The Eric Metaxas Show - Jerome Corsi (continued)

Episode Date: August 30, 2022

Jerome Corsi continues his Miracle Monday presentation of fascinating facts about the Shroud of Turin, and shares an interesting story about Dick Cavett and William Peter Blatty's "Exorcist" book.

Folks, welcome to the Eric Metaxus show, sponsored by Legacy Precious Metals. There's never been a better time to invest in precious metals. Visit legacy p.m.investments.com. That's legacy p.m. Investments.com. The Texas show with your host, Eric Mettaxas. Folks, welcome back. This is hour two of the Eric Mataxis show, Miracle Monday, talking to Dr. Jerome Corsi, author of innumerable number one best sellers. as we're today talking about a book called the Shroud Codex,

which in fictional form and the form of a thriller, gives you the story and the information behind this famous, extremely famous object called the Shroud of Turin, which many people believe, and I am one of them, is the actual burial cloth of Jesus. Now, Dr. Corsi, what I find most amazing is, because I kind of get into it in my own book, is atheism dead, how the more we learn from science,

the more it points to the authenticity of the Bible, to the God of Scripture. And it makes me feel like we're living in the end times that God has preserved these things for this skeptical era in which we live so that anyone who is not inclined to believe has more and more and more evidence to deal with. It becomes difficult when you read a book like your book,

The Shroud Codex, or you look into this, you think, at least I know I've got a problem. I cannot dismiss this easily. I thought your book was very powerful on that point, and I really read it and absorbed it and agreeing completely. You know, the big bang, the moment of creation, you know, the moment let there be light, that you point out.

I believe that the Shroud has been, around for all these since Jesus Christ died. I believe it is the original shroud. I believe it's coming out today. I wrote this book 10 years ago and had very difficult time getting anybody to pay any attention to it. And then suddenly now, with you are paying attention to it and some others, but it's as if this is the moment God wants it looked at. It was created for this moment because if the world gets the idea and can look at the evidence, see that we might have an actual photograph of the moment of resurrection, that Jesus Christ lived and the resurrection happened, that's an idea that can change the world. Oh, there's no doubt about it. But I also, I just find it fascinating God's timing and his sense of humor, that he did, he does not, for his mysterious reasons in his sovereignty, he lets us wait till 2020. before he reveals certain things.

And what you have in this book, I mean, toward the end of the book, you get into this idea of, you know, how this image would have been made. Because we said before that a lot of people said, oh, it's medieval forgery. Somebody in the medieval era was trying to create a fake relic, a relic that, you know, they could convince was whatever. So how would they have done that? And you say, well, some genius would have painted it or whatever. Well, we now know there is no paint involved.

None at all. There's no pigment of paint at all. So what do you say, and I know you're writing another book about this, but what do we theorize could have created this magnificent image? Well, there's some actual scientists at CERN, which is one of the major scientific laboratories in Switzerland looking at particle physics, which is a very, you know, part of quantum physics and relativity theory. and they have this couple of scientists there who actually made DVDs and

have argued as I believe that this is a moment of a transcendental moment when the body of Christ crucified dead actually levitated so the shroud which is wrapped around the body wrapped around the head this long piece of cloth

14 feet long wrapped around the head to cover the front of Christ when he was laid in the tomb and when the moment of this image gets placed on the shroud, the body is suspended. Now you can know that because the features of the body show no indentation as if the body were lying on the linen. You're not seeing the evidence of gravity and weight.

Not at all. It's completely weightless. And the flash that created this seared the very top threads of the linen. It does not penetrate deep into the cloth. In fact, when you first see the shroud, you probably won't even see the image. It takes a while before your eyes begin to see the image. And then you're seeing a negative.

You're not seeing, you're like a photographic negative. The dark parts are actually the light. The light parts are actually the dark. And so it is a photographic made by radiation, like a blast of radiation at the instant of the resurrection. The soul comes back into the dead body. And that's preserved on the cloth by searing, the very, very top fibers, just the top fibers.

And there's no paint. There's no indication at all. There's no bleeding of the paint into the cloth. If these top fibers go away, you won't see the image at all. It's literally not in the cloth. It's above the cloth, as it were, embedded in these very top fibers. It doesn't really make sense to me why the body would have momentarily, maybe instantaneously levitated before it kind of blasted into the next dimension.

That I didn't quite follow why that would have been necessary. Well, to me, and as I talked to the scientists and talked about it, as if it was a what they call an event horizon. Okay, so event horizon occurs, for instance, entering a black hole when the light is sucked into the black hole and the physics change. Well, there's a transition instant there. with here in this dimension it's going to be here it's going to transition that transition is a tremendous expenditure of energy which we probably don't even comprehend entirely but it's like it's a you set up for

that moment it transitions and then it's it's suddenly in the other dimension so the body having you know i'm imagining and seeing it in my mind this way that the body levitates it transitions and it's gone because Jesus is now, you know, a transcendental walking around. But we could not talk about something transitioning from one dimension to the other until very recently. Very recently. In other words, it's only now when we're talking about when actual physicists are talking about string theory and various dimensions.

A hundred years ago, no one would have had this conversation. This is at the edge of where relativity theory is. today. I had to do a great deal of reading on relativity theory. I had to talk to scientists about it. I create a fictional character that I can explain some of the science. But the idea that we live in a multidimensional world and the transitions from one dimension to another occur at these event horizons, which are expenditures of tremendous amounts of energy. And the physical substance goes from one dimension to another dimension in which is no longer the same and won't return. So a body risen, as the Bible again describes Christ as risen, appearing transcendent,

really not a physical, but yet physical enough where the apostles could put their hands in the wounds and see that it was Jesus, but Jesus would appear and not appear, be there, be gone. Well, that's the event horizon. That's the moment where the body suspended, the flashed, and the body was gone. The shroud then would collapse, which again corresponds with the women coming in the morning and finding the shroud lying there in the body gone.

Body was gone. That's what I describe in the book. Now, we also have to talk about, if this really was the burial shroud of Jesus, how would it have been preserved for 20 centuries? It only follows logically, and I talk about this a little bit of my book, is atheism dead, that if you were there when any of this stuff happened,

you were all over it. I mean, if that's the house where Jesus grew up in Nazareth, you're not going to be like, where was it again? You know where it was. It's a sacred place. If you could find a piece of the cross, if you could find if this burial cloth existed, someone, I don't know who, whether Mary or Joseph of Arimathea,

or we don't know who, but clearly they would have seen it as sacred, they would have wanted to preserve it. But where does it go from there? How does it get not destroyed? There's a lot of the history about this where it shows up in various places. It shows up with the Knights Templar, shows up in the first century. And again, I discussed it in the book, but there are, in this period after Christ died, when the apostles are beginning to bring the word of Christ more to the world, there's tremendous disbelief. And anything like this would be precious and have to be preserved and almost secreted.

We're going to go to a break. We'll be right back talking to Dr. Jerome Corsey, the shroud codex is the book. In case you haven't been paying attention, the Biden administration has caused a financial crisis, and they have no clue how to fix it. Oil prices have skyrocketed. And when oil prices go up, the cost of transportation. transportation and shipping spikes, leading the prices of goods to rise. And when we're already seeing record inflation, that's the last thing we need.

Our economy is in trouble, and you need to take steps to protect yourself. If all your money is tied up in stocks, bonds, and traditional markets, you are vulnerable. Gold is one of the best ways to protect your retirement. No matter what happens, you own your gold. It is real. It is physical. It's always been valuable since the dawn of time. Legacy precious metals is the company I trust. for investing in gold. They can help you roll your retirement account into a gold-backed IRA

where you still own the physical gold. They can also ship gold and precious metal safely and securely to your house. Call Legacy at 866-528-1903 or visit them online at legacy pminvestments.com. Tell me, Eric, why is Relief Factor so successful at lowering or eliminating pain? I'm often asked that question. The owners of Relief Factor tell me they believe our bodies were designed to heal. That's right designed to heal, and I agree with them. So the doctors who formulated relief factor for them selected the four best ingredients, yes, 100% drug-free ingredients, each helps your body deal with inflammation. Each of the four ingredients deals with inflammation from a different metabolic pathway. And that right there, approaching from four different angles, may be why so many people

find such wonderful relief. So if you've got back pain, shoulder, neck, hip, knee, or foot pain from exercise or just getting older, you should order the three-week quick start discount, to only 1995 to see if it will work for you. It works for me. It has for about 70% of the half a million people who've tried it and have ordered more. Go to relieffactor.com or call 800 for relief to find out about this offer. Feel the difference. Ladies and a gentler people, this is the Eric Metaxis show.

I'm talking to Dr. Jerome Corsey about his book, The Shroud Codex, and about the concept of this thing called the Shroud of Turin, which today is in Turin. Italy. But so how does it get from Jerusalem in the early first century to Turin? What is the path ostensibly that it took? There's a path where it was kept by kings or different people prominence and secreted away. So it wouldn't be found and destroyed and displayed in various ways. So the Knights Templar had a display of it. Now who are these fabled infamous night? Knights Templar that the Catholics are always talking about. They're a group that were involved in going in the Crusades, the very strange, mystical kind of group. But they had a history with the

shroud. They were looking for relics and were finding relics. Now, I've also been in Israel more times than I can tell you. I've been going to Israel. I've done a lot of work on Iran. I've consulted with the government. I've been in Israel many, many times. And I've always gone through in Jerusalem, the stations of the cross, I've gone to the Church of the Sepulchre, everything related to Jesus in Israel. I've tried to go see in my own eyes. Now, not all of it has the same ring to it, the same feel to it. I don't have the same response or the same ability to track historically, for instance, the Church of the Sepulchre, which I think is yet questionable. I don't believe these things automatically.

So, you know, but... I think the stations at the cross are all wrong. Well, I do too. I mean, again, most of this is wrong in terms of the real historical what happened. You know, there's not even certainty where Galgitha was, where it happened. Right. But what I can tell you is that the distinction between all these relics, and I quite frankly don't put a lot of credence in relics. You know, they were...

Well, most of them have to be baloney just because of the sheer number of them. during the Middle Ages and sold, but the shroud is unique in that as I studied it, it had too much authenticity to it. The crucified man was just too identical, not only the biblical description in the, you know, the Gospels, but identical to the way the Romans really crucified someone, anatomically correct, even though we know this cloth dates at least from the 1300s. No, it's all astonishing. There's so much that's astonishing about it that we can't get into all of it here.

What about the idea of the coins that would have been placed on his eyes? Is that something that you think is correct? Most likely, yes. I mean, I met with the scientist in Rome who did the study and found the photographs and was able to, you know, burial practice of putting coins on the eyes. and these coins of Roman coins of the first century, or Jewish coins from the first century, but their first century coins.

So that would be authentic. Again, to me, the most important thing is the physical wounds, which are clearly the features that are there. And even as to how the knees are bent and for the foot to have been nailed together, the bending of the knee is precisely correct, the twisting of the body, all the anatomical features. Well, now, of course, the knees, by the time Jesus was laid on the slab there, the knees would not have been bent. And you can see rigor mortis in this figure. You can see the rigor mortis.

And that's been also analyzed by the doctors. You can actually see. So, I mean, 1,200s, how are they going to know how precisely rigor mortis works, how precisely a body still? difference. I mean, the wound in the side, the way the wound is through both feet, the wounds in the hands, the fact that the thumb, you were mentioning that nerve, this is an extremely specific detail, a strange forensic detail that no one would know. It's just too bizarre. There was no crucifixions in the 13th century. And the same with the feet. I mean, the feet again had to be, the nails had to be placed through a specific point in the feet for the, there's lots of little bones in your wrist and in your feet. If you don't drive the nail through those bones, it won't hold the weight of a man on the cross.

These nails have to hold the weight. And the Romans wanted somebody to die quickly. They didn't have any little seat to sit on. You had to, most people crucified, nailed, died of asphyxiation because they had to push themselves up to breathe, and then they get laid down as they exhaled. I mean, it was excruciating just to breathe. And the weight had to be, the body nailed had to support that weight and that transition of weight for breathing to occur.

Tell us about the cedarium, if that's how it's pronounced. Well, cedarium is a little seated, which you'll see, you know, many of the, and by the way, the pictorial in the paintings done back into the 12-13-100s. Right. You know, I've seen those in Florence. I've studied those. those are really not at all like the shroud looks. The shroud, those are imaginations, like you would imagine the crucifixion.

But the shroud is how you would really crucify so much. Let me ask you also about when we talk about the cloth, that it was, you write in the book, and I've read about this other place, is that it would have been folded and displayed so that you just saw the face, not the 14 feet of this negative double image of the front and back, but it would have been folded in such a way that only the image of the face would have been visible, and that that was ostensibly displayed at certain times through the centuries to promote faith in the faithful. And also, they would perhaps different times, very rare, but they would, as if Christ were arisen, and they would unfold it and levitate the whole cloth so you could see it all extended. Now, who they, who?

Well, this would have to go back and really find the specifics in the book, but, I mean, those who held the shroud, say it out 1,000 AD, you know, there's a shame. So it would have been Constantinople? Constantinople, probably, Constantinople probably. And again, some of these details I'd have to add the book in front of me to be precisely correct because the book is very detailed on these points. but there have been exhibitions of a cloth that go very deep back into the literature going back to the first century.

Now, then the issue is, is this the cloth they're talking about? You know, for instance, in the Bible, there's, you know, Veronica who has an image of Christ. Well, Veronica means true image. It's in Latin the icon. And by the way, Veronica is not mentioned in the Bible. No, it's not. This is legend. Catholic lore.

Yeah. Well, that Catholic lore is part of the creation. to explain this cloth being there. Veronica does not appear in the Gospels, but it's part of the lore, which again indicates that there was an awareness going very, very back early into Christianity that somehow or other,

they existed an image of the crucifixion, and that it was round, and it was made during that day. You know, that today I'm saying that now the scientific evidence, including, you know, credible physicists having studied the shroud, and it's coming up with explanations that validated having been the burial cloth of Christ

and explaining how that could occur in physics terms. These are the kinds of things that so deeply impressed me. In addition to the fact that I sat there and studied it. I remember the first time I sat there for about three hours, and as you watch it and study the details, more and more details become clear to you of the body and the wounds. And it's, you begin to, this figure has an ability, to come alive.

They've now done holographic images of it. It's also a hologram. Now, that is another thing. I forgot about that. You read about this in the book. Somehow, there's three dimensions in the image. Many, many, many, many centuries before anybody knew what a hologram was.

Evidently, this shroud has elements that are holographic. Holographic. Now, what does that mean? I don't get that. Okay. Holograph is very interesting. image because each piece of the image contains all the image. It fits together. Each piece has the information of the whole. Kind of like our DNA, ourselves. Every cell has everything about my whole body.

It's a very mystical principle. I'm not even sure that this is entirely understand it. But the point is if the image is holographic, the data is encoded such that the two-dimension will display as three-dimension. If the image is not holographic, two-dimension will not display as three-dimension. In other words, there's certain transformations you can put it through and see only certain images which are holographic and how they're constructed will appear three-dimensional later on. When did they discover this aspect of it? Because this was new to me when I read your book.

Very, very recently. I mean, this has been within the last probably 20 or 30 years that this has been really discovered. And it was done by one of the physicists who was working on, John Jackson, began, he had a little computer, and he decided he'd make an image of this child, and he ran it through the computer, and it came out three-dimensional. He said, how do that happen? And that's when he began to say, wait a minute, there's something about this image I didn't know. And John Jackson's in Colorado, he is one of the scientists, one of the most prominent scientists,

who was in the 1978 shroud of Turin group that studied scientifically the shroud, and I've communicated with them, I've talked with them. Is there a website? Most of the people I've talked to, most of these people who've done the science audit, But they're still living. I've talked to. Well, when we come back, we're going to find out more. The book, The Thriller, the fictional thriller, is called The Shroud Codex by Jerome Corsey.

Look at my life. I'm a lot like you were. Oh, man, look at my life. My Pillow is having their biggest sheet sale of the year. You've all helped build my pillow into the amazing company it is today. Now, Mike Lindell, inventor and CEO wants to give back exclusively to his listeners, the per kale bed sheet set is available in a variety of colors and sizes, and they're all on sale. For example, the queen's size, regularly priced at 89.998 is now only 39.98 without a listener

promo code Eric. Order now because when they're gone, they're gone. The per kale sheets are breathable. They've got a cool crisp feel. They come with a 10-year warranty and a 60-day money-back guarantee. Don't miss out on this incredible offer. There's a limited supply. So be sure to order now. Call 1,800-978-3057. 1-800-9-78-3057. Use the promo code Eric or just go to Mypillow.com.

Mypillow.com. Click on the radio listener square. Use the promo code Eric. The offer will not last very long because these percal sheets are known to sell very quickly. Order now with promo code Eric at Mypillow.com. That's Mypillow.com. Promocode Eric. Folks, welcome back talking to Dr. Jerome.

Jerome Corsi, C-O-R-S-I, about his book, The Shroud Codex. Now, you're talking about this group in Colorado that has really studied the Shroud. He wouldn't expect that to be in Colorado. But is there a website? I mean, if people want to see some of the best images that we're talking about, where can they go? Yes, again, I don't, offhand, I don't remember the precise website, but there is a Shroud official shroud site, Barry Schwartz, who is. was the photographer on the probably, very, very interesting guy.

I've got to know him, a fascinating guy. Jewish did not believe in the shroud. Was the photographer for the original Stroud group that was allowed to study the shroud by the Vatican in 1978, I believe. And he is remarkable on his ability to deal with the photographs. He's created a website, which is shroud.com or something of that nature. I'll be putting it back on my website very soon now, which is Dr. Jeromecorsi.com. Again, I wrote this book 10 years ago, and it was hard to get anybody to pay attention to it.

Now, the book came to me all at once. Like, you know, I had the whole idea of writing this book, and it was complete, like you dreamt the book, and I couldn't get it out of my head until I started writing it. Then also, starting in the beginning of this year, it started coming on me again. I started thinking about the shroud. Simon Schuster originally published the book in 2010, and I researched it, and I decided I'd ask them, they gave me the rights to the book back.

Now, that's remarkable to me. I would say, you know, what interest was there in this book? They said, well, what are you going to do with the book? I said, well, I don't really know, but since it's really kind of out of print and you don't have more copies in even the warehouse, why don't you give me the rights back? And they just did.

Now, that was remarkable to me. and so now I'm going to read a second one of these books, and I have it full in my mind as well this time. And when you say a book, you mean another fiction book, or is this a non-fiction book? I'm going to make a second book in the Dr. Castle series. Dr. Castle is going to get presented with another series of supernatural events that he's being asked by the Vatican and the Archdiocese in New York to investigate.

And he's looking at all of these as skeptical. and through, I could see three books right off, now in my mind. By the end of the third, Dr. Castle will begin questioning whether or not his atheism is well-founded. It's not going to be easy because he's a brilliant psychiatrist, and he has psychological explanations for why all these things might be manifesting in the priest, modern-day priest who is exhibiting the ruins of the shroud. Right. It's so funny, though, because as I was reading your book, The Shroud Codex,

I just thought to myself how really gullible strict scientific materialists can be. In other words, no matter what they see, they have some cavalier explanation, like, well, that's the subconscious doing that. And you want to say, what do you mean that's the subcontinent? Like, you don't even know what you mean. You're throwing words out because you have no actual explanation, and you give the subconscious the power. to do these bizarre things. Well, in biblical terms, I would see that is, you know, the Satan's mission is to lie and to give you a doubt.

So that can't be this. It's got to be this. There's always an alternative explanation that atheists can have. But the problem is when I said, okay, I'm going to take the objection, the atheistic objection seriously. And when I investigated it, it didn't have merit. The believer that this was the real image of Christ ended up having better scientific validation to it by far than the idea that this was a constructed

image, which is, the more you look at it, the sillier it looks. But that's what when you say by far, that's the point. It's not like, well, I'm going to go with this. It's overwhelming. It's ridiculous. And I kind of make the same point in my book as atheism dead. It's like, look, you don't have to believe what I believe. But when you look at the facts, it's ridiculous. It's absolutely ridiculous. The idea, that life emerged from non-life through random natural processes. It's the dumbest thing anyone has ever believed. It's ridiculous.

At least be honest about it. Well, and you said something earlier, and I truly resonate with it, and that is that somehow or other it's in God's purpose that this be done now. I write this book, that it be sitting there for 10 years, and suddenly today it has a power behind it, a motion behind it. of a compelling nature to it that I could not get communicated when I wrote it. But it's, you know, it was written so that God could use it today. I have that feeling.

And the others, I think I'm going to write are extensions of what I'm here to communicate. Well, I do think that I'm fascinated with the way information travels or doesn't travel. You know, you think, why is it that only now do we know this or this or this or this? or why is something hidden forever? And then suddenly, whoop, finally we discover it. And it's been there all along, but hiding. And there's a mystery there, but there's also God's sovereignty. Because it is, it's just funny to me that the more we know about science,

the more we're able to make sense of these kinds of things. When you talk about this moment of transition from one form of matter to another or from one dimension to another. A hundred years ago, people would have said, well, I don't even know what you're talking about. Now we can talk about it as scientists. 50 years ago, people wouldn't have known. The idea of these transitions between one dimension and another,

this is relatively new in relativity theory. These are relatively new concepts. We didn't have a good idea what black holes were, how they worked. You know, I mean, this is really recent. Actually, that's right. Black holes is like, that's a brand new thing. That's in my lifetime. In the 70s, suddenly everybody's talking about black holes. And before that, okay, we're going to go to a final break and come back. Final segment with Dr. Jerome Corsey. The book is the shroud codex. Welcome back, folks. Final segment talking to Dr. Jerome Corsey. The book is the shroud codex. And we just, Albin just told us that the website is, in fact, shroud.com. What could be simpler? dot com. And it's very short to maintain sure.

Okay. And it is at least fascinating. Even if you don't believe it, or you have questions, it is at least tremendously fascinating. What have we not touched on? What do we know now that's brand new,

that if you were to write a nonfiction book about this kind of thing? I would really think it would be the relativity aspects of the image. That we are now, beginning to contemplate that some images we have can only be explained in terms of relativity theory, which have to do with multiple dimensions, transitions of dimension, how energy works. But do we have any, what else do we have in the world that is anything like that?

I don't, I've never seen anything like this in my life, and I don't know of anything like it. I mean, at CERN, when they are doing things with subatomic particles, do they get certain kinds of images? They do, but the images are not images that could be publicly it won't mean it won't mean anything

to delay person to see these images. Images of subatomic particles or even the imaging of them, the attempt to represent what they are are not the way it really looks.

We don't have an ability to image it. But the shroud images, what I think is one of the moments the most significant in history

of a transition which is the resurrection of Jesus Christ. Now, of course, even the Catholic Church will not take this position because the church does not want, and I discuss this in the book, doesn't want to bet, you know, the authenticity of Jesus Christ, even in my faith, is not dependent on any relic. It's my own conviction of Jesus Christ, in my own life, which is independent of any image. And so I was even resistant to saying this could be the image of Jesus Christ. What was compelling was the more you study, and the book unfolds this, the more you look at the details of how the shroud is

constructed, what we know about the history of it, what has been recorded, and scientific investigations have been done. The 78 team spent an enormous amount of time. They had about 30 scientists. They published enormous papers on it. I've read them. I've studied them. There are shroud journals and shroud groups that I've read the papers and I've studied the science and the science is what's so convincing that this image it was impossible to have been created even the 13th hundreds now I read a book recently by an Italian genius who talks about these eucharistic miracles and I want to see if I can get him on this program but he says that everywhere they look the blood of Jesus, if somebody says this is the blood of Jesus, it always is A-B-negative, which is the rare

blood types. Have they ever done? Yes, they've been done. They've done blood types. And again, some of these details I'd have to go look at to make sure I was, you know, my memory is, I could see the page in which it's written, but I'd have to go look at it. It is, the blood has been typed. It is a very rare blood type. And I think it probably is A-B-negative. Well, according to the person who wrote this book on Eucharistic, Miracle, It's always A-B-negative, which alone is fascinating and weird. I don't even base my conclusions on the shroud based on any other events or any other reasoning. I mean, even in the book I show the evidence that Padre Pio has been questioned.

And people object to that because they say, you know, they believe in, well, I'm going, I did a hard-nosed assessment of what fakes were, how religious, how religious, how religious, were created, how they were faked, how people faked, you know, supernatural events. And this Dr. Cassow, I created as a fictional character, is created to be quite brilliant and quite able to really get into these details. And present the entire psychological argument that this is essentially a schizophrenic kind of episode. Yeah. That this is really not anything like the priest is experiencing, but it's imagined in his mind and in the manifesting. itself physically. And so again, you know, the analysis of this is to me that there is no other explanation that I can come up with to how this image was created. And it's authenticity to the

details of the Bible. Even the crown of thorns. Again, the crown of thorns represented in art is this, you know, the crown of thorns was a cap and it pressed upon the entire skull. And you can see the entire skull marks. And you can see where it was beaten in the art. to the head. So the nature of how the kronal thorns was placed on the head and the torment in terms of individual acts of beating upon it are visible in the image of the shroud. It's really too gruesome to bear and it's painful just to think about it. One of the things that I find interesting is that there are a lot of things that you can argue about. Catholics love to argue about is Medjugoria a real thing or Fatima or all these arguments. But this is something

that really defies serious skepticism. The more you look into it, the more you have to think that this could not be made up. Somebody could say, I think Padre Pio was a hoax. Maybe that person has an argument. This doesn't seem to have anything like that. Yeah, and that's where I draw the line of, you know, I want to present the skeptical. evidence. I've studied many of these miracles and many, you know, actually as soon as I saw the shroud, I started making

more and more of a study of these. And many of them, I believe, are frauds. vast majority of them, I believe, are frauds. There's only a few that defy explanation. They have to really defy explanation. The shroud does. It's at the top of the list. There's no, every way you look at it,

to imagine them some artist created this in 1300s. As genius as Leonardo da Vinci was, his paintings don't hold a candle to the image of the shroud. The Vindis' Shroud is more anatomically correct than we do today. Well, and again, the fact that there are two images. There's this one photographic negative image created in the moment ostensibly of resurrection, and then there's the other image created two days before when they lay the corpse on it and the blood pools here and here and here. Who would think that up, the bruises on the body can be seen. The way to carrying the cross. I mean, there are so many physical details embedded in this figure that are clear and documented.

We're out of time. Forgive me. Folks, you can check out shroud.com. The book is the Shroud Codex. My guest has been Jerome Corsi. Dr. Corsi, thank you so much. Folks, I thought the interview was over, but Dr. Corsi has one final thing he wants to share regarding William Peter Bladdy, the man who wrote the novel The Exorcist. What about that? Well, he contacted me a few years ago. We've been reading my books on politics. And he sent me an email. I said, is this the same guy who wrote The Exorcist? He said, the very one. We started having dinner in Washington together. I said to him, how did you ever get The Exorcist to be so well? known. He said, well, it's a pretty remarkable story. He said, when the book came out, The Exorcist, I couldn't get anybody to pay attention to it. And it was going nowhere. And then I was being interviewed one day by Dick Cabot on the Dick Cabot show. And Dick Cabot said, our guests today have canceled. So he had the entire hour with Dick Cabot. He said, that was miraculous. He said,

that one hour, the book immediately skyrocketed. He said, I think that was divine interoperative. This He says, divine intervention. And that stuck with me. In fact, he was telling me that because I already had in my mind to write the shroud codex. And I thought that was, I said, you know, would that happen? And then I published the shroud codex, 10 years nothing happens. You pick up on it. And suddenly, you understand it.

It's the right moment. Eric, I'm going to write three of these books. I'm going to dedicate the second one to you. I can't bear that, but do as you must. I find the strangest part to me is that, of course, I'm friends with Dick Cavett. I revere him profoundly, and I'm now watching him every night on the Decades Network. I don't know if you get that wherever you are, folks, but there's never anything good to watch on TV. I go to the Decades Network 9 p.m. in New York, Dick Cavett is on.

But it's an astonishing thing how well his interviews hold up. But I have never heard that William Peter Blattie was on the Cabbage show. He told me this story. He didn't tell me the first dinner. I had to, I finally pride it out of them. He said, no, you've got to tell me how it happened. But, but wait, what people don't know, I want to be clear, William Peter Blattie wrote The Exorcist, the book.

It was only years after that, what's his name, Friedkin, decides to make a film. Most people know the film. I do not recommend the film because it is so horrific. It is so demonic and real. I don't, unless you're an atheist. If you're an atheist, go see the film. But if you're any person of faith, I would avoid it for a number of reasons. But what an amazing...

It was being completely ignored when it came out as a novel. He couldn't get any traction on it. There's one interview because the guests canceled. And DeKalb said, you're my only guest for the hour. We're going to have to do the entire hour. He said that one hour he got to explain the book and immediately captivated people's minds. And so, again, and I asked how William, Peter, Blady, he understood that as a more. moment of God. He understood that as an intervention to get the book paid attention to.

And it was, he wrote several books. That was the most significant of the books he wrote. And I got to know him quite well until he passed away. And they got to be quite a good friend. Unbelievable. Well, I'm glad that you were able to tell that. Before we go, folks, let me remind you, we desperately need you, if you haven't yet, to give to food for the poor. You can go to MetaxusTalk.com and click on the banner, or you can just dial 844-863-hope. We really do need your help. Please go and dial 844-863 hope. Give whatever you can. We're grateful to you. Hungry people will be fed because of your generosity. 844-863 hope. The website is metaxisotalkysot.com. And finally, let me say to you that if you're not yet signed up for our newsletter, go to my website,

Eric Mataxis.com. Sign up for the newsletter. We want to send you this interview and all kinds of other stuff. Since we've been canceled in many ways, that's the best way for us to do it. Go to ericmataxis.com. And we will send you the video of this interview, which is even better, I think, than the audio, because the video tends to have pictures. Dr. Jerome Corsi, thank you. My great pleasure. Thank you.