The Eric Metaxas Show - Randall Terry (Encore)

Episode Date: April 28, 2023

Randall Terry talks about the history of Operation Rescue and his involvement in the pro-life groundswell that eventually led to the overturning of Roe v. Wade. (Encore Presentation)

Folks, welcome to the Eric Mattaxas show, sponsored by Legacy Precious Metals. There's never been a better time to invest in precious metals. Visit legacy p.m.investments.com. That's legacy p.m. Investments.com. Welcome to the Eric Mataxis show. We'll get you from point A to point B. But if you're looking for point C, well, buddy, you're on your own. But if you'll wait right here in just about two minutes, the bus to point C will be coming right by.

And now here's your Ralph Cramden of the Airways, Eric Matt, Texas. Yousa, Yousa, Yousa. We did it. Yeah. Albin, I always, I want to start by telling people who we have on as our guest. And then I want to talk about Dennis Prager. I'm angry.

Not at Dennis. I love Dennis. But I want to tell, before I talk about Dennis Prigger, I want to say, today's program, ladies and gentlemen, this is really interesting. My guest in most of both hours today is Randall Terry. There are certain people who I can say genuinely are living legends. Now, he's seemingly too young to be a living legend, but when he was a very young man in the 80s and the 90s,

He was the face of the pro-life movement. And many people today are not aware of his utterly heroic, self-sacrificial, gigantically courageous efforts, gigantically courageous efforts, so gigantically courageous that it should shame every one of us who claims to believe anything. This is what I talk about on my travels. I was just in Atlanta, before that I was in Raleigh, North Carolina. And almost everywhere I go, I'm speaking about my book letter to the American Church.

And the whole point of the book in a way is to say that faith without action, faith without works, is dead. So you can say, I believe this, I believe this. What are you willing to put out on the line for what you claim to believe? That's what the Bible requires of us, is to live out our faith. Randall Terry, who's not here right now, so I can brag on him, is a living hero. And you'll hear his story. I hope that you listen to the whole thing because it is important. It is genuinely important that we understand what hell some people faced so that we can get where we are today.

So that Roe v. Wade could be overturned today. We really, really need to understand this. If you don't understand this, you're effectively ignorant. You cannot really understand the pro-life movement unless you understand what handful of people paid a monumental price to move the ball forward. So we're going to hear, I'm going to interview Randall in both hours today. And I am still, I guess let's sum it up in case anybody like misses it. This guy in 86 or 87 founded Operation Rescue, these people put themselves in front of abortion clinics,

got arrested over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over. And it's because of them that the ball was moved forward. This became more of a hot button issue. Do you know many Christians, evangelical Christians, couldn't care less about the unborn before Randall Terry and before him, Francis Schaefer put it on the map. How many evangelical Christians just didn't even register a blip? It's because of Randall Terry principally that this became the issue that it did, and we kind of assume that it was always an issue.

It was not. So we're going to talk to him about that today, and you need to know who he is. and you need to buy his book. I don't remember the title, but you'll hear about that because it is absolutely it's just central in terms of going forward. Yes. And it's both hours today, too, folks,

so you're really going to hear about this movement and Randall himself. Yeah, no, it's just, I, and the funny thing is when I did the interview the other day, I thought, I wish I had three times as much time as we had. And so we'll actually have him back because I felt guilty. I thought, my goodness, this is a hero, a legend.

And most people don't even know who he is and don't understand what it is that he did. So we're going to talk about that today. This is important stuff. I also want to talk for a moment about Dennis Prager. Dennis Prager is a hero, an absolute hero on every level. And now he's not a Christian, doesn't believe in the resurrection. of Jesus, which I consider pretty major issue.

Yeah, it's a big ticket item. It's kind of a major issue for me. But in terms of his values and everything, you know, Dennis is just an absolute hero. He's become a friend. And he was lured by Jordan Peterson. I don't think Jordan Peterson really did this intentionally, so I can't say he was Lord. But he made a few comments. They were doing a commentary on the book of Exodus on Jordan Peterson's podcast. And Dennis made some comments, which I would differ with. And I think any, you know,

born-again evangelical would differ with his comments on this. But not as much as you think. In other words, what he said was kind of blown out of proportion. And it really was unfortunate. But the reason I'm bringing it up, bringing it up is because a lot of Christians have suddenly decided, we got to cancel Dennis Prigger, and I thought, holy cow, this is exactly what happened to me a few times. Like you say something, people take it out of context, then they add to it, or they say, they just decide they don't like you, and they need to now find things about you to bolster their sloppy opinion, taped together opinion of you. So people then find, oh, he said other things. He said homosexuality is the norm that we're all bisexual. Did you know that? Oh, yeah. He said,

oh, now we're digging it up now. He's a bum. Dennis Brick is a boy. Then you find out, and again, this is only because this happened to me, I know. So people will cherry pick something you said. They won't put in the second part of what you said, which is that God condemns these things, right? Because at some point, over the years, Dennis has, first of all, he's been a hero in the fight, the fight against same-sex marriage, in the clarity of that the Bible says

sexual activity has to be between a man and a woman between a man. I mean, he's been a hero for decades on this stuff before you even heard of him, right? So, but people will cherry pick. But I'm saying when people do this, it's despicable. And they did it to me many times. times. They'll take something you said, they'll twist it, and then they'll present it in an article,

then someone else quotes that article, and then somebody else quotes that. Before you know it, all your friends are convinced you said something you didn't say, and you believe something you don't believe. So Dennis, you know, would make a statement like about homosexuality being the norm in all cultures and all history until the Bible and the Jews and the God of the Jews changed everything. Yeah. Right? Yeah. But they left out the second part. They just say he makes it sound like, oh, we're all bisexual,

therefore let's go for it. Or that he's saying that porn, and also when he made his comments on pornography, even though I disagree with them, he still is referring to like, you know, Playboy 1972. He's not referring to videos and stuff. He's clarified this.

He wrote a letter about it. He's going to write a piece, actually. I think he's writing it today, and we will read it on the air tomorrow or comment it on the air tomorrow. But I just want to say, The main point is that how disappointed I am in my fellow Christians for jumping on the bandwagon, again, they've done it before.

Some of them, they've done it to me, and I've seen it happen. But it is effectively lying. It's bearing false witness. It's cherry picking things. Maybe you have an animus against him. Maybe you don't like Jews, and this is your opportunity to whack him. I don't know. All I know is if you don't get the facts right and you open your big mouth, you're guilty.

And people have done that. And I want to urge caution. And I also want to speak grace. We can disagree with people on things. Let's have a conversation about it. Dennis Prager, I'll say it again, is a stinking hero. The man is a hero on a thousand issues. And if I disagree with him on, you know, one or two or three or whatever it is, by the way, he's also a big guy.

So he'd punch you in the head if you disagree. And he would whack me one swipe from his bears. claw. That's it. All right. When we come back, uh, both hours today, we're talking to another hero, huge hero, Randall, Terry, uh, formerly of Operation Rescue, uh, and we'll catch you at the end of the show. Some people go to church just to signal fire. Trying to make a date with the neighbor's wife. Brother, let me days just to show as you're born. You better leave that. Legacy precious metals has a revolutionary new online platform that allows you to invest in real gold. and silver online. In a few easy steps, you can open an account online, select your medals of choice,

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LegacyPm Investments.com. Legacy pm investments.com. Check it out. Folks, welcome back. As I hope you heard me say in the introduction a minute ago, I'm really honored to have as my guest, Randall Terry. Some of you know exactly who he is. Some of you are younger and more ignorant. And you don't know who he is. And the reason we have him on, we have him on right now is because you can't really not know who he is. You need to know his story, a central, central figure in American culture in recent decades. Randall Terry, welcome to the program.

Eric, God bless you, brother. It's good to be with you, and it's an honor. Thank you for your kind words. Well, I know. You are an iconic figure in the pro-life movement, which I have said in the introduction. But I think it's sort of fascinating how time passes and how all over. lot of younger people wouldn't know you. And that's why we have this program and why people do what they do. And, you know, you got to explain to people. Abraham Lincoln was a president.

It was a civil war. He got shot. Like, if you didn't know that, you're responsible. But it's going to be on the test. In this country, we had, we have a pro-life movement. But in the 80s and in the 90s, you were at the center of that. So heroic, extraordinary. So I want my audience to get to know your story. And let's start with this. You're making a documentary film called Dragon Slayers that tells the story of this. So I want everybody to know about that by the time we're done with this. But Randall, I want your story. You were so iconic and so central to this movement in the 80s and the 90s. What is your story before that? How did you get involved in the pro-life movement.

Where did you begin life? Well, I was a graduate of a Bible college. I was blessed by the Lord to be able to preach in churches all over the northeast and in Mexico, Costa Rica, Honduras. I spoke Spanish fluently and preached in Spanish. And my mission in my head was to be a missionary and to preach the gospel. Where did you grow up? I grew up in up in upstate New York, outside of Rochester, New York, and a little

town called West Henrietta and went to public school there. I quit school when I was 16, four months before graduation. I was an honor student graduating early and I got into a big fight with my dad and quit school and literally started traveling around the country, hitchhiking, sleeping under bridges. And I was 16, my poor mom and dad. But people were preaching to me as I was going. and I came to the Lord when I was 17 and had a genuine, born again, come to Jesus conversion. So I began to preach to all my friends, and I felt the call to go to Bible college. So I went to Bible college. And while I was there, I saw the documentary by Francis Schaefer called Whatever Happened to the Human Race.

You remember it. Isn't it interesting how, you know, we all do what we do and we don't know how it's going to affect people? It's kind of funny to think that there are many people in my audience that they don't know Randall Terry and Operation Rescue, much less Francis Schaefer. But that film that he made, I've never seen that film, but the point is that he's the one that effectively brought the life issue from, the Catholic Church into the evangelical world. Do you remember when that film that you're talking about came out? 80, 19. I've got to tell you something, Eric, this is really interesting.

You hit a nail on the head. Sony, as in the mothership of Sony Corporation, just finished recording a seven-part podcast, and I am the central figure for their podcast for the pro-life side. The opposition has Ellie Smil, Patricia Ireland, that you and I know, the hardcore baby-killing feminists of the past, they are in it. But for the pro-life side, I'm in it. And they're giving me enormous amounts of airtime because they want to show how we got to the place where Roe could be overturned. And Operation Rescue,

the movement that I led was central. Without Operation Rescue, Roe would never have been overturned. That's the premise of the Sony piece. And that is a fact. And that's really the main reason I wanted to have you on the program. People need to understand this. Operation Rescue was a monumental reality in America culture. We ended up by you. I got to tell you, this is funny. I'm getting ahead of myself, but for people who come and go, because I know it's radio. I love radio, by the way. Randletary.com is my website. And if somebody only has, you know, a minute, they're going to leave us. If you go to Randall Terry.com, you will see a five-minute promo about Operation Rescue opened by Oprah Winfrey. Oprah Winfrey opens the promo.

That's all I'm going to tell you, but that's how big we were. We were on news coverage, every continent in the world, except for Antarctica, literally every continent in the world. We were in the nightly news, 48 hours, 60 minutes, good morning America, meet the press, CNN, Crossfire. Fox. We were the number one pro-life news story for about six years. On every continent and shame on pro-abortion Antarctica. All right. So seriously, though, but I remember this, this was the 80s. And it's fascinating to me because you did such heavy lifting. And I mean, listen, I want to talk to you about that. But you, let's just, let's track this. I got to tell you. So I had a vision. So I'm thinking, to go, you know, I graduated from Bible school. I'm going to go be a missionary. And we were praying

in a local church in 1983 about abortion. Somebody came in and said, we've got to pray. What year, before you say this, what year did you see, is this before or after you saw the Francis Schaefer film? It was three years later. So when I saw the Francis Schaefer film, I sobbed my eyes out, but I was still in that kind of ghetto mindset that I'm just called to preach the gospel. I'm not called to social issues. Yeah, whatever the heck that means that. So in 1980, and tell us again the title of the Francis Schaefer film. Whatever happened to the human race.

Okay. So this was a big deal at the time, 1980. Yep. And he wrote a book. And then he also wrote the great evangelical disaster. And he wrote a book called The Christian Manifesto. So what Francis Schaefer did for me, he gave me permission to practice civil disobedience. So I was arrested for peaceful protests.

almost 50 times. And we led the largest civil disobedience movement, the peaceful civil disobedience movement in American history. So when you look at Dr. Martin Luther King and the civil rights movement, they had about 7,000 arrests from 1958 to 1968. We had over 75,000 arrests from 1987 to 1994. It was 10 times the size, just sheer violence. of people getting arrested, filling jails.

So. But let's go, let's go back again. So let's just go back to 1983. So in 1980, you see the film by Francis Schaefer, whatever happened to the human race. It convicts you. But you were still in the mindset. And I'm glad you put it that way in this ghetto mindset. You're not, because we're dealing with this today and we can talk about this. And my last book letter to the American Church is this, it's the same issue. That people, People get it in their head. I just want to preach the gospel. They don't even know what they're talking about.

I don't even know where they got that mantra from because you've got to understand what is the gospel. What does it mean to preach the gospel? What are the boundaries? Can I talk about slavery is a bad thing or is that not a gospel issue? So you in 1983 have this experience in a church. Talk about that. So we break up into little groups. There may be seven of us in my group.

We're in a little Sunday school. room. And, you know, we had our list of what to pray for, and abortion was on the list. So I started praying. Lord, you know, please save babies. I mean, I didn't even know what to pray. And I had a vision. So this was not normal for me, but I saw a scroll coming down in front of my face with words written on it telling me what I was supposed to do. And that I was to recruit people to go by the hundreds and thousands in front of abortion clinics, that we were to re-educate the public to the value of human life from a Bible-based perspective. And I saw myself on Donahue, the Phil Donahue show. In the vision. In the vision, I saw myself on Donahue. And so I went to my, I went to no one.

I didn't know what to do. I was so startled. I didn't tell a single stole. And I thought, okay, am I going crazy? Because this doesn't fit my theology. I don't know what to do. I don't know what to do. And then I had this idea. If this is from God, I'll find something in the scriptures to confirm it. So I started digging through the Bible, not even knowing what I was looking for, and I found this phrase, the shedding of innocent blood. And I thought, oh, my goodness. And so as I studied it, from Genesis to Revelation, most of the time in the scriptures, when the phrase is used, the shedding of innocent blood. Most of the time, it's talking about child sacrifice. Okay, hang on. We're going to, we're going to put a pause there. Folks, I know you don't want to miss this. This is very important.

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Again, use code Eric and Save Mypillow.com. Welcome back talking to Randall Terry, Randall Terry.com. Okay, Randall, so you're giving us the timeline, the story of how you become the head of this monumental, civil disobedience, civil rights organization to end abortion. And you're giving us this moment. This is so beautiful. You're in a church. You have a vision.

We'll talk about that in a minute. But you then search the scriptures and you find this phrase, the shedding of innocent blood. So go ahead. So in the scripture, it says, for example, in the Psalms, it says, they shed innocent blood, the blood of their sons and daughters. who they offered to the idols of Canaan, and the land was polluted with blood. And the Lord hated his inheritance and handed them over to foreigners to oppress them.

So I studied the books of Moses, the law of Moses, and I saw how that the pagan nations, the seven Canaanite nations, they were displaced because they were sacrificing their children. They were shedding innocent blood. And it all came into sharp focus for me. that true religion, James wrote, true religion and undefiled before God the Father is that you help the fatherless in their distress. And a fatherless child is a child about to be killed. So the prophet Isaiah said, though you multiply prayers, God is talking to his own people. He says, when you lift up your hands in prayer, I will not hear you because your hands are covered with blood. And I thought, what is going on? And so the more I dug in the scriptures, the more I saw that the guilt of innocent blood is twofold.

It's upon those who kill children. But it's also on the hands of people who know that children are being killed, but don't do anything to stop it. So the Greek word in the Bible for a baby is brefos. The Hebrew word in the Bible for an unborn baby is Ben. And it's the word for a baby, for a born baby or an unborn baby in the Bible, same word. So I came to these intense conclusions that God wanted me to save babies from death, that that is what true religion was, that the shedding of innocent blood was an abomination to him, that the blood of these babies was crying out from the ground for vengeance,

and that he put his hand on me to stop it. Now, I'm 24 years old. I saw, you know, who's going to listen to me? But the vision was so stark and it was so real. I just, I told one friend. And he later, years later, he told me he thought I'd lost my mind. Listen, Randall, I just want to say, I became born again in the summer of 88. So it's right in the middle of a lot of the stuff that you were doing.

when I came to faith, it was normative for people to say, God gave me a vision or something. When I have had a number of visions, I haven't really written about them, I don't think, but the point is, when you get a vision vision, we're not talking about I had an idea in my head or I had a vision in the metaphorical sense. you're talking about a supernatural vision from God. Yes. You are awake. You're in a Sunday school room praying with some people and you have a vision. And I want to be very clear when I say I had a vision or when you say you had a vision that we're talking about something utterly supernatural, utterly miraculous. It is either an insane hallucination or it is either a demonic.

vision or it is from God. But the point is, it's not nothing. It's not like I think I had a vision or I had some thoughts floating from my head. You're making it very clear, or at least I want to make it clear, that what you're talking about was, in my estimation, a vision from God for you that the Lord knew your future and knew his calling on your life. And he waits until this moment to give you this supernatural vision and to underscore it, this was not something you had experienced before or was even theologically something acceptable to you. Because there are plenty people that would say,

like, I don't believe in that stuff. But then if it happens to you, now you have a problem because it just happened to you and you've got to figure out, what do I do with this? I know I'm not insane. I know I didn't invent this. So when you're in that room praying

and this vision happens, happens to you. I just want to think what what did you what did you think? I mean it's because obviously you're conscious but this thing happens and you're watching this thing. It's hard. It's actually very hard to explain to people. How you have a big wake. I'm in this room and I'm seeing a scroll come down in front of me with writing on it. I can't and there have been times Eric to be honest with you where I didn't even tell the story because it seems to some people so incredulous. But the proof is in the pudding. So here I am. I'm a 24-year-old kid. I have this vision and I pray, I study the scriptures, I pray more, I'm begging God to give me strength. And I start by standing in front of an

abortion clinic by myself, not a clue what I'm doing. All I know is that I'm supposed to do something. And so as time went on, you know, the passage in the New Testament, Jesus healed the blind man's eyes and he said, what do you see? And he said, I see men like trees walking. So sometimes revelation comes to us in a sequence. It doesn't happen just instantaneously. Right. You don't get everything all at once. Exactly. So I saw what I was supposed to do. And in 1991, when I was on Phil Donahue with in a room of 5,000 people in Wichita, huge, one of his biggest shows ever. You know, Faye Waddleton from Planned Parenthood and me. Oh my God. Let's wait, wait, wait. Well, this is, we're getting into more deep waters.

Ladies and gentlemen, let's hit pause. We'll be right back talking to Randall Terry. Folks, welcome back. I'm talking to Randall Terry. Randall, there's a lot here. And I want to give you time to tell the story. But you just told me you have a brand new book out. The title is, the title is divine correction, how God gets the nation's attention.

Now, you know, we've been talking about the shedding of innocent blood. So I started my study in the scriptures about. divine correction, God's chastening, a nation reaping, what it sows, judgment, whatever you want to call it. I started this study over 40 years ago. I have been working on this particular book for three years, and it is a comprehensive study of the way God corrects a nation, how God gets a nation's attention. It's a comprehensive study from Genesis to Revelation. And as far as I know, and I've been studying this for a long time, it's the most comprehensive book. in the English language on this topic to have been written in a hundred years.

I mean, no one is doing this. And it's not dated. So I wrote it, because I'm a Bible College graduate, I love theology, I wrote it for people who teach the scriptures for pastors, priests, evangelists, so that they could have a resource to look at the various ways that God delineates in the scriptures, how he chasens the nation. and why he chases the nation and and what we have to do on our end to get God to show mercy in the midst of judgment. Okay. And that's the larger subject, folks, of this conversation with Randall and Terry. The book is divine correction, how God gets the nation's attention.

But Randall, let's go back just so people understand your story because I want to get to all of this. But so you're saying that God gives you this vision in 1983 and a bona fide vision in the vision. You see yourself on the Phil Donahue show. And a number of years later, that comes to pass. Yes. But I don't want to skip ahead to that. I mean, you can say a little bit about that, but I want to go back. I want to follow the track.

Well, the point was is that the proof of a vision is if it really comes to pass. And it came to pass. I led the largest civil disobedience movement in American history. We had thousands and thousands, tens of thousands of people that gathered around abortion clinics. And, you know, I was young and just trying to do what God wanted me to do. That was, the Lord showed me like the prophet Elijah to play to an audience of one. What mattered was, did I do and did I say what God wanted me to do and say in any given situation? And as I tried to remain faithful to that paradigm, if you will, God kept opening doors.

And, you know, I would be on these TV shows. And, you know, I started, but like I said, well, you know, I'm jumping ahead now. But back in 84, in the spring of 84, I started in front of an abortion clinic. And then a few Christians joined me. And then a few more. And it just steadily grew. And I did my first act of civil disobedience in January of 86 with seven people, me and six others. We went into an abortion clinic with big chains and we chained ourselves to the equipment.

And we got it on videotape and it was all very exciting. You know, at that point I'm 26 years old. I'm full of fire and passion and just being faithful in the literal things. And then moment by moment, event by event, God gave me. favor and God gave me authority to speak into the hearts of men and women. And people literally came from their pews, many of them doing nothing and saying, God, I repent from what I have failed to do. I repent that I did not do more to stop the shedding of blood. And they would come from their pew right into the streets and oftentimes right into jail. Go directly to jail. Do not pass go.

we had literally hundreds of preachers and priests with us in jail. So we were having these massive prayer meetings singing, carrying on. It was like a spiritual retreat. I would tell people, we're going to go have church on the doorstep of hell, the abortion clinic. And so, you know, at first there was 200 of us. Our first big event was in fall of 87, Cherry Hill, New Jersey. And we called it our test run. And we had 300 people come from around the country to sit in front of an abortion clinic.

They arrested 230 of us, took them 11 hours. And then the chief of police came to me and begged me, said, please, Mr. Terry, please, just the rest of you go home. We're tired. The abortion clinic is not going to open. Please. I said, okay. So 70 of us got up and walked away. 230 were arrested.

Of course, they knew who I was. so I got my summons and I went to jail for that one. But that was the beginning. And then Pat Robertson, the 700 Club, they had us on because of that event. And then that led to New York City in May of 88, right at the time when you were coming to the Lord. And that went really well. And that led to Philadelphia during July 4th weekend in 88. And then this is really funny.

I'm on Crossfire with Pat Robertson. I mean, Pap Buchanan on CNN. And they say to me, what's next? This is July 6th. And I said, I made a snap decision. I said, we're going to the Democrat convention in Atlanta. Now, my staff was watching, and they looked at each other and said, what? Holy crap.

So we had 13 days, 13 days to prepare to go to Atlanta. No cell phones. No email. So we're now scrambling, sending out letters, calling people saying, hey, John us in Atlanta, join us in Atlanta. We want to go when the Democratic Convention is there. So we go, 137 of us get to Atlanta. And on day one of the convention, when Dukakis was the nominee, we go and we get arrested in front of an abortion clinic. We do a blockade. We do a rescue, that's what we call them, was a rescue. And we all give the name, baby Jane Doe for the women, baby John Doe for the men.

And I said, we're going to identify with these babies. We're not going to give our name because they die without a name. And I said, and furthermore, they'll keep us in jail for the three days that the convention is in progress. So we're going to be in jail while the Democrats are having their convention and we're going to get media coverage. And we're going to say, hey, we need to stay babies. The Democrat Party is supporting the murder of children.

So it worked. We were sitting in jail. And then the attorney for Doe versus Bolton, the Roe versus Wade companion case, the attorney for Doe versus Bolton gets involved and uses her political cloud in Atlanta to say, you need to keep these people in jail until they give us their names. Hold on. Hold on. We got a lot more ground to cover folks. Please write these things down. Operation Rescue. My goodness. We'll be right back talking to Randall Terry. like a crown.

It causes child Jesus. Folks, welcome back. Just to conclude this portion of my conversation with Randall Terry, I want us to mention the documentary that you are making now about everything we're talking about. It's called Dragon Slayers. And I would love people to support this film. Dragon Slayers.com.

No, let me, let me say, so go to randletary.com, right on the front page, R-A-N-D-A-L-L-T-E-R-R-R-R-Y. Randletary.com. If you click on the thing that's right on the front page, it's a five-minute promotional piece opened by Oprah Winfrey, and it'll take you to give send go, which is one of the crowdfunding places. So we, Eric, we're going to do a serial documentary. We've been talking to a lot of filmmakers about this, people are drooling because the content is so rich and we have hundreds of hours of footage. I hired camera crews back in the day to follow us. So we have pristine footage that's 35 years old and we're making a killer documentary, but it's going to be a serial documentary. So it'll be 10 episodes and I know that it sounds expensive. You're in the media world.

You know how much it is. But to do a good 30-minute cereal, you know, 30, 30, 30, 30, 30, you're at about 90 to $100,000 per episode. That's how much it takes. Right. And that's a cheap one. At least, yeah. Yeah. So we need to get the money to do the first one, which is going to be on Atlanta.

They called it the Siege of Atlanta. That is where Operation Rescue exploded internationally. And you were just talking that story a moment ago. this was in the summer of 88. So first of all, we want to send people to randletary.com. And if they go there, if they give a contribution, when they go to the thing, I'll send them my book, Divine Correction, as a thank you. Okay.

Randalletary.com, this is the action point, ladies and gentlemen. I will continue my conversation with Randall Terry. But the action point is go to randletary.com. It is vital. People learn the history of this movement and how it was. was by God's grace, Randall Terry in Operation Rescue, that led to the overturning, did you hear about it? Of Roe versus Wade.

Yes. I got to say, Eric, if I could to make this point, I know we're almost out of time, people have said to me media people that Roe would never have been overturned without Operation Rescue because we brought the social political tension that was needed.

If it was not for Operation Rescue and the Rescue Movement, America would be like England or France or Germany where abortion is entrenched. There is no political movement to end it. There's no party that's pro-life. So politicians see the light after they feel the heat. We did what the anti-child labor people did, the abolitionists did, the people against segregation. We created the social tension that was needed to get political change.

And if people don't understand that history, they're not. going to understand what to do in the future. So this series, this documentary is not just about the past, it's to inspire the future so that we can finish the battle and make it against the law to kill babies. I think that's why I want people to go to randletary.com because this is about where we are right now in the culture. We are at a moment where many people have shrunk from this kind of activism. They say, I just want to preach the gospel. I don't know. They are absolutely theologically wrong.

Many of them are just cowardly. And it's important that we understand what we're dealing with. So this ends this portion, but I want to keep talking to you, Randall. I want to go back to when the movement exploded in Atlanta in 1988 at the Democratic Convention.

For now, we'll just say, hang on folks for the rest of this, and we'll be back. Folks, we'll Welcome back. I get now to talk to somebody who understands things economic. Charles Thornegren, who's the head of legacy precious metals. Charles, welcome back. Thank you, sir. Glad to be back.

I feel like whenever we talk, we've got kind of good news and bad news, right? Or no, bad news and good news. Bad news details on the economy, very, very bad. Good news. One way people can get around that. by going to legacy PM Investments.com. And we're not kidding, folks. I set up an account there. If I could set up an account, trust me. You could set up, believe me. But what news have we gotten recently from economic leaders about the economy?

Yeah, and that's interesting. It's kind of like you were saying. It's bad news, followed by good news. And I've always likened it to say, knowing that there's a problem allows me to take action to avoid it. or minimize it. So even the bad news really isn't bad news. It's a warning.

That's the way I kind of like to look at it. It makes me feel better about having to deliver the news. Yeah. I'm giving the warning. And I think, you know, we've talked a lot about economics and what's going on and what's going on within this administration. But really, we come down to this. The recession is coming.

The latest poll by economists say that expect the recession to start by the first quarter of next year. 80% chance. There's no way you avoid a recession with the financial issues that we've had. Now, by the way, I just kind of ask, I mean, it feels like things have been so bad that we've been in a recession. How has it been not a recession? I mean, so, I mean, I guess it's dramatically worse. We're not making this up.

This is what, you know, the head of the Bank of America has said this. So these are people that are maybe not on the same page as we are ideologically, spiritually, whatever. but they are predicting recession at the beginning of next year. So this is not us being doom and gloomers. This is people that don't agree with us on many things, making this a prediction. So as bad as things are, they're saying, no, no, no, it's going to get really bad.

It's going to be a real capital R recession. Absolutely. You know, there for so long when they talked, oh, a soft landing into recession. That's not even a possibility. We have to raise interest rates again. at a time where banks are struggling. We have to.

That's what the Federal Reserve has to do. Inflation is not lightening up. It's not getting softer. Everyone talks about, oh, it's 0.01% less inflation last month. That was strictly gas prices. But we know gas prices are going back up again. We have OPEC saying, we're going to tighten. We're not going to release as much oil in.

You're not going to have that easy availability. And even if they didn't, we still have to deal with the fact that this administration released our strategic reserves. We have about 12% of our capacity in the strategic reserves. That needs to be refilled. That is what this nation counts on in case everything gets really bad. So we're going to have, at a time when gas prices are going up, the government competing with us for the oil that we need, the gas that we need for our car. They're going to be directly competing with us, and that's going to cause the price to go up even higher. So we know that has effect on corporations.

Any product that gets transferred, right? There's gasoline involved. So we're going to see that little blip of pullback disappear. And we're going to have a Fed that has no choice but to continue to race. They've said it all along. You've heard traders say, oh, maybe this is the thing that we need now. We can start to soften the rates. We're not even close, folks.

I don't say that with joy. It's the reality of it. We're not even close yet. Well, as I said, things have been bad. Everybody knows things have been bad. Prices, everything. But experts are saying, yeah, but get ready. It's going to get worse.

The only thing I think the good that comes out of it is that you have, it looks like who's ever on the Democrat side is going to have to own this. They're not going to. but I think most people realize, like, excuse me, you brought us to this, to this nightmare. The housing market is already, is also down. Is that right? Housing market higher interest rates. No one's going out and buying the bigger house because the payment's too much.

I mean, look, I remember during, you know, Jimmy Carter brought us to, what, 18% mortgage? I mean, I remember this. Like, crazy, absolutely crazy. and it took Reagan to get us out of it. In the short term, obviously, you're recommending that we buy precious metals, that we can have a safe place. I want to tell people to go to legacy p.m. Investments.com. You can set up your account.

But apart from that, I'm amazed that a lot of these folks are saying, saying like they seem to know that this is what is happening within the year, that things are going to get that bad. And you mentioned Bank of America earlier. You know, the top four banks of the United States just had writeoffs of $3.4 billion last quarter on bad debt. We have a credit crunch coming on top of all of this. All the bad news that we already know about, there's more coming.

There's a credit crunch coming. You have people defaulting on loans because this is what happens when you have. high interest rates. They can't afford to pay them. A choice has to be made. So you had a lot of these credit cards go into default. I was reading an article, and it's really weird that they're saying the next big wave, the next big wave of conventions, car repossessors.

They're saying people are going to be losing their cards because they can't afford to pay them. So we see this coming, and I would say, I urge you, if you haven't bought metals, please consider it. Talk to somebody. I think it's important. I, the website, legacy PM Investments.com, legacy PM Investments.com. I want to end on another note. Gold is at an all-time high or near an all-time high. Is that right? We are near an all-time high. And normally that would be cause for concern for me. But the last time we set this high, the nation only had $600 billion. worth of debt. So when you look at gold, that's your counterbalance from $600 billion to depending on

who you believe, $9 trillion. Well, I mean, I got to say, you know, when people are talking about going to digital currency, Bitcoin, all this stuff makes me so nervous. Folks, check out legacy pm. Investments.com. Charles Thorngren, once again, thank you so much. That's my pleasure as always. Thanks for having us.