The Eric Metaxas Show - The Moral Responsibility of Truth in an Age of Holocaust Denial

Episode Date: September 11, 2025

Eric Metaxas sits down with Larry Taunton to confront the troubling rise of Holocaust revisionism and the platforming of anti-Semitic voices in today’s media. Together, they examine the moral responsibility Christian hosts bear when engaging controversial guests, stressing the importance of pointing audiences toward truth rather than relativism. From Stalin’s brutality to modern-day attacks on Israel, they argue that history must be faced honestly if freedom and faith are to endure.

Welcome to the Eric Mattaxas show. It's a nutritious smoothie of creamy, fresh yogurt, vanilla protein powder, and a mushy banana. For your mind? Drink it all down. It's nummy. I wub, vanilla. Here comes Eric Metaxus. Hey there, folks.

Welcome to the program. I call it the Eric Mataxis show, because that's actually the name of the show. My name legally is Eric Mataxis. and I get to talk to all kinds of interesting people, many of whom at this point are friends. For example, Larry Taunton, welcome back. How's going, brother? A lot going on.

So I always say to my guests, like, where do you want to start? You actually, you just mentioned something. You know, everywhere I go, I'm, I try to puzzle things out to try to figure what's really going on. And Candice Owens is, she has said enough things that I have heard her say that make me no longer open to the idea that this is nuanced. In other words, a lot of times people say stuff and I think they have a point. They're making some good points, but I disagree with this. I disagree with this. She goes so full out against Israel that I'm astonished. Tucker Carlson has, to use an ugly verb, platformed some people like this historian Cooper.

And you've talked about this on the program. I mean, look, you know, even when people are wrong about a lot of stuff, there's some truth there. There's some things worth, you know, exploring. You're someone that I turn to for help on this. So what is your latest on any of this stuff? Well, here's one of the places that I would start, Eric. I know you and I know obviously the way your show functions. You're kind enough to have me on plenty.

I as a show host, we've never discussed this before. So anybody listening to us will know this is never come up before. But I'm pretty sure I know what your philosophy is as it relates to this sort of thing. Tucker Carlson continues to platform people who are, who are anti-Semitic, who are seeking to undermine the Holocaust narrative, who like saying things like, you know, maybe Hillary wasn't so bad, that Churchill was the chief villain of World War II. That's a direct quotation, sort of framing the United States as maybe the villain in World War II, along with Britain. and when I respond to those kinds of things, you know, on my own show, what you often get back in response is, hey, Larry, they're just, they're just asking questions. And my response is to say, so is Satan, you know, in the Garden of Eden. Did he actually tell you you shouldn't eat of,

you know, of that tree? And what I'm getting at here as it regards a show is that, and again, I'm guessing as to how you think about this, but I think I have a pretty good idea. I think that it's incumbent on a show host, particularly those of us who are Christians, that there's a moral responsibility that rests with us in doing interviews or our commentary, that we're trying to point people towards truth. And do I have a problem, you know, platforming a Holocaust denier or a fashion, or a Nazi or a communist, I do not, provided that the show host is savvy enough to recognize that they are that and to point it out to their audience.

So for that reason, you know, I would host, not because he's a communist or a fascist or an anti-Semite, but guys like a Dawkins or, you know, a virulent atheist or Muslims or whatever, because I want to give that content, you know, to the audience. But I never just go into that and go, well, I'm just, I'm just, I'm just, asking questions when the reality is I'm actually trying with my questions to push a particular narrative and to undermine a historical truth. Don't you agree with me that a show hosts, that you have a moral responsibility? Because at the end of day, aren't you kind of teaching? Well, of course. I mean, there's no doubt about it. And it's tricky. I mean, it is tricky

because there's, we're living in kind of crazy times where a lot of things that we all knew suddenly aren't true and we have to recalibrate and repent and say, you know, I used to think George W. Bush was a good president. And from what I know now, no, he was going along with this globalist order. He was not really pushing back against evil. He didn't want the trouble, it seems. And it's embarrassing, but to try to get it right, to try to keep going and to try to say, okay, I got this right, I got that wrong. And right now, I mean, look, I have often had questions about World War II because even though I wrote a book on Dietrich Bonhofer, even though my mother and my family were alive in Germany during the time of the Nazis, and I've always thought ill of the Nazis,

and I've always known the Holocaust to be true and horrible, whatever. I've always had that question, wait a minute, so then we had to make a deal with Stalin. Like, wow, that's pretty creepy because Stalin is certainly as evil as Hitler, and I don't understand that. But I've never gotten much farther than that. And I know that Tucker Carlson is asking questions along these lines. And so part of me says, okay, that's a lot of me. He says, okay, that's a good thing.

But then he seems to go too far. I guess that's where you come out. Yeah. And for me, the, you know, aligning with Stalin, I don't find that problem either at all for this reason. We knew very well that Stalin was evil. Just as you pointed out, at least as much as, you know, as Adolf Hitler. But when when Hitler invaded the Soviet Union, June, 20th, 22nd, 1941, Operation Barbarossa, we saw eventually, I mean, the United States wasn't in the war yet,

but Britain saw, and eventually America, that this was an opportunity to kill Nazis and communists. And so the United States, Britain, they're more than happy to supply Stalin so that he could continue to fight that war and draw Hitler's attention in that direction away from Western Europe. I mean, if we don't do that, are we able to, you know, as private Ryan possible, are we able to land at D-Day because all those German divisions, you know, were over, you know, protecting a fortress Europe. I think it definitely becomes much harder and proof of the fact that we understood that Hitler, excuse me, that Stalin was evil, was the fact that we fought the Cold War. I mean, the goal was, I know that there are a lot of people who will say, well, we should have invaded, you know, Patton wanted to invade.

I'm like, do you not understand the American people were war-weary? They wanted their boys home. They were not going to tolerate another war. And you're also talking to war where millions, millions, potentially millions of Americans, would have died. What was deemed to be at the time, the less bloody route was to fight a Cold War, containment. You know, as George Kennan, you know, called it. Let's just contain it.

Let's strangle it. And we won. You know, I was just standing at the very spot where Reagan said, and, you know, behind the Brandenburg gate, Mr. Gorbachev, open these gates. Mr. Gorbachev tear down this wall. Within two years, that wall was down. You know, so we did win. We did win that Cold War. We didn't recognize that it was evil. The problem that I have here is so many people are so ill-informed on these issues. that when someone comes along and says, well, was the Holocaust really all that bad? And you mentioned, you mentioned the attitude towards, you know, Candice Owens' attitude, and increasingly Tucker Carlson's attitude, which to me is just mind-blowing towards modern-day Israel, that really is the target. That's the goal.

Why all the sudden interest in the Holocaust? Well, the sudden interest has everything to do with the fact that they want to undermine what they see as the moral authority of the modern state of Israel to exist. And that's rooted in the Holocaust. But what I would want to say to Candace Owens is, look, the Holocaust happened. I mean, it's a fact. I did research on the Holocaust. I've interviewed a gazillion Holocaust survivors. There's a saying, history gives one weapon to truth, which it denies to the lie. Lies have many versions. truth has only one. But Candace, you don't have to deny the Holocaust to question the policies of modern day Israel. Actually, we're going to a break, folks. This is obviously important. So you're not going

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Now don't forget to use promo code Eric to grab your standard My Pillow for only 1798 only while supplies last. Welcome back talking to my friend Larry Taunton. Okay, Larry, you're making an important point. I am always baffled when people kind of ask questions of the Holocaust because I think, what do you say? I mean, it really would be like if all your children are murdered, but one of them ends up surviving. And somebody says, come on, like, they weren't all murdered. One of them lived. You know, he'd be like, excuse me, his children were murdered. Can you have some perspective here, what we're discussing? What happened in the Holocaust is so sick and so evil that

there's something deeply wrong with thinking that, you know, we're talking about, you know, like accounting or something. We're talking about human lives destroyed, cruelly innocent lives taken in the millions. And so when people even get into that, I'm fascinated. And it's the same thing with, you know, the October 7th, you know, in 2023. Like, do you realize what happened there? like have some perspective. If you want to criticize,

at least have some perspective. And it seems to me that people like Candace someone, they lose that perspective. I don't know how that can be, but at least that's my take on it. Well, and she'll listen. She's become tight with platformed, Andrew Tate,

Andrew Tate, who is a misogynist, a Muslim, you know, pig. She's, I mean, if you're a, if you're a serious, Muslim, a real Muslim, not just, you know, the fussy Western types that don't engage their, quote-unquote, holy writings or the life of Muhammad, the Hatith. You are by definition an anti-Semite. You have to be if you are a serious Muslim. And the point is, she and Tucker Carlson, along with others, there's a theme here that isn't just about asking questions. It's about

platforming people. I mean, Daryl Cooper, the pseudo-historian, he discused. describes himself as a non-racist fascist is what he says. Now, fascism, again, by definition, is racist. But all that aside, this is what he's saying. And Tucker Carlson continues platform. The point is, the sudden interest in the Holocaust isn't because they're like, wow, this was such an important event topic of the 20th century. We should really address it and make sure modern audiences know about it. It has absolutely everything to do with Gaza. It has absolutely everything to do with Israel. And I'm not saying that Israel's beyond being questioned. I'm not saying that at all. But if I question Israeli policy, I don't feel the need to deny the Holocaust in order to do it. You see what I'm

getting at here. And one of the things that Candace Owens and others keep raising in this is they keep saying, well, there was a genocide of all these Christians post-World War II. And that's been hidden in history. No one knows about it. And I'm saying, no, Candace, that was called Stalinism. It was called Stalinism. People with educations knew about Stalinism. They're aware of what happened post-war.

Now, were they killed because they're Christians? In some cases, they were. In many cases, it was just pure retribution. You know, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, Russians decided post-war. I mean, Stalin had decided, we're going to let 100,000 people in Berlin starve to death before we began feeding them. And I mean, and I'm in no way suggesting that that Stalin was just in doing it. I'm saying that we should understand World War II of the roughly 50 to 55 million people who died in World War II after we're Russian. The Russians lost more people

at Stalingrad alone that we lost in the entire war. They lost more people at the siege of Leningrad, modern-day St. Petersburg, than we lost in the whole war alone. And the extermination squads that came in to Eastern Europe and eventually into Russia, the Einzatz group and the SS following the Vermacht, the Russians just repeated the same to the Eastern Europe. and to German people. I've been on your show talking about Richard Warbrand, you know, who talked about this. He lived under first the fascists and then the communists. So no, Candace, these things have been

talked about for a very long time. Has the Holocaust maybe gotten a little better publicity and media? Well, sure. And that's because you have, you know, directors like Stephen Spielberg. And if I'm Steven Spielberg, I mean, it's not just that. I don't think, I honestly don't think the two can be compared. In other words, the reason the Jews were killed by the Nazis was a simple hatred of the Jews.

The Nazis said, we just want to kill Jews. What Stalin did, it's not... It's more indiscriminate. It's more indiscriminate. It's not like he said, let's just kill all the Christians, but

I guess the larger point is to pretend And it's kind of like saying, oh, your family was all killed. Shut up. My family was killed. Why do we have to shut up? Why can't we talk about both? It's not a competition who suffered more.

And so it's really unseemly. It's tacky. It's disgusting to me that somebody says, well, why are we always talking about the Jews who were killed? What about the Christians? And you think, well, okay, let's talk about the Christians who were killed. But why would we talk less about the Jews who? who were killed. This is equally horrific if anybody's killed. And it's also totalitarian anti-god philosophy.

100%. Anyway, yeah. Anyway, this has been something that's sort of occupied my time. And I was just in Germany. You and I were chatting off air about that. And part of the reason I went there, I'm sure you've been to a number of the concentration camps. I was there, went north west of Berlin, about an hour to Saxonhausen. And I'd already been to Mouthhausen, Auschwitz, at least twice, maybe three times. Dachau, I've been there multiple times, Bukenval, Mitala, Dora. I've been to a bunch of the concentration camps. But I decided I would go to Saxonhausen and the horrors of that particular camp and all

that took place there. And then the Soviets, post-war, guess what they did? They converted it into a Soviet camp. So between 1945 and 50, 51, they killed a lot more people there. And it's just astonishing to me the way that we are now into, you know, when the concentration camps were initially uncovered, we knew about the thousands being killed. We didn't know about the millions. And Eisenhower, it was Patton, who, I think it was his third army, who informed Eisenhower, Ike, you've got to see this. And so they went and they saw it puked their guts out, you know, of what they'd seen. And Eisenhower said, make every village, and I want every soldier to go through it and to see it,

because the time will come, well, people will deny it. I mean, yeah. It's unbelievable. I think what needs to be said, because murder is obviously wrong. But the way the Nazis did it, the systematic, you know, it's one thing to kill people. It's another thing to plan carefully how to kill millions of women and children and old people. there's something more diabolical because of that, because it was planned in that way.

And I always say that I find it shocking and unseemly, it's at least an extremely bad taste to question the Holocaust or to act as though somehow it's not as bad as, you know, all those Jews are saying. I don't get that. I'm just fascinated by that. You know, it really, it's like, it's like if you or I had our family members killed

and they would say, I think Eric, he just goes on too much about it. It's like you're not a position to make that call because you haven't had your family killed, you know? So it's, that's what I find. It's bizarre to me that people don't have the good taste,

at least, to understand I should be, I should tread carefully here. Very well said. know, it's kind of like, you know, I find often with pain, you know, the issue of pain, there are people who want to compete about that, like mine is worse than yours. Or sometimes I go in the other direction and say mine is, you know, really nothing compared to yours. And I say, look, this is not a competition you want to win. This is not a competition you want to win.

And I don't see the need. You know, Candace, if you want to bring attention to Stalinism, please do. please do but why do you feel the need to go after the holocaust in order to talk you know to talk to it I don't I don't I mean I say I don't I know exactly why she's doing it and it's because she wants to undermine modern day Israel's moral authority to exist and to have a home state which was based on and birthed out of you know European guilt after World War II to say yes we will create, assist in the creation of a home state for the Jewish people because of the horrors of the Holocaust and what happened to you. Yeah, and that's what I don't get either. When we come back, we will explore these and other questions talking to Larry Taunton.

Welcome back, folks. Every day I talk to my mother, who's 91, and who grew up in Germany under the Nazis. it then was taken over by the Soviets. So she grew up in the eastern part of Germany where the Soviet Union took over. And so my parents raised me not just to be an enemy of the Nazis, but even more to be an enemy of the communists. And it is amazing that East Germany was taken over by the Soviets. Thank God, eventually,

in my lifetime in 1991, that all changed. So, Larry, you were there recently in Berlin. Yes, and Eric, something you just said, I want to follow up on it. Maybe we discussed this off air, but is your mom real lucid? She's still pretty sharp. Well, certainly with this kind of stuff, yeah. Have you thought about recording an interview with her? You can edit out any stuff where, you know, I mean, these things need to be

remembered and they're they're so important and we're losing these kinds of eyewitnesses of these things. When I was just in Berlin, I love to chat with your mother, you know, over coffee sometime. And I mean that sincerely. I'd love to hear her stories and what she has to say because we're losing them. And interestingly enough, my own mother, my mother suffered a stroke and she now lives with us. You've met my mother a year ago this month. She had a stroke and it wasn't looking at. too good there for a while, but now she's doing, she's doing pretty well. And I have been trying, been chatting with her, kind of like you say about your own mother. My mother is 83. And I, when I was just in Berlin, you know, I said to her, I said, you know, mom, you and dad lived there during a pretty

important time. I mean, have you ever thought about recording some of those memories? She goes, oh, that stuff wasn't very interesting. And I said, well, weren't you there when the Berlin wall went up. She goes, oh, yeah. She said, that was really intense. And I said, weren't you there during the Cuban Missile Crisis? She goes, oh, gosh, we thought World War III was coming. And I said, weren't you there when Kennedy was assassinated? She said, I remember vividly, your father telling me, Judy, my country does not have me here for you. And in the event of war, you will be evacuated and you do everything. I said, Mom, that stuff actually sounds kind of interesting. You know, maybe. Maybe. It's worth recording some of that stuff because it'll be lost.

When we lose you, we will lose those stories and what that was like. And when I was just in Berlin, I took a tour with a taxi driver. I often negotiate with taxi drivers because they're not coached to give you any kind of particular narrative. You know how that is. And this guy was the same age as my mom and, well, a little bit younger. And he was born during World War II. and his first memory was of the Berlin air left in 1948 when the United States and Britain,

Stalin was trying to strangle, starve Berlin, and the United States chiefly fed the city from the air. You know, planes landing every two minutes. It did it for a year. So the Stalin eventually was like, okay, there's no point doing this. They could feed the whole city, you know, with planes. And he was talking about that. And then he was talking about his father who fought on the eastern front and against the Russians

and then was eventually captured by the Americans. And then he started talking about when the wall went up. He was there at checkpoint Charlie. And then he was on the wall in November of 1989 when the wall came down. And he was chipping away with everybody else. And I was like, man, these are just incredible stories. And Eric, his historical take was so judicious, so thoughtful, so accurate. and then he says Trump is a fascist.

I thought, you know, you're probably used to having people on your taxi from New York or something. I don't know. I think he thought he was earning, you know, points with me. I said nothing. He said it again. I still said nothing because I wanted to enjoy chatting with him. And the third time he called Trump a fascist. I decided I'm going to have to go after this.

So I turned to him politely and I said, name for me. I said, look, you're a guy who was born in fascist Germany. If you aren't young enough to remember it, you're certainly old enough to remember the stories. How is it that a guy like you lived under fascism and under communism can genuinely be deceived into thinking Trump as a fascist? Name for me one thing where Donald Trump is a fascist. One thing. Is he the one who's doing Joseph Mengelah-like experimentation on adolescence, moving their sexual organs? Is he the one doing that? Anyway, he eventually didn't answer that,

and I think he, I think he was embarrassed because I think he realized I misjudged him. I thought I was going to up my tip. And, but it's fascinating to me, Eric, because post-war, the communist's genius marketing, they refashioned communism as the ideological opposite of Nazism, a fascism, and it isn't. It's the twin bastard child of the same evil father. And people don't understand that. And I find myself these days attacking terms like woke right. No such thing. It's an oxymoron. If you're woke, you're on the left. Fascism is on the left. Communism is on the left. And we have to fight these things. We're going to go to a break. There's so much.

much. My goodness, Larry, it's just great to have you on. And we do need to remember our history. It's just so fascinating. It's so easy to say stuff until you talk to people who were there. We'll be right back. Welcome back talking to Larry Taunton. Larry, we always talk about history, but let's talk about where we are right now. What is your sense of where we are in the country with what Trump has been doing? Are you hopeful about where we are with draining the swamp? etc. Absolutely. We're winning. I think that that conservatives, I don't know if I told you this, Eric, but I've been off of social media for more than a month now. Now, I have staff members who are pretending to be me, and it's hilarious when I see their posts interacting with people. And I go,

I would never say that. Or sometimes I go, well, you know, that's pretty good. I might have said that. But I've been off of it for a while. And I have because it's such a drain in time. and I feel that it's affected my writing. It's affected my research in negative ways. And it also kind of gets me, you know, amped up, you know, because you see something and it just so outrages you that, you're, you're, you're, it's, it's kind of the tyranny of the urge. So I've kind of stayed away from that. But the point I'm making is that I think that social media has been fairly successful, along with, you know, mainstream media has been fairly successful. has been fairly successful in convincing conservatives that nothing has improved.

And I'm thinking, on the contrary, Trump has come in with a stick and gone after every Hornet's nest. And he's doing it systematically, closing the borders. Did you not, I don't want to cheer when people get killed as a rule. I did when Osama bin Laden was killed, the hanging of Saddam Hussein, had I been alive, Hitler killing himself. when I saw that drone hit that boat full of those cartel members, I want to make that like my screensaver. I mean, we need more of that. I loved what Vance said when he said that using our military to defend our borders and to defend against, I'm paraphrasing, but to defend against, you know, the invasion of cartels is the best use of our military. not in Ukraine, not over there, not in some godforsaken foreign war where we have nefarious motivations defending a corrupt country from an invasion from another corrupt country.

So, yeah, I think we're winning. I love what Trump is doing. I would really like to get rid of the Fed chair so that we could see interest rates begin to come down. But I told us. You think we could take them out with a missile? Is that what you're saying, Larry? Is that what you're saying? that's the best use of our military.

Did you say that on this program? I think you said that. You are going to get yourself. You've already been kicked off of YouTube. Now you're going to be kicked off a rumble. But I want to see these things happen. And I think that Trump has been clever. I think he's been courageous.

And I think we need to pray for him because of a total friend yesterday. There is going to be another or multiple assassination attempts on Trump, perhaps even fans too. It's interesting. I mean, listen, it is fascinating when you talk about the Fed chair. It seems like there are people who are the enemies of this president, and so they'll do whatever they can. To hurt America.

To hurt America, which is bizarre. So I think Powell will, he'll go away, obviously. I don't think we should assassinate him. But I got to tell you, it seems like these people, are they're doing what they can, you know, to kind of hurt Trump, feeling that they're doing the right thing, obviously, but they're not. But I am hopeful that over time, these folks are moving away. I don't know how that works. I don't know if the president can fire him. But there are lots of people in government who I think they're firing themselves. They're leaving. But I do think that one of the things that's delightful is to watch this president use the power that he has to fire people and, you know, to see RFK Jr. firing people.

It's there's, there's something wonderful about it. I think because in our lifetimes, very few politicians have behaved like this. They've kind of acted like, well, I don't want to be mean, you know, and you think you're not being mean. You're being a good steward of the power that the people, we the people have given you to do what is right for we the people. It's not about that person's job. It's about we the people. And so it is dramatic to watch Trump doing all that he's doing. I think that the left is, they're staggered.

They don't know what to make of it. They're fomfering for words. Yeah, and for that reason, they're, latching onto anything they can in the hopes that it will stick where Trump is concerned. But to me, listen, you know, you're talking about George W.B. Bush. I think that at least since Eisenhower, Eisenhower spoke of the military industrial complex and as really a massive, well-funded special interest group. But I think at least since that time, presidents have come in knowing Democrat and Republicans, knowing that there were certain things they shouldn't

look into if they wanted to remain president. And I'm reminded of a line. You ever seen the old what's her name, Marlena Dietrich, Spencer Tracy movie, Judgment at Nuremberg? Yes. Great, great film. I would make everyone watch it if I could because talk about something that deals with absolute truth in the Holocaust. It's a genius film. I used to show it to my students. But there's a line in it where Spencer Tracy is talking about himself being a small town judge in Maine. And he's chatting with Marlena Dietrich, and he said, look, I knew when I became judge, there were certain people in town I should not cross if I wanted to remain judge. But now you're asking me to turn the other way at the Holocaust.

And the point being here, I think there's been, there's been successive, presidents who decided discretion was the better part of valor and they stayed out of it. And Trump decided, I think Trump decided, I'm going after all of them, even at the potential cost of my own life. I am going after all of them. And people are saying, well, why isn't he going after Nancy Pelosi or Adam Schiff or Chuck Schumer? It's coming. He's building the cases. That takes time for the Justice Department to do that. As my son, who's an attorney, likes to point out to me, dad, there's a difference between knowing someone's corrupt and proving it in a court of law. And they are building their cases and they're moving in that direction. That's why you see

absolute panic on the Democrat side. So to come back to your original question, how do I think it's going? I think we are winning. Well, I agree with you. We're going to go to a break, but I agree with you and that we are in a war, folks. This is real. And I hope, if you don't hear it anyplace else, let me say the power of prayer. Pray, pray, pray every day for this nation

that you don't deserve to live in, but that you're blessed to live in. Pray for the nation, pray for the president, pray for God's purposes in our history right now. We'll be right back. Welcome back talking to Larry Taunton. Okay, Larry, you say that you think that the president is in.

fact or that his team, Pam Bondi, Cash Patel, Dan Bonito, that they're building these cases, because there are a lot of voices out there who say, you know, how we haven't had any arrests yet, we haven't had any arrests yet. And so do you believe, as I'm inclined to, that this is not because of inaction, this is because of prudence in how one does these things? Yeah, I mean, listen, he hasn't even, he hasn't been in office for a year. year. And building these cases takes time. I mean, it takes time. It also takes time for Trump to get his own people in place. You know, there's a saying, as you know, I'm a big, I'm a big football fan. And there's a kind of truism in football that it takes a coach a couple of years to get his system in

place, to get his own personnel in place. You can't judge him on his first year because it takes him a little while. how much more for a president of the United States, the entire government bureaucracy had been weaponized against him. There were efforts to fortify it to endure a Trump presidency to survive him. And that's what we mean by Deep State. When we're talking to Deep State, we're not talking some, you know, some theoretical, you know, a little cabal of people in a bunker and on the moon. we're talking about a permanent, deeply embedded bureaucracy that seeks to protect itself against agendas that are not in line with their own. And Trump is slowly getting his people in place. He's slowly rooting those people out. I mean, you mentioned the CDC. You saw those people going on, you know, kind of a strike as if the American people were going to be. terribly upset by that. That's a result of Trump's moves in those directions. I was reading,

I just did an episode on the new co-chairman of the World Economic Forum, which is interesting, who they are, who they've just put in place. And one of them is Larry Fink, the head of BlackRock. And, I mean, I mean, think about this. That episode just dropped today. Ideas have consequences on YouTube and on X. And the other one is a guy about the name of Andre Hoffman. Guess who Andre Hoffman is? He is ahead of one of the largest pharmaceutical companies in the world. Now, what does that say? And I was reading last night. I couldn't sleep. I had some serious pain issues. And so I decided I would read about Andre Hoffman. I was reading an interview where he was just trashing Trump. And then it becomes clear that what he's worried about is whether

they're not Roche, I'm going to guess that's the way it's pronounced, or Roach, R-O-C-H-E, is the name of the company. They're losing loads of money since Trump became president. I mean, loads of money because of tariffs and because of the Trump approach, the appointment of JFK. I mean, these are deeply embedded, powerful people who have interests that they want to protect, and Trump is coming after them. So I love it, but pray for the man because Trump is such a genuine guy. I think that's what Americans respond to.

He's, yeah, did I do that to that woman? Yeah, sure did. I slept with her. But it was consensual. You mean, he's, you know, he's a guy who just is just sort of honest with everything he thinks and runs through his head. But something that concerns with me is that Trump is such a people guy, just getting out walking into crowds and talking with people. that man has got to be careful because there are a lot of people wanting dead. Listen, that's the end of our time together.

But Larry, thank you. And I do want to say, folks, there is no doubt. This is a spiritual war. We have to pray, pray for the nation, pray for this president. It is only by the grace of God that we will succeed in all of these things. Larry, my friend, thank you. Good to see you, buddy. Thanks for having me.

Thank you.