The Eric Metaxas Show - James Kuntsler Slaloms the Gates: Russiagate, Obamagate...
Episode Date: August 4, 2025James Kuntsler slaloms the gates: Russiagate, Obamagate... More at kuntsler.com ...
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It is Wednesday, wow, July 30.
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So today, yesterday we had our friend Roger Stone on the program and Rod Martin.
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hey, can you come on and talk about what you're doing
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For example, today, in hour one, I have Jim Kunstler.
I met Jim Kunstler.
It is hard to believe, but I met him in 1986.
He was then a brilliant writer.
So you can imagine, that's almost 40 years ago now,
which doesn't make any sense.
I was just a kid, but he is a really brilliant writer.
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And I want to embarrass him.
But he's a great writer.
He's a very funny writer, brilliant writer.
But he's been writing about the news of the day lately, which is tremendous.
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And you should follow him online.
He is just one of those.
So he's got a substack, which is worth following.
in hour two, another old friend, Joe Laconte.
Joe, I knew in New York for many, many years.
He was a professor of history at the King's College.
He was my guest at Socrates in the city a number of years ago.
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Joe LaCante, some of you do, of course.
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Thank you.
Folks, welcome back.
I have the joy now of speaking with James Howard Cuncelor or Jim, as he lets me call him.
Jim, your writing is always just tremendously entertaining to read.
And it is even better than that, very important what you're writing about.
Because, you know, I've read your fiction, which is fantastic.
but right now we're talking about stuff about the survival of the Republic.
And so the fact that you're writing about that,
I'm just thrilled that you're using your great talents and mind for the purposes of history.
So forgive me for buttering you up so much,
but I'm just a huge fan of your stuff.
And lately, you know, you bring a level of detail that I think most of us don't have.
So I want to talk to you about the Epstein stuff, the Tulsi Gabbard Revelations, Obama Gates, Russia Gate.
A lot of gates to go through.
It's just like a slalom skier.
There you go.
There you go.
See, that's an example of the cleverness that I'm talking about, folks.
Hey, listen, before we forget, if people want to read your stuff, you're on substack.
But it's just my whole website's on substack.
It's K-U-N-S-T-L-E-R-com.
And it's on substack.
So if you just search for Kinsler.com, it'll come up.
Okay.
All right, look, let's start with the one thing that I almost never talk about, the Epstein stuff.
I mean, it seems to me that, well, it seems comedic to see the left-wing media suddenly
now. I mean, I went the other day after the Tulsi Gabbard revelations like a bomb, and you go to
CNN.com, not a word, and they have this big thing about, ooh, Trump is scared of like the Epstein
stuff or what, this is what it, it seems to me, they're desperately trying to change the subject
because it is unbearable. It is unbearable to them to face the truth. Well, who's for them?
Well, the mainstream media.
Well, okay, them. Yeah, sure. Yeah. They're having a hard time with it. Everybody's having a hard time with it. Everybody from every angle is having a hard time of it. But I get the feeling that there's some interesting game afoot here. You know, this business about Trump coming out, as I wrote my blog today, Trump came out about, you know, a week 10 days ago and said, forget about it. There's nothing to see here.
everybody knew that there was a lot to see there, but we just didn't know how the show was going to be revealed.
But, you know, what's happened since then is pretty interesting.
We know now that Gielane Maxwell was deposed by, and Gielane Maxwell was Epstein's second in command.
She was just deposed in Florida on Friday and Saturday by Trump's DOJ second in command, Todd Blanche.
And by deposed, I mean, questioned under oath for nine hours total.
And believe it or not, she has not been interviewed by any federal or state law enforcement or Department of Justice official in the whole time that this thing has been a scandal.
You know, going back to the 2005-2007 grand jury in Florida.
What does that tell you?
Because I'm not following this closely enough even to understand why would that be?
Why could that be?
Well, one can only surmise that there are a lot of people who don't want to hear from her.
But now I think you have to surmise that Todd Blanche, who was, after all, Mr. Trump's personal attorney in many of the bogus cases.
that were brought against him in 2003 and 24, that Todd Blanche, who is now the Deputy Attorney General,
you know, was basically given permission to go do this thing by Mr. Trump.
So I think there's a game afoot, as I said a few minutes ago, that on the one hand,
and I'll tell you what I think the game is, that you have to segregate so strictly all of the Epstein files that were superintended by,
Merrick Garland and his Department of Justice regime under Joe Biden,
you have to segregate that stuff from any stuff that might develop now.
And a good predicate for reopening the Epstein case is the long deposition of Geelaine-Maxwell,
which means they can start over again to some degree, whatever degree they choose,
and reopen the case, and it will be clean and separate from all the stuff that the DOJ under Merrick Garland might have fiddled with,
because they did have, after all, four years to curate the material.
Well, is that why you think Trump was so upset about that he was saying it's a hoax?
Well, yes, I do think that that's why I think it was obvious that the Democratic,
under Joe Biden had all this time to fiddle with that material.
Now, the fact that nothing defamatory was used in the election campaign of 2024 against
Mr. Trump suggests that there was absolutely nothing there that they could use, because they
had done just about everything else that they could do to defame and convict and shove him
out of the arena and defenestrate him. And, you know, why wouldn't, you know, why wouldn't
they have used that?
Some of the actual maneuvers they made were so ostentatiously and garrishly illegal on their
face.
And, you know, all of the Letitia James business and E. Jean Carroll lawsuit and the
real estate lawsuit and, you know, all of these things were just so bogus and in your face.
If they had something real on them, why wouldn't they have used it?
So they didn't use it.
Well, let me, before you, because this is an important point you're making,
but I cannot help wanting to know your opinion of the E. Jean Carroll stuff,
because I think she's nuts, but the whole thing is unfathomable to me,
that she went forward with this.
What is your-
I actually met her once.
I met her once, something like 40 years ago.
She was a reporter, or she was a reporter, or she was.
was actually trying to write a book about Rolling Stone, the history of Rolling Stone magazine.
And I'd worked there for a couple of years for over 1974, 75 in the 70s. And so she came to
interview me in Saratoga. And, you know, at that point, this was 40 years ago. She was kind of a babe.
You know, you could tell that she was, I don't know, kind of, you know, sexually kind of a provocative
character. She didn't come on to me particularly, or if I did, if she did, I didn't notice it.
But, you know, then she pops up 40 years later with this Trump business. And I would say that she
appears to be significantly crazy and just being, you know, allowing yourself to be used this late in
life to, you know, to make a buck and to get some brownie points from her, you know, her status
group.
So I don't know.
I mean, I think the whole thing was completely bogus, and she was put up to it.
And by the way, the whole legal suit was financed by Reid Hoffman, who was notorious, he's a notorious anti-Trump billionaire from Silicon Valley.
And, you know, it was bogus.
Well, okay, so, but getting back to the thesis, then,
that anything they had on him, they used, and even stuff they didn't have, they made up and used.
So we don't really believe that they have anything on him on the Epstein stuff.
So why do you suppose he did shut it down in the way that he did?
Like I said, I think he shut it down and called it a Democratic hoax because of the probability
that the evidence was fiddled with by Merrick Garland's Department of Justice.
As simple as that.
But then why do you suppose Pambandi would have, I mean...
Because that was the next step. That's why.
Because first you shut down the democratic curation of the files, and then you open up a new offensive on it.
No, no, I'm talking about before.
I mean, months ago, Pambandi comes out and says, we've got this and this and this and this.
I think that was a nervous blunder.
You know, she'd been in office for, I don't know, days, maybe a few couple of weeks or something.
And I think that my own opinion is that that was a nervous blunder.
She misspoke.
She had a certain amount of material on her desk.
She hadn't quite looked at it.
And she said she had it on her desk.
And people interpreted that to mean that, you know,
she had already processed it when, in fact, she hadn't.
Don't you think that she should have at least come out and, I don't know, come clean on that?
I think she did eventually.
She was challenged and she explained it as, you know, she explained it poorly is what she said.
Okay.
Well, I didn't.
I never caught that.
She misspoke.
Okay.
Well, I'm glad that she said.
It was at one of those news conferences that she did jointly with Trump about, you know, she was on the scene.
They were talking about some other stuff.
The whole cabinet was there.
And she was sitting next to him in a cabinet meeting.
and she sort of fessed up and said, I blew that.
Okay, we're going to go to a break.
We'll be right back talking to Jim Cuncelor.
Talking to Jim Cuncelor or James Howard Cuncelor, if you prefer.
Jim, this Tulsi Gabbard stuff, it's really delightful to see somebody with a spine doing what she's been doing in her position.
Where do you think it goes?
I mean, everybody says the same thing that, you know, now it's with the DOJ.
I mean, it would be my guess because of how Trump has spoken that he has told his people, you know, I expect you to do something with this.
There shouldn't be any question that they're going to do something with it.
Look, Pam Bondi, the attorney general, has gotten criminal referrals from the two highest intelligence officers in the U.S. government.
Tulsi Gabbard, the DNI, and John Ratcliffe, the head of the CIA.
John Ratcliffe, by the way, is a former U.S. attorney, a former prosecutor from Texas, where he was in charge in Texas of American security issues for his federal district.
And he knows how to prosecute cases. He understands how cases are made.
And, you know, he made this referral based on his knowledge of how prosecutions are conducted.
And you can be sure that Tulsi Gabbard, who is not a lawyer, certainly did not go forward without a lot of advice from competent constitutional attorneys.
And so I think that's probably the main reason that you shouldn't doubt that this stuff is going forward.
The fact, you know, the outstanding situation right now is that none of it is being discussed in the New York Times.
or CNN or NBC News or ABC or CBS.
And that itself is rather telling, you know,
and what it tells you is that they're scared stiff.
Because I think that, you know,
it is hard to separate out the First Amendment freedom of the press issues
from what they have done.
But at the least, I expect that they will be named
as unindicted co-conspirators.
And by they, I mean the executives
of the news networks and the publishers and top editors of the New York Times and maybe some of
their reporters will be unindicted and the Washington Post will be named as unindicted co-conspirators
at the least.
Okay.
I've heard that term throughout my life, unindicted co-conspirators.
What does that mean if you're not in-dict?
Are you liable on any level?
Well, it means that you have a kind of a liability excuse.
but it makes the point that you were you were included in this cabal,
but you're, you know, for one reason or another,
you're either not prosecutable or the DOJ has chosen not to prosecute you
because of some probable conflict with the Constitution.
Well, I mean, listen, we have...
For example, hold it.
For example, Barack Obama, Barack Obama may be,
be indicted and may not be indicted, but if he's not, I think there's a fairly good chance he will
be an unindicted co-conspirator because the Supreme Court last year issued a ruling that
the president's actions as president under his official duties are exempt from any kind of
prosecution, although his, you know, anything he does off the books or, you know, personally might be,
now you would have to make a distinction between whether this whole Russiagate business,
this plot was, you know, something that he conducted as an official business or not.
It looks pretty official.
And so that's why I would doubt that he is going to be indicted directly.
But I think he would be an unindicted co-conspirators.
Well, that's very unsatisfying, isn't it? I mean, okay.
Not really, not if a whole bunch of other people are indicted. It would be fine with me.
Well, I don't need to see Barack Obama sitting at jail cell, you know, and I would agree.
It would, you know, it would dishonor the office of the presidency per se. I don't think that
that's the, maybe a huge reason not to do it, but it's one reason.
reason. And I think it would be fine if a lot of other people, and by a lot, I mean a lot of other
people whose names have been in the news for the last 10 years. You know, we know these people,
you know, Andrew McCabe, Peter Strach, Loretta Lynch, Lisa Monaco, you know, that whole gang of
people from the DOJ and the FBI and the FBI. And I'd be perfectly satisfied.
if some of them were convicted.
Well, that would be a huge deal.
And I guess you and I are old enough to remember indicted.
I think it was Newsweek, indicted.
And it was, you know, a picture of Chuck Colson,
indicted, picture of Holderman, Ehrlichman,
this has happened in our history for something infinitely smaller
and less significant than what we're talking about today.
So you are saying when that some of these folks will
go to jail?
I think that a case will be made and brought
and that, you know, the grand juries will be convened
and we'll see the process.
And the process this time will be, you know,
a truly fair play legal process,
unlike many of the other things that have been done
to the conservative side and to people on that side
and the lives that have been ruined unnecessarily.
I mean, there are a whole lot of other things that, you know,
that sort of go into this packet.
And, you know, let's consider another thing, which is that there's been a big issue
about the statute of limitations running out on the crimes that were committed in 2017 and
and so forth.
But Mr. Ratcliffe at CIA has made the point that a conspiracy charge or conspiracy to do this
and do that runs as long as the conspiracy.
runs and it's still running. Forgive me. Forgive me for interrupting. Going to a hard break,
be right back to continue this conversation with Jim Cuncelor.
Back talking to Jim, Jim, we're talking about a lot here. You talked about this idea of
there being, I mean, a lot of people have mentioned statutes of limitations, but you say that
if it's seen as a conspiracy, that changes things. Not just seen as a conspiracy, but
charged as a conspiracy.
You know, now conspiracy cases are notoriously difficult to prove because you have to prove a lot
of intent and motive and what's going on in people's minds.
And, you know, we're not mind readers.
But, you know, the conspiracy laws exist.
The statutes exist.
And the nature of that law is that the case is prosecutable.
The clock runs as long as the conspiracy.
continues. And you can argue easily that the conspiracy to overthrow the president is still running.
I mean, we've got Norm Eisen out there running this lawfare operation. Norm Eisen was part previously
of the impeachment number one. He was counseled to the Gerald Nadler impeachment committee in Congress.
And he had a lot to do with engineering that. And it is alleged.
for example, that he engineered a lot of the business between CIA agent Eric Charmella,
who was the Ukraine whistleblower and Colonel Vindman, the National Security Council Cat,
who blew in Charmella, and Michael Atkinson, who was the Inspector General of the Intelligence
community, all of the agencies, who changed the rules for whistleblowers a few weeks before,
this campaign to impeach Trump started. So there's just a huge amount of liability for many people
over many years of an ongoing cabal and a coup. And I think it will be argued as a, you know,
it's a coup. Watergate, for whatever it was, and by the way, a lot of people now consider it to have been an op
to get rid of Richard Nixon unfairly and unjustly.
I don't know.
I first heard that from Roger Stone,
and he, I mean, I have to say that it never occurred to me.
And again, this is part of the horror of waking up to see things that have been there for decades,
but you bought the lie.
And I and most of us bought the lie that, yeah, Watergate was pretty bad.
And then you begin wondering.
There were some peculiar things going on with that,
not the least of which was the fact that Bob Woodward had been a CIA operative
just before he was hired by the Washington Post.
Yeah.
And, you know, that's probably the – and nobody knew that, you know, until, you know,
what, 50 years later?
Nobody knew that.
Doesn't that tell you everything?
That's just amazing.
a lot portrayed.
Yeah.
Well, I was going to say, whatever else, the, you know, the Russia Gate thing is, it was way
worse than Watergate. Watergate was not a coup to, you know, Watergate was not a coup in the
same way that Russia Gate was.
Well, look, first of all, Watergate was back when we lived with the markets of Queenberry
rules and where, you know, the Republicans would go up to the White House and say, Mr. President,
you know, it was a completely different world.
And right now, anyway, we're in a new world.
I want to talk to you about, you know, you talked about unindicted co-conspirators,
the mainstream media.
I mean, because we have a free market, it is my hope that the mainstream media
in doubling down on these lies, in not coming clean now,
as the facts come out, refusing to report on them,
that their market share goes into,
the tank and that people cease to read the New York Times, the Washington Post,
watch CNN, CBS News, and on and on and on. Now I know that there are plenty people that
will always cling to those things that they can't help but somehow think, oh, it's the New York
Times. But what's been happening, it's my hope that this will be, you know, a way for most
Americans to wake up to the fact that they ought not to have been trusting these.
these places. It's already happening with the network news and cable news people, you know, CNN, ABC, NBC.
It hasn't quite really hit. It's happened to the Washington Post pretty badly. They have,
they've lost a lot of readers and they've had to fire a lot of their reporters and employees.
The New York Times, not so much. The New York Times somehow manages to squeak through all this,
but, you know, their reportage becomes more garrishly, more ostentatiously false every day.
And, you know, they're headed for some kind of a reckoning.
For one thing, I really wonder why Dean Beckett, who was then the executive editor of the New York Times,
has not been called into Congress to explain, to do some spleenen.
and I think that it's possible that someone like him will, will be.
But, you know, we'd also, I think, like to hear from some of the executive producers of the news,
the people behind the scenes who watchers and listeners don't see and don't know.
I mean, they know the talking heads, but they don't know the producers who,
and especially the top ones who are behind the scenes.
And I think they need to be dragged into Congress and do,
some splaining.
So you use that term
splaining and of course, you know, you date yourself.
You date yourself. That's what Ricky Ricardo used to say to Lucy.
Right. And you didn't have to watch.
In the 50s, folks, because it was in reruns for like 40 years.
But I guess that's part of my question is whether
most people in America will,
through some of these folks being called in front of Congress and so on and so forth,
move away from these.
I mean, I would just love to see CNN go out of business or see, you know,
somebody by them who actually cares about news.
And I wonder if we're on the verge of that kind of thing.
Well, I think it's already demonstrably happened, you know, in the first place,
Mr. Trump managed to get elected, you know, despite all of the campaigns waged,
against him. The vicious campaigns waged against him in all the years before. So that's one thing.
He did get, he managed to get elected. He's appointed some really, he's made some startling
appointments of very capable people who are now, you know, do on the job unraveling this
hairball. And, you know, that's a disgusting image. We have to go to a break, folks. We'll be right back.
Welcome back talking to James Howard Cuncelor.
Jimmy just gave us the horrifying image of untangling the hairball.
Nobody's ever said that before.
Hair balls, you don't typically think of wanting to untangle the hairball.
So thank you for that image.
Go ahead.
Well, I actually want to get back to what you said a few moments ago about, you know,
normal people waking up to what has actually been done to them under, you know,
under the color of law by their own government.
And let's just remember.
that this is a very slow and painful process for people who have been psychologically invested
in a certain way of thinking to change their minds about stuff. And in fact, I would expect that
a certain proportion of them are never going to change their minds about it. So what you need is,
you know, just enough people to come over the line to form a consensus. I think to a certain extent
that's already happened demonstrably by the sheer election of Mr. Trump.
But, you know, now the consensus, I think, is changing, and we're going to see it displayed in the
2024 elections and in what happens.
And, you know, a lot of it depends on what the venue for any of these cases is going to be.
They've got to find a way to get it out of that.
the D.C. District federal courts because it's notoriously corrupt, horribly corrupt.
So I'm actually optimistic that we're going to see some interesting writing of wrongs.
You've in your writing over the decades, often used the phrase decrepitating Republic.
Are you, so it sounds like you're hopeful that the, that the Republic is in fact
crepitating?
I think we're in a pretty tough situation.
There are a lot of forces and dynamics in play that, you know, may be events beyond the
control of personalities and officers of the law or any of that.
We still have a very serious energy.
problem, which I started writing about in the early 2000s.
Despite all of the pledges to drill baby drill, we still have a peak oil problem.
The shale oil plays of Texas and the Dakotas are probably nearing the end of their useful life.
We can expect a serious decline in American oil production despite the drill baby drill stuff.
that is going to be a huge economic wind, a headwind.
Should I buy a mule?
Should I buy a mule?
That's my question.
Well, you know, I think a lot of this may be beyond Mr. Trump's ability to gin up a second, you know,
a second industrial revolution in America.
we're not going to become the America of 1962 again.
And I really wonder, for example, if the capital for rebuilding our nuclear energy fleet is still possible.
You know, if the capital is going to be there to rebuild those nuclear power stations or build the new ones that we're going to need.
And that's not looking too good.
And, you know, I'd say we have a lot to be concerned about.
Yeah.
Well, there's no doubt about that.
There's no doubt about that.
I just want to encourage my listeners to read your stuff.
Folks, do yourself a favor, I promise you.
Read Jim Cunsellor, James Howard Cunsellor.
You can go to cuncelor.com.
He's on Substack and other great places.
Jim, thank you very much.
Okay, that's every Monday and Friday for my blog.
Yes.
