The Extras - Halloween Horror Special: The Curse of Frankenstein and IT Extras

Episode Date: October 29, 2021

Filmmaker Constantine Nasr of Rivendell Films joins the podcast to discuss the extras for several classic Horror films.In December of 2020, the Warner Archive released “The Curse of Frankenstein,” so we review the extras Constantine Nasr created for the special 2-disc release.  This Hammer horror classic revitalized the horror genre and led to an explosion of creativity in genre filmmaking worldwide.  And it turned Peter Cushing and Christopher Lee into box office stars.The second half of the podcast delves into the extras Constantine Nasr produced for the Warner Bros adaptation of the Stephen King novel IT, in the two films “IT” and “IT: CHAPTER TWO,”  directed by Andy Muschietti and produced by his sister Barbara Muschietti.   For the first “IT,” we dive into the intimate extra that explores the bond between the child actors in “The Losers’ Club.” Then we discuss the impressive 2-part documentary “The Summers of IT” and the challenges that went into pulling together this in-depth look into both the child and adult actors on the films from hundreds of hours of on-set footage.And finally, we touch on Constantine Nasr’s work on the recently released TV classics “Kolchak: The Night Stalker” and the soon-to-be-released “Night Gallery" season 1.The Sitcom StudyWelcome to the Sitcom Study, where we contemplate the TV shows we grew up with and...Listen on: Apple Podcasts   Spotify The Extras Facebook pageThe Extras Twitter Warner Archive & Warner Bros Catalog GroupOtaku Media produces podcasts, behind-the-scenes extras, and media that connect creatives with their fans and businesses with their consumers. Contact us today to see how we can work together to achieve your goals. www.otakumedia.tv

Hi, I'm film historian and author John Fricke. I've written books about Judy Garland and the Wizard of Oz movie, and you're listening to The Extras. Hello and welcome to The Extras, where we take you behind the scenes of your favorite TV shows, movies, and animation, and their release on digital, DVD, Blu-ray, and 4K, or your favorite streaming site. I'm Tim Millard, your host. My guest today has worked with some of the top directors in Hollywood,

including Frank Darabont, Terry Gilliam, Mel Brooks, Michael Mann, Richard Donner, and Tim Burton. He has produced hundreds of extras for Fox, AMC, Turner, Dimension, HBO, Sony, Universal, and Warner Brothers, as well as specialty distributors Shot Factory and Kino Lorber. He is the author of the book Roger Corman Interviews and is a highly respected film historian. He is a multi-Rondo and Saturn award winner and was inducted into the Monster Kid Hall of Fame in 2019. He has an amazing range of work that includes classic Hollywood films and animation, current television, and superhero blockbusters. However, he's joining the show today to discuss another passion of his, horror films. So I hope you enjoy my conversation with filmmaker Konstantin Nasser as we talk about the Warner Archive release of Curse of Frankenstein,

recent horror blockbusters It and It Chapter Two, and television classics Kolchak, The Night Stalker, and Night Gallery. Well, Konstantin Nasser, welcome to The Extras. Thanks, Tim. This is really cool to finally be on your show. I've been listening pretty much since you began. Well, thank you very much. I know you've just been terribly busy, so I appreciate you carving out some time in your schedule to be a guest on the podcast.

Sure thing. You teased me with let's do a Halloween episode and it's very timely. So, of course, I wanted to be here. We've known each other since probably around 2007 when I started working at Warner Brothers. You know, I know, of course, all the stuff you've done with Looney Tunes, with Jerry Beck and George, a lot of the other stuff you've done with George from the Warner Brothers catalog. And I know you've worked on TV, you've worked on films. There's just been so much. But I did not know that you had worked on so many horror titles.

So when you told me, I was like, Halloween's coming up. That'd be great. Why don't we do that? And you're actively working on some of those, which we'll get into in a little bit. But before we go down the spooky Halloween route here, I did want to get for the fans a little background on your career, how you kind of got into the business. Well, it's probably appropriate that it's Halloween because I fell in love with movies as a kid with things like Star Wars and famous monsters of film land. And I was of that crowd in the, in the 1970s and eighties. So it was just a love of,

of movies that led me down the path of making movies, wanting to study movies. And, and so my path led me ultimately to USC where I went to film school, but it was all because of this passion that I think was driven by comic books and movies and old movies and black and white movies and silent films and whether it's Universal Monsters or Star Trek, Monty Python. It's just strange how the path has kind of led me to be a part of a lot of those things I just mentioned. And so for a kind of a nerd like myself and someone who spent time as a young kid, like the guy who had his nose in the book, you know, and my other hand had a camera or a pencil because I was drawing comics. It's a nice mixture, but it's been a lot of work.

It's been a lot of work. So you end up going to USC. Did you go to USC for film? Yeah, I came out in 93. Had a full plate, wrote for the Daily Trojan. film? Yeah, I came out in 93, had a full plate, wrote for the Daily Trojan. So I was honing my craft as an interviewer, writing for, as a journalist alongside people like Scott Foundas or Jason Reitman was actually one of our other writers. So I knew some of these people when we were all students. And then I was interning for Roger Corman. You know, I was doing all that kind

of stuff while I just took advantage of what Los Angeles had to offer, because growing up in Oklahoma, none of that. Right. Coming out to LA, like it was magic. You know, it was Hollywood. Being that you grew up in Oklahoma, you applied to USC when you were accepted and everything. That must've been a big dream come true for you. It was, it was. And when I got rejected from the film school, um, multiple felt that's OK because Steven Spielberg got rejected three times. So, you know, I'm going down that path. Ultimately, I did graduate. I worked there.

Part of my relationships I've built with people were developed by sneaking into classes and meeting my mentor, Frank Darabont, and a little private little event that I snuck into. Or Mel Brooks, who I've worked with, who I met at USC and it like snuck into a class. Very Spielberg-esque. All, you know, I just had to do it because these guys, I love their work. So why wouldn't I just crash a graduate class? And then ultimately it was a natural progression for me, I would say. Yeah. So after USC, then did you immediately kind of get into producing extras or when did you end up over there?

Was it a new wave that you kind of got your. No, it was it was it was Frank Darabont. So so I you know, the Green Mile will be forever like the thing that that is associated. I think I will be associated with. Right. And I ended up hoping to just get a job on the film as a production assistant, but it was really my good friend, David Leslie Johnson McGoldrick, who introduced me or really gave me an opportunity to throw in my resume. He endorsed me to make a documentary. Frank wanted to make a documentary on the Green Mile and Frank took a chance, said, sure, give this guy a camera. I had done a little documentary prior to that. It was

kind of like off and running and I spent two years on the Green Mile and the rest is kind of history. Wow. Especially my relationship with Frank. Right. Well, we just don't have time today to get into the Green Mile and your relationship with Frank. But I remember you telling me about it. It's fascinating. I hope maybe someday we can we can actually sit down and do that. So that was the beginning of the documentary. You're doing basically what you're doing now, but for the Green Mile. How did that transition to kind of the next stage? I've been doing this for, man, almost 25 years now, but I've done a lot more. So I produced television, I produced for film, written, all those things that allow me to be a multitasking filmmaker. I'm an editor. I'm also a cameraman. So it's all, all of that to me, it's, it's where

the action is, you know, that, that to me is the best part of telling stories, working with people, not just in a basement, cutting away on pieces. And we're in, we're in COVID time. So everyone's working alone. It's been hard because, you know, filmmaking is a collaborative effort and people, I think, need to be in each other's faces, you know, to develop bonds that relate in terms of creating characters and stories and all of that is it, that's what the magic of movies is all about. So I think what I do in terms of behind the scenes or documentaries about movies, it's just pouring my love, my passion, my art, whatever skillsets that I've acquired and learned from all the filmmakers that I've

been able to sort of not just be in their presence, but spend a lot of time with and study. So. Well, that's terrific. When did you then first start working with Warner Brothers on some of their projects? Well, my relationship with Warner started in 98 with the Green Mile and it's never ended. I say, you know, it's, it's odd that I'm, I'm not a technical Warner employee, but I've been working with them for 23, 24 straight years. So I feel kind of attached to the studio and I'm very grateful for that. But, um, as a, as a producer, I began in 98 and I've been doing everything from cartoons to television shows like Smallville or Supernatural to other

movies, whether it would be Heat or The Dirty Dozen or the Superman films or the Batman films and of course, new films. Yeah, I know that you worked with Richard Donner on the Superman films. That must have been a highlight. So yes, I mean, again, Superman is right up there. Christopher Reeve and I were born on the same day. Wow. Mark Hamill and Christopher Reeve and myself. So when I was five years old and I discovered that my two heroes were born on the same day, I loved them even more. You know, the connection was there. So Superman, the movie was and remains very special. So I couldn't believe it, whether I'm working with Richard Donner or I'm sitting in air studios in the UK

recording voiceover with Terrence Stamp doing a documentary on like Jor-El and obviously he's Zod. I have a great story there, but he was, you know, the voice of Jor-El on Smallville. It just, it was amazing that the, the Superman family just kept coming back, circling the same thing because all those people really loved, they loved what they were a part of. Right. Yeah. Yeah. And then you've also worked, I know on the Batman franchise. The movie, yeah. That, that movie changed my life when I was 15 years old and it was either become a comic book artist or make movies. And I saw that Tim Burton's Batman, including Superman, too, but Batman really changed everything for me. Right. And to be able to then say to my 15 year old self, just wait, you're going to get to work with Tim Burton.

And we spent two years producing the first Batman anthology box set. Wow. Um, I think we made like eight hours of documentary work, including the, the multi-part shadows of the bat documentary, or the legends of the dark night history of doc spending time with all these comic creators. I mean, heroes, right? So I don't know what, I mean, spending time in Jack Nicholson's house, talking about the Joker. Wow. Um, doesn't get better than that. Nope. Sure doesn't. I've, I've admired your work fairly closely, I should say, because I worked at Warner Brothers, but we kind of were like ships passing in the night. We would almost work on a project and then it would morph and then you get busy and I'd be, it's like supernatural. For instance,

you worked on the first few seasons just before I started working. And then I worked the rest of the 13, 14 seasons after that. How we miss each other. Very strange. But I'd say hide you in the hall. We'd see each other, you know, like at meetings or like, well, eventually we'll do it. See, here we are. Yeah.

Well, it's an amazing variety of projects that you've worked on. And then the horror is kind of, there is a connection there and we're going to get to in a little bit talking about the movie It and It Chapter Two, which is a Stephen King, obviously based off of Stephen King's books, Green Mile connection. That kind of goes back, obviously the different directors, but you've worked on a number of Stephen King projects from very beginning of your career. So you've kind of had a foot in that kind of horror thriller space for quite some time. My love of film can't really be separated from my love of monster movies. It's like I can't remember when I didn't love Frankenstein or Dracula or The Wolfman.

So if you knew me when I was a kid, I would be carrying around books or magazines. And I knew the cinematographers or the kid, I would be carrying around books or magazines and I knew the cinematographers or the filmmakers. I knew all that. I knew the synopsis is written by people, the handful of books or magazines that ended up becoming my friends, you know, I've worked with over the years. So to have been able to work with Universal over the years. I was going to ask you about Universal. Yeah. You know, Universal. And it was actually with our friend, Jonathan Gaines, about Universal. Yeah. You know, Universal. And it was actually with our friend Jonathan Gaines back when, when he was there before his time at Warner's with the Universal team and Colleen Benn and Marion Mancy. Right. I got a chance to work on Frankenstein, Dracula, those films, and then

working with John Landis on American Werewolf in London or working with John Carpenter. I mean, when I look back on it all, it's pretty crazy what I've been able to do. A documentary on Freddy Krueger with Wes Craven from Warner Brothers, you know, history and you name it. So I'm very fortunate. I did want to talk to you about the 1957 Hammer Films release of The Curse of Frankenstein starring Peter Cushing, Hazel Court, Robert Urquhart and Christopher Lee. This movie was a huge success when it came out and really helped usher in a golden age for Hammer. The Blu-ray was released by Warner Archive in December of 2020 to rave reviews and I know you produced quite a few extras for the release. Why don't you tell us how you were

kind of first brought onto this title and how you came up with your concepts for those extras? Of course. Yeah. I'm very happy to talk about this release because ever since I started working with Warner Brothers in the late nineties, I was asking about the films I loved, including this movie right around the time it was released on DVD originally. Okay.

Because we thought, oh, we're going to have a special edition someday, someday. And that day never came. I mean, if you could, you can ask George or anybody else over at Warner Brothers, there were movies that I, and I'm still hounding them. But I also know catalog has, has had a complete collapse in the industry outside of the small venues, the sub licensee companies or the niche market that Warner Archive provides, thankfully, to the great and legendary George Feltenstein. I've just been very grateful to have been kind of tapped in that world, whether it was classic movies by filmmakers

of the golden age. I just I got myself in that niche of working with Michael Crawford, working with George that when the time came around and eventually it did that the curse of Frankenstein was going to be restored. George called me and said, uh, basically it's happening. And I said, well, what do you mean it's happening? Because originally I thought they were going to license this thing out, uh, in a hammer in the UK had released it through Lionsgate. They didn't have the best print. They wanted the negative. It just, you know, Warner brothers held onto that negative because George in his wisdom knew that to do this and he's never been half-hearted or cheap on anything. He can find a way to make the pennies work, but the end result, I mean,

especially with Warner archive, how they'veive, he's never missed a beat. So when the time came, I certainly raised my hand. I'm like, I'll rally the troops. And in COVID, we did this in COVID. Oh, really? So take us back then. We're talking in 2019, did you start or in 2020? No, 2020.

In 2020. COVID and everything else kind of screwed everything. Right. But at one point in 2019, there was talk of it. And then it was, everything had the kibosh, nothing was going to be done. And then George said, I think it might've been in April of 2020. It's coming up. And I said, all right, I have some ideas. Well, how can we do this? How can we pull it off? We're talking right at the beginning of COVID. Right. And I had friends that I wanted to bring on board that would die because I was doing all of this work through Scream Factory. So I had produced up to that point, maybe a good 30 Hammer Horror titles and Universal titles through Scream. Okay. All of them were sub-licensed from Fox and from even from Warner Brothers,

like the Val Luton movies. When I asked George what he thought and Michael Crawford what he thought, there was a little bit of money. And money is always helpful. I needed to hire a crew to go to Sir Christopher Frayling's home in the middle of, you know, UK to safely, because, you know, certainly Warner Brothers did not want anyone to get endangered. Right. Contrary to what people may do or think, there's a very strict, especially during COVID, very strict protocol with regard to a studio production. Right. You know, if you're non-studio, you can maybe do some other things around,

you know, you can work around it. But I had to make sure everyone was safe. Yes. And everyone was comfortable. I wasn't going to force anybody. But believe me, these people wanted to talk. So we were able to get film historian and author and publisher Richard Clemonson. Right.

To do one subject. I had a way to like make all of it work by having four different pieces. Before you get into that, though, I'm actually talking about the concepts. Had you already concepted some of this stuff out or did that all coalesce in April of last 2020? Stay with us. We'll be right back. Hi, this is Tim Millard, host of The Extras Podcast. And I wanted to let you know that we have a new private Facebook group for fans of the Warner Archive and Warner Brothers catalog physical media releases.

So if that interests you, you can find the link on our Facebook page or look for the link in the podcast show notes. Well, I had to find the people that could talk during COVID. Right. Because whatever I might have had, if I wanted to make a documentary, which I, which I kind of wanted to do prior to everything changed. So I had to figure out what could I get, who could do it and where, where were the, you know, where it's the best use of the money. And so, uh, my friend, Chris Drake, who's a composer for Warner brothers, he composed like the Batman, the dark night returns soundtrack or the score of that film among so many other things. He is a fan of James Bernard. So he said, I'll talk about James Bernard and my friend, David Miller, who's a very celebrated and experienced

producer and especially cinematographer. Right. David wanted to talk about Jack Asher. Okay, we'll do that. And I was able to convince Sir Christopher Frayling to come and talk about the history of Frankenstein. You know, I mean, again, everybody had their own speciality. Right. And I just had to do it quickly, safely. And then all the material comes in and I got to cut it. Right.

The best part of this release was that George, in his wisdom again, and his love for the movie, he released the film in three separate aspect ratios. Right. So in the US, it was released in 185. In the UK, it was released 16 one eight five in the UK, it was

released one six six. So he properly framed those. And we, you know, again, I was called in and asked to help even in identifying color and, and helping out the framing. I mean, it was, it was crazy to be really that integral or be a part and to give advice, but what George did extra, he went the extra mile by giving the full open mat for four, three. I mean, it was crazy because he knew the fans would love to see all the cool stuff on the top and bottom of the frames. It wouldn't be seen right now. The UK release through Lionsgate had done something similar, but it never looked as good. This is pristine. And I mean, it's an immaculate transfer. And it was one of the greatest things I was part of in my life. That timeline you just said from April and then the release came out, I think, in December. That means you had about four months before you had to deliver? I think I had to deliver everything by the end of July because the attempt was to get it out in October.

Right. Sorry, I'm kind of like spilling some beans here. But the problem was because of COVID, I got my work done. But the work in terms of the restoration. Right. That needed to be perfect. Right. You know, to me, I'll wait an extra. It was worth the wait. Sure.

So we had to get it all done. And then, of course, I did an audio commentary with my friend, Dr. Steve Haberman. And I think we were able to actually bring some new research to the table, which had not been done. Again, this is all through Warner Brothers. I've been working, or I had been working for some years, researching the life of producer Anthony Hines, the producer and the instigator of the Gothic horror movement at Hammer. So thanks to Warner Brothers and my relationship with Warner Brothers, I got special access some years ago to the USC Warner Archive, where I had discovered with the researcher over there, the head of the archives, a first draft script of Curse of Frankenstein. And I was given access for a copy because Warner Brothers, thankfully, they trust me.

I hope they will after this podcast. And so I use that information that no one else had read. I kind of kept that a secret. I was going to write about it in a magazine and I chose not to. And I thought this is the place to reveal it. Right. And thankfully, Warner Brothers let us share for the first time new information, new scenes where the film was originally going to go. Because when you think of a movie like this, or whether it's the original Frankenstein or Gone with the Wind or like a big movie, these bones have been picked over a thousand times. And I felt we had some nuggets that nobody else had. And so for that, I was really proud. Right. That really makes that commentary very valuable. And I have not heard it. So I'm definitely going to listen to that soon. One thing you mentioned about that originally the Blu-'m definitely going to listen to that soon. One thing you mentioned

about that originally the Blu-ray was going to come out in October. Is that right? Did I hear that? I think so. I mean, George wanted it for Halloween. Right. Well, that's my assumption. Yeah. That was, it was going to be that, but you know, COVID just kicked everybody to the, kicked everybody around. Well, that was why when you brought it up, I thought even though the release has been out for nine months, 10 months, there never was the opportunity to talk about the release for Halloween. So even though the Blu-ray has been out for 10 months,

this is the first Halloween. And I thought it'd be fun for us to put it on the podcast today so that you could kind of tell the fans in case anybody missed it or just as a, let's hear the stories about some of those extras that were on that release. That's why we're talking about it today. Let me, let me try to encourage your audience to not only buy this, get your hands on it or rent it or share it or whatever. It's an important movie. It's a fun movie, but there's, there, there are a number of

important aspects to it. Least of all, it's got these incredible performances by Cushing and Lee that made them stars. Right. But the horror film had been dead for a good decade. I mean, after Abbott and Costello meet Frankenstein and there was, yes, science fiction, things were sort of bordering on. But like we're talking blood and there was a sexual component to it. Right. It was a completely transgressive movie.

It had an evil protagonist. It was risky in so many different ways that the barrier that was broken by this film, not only re-energized or really brought back to life. I mean, the piece is called The Resurrection Man. That was my little documentary on that Richard Clemenson talks about the history of the film, all of a sudden shifted. And then not only that, but because of the presentation of blood and sex and gore, all of those things. And it's not just exploitation, but the context in which you could present this material. And we're talking, this is a period drama.

Okay. It's more period drama than it is anything else. Right. Okay. It's more period drama than it is anything else. Right. But then Westerns, action films, all the genre films started being able to like, oh, well look what the horror film did. We can now cross barriers. We can introduce characters that are a little darker. We can, you know, cause we were coming out of the Eisenhower era, all this post-World War II. Right. Curse of Frankenstein changed everything. So George fortunately recognized that. And this release, which has, I think, an hour and a half of special features and commentaries, all the things that we did. Unfortunately, no other Warner Archive, like Warner Archives hasn't had the chance to do any of that yet. We were able now to do a couple of things with Dr. X recently in Mystery of the Wax Museum 2, very exceptional restorations that Warner Brothers put out this year.

But, you know, this was special because it was also the first two disc release that Warner Brothers put out this year. But, you know, this was special because it was also the first two disc release that Warner Archive released. Right. So all these things, I think, just help get everybody excited and see where the future can be. Because again, I just take my hat off to George and thank him for, for what he's done. Right. Yeah. I did want to ask you about the Resurrection Men. That is a fantastic extra. Yeah, I did want to ask you about The Resurrection Man. That is a fantastic extra. And when I watched that, I really learned a lot.

It really puts the context of the Hammer films and how this film was so important to Hammer, to the horror genre, and then also the careers of Peter Cushing and Christopher Lee. So now let's go back and talk about what we teased earlier, which was it and it chapter two, and some of the extras that you created for that. Take me back to when you first were brought on to the first it and how you kind of got involved. Well, fortunately, I think it would be Michael Crawford again at Warner Brothers, who recognized my love of Stephen King and my experience working on movies like Shawshank Redemption or The Green Mile. And this would have been in 2015, 16? I think it was 2016 or thereabouts. So Andy and Barbara Muschietti, the filmmakers, had a on-set filmmaker shooting behind the scenes, but they really wanted someone who was, I guess,

experienced in, and so did Warner Brothers, uh, in, in making these documentaries because it was just a mountain, a mountain of footage. Right. And so I was asked and I was of course, uh, very excited to say yes, of course. And, uh, I think we tried to bring a very personal approach, particularly with our little documentary on The Losers Club. We were able to get Stephen King to talk about the book. And then actually, very interestingly, we had this Pennywise piece, which Barbara was so very smart. I mean, it was her plan. She didn't want to give away all of Bill Skarsgård's great work.

They wanted to keep that a secret because they didn't want to give the magic away. So we had cut this piece and she said she really loved it. And I was really excited because all I want to do is make people happy. Sure. If I can make them happy, then I've done my job, you know?

Because I think if the filmmakers are happy and this dude is happy, then everyone else should be happy, I would think, you know, because that's their film. But then Barbara said, we need to keep, we need to keep the secret of Bill Skarsgård back. Can't show him. So it was kind of hard because I felt like, oh, well, we'll just save it for later. I hope there's a later,

I hope there's a chapter two because Andy and Barbara wanted to make a big documentary. That was what I was told a goal from day one, but they didn't have it. Chapter two hadn't been greenlit yet. And so, um, I just said, I do the best I can like everybody else. And it blew up, right? It just blew up. Yeah, it did. So I was hoping to be back, you know, I think we all kind of hope to be back for the sequel. And, uh, it was just very, very nice, very rewarding and very satisfying and daunting when I got the call saying that they and Warner Brothers, everybody wanted me back to come make this documentary. We had a small window of time to make it because contrary to people's belief, we don't have, as you know, a lot of time when it comes down to it. We have to make our work and turn it in

like really when the movie is done, Right. Well, let's go back a second to that first it, you briefly mentioned the losers club, but we didn't have a chance to go into it for the listener. Tell us a little bit about the losers club and why it's one of your favorites and such a great extra. The great thing about the footage that we had for it chapter one, or really it's just it shot by Mikkel Zoll. He was the filmmaker that the Muschiettis hired to shoot this, was that it was very intimate. You know, the seven young actors that were cast and were just perfect. They really got these characters. I mean, that's the charm of that movie is this incredible cast coupled with Bill

Skarsgård as Pennywise. They were just so open and free and engaging. In fact, they had given the kids, now they're all adults, they'd given them a camera to shoot. They would shoot themselves. You know, there was just this excitement that was captured. And I've seen that on a movie set, especially when I'm on set shooting, especially young actors who there's still a sense of wonder about all of this. And they allow, allowed for that freely to be captured. So what I wanted to do was highlight it. And, and I'm a, I like to think myself, I can be both verite if I need to be, or if I want to be, if the subject matter needs calls for that, or I will be more classical in composition and presentation, but I just love the rawness of it. I love the honesty. So we made this

piece and, and it, I think it to me, I haven't seen it in a while, but I, but I recall that I didn't use any film clips. I just wanted it to be of the moment in the moment. And that aesthetic is what I brought to the summers of it documentary, right? Because I didn't know at the time, if we were going to make that thing, I didn't know there was going to be another movie. So I at least wanted Andy and Barbara to get a sense of what they wanted. And I think it, I think they were touched by it. I think they obviously were happy enough to call me back in and say, let's do it again. Literally let's do it again. And we did. me back in and say, let's do it again. Literally, let's do it again. And we did. And the summers of it, I think there was so much more we could have gone into, but we, we, we actively decided to make

this choice narratively to be half about the first movie and half about the second and challenge with the second movie is you've got twice as many people because of the adult versions of the cats. I did want there to feel like there was a growth. So you saw the kids as younger versions of themselves. And a couple of years later, they're, they're back and they're, they're grown and they're reflecting on, and you've just seen what they've done. So I just wanted the passage of time to be experienced. And I, in that case, we also decided not to use film clips. It was just, there you are. If I could drop you in the middle of things, I would try to do that. The hard part is when you don't shoot it yourself.

And Mikkel was also the cameraman on that as well. So there was the trust bond relationship. And so we kind of were a little team. It was like bringing everybody back together. We were able to pull it off, I think, in a way that was meaningful and satisfactory to the filmmakers. And that's, again, if the fans like it, that's wonderful. But it's a nice encapsulation, I think, of several years of all of these people's lives that they were fully committed and made a movie that touched a lot of people. And particularly that first movie with the kids just was an exceptional horror film for sure.

Yeah. When I watched The Losers Club and then also the other, the summers of it, chapter one and chapter two, I just really enjoyed a couple of things. One is that the kids, just their sense of wonder of being on a film set, of doing a film. And when you see the footage of them, you wouldn't even know they're on a horror film of any kind. They're just doing a film. And what is captured is their friendship and how the director, Andy, and his sister, who's the producer, Barbara, just how they basically put the kids together and made sure that they could bond and at least put the groundwork in there for them to develop real friendships so that they could get through what was almost three months of filming. I mean, that's a heck of a long time. And that is a grueling pace for anybody, let alone a 13, 14 year old kid. Yes, they have a lot of energy, but the amount of concentration

and effort and getting, you know, tapping into energy, but the amount of concentration and effort and getting, you know, tapping into emotion, what all the things that an actor needs to do, that's a lot of work. And they really set up the groundwork for the kids to do all that. And your piece shows that. And then the, the style of the, the footage being shot, the fact that they shot some of it just captures them just being kids. And it's really neat because here you are, you're thinking you're going to be watching an extra for a horror film. And this shows up. It's like a really cool documentary that ties into the film, but in and of itself is a really nice piece of filmmaking. Well, I appreciate that because we wanted that.

We, you know, they wanted that. So I strive for that. My co-editor and I, like my other producing partner, we were all working hard. And of course, everybody at Warner is just like giving us whatever tools we needed to because the expectation was high because everybody's expectation for It Chapter Two was very high. But personally, I was excited to do a couple of things. One was to show the kids, because, you know, there's a lot of difference you go through from age 13 to 15. Right. And those

seven actors did grow up mentally and professionally. They're physically quite different in the second film as well. Yeah. I wanted to represent them. I wanted to give Andy and Barbara the journey that they spent two, three years plus of their lives because they really just went right into the next one. And it was just a long process. But also this goes back to the Pennywise documentary. I didn't get to do that. I really didn't get a chance to dive into Bill.

And so I think what I tried to do is finally have a chance to show bill's work with all the actors right and and shine a light on on his uh masterful creation of that character because if you're a fan of stephen king films and there was there was a lot of excitement for pennywise right sure but there was this iconic performance of Tim Curry who had done it in the TV film. Everyone. How can you how can you have anybody but Tim Curry? Well, I think I think Bill Skarsgård, you know, gave him a run for his money and and really rose to the challenge and gave a absolutely just. I read that book in 1986, 85, 86, and I've read it maybe five, six times every few years. It was like, it's a book to pick up and dive into. And we all have our imagination of what this character could be,

particularly like the tragedy of, I think Bill brought tragedy to Pennywise that had not been perceived, at least for me, both in the book to the degree and not in Tim Curry's performance. So again, it was just exciting to work on. And I hope I was able to give everybody what they wanted in 60 minutes. We're always stuck by runtime, right? Right. Yeah. Those are a lot of fun. And when I think of the work you did on Curse of Frankenstein, which is a very much, you put on your film historian hat, don't you? You really talk about Hammer. You talk about the era. There's just so much that is kind of

the historian of the film. And then you go to a movie like It and It Chapter Two, and some of these extras are different because we're not far enough away from it yet. And the interesting thing when it comes to child actors is that when you document it in time, just two years later, when you do the other pieces for the second chapter, the kids have changed. It's really interesting to see that footage and to watch those kind of back to back the summer of it one and then two. And you just see all the changes in the, in the kids that really makes it that documentary, because when you're watching the film, you, the viewer, you're taken back to your own childhood as guys. You know, I remember being that, that age and the friendships you made

and just the things you went through with your friends of that era. And so to then connect you to those kids through these extras, I think is kind of a brilliant move because you don't want to necessarily give away, especially in the first movie. Absolutely. You don't want to give away all the stuff about Pennywise. I remember Barbara saying she was impressing upon me and Michael, like, take a look at the Stand By Me documentary. There was, there was a lot of, I think they took, again, I'm, I'm saying this, but I remember them suggesting we watch, I'd seen that on some time ago, but I think the idea of Stand By Me being very important

in terms of the relationship of those characters. Right. It's all about character. Yeah. So I thought that must translate into the documentary, especially when you see the kids riding bicycles and training and playing and singing together and swimming together, you know, to me, those were the moments. And then when they engage, this is the trick, you know, you never really get it with, with, I mean, sometimes you get it with, with big stars, but when that, when the actors will engage with the camera, filmmakers engage with the camera, the audience now becomes a part of that, right? Not to say that it always has to happen, but there was enough of that, that I thought I'm

just going to lean into this and allow that to be part of the narratives. All the kids, I tried to give everybody a chance to see the kids, you know, react to the camera. I think, I think it extended a little bit into also the adult actors when we got to chapter two, because Andy and Barbara had made that set so welcoming and so free, obviously a lot of, a lot of work, but the, the love for what they were doing was again, very clear. I think if you watch the doc, you'll just see everybody was just having hard, but they had a good time in the hard work. That second piece, the summer of it, chapter two, where you have the adults was fascinating because just hearing the stories about the casting and how some of the kids actually had a pretty heavy hand in the casting of their adults, or at least they put the request out there.

And then some of it happened to Bill Hader, you know, casting specifically the Jessica Chastain. And then those stories are really interesting. And then just to see them come on and talk about these letters that the kids had written to their older self. That's a really fascinating peek behind the scenes of how, you know, you're watching the movie, you don't know all this stuff has gone on, the scenes of how, you know, you're watching the movie, you don't know all this stuff has gone on, but when you see that extra and you get those stories, it's really fulfilling to watch. And you really enjoy then the film in a sense, even more because you now understand some of the filmmaking part that went into it. And so that was really fun. You use the word extra and that's, that's your podcast. And we've talked off screen about or off camera about this. But by my telling you that I was directed by the filmmakers to watch a documentary and they had known of my Green Mile documentary.

So I think they come from the school of we used to watch this night. We used to enjoy listening and watch. We love movies. We love the process. And so I think those of us that do this, we're trying to share all that. I think that there's, I wouldn't want to say that there's cookie cutter work and then there's not, you know, there's a little bit more effort, but it also does stem from the top. So there are filmmakers. I mean, I got into this through, as I mentioned, Frank Darabont, because Frank loves all of this. There's a reason why Peter Jackson has, you know, four hours or eight

hours or 10 hours of behind the scenes on each one of his movies, because he loves the process and loves sharing it. And, and it's not just, we need a button on the back of the box. Right. And I know, you know what I'm talking about? So like, again, there are some people that care and then, then there's some, I don't think anybody doesn't not like, they don't don't care, but they're probably focused on their movie. The movie is all important and all consuming. But then when there are those that take a little bit of extra time and realize the bigger picture and then trust the people that they're collaborating with, whether or not they think this, but I just feel like I was given a collaborative opportunity. And the only unfortunate thing is I didn't get onto the set. I was hoping it was shot in Canada.

Normally I'd be like picking up my camera and I'd be the one shooting behind the scenes, but I wouldn't have been able to do that in Canada. And I just didn't, I didn't get out there because I was kind of brought on a little, little bit late, but I don't think that stopped us. No. Yeah. You know? person was there, that they had good audio. The kids were playing to camera. They inserted themselves into it so that there was a driving narrative from their perspective as well as filmmakers. So it wasn't just kind of, Hey, the kids are playing. No, their presence makes sure that you see how that plays right back into the filmmaking process. They wanted the kids to bond so that when it comes to on screen, they're really looking out for each other. They're helping each other.

They're really crying because they're feeling their friend being beat up, being in danger, all of that. So that that was really a huge part of the filmmaking as well as you used. I know in the first one, a lot of their casting audition tapes, which was really fun to see as well. We got access, as you said, to those letters, to the tapes. The hardest part is knowing that the, we all have to make choices. So in this particular doc, the agreement was to, to focus on the filmmakers being Andy and Barbara and the journey of these actors. And it, it, it did make sense because that's the story of it. These characters going through the trials and growth and adult and child and intercutting that. But all of the cool stuff

about the making of, despite people not maybe needing to watch a makeup featurette or how they did this or built this set, that movie had so much of that. Or those two movies were just, I mean, I did these, uh, these next gen tracks. I was writing all these facts and trivia and so much information. And I, as a fan would have loved to have shared that, but we had to make a choice because of the runtime. Right. And what are we going to do? And, and telling a narrative story, we thought we were going to follow these people. I wished I could have had a little more time to do things on the actual production, but I believe those were on the DVD. So there were other pieces being done on, well, there was other pieces on the Blu-ray.

And I think I, as I said, we had maybe three or four months, very short amount of time to go through for two movies, probably 200 hours. I mean, it was a lot of footage. So I have to thank my editor, Michael Falvolita and my other producing partner, Emily Moore for really standing up and putting in the long, long, long hard hours, as well as Michael Crawford and the team at Warner Brothers for trusting me to do this. So it's a collaboration. Well, for those fans out there of the IT movies, IT and IT Chapter Two, if you haven't had a chance to watch those extras, be sure and take a look at those. Those are a lot of fun.

Why don't we transition now and talk about some of the recent releases you have been working on. I know one of them is Kolchak, The Night Stalker. Kolchak, The Night Stalker was a 1974 television series that was a spinoff of the Dan Curtis, Richard Matheson, Darren McGavin horror TV movie, The Night Stalker. They made The Night Strangler and then they said, oh, we'll make a television series. And it's very beloved among fans. I'd say almost half of the episodes, a third of the episodes were written by famed Sopranos creator David Chase. So if you're a Sopranos fan, you should check this out. I'm just trying to win the audience members here. But yeah, I contributed a couple of commentaries to this. The thing is, Kulshak was the forerunner, let's just say, of the X-Files. I mean, that's been acknowledged by Chris Carter. So the reporter every week coming across something supernatural or scientific or

alien. And it's just a fun show. And I think did some cool stuff. And it's, again, very beloved. Kino Lorber put it out. And I had the pleasure of working on, on a couple of tracks, the werewolf and the devil's platform with my friend, producer and writer, Rodney Barnes. We just sat around and chatted a lot of hard work still, because again, when you're doing it, especially you work in TV, not a lot of facts to be found in terms of detailed and hard, hard facts, primary sources when it comes to call sheets and records and production documents for a 1970s television show. Right. So we had to do a lot of, a lot of digging. And I thank my friend, Mark DeWidziak for sharing

information. Another thing that's coming out in about, I think next month is the other very famous horror television show, Rod Serling's Night Gallery, which Kino is also putting out. And I contributed a track to, you know, this is just a great time for classic movies, classic TV shows. And I'm just happy to kind of say yes when I'm asked, you know. So when you do those tracks, you put on kind of your film historian hat and you do a commentary for the specific episodes. Is that how that works? Yeah. Yes. So for a good dozen years or more, I've produced hundreds or more, maybe a thousand commentary tracks from animated shows, TV shows to feature classics.

classics and having written so much and, and been able to like do really in-depth research. I thought, well, I can, I can do this on films that I'm really passionate about. Right. So we talked about Frankenstein and what I was able to bring to the Curse of Frankenstein, uh, Kolschak, Night Gallery. I've tried to do the same, but yeah, you have to put on a different hat to put in the work. And in the last two years, you know, with the Academy Library being down, all of the research has been kind of cut off from historians. It's been a lot of people helping one another to get the information we need. I will say I did one this summer. I did the Dead Zone, David Cronenberg's The Dead Zone with Steve Haberman. And once I waved my hand to Cliff McMillan, who I thank so

much for allowing me to do all of these Scream releases. I waved my hand saying, I want to work on the dead zone. He said, well, we've got a lot, we got another producer working on it. But I said, well, how about a commentary is, did you get Cronenberg? No, no, he's too busy. Well, I'll do it. And then he's like, okay, you got it. And I thought to myself, what did I just do? What did I just do? Because I love Stephen King. I've worked with him. He's still alive. Oh man. And I know the fans will go nuts if I go wrong, if I make the wrong move. Cronenberg, one of my favorite directors, what did I just do? He's still alive. So I took that extremely seriously, did the research. I even, through my friend Tyson Blue, we contacted Steve King's

office and said, do you have that first draft script? I'm just asking Stephen King directly. Can I borrow your script? I said, no, no, we don't want to share that. It's fine. But, um, you know, the, the responsibility is a big one. I think some films more than others, having been on that side of it, where I'm expecting kind of high end quality, I put that pressure on myself. So hopefully the fans don't feel disappointed when I provide whatever I can from the scraps of information we can get. Yeah. Well, I'm sure it's greatly appreciated. That's why people buy and want to collect and have these discs that have the great extras that have the great commentaries, provide

more information and give a little bit of background on the film, the actors, the scripts, and help place it also, if it's an older classic film or TV show in history, in film history, in television history. And that's a lot of fun for those who are older. We remember watching these shows. And then for those who are younger, who are coming to them and they watch a disc like this, they can obviously stream some of these shows, but you don't really know the context of how to appreciate a, or I've been a member of a writer's room, which I

have been like, I've done some of the things that I think from the filmmaking standpoint, I can't ask David Cronenberg, do I dare make a supposition? But on some of these things I try, especially like with the television show, and I'm trying to do a commentary on Kolchak and guessing why they did what they did. Well, you just have to break it down by how many days. And there, I did a track on this episode called the werewolf. It was shot all on the Queen Mary. I've been to the Queen Mary. I know what it's like. I also know that you've got a small window of time to make a TV episode, a TV show. If you've got five days, how do you maneuver? How do you best use your time? You're shooting nights. It's a lot of calculation. Right. So from having shot down in Long Beach myself Beach myself, I've never shot on the Queen Mary, but I've shot on boats for TV shows.

I'm taking all that experience. You know, I did a track on John Badham's Dracula and I've worked with John Badham. And thank God he was very nice enough to allow me to do a track because I wrote this very lengthy history of his film. There's a stretch of that movie that takes place on a beach and holy cow, with all the extras and all the work and they constructed sets on this beach in the movie Dracula. I was part of the film. I was on the majestic. We shot for a couple of days on a beach. I know what that's like and how hard it is to shoot in sand and trying to get the gear down there. And you got to remember all those things. So I'm trying, whenever I do this, bring whatever little experience I have. If there's a nugget of,

oh, that relates to my experience. I try to contextualize it. And if it's useful, great. If I make too many suppositions, well, at least I'm coming at it with an attempt to share insider knowledge. Well, it's been great sitting down and talking with you today, Constantine. Thank you. I mean, you too. It's been a long time coming. Just talk about movies. We've run the gamut of a few different things, but I think it's been a fun kind of little

horror Halloween discussion of some classic horror older with Curse of the Frankenstein and the two It movies, which are modern day classics for the horror genre. I definitely agree. I think those two films will be spoken of in the same breadth as some of the other classics we've been mentioning. Well, we'll have to get you back on the show before too long to talk about some of the other projects that you've worked on. But thanks

for coming on the show today. Thank you so much for having me. Happy Halloween, everybody out there. And don't skip the extras because they're worth watching and worth listening to. Thanks once again to filmmaker and film historian Constantine Nassar for coming on the show today to talk horror extras. For those of you interested in learning more about the titles that we discussed, please visit the website at www.theextras.tv. Also, follow the show on Facebook or Twitter at The Extras TV or Instagram at TheExtras.TV to stay up to date on the latest episodes and for exclusive images and behind the scenes information about the episodes and upcoming guests. And if you're enjoying the guests we have in the show, please subscribe and leave us a review at iTunes, Spotify, or your favorite podcast provider. Until next time, you've been

listening to The Extras with Tim Millard. Stay slightly obsessed. The Extras is a production of Otaku Media, producers of podcasts, behind the scenes extras, and media that connects creatives with their fans and businesses with their consumers. Contact us today to see how we can work together to achieve your goals at www.otakumedia.tv or look for the link in the show notes.