The Eric Metaxas Show - Jochen "Jack" Wurfl (Continued)

Episode Date: February 2, 2024

Holocaust Survivor Jack Wurfl | My Two Lives

Folks, welcome to the Eric Mataxis show, sponsored by Legacy Precious Metaxus show, sponsored by Legacy Precious Metals. There's never been a better time to invest in precious metals. Visit legacy p.m. Investments.com. That's legacy p.m. Investments.com. Welcome to the Eric Metaxus show. Did you ever see the movie, Blob starring Steve McQueen. The blood-curdling threat of the blob. Well, way back when, Eric had a small part in that film, but they had to cut his scene because the blob was supposed to eat him.

But he kept spitting him out. Oh, the whole thing was just a disaster. Anyway, here's the guy who's not always that easy to digest. Eric, the Texas! Folks, welcome back. I have the privilege of continuing my conversation with Jack Vorful. The book is My Two Live. about his experience as a boy growing up as a Jew during the Holocaust in Germany.

Jack, you just shared with us something so difficult, so painful, hearing of the death of your mother who was at Auschwitz. And this would have been Christmas 1944. You said it was Christmas Day that you heard this terrible news. Yeah, I'm not sure if it was 44. It may have been 43. Yeah. That we heard about my mother.

Yeah. It's just extraordinary young boys hearing of the death of their mother in Auschwitz. Your father, when did he, was he killed? He was not killed. He was transferred shortly before the end of the war to another concentration camp called Madhausen, which was right down at the Austrian border, near Lens. and he was freed by the American Army, but at that point, he had lost so much weight,

and he was so sick, both of his lungs were gone. So he lived about another two months at the most. It was by a family who they assigned my father to be, very careful to feed him. Not to feed him too much. You have to be very careful when you haven't eaten for a long time. And tried to bring him back. Back after the war, I went back there and I met those people and I also met the two doctors

who treated him. I tried to find his grave, but I couldn't find his grave. I went to all the cemeteries in there. in the area, but they had all these mass graves in those days because of many people were found dead in the concentration camps and died shortly thereafter. So I never found his grave. So you were 13 when the war ended. Your brother was 14 or 15.

What did you do at that point? At that point, we still lived in Germany, of course. and we tried very hard to leave Germany and come to the United States preferably. I had some uncles who lived in Quito, Ecuador. They tried to get us to come. And we did make an application, and we did finally get our papers. In the ship, we were supposed to sail on. Then they had a change of government in Quito, and everything was null and void.

so we couldn't go there. So we were still hoping to come to the United States. And sure enough, one day we got a call from the American Army in southern Germany, and they said we were now fully aware of what happened to your dad and what he did before the war and during the war. and we also know that your mother died in Auschwitz. And if your boys would like to come to the United States, we'll be happy to take you there. I was then 17 years old,

and we truly came to the United States. And that's where my second life begins. So I want to talk to you about the second life because it's just such an extraordinary thing to have lived through this as a child. And then suddenly at 17, to be able to come to the United States. Your brother came with you.

Yes. My parents are immigrants, my mother from Germany and my father from Greece to the United States. So here you come to this nation. What did you do when you came here? You said you were 17. Well, there is an organization called to United States. States Committee for Care of European Children, financed by half Jewish and half Catholic money.

And they're the ones under their auspices, we came to New York. And we lived in New York for six months because we had no papers. They brought us over so quickly. And the Army said, don't worry. Just go on the airplane, fly to the United States. who got your papers eventually. And they did after six months. So you were stuck in New York in, it's 1949?

I arrived in New York, yeah, in 1950. January, 1950. January 50, you came here. So you were stuck in miserable New York, like me, for six months. And where did you go from New York? Where did you go from there? Well, once we got our papers, we were free to go some. So in the meantime, during those six months, I went to the New York Public Free Library, almost constantly, to learn about the United States and to try to learn a little bit of the language.

And I picked San Francisco as the place I wanted to go. So when I had my papers, they gave me a little money, and I went to the Greyhound bus station and I asked for a ticket to San Francisco. Francisco, and the lady counted the money, and she said, young man, you don't have enough money here. I said, well, how much money do I have? How far can I go? And they said, no further than Baltimore. Baltimore. You only had enough money to Baltimore. That's not that close to San Francisco. That's what I said. I said, how close is it to San Francisco? I really didn't know. And she said, well, it's a little ways to go. I said, is it in the right direction? Yes, it is.

More than that's barely, barely. My gosh. I mean, anybody knows Baltimore. It's about maybe five hours by bus from New York City. San Francisco would be something like 45 hours. I mean, it's amazing. So did you settle in Baltimore? Was your brother with you at this point?

Yes, my brother was with me. Yes, we settled in Baltimore. My brother in the meantime had met someone he really liked the girl, so he wanted to go back to New York. But I decided that I wanted to stay in Baltimore and see what life was going to be all about there. Because when I arrived, I had absolutely no money to speak of. I had no place to live, no place to work.

But as I got off, the Gary Ambassador. station right across the street, we noticed something about work. It was a state of Maryland unemployment agency. So I walked in there and I found a gentleman who spoke a little German and I told him what my story was and he went through his cottage and actually said after an hour, I think I have a job for you, but you have to start tomorrow morning. It's a necktie factory. A necktie factory.

I didn't know they made them in factories. Yeah, they make them in factories. So I took that job. Now, I still needed a place to sleep. So I went back to the Catholic Church that I saw from the bus as we were coming in. and rang the doorbell there in a building right next to it. And a very nice gentleman came out by the name of Libertini. And Mr. Libertini heard my story and he said,

yes, I can't find a place for you to sleep because we have a cemetery closed by. Seminary. A seminary, yes. Excuse me. Yes, I have an hour. And the kids, the boys are all on vacation right now. It was June. It was summertime.

And he called the nuns there who took care of the building. There were five nuns there. And they said, said the boy, it's over. I'd be happy to. This is unbelievable. There's more to the story. We'll hear the rest of the story when we come back. Folks, the book is My Two Lives, the author Jack Vourf.

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I'm talking to Jack Worfel, W-U-R-F-L. The book is My Two Lives. And Jack, let me ask you, since I haven't asked before, did you say My Two Lives because the first life was in Germany during the Holocaust and the second life is in America, which you're describing now? Exactly. Yeah. And you can't live any words.

life than you can at that time in Germany during that time. It was terrible. It was miserable. Obviously. Well, so you described coming to America, go ahead, sorry. Well, I was going to say especially because we had to live a life that we didn't believe in. We knew the truth. We knew all the time what was going on.

I would sing a song about the terrible Jews and kill the Jews every day and all of those sorts. We knew exactly who we were. we knew what was going on, my brother and I, you know. So those were very difficult times, yeah. I mean, to think that there are Palestinian children singing those songs today in 2024, these evil songs about how terrible the Jews are and how we must kill them, this is happening today. And it's one of the reasons I'm so privileged to have you on this program,

because we need to get the word out that evil exists, that hatred of the Jews, has existed for a long time. There is evil in the world, and we must speak about it and understand it. And, Jack, you come to America and you say that you settle in Baltimore, but you also decided to serve the United States in the Korean War, which was happening just as you arrived. Yeah.

Well, it wasn't my decision exactly, but I was here for three years going to school, and by then I was working in a little, insurance company. I had enough learned enough English. So at that time you know,

things were so good. When I landed in New York, when I was in New York, I was the happiest man in the world. Finally, I was in a place. I was in a country. There was freedom there. Democracy. all of the things that we dreamt about, they were all right there for us.

And I enjoyed every minute, and I loved every minute, living in the United States, greatest country in the world as far as I was concerned. Well, it's not just as far as you're concerned. It's an objective fact. But you did serve in the Korean War. Yeah, I was drafted. Yeah. by the United States to serve in the service.

And I was assigned to 101st Airborne Division, and I took my basic training there. And while I was taking my training, someone came to me and they said, we just looked at your Form 20, which is your personnel, all your personal things are in the Form 20, as to who you are and what you've learned and so on.

and they said, you speak German. And we would like to send you to Germany as an interpreter because we need interpreters in Germany. And at that time, in Germany, they were training as Americans and the British and the French. We were training the German army. They called the police force. What they called the police force, we were training a regular army. So I spent most of my time there with the German and American generals translating for them as they were going on maneuvers and trading each other and so on. In Germany.

In Germany. How amazing. I know it's all in the book. So after this, you decide to start your own business and you started what ended up being a very successful insurance business. Was that also in Baltimore? Yes, that was also in Baltimore. And so it seems to me like you spend many... What's that?

I was going to say it is still in Baltimore, and it's now run by my daughter and her husband, Tom. And this is the diversified insurance industries. How many decades did you work there? Since 1950. I mean, since 1969, that's when I started. You started the company. You started the company.

And I know that you were married and that your wife passed away just a few years ago. How did you meet your wife, Jack? Well, I had a friend who I had gone to school with to learn English, and he was from El Salvador. And he worked for the consulate in Baltimore, in the El Salvadorian consulate. and he, when I came back from the army, he was telling me about this great party, their golden half at New Year's Eve, and would I be interested to come to their party?

It's mostly Latino people from the various embassies in Washington, and I said, yeah, I'd love to come. And I did. And I met my wife. I met Sonia, who previously had been Miss El Salvador. And, yeah, we got along great, even though she spoke very little English, and she only spoke Spanish, and I spoke very little English, and I spoke German. But somehow we got along and we fell in love and eventually got married, and we had three children, three girls.

we had Odette and Dana and Lisa and they are still doing very well today and I still see him very much especially Dana who works with me in my company

and she's actually running it I left the business to her and her husband and I love the fact your story is very similar to my parents' story because my father came from Greece, my mother came from Germany. They met in an English class in New York City, learning the English language, the Greek met the German,

the German met the Greek. And of course, we spoke English at home, which is why my German and Greek is not so good, because we spoke, sorry, we spoke English at home, of course. So you describe yourself as having, you had an extraordinary business life. I know that you met a number of celebrities. Hedy Lamar, one of the most beautiful, brilliant women who ever lived,

is the actress Hedy Lamar. People know her as the famous actress, but also she was a brilliant inventor, one of the most strange, amazing stories. How did you meet Hedy Lamar? Well, I met her through my parents. My father knew her in Austria, where she started. She's Austrian, you know.

And she just changed her. name eventually. She got married in Austria to probably the richest men there. He had a huge factory and somehow became friendly with Hitler or Hitler maybe insisted that he built tanks and airplanes for Germany. And Haiti Lamar was married to him. Haiti was also Jewish and having dinners with Mussolini and with Adolf Hitler. She wasn't too happy about it, what happened to the Jews. So she escaped and went to England and then from England eventually to the United States, where she became very famous. But she was a fairly famous actress already in Austria. And she was a friend of my parents. And she used to come.

As a matter of fact, I have a film that she and her company took of my brother and myself and my parents and we're playing and having a picnic and all of that. And I still have that. From when you were children, so my goodness, I didn't. We were children. I didn't realize that. Yeah, we were children. Well, I'm sorry. And you, you met many people over the years.

you said that you played golf with Alan Shepard, who was the first American astronaut. How did that come about? Yeah, he was the only astronaut who ever hit a golf ball on the moon. You know something I forgot about that? Alan Shepard was an astronaut before the moon landings, but he was chosen to go to the moon,

and that he is the one I remember it because I was a kid who hit a golf ball on the moon, and I think it went about two miles because there is literally no atmosphere. So that's called cheating. But Alan Shepard hit a golf ball on the moon. fairly far, yeah. And I want to ask you, the most important thing I really want to ask you, when we come back from the break, is how you made sense of,

of all of this as the years passed. So, folks, I'm talking to the author of My Two Lives. Jack Worfell, we'll be right back. I want to remind you, if you're listening, folks, please go to letter to the Americanchurch.com. A lot of what we're discussing is, or I should say, my book is relevant to this discussion about what we do when evil rises around us.

Letter to the Americanchurch.com. The documentary is out. Letter to the Americanchurch. com please check it out please sign up there we'll be right back nothing to do but frown rainy days and mondas always get me

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Get 15% off by using the code Eric. During checkout, go to Nutrametics.com, and search health bundles, support your health while helping others in need. Go to Nutrametics. That's N-U-T-R-A-M-E-D-I-X.com. Neutrametics.com, use the code Eric for 15% off. Again, Neutrametics, N-U-T-R-A-M-E-D-I-X.com. Neutrametics.com, use the code Eric for 15% off. I'm talking to the author of My Two Lives, Jack Vorful.

So, Jack, you've given us this extraordinary story of living, through the Holocaust in Germany as a Jew, coming to America, experiencing the privilege of living in a free country with tremendous opportunities, making the most of those opportunities. But of course, the question that most people would have is, what were you thinking during those years? Did you want to just put the past behind you initially? Or was it something that was always on your mind? because obviously you didn't write this book until very recently. So what was your relationship with your past as you're living in America and having a wonderful life and raising three girls?

Yeah, I pretty much tried to not to think too much of my first life in those days while I was living here and working, getting married, having children. I had so many other things on my mind that I purpose. tried to not think of my first life because that was a very, very sad life, of course, you know, in a very traumatic life. But once I was in this country, I was able to do that, and especially when I was in the U.S. Army, that made me very proud to be in the U.S. Army. and I can tell you a little story.

When I was 12 years old, living in Germany with my brother, we listened to the BBC many times at night to find out what was really going on. And we found out one day, oh, my God, they call it D-Day. The Allies landed in Normandy. Now, I was 12 years old at that time, and we were so happy about that. You were 12 years old in 1944. You're in the north part of Germany listening to the BBC. I know that my grandfather listened to the BBC with his ear pressed against the radio speaker

because it was not allowed to listen to the BBC. Bonhofer's family, whom I mentioned, listened to the BBC. So you and your brother heard that Isaac, and the Allied forces landed on Normandy in 1944. And what happened in your mind at that time? Well, we were happy because we finally thought the Allies are in Europe. And we felt the whole world was against Hitler at this point, except the Far East, except maybe, you know, the Japanese and so on.

So, I don't know, I don't know. like to go back at this point to my time when I was in the U.S. Army. When I was in the U.S. Army stationed in the first infantry division in Germany as an interpreter. One day my company, commander said, he said, Jack, I watched you walk around here. You have very good posture. You are very straight. You walk very straight. I have an offer to make to you.

I would like for you to be in the first division. color guard. Now, 20,000 men, and I want you to be the color guard and help carry the American flag whenever necessary. Well, I thought it

was tremendous. I was very complimented, and I told my company commended, yes, certainly I will do it. So this is now in the 1950s you're talking about. Well, this was in the 1940s. This was just

before the late 40s, you know? Okay, so you, yeah, go ahead. Sorry. So, so one day they came to me and they said, this is now a 10-year anniversary of D-Day. This is when I was in the American Army, stations in Germany, the 10-year anniversary of D-Day.

So 1954, obviously. Go ahead. Exactly. And I want you to go with the color guard to Normandy in honor all the people, all of our soldiers, all of our Americans and others who died trying to fight Hitler. So I was delighted. So the color guard myself, we went to Normandy and we marched on Omaha Beach and Utah Beach. all these famous speeches. And it was just unbelievable that I, who listened to this,

I remember when I was 12 years old, and I heard that D-Day happened, that here, 10 years later, I was there, and I was carrying the American flag. And one morning we had a special one of the Roosevelt's generals was killed during Omaha Beach or Utah Beach.

I don't remember which one. And they asked the color god to be at the British Channel right there on the beach and dipped the flags and we had a bugler with us who played the bugle

and the sun was rising and we were standing there with the flags, just the four of us, the bugle, and the four of us in the color guard. And the sun came up, and we were standing there honoring General Roosevelt, who was killed there. This was one of the most emotional moments I ever had in my life. It's certainly, in the European out. It's extraordinary to hear you tell it. I know you tell it in the book.

We have a final segment coming up. The book is My Two Lives. Mike Lindell and My Pillow employees want to thank my listeners for all your continued support. To thank you, they're having an overstock clearance sale right now for the best prices ever when you use promo code Eric and you get free shipping for the entire order. Get 50% off the MyPillow 2.0 and the brand new flannel sheets that just arrived and won't last long. Get six-packed towel sets for only 2998 and take advantage of the free shipping. larger items like mattresses and mattress toppers 100% made in the USA on sale for as low as 9999. Everything is on sale from the brand new kitchen towels that have the same technology as

the bath towels that actually absorb dog beds, blankets, couch pillows and so much more to get the best specials ever go to mypillow.com. Use promo code Eric. Again, mypillow.com. Use promo code Eric. Remember, you get free shipping on your entire order. You can call 800-97830.000. 5-7-800-9-78-3057. Use promo code Eric. Welcome back. I'm talking to Jack Worfell, the author of My Two Lives. Jack, thanks for writing this book. I'm glad your daughter pushed you to write it because it is an amazing story. It's unquestionably an amazing story, and we're just covering the highlights right now. But how did you make sense of this? In other words, you are, you know, like my parents

coming from war-torn Europe, recognizing the greatness of America, the greatness of freedom, that patriots died for freedom, that patriots gave their lives, as you were just mentioning, to fight against Hitler and the Nazis. And we think if it weren't for American patriots doing that, where might we be today? It's an extraordinary thing. You got to experience that in Normandy, 10 years after the Normandy invasion. of the allied forces. It's a beautiful thing.

But right now, we see the rise of anti-Semitism, the rise of anti-Americanism within America itself, and an ignorance of the evil of many of these regimes. So it seems to me that this is the perfect time for your book to come out, if I may say so. Yeah, it's just a coincidence. I wrote the book just really for my family. it wasn't to be sold or publicized or whatever.

I wrote it for my family because Dana, my daughter and her husband, they said, you know, we need to, you had such an interesting life. And our children and grandchildren and great-grandchildren and so on and so. They ought to know about this. So we want you to write this book for the family. And that's what I did. And then all of a sudden, through the people who print a book or something, it got out, and now it's very popular. And I just hope that my book will be read by a lot of people, and especially young people, that they learn a little bit about anti-sentivism and learn about what's happening right now so that they can.

compared to Nazi time, even though there was six or seven million Jews killed during that time. But this business here with Israel and Hamas is a terrible thing, a terrible thing. You know, Hamas killing children in front of their parents and parents killing in front of children, I just don't understand how human being can do that. these kind of things. Well, it's called evil. It's called evil. And the Nazis understood, made their peace with evil and were the handmaidens of evil in Europe. But evil doesn't go away, which is why we have to be vigilant and we have to remind ourselves over and over again of the truth. And again, to have so many years pass between what happened in Germany

and now, I don't know if I mentioned it to you off the air, but I've written a book called letter to the American Church, where I am specifically trying to wake up the churches in America, that there is evil rising among us today, and we have an obligation to stand against it, just as the German Christians had an obligation to stand against Hitler, and very few did. I want to send you a copy of my book on Dietrich Bonhofer, because you should know his story. It's an extraordinary story. There will be a film coming out in November. but you see the same thing repeated over and over in history.

And that's why to me it's just extremely valuable to hear your story. And I'm just grateful not just for you writing the book, but that you're willing to come on this program and to talk about it, but because people need to know that this happened to you. This is not some story. This actually happened to you and you remember the details, which is amazing. Yeah. And I just hope that people will read my book, which was not the original intention,

and hopefully learn something from it and begin to understand anti-Semitism. What the hell is anti-Semitism? I never did find out. What is wrong with the Jews? I think the Jews are very normal, very nice people. I haven't ever seen the Jews start a war. I think they're very, very, very interested in having their children always well-educated and get into good professions. And as a whole, they have been quite successful.

So I think any country that has Jews within that country, I think that country benefits from it. Because these are decent people. These are very, very good people. I know that for my own family. And I know it from other families, you know. Well, you're looking for a natural answer to this question, and there's no natural answer. There's a supernatural answer. The Jews are the people of God, chosen by God.

We wouldn't have the Bible without the Jews. And it is a hatred of God. Evil is a hatred of God himself, and of whatever God loves, a hatred of what God loves. And so the Nazis hated the Jews because God loved the Jews. Hamas hates the Jews because God loves the Jews. Haman in the Old Testament in the book of Esther, all through history we see a hatred of Jews. Why? It's a hatred of God. And it is irrational and it is evil. And we have to understand that we're dealing with something called evil. It makes no human sense, no rational sense, but it's a supernatural evil. And that's what we're facing.

And that's why it really does make no sense. The cruelty that we saw with Hamas on October 7th, there's no human explanation for it. It is absolutely evil. And God is the only answer to evil. I talk about these things wherever I go, and that's why it's such a joy for me to have you on the program and to hear your story and your experience.

I assume we can get this book anywhere, My Two Lives, if people can only spell Vourful, W-U-R-F-L, W-U-R-F-L, W-U-R. You get it everywhere, but you get it through Amazon. Yes, pretty much everywhere. We will put this on video, people who sign up to my newsletter, Eric Mataxis.com. Folks, if you go to Eric Metaxus.com, we'll send you my newsletter with the video

of this conversation. I just think it's a very important conversation generally, but specifically right now. So Jack Worfell, it's been my honor to talk to you. Congratulations on your book, My Two Lives. Thank you so much. Eric, it's my honor to be, to have been with you at your program. God bless you.

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you, Jack. Thank you. Thank you, Eric. Folks, welcome back. I'm talking to Robert Netsley right now, who is with Inspire Investing. Robert, I can't help but get excited about what you've created an opportunity for people to find out if their money is funding wicked things. If they have money in a 401k or retirement, whatever it is, that is invested in companies that are doing evil things.

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understand what's going on and shift that money to good stuff, it's just huge. It's just absolutely monstrous. Like what is- It's enormous. It's enormous. And we are seeing fruit from that labor. It's remarkable. It doesn't have to even be trillions of dollars to change things.

I've been on the phone, you know, in recent weeks, you know, with investor relations and CFOs and whatnot. We regularly engage with companies that we invest in or are like to invest in or kind of just speaking biblical truth, the corporate power. And, you know, one of the things we hear is often that, number one, these people have never heard, they tell us they've never heard from a faith-based investor before. They've been doing their job for 20, 30 years. years, you know, executive major organizations never heard from a faith-based investor. So, number one, they need to hear our voice. Number two, they're thankful to hear it. Even in some of these sort of, you know, woke businesses you think that this don't care,

there are people in those businesses of influence that actually do care about what we have to say and oftentimes have enough influence to change things. So, for instance, Costco stopped giving money to gay pride parades. Chevron stopped giving money to Planned Parenthood. There's a laundry list of other organizations that can change things. That is unbelievable. Robert Nelson, that is unbelievable. It is so wonderful.

I want to tell people, folks, what you do and don't do, you can change the world if you take an interest in this. When I hear that a company like Costco would stop giving money to something like that or Chevron, these are huge, huge companies. And you shop there, your money may be invested there. When we get involved in these things, we can change the world. So I want to say the action point is go to invest. I'm sorry, inspireadvisors.com slash Eric. Inspireadvisors.com slash Eric. You'll get a free report that will help you figure this out.

And I know, Robert, that you guys will help people if they want to transition to invest in companies that believe in their values. But this is a gigantic thing that we have. I mean, it's to me scandalous when we have power and we don't use that power. It's like when I say, I'm not going to vote. I'm not going to do this. I'm not going to do that. When you don't do those things, people who don't share your values, who share opposite, who have opposite values, they're going to prevail.

So I just want to say to you, Robert, thank you for taking this on because it is game-changing. Like you said, it's a movement. The more people that do this, it's an amazing thing when we think of the money that is out there that many people of faith with traditional values have invested in woke companies. Ladies and gentlemen, you've got to do something about it. You've just got to do something about it. This is like a mandate that we've got to live our faith out in every sphere and where your

money is. That's a big deal. So please go to InspireAdvisors.com slash Eric. This is a free report. inspire, advisors.com slash Eric. Robert Natsley, thank you. Pleasure.

Thank you, Eric.