The Eric Metaxas Show - Kyle Mann & Joel Berry

Episode Date: May 28, 2022

Kyle Mann and Joel Berry, two of the comic geniuses behind The Babylon Bee, tag-team stories from their new book, "The Post-Modern Pilgrim's Progress," and touch on Elon Musk's interview with the Bee and their banning from Twitter.

Folks, welcome to the Eric Mataxis show, sponsored by Legacy Precious Metals. There's never been a better time to invest in precious metals. Visit legacy p.m.investments.com. That's legacy p.m. Investments.com. The Texas show with your host, Eric Mettaxas. Hey, folks, welcome to Friday. How been, can it really be Friday? I don't believe it. Well, I tell you, don't believe it. I don't believe it. I got to put my glasses on. Yes, it's frie-ie as Shannon. It's Friday is our sweet friend.

Shannon Bream says, uh, fray, yeah. Well, this is a particularly special Friday because it's Memorial Day weekend. Very hard for me to believe that. It's Memorial. It's Memorial Yay weekend. Oh, I'm sorry. Memorial Yay weekend. Right. Um, I, uh, I want to, uh, say that, um, well, three things. First of all, four things, five things. In a couple minutes, we're talking to our friends at the Babylon B. The Babylon B, ladies and gentlemen, these guys are comic geniuses. And speaking as a comic genius, I know that they're comic geniuses. They are so amazing that I just, I thank God for them. What can I tell you, except I thank God for Elon Musk. But that'll come up in the course of my conversation with the guys at the Babylon B who have a relationship with Elon Musk. That's coming up in a couple

seconds. In hour two today, Alvin, this is crazy. Pat Castle is the head of life runners. Yes. You can go to liferunners.org. If you believe that the unborn human beings are unborn human beings, then you believe in life. If you believe in life, you want to listen to my conversation with the head of life runners Pat Castle. So that's hour two. I'm a runner, and I believe that the unborn people in their mother's wombs are actually people. And so we're going to be talking about that.

But he's just an exciting, fun guest. So that's an hour to today. On Monday, I'm speaking to my friend Chris Reed. This is Memorial Day. I will be speaking to Chris Reed. Chris Reed is a prophetic voice. He's a friend. I've got to know him.

When you know someone like Mike Thompson, I've had on this program, like Chris Reed, you know, you really can, no pun intended, get a read on them. Are these people, you know, are they being slightly sloppy? Are they miss speaking? What's going on with them? Those two particularly, I mean, I have a number of friends in this world. but Chris Reed, there's nobody quite like him. And on Monday, we're going to air my conversation with him about an angelic visitation.

Now, you know, it's funny. I've written about, I've never seen an angel, but I know many people who have seen angels that have experienced, they're totally, totally miraculous things. And I think that there are a lot of people that are a little bit diffident about the subject of the angelic or that kind of stuff. And I think I want to challenge you, folks, to be intellectually honest. And to say that if you believe what the Bible says,

there's no question that angels are real. And to, well, I'll leave it at that. But I'm going to have a conversation with him. That's going to be on Monday. And I am super excited about it. Yeah. And I think Pat Castle in Hour 2 talks about Padre Pia. He has got a...

Oh, Padre Pio. Don't give it away. Don't give it away. Yes, today, our two, Pat Castle talks. about Padre Pio. We'll just leave it there, folks, but it's real. It's amazing. All right.

Well, I guess I also want to say this weekend, if you're looking for something to do, some of my dearest friends have not yet seen 2,000 mules. And I want to say publicly on the air, they're dead to me. Do you understand? You're dead to me. Maybe not, but go see the film. The film I'm legally obliged to say that I'm involved in the film. I'm in the film wearing green pants.

You could see, if you want to know who I am, I'm the guy wearing green pants. My character in the film wears green pants. And those pants are, they're going to be in the Smithsonian soon next to Fonzie's jacket and the ruby slippers and Archie's chair. But if you want to see the pants themselves, instead of taking a trip to Missonian, why don't you just go to the theater this weekend, go to 2000, Mules.com. You can plug in your zip code. It'll tell you where the nearest theater is. But I feel like every American needs to see this film and needs to exhort others to see it.

I'm, as I said, legally obliged to let you know that Salem, we are on Salem Radio Network. Salem participated in the production of this film. You can see it at Salem now.com. and I, as one of the stars of the film, now I do my own stunt work. I've been very open about that. I don't care. But as one of the stars of the film, I participate in the back end.

Now, it's so minuscule. It annoys me that I have to mention this. It's like, really? But yes, evidently, legally, I'm obliged to do that. So if you want to put like a shiny nickel in my pocket, go see the film. Yeah, by the way, if you go to see the film, you do have to buy your own ticket.

that because you're in the film, you get a free box of gummy bears. That's right. Everybody who participates in the film, when you go to the theater, you get a free box of gummy bears. Now, we should be clear that the film is important. And I earnestly desire that not only would every Americans see it,

but that we would have a national conversation about it. You can't have a national conversation about it if you haven't seen the film, if you've only seen a trailer or something. There's a lot in it. You need to know what's in it, folks, because it will change your view of things, no matter what you believe.

You'll have a different view of confidence, a different confidence that you know what happened. So I want to say that. I also want to remind folks, CSI. This is your last opportunity to help Ukrainian refugees. Many people know that we can depend on CSI to do great things. We only partner with folks that are, you know, to my mind, heroic that are dependable.

CSI is they're heroic in what they do. They're utterly dependable. So if you go to the website metaxis talk.com, you will see there a link at that link. You can click on it. Whatever you give, folks, we'll be grateful to you. We are grateful to you. And to those of you who have already given, I want to say thank you. We have to step up when we can and we have to find as good stewards.

We have to find organizations we believe in. We don't give our money indiscriminately. You want to make sure that it's being used to promote things you believe in. That's why we partner with CSI and that's why I ask you to go to metaxistalk.com. Actually, there is a phone number. Let me give you the phone number. It is 888253. 3522, 888, 253, 3522.

I should also say, Albin, I, some people keep asking me to update this. So I'll just say this. As you know, because of a guest that I had on this show like a year ago, I'm being sued. I can't get into the details. but it's amazing. It's just part of the cancel culture. It's part of this chilling effect. People are trying to shut people up.

So I'm being sued. The legal fees for that are very significant. We were knocked, as you know, off of YouTube. The financial hit from that is very, very significant. So if you want to help, you can help by going to give, send, go. If you subscribe to my newsletter, Eric Mataxis.com, Sometimes at the end of that, we put a link to the give, send, go page for Eric Metaxus. But I can use your help.

We're in a battle. We trust God. Our job is to do the right thing, not to worry too much about the circumstances. I mean, just to simply worry about doing the right thing, not to shrink back and say, oh, I better be careful. Of course, we better be careful. But most people are on the side of being too careful. And if everybody would speak up, if everyone would use their voice and risk push back or

risk, whatever it is, it would be easier for everyone. And so that's kind of, we need to be in this together. So as I say, if you want to help me and what we're doing on this program and in all the other ventures that I'm involved in, we really can use your help very much so. And we've set up a give, send, go page for that purpose. If you're able to help, I'm really grateful to you. Give send go, by the way, they're fantastic. I'm glad that they exist. Give send go. go. All right. When we come back, Alvin, we're going to talk to the folks at the Babylon B. Get ready, folks. Yeah. Tell me, Eric, why is relief factor so successful at lowering or eliminating pain? I'm often asked that question. The owners of Relief Factor tell me they believe our bodies were

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Now I'm able to clean out the junk and invest in companies actually doing good things. Go to Inspire Insight.com. today and register for free. That's inspireinsight.com. Go there. Folks, welcome to the program. I warned you that there were people crazier than me in this world. You didn't believe me. And I said, you know what? That's on you because I'm going to find them. I'm going to bring them on the show. As my guests, I'm going to force you to see that there are people even crazier than I. One of them is Kyle Mann claims to be the editor-in-chief

of the Babylon B. Who believes that? A lot of people claim a lot of things. Managing editor of the Babylon B is Joel Berry. Anyway, that's what they claim. Let's see what they have to say. Joel and Kyle, welcome to the program. Thanks for having us. Thanks for having us.

You guys claim also to have written a book called The Postmodern Pilgrim's Regress. You want me to just take your word for it? Is there any proof? Can you offer my audience any proof of these things? No, it's all fake news. Yeah, it's entirely fake. So another elaborate satire.

Yeah. We didn't expect these kind of hard-hitting questions from you, Eric. I'm a hard-hitting journalist, okay? This is not fun in games. I don't throw softballs, okay? I want answers. So you guys claimed have written a book called the Postmodern Pilgrim's Progress. Let's say you had written a book.

Let's say such a book exists. Let's say the book is brand new and available in paperback. What is the book about? And I think most people listening to the program are familiar. with the Babylon, B, I would think. But feel free to talk about that if you want. Absolutely. So, yeah, we wrote a book that's, or we claimed to have written a book that's a modern take

on the Pilgrim's Progress that Bunyan wrote. And this is an idea that was bouncing around in my head for quite a while, that if we were to take Bunyan's approach to allegory where you have Christian meeting all these people who are like very clearly one-to-one representation. of people that we encounter in the Christian life. And we were to have them encounter people that maybe we encounter more commonly today. Everybody that we talk about in the, you know, that we mock in the Babylon B, kind of represented in this allegorical form.

So that's an idea that I've been bouncing in my head for a long time. We finally got the opportunity to do it with Salem Books. And we were very excited about it. It's just kind of this crazy, weird, mishmash, sci-fi fantasy. multiverse type story with a lot of humor and some crazy characters that our guy. By Salem Books. Yes. Salem Books is my publisher.

And so I can corroborate this independently because I'm going to email them after this is over to prove that you've been this. Now, Kyle, when you say you've had this idea to do a postmodern Pilgrim's progress bouncing around in your head for years, I feel like what can I say to that? Like you should have sought out prayer. I think soaking prayer because it's a disturbing idea that you would have that in your head. And then you would actually execute it. It's unbelievable. Now look, there are people listening, I'm sure, who don't really know, and I'm not joking,

what is Pilgrim's Progress. This is one of the great classics of English literature written by Paul. I was going to say Paul, John Bunyan. and how do you describe it for people literally who don't know what is? Because we live in a culture that has forgotten, you know, the basics. What is, who is Homer and John Milton? So tell us so that we can understand what you've done. What is Pilgrim's Progress, this classic book, roughly?

So Paul Bunyan is the axe guy. Yeah. And with the big ox. The Blue Ox. John Bunyan was a Puritan who, he actually got thrown in jail and started writing this book. And it's arguably the first English novel, which is fascinating to me. It's one of the most widely sold and read books in the world.

I think behind the Bible, it's number two. What year roughly did he write? To be a Puritan, that's mid-17th century. It was, yeah, mid-late 17th century. Now you're quizzing my knowledge. but yeah, he was, he died in 1688, so, so I don't remember the exact year that, that Pilgrim's Progress was published. But the point is, it's before Tristram Shandy, it's before Pamela.

So it really is the first novel in English, because we forget that, you know, 1600, we've got Shakespeare in the mid part of the century. We have Paradise Lost, an epic poem. But yes, prose, this would be the first. I actually did not know that. That's extraordinary. There's debate about it. There's debate about what the first English novel is,

but it's constantly put forward as one of the first novels. You're right. I mean, because there's epic poems and such. But in terms of prose and dialogue, Pilgrim's Progress is one of the first. And it's crazy to me because it does start out. You know, we really lean into the multiverse thing in our story where this character gets knocked out and then he has this dream. But that was kind of present in Bunyan that he kind of says that he feels drowsy and falls

asleep. And then in this dream, he dreams this crazy sequence. And it's like this thing that kind of represents the Christian life. You have a journey of Christian who's in the city of destruction. And he has to make his way to the celestial city. And it's, you know, everything is very didactic in Pilgrim's progress. You know, it's very instructive. It's heavy-handed.

It is heavy-handed. I think in a good way. Overec pedagogical. I mean, I think in a good way, I actually find it very funny. I found a lot of absurdity in Pilgrim's Progress that I don't think Bunyan really intended it to be funny, obviously. But you have these characters in the city of destruction, and it really does kind of satirically shed a light on his culture and on humanity, because it's like there's these characters

in the city of destruction, you know, who are like, oh, we live. live in the city of destruction. That's fine. You know, like, we're in this place that's about to be destroyed by fire, but we're cool. You know, everything is good. And, and Christians trying to get them, like, no, we need to leave. Like, you know, we're all going to die. And they all don't care because they have their fares and their bread and circuses. And so we kind of really tried to lean into that humorous element in this, in this kind of version of the tale. So when you say you've updated it, the postmodern Pilgrim's progress, give us an idea of who does, uh, this the current day Christian bump into who are some of the figures and Joel don't speak okay

come on Joel what yeah yeah well I'll jump in here I guess I I Kyle like he said had this this book in his mind for for many years and he approached me maybe a couple years ago and said I would like to rewrite one of the greatest English novels and I said what a hubristic and greedy idea you should have reported him woke thing to do that is you report people like that. You need to keep an eye on people like that. That guy is like one millimeter away from violent insurrectionism. Yeah.

So I was like, of course I'm in. That sounds fantastic. So yeah, you know, it's funny what a natural fit it seemed to kind of what we already do with the Babylon B. I grew up with the Pilgrim's Progress. It was a very impactful book for me. And he doesn't run into, you know, one for one recreations of character. from Bunyan's book, but you'll run into things like the smiling preacher, who's kind of a prosperity guy. You'll run into Mr. Humanist. Wait, wait, wait, wait.

Stop. Stop. You didn't mention Joel Osteen by name, and that's not right. Yeah. Any resemblance to characters real or imagine is entirely coincidental. You guys have a deep animus against brother. Osteen and the funniest thing I think I ever, like your stuff, the Babylon B is like genius funny, which I don't throw that around lightly, but the John MacArthur coming out of the rafters to do a pile driver on, like, I think comedy's over at that point. You just go, I'm done, mic drop and you walk away. So, so you had to sneak in an Osteen thing in this book. And what is it called? I'm sorry? The smiling preacher is his name.

He also runs into a guy named Radical. We have a Mr. Humanist character. We have a, who else do we have, Kyle? I'm blanking here. Yeah, there's like, there's a faith healer. There's a city in the middle of the story that was a lot of fun to write. There's a city that he goes into that kind of, it's actually literally a giant glass bubble. You know, and it does represent the kind of Christian bubble that,

we kind of enter into a lot of times when we're new Christians. And it's like a bunch of people who are sitting there in this land that's about to get destroyed by meteors and fire. And they're all just studying the theory of what it means to follow the king and go down the king's road and make it to the Golden City. But they're just debating each other and arguing and collecting books and having meetings and forming commissions and all this stuff. And they're not actually going, you know, and then I think, you know, the main characters are kind of going through, like, why don't you guys actually like go follow the king now, you know? It's fine to study, but we need to actually get out there. And they just live their whole lives there and die there.

And, you know, so there's kind of, there's some fun twists and reveals in that chapter, but that was a lot of fun to write. I mean, it's, it's hilarious and depressing on some level. That's the joy of being able to laugh at what is normally just simply depressing. But, listen, this is terrific stuff. We'll be right back. Folks, I'm talking to Kyle Mann and Joel Berry, editor-in-chief and managing editor of the Babylon B. It's real people who write that stuff. So they tell me, the new book is the postmodern Pilgrim's Progress will be right back. In case you haven't been paying attention, the Biden administration has caused a financial crisis, and they have no clue how to fix it. Oil prices have skyrocketed, and when oil prices go up, the cost of transportation and shipping

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legacy pm.investments.com. Folks, I'm talking to the editor-in-chief and managing editor of the Babylon B. Have you heard of the Babylon B? If you haven't heard of the Babylon B, we need to have a talk, but we can't do it now because I'm on the air. The postmodern Pilgrims Progress. What a brilliant idea. Kyle Mann and Joel Berry. Congratulations on the new book, The Postmodern Pilgrim's Progress. It's such a good idea that I wish I had thought of it. But I'm also glad that I didn't because then I would have had to write it. And you guys already did that. Tell me more about what's in the book because it's, it's, look, it's a little bit like shooting fish in a barrel. Like when you get a good idea like this, it just, I can only imagine both of you thinking,

like, I know what I want to satirize. This is, you know, and we've been talking about some of that. And it is funny. And we need to make fun of these things because when you make fun of things, it helps you understand them, frankly, better. You do a lot of that in the Babylon Bee. So give me some more, give my audience some more ideas on what is inside the postmodern Pilgrim's progress.

So one early encounter that our main character goes through is it was really fun to write. I'm a massive G.K. Chesterton fan. And I think Chapter 7 or 8, he encounters Chesterton's fence. And if anybody doesn't know what Chesterton's fences, it was this concept that Chesterton popularized that if you stumble across a fence in a field, don't tear it down until you know why it's there. And he's like, you know, he says the, the traditional reformers would say, I may allow you to tear the fence down, but first tell me why it exists. And it's so like, I don't know, it's so applicable to our current day because we tear down institutions, you know,

we defund police, we, we, we, we tear down walls that our ancestors set up without asking why they're even there. And in some cases, yeah, institutions do need to be questioned. And maybe some old rules do need to be torn down. But first, we need to ask why, why thousands of years of humanity led to these traditions? You know, and so it's Chesterton arguing for the wisdom of the pre-moderns. Anyway, in our story, there's a literal fence and there's a group of protesters that is pulling the fence down, you know, down with fences. Fences are oppressive. And our characters kind of engage in conversation with them like, why are you tearing this fence down? And then they're told that they're pro-fence bigots because they're even asking that question.

And, of course, eventually it ends in ruin for the protesters who manage to tear the fence down because there's horrible things beyond. Gory and graphic ruin. Like drug mules, fentanyl, coyote. We're not that on the nose, you know? I know that's what you would have done if you had written this book, Eric. That's why I didn't write this book, man. I, I, I'm also obviously a Chesterton fan. And it is, it is fascinating because we do need to think about why we're doing what we're doing.

And the madness, I mean, when I wrote my book about Martin Luther, it's so fascinating how a good idea the crazies adopt it and then they run with it, you know? So, you know, the idea that we want to, we want to build bridges, like those are good ideas. but when they lead to tearing down walls indiscriminately, it's kind of crazy. And that's where we are in the culture. And obviously, that's a big part of the role of satire to kind of show us what we're, show us the absurdity of what we're doing rather than ranting about it, actually making the point, I guess, lightly with some levity. So who is the character who stands in for Christian in, in Europe?

your postmodern version of Pilgrim's Progress. Yeah, so the main character's name is Ryan. And we gave him a little backstory in our book. He has a horrific tragedy in his life, that kind of a meaningless death that almost turns him into a bit of a nihilist. And he's struggling with the existence of God. He's struggling with kind of the failure of leadership in the church to provide any sort of answer or understanding

behind the tragedy. And so he goes to this megachurch and here's kind of a bunch of empty platitudes from the pulpit. It gets really mad, loses his temper at the pastor. And then a giant projector falls from the ceiling and knocks him out. And he has this dream. And so the entire book is basically the retelling of this dream and this journey that he goes on through this kind of multiverse world. And we were excited to to bring. bring the multiverse element into it. That those, the multiverse stories are kind of big right now.

They're usually used to tell kind of a nihilistic tale. And we, we reverse that to tell the story of a nihilist who, who finds meaning and finds his creator, um, on this journey. It was kind of cool. A lot of people,

um, again, this is a program with a, with a pretty diverse audience. And a lot of people don't know, um, your involvement, Babylon B,

with, uh, what happened? with Elon Musk and Twitter. Can one of you give us some idea of how that went down or how that started? Yeah, well, I mean, we interviewed Elon Musk back in December. And, you know, we started to kind of just develop a relationship with him. You know, he'll comment on our stuff on Twitter.

He's kind of always weighing in on, you know, laughing emojis or whatever on a Babylon B article. So when we got banned, it was, I don't know. know that that was the, you know, I don't know, there's a lot of news stories like this is the reason. Yeah. There's a lot of news stories like Babylon B bought Twitter just so he could read Babylon B. Or he bought, yeah, or Elon Musk bought Twitter just so he could read Babylon B stories. I don't know.

What's 40 billion, you know, for a few laughs. Hey, man, why do I have the money? You know what I'm saying? We're going to be right back. I'm talking to the guys behind the Babylon B. The new book is the postmodern Pilgrim's Progress. Folks, don't go away. Hey there, folks.

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978 3057. Folks, I'm talking to the guys behind the Babylon B. at least two of the significant guys behind the Babylon B. Kyle Mann and Joel Barry. Can either of you tell my audience, when did the Babylon B start? March 1st, 2016. Put it on your calendar. It's an important day

in the history of our nation. It's hard to believe that it's that right. recent, actually. Yeah, that's what everybody says. It feels like it's a cultural institution that's been around a lot longer. But yeah, we launched right in the middle of the 2016 election. You know, it was like a couple months, a few months before Trump was nominated before Hillary was officially nominated.

So it was kind of this moment for Christians where like nobody knew what to do politically, you know, who to we vote for? Can we vote for Trump or not? Yeah, the answer turns out to be yes, but we're not going to cover that in this show. So let me ask you because I can't remember, I can't remember with whom I've spoken about on what subject. I know I talked to Ethan Nicole. I've been on the podcast with you guys in your home offices in California.

But I can't remember if we ever talked about, I mean, when I was at Yale, I was the editor of the humor magazine. And it's when I kind of cut my teeth on. writing humor and you realize how hard it is, at least I do, to write humor. It's incredibly hard. And I think people, when they laugh at something, they think they could tell that joke or they could do that. But it's actually really hard. And I think I've said to you guys in previous interviews, just how thrilling it was to me to read the Babylon B humor because it comes up to that level, which I would not have expected from a conservative Christian thing.

not because I don't think it's possible, but just because I think that would just be too good to be true. That would be so wonderful. And so I want to ask both of you, what are your antecedents in comedy? What led you to be able to think and crack jokes in the way that you do, you know, going back to when you were younger? How do you get to this place? Because not everybody can write funny. It's a really extraordinary gift. Most of us Babylon V people came from. like very boring like sales backgrounds, you know, and going to ordinary small churches and just observing wacky stuff going on. And we were just like building up all this material for decades before we made the jump over to, over to writing comedy. But like just the comedy that I've enjoyed

to consume is always very dry. I love like, you know, this is spinal tap, all the Christopher guest stuff. That was always big for me. Monty Python. That was something I discovered in middle school, like, wow, there's this whole world of comedy that's not just completely on the nose with a laugh track, you know, and that was a, that was a real revelation for me. Joel, what about you? Yeah, for me, I guess my influences are a little goofier. I, you know, I think like the three stooges is like the height of comedy for me. I like just the, the image of a well-dressed man in a suit getting a pie in his face, I think is just perfection. And so I like the, I like when we can get a little silly with our articles sometimes. You'll see a range with our comedy. This interview is over,

Alvin. No, honestly, I am, I'm as a fan of the three stooges. I'm just, I'm a gog that you would dare to bring them up. People thought you were sophisticated. What is wrong with you? Um, no, that's, that's kind of, that's actually very funny. I don't see any real link between the stooges, maybe shimp, but we'll put that to the side, but between the stooges and the Babylon B. So anything else? Well, honestly, I really just became very good at imitating Kyle's voice. I mean, he created a lot of the voices of the Babylon Bee.

I started off as a fan myself for the first couple of years of its existence. And just I kind of trained in the school of Kyle Mann, the Kyle Mann School of Comedy is how I... Is this like an all about Eve's scenario? You're slowly pushing him out. I don't know what this is about, isn't it? You're all smiles. You're all friendly.

And next thing you know, you're getting the trophy. No, listen, I'm just so proud of what you guys do. It is unfortunately very necessary at this point. So it is, it is wonderful. The idea that you would bring up Christopher guest, Kyle, he hasn't done anything recently. Has he? Like, I think that they're doing the latest I heard, because there's been years. actually since he came, you know, he came out with, you know, a mighty wind waiting for Guffman

and Best in Show. Then they came out with something which wasn't that great. I always forget the title of it for your consideration. I mean, these are some of the greatest movies ever made. And I think now maybe they're doing another spinal tap, literally. I don't know if you have you heard about that. Yeah, they did one called mascots in 2016 that's on Netflix. I haven't watched it. I heard it was pretty funny, but it did seem to blend modern styles of humor with his, with his classic mockumentary style. So it was a bit of a hybrid. And then, yeah,

this is Spinal Tap Part 2 was announced for 2024. But is there anything better than those first three movies? I mean, I don't know how many people listen to this program have my wacko, the sense of humor, maybe a few since they listen to the program. But best in show, waiting for Guffman and a mighty wind. Mighty win.

I don't know what to say. They're like, they're unbelievably spectacular. I just what really makes them work. And I think it's similar. there is a lot of overlap between what makes the Babylon B work is it's a very small community that takes itself very seriously. And it's clear that the filmmaker has a passion and a respect for the subject matter. And that's what made Babylon B work is if you watch a lot of, if you consume any kind of secular satire of the church, it's clear that it hates the church,

it doesn't understand the church, the people who write it have never been to church. What makes the Babylon B's church humor work is where we're there. we love the church, and we know that we take ourselves very seriously, even in things that we probably shouldn't. Well, you're speaking from the inside. That's the, that's the beauty of it. I mean, to crack jokes about John McArthur and Joel Osteen, you've got to be literate in the things of American evangelical Christianity, I guess, and you guys are. So it is delicious. Also, I think that because of the secularization of the culture and Hollywood, there weren't a lot of people. people who knew that world. And so there's a gigantic audience that lives in that world that knows

that world and nobody's really talking to them. That's what you guys have been doing. A simple yes or no. Thank you very good. I was waiting for Joel. Exactly. Sorry. Well, but it is, it's a huge audience hitherto untapped. And you guys have, have been feeding that beast and it's been growing and I'm scared. Do you, uh, if, If you'll stick around, we've just got a few minutes left. But folks, we're talking with Kyle Mann and Joel Berry, who have a brand new book out called The Postmodern Pilgrim's Progress. I think you'd be crazy not to get a copy.

That's a blurb. Thank you. Sometimes I'd like to quit. Nothing ever seems to fit. Hang it around. Nothing to do but frown. Rainy days and Mondays always get me. Hey, folks, have you heard of the Babylon B? Now you have.

I'm talking to the editor-in-chief, managing editor, Kyle Mann, and Joel Berry. They have a brand new book out. I think you want this. It's called The Postmodern Pilgrim's Progress. We've been talking about it. But let's just go back to the Twitter ban. How insane is it that you guys write comedy

and that you were banned from Twitter? What? For spreading disinformation? Yeah, we told a joke after USA Today made Rachel Levine, their woman of the year, we decided to make Rachel Levine our man of the year in response. And so that was a bridge too far for Twitter and they gave us the boot. Are you saying that Rachel is not a lovely woman? Is that what you're saying?

We're not saying. We would never say that. You guys are just mean. You know who the comedian Bruce Valanche is? he wrote a lot of stuff he's kind of a Hollywood writer but whenever I see Rachel Levy I just get them mixed up

but you you guys were knocked off of Twitter how long has it been since you've been on Twitter off Twitter it was like March 27th March 28 so we're up on 60 something days now but I'm not good at math but it's like yeah over two months

and and are this a permanent ban what are they saying like I don't They asked us to delete the tweet and acknowledge that we've committed hateful conduct by calling a man and a man. And we refuse to do that. So we're locked out. You call the lovely Rachel Levine. Dude.

That's your game, Kyle, man. What is wrong with you? We honored Rachel Levine within a war. I don't understand what the problem is. That is so harsh, man. Okay. So you guys have been knocked off Twitter. Are they, is there any indication that they would reinstate you or is this just, that's that?

We've submitted several appeals and they haven't responded to any of them. So unless Elon buys Twitter, we're stuck in Twitter jail. So hopefully he'll tunnel us out of there or something. He's our only hope at this point. Help of us, Elon. You're our only hope. I have to tell you the idea that. that Elon Musk is pulling together $40 billion with a B to buy,

it's just, it's sort of crazy. Can you give me any insight? I'll give my audience any insight onto that, because this is something I frankly cannot understand any of it, really. Yeah, well, the problem is, you know, especially with kind of the recent revelations from Project Veritas, is that Twitter is a very poorly run company. It's not making money, and it's run by ideologs that are more interested in,

kind of controlling a political narrative than they are making money. So it's kind of a bad business model. And only someone is as crazy as Elon, maybe with some driven by some higher ideals, as Elon hopefully would buy something like that. So, you know, it's, I don't know anyone else who would make a purchase like this. He's purchasing it at a premium. What do you mean you don't know anyone else? You don't know any other trillionaires capable of reaching?

in their pocket and pulling out $40 billion. Man, I could think of, yeah, I can't think of anybody either. Yeah, yeah. So it's weird. You know, there's, he's gone silent, you know, in the last few weeks. So there's a lot of questioning as to whether or not the deal will go through. So we'll see. It's, it's unbelievable.

What is the release date? Is this June 7th that your book comes out? Yes. Okay. So we're going to, so we want people to pre-order the book. And then we will re-air this around the date of publication. And then we want people to order the book. I am thrilled you guys are doing what you do.

God bless you. And thank you for everything to be continued. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you so much.