The Exorcist Files - BONUS: The Audience Asked, Father Martins Answered

Episode Date: January 15, 2024

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We know you wanted more questions answered. And so we are excited. we actually have a very special guest. And by that, I mean, Father Martins is actually here with us. Anyone who's kept up with his hectic schedule and relic tour knows that it is a very special treat when father's actually in one place at one time. So we are going to get to as many questions as we can. But we have some announcements I need to make first. First off, we hope you've been enjoying all the bonus episodes.

How cool was Father Zeta, Father Rehill, those stories were pretty chilling. Also, Father Cole, how was that deep dive into the angelic hierarchy? My head is still spinning, but in a good way, not the kind of way that Father Martins would disapprove of. Now, we've hinted at this in some other episodes, but we are going to be doing a Kickstarter. For those who aren't familiar with a Kickstarter, it's a crowdfunding platform. It's basically a month-long fundraise we're going to be doing to finish season two. Now, season two is being worked on. We are done with a lot of scripts.

We are in production. It's coming along very nicely. But as I've told you throughout the entire series, this is extremely expensive to make, and we need to raise some finishing funds to help get it done. Think of Kickstarter as sort of a Pentecost for fundraising. It's going to kick off and spread like a wildfire. And we have some very cool and very limited edition items

that you can get only through donating to the Kickstarter. We will be doing a formal announcement when that launches. But right now, you can sign up for our pre-launch page. That's a page which will get you updates and notifications for when the Kickstarter actually starts. So go to exorcistfiles.tv, and you can sign up for the pre-launch page on Kickstarter there. It's really important. We need everyone to do this. Go to exorcistfiles.tv, and you can sign up pre-launch page.

Also, before we start today's Q&A, I do want to give a shout out because, look, we heard you all. We reduce the commercials by 90%, honestly, probably by 98%. And the commercials on this show now are fantastic. That's why I'm going to give a special shout out to Good Ranchers. It's an awesome team, and they do amazing meat, chicken, and seafood that's sent straight to your door. Honestly, once you get used to meat just showing up on your doorstep, perfectly packaged with all sorts of different cuts, it is pretty cool. But Good Ranchers, thank you so much for making this show possible. and everyone go seriously, try their stuff.

It's wonderful. I made a white bean chicken chili last night, which I dare say was chef's kiss. It was fantastic. Good Ranchers.com slash X-Files. Go now. Make haste. All right, father, welcome back.

It's been a minute. You've been on the road a bit. It's been a long minute. Yeah, a very long minute. Are you getting a little stir crazy? I know how it is when you're in one place for more than, say, nine hours. Well, I've appreciated the time off. In December, I got a terrible cold, and that turned into a lung infection, and then I had antibiotics for that. And I thought it was gone, but about five, six days later

after I took my last antibiotics, the symptoms all came back, and it turned out it was pneumonia. So I had to go on a course of two antibiotics, and I took the last antibiotic pill this morning. I feel good. Yesterday is when my energy came back. So I... I've enjoyed the time off, but truthfully, there wasn't much that I would want to be doing anyway. Now, I've obviously kept in touch with you, and you've had just a run of it from a couple years ago. You got COVID and a pretty bad case, had sleep messed up, pneumonia. Honestly, you've had a lot of issues. And do you ever stop and go, that's just par for the exorcist course?

Or I'm curious, maybe a better way to frame this is out of all your exorcistic colleagues is a series of unfortunate medical. comments common or is this just bad luck martins right now you should ask it again but say exorcist colleagues aren't we all exorcistic in our nature if we are following christ exorcistic is an adjective yeah exorcistic colleagues your colleagues are nouns and those are that's an adjective that is grammatically correct don't try me on this one okay sure sure sure we we need to get you on grammarly sponsor you know there is such a thing as pushback and retaliation from the demonic world and and I have experienced it at times. But the physical elements that I've had, like I had COVID twice.

So this past December, so last month, I did not have COVID, but that's the first December in three years that I did not. The first one was largely a piece of cake. The second one was more. And the effect of it was a terrible insomnia and kind of a permanent altering of taste. There are foods now that I used to like that I just find disgusting. And there are other foods that I liked before. and I like even more now.

In other words, the flavors have been enhanced. So, for example, coffee. I like coffee. I drink two cups of coffee a day. I love everything about the coffee, but most especially the taste. And after my second COVID, the taste is just way enhanced. So even bad coffee, like gas station coffee, is before I would almost never drink it. If I would drink it, it would be strictly because I needed the caffeine to stay awake for dry.

or for something that I'm doing. Or a penitence? Well, sure, or a penitent. But even that now, I don't find as displeasurable as I used to. Now, so was the COVID a demonic retaliation? No, I don't think so. So for me, I'm an exorcist, but no, I don't look for a demon behind every tree. And I don't see need to give them credit for everything bad or unfortunate that happens

in reality. COVID is an illness. A lot of people have gotten it. And the symptoms that I have are no different than a great many have had. So it's well known. It's well documented that some people suffer from long COVID, and I am one of them. And it can really affect in certain people their sleep. And I am one of them.

I see no reason to revert to the demonic there. I see no reason to give him credit for something that there's no connection of the demon to this. This is just a product of being in a fallen world, a world that is subject to illness. Why don't we start with some, maybe. maybe lighter fare, if such a thing exists in a conversation about spiritual warfare and your particular work. We had several people ask, how does one get to be a holder in an exorcism? What do you look for? And what's the career path or volunteer path to become a holder? Well, generally, the first criteria is I want the strongest person that I can possibly get.

I want men. I want big men. I want men that are physically robust and that can apply pressure and apply that pressure for a long, long time, hours if needed. So I generally use at least three, one on each arm and one holding the legs or kind of hugging the legs. So that one doing the legs, he's going to be lying on his stomach for potentially hours. He's got to be comfortable at that. You want people that are able to follow orders. You want prayerful souls that are able to be comfortable in such an environment doing that

type of work and willing to put up with what happens within an exorcism. They're guaranteed. They're going to get spit on them, probably vomit. They're going to be attacked, whacked. They're going to take the odd knuckle to the face or two. They're going to be picked on and harassed. The demon is going to try to coax them into a conversation. So they have to be resolute and stoic enough to just focus on a spot on the wall and look at that and let me and whatever other exorcists might be present dealing with the demon. And then I typically referred to you when you are doing an exorcism in a particular diocese, are these referrals that come potentially from the parish where the victim is located if they're part of a community or do you travel with holders or do

a network of holders in different areas that you will call upon? I've done both, generally speaking, if I'm not going to at the moment many new places to do exorcisms, I go to places where I already have an established connection, simply because there are so many demands on my time that I'm not an exorcist on call at the moment. I just don't have the time to be able to do that. I'm doing this Vatican Commission, bringing the arm of St. Jude the Apostle across the country. So that really puts a limit on the other things that I can do. Father, we had many people ask if their pets can be possessed. Now, we know for our regular readers of scripture that Jesus did drive demons into a herd of pigs, but

What about our adorable dogs, cats, or even parakeets? Father, your thoughts on demonic infestation or possession of animals? It is entirely possible for animals to be possessed. That has a scriptural basis, and it has an empirical basis. We do encounter that. Demons can manipulate animals to do their bidding. Is it easy for them to do? That really depends on the situation.

There isn't a simple answer for that. But if the devil can find a way to use your animals against you, then he will try to do so. If he can put a rock in your shoe, he's going to try to do so. But for us, I think that we're humans and we have to live our lives and we cannot live our lives constantly worried about the devil. The ammo that we should have framed in our minds is we have to get to heaven. And that means I've got to love God with all my heart, all my soul, all my strength. I've got to live virtue. and I've got to proclaim the gospel because I want, my duty is to evangelize.

And so that has to be our primary aim, not the devil. If the devil has managed to make us be solely concentrated on him, or at least as the first thing, then he's already won because he's taken our attention away from where it should be. Now, I know we mentioned actually in an episode in season one, a father Amorth had mentioned, this was not a scientific statement, but he said in his experience, he thought that, sometimes dogs and cats or animals had a particular sense or perception and might be a little more sensitive to spiritual activity. Do you agree with that or is that something you've seen? We have many people have written in saying that they think their animal has barked at something

or detected something that may not be entirely perceptible to human faculties. I totally think that that is the case. In fact, in one of my cases, I had a Ouichi Board case. the two family dogs, the dogs saw the teenagers who were beginning to play with the Ouija board. The dogs saw something, a figure, rising out of the board. And how they could tell is the dogs, it was a spot above the Ouija board that they started to growl at. They stood at attention towards it. And they started to walk backwards. And that spot rose and rows and rose.

And their eyes were following it. So the dogs are walking backwards and they're constantly looking further up. almost as if something is rising, getting bigger out of the board. And then at a certain point, they yelped, left the room, and those dogs never again entered that room. So even when the case was resolved, they never again entered that room. Let's take a brief pause for a little levity. Father, you've been on this relic tour, and you've been traveling with this arm.

We told an awesome story about a woman regaining a lot of her health, who had been suffering with the aftermath of brain tumor treatment and therapy, I believe it's chemo. And have you seen, we had a couple of people ride in and ask, have there been any other miracles or other stories that have happened? Any quote anecdotes from the road that you could share? Oh, sure. I mean, there are healings, for example, every day. Some of them are physical. Some of them are spiritual.

But just in terms of the physical, there was a priest that came and traveled with me for a week. Father Brian Hurley, who is a pastor at a parish in Detroit. And in fact, that parish in the Archdiocese of Detroit, it's in the city of Lapeer, St. Jude's Children Research Hospital in Memphis, Tennessee, was founded by Danny Thomas. Danny Thomas was a Hollywood actor whose career had hit the rocks. And someone had told him, look, pray to St. Jude, make a deal with him, ask for his help and make an offer to him, offer him something. And so he said to, look, if you help me, if you get my career, if you resurrect it, if you get it going again, I will build you a shrine. And so he prayed to St. Jude in front of a statue of St. Jude. And what happened? Well, almost immediately his career took off. And he came through with his promise,

and that shrine took the form of a hospital. And that's the St. Jude's Children Research Hospital in Memphis, Tennessee. So it treats children from all over the world free of cost. Even their transportation there is paid for by the hospital. Well, Father Brian Hurley, at his parish, Immaculate Conception Church in Lapeer, that very statue is now in that church. So there was a connection there, and Father Brian and I have been friends for a long time. There was no question I was going to go to his parish, or at least I offered to bring the relic to his parish. And, of course, he accepted a month after I was at his parish, he baptized a newborn baby. That baby had just come out of the womb. it was maybe a day or so old. Well, one month later, that baby developed double pneumonia.

So one of his lungs was 100% non-functional, was not absorbing any oxygen. The other lung was only one-quarter functional. And so they had called the family to the hospital, and there was really nothing that the hospital could do other than intubate them. And so they were waiting as a last recourse to do that because when a newborn is intubated, it almost never survives. And so it's the only thing they can do so they're ready to do that, but the success rate is not very good. And so the family had been called to the hospital to say their goodbyes to baby Silas. And so Father Brian gets this call that the baby is in trouble. And we go and we pray in front of the relic of St. Jude.

So we knelt in front of him and we just implored him to do something. In my words, I just kept saying over and over again, Jude, I need you to do something for baby Silas. And so an hour later, when they were about to do the intubation, they tested him and they found that now one quarter of the bad lung was working. So there was a quarter and a quarter. And several hours later, it was 50% and 50%. And then about 24 hours later, that baby was being prepared for discharge. So it was absolutely not a thing wrong with him, which is impossible. Pneumonia just doesn't go away like that.

So that is absolutely a divine intervention that came about through a petition. of St. Jude. So, Father, I have to ask because, obviously, from experience and of course, Theologically from reading the Gospels, not everyone who lived at the time of Jesus got healed. And clearly not every single person who goes to a relic exhibit or asks for prayer for healing gets healed. When you speak about St. Jude, I need you to do something. There's a desperation and there's a fervor in your request. But what would you say to people who feel that they have also approached God or if it's a Catholic individual, a saint with sort of the same intensity and has been let down because obviously this incredible story, we rejoice with this. But what would you say

to someone like that who's wrestling with that? Because there was a certainty when you said that, like, I need you to do this for me, St. Jude, you know? Well, there was a certainty, but all that I was certain of is that I wanted him to intervene. I didn't have a certainty that I knew he would intervene. The question is, is God, who is the ultimate healer, going to bring about the healing or not? And that I wasn't certain of. We make the petition. We beg. And then God makes the final decision, and we have to live with that. So you're right. There were some people that Christ didn't heal. He healed lots of people, and people came to him. He had an incredible reputation as being a healer. And they begged him to heal. There were some that he was able to heal, some he wanted to heal,

but he couldn't because of their lack of faith. And others straight out rejected him. So at the end of the day, God is God and we're not. So there is no magic formula. There is no kind of magic command by which we can get everything we want. And God, it would be irresponsible for him to let us have that. Why? Because then we're God.

And then he becomes the servant. We then become the one in charge and we snap our fingers. And okay, God, you know, I did the. magic formula, bring about this healing. And when I need you to do something for me again, I'll let you know. Well, on that note, Father, if you don't mind, because you mentioned Danny Thomas and his, I don't want to call it a bargain because that's not a fair characterization, but because I know that many people, and I know I've done this, where you know that you're not going to motivate God by negotiating your prayers and he doesn't need your offering to grant the prayer.

but what would you say when you mentioned Danny Thomas says, hey, St. Jude, if you resurrect my career, I'll do this. There's a part of me that goes, wow, that feels, I know it's not Faustian because it's not obviously a deal with the devil. It's with a saint, or it's a request of a saint, but what is your kind of thoughts on the idea of, you know, when we naturally let sort of, was that a bargain slipping in? Well, look, let me ask you a question. If you got your mom flowers for her birthday, is it like, that it would make you more endearing to your mom. Sure, yes, especially with me, yes. So if you got her flowers every single day, is it really about the flowers? So I'm not disagreeing with you.

I think, yeah, it's reasonable to assume that your mom's going to be endeared to you if you got her a gift for her birthday. But it's not really about the gift. It's like you could keep getting her flowers every day. You could get her flowers three times a day. at a certain point, is the endearment going to keep going up? You kind of reach a plateau. So in other words, it's not about the flowers. It's about a gesture. It was about really, ultimately, relationship. You did something beautiful for her. You did a relational act.

And that is what brought about a greater closeness. And it's the same thing with God. So making a deal with God or with a saint can bring about a relational closeness. It can make the relationship tighter. It can increase Christian faith. It can bring about a greater bond at the level of soul. And that's what it's really about. God and the saints are not against deals if it brings about a greater relational closest. But it's not about the stuff or the thing that you can give them. You know, God can raise children of Abraham out of these very stones, Christ said. So he can accomplish wonders without any. antecedent. He can just snap his fingers and do it. He doesn't even need to snap his fingers in order to do it. So the point is that what God is after is relationship. And all of these things that can contribute to a closer relationship, those can bring about the effect that we want. They can open a doorway into the heart of God. He rewards the effort for closeness. I hear you. Now, maybe I misheard the story, but in the example of the flowers, is one is an unsolicited, hey, I just

want to do something nice. But in the Danny Thomas story, shared, it sounded like he said, if you do this, then I will do this. And I know that there's a dynamic of the Holy Spirit helping communicate our prayers to God. But would you say anything in general? We don't want to presume to negotiate with God like that. It needs to come from a place of a genuine doing something out of affection versus, hey, if you do this for me, then I'll do that, right? You know, this is going to surprise you, but I'm going to say no. Because, again, look at what I said. It's not about God desiring the product or the deed that you have to offer.

It's about a greater closeness and communion. So then if you made a petition, you want him to do this, he does it. What is that going to do in you? It's going to increase your faith. It's going to say, my gosh, he said yes. He took me up on this. God heard me. He's really there. And he's given me a sign that he's listening and that he wants to help me. What would be my comment on that? Mission accomplished. God has gotten what he wanted and you now have what you want. I am a priest today because I made a deal with God. And in my conversion story, which I've said before on the program, I found myself in this chapel on a retreat because of the witness of faithful Christians. And their life and the way they lived really, was mesmerizing. It was powerfully attractive. And when I got there and I knelt in front of what appeared to me to be a cracker, but it was the Eucharist exposed on an altar. The deal I made with God

was, if you're here, please reveal yourself to me. And if you do, and if you can give me the faith that I see in them, I will give you my life. And God took me up on that offer. So I really, I hold nothing against making a deal, offering a deal to God or the saints. In all things, there are limits. Again, it's not about the deal. What God wants his relationship, and that's what he got from me. At a certain point, if there is no greater relationship that you're offering the Lord, I think he's going to get disinterested very quickly.

All right, so as God the Father says, right? You made him an offer you couldn't refuse, huh? Yeah, something like that. Not a Godfather fan. All right. Amen. Father Martin's here. I want to do a quick plug for one of the most powerful tools I've seen for breaking free and growing closer to Christ.

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That's Exodus 90.com slash X-Files. to join tens of thousands of men from all over the world for Exodus 90. Again, it begins Monday, January 20th. God bless you. Come back, Exorcist Files listeners. Let's go on to another question. So Father Zeta and Father Rehill both mentioned Freemasonry, and I can't remember, I think we hinted at this in season one as well,

but obviously the Catholic Church has also been very open about Freemasonry being incompetent. compatible for practicing Catholics, but both those exorcists mentioned that they had many cases that had origins in ancestral involvement in Freemasonry. I want to clear up a few things because we've gotten a ton of emails with people asking if pretty much every malady that is afflicting them now is a result of a long-lost uncle that was in the Freemasons Street. So I know we're actually going to do an episode on this in season two. So we will do a deep dive into this. But, Father, what would you say just in general about Freemasonry and then the idea of generational curses as a result of this?

What's the proper attitude one should have if they're concerned about this? Look, the proper attitude is the fact that we are God's children and the number one thing in your life should be your concern is to get close to God. So if you're doing that, then you're 98% of the way there. Then the other things that you need in your life is you look for what can be keeping you there. You know, ancestrally, if you're aware of some Freemasonry, then you should be renouncing that. You should be looking up, you know, how do I renounce generational ties and engage that kind of prayer? If you're aware that there's some masonry in your past or some witchcraft or some Satanism or that there was some extreme superstition practiced in your ancestral past, you know,

then take it to prayer and just say, Lord, I don't know where it all is. And I know that I have tentacles in my past. But you yourself in your life, in your human lineage Christ, you had dysfunctional people. You had rehab, for example. You had an Adam was your father as well. So you had these people. And so the fact that Christ himself had these people in his ancestry, in his lineage, needs to give us hope that these things don't define us.

Nevertheless, we take them into prayer and we say, Lord, I invite you into those areas of weakness. You know, my grandfather, Steve, I ask you to come in and if there's anything residual from his Masonic involvement in our family, I ask you to come in and remove it. My grandmother Laverne on the other side of my family, she practiced a lot of of what we would call sorcery today. She practiced witchcraft or she dabbled in the oak hole. Lord, I renounce that. I renounce its effects from me, from my family, from my children, from all of us. And I ask you to go into those places where your touch is needed. And I ask you to plant that touch. I forgive my grandmother. I forgive my grandfather. I ask you to come in and do a

cleansing. That's the kind of thing that we should be doing. That's a very relational prayer. You're making a petition to the Lord. You're not looking for a magical formula. Like, if I just find the right prayer, then poof, magic. It's gone. I love ritual, but I'm not a ritualistic person. I'm a relational person. I invite God into situations.

I listen to him. I listen to my heart because he also speaks through that. He speaks through an intent. He speaks through your instincts. He speaks through your gut, guiding you to one thing as opposed to another. And so I follow that. But bottom line, I let my faith, I let my pursuit of God and my trust in him as his son to guide the words I ask of him and in confidence to expect that he's going to grant his grace when I do. And also, I think it's important to note, too, that like you said, you don't go looking for a supernatural, spiritual cause for every bad thing that happens to you.

And Freemasonry, just like any whole list of other issues, you know, it's no different than any other framework for. for a generational sin, which maybe we should go into just for a second because I know there's a natural sort of resistance to the idea, especially in a justice-minded individualist Western society. Like, no, I'm Ryan. I'm responsible for my actions. I have nothing to do with what Laverne did three generations ago. But we do see in scripture, and this was something that I, until we started actually collaborating together on this, having studied Christianity, this was not something I really noticed too much. And obviously, I knew that the Christian framework is that humans are responsible for the sin of Adam. So that, that goes, clearly we are held accountable because

it goes back to the origin. But the idea, you know, reconciling the fact that God says, I will remember your sins no more and I will cast them as far as the east is the west. However, he also says, I will repay sin for prior generations. And you have shared in your exorcist cases that many people, through no fault of their own, inherit these familial sin problems. So maybe, Father, you could give just a little understanding for some people or may have a tough time reconciling how they may say, I did nothing wrong. How does a third generation removed relative of mine have any bearing on my life?

So I think what we need to be aware of is generational sin exists. So that's a fact. original sin is a generational sin. We have other examples in scripture of a generational sin. David cheated with Bathsheba and the child that was born out of that illicit relationship. And after David had killed Bathsheba's husband in order to hide his sin, that baby suffered the effect. So it died. And it was clear, scripture is clear, that that was a punishment for the sin. So the baby didn't sin. His father sinned, David, but the baby is the one that received the punishment. So there's an example. And so Deuteronomy states, I will punish the children and grandchildren of those who transgress my ways to the third and fourth generation.

And that usually, in biblical language, that means down through the line, three and four, down through the line. Now, later on, he says, the Lord says, but I will reward those who are faithful to the thousandth generation, right? So there is not a congruence between the two. There's an obvious way in which good is winning out, that God is, the reward for the good, far exceeds the punishment for evil or the residual effect of evil is far less than the residual effect of the good. where exactly the fine line is between the two, we don't know. And that's part and parcel of being human. When I come upon a scene and somebody is afflicted, I've got to go, there's nothing

magical in the scene that alerts me to what is going on. Like there's no blue dye that I put on a person's forehead. And if it turns green, it means generational curse. If it turns purple, it means, well, there was some kind of satanic involvement. And there's no magical way by which I know these things. It involves a lot of testing and trial and error. And at a certain point, when the obvious is not present, it isn't obvious in this person that there was a life of sin here.

This person is living a good life. So it wasn't an individual evil action. It doesn't appear to be. There's no evidence that there was. You move on to other things. Well, is there likely to be a curse? Do you have any enemies? Do you have people that there would be a motive for them to inflict a curse upon you?

Did you get the wrong people angry? And if the answer if that is no, then we start looking at other things. Are other family members of yours complaining of the same kind of things? And even when there's a generational curse, I've seen it where, yes, there are others being afflicted from the same thing. But you know what? Sometimes it's a one-off thing. Sally herself is the only one in the family suffering from the effect of a Masonic involvement

of a family member, of some witchcraft that was practiced, or just some individual sin that was for whatever reason so visceral that it brought about a demon with jurisdictional rights within the family. So a couple of thoughts and questions, your father. One, is this an oversimplification, but Jesus lived a perfect life, and yet he was technically held accountable for all our sins, right? I mean, there was a, I don't know this is mixing my metaphors here, right? But is that an example where Christ was sinless, and yet a punishment was still meted upon him for our sins? And yet, So he would be the ultimate example of, look, I don't have to do this, but I'm getting God still had to visit some judgment. Or is that a different dynamic?

It's a dynamic due to the fact that he subsumed the vocation of the Messiah. A Messiah was needed and he willingly undertook that. So yet give it to me, I'm here to redeem. And whatever it takes, I'm here to do that. Father, in one other question on this, in John, in the Gospel of John, there was an inquiry from the people around him that, they asked who sinned that this man would be born blind. And so that seems to reflect a understanding in Jesus' time that if you had ailments or maladies, they were a result of either sin that you committed or sin in your past. And Jesus in that case said, no one's sinned. Essentially, it was this man was

born so the works of God could be demonstrated if I recall. And so is that Jesus correcting an incorrect view, or is he simply saying in that verse, no, this one is actually not generational sin. This is just so I can show off. Well, I wouldn't phrase it the way you did it, but I think it's the latter of the two, that the situation was created so Christ could demonstrate something of his identity there. So nowhere in John 9, where this account is given, the man born blind, nowhere does it state that generational sin does not exist. But we can already see the level that that was on the mind.

of those around him. That was so on the mind of those people at the time that if anything bad happened to you, well, this is a divine punishment. This is a rebuke from the Lord. Jesus doesn't correct their view of things. He just says, no, watch this. This is so that my identity can be revealed to you, and here it is. So he's teaching them. And, you know, at times, we can have generational sin in a family line. At times, we can have a generational curse that we can have, we're dealing with, that our families deal with, and we may know that they're there, we may not know that they're there. Sometimes they go away without us having done anything that we're aware of. Just by becoming holier, by forging a closer relationship with God, becoming a greater saint,

guess what? We receive the benefits of the kingdom, and part of those benefits is that junk is shaken from our past. Sometimes we move on the path to holiness, and that stuff doesn't go away. And if it doesn't go away, well, then that's the Lord saying, hey, I want you to deal with this specifically. When he points that out, then we go forward and we deal with it. But bottom line is, I think we don't need to be worried about the generational curses in our life until they present themselves. At the time that they present themselves, all right, then, Lord, I want this out of me and I'm going to take this to heart. And I'm going to knock on your door until you help me. And if you feel the need to go digging, I don't think there's anything wrong with that.

I don't think you need to ignore it until it's non-ignorable. I do the best that I can. And then at a certain point, if there's more, I'm going to have, I just trust that the Lord is going to reveal that there's more. We have a great example of the reality of generational curses with Tammy Comer's story, right? She had done nothing overtly wrong that she was aware of, married to a pastor serving in God's church. and in her story, right, it was, they looked back and they saw a pattern of the firstborn in each of the family going back, I think several generations, was chronic illness or death. So you would say pattern is probably a really interesting marker to look at, right, when you're considering if there's a curse,

if you see a repeated pattern, that's probably a big yellow flag. One other thought father, too, and this actually kind of leads into our next question when we get into some of the demonic tactics and sort of their organization has been asked about. But is this, I'm sure you're going to say this is plausible, if not probable. But also, we've discussed that demons get, in your teachings, that demons get access via openings that are sometimes explicit and then other times of an origin. Could a demon have access via a generational curse?

And then due to a ongoing, and I hate to use the word strategy, but you have mentioned the enemy watches and studies, but could a demon plausibly hold on to an access card and not play it for a while and waiting for some sort of grander purpose? So say, you mentioned Laverne, there's some sorcery, and nothing manifests in your life as a result of that for a long period of time. And then one day it does. Is that a dynamic that could be at play where demons hold on to that

until a time when they might want to use it if it's not dealt with? Sure it is. Yeah, they absolutely can and they will do that. And again, God is the referee, so to speak. And so he's over all of these events that are unfolding. And we have to do things according to his time. If he reveals it, if he reveals something to be dealt with, then we deal with it. Until we know what needs dealing with, there's nothing we can do. And worrying about it is not going to be helpful. You might say this is my inner Protestant coming out. But what's the argument against just someone saying, hey, look, right? You know, in Christ, right? He's born all the wounds, all the stripes, all the sicknesses. Like he's, you know, he's the great physician and healer. And just saying, Lord, I trust you.

And I, by the authority, like, I've declared I'm in your kingdom. And I renounce all generational curses over me and my family. Like, it starts like, I plant the flag here. I'm a new creation. and I've no ties to any of that, one and done. What's wrong with that thinking? Or what's the whole in that thing? Is there any?

There's nothing wrong with the action of doing that. In fact, I would encourage the action, but the way you put it is one and done. So that's not up for you to determine. You can't possibly know that. You can hope that it is. You can add it, you know what? Lord, from my part, I am saying one and done,

that I'm not going to be worried anymore. I'm just going to trust that in your goodness and in my faith right now, that you're able to help us and that you want to help us, that you want us to be free of any residual effects of our past. For my part, for our part, I'm saying one and done. We're going to walk away from this, trusting that we're living in a perfect new life. I think that's a beautiful prayer. I think that's great. But God may have other plans and he may decide. It's actually not one and done.

There's a few things that need to be resolved, but this is not the time for it right now. I'll let you walk away thinking that everything is fine. And when the time comes at my choosing, I'm going to bring a matter that still needs dealing with forward. Gotcha. So I guess for the dynamic there, it's not that God doesn't want you to be free of this, but he does in his sovereignty.

And it might even seem, you know, for lack of a better word, using the demons who want to bring about and say, no, it's plausible he might say, no, I'm going to actually, there's going to be some hardships that may result from this. but I have to have those bear out in a certain way in your life in a certain manner because that is actually going to cause the most fruit. And at that point, I will eradicate those because we know that God does use suffering

and hardships, be it from generational curses or other things to move us and steer us in the direction he needs us to go, right? Absolutely. This is the great irony. God uses demons all the time. He permits their action in order to bring forth a greater good. And this is simultaneously within the demons a great horror and a great cause of their pain, that they can't seem to get away from being used for the greater good by God.

And yet they're not able to stop themselves. And it's their own choosing. God is not forcing them to be evil. That's a choice in and of themselves. But they cannot choose not to do God's will. Let me change that one. They cannot choose to be, how do I want to phrase this? They cannot choose. They can't but help do God's will.

Yeah. They can't but help to be in God's plan and accomplishing is good. They cannot, they don't have the power or the smarts to usurp his plan for things. So, Father, there's been this testimony going around that went viral on the internet from my former warlock in Africa who has an incredible testimony from a sheer Hollywood storytelling standpoint. And I have no reason to doubt his claims other than they sound. They're very difficult to believe from just a supernatural. I mean, it's the most wild thing ever heard. But one of the things that I wanted to get your take on, and we've actually gotten a few

questions on this as well, he alludes to this far more organized demonic hierarchy that may exist with actual witches having particular geographical territories. And one thing in particular was interesting is that a lot of them, he claimed that they were near rivers, that they were trying to gather strength and dominion over rivers. And so I just want to get your take. If one, if you have any reason to suspect that there's sort of a hierarchy and, you know, organization like that. And then secondly, the connection with water and demons, which we've alluded to in the past. Sure. So there is a connection with water and demons. Absolutely. That's scriptural. And it's also empirical. We encounter that all the time. Both witches and

Satanists like to gather around bodies of water. Is there a hierarchy? Yes. That hierarchy has a character that most people would probably not guess. So, for example, witches and Satanus, they don't play nicely with one another. They don't like one another. They're natural enemies. One is a patriarchal group. The other is a matriarchal group. They don't play well in the sandbox together. Is there a hierarchy within those two realms, yes, but Satanism and witchcraft, by and large, are way less organized than what you would think. Case and point, when was the last time somebody knocked on your door and asked you if you'd like to join their satanic club or asked you if you'd like to join their coven of witches? So they're not after new members, like say religious groups, Christian groups,

are after new members. They're not out to evangelize, so to speak. So they're a higher hierarchy is much smaller and it's different. It's organized around a, it's organized around achieving the goals that they want for their sect or for their covenant. They're not out to convert the world for to be satanic or to be wicken, for example. So that part is, in order to understand those realms, we've got to dispel that. You know, it's interesting is he actually said in that interview too that they all would turn on each other and that part of of the process of ascending was you had to dispense of the people who are already in your spot. So he alluded to the idea that evil just consumes itself. There was a anarchist component to it, which was really

interesting. And that would make sense because if everyone's just out for themselves, everyone else is just a pawn or a tool to get to wherever. And then part of what he said in that testimony was to ascend to the next spot, you had to literally remove for that means from everyone else underneath you. And I thought, well, that seems on brand. But also one thing he mentioned, which you have alluded to in the past two, is he said there were particular areas that they couldn't target using their demonic powers because there were groups as small as 20 people covenanting, 20 women praying together, and that they couldn't touch certain areas.

Do you find that surprising or is that pretty, is that sound? You've often said that things are held up by these nuns praying that we don't know about. I don't find it surprising at all. Where prayer is, where two or more are gathered, Christ is their presence. So they're now, they're up against Jesus Christ. So for sure, there could be 20 warlocks or there could be 20,000 warlocks. And if they're up against Christ, they're going to lose that fight. And, you know, Father, he said something, too, about Covenant, which I wanted to get your reaction to.

He said, and I appreciate that this is not an exact science, right? And this is many people, you know, this is a different realm. but he said one thing that the spiritual realm was big on was covenant. And he said that when people were covenanted in particular to pray with each other, not just he said praying was powerful, but he said that the scariest enemies he had when he was in the occult was Christians who were in covenant to pray with each other. And he said that he was always under instructions to attack covenants like spouses,

anything that Christians were in covenant with, he wanted to dissolve. And it made me think that because God is, fundamentally truth and God is what is truth and is a promise in a sense too that the enemy would of course try and eradicate that and so he was always trying to undermine that and so do you have any thoughts on covenants as far as a spiritual currency sure i mean you know covenants the stronger the christianity is a covenant-based religion right our relationship with god is covenant based the first covenant we enter into his baptism.

And that is a culmination of many covenants that God made with his people along the line. And the final covenant is the covenant made by Jesus Christ. And so it's no wonder that that's what they want to break and that's what they want to shatter. They want to shatter community and the union that people have with others because we are stronger in a Christian union than without. And he said they would always try and isolate people individually. When they were trying to break up a prayer group, They'd try and step. One of the first steps was to try and separate you from your prayer partners and community,

which I found so interesting. Sure. So right. Same play. Same playbook we've seen for a long time. We're going to wrap up here, but let's get to a couple more fan questions. We have one that asked, so speaking of covenant, if a baby was being baptized and the godfather that we had selected was in, unknown to us, was involved in the occult or had demonic presences,

could that affect our child by making him godfather? Absolutely. The whole point of a godfather is that you're bringing a model example of Christian faith into the life of this child who's going to serve as a spiritual father, praying for him, and that will present himself as a Christian witness that can be imitated. If that is not present, you've picked the wrong person for a godfather. So pick well, right? Pick well.

Pick fair moral story there. We've gotten a lot of people have asked, Father, we have wanted to want to people want to check in on Jeremy, our firefighter from season one. Interestingly, folks have asked, because the demon was said in the episode to sort of accelerate his strength and muscle, do we have any, they were curious if once he was liberated, if he lost his strength, which is another question about do people lose their demonically given granted abilities when they become liberated? Maybe there's a two-partner there. He lost the supernatural element of his strength, but what he was before was something superhuman. he's a very large man he's very musculature he is a strong man so he has the strength for his size and i'll tell you this it is more than adequate for what for what he needs so father we've we've

addressed this before psychics fortune tellers shamans all no-noes according to christian teaching but is there a do you i'm trying to find the right way to phrase this but do you empathize and like in mark and sherrell's case for example people do you believe that people have genuine experiences when they go to psychics, et cetera, and do you empathize with that, but while still acknowledging that it's wrong? And just as a reminder, why is it so wrong? We know it says in scripture, divination, all it is terrible, but what is so wrong about, and I'm playing devil's advocate here, but what is so wrong about it, perhaps a grieving widow, seeking out a medium to try and speak with her, her, you know, deceased spouse?

Like, it comes from a place of loneliness, right? But why is God so hard? know on that. Because it's a direct violation of the First Commandment, right? We are trying to be God. We usurping his sovereignty. So he is set up natural limits in our lives and death is one heck of a natural limit. And so when that has occurred, God has permitted it to occur. Now, he may not have desired it in his antecedent will. He may, I mean, especially if, say, a person died as a result of murder. God is not delighted in that action, but he permitted it. He's, he's, allowed it to happen. So in his consequent will, it all plays a part within his plan. And so if we sinfully try to bypass that, then what we're saying is, I am God. And, you know, Lord, I'm just going to,

your rights to have me not do this, I'm going to usurp because, you know what, I have my reasons, and I'm going to follow my reasons. And at the end of the day, we've committed a gravely sinful action. And there are consequences to that. Here's an interesting one. Someone you suspect may be demonically afflicted, but refuses to acknowledge that as a reality. As a layperson, is the only thing you can do, pray? Well, you could kidnap them, torture them. You could make them, you know, look, people have free will. Like, you, I mean, that question, it's asked every single session that you talk with people. Like, my son isn't doing the right thing. And he's got, what can I do? Well, you can pray for him. And, you know, as St. Monica informed us, that God hears those prayers.

She waited an awful long time for the conversion of her son, but it came. But what else can you do? Again, relationship with God is not magical. You don't add two cups of flour, one cup of sugar. And if you get all the proportions right, sprinkle it, poof. Then you've got relationship with God. He has to want it. And he has the right to not want it.

And that's a right given to him by God. So we'll do two more questions here. and then we'll wrap up here. Father, we've had a lot of people have asked that they would like to get involved with helping intercede or be on a prayer team for an extra support their local exorcist. What steps would be advised for lay people to offer to volunteer? Well, I think if you feel called to pray for the local exorcist, then just pray. You don't need anything else other than that. And I think that, look, if somebody came to me and offered that, my answer would be, thank you very much, but I have all the people that I know.

need. When I want someone, I pray and I take stock of the people whom I already know and those people whom I already know, then I will request membership from them, one or more if I need more. But brand new people, I personally never let in the room, especially anybody who desires it, because I really don't know what's at the heart of that. I don't take unknown people is the short of it. And I don't know an exorcist that takes unknown people. If you're a known person and you want it, then You can exercise the channel that you already have, but there is no kind of application process by which you become an assistant in the room. Last question.

We have a few requests for a little ecumenical hour, a little council, not of Trent, but, you know, maybe Vatican II vibes here. We have some listeners have asked, what have you and Ryan learned from each other? Now, there's a premise problem with this question, right? Because one of us is clergy, and I fully expect father to not have learned anything, theological for me. But if you want to say Protestants in general, if there's anything that you have felt you have been blessed by in the Protestant tradition, we can each share because I have a lot to say about how much I've grown in appreciation for Catholics. So why don't you start since your

is shorter list than mine? So what I've encountered, and through you, Ryan, I've met many different Protestant groups, many non-denominational people, member of classic Christian denominations and and everything kind of in between. I have encountered people of tremendous faith, people who are in love with the Lord, who are trying to be holy, who are pursuing the Lord, and who have made God the center of their lives,

and who are living their dignity in Jesus Christ. And it has been a beautiful thing. These are people with whom it's been a delight to speak with and have conversations about the demonic, but just about Christian faith. And it's been wonderful to see how God has made a mark in their lives,

lives, how they carry the happiness that they have in every aspect that they do, in their conversations, in their workplace. And they are, I've spoke with so many who have changed jobs because they sense they could have a greater impact on morality in the world by taking on this other job that really they may not have been the most qualified for. They would have never, when they had a secular mindset, thought I would find myself doing this because it's less fun or it's paid. is less than what I've been educated to do and the world in which I've built up a career up to this point. But by golly, they've gone and they've made an impact and they have forged their lives by these holy decisions that they've made. And it's been a wonderful thing to see. It's been

a beauty and an attractiveness that is there. It's a delight to see. And these kinds of people I've encountered everywhere where we've traveled and all the different people that we've encountered, and including when we, well, for this podcast, we're now going independent and the people that have come forward that have said, hey, look, I hear you guys are looking for help to pull this off. Here's the skill set that I have to offer. Do you need somebody like that? I'm a committed Christian. And most of the people that have come forward are from the Protestant tradition, but they are

wonderful people. And thank you, Father, and on behalf of prods everywhere. But also, would you say, too, that while disagreeing on. obviously with Sola Scriptura, that one of the upsides of a highly biblical focus is evangelizing of the bringing the Bible to a lot of parts of the world. Oh, absolutely. Yeah, they love the word and they love spreading the word. And that's a beautiful thing. You know, to be in love with the word is to be in love with God. The word is God. Well, in kind. One of the questions I get constantly from my circle is, Ryan, why haven't you converted yet? And I say, you just, you know, we'll see how much the

Kickstarter raises and then we'll go, hey, we'll make a deal. But I will say one of my favorite things is I really appreciate this question. Thank you for asking this because I love to see the, when I was growing up, it felt like there was a significant rivalry, particularly culturally, between Protestants and Catholics. And I actually grew up just sort of, I mean, just because I didn't know anything about Catholicism. So I truly thought it was an entirely different religion. I didn't know much about it. And also, in the same, same way probably an agnostic would walk into a megachurch with a fog machine and a Grammy award-winning band and go, what is happening here? I saw the incense and the procession and just the

church. I just, I did no idea. And since working with Father in the show, one, I have really reevaluated some of my beliefs. I do see a sort of Petrian deferrence in scripture. So what I mean by that is I see Peter as being a sort of first among equals. I just ever thought much about that. see that in him in the scriptures. I see apostolic succession. And I also just really, and a deeper reverence for communion, as Protestants call it, and the Lord's Supper and the Eucharist. I think that once you study the history and the tradition of it, regardless of where you come down on the side of transubstantiation and whether it's the priest in particular activating God's blessing on that, it's hard to see the sort of casual manner that I grew up sort of treating communion with each

and reconciling that with the tradition of how serious it is. So there's a lot there. There's stuff that I haven't intellectually been able to wrap my mind around, but I love going out with Father on the road, and it is so cool. We've done a couple. We've actually done several events called an Evening with an Exorcist, and it's a predominantly Protestant audience. And you can tell they're a little nervous at first, and then they, and then right away, Father does a great job of establishing that this shared baptism in Christ unites us in our battle against darkness and that everyone by virtue of their baptism in Christ can exercise demons when God chooses to grant that authority. So seeing that unity and building that connection

of what unites us, I would say I love walking away feeling like we have an intra-family disagreement rather than an inter-family disagreement. So that's a lot. But, you know, Protestants love words. the word. So there you go. So it's been a journey and, you know, Father calls me a prod. They call me a turncoat. I think I got to settle for the contemplative, charismatic, quasi-Orthodox. So how's that far? That's great. That's great. We're learning from each other. Praise God. Absolutely. So all right. Well, folks, thank you for listening. We please keep sending those questions. Keep praying for us. Yeah, whether it's pneumonia or mic issues, you never know what's going to happen when you're documenting this, but we have some, we really hope you'll support us in our Kickstarter

coming up here. And I promise you, season two is coming. As they say in the scriptures right here, but not now. So, God bless you all. We'll talk soon. Bye, bye, everyone.