tried to get us. It would have been, he says, quote, a pretty good hall. Everyone laughs. And then he says, let me tell you about what's happening in China with Shanghai Shek. And they go on from there. And they just left it there.

After the war, there were several books written where they interviewed participants in those events. Then in 2003, the Soviets released a batch of secret documents, previously classified documents, that detail the plot. These documents, as I did my research, coincide with German archives, American archives, and British archives, and I was able to put the whole thing together and tell this story. This plot is also referred to in biographies of many. many of the, or autobiographies and memoirs of many of the participants. For example, Mike Riley, FDR's Secret Service guy, Churchill's Bodyguard, it's all referred to. So it's a plot which isn't well known, but it has been gotten attention.

There are many people who still say it's Stalinist invented history, but the facts are there that can connect all the dots in a very compelling way. And what is particularly interesting today is how close they came to Ashley succeeding. So they had a plot which would take these Nazis that parachuted into Tehran, into the Iranian countryside, and get them through the water tunnels to the British embassy when Churchill was sitting shoulder to shoulder with FDR and Stalin on his 69th birthday. They were singing happy birthday. The cake was right there. There's a picture of that in my book. And these commandos who were trained by Otto Scorsenzi, who's a famous German commando,

we can go into that, were getting very close. And Mike Riley, the head of FDR's Secret Service detail, a 33-year-old former football star on Montana, a man who described himself in a self-effacing way as an Irish cop with more brawn than brains, had to stop them. And fortunately, he succeeded. Well, now that is even more fascinating Had to stop them In other words

We know the plot didn't succeed But you mean that there was actual contact Didn't get away the ending of the book No Listen, don't worry about it Because we know FDR lived At least a little while longer

And we know Churchill lived into the mid-60s And we know Stalin died as well That's the best news But really when people think of plots like this, I mean, in my book on Bonhoeffer, I talk about a number of plots to kill Hitler, and it is always fascinating. The details are fascinating. In other words, you know, if you have three people of that stature together in one place, it's a stunning thing and a stunning risk. I mean, we rarely

have the president of the vice president in the same place during wartime. Why wouldn't the tunnels have been blocked off? Why wouldn't they have taken every precaution? How is it possible that Hitler could have launched something like this and thought that it might work? You're correct. These were the three most closely guarded men in the world. And consider what happened as this first begins. FDR, who is basically, he can't walk, has to travel from Washington, D.C. to Tehran, the other side of the world. He starts off going on the USS Iowa. He's undersea in the Atlantic going to North Africa. A torpedo is launched by a U.S. boat, which is thinking it's doing a practice mission, and it's just citing USS Iowa in its gun sites, except they fire a live torpedo, and it just

misses the ship where FDR and the Joint Chiefs of Staff are traveling. That's like a Jerry Lewis movie. You're not kidding. I'm not kidding. It's well documented. You know, it's events just like this. When they finally do, when they pick a site for the conference, they pick Tehran. At first, they're discussing Alaska, maybe Russia, maybe a ship at sea. Churchill comes up with the idealist, have tents in the desert.

But Stalin wants to go to Tehran. Of all the places in the world to pick, he picks the one city where for the past, Two years, the Nazis have been sending parachute teams into Tehran. They've been sending these teams to sabotage the railway and also to ferment revolution. They have safe houses set up. They know how to conduct aerial and search emissions. They have radio transmitters. And he picks the one city that works perfectly for them.

Then they send in a spy and advancement of the Nazis. and he finds these water tunnels that lead right into the embassy grounds. First, they're sending FDR into a city which is filled with typhus. And like today, it's an invisible enemy. We're putting our leaders in jeopardy. And FDR already has a bad immune system. But when Mike Riley finds out about these water tunnels have been built by the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers

to get fresh mountain water. to the embassies. He says, well, this is great. We'll have some protection. But the Nazis are able to use this because the Americans have left them unguarded. Then the Nazis send in the first team of 38 paratroopers to jump into Tehran to make their way to Tehran.

There is a double agent working for the Russians in the Nazi spy hierarchy. He tells the Russians what they're doing. The Russians realize this is an attack on the big three. So when the 38 paratroopers land, the Russians are waiting for them and they mow them down except for a group of them, which they capture, they interrogate, and then they find out for the first time that six other men have already come in, and there were six paratroopers trained commandos, men who trained for months,

at the special commando school outside Saakenhaus concentration camp that the SS ran, and they are there on the loose while the meeting is taking place. It's not to later on that a woman who's aware of this plot, who's a Nazi asset, not really an agent who's working with the Germans, she has, it seems to be having an affair with an American, An American who she meets, the story is incredible, but it's all there in the documents, who's playing in a band while he says a U.S. Army Sergeant, who's playing in a band where Iranians

are going to, and he's also working for the CIC, the Army Intelligence Corps. He finds out about this, passes it on to the OSS, which tells Mike Riley, and she tells them the details that are able to track down the Nazi asset who have. discovered the water tunnel route, and now we're finally able to guard the water tunnels. At the same time, these six men are still on the loose, and Mike Riley has to go through the four days of the conference, knowing that these men are on the loose,

knowing, as he puts it, that a Nazi commando if he shoots once is not going to miss, and it makes for a real cat-and-mouse game between Mike Riley and these six commandos. I mean, look, let me cut you. Jeff, because we're going to go to a break here, but this is so fascinating. The author is Howard Bloom. The book is Night of the Assassins. This happened, folks. In case you want to know, this actually happened. We're going to be right back with more on the Arkansas show. Hey, folks, President Trump's birthday is coming up June 14th. It comes up every year on June 14th, Flag Day. And there's no better way to express your gratitude for him and the work he's done for our country than by taking a moment to wish him. a happy birthday. All you have to do is text the word cupcakes to 88022 to wish the president

a happy birthday. Again, that's cupcakes to 8802 to wish President Trump a happy birthday to join him in the fight to keep America great for four more years. Hi folks, trying times. Just know they won't last. Trying times can be hard on our digestive track. So why not try life change tea to get the tea.com? Life change tea is an herbal blend of tea that helps the digestive track and the colon cleanse from intruders. For years, people have experienced the benefits from life change tea. And so can you. Log on to get the tea.com. That's get the tea.com. And for those of you that want to go a step further, we have non-GMO organic supplements. If you're listening to Eric, you're informed and educated. So how about free shipping? Just go to the checkout, find the coupon code,

enter Eric, E-R-I-C, hit apply, and receive free shipping. Again, Eric, in the coupon code, hit apply free shipping. These historic times will pass. The yuck in your gut will pass also with getthathe.com. That's getthotty.com. Folks, I'm talking to Howard Bloom, the author of Night of the Assassins, an implausible and yet actual plot that the Nazis launched to kill Stalin, FDR, and Churchill, while the three of them were together in Tehran.

Howard, what was the date of this meeting, the summit of these three leaders? Churchill, FDR, and Stalin arrived there, November 27th, 1943. The talks begin on November 28th, and on November 29th, at Churchill's 69th birthday party, when the three men were sitting shoulder to shoulder

in the British Embassy. that was the evening when the attack was planned. It's interesting when they first arrived there. The world doesn't know that this meeting is taking place. Churchill gets there, he hopes, to sneak into the city. As soon as he arrives into Tehran, there's a ceremony, and he's a bit taken aback. You thought he would sneak into the city.

Then he starts driving away in an open car, and he sees the route is lined by Iranian cavalry and sort of comic opera uniforms. And he later writes, any man who wanted to come after me with a pistol or a gun would have succeeded. And finally, as they get close to the British embassy, there's a traffic jam.

And he's stuck there for about 15 minutes in this open-top car. And he later writes, if anything would have happened to me, the plot could not have been more perfectly planned to put me in the most jeopardy as possible. FDR comes in, And he's able to sneak into the city.

He gets there. But then he goes to the American embassy. And Mike Riley, his bodyguard, the head of the Secret Service detail, discovers the American embassy is four miles outside the city, while the other two embassies are in the heart of the city. So that means that FDR is going to have to travel by motorcade, perhaps once or twice each day through the twisting streets of Tehran. and that gives Mike Riley, as he says, a heart attack.

So eventually, when they find out about this plot, they want to get, they make a plan to get FDR out of the American embassy and have him stay in the Russian embassy. Stalin has invited him. How they're going to get him there? So Mike Riley comes up with a plan. They'll do a motorcade, and a motorcade goes through the city. There are two armed cars in front, two armed cars in back,

the presidential limousine, and it's going through the streets, and people are waving. There's someone sitting in the back waving to the crowds, but it's really just one of the secret servicemen, Bob Holmes. FDR is in a sedan, which is zooming through the city through back speeds, sneaking into the Russian embassy, and he gets there that way. So they were totally unprepared for really what they were walking into. It's comforting to think that the leading. of the world are bumbling. I mean, can you imagine? Anyway, this is another story. I also am fascinated

always by the idea at Yalta and here that we, the United States of America, the beacon of freedom in the world, would have had to make common cause with perhaps the greatest monster in history, of certainly one of the greatest monsters in history, Joseph Stalin. Any thoughts on that? Well, one of the reasons that FDR wanted this conference to take place why he was so adamant about it, why a paralyzed man decides to go across the world to Tehran

is he has his vision of the future. He actually thinks that he can work with Stalin after the war is over. There'll be the four policemen to police the world. But on the day before, for Churchill's birthday party, there's an event at the Russian embassy at dinner. And Stalin

gets up and he gives a toast and he says at the end of the toast, I think when this war is over what will need is will need to kill 50,000 Germans as the German military corps, just execute them as soon as the war is over.

And Churchill is shocked and he says we can't be serious. We can't that. My people, the British people will never allow it. FDR tries to diffuse the situation all throughout this conference. He's trying to diffuse the tension between Churchill and Stalin. And he says jokingly, well, then let's not, let's just kill 49,000 of the Russians rather than 50,000. Of the Nazis rather than 50,000. When Churchill hears this, he walks out of the room.

he goes storming into the next room. It's their lights are off and just sitting there brooding, thinking to himself, what have I gotten into? He feels an arm on his shoulder. He turns around and it's down and he says, I was only joking. FBR, I mean, but Churchill just doesn't believe him. He thinks he was really serious.

Well, it just is extraordinary. You know, we don't have the time to get into it so much. But you wonder sometimes, in fighting Hitler, what price we paid. It's very confusing to me as somebody who, you know, thinks of evil and, you know, as a serious thing. What the Nazis were was evil writ large, but then obviously to have to make common causes,

as I said, with Stalin, it's a curious thing, because when you think of those who suffered in the Gulag under Stalin, it's just a bizarre thing to think that they're celebrating a birthday party and they're sitting there with Joseph Stalin. And even more so, because when the war started, Stalin was Hitler's ally, as we all know. It's inconceivable. But at the same time, one of the reasons the war was won was what the Russians did.

I mean, at Stalingrad, that was a tremendous victory, and they paid for it. I mean, there's no question about that. Forgive me, we're going to go to another break. Folks are going to be right back with Howard Bloom. The book is Night of the Assassins. Don't go away. Hey, folks, welcome back at the Eric Mataxis show. We're talking history.

I have Howard Bloom with us. You may be listening via radio because it's a radio program, but you can also find us on YouTube at the Eric Mataxis show so you can see what we look like, what we're wearing, whether we've shaved, and all that kind of important stuff. Let's get back to the story. The book is Night of the Assassins. Howard, we're just talking about the bizarre idea that you have Stalin, one of the most wicked,

cruelest men in history, who genuinely meant, let's kill 50,000 people. That was for him, as for Hitler, people were not made in the image of God. People were not sacred. The individual was not sacred. So killing was meaningless to them. And it's just fascinating to me that in order to defeat Hitler, we allowed this man to take over half of Europe and to subject its inhabitants and the inhabitants of the former Soviet Union to horrors for decades and decades. It's just something that troubles me and puzzles me.

Well, we were pragmatists. We wanted to win the war and ensure what FDR thought would be a future peace. It's interesting, too, at this point, why did the Nazis launch this plot? Why did they do it? They didn't think they could win the war at this point, but they were concerned about making an endgame strategy that would also be pragmatic. At this point, they realized the war was lost. But then FDR at the Casablanca conference in January of 1943 on the last day, he goes to the world press and he says, we will not yield until we have the unconditional surrender of Germany, Italy, and Japan. Once that was said, the Nazi hierarchy knew there could be no negotiated peace. Previously, they had had a strategy where they thought they might be able to pull a stalemate from the jaws of defeat.

They could maybe make an agreement where they would keep their territories that they had conquered in the east, and Germany would still remain a strong state. Now, however, they knew that like Carthage, Germany would be destroyed and that they themselves would have to go before Allied war crime tribunals and answer for their crimes against humanity. And when they realized this, they had no choice but to try to get Operation Long Jump, as it was called, to target the Nazis. And their big problem when they were trying to figure this out is when is this going to happen? When will it occur? And because of a spy, which is an interesting sideline, they were able to refine this out. When you say Operation Long Jump, that was the plot to kill the three Stalin, Churchill, and FDR, or no?

Yes, that was the code name that was given by Schellenberg, who was head of the SS, Cloak and Dagger Operation Section 6. And he comes up with this idea talking with Canarsis, that we've got to do something to see if we can get rid of this specter of unconditional surrender. But once they're trying to plan this mission, they first don't know where it's going to take place or when. They don't know where the conference is going to be. They don't know how they're going to get past the three most closely guarded men in the world.

And they don't have a plan to execute it if they can even get close to them. And then into their lapsed, several things happen. The first is that a spy tells them where this meeting is taken place. Who is this spy? Well, this spy is a ballot in the British embassy in Ankara, Turkey, man by the name of who goes by the code named Cicero. When he first comes to the Germans and says, I want to sell you top secret documents.

They're very nervous, like all people are. All people in the Espar. What happened to the Cicero? I mean, it seems like the Brits have a very, very bad history with top-level spies. Kim Filby, of course, at the top of the list. But what happened to the Cicero? Do we know? Yes.

He gets, this is interesting, the Germans hire him to give him the secret information. They pay him a million, $200,000. And after the war, he goes to spend it. And it turns out the money the Germans gave him all counterfeit. He then sues the German government after the war to try to collect on his debt. He loses the suit and he goes into poverty and his life is basically ruined. But he provided the information that this conference was taking place. I've just got to ask you.

So what's German for long jump? Is Langshpong or something like that? It's German words are always funny to me. This is Velten Schbromis. I'm not very good on the German. I got a C plus in German. Or Witenschsprung, something like that. Okay.

Well, anyway, let me ask you, when we're talking about something like this, what do you suppose would have happened had the Nazis succeeded? In other words, it's an unthinkable, unprecedented thing in history that three leaders of this stature could be killed. What would have happened in the world if those three leaders had, in fact, killed. Well, now is a very interesting time in our history where we can understand all of us living today how important leaders are to us. We turn to our leaders, our mayors, our Congress people, our president to help us get us through the current crisis we're living through. We look to them to

show us that there's a possibility of a saner world on the other side. And just as we know, the virus will hopefully be eventually defeated. We knew at that point that the Allies were going to win the war. They would win it eventually on the battlefield. But we didn't know what the spirit of the people would be, how it would be dragged on. We didn't know how the peace negotiation were. Maybe we would have allowed Germany to keep a lot of their territories. That's what makes it so interesting.

I mean, we saw Truman's backbone when he dropped the atom bomb. we knew the war would have been concluded, but would the American people have been mobilized, where the British people had been mobilized the way they were under Churchill? That's the real question. And one of the things that you would know this because you don't know my book,

but in my Bonhofer book, part of the problem was Bonhofer was involved in the plot to kill Hitler with the idea that a number of Germans would somehow form a government or something like that, that they would stand against the Nazis, but it was because of Anthony Eden and Churchill that that became a no-go. They basically said, nope, it's too late.

We don't want to do business. We don't care whether you want to kill Hitler. We're done. We want unconditional surrender. So go ahead and kill them, but it's not going to make any difference to us. We have a final segment coming up, folks. My guest is Howard Bloom. The Book is Night of the Assassins.

We'll be right back. Back, I'm talking to Howard Bloom. That's BLU M. The book is Knight of the Assassins. What a story. Howard, it is the quirkiness of history that fascinates me. When you look at it from a distance, it all seems to make some kind of poetic sense. But when you look at it on a granular level, it's horrifying how things might have turned this way or that way and so much hinged on it. The idea of, of, of, of, of, of your book that any of this might have succeeded, is just, it's really hard for us to accept that it might indeed have happened. And the Nazis became so very close to succeeding. They had six assassins on the Rome in Tehran as the conference was taking place.

They were about to make their way to the water tunnels. Ultimately, they're betrayed by a $20,000 reward that one of the Iranians takes to give them away. But we had troops going through the bazaars of Iran, going door to door. We could not find them for the first four days. And the men were hiding out. They still had their weapons.

They had practiced with a certain kind of bomb, which was called a gammon bomb. They had practiced with this in Germany to attack the big three. I'm losing my voice a bit. I have to ask you, This is, it only occurs to me now, because I'm a ding-dong, but when you, when you talk about this, it has to have occurred to you that this would make a great film. And almost a semi-comic film

could be made out of it, because we know how it ends. You're dealing with these three, four major, major figures in history. Has anyone approached you, or I'm hoping someone does approach you? Well, there's some people talking. I, I, I, I, sort of see this as a Day of the Jackal type story where you know the ending, you know in Day of the Jackal that the goal survives, but still there's a great deal of suspense. There's this cat and mouse game between Mike Riley, this college football star from Montana, who at 31 becomes the head of FDR's Secret Service detail. And he suddenly, right after Pearl Harbor, in over his head, because there's never been a war before where the enemy can fly over Washington, D.C. and drop-powered

shootists, when missiles perhaps could be launched on D.C. And also, the man he has to protect can't walk. He is literally a sitting target. And Mike Riley realizes that he has to protect this man, put his body in front of him, and he also keeps on referring to FDR and his memoirs as his boss. He's extremely close to him, and he feels a real personal connection. to him and he wants to dedicate his life to protecting him. And so it's a very moving story that way. I'm always fascinated by what I perceive now as liberal naivetee toward evil. In other words, the idea that FDR thought that he could play patty cake with Stalin

if they'd won together, obviously that didn't happen. It feels the same way that we have dealt with China. over the last 20 or so years, giving them, you know, the ability to trade with us. You know, if we play nice with them, they'll come over to our side. And it never seems to work out that way because you're dealing with people that are playing by different rules. Well, it's interesting, too, for the Tehran conference. Here, the Nazis try to make at first make peace with Tehran.

And that doesn't work. But the Iranians refer to Hitler as Hitler Shah. the Iranians are in the Nazi racial rules are considered an Aryan nation. Iranian, the reason the name changes from Persia to Iran is that Iran means Aryan, and they want to attract Hitler. And this is the place that our leaders decide to have this meeting. Listen, we're out of time. It's been a joy.

Howard Bloom, congratulations on the book. Folks, the book is Night of the Assassins. I think if you're looking for something to read, you might check it out. Thank you, Howard. Thank you. Good to speak with you.