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You know, comparing Eric Mataxis to any other radio show host is a lot like comparing apples and, oh, I don't know.
Oranges, perhaps?
Yes, that's it.
Precisely, oranges.
Ripe, luscious, supple oranges.
Tripping with sticky sweet juice.
Another day or two, and they'll be rotten and inedible.
But today, oh, they're glorious and inviting.
Just like Eric.
And now, Orange's you glad he's here.
Hey there, folks.
Welcome to the Eric Mataxis show.
My name is Eric Mataxis.
This is the show. This is all we've got. I apologize. The good news, though, is that I get some wonderful guests on the show. I get to have conversations with them. Today, oh, yes, former Congressman Trey Gowdy, I assume you know who he is. Tray Gowdy, welcome to this program.
Thank you, Eric. It is great to see you again.
Well, I just want to say that I know you have a book out. And as somebody who writes books,
I know that when you have a book out, it's important to talk about that book if you're doing media.
So I want to talk to you about a whole bunch of things. But before, you know, we get very far,
I want people to know that you've got a book called Doesn't Hurt to Ask. I love the idea that it says,
using the power of questions to communicate, connect, and persuade. You, sir, were, before you were a
congressman, you were a state and federal prosecutor. So tell us a little bit about that because we know
you, you know, you were the guy of the Benghazi hearings and you've been on the news many, many times
talking about what's going on in current events. What persuaded you to write a book called Doesn't
hurt to ask using the power of questions, communicate, connect, and persuade.
Well, Eric, I think there's a hunger within us to be heard and to be understood.
I think the impetus behind this book was really Thanksgiving dinner, listening to people
within my family that have different political viewpoints, struggle to make their point,
struggle to be understood.
And I'll find myself taking up for the underdog, whoever is losing the conversation,
So I thought, well, I spent 20 years convincing 12 people who had not already made up their minds.
And as you know, Eric in a courtroom, you know, 10 out of 12 is great in politics.
It's unheard of.
But that's a loss in a courtroom.
You got to get all 12 beyond a reasonable doubt.
So how do I transfer those persuasive skills and then teach people how when given a chance to persuade, they don't say, I think, I feel I believe.
they use the power of questions to illustrate their point.
It's a learnable skill.
I was terrible when I started.
So if I can get okay at it, then you can get okay at it.
Well, I think we're living in such divided times that many times I decline even to get
into the conversation with somebody who differs from me, particularly politically, because I
feel that it doesn't get very far.
People are so entrenched in their positions and are often.
so wedded to things that I personally know aren't true or are half true.
But we seem to be living in times when emotion gets in the way of being able to be
open to be persuaded.
Yeah, I do not like sentences that begin, I feel.
I mean, I cannot have a conversation or debate with people's emotions.
And I do have a section in the book.
If you want to be really persuasive, you have to ask yourself, are you yourself persuadable?
Because if I were to ask you to change your position on some deeply held conviction,
but I'm not willing to look at your facts, listen to your arguments, that's not going to be a long conversation.
So, I mean, I don't want people to mistake this for me not being firmly convinced in what I believe,
but I do like to go through life saying I am one fact away from switching my mind,
but it's got to be a fact.
I mean, it's got to be an objectively true fact.
So if I'm not persuadable, I can't expect you to be persuadable.
I want us to get to a point where whoever has the best facts and presents it in the most compelling way carries the day.
It's interesting.
My latest book, which is not like Bonhofer, is called Donald and the Fake News.
It's a humor book.
But I think that we all know we're living in times that are unprecedented.
The idea that people are saying things over and over and over again that flat out aren't true,
it's hard when you begin to lose faith in basic institutions.
Like journalists might have been slanted one way or the other,
but you felt that you would count on them to give it to you straight.
And so I think a lot of people have become,
cynical and it is all the more important to do what you're talking about is to say, wait a second,
we believe in something bigger than our feelings. We believe in something called the truth and
we're supposed to care about that. Now, when you're in a court of law, people are sworn to tell the
truth and the jury is obviously in a position that they can't take lightly. So that's,
obviously different from where we are in the culture. How do you translate that situation in a courtroom
to the situation outside the courtroom? Well, you put your finger on the least persuasive thing,
which is disingenuity. So when people misrepresent facts of nothing undercut your efforts
to persuade quite like being factually wrong. And I write in the book about how to avoid
making these overtly false statements.
I mean, you've got to preface it by saying, you know,
I'm open to being persuaded that I'm wrong.
Perhaps I got this wrong.
But you talked on a broader point, Eric, which I think is fundamental.
In the courtroom, there's a referee.
There's a judge.
And a bad judge is better than no judge.
You mentioned your book, Fake News.
We need a societal referee.
And I think the media was supposed to play that role.
But, you know, curiously, because the media is so unfair to conservatives and conservative thoughts, it makes conservatives less objective about themselves.
I mean, if the other side is not being fair to me, it causes me to recalibrate my definition of fairness.
And we almost become relativist because you're not fair to me, I'm no longer going to be fair to myself or others.
we desperately need a societal referee.
And I thought that was supposed to be the media, but boy, it is not, not now.
Well, you know, speaking as a person of faith, as a Christian, I realize that I have a higher responsibility than winning.
I have responsibility to obey God.
And so when I see people who say that they're Christians or are conservatives, misrepresenting things,
I want to yell at them the most and say, listen, we can't do that.
If we really believe that what we believe is true, we should never muddy the waters by playing hard and loose with the facts.
We need to be careful.
We need to be better than that.
We need to know that we're called to a higher standard.
And I just think that's something that it needs to happen.
And speaking biblically also, there's a Jesus.
says, you know, cast ye not your pearls before swine. If somebody doesn't want to know the truth,
they just want to argue, it seems to me you can't persuade them and you're being a bad steward of
your time and energy if you try to persuade them. So part of what you're talking about has to do
with discerning with whom you're talking to. No, you're 100% correct. You cannot,
first of all, I can't win an argument. I mean, arguments are driven largely by emotion and
And so some folks said you should have titled this how to win an argument.
Well, I can't because you can't win an argument.
Your broader point about the existence of an objective truth and how the process matters,
the courtroom is about the only place I know, Eric, where you can have the right person for the right crime.
And if you don't follow the right process, whether it be Miranda or whether it be the Fourth Amendment,
the courtroom says the process is so important.
even though you have the right person for the right crime, we're going to let him or her go
because how you do things matters every bit as much as what you do.
Now contrast that with politics, where the only thing that matters is winning.
And we kind of minimize either deliberate faulthoods or intentionally misrepresenting the other side's position.
We minimize that because we've convinced ourselves that winning is the only thing that matters.
and I can't think of anything more antithetical to Christ than just winning.
Amen.
We're going to go to a break.
We'll be right back.
Folks, I'm talking to former congressman and current author, Trey Gowdy.
Hey, folks.
I'm talking to former Congressman Trey Gowdy.
He's the author of a new book called Doesn't Hurt to Ask.
Trey, we were just talking about this idea of, you know, when you're working with some clear rules,
and some fairness, it's much easier to proceed.
But when the rules themselves are fuzzy or when you have people who've thrown the rules out
the window, it can often be a waste of time.
And even scripture, Jesus says, don't cast your pearls before swine.
You need to know to whom you're talking.
You can't pretend that someone is open-minded if they're not being open-minded.
And that, to me, is a big part of the problem, which is why,
in this election, the reason that I have been publicly advocating for the president is because I really believe the system needs to be fair.
And I'm very, very worried about how dramatically and radically left the Democratic Party has done.
They're not the party of our parents.
They have just thrown in with cultural Marxists.
And I find it frightening.
And I think America needs to understand what we are facing with that.
Because cultural Marxists don't believe in God.
And they don't believe in the rules that God hands down.
And so they just believe in whatever I need to do, power, however I can get power.
Do you see something similar?
What do you see happening?
I do.
But my expectations for the Democrat Party were never that high to begin with.
So, I mean, I kind of put them in a separate category.
My real frustration over the last four years has been with the media and the way they cover Republicans versus Democrats, the way they cover issues.
Steve Bannon's indictment is front page news, but an FAAI employee who pleads guilty is buried.
And my real frustration over the last four years, we desperately need a Department of Justice and a legal system that while we may not always like it,
we always respect it.
And it's been a dreadful four years for the FBI and the Department of Justice.
And I don't think we're going to make it as a culture if we don't, if we can't agree that
the law matters, that it should be blindfolded and oblivious to your political ideation
or your race or your gender, I don't even see that anymore.
I see a mitigation of using the levers of the Department of Defense.
justice and the FBI to impact an election. I see a, I see a minimizing of that. That's what's got
me far more worried. I got to trust my citizens to reject Marxism, socialism. I got to trust
them to do it. It's these arbiters, these, these referees that have failed us that concern
to be more. Well, you're, of course, you're right. I mean, things have gotten shriller and
and more cynical in general.
I guess, you know, when you talk about the voters,
that's the funny thing to me is that if ever there were pressure on the voters to pay attention,
because we don't have the sources that we once did.
You know, if you turn on CNN, you're really getting something so dramatically slanted.
It's actually shocking.
I mean, it happened when this president got elected pretty much.
something shifted so dramatically and we're having to fight just to know what's happening,
what's not happening, because they're straight up not covering some things, as you just mentioned.
It's a scandal and it's a real inflection point in the republic.
I think they figured out how to monetize, you know, how to conflate the news with advocacy and how to monetize it.
And I do go on CNN's website from time to time.
And I am just stunned, not just to, you know, the news, Eric, is not just how you cover things.
It's what you decide to cover.
I mean, that's a lot of power.
I get to decide what is news, and then I get to decide how to kind of portray it.
You go on the CNN website or even worse, the Washington Post or the New York Times.
I mean, I was watching, I watched Tim Scott and Nikki Haley last night.
I didn't watch anything all their nose to.
But if you flip on the New York Times, they are essentially extensions of the Democrat Party.
So Republicans have a choice.
We can go get our own newspaper.
But the citizenry loses because their question is, okay, where do I go just to find the straight news, the straight facts?
I mean, how would you answer that question?
If a young person came up to you and said, Eric, where do I go to do?
Just find the facts.
Well, people have asked me that question, and it's not easy.
I think that part of what you have to do is you have to figure out whom you can trust.
There are certain voices out there.
I try to be one of those voices that are going to try their hardest to get it straight.
Now, it doesn't mean I won't come up with a conclusion,
but the point is that people would trust me that I'm not twisting things
to get that conclusion. And I think that that, you know, we used to be able to do that just by turning
on TV, assuming that those standards existed. And as you say, they don't anymore. I mean,
even the most dramatic example is the cultural Marxism that has poured onto the streets of America
in the form of Antifa and the Black Lives Matter organization who pretend to care about black lives.
And I thought, what could be more cynical than clearly not care.
about the average black in America.
You clearly don't share their values.
You are a Marxist, you're anti-family,
you're anti-everything that would lift them up.
And yet you've used this phrase.
And I think we're living at a time
where the news won't talk about this.
They conflate the two ideas
as though if you care about black lives,
you have to side with Black Lives Matter.
And I've got to tell you,
if you care about Black Lives and you better,
if you're any kind of a Christian,
you have to speak out against Black Lives Matter.
So it's become very difficult today, as you say, and you have to try to find a handful of people or a handful of places where you simply trust those voices that they're going to try to give it to you straight.
But as you're saying, it's it isn't easy.
So in a sense, the American citizen is being forced to do the work of staying free, keeping free, fighting for freedom.
it requires a little bit more work.
Maybe we don't have to pick up a gun and go to war,
but it requires something of each of us in a way that it hasn't in the last few decades.
You know, when I hear that phrase, the question I want to ask is,
where were you 20 years ago?
Where were you when I was trying to convince witnesses that saw a little girl get shot at a
birthday party to come forward and cooperate because her life mattered?
Because you know what happens.
You have a homicide.
you've got to go to court and prove it.
If you don't have witnesses that they won't cooperate,
if they won't tell you who was driving the car or what kind of car it was,
then that life is devalued because you're not going to get a conviction.
What you do is you wind up pleading it down to something
that is not reflective of the value of her life.
So if you want to prove, not say, but prove that Black Lives Matter,
then start helping us treat those lives the same way in the courtroom
room and get the exact same verdict for the death of an eight-year-old black girl as you would
someone else. So don't tell me it matters. Prove it to me and start cooperating. I don't know
where they were 20 years ago, but I didn't hear a lot of help for prosecutors and cops that
were trying to not just say Black Lives Matter, but actually prove it to Port Walton.
Well, people of faith really need to live their faith out wherever they are, not just in church,
in the justice system, in the culture.
It's very, very important.
And I have to say, I don't know how much time we have in this segment,
probably not enough to get into this.
But what I've learned in the last couple of years,
I often confess ignorance on things to say.
I had no idea that the history of the Democratic Party was a history of racism.
I never, ever knew that.
And when I learned that Lyndon Johnson, you know, he gets credit and the Democrats get credit for the Civil Rights Act.
And I think to myself, I never knew that most of the Democrats were against it.
And I never knew the cynicism of Lyndon Johnson.
It's one of the most cynical, horrible things I've ever heard that he said that, you know, when he signed it and he got no Democratic support, he says, we're going to have these N-words voting for us.
for 200 years. It was so cynical. And I thought to myself, people need to know the truth. People need to know that in fact, historically, it was the Republicans that fought against slavery. It was Republicans that were at the forefront of these things. We're not teaching this in schools. The media is not teaching it. And you know and I know, you've worked with Tim Scott. I've worked with so many black colleagues. This idea that's
that conservatives bear some kind of racism.
It's the ugliest lie in the world.
The church that I went to was so diverse and so wonderful,
and I thought, why is the media allowed to get away with putting this forward?
People need to know the truth and don't be a sucker when you vote,
because we've been suckers for 50 years.
In any case, we're going to be right back.
I'm talking to Trey Gowdy.
Gowdy about his new book and about current events.
The new book is Doesn't Hurt to Ask, using the power of questions to communicate, connect, and persuade.
So, Trey, what are you doing with your life?
You know, we liked you in the Congress.
You were a powerful voice there.
What made you decide to step out and to be doing other things these days like writing this book doesn't hurt to ask?
Well, Eric, you were kind enough to have Tim Scott and I on your show, and we are very grateful to you for that.
A couple of years ago, Timmy and I wrote.
a book together. And he's the reason, really, he's the impetus behind me writing this one. We wanted
to write another one together, but he's so optimistic and I'm so cynical, it just wasn't going
to fit. So he wrote a book about the story of his life. And he persuaded me. He said, write what
you're passionate about, how to persuade. I appreciate what you said about my time in Congress. I did not
perceive myself as being good at that job, and I did not like it. I was constantly,
thinking about what I was missing.
And I'm probably older than you are, Eric,
but about two-thirds of my life is in the rearview mirror,
and I got about one-third in the windshield,
and I got to figure out how I want to spend that one-third.
And I've been married 31 years to a school teacher.
We have two children,
my parents are still alive and in good health.
I just did not think D.C. was the best use of my time.
So I left unindicted and undefeated.
I nobody ran me off. I wasn't going to lose. I just decided I want to do something else.
Well, and what are the things you want to do? Obviously, you want to spend time with your family and your folks who, thank the Lord, are still with us.
What are the other kinds of things you want to be doing? I hope you want to stay active by being a voice in the media, because I think we need your voice.
But what are some of the things that you'd like to do?
I'm with a law firm.
I have a kind of a litigation, criminal investigation-centric practice.
I write this book, as you know, is time-consuming.
I mean, you've written more books than I've read,
so I don't know why I'm telling you that writing books is time-consuming.
It is.
I gave a lot of speeches in the pre-pandemic world,
most of which had nothing to do with politics.
It's about cultural issues,
about how to be persuasive,
about how to find something bigger than yourself
to devote your energies to.
So law speaking,
a little bit of television when they can't find a better person to go on,
is, I'm busier than I've ever been before,
and the mix suits me well.
I like having different things to look forward to.
Did you, I know recently you said that you were,
you had a confidence in the Mueller team and the way this thing would play out,
and that more recently you've reassessed that initial optimism.
Can you talk about that?
Yeah, I think they used to say this as I was wrong.
I mean, I was naive.
I actually write about it in the book.
I mean, this notion that you can have an investigation, kind of like what I was more used to,
this grand jury type, devoid of politics,
devoid of leaks, the kind of investigations that we have confidence in, that we do all the time in
the executive branch, but never happened in politics. I do think, and I've told the president,
I don't know that he agrees with me, I think if you're going to be cleared, being cleared by an
enemy is better than being cleared by a friend. Having said that, he is correct, that this put a cloud
over his first term, and it consumed his first term.
And there's no worse feeling in the world, Eric, than to be accused of something you did not do.
And in this case, make no mistake, it was treason, to be accused of treason, a crime for which you can be
put to death, and have essentially lost part of your first term dealing with this.
And then after you are exonerated, they immediately moved to impeachment.
to take what's left of your first term, I get his frustration.
I wish you would phrase it differently sometimes, which I've also shared with him, but I do,
it is the worst feeling in the world to be accused of something you did not do.
And so, yes, I was naive to think that executive branch investigations could survive in the current political environment.
Well, I'm glad you're forthright about that. I'm glad you write about it in the book because people need to know that good people can make mistakes. The difference between a really good person is that they admit it and they move on in a different way. I have to say the idea that this president was being accused over and over and over of colluding with Russia, of being a puppet of Putin's or whatever, is so preposterous that if you made it,
up, people wouldn't believe it. It sounds like a joke. But they did it with straight faces. My way of
dealing with this kind of insanity is through humor. And I mentioned to you, the reason I have the
Donald, the caveman behind me, I guess you can see it, is that I've written a book making fun of it.
It's called Donald and the fake news. And in the book, basically I say that somebody spotted him
in a deli. This is Donald the caveman. Spotted him in a deli ordering a Rubin sandwich.
It has Russian dressing on it.
He asked for extra Russian dressing.
And they said, aha, we got him.
He's working for a Russian salad dressing company.
He's just getting rich off of it.
Don't believe anything.
He says, that's his whole goal in life.
And there's a big investigation, and they don't come up with any evidence.
But I've got to make fun of these things because I think your average American just looks at it and says,
this is like a kind of a madness, like the sales.
and witch trials, it's just hard for us to process it.
We'll be right back, folks.
Final segment with Trey Gowdy, don't go away.
Hey there, folks, welcome back.
I'm talking to former Congressman Trey Gowdy.
He is currently the author of a brand-new
book called Doesn't Hurt to Ask.
Trey, since you say it doesn't hurt to ask, let me ask you, what do you see happening in this
election that's coming up?
I think it is obviously at least the most important election since 1860.
What do you think is likely to happen because you've been part of that world between now
and that election?
I think it's going to continue to tighten.
Eric, I think, you know, you like facts, I like facts.
Republicans have lost six out of the last seven popular votes for president.
And it is true that you don't need to win the popular vote to govern.
I do think it is helpful to have the popular and the electoral vote to fully lead,
to lead in the kind of transformational way that our country needs.
So I think it's going to tighten.
We need to do better, I think, among women voters, among college-educated voters,
I'm really curious to see the theme that comes out of the convention and whether it's a base-centric theme or whether it is, you know, more politically directed towards folks that may be open to changing their mind.
The house is in play.
I know Kevin McCarthy, who's one of my dearest friends, is working his tail off.
That's a heavy lift to flip the house.
The Senate's also in play.
So, I mean, what's in play is everything.
Because if the Senate's in play and the White House is in play, then the Supreme Court.
Supreme Court, the judiciary's in play and foreign policies in play. I know what we say it every
four years. This is the most consequential election of our lifetime. But if you like contrast and
politics is about contrast, then supporting the police, identifying those that don't meet
our expectations and getting rid of them, that's one thing. Targeting police officers with
lasers, the anarchy and the lawlessness that you see, that some leaders of cities are having
a really tough time condemning, that's on the ballot. Yeah, COVID's on the ballot, that so is whether or not
we're going to be a system of laws equally applied and whether we're going to kind of equivocate
on violence towards law enforcement. That's on the ballot, too. Well, I really think that this
is finally the time that black America wakes up to the idea that the Democrats have had
control of these big cities for more than 50 years and have failed dramatically. And when I say
dramatically, I mean, families have suffered. Communities have been torn apart by these policies.
And you know, you don't have to be angry to say, I'm not going to vote for that, which has,
has harmed me and my people. And I do think that that is happening. We do have, as you say,
such a stark choice that it's bizarre. I mean, to think that cities across America are being looted
and torched and destroyed. And the lead Democrats who try to portray themselves as slightly
centrist or moderate are not speaking strongly against that. I mean, you remember
President Clinton had his sister soldier moment, you know, where he says, I'm not going to side with that crazy stuff. I'm the president in the middle here. I care about everybody. The Democrats don't seem to be able to do that right now. I just find it kind of amazing that they seem to be victims of their own wokeness or, you know, making a common cause with true radicals and true cultural Marxists.
Well, I think, you know, Lori Lightfoot, the mayor of Chicago, has one rule for protests when it involves other people's property.
She has another rule as it relates to her own house.
I think my fellow Americans, particularly fellow Americans of color, are going to say, you know what, before the pandemic, economically we were better off.
We do think our justice system can be improved, but it doesn't need to be burned down.
This is what I watched last week.
I watched a two-term black president speak at a convention that nominated an African-American female.
That's what I watched.
And some of the left want to disassemble the institutions and burn down that country.
That's the country they want to burn down.
And then I heard Tim Scott last night say, we made a lot of progress.
We made a lot of progress.
And to me, that's the contrast.
Do you want to burn it all down, or do you want to say we are in the process of perfecting this year?
union, we can be better, we should be better, but let's don't burn it all down. You like contrast?
There's your contrast. Well, and look, we've never had a Democratic Party that was as openly
anti-God. I mean, you know, this is not the day of Jimmy Carter. We are now at a time where they
have gone full on atheist Marxist, at least in their actions, and they seem to be against
everything that all
the black Americans I know
believe in certain
things and the party
has moved away because
I think that they're very cynical. They're saying like,
well, we've got that group in our back pocket.
Well, I don't think you do.
I think there are so many prominent
black Americans speaking
for the president and speaking
against Black Lives Matter and Antifa
that we're in a really
new day.
I guess I'm just wondering
since I just got another minute or so with you, do you think any of the architects of this hoax,
the Russia hoax, the horror that America had to go through the last few years,
do you think any of them will go to jail? I mean, it seems to me that we keep asking these
same questions over and over, and we still don't have anything. We still don't have the Durham
report. What do you suppose is cooking behind the scenes?
Well, I try to lower expectations because indictment is a,
a big threshold. And I think the standard for propriety has got to be higher than narrowly avoiding
indictment. So when I hear criminality, I think, show me the statute, show me the elements.
You know, McCabe was not indicted. Combe was not indicted. But that does not mean they in any way
met our expectations. Do I think there are going to be other indictments, other Kleinsmith,
based on no facts and no knowledge? I do think there will be additional ones. But I also think we've got to
get better at meeting out consequences and accountability and punishment in our culture and not
just wait on someone to be indicted. I mean, there should be a concept of shame. There should be
the concept that history does not treat you very well. There should be the concept that we're not
going to rely on you because you've been misleading us in the past. It can't just be indictment or
everything was okay. You're as usual, absolutely right. And by the way, that's what we have
the ballot box for. We're at a time, but I just hope everyone will understand that they have a
real obligation to vote in this election. Trey Gowdy, just always a joy to see you and speak
with you. Congratulations on the book. Doesn't hurt to ask. Thanks for your time. Thank you,
Eric. Take care of yourself. Hey there, folks. As you know, today, I'm in Washington, D.C.,
where I got to hear the president give his acceptance speech,
actually not far from where I'm standing right now.
A couple of things I want to cover with you really quickly.
In a couple seconds we have left.
Number one, food for the poor.
We are asking every one of you,
this is the last few days that you can go to metaxis talk.com
or you can call the number.
I want to, the head of Food for the Poor, Angel Aloma,
has something to share. Let's play that.
Now with the coronavirus,
she sees that the hope
keeps getting smaller and smaller.
Imagine if a two-year-old
who might have weighed 13 pounds
and all of a sudden they go to 12
and they go to 11 and they go to 10
and they go to 9 and they go to 8 and they go to 7,
imagine if that word your child
knowing that because you could not get them food
that your baby is going to die.
It's that simple, folks.
The bad news is that that's happening.
The good news is that just about every one of you can do something about it.
$37 can feed a kid for six months.
Two good meals a day.
Food for the poor are as reputable as it gets.
We work with them every year to help folks in places like Haiti and Guatemala.
These are truly the poorest of the poor in our hemisphere.
So either go to metaxis talk.com.
There's all kinds of things there you'll see that we want to do for you to thank you.
If anybody gives anything, we put you in our drawing for, it's a grand prize drawing for all
kinds of stuff, studio visits, signed books, all kinds of stuff at every level.
If anybody wants to give $10,000 tax deductible to what is a magnificent and important cause,
I would be delighted to have dinner with you at a time of our mutual convenience,
as many people as you want, wherever you choose.
I put that out there because there may be some folks who want to do that.
But this is very important, and I just wanted to say,
we've just got a couple of days left.
Whatever you can give, we want everyone to participate.
Give something, folks.
You can go to MetaxusTalk.com or call 844-863 Hope, 844-8663,
hope. And we've just got a minute left. Let me say this. If you're not signed up for my newsletter,
there's all kinds of information that I want to get to you, that we can't get to you on the program.
I can't put it all on social media. So please follow me. So sign up at ericmetaxis.com for our weekly
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Finally, let me remind you, I have a new book out.
It is called Donald and the Fake News.
It's meant to be funny, and guess what?
It actually is funny.
The illustrations by my dear friend, Tim Raglan, are brilliant.
you'll recognize a lot of the cast of the characters
from the swampy city in which I'm standing at present.
It's meant to be funny, but it's also meant to communicate some truths.
I think you'll appreciate that.
It's a humor book for adults.
You can give it to your friends who love the president.
You can also give it to your friends who hate the president
and dare them not to laugh because some of it is just that funny.
It also does work as a kid's book, and a lot of people are sharing it with their kids,
but it's originally intended to be purely humor, political satire.
in any event. So grateful for your listening. Please stick with us, listen to this program when you can,
and thank you for doing so.