The Fighter & The Kid - The MeatEater Steven Rinella | TFATK Ep. 930

Episode Date: September 26, 2023

Steven Rinella joins the show and discusses the craziest, wildest, best and worst things he's eaten during his hunting and fishing adventures around the world, how he started MeatEater, getting trichinosis from eating raw bear, being considered the Michael Jordan of hunters, taking Joe Rogan and Bryan Callen hunting, future plans on taking Brendan Schaub on his first hunting trip and much more! Magic Mind - https://magicmind.com/ HelloFresh - https://hellofresh.com/50tfatk And use code 50tfatk for 50% OFF House Of Macadamias - Get a free gallon of Macadamia Milk when you visit https://houseofmacadamias.com/tfak - just add milk to your cart with any products and use code TFAK

Yes we did, cause we back at it again It's the fight only in the kid This is really the fight only kid Come on baby What's that? You good? Running an empire now? Huh? When I did, you were just a guy who was on this

Outdoor channel, now you're like Mr. Netflix Right, you've changed dude, you fucking changed It's unbelievable, plus you've probably obviously had a lot of work done on your face. It's expected. Oh, we're talking about that this morning watching the Mark Kelly show. Oh, it's a turner. That fucker looks good.

He looks damn who does? Kelly Ripa's husband. Mark is always good. I met Mark 25 years ago and he was like, he had played soccer. I need to get his fucking dentist. He was such an... He was a dentist in the race. I remember, she was the best looking,

she was the coolest, funniest, hottest... She's super-faceted. Gal ever. When 25 years ago, I remember going, well, I want to marry her because I would... I'd move her in my house right now. What happened? Talk to her for 10 minutes. Because Mark's been here. Oh, because I'm not Mark move her in my house right now. What happened?

Mark's because I'm not Mark's gonna. Well, I'm a piece of shit. That's why but otherwise I Know yeah, yeah, yeah, obviously. Yeah Kelly Ripa come on dude. I was cute. I was younger Yeah, me Kelly just saw him in the mirror next to me and I was like you're enormous and he goes yeah You're you're small. What is shaking up?? This is magic wine, you wanna try some? It's a, it's a neutropic, but it's like really, really good. It's invented by a guy. This guy invented it. He had heart trouble. He, he, he's a huge tech guy.

So you're gonna tell me a pseudo science thing? No, no, no, no. He, he, he said, how do I, how do I get like five hours of energy without caffeine? Okay. Try that. Tell me what you think. It makes your coffee last all day.

Well, why does it got, oh, a bunch of like medical shit on it? It doesn't. These are adapted gins mushrooms, matcha, all kinds of things. Trust me. It's great. I love it. Take it every day. It doesn't make it like shit. You're paying. No, no, no, no, no, do it. It's all natural. Yeah. It's all natural. And there's about 10 years worth of science in it. Give it a shot. Yeah, you bet it. You bet it. You bet it.

I feel like that hurts the cause when you're 10 years of science. It's funny, there's ayahuasca and you're like, what the hell? That's where we're at with society. There's 10 years of science. Even when I heard them, I'm like, I wouldn't take it. Yeah. You keep checking the family for you, but today, is your phone on silent? Yeah. No, but I want you to take a time to what you think

See if you feel it's so it's not like a it's not like a hallucinja. No, no, no, no No, it's literally like a magic mushroom through me. Yeah, yeah, it's like a natural five hour energy thing See see even do you have a black guy right now? There's my vision bad No, you're good. Well well, it must be the lighting. I'm gonna say your vision's bad, but no. You don't have a little bit of a black guy, it might be the shadow. Let me see.

Does it look, on your eyes angles, is it our lighting? Yes, look at the light. I don't, I don't think it's that. That's from holding a scope against his eye. That's for, I don't know if people think he got, that's for the whole murder. I don't know if people think he has black eyes

if our lighting. It's from all the murder he does. He would, no, I think I'm lighting. It's from all the murder he does. He would. No, I think I'm poorly lit. You know, my nickname, my nickname, I've been hunting with Stephen four times now. Yeah, the inconsiderate mountain goat hiker. You are the inconsiderate mountain goat hiker.

Yeah, no, I asked someone, someone made me some merch that said that on it. Well, because you, when it's only one thing, what is it? It's like your t-shirt. Yeah, well, you take us, you take us to, like wherever the most uncomfortable place is. If there's a trail, Steve Rinalo goes,

I'm not gonna do the trail, let's walk through the thorn bushes in the water. And then he goes, let's sleep in water. It's better to be wet the whole time because you want to be miserable. I did it. And he never gets tired, he's a mountain goat and Rogan and I are just, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, hhh, like a real long hike with Joe. To find long.

Well, 12 miles. Well, I don't know, that's his long. Yeah, that'd be good, right? Watch this, watch this, ready? But then it's like to do that. I would think if you'd, if to hike that far a number of days in a row, I would regard as a good, that's a good hike with elevation change, right? They called me the cashmere killer

because I bring, I wear cashmere. But then they called me dead eye because I can see everything. I don't need to glass a few. Did Brian kill anything when he went? Stephen, even with your help, did it? Yeah, killed a, no, no, let him answer. Let him answer.

He knows. No, no, no, I said you picture. No, no, no, no, let him answer. You got a, the first time we went, the one we met, you got a deer, you got a wilder. You got a baby deer. If the spot on the horizon, I dropped that bad boy.

My finger was steady, I became one with the deer, I could feel it's heartbeat. And that was linked up through meat eaters? Is that how you eat eaters? Yeah, so that's how we met. We met, well, I went on Joe's podcast. In fact, I always tell people this. The first time I ever heard the word podcast

was in context of Joe's show. Makes sense. Yeah. I didn't know who he was or what it was. You just got to invite to come on the show. Yeah, and a friend of mine, Helen, Joe was like, you really need to go and I'll go with you. It she took me, so we went, did Joe show.

And then I did Joe show one or two times, I can't remember. How long, sorry, how long ago? Oh, over a decade. Oh, so right at the start, really. Long time ago, yeah. And we hit it off, talked about, and he was interested in hunting.

So I took him, I think he was so new to it. I think you might have been. He hadn't been. He hadn't been hunting. He hadn't been. So he wanted to bring you because he likes hanging out with you. I remember he said he sent me a video of you when you were doing a book signing and a vegan, rather mills and vegan. No, he was chill. He was cool. He was thoughtful. But Joe said watch this guy how he responds to this vegan he's very thoughtful as a person with the vegan do well he's kind of challenged even but

seem said look I'm I respect your stance but I have a feeling that you don't know as much about animals as I do and I don't you know you kind of made this case which is to be a good hunter, you've got to have tremendous respect for animal behavior and understand animal behavior and it's habitat. And you made this great sort of argument for it, which I think convinced him. It kind of like, it was a really awesome exchange.

And then did you say, and also because you're vegan, you probably don't have the energy if we get in a fight. He didn't look like a super energetic feller, but... That's my joke up on you. To this guy's credit. So this dude, he totally played by the rules.

This is also long time ago. But I was promoting a book. I was in New York. It was in a bookstore. He waited till the question part, raised his hand, and asked a question. Good for him. It wasn't like, you know... He didn't storm in. Yeah, or like like you know just disrupting or throwing shit. He he

Do you see like any questions? He had a question and it was you know Don't you think this is all justification? Rationalization and then had a pamphlet. He wanted to be the you know you can do But you know, I mean we didn't become bodies. I did, I told him I'd read his pamphlet. I read his pamphlet, but no, he didn't do anything like, he was, he did just what he's supposed to do. Here's what you should do.

On your show, you should have a segment dedicated, you invite vegans, you guys go out, way out, do some alpine hunting, your way out in the wilderness, they bring broccoli, you bring meat, and we see how long it takes for them to fucking die. Yeah.

You know what I'm saying? Yeah, maybe. Because you're not going to last that long. There's some bad-ass vegans out there, but you know, there's some gnarly vegans. I do a body-mind. You have to be specific about how you eat, though. A body-mind was telling me that, uh, yeah, I don't think about, vegans come up a lot. I don't think about, vegans come up a lot. I don't think about them a bunch.

Me neither, but. I don't think it's unhealthy. I think you can be really healthy and be a vegan. A buddy of mine who, right. He had a friend who was a mountaineer and he was vegan. A disfriend would, accorded my body.

This friend would drink olive oil. Just is trying to think of a way to... Gangster. He was a vegan and he did that. He was a vegan. So he would drink slugs of olive oil. All in. Have you ever met a guy who was a vegan?

Have you known athletes who were vegans? Is that a dumb question? In what regard? I know there are athletes who are vegan in the NFL or in the industry. No way. No, because they like to win. It'd be tough.

I do think that you can be very healthy and be a vegan, obviously, but it's a lot of work, I would imagine. You can get a lot of what you need from. Yeah, even if half, I don't know what percent Well, if I was the only person who wasn't a vegan It wouldn't bother me right if it didn't change if I was still able to just do what I do Yeah, brockley tastes like Stay can eat brock, but I like like when you said that why ask him

What what do you eat when you're in the mountains and you need energy at night What is it that you because when it comes to besides meat? You like I asked you all like what kind of stuff to be bring. Yeah Oh, it's all kinds of shit cuz cuz I I'm already I said to you What do you do when you're in the mountains and you're really hungry and you know you want to recover? I was like cuz I was all in the nutrition and you go candy. Yeah. So what are you candy?

Like on, so we just got back from, just got back from Moosehunting in Alaska. So that would be, you know, go for 10 days. It has weight restrictions on how much stuff you could bring on a super cup on an airplane. So what normal diet would look like would be instant oatmeal in the morning with the little envelopes of instant coffee. Then shit like miso packages, suit packages,

summer sausage, cheese, and then bars. Sounds fantastic so far. And then at night would be, the problem is, so freeze dry meals at night, but it's hard to do freeze dry 10 days. Yeah. But if just for a couple nights out, back packing, that always freeze dry Yeah, why why is it hard to freeze dry it 10 days just after

Well, it's really I'd love to understand better what what happens But I mean there's nothing more perfect for two days three days four days, but after a while it just takes a Just takes toll I felt started and did you did you take down some big moose when you're out there? Yeah, I got a really big moose man I'm not saying it man. They're cool. I don't mind saying I mean, I'm so big. I get wait I'm not saying I'm just saying they're cool man when you close their monster I've wanted to get a big one for a long time and I've carried a lot of people's moose but

It been in on a lot of moose since I finally got a real big one of my own. That's a lot of meat. You like some man-beating? This guy went to this guy's like a... Oh, there's the moves, Alan's right there. Yeah, that's a stud. How much meat did you harvest out of that? Oh my god, that's hundreds and hundreds of pounds.

How'd you hoof that bad boy? We only had a walk at a half mile. Oh man. Because that's hellish. And what do you take a moose down with? I'll shut that out of the rifle. I use throwing stars. Dude, dude, why would someone go back to into that moose thing? Look at the comment. They're first of all they're following you. The first comment is, please tell me that animal died of natural causes and wasn't killed.

Fucking shut up. Yeah. Hey, man. A knife, yeah, a bullet to the heart. Yeah, the died of natural causes that we proceeded to. Um, but why would they follow you? I assume this died of death. How about this guy? One more year. Back in.

You know, a real nice one. One more year. Is that right, bro? Are those horns not big enough? You fucking one upper? Because that doesn't it helps? Stephen and Krakmy even correct me if I'm wrong but if you take out the bulls which older bulls because they take out the the younger oh no that's not that's not a thing he that's not real I made that up no he's at the peak of

it's like a bull that big is gonna um when you get like with servants or you know members of the dear family and a bunch of other animals, you get, they don't have a retirement phase. So, females will, but males generally go, like it's an ascendancy to peak and then it's usually death. Yeah, they don't have, they don't have like a period of like, to peak and then it's usually death. Yeah, they don't have a period of like, sonility.

Oh, interesting. Yeah, they rise, rise, take like a whitetail deer which live everywhere. I mean, virtually ever. You hunt whitetail deer at all 47 states or something like that. So they go, go, go, go. And then they get to their peak period six or seven years of age, if they're really lucky and they don't make any mistakes, nothing bad happens to them. And they'll be at like dominance and probably do more breeding, dominate other males, and then

it is done. God. They just die. Females, you know, females can go on and on and on, but you don't find like with mostly species like that, they they wind up investing so much energy. For instance, a moose. So his rod is September, October, late September, early October, and winner begins. Winner is beginning during his brought his breeding season. They, they, more or less stop eating. They're competing with a bunch of their males. They drive themselves. They like work so hard during that period and they get hit by a winner and they get toast.

Damn. They just die. Are they gonna eat and or something? Yeah, they just, they just deplete themselves and they're, they're subject to dying, meaning if, like, point being like, let's say you take a sheep, a big horn sheep and his prime is gonna be, like, eight, nine, 10 years old. You just, I'm not saying you,

I'm basically saying you don't, like if a ram is at his prime at nine or 10, you do not find 13 year old rams. You just don't find 13 year old rams. They will not be around. They just after fighting and and rotting they burn themselves out yeah it get killed and then also predation from you know hunters but even in areas that aren't hunted they don't they go from peak to dead wow and mountain line hunt moosa are they too big for a mountain line oh yeah where they overlap they definitely would.

Yeah, especially bears. Bear is right. Yeah, they'll hunger. Grizzlies. Yep. But no that like that bull you're not. If you want to control. If for some reason you want to lower moose numbers and that's generally not an issue, you know,

because there's not a ton of. There's not a ton of agricultural damage that moose numbers and that's generally not an issue, you know, because there's not a ton of, there's not a ton of agricultural damage that moose cause. Around municipalities, you might sometimes want to lower moose numbers just for the sake of lowering them because of vehicle collisions. But with deer and elk, when they get, when they come agricultural nuisances, and they want to lower their numbers, you kill females. You kill a female, you kill every baby she's ever gonna have. You kill a male, you've removed one, and then all the females will get bred anyways. Oh, interesting.

So you don't, you're not like, you're mechanically removing one creature. You kill a female, that's what you could drop, no. So if they want to drop numbers, it's getting people to kill doves. What's funny is I grew up in Michigan and Michigan, they just sent out a letter. The fishing game agency just sent out a letter to hunters basically saying, you people need to kill doves. Like we're way over objective on deer numbers and culturally people don't want to kill doves. I was shocked to hear that they're like we're way over objective on dear numbers

and culturally people don't wanna kill those. I was shocked to hear that they're killing fewer do's now than they were in the past, begging people to kill females. Wow. So they want to drop numbers. Yeah, cause you want them rack, the horns, it makes sure they're a man.

I'll eat the shot, kill the shit out of a dough, it's so delicious to meet. Let's take a little break. So we take a break through? Now, Greenboro, North Carolina, never been there, but I'll be at the comedy zone there. So, that'd be fun. And then we got some, then we got some skank fest.

We're just skank fest. This coming weekend, next month, I am in Iowa. That's in October, that's October 13th. The Buc, the Buc, the Buc. That's October 13th and 14th. That's just Friday, Saturday, only. The Niagara Falls almost sold out casino up there November 4th and 5th,

I caught one December and that's it. But I will see you Iowa, October 13th and 14th. Then Skankfest, Vegas baby, we're taking over. Skankfest, we're doing a podcast, live podcast. It's gonna be a lot of fun. Doing spots, it's a comedy festival We have some comedy festival now we got the ultimate hunter on the show today But the food on here to talk to about you don't have to hunt

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Wow. Yeah. That is hellofresh.com slash 50TFATK, and you've called 50TFATK for 50% off, plus 15% off the next two months. Hellofresh, America's number one meal kit. Stay fresh. Can you talk to me about fantasy guru? I'll tell you what, it's fantasy gurus.

Listen, I'm not an expert like the guys at fantasy gurus, but I can tell you don't bet on my freaking Debra Broncos who lost 70 to 20 to the Miami Dolphins. Did they lose 70 to 20? Did they? Did they really? Yeah, 70 to 20. 70 to 20.

And then my seatbelt. I didn't hurt them anything, being either at the NFL level. That's the greatest thing I've ever heard of my life. Was this a high school game? Yeah, against a pro team. Yeah, 70 to 20 dude. What this is we're what we're on three We're so bad someone's head needs to run away around because I would rather have him than Russell Wilson Oh my and then also my see buffs got their tails kicked by Oregon

So don't don't yeah, I was but don't take my picks, let the experts do it with fancy guru. I'm talking about legit experts, giving you guys their picks, whether it's NFL UFC, don't listen to me in Drake or Brian Cown, take the experts here at fancy guru and to get their picks and their advice, go to fancy guru.com, use the code shop for 20% off. That's fancy guru.com fantasy fantasy Fantasy guru.com use the code shop you get 20% off for the expert picks fantasy guru.com use code shop SCH a you b for a 20% off You know side you don't be they killed like you don't dog darn yeah, you want a dog's place. Yeah great best made I've ever had besides you the best meat I've ever had

To interrupt you really quickly was the beaver that we ate it dogs. Yeah, he trap was good He trapped me for a taste all time. He eat the tail. No, he trapped he trapped beaver and He stewed it. He stewed it with potatoes and carrots That was the best meat I've ever had a mother. Am I wrong about that? Well, the meter was at the stew. You might just make a fire Like it's almost 10 minutes. Yeah, beaver? But you wouldn't know, dude. If you paid, here's the thing.

I wasn't wood flavored. I'll tell you this. I'll tell you. I'm hilarious today. I want to get into that, to the, to the eating beaver. Oh yeah, there's no joke to keep. There's two things that are tapped out. Yeah.

Sausage bacon, when you're making, when you're stuffy sausage, there's no joke that has been made. Yeah, there's no joke. There's two things that are tapped out. Sausage bacon, when you're making, when you start a sausage, there's no joke that has been made. Yeah, that's right. When it comes to consumption of Americana's cast, or what's the name of the name of beaver? I think you got it. Americana's cast, stories. So when it comes to eating Americana's cast, stories,

or whatever it is, there's no joke that has been made. Doug, on the Duran family farm, so a few hundred acres of ground Wisconsin, he's real aggressive about killing those. They're killing 30 doves a year off that farm. Damn, you can't get a grip on them. Oh, the meat is so good, I can't tell you guys. You can't get a grip on,

they can't get a grip on deer numbers around them. But that's an anomaly. Most people don't want to, but when I was a little kid, if you drew a doe tag, you know, because deer just, have, wait till deer just explode, all over the range. If you drew a doe tag when I was a kid, you were fired up and excited.

Because it was so rare. They've even now, some states have even now toyed with these things that you can't, that they toyed with these programs, which are called the earn a buck. They're saying to try to get people to kill those. They've tried to system where you can't kill a buck until you've killed a doe.

Oh, dang. But you can't get people to do it. They did you. Now that you can't, they can't get people to do it to the degree they want them to try to lower deer numbers. Did you see the size of the mountain line that Doug, I'm sorry that Derek Wolf took down?

Because I always thought mountain lines were 150 pounds top. That was a giant one. This thing's 220 pounds. When he gutted it, when he gutted it and skinned it, I think it weighed 170 pounds. Yeah. Like I didn't know they were that big. Was that a huge takeoff?

That is a huge takeoff. Now, now, Bubba, Derek Wolf is 673. He's not 67, he's about six. Ah, he's about 67. I was looking up, Chen. I was a 67D line would be, Bubba, he's 67. Bring it up, Chen.

Next one. That's a big line. 65? Yeah. Okay. There's no 67D line. I'm telling you, he's tall, I'm not, but he's six haven't bring it up to you next That's a big line six five. Yeah, okay. There's no six on D line. I'm telling you his tall out map, but okay He's well, what do you argue? What do you argue? He thinks this guy six seven? I know I've worked out what he died all the Gods are not six. All right, but I the way that'd be weird six five two eighty five about yeah, maybe heaven and that's Sometimes okay, so but he's hunting in Colorado. But look at that line. No, no, so it's huge line. It was a lot like, he's seven feet.

They struck that, they struck. Sorry, he's seven, seven. He's seven. They struck that track. He was slouching around you and when they measured him, keep going. Now, yeah, when those lions get that, where they get that ripple,

they get like that Marlon Brando, like ripple, fat ripple, on their head. That's big, but they struck that lion track, or he had killed that lion and killed it, Mildir. Hell yeah. And dragged it under some guy's porch. Jesus. But I'm not like, I'm like way pro-line, I'm not like an anti-mountain lion guy. In other words, you're not anti-hunting them. Who's anti-line, though? Are there people who are anti-mountain guy. In other words, you're not anti-hunting them. Who's anti-line though?

Are there people who are anti? There are people, yeah, there are people who just hate predators. See, I find it more intriguing, like if we're going to hunt if you're like, hey man, there's this lion killing people in the village, I'm like, yeah, time me up. Yeah.

I'm about to, he was killing deer in the village. Yeah, I don't think it's fine. But here's the thing, but I'm all for hunt lines. Look at this. I think that lions should be, like, I like village. Yeah, that thing is fine. But here's a take, but I'm all for hunt lions. Look at this. I think that lions should be, like, I like lions. Yeah. Be it out there, I like grizzly bears be it out there, I like wolves be it out there, I like there to be a lot of them.

I like you to be able to hunt for them. Yeah. I'm not like a get out, kill all the lions guys. I have a thing about, I don't want to hunt them. I don't like hunting anything that's, that I, I wouldn't eat. Why don't you eat the lion? I don't think it doesn't feel like it would be very good meat Dude you don't know what you're talking about is that right? Yeah, you don't know shit

Hey, let me help you. Hey, don't know shit. You'll be quiet all that talk about all that stuff, you know Mountain lines good you can email line. Yeah, very good very And this isn't just acting like shit. It's good. It's not but be right there I'm gonna say one thing's bad though That's what's alarming. Oh, I'll say something. I'll take you to your 10 days into a hike I'm sure that mountain that's Ryan tails, but I don't mind talking about I'll take a I'll tell you things that that are not that are hard to deal with Gold and I ducks a hard to deal with

Mergansers are hard to deal with some are cancer. It's a A hard to deal with. Mergansers are hard to deal with. It's a Merganser. It's a migratory bird that is hunted. You mean just eating them or not? I'm just like, yeah, you got it. It's, what I'm trying to do is stay out with straight down if you've lost track of where we're at here.

Nothing. No, no, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm about like challenging you. I know you drink on there, mushroom shit. No, I just get, I get lost in your eyes. So what I'm saying is you're saying like, I say everything's good. I think a lot of things are good,

but I don't think that everything's good. I think something's a hard to deal with. So somebody says to me like cooking mergansers. Something we've never heard of, but okay. Right there. I guarantee you've seen. You have the most obscure duck. There's one species in the duck

that you don't find appetizing. That's literally in the whole animal kingdom. No, I didn't, you're gold knives. Gold knives. I was there a legit duck. Of course they, they're, some are gads or I'm just pointing out a handful of examples of things.

So you're eating, you're eating it with some lignin berry. You'd be like, is this a gold knife? But what big animal don't is the worst to eat? He'll eat them all. Uh, havelinas can be challenging. What the hell is a havelinas? Collard Packer, you've seen them. Yeah, I've tough, yeah. Pull the a havin' it? A collard packer, you've seen them.

Yeah, I'm tough. Pull the havelinas. Bring up a collard packer. And don't touch that in your collar pack. Don't touch that in the U-port. Oh, God. That's, of course, he's not tasting. West Texas, Arizona.

That's a wild boar, bank bag. So that, no, it's not, it's a packer. Oh, okay. And is that a thing? Everybody thinks it's a boar. Is that it? Is that indigenous to Texas? No. Well, Oh, okay. And is that a picture? Everybody thinks it's a board, it's not. Is that a picture? Is that a picture?

Is that a picture? Is that a picture? Is that a picture? No. Well, yeah, so what's interesting about these deals? Okay, so you have three packeries. You have the collared packery. Yeah.

The Chicoan Packery. I know. And the white lip packery. Yeah, the white lip, yeah. So these, what's interesting about these is it seems that these are, have been in a northward expansion. Meaning, if you go back and look at cave art and other pictographs and things, you don't see them represented in areas they now live.

It's like they've, during the historic period, or since Europeans arrived in the New World, it seems that Havelen have moved north into areas They hadn't or there wasn't like an indigenous awareness of them, but they taste awful I don't want to call the brothers awful, but yeah, oh here's something it's awful Kaya meat is awful. Yeah, I make sense. Oh, let's get sense. I don't like coyote meat, I don't like cart meat. What's cart, cart? Carp fish.

Yeah, cart. Yeah, that's bad. I don't like cart. Well, that's globally. That's one of the most consumed fish in the world. Yeah. The Bible, the Old Testament has all these rules about what you can't eat. Like osprey, I think like you can't eat lion.

There's all kinds of stuff. Well, you can only eat stuff that's got a, you can only eat stuff. You've got to split hook. Right. And that's some of that might be because you stuff. Well, you can only eat stuff that's got a, you can only eat stuff that's got a split hook. Right. And that's some of that might be because you can get kind, you can get like trick and osu, it's like, well no, here's what's happened. You never hear of the,

Kryn, you know about the Habbad, how the Habbad. Yeah. For your viewers at home, Kryn's over there. Yeah. The only one that knows what that is. Yeah. So I had a long, long ago, I had a girlfriend who was Jewish and she was a writer and it just, I'll spare you all the details.

We went to this place where you go to these really like hard, hit and traditional, conservative Jewish like like, or the Orthodox. Yeah, but they would, the Hobad were like traditional orthodox who would have a dialogue with reformed or non-observant Jews. So rather than being coistered away, they would be like. They would engage in debate. Yeah, they would like engage with, particularly with non-observant Jews or reformed Jews, whatever.

It would give you a way to, like, for these worlds to mesh. So I went with there one time to this deal. And at the end of it, we were sitting around talking. I was asking a bunch of questions about hunting. How would you, how could hunting ever be reconciled with the Old Testament? Because if you get into a casher root and like kosher slaughter, the animal has to be killed with a blade, like cut to a throat. So I was like, well, how would you ever hunt? And he said, you would have to, I mean, if you were going to kosher

slaughter a deer, you would need to catch it in a net, um, and capture it alive and then bring it to a kosher slaughter who would do the ritual slaughter and, and then examine the lungs. They were shepherds. You were trying to make bank, bro. But what I was saying, what I was asking about this whole deal, and I was saying, like, you know, is the prohibition on pork because of trickinosis? And he was careful to point out, he's like, you, we don't know why God said what God said.

It's like not our job to site, to determine what he was getting at. He said, don't eat it, don't eat it. We'll never know why he said, don't eat it. And so it's not about tricking noses or disease. It does seem to make sense, he said, don't do it, don't do it. But you can eat foul, you can eat for example, you can eat duck, you can eat chicken. But not raptors. No, you can't eruptors, you can't eat osprey, you can't. So in the book of Leviticus, you can eat chicken. But not raptors. No, you can eat raptors, you can eat osprey.

So in the book of Leviticus, they talk about that. And that would make sense because eagles are scavengers. And they eat a lot of carrion. And when you eat an animal that eats carrion, which is also what pigs do, bush pigs will eat, for example, anything lying around, right? So things that die, we were in Africa and this zebra kind of broke its leg and it kind of died and they said the bush pigs

Will get away before the lions do Yeah, so maybe that's part you but you you can eat beer though, right? You said to cook it Can't eat beer. I don't think you want me home. It can't meaning no, okay Are you talking about according to the old test? No, I'm not I'm not I'm talking about you and you don't want to last the All you think though, okay, please Okay, right. I'm carrying and scavengers. How about this one?

No smooth skin to fish. That's it, I know. No shellfish, right? No shellfish, no smooth skinfish. Anything without skin. So they define like scales and fins, which would be, so here's the trick. Historically, you wouldn't be able to consume shark because it was not a scaled fish,

but now the new understanding of a shark's skin is it kind of is a scaled fish? Or, so do you open it up? So anyways. But again, even that, so you know a shellfish. The problem is you get a bad clam or a bad oyster. Good luck with that. That's gonna be a long day for you.

Well, I need to take all your arguments down to the Habbad house. Bears are very good. No, bears are great. You got to cook it well done. You got to brine it, right? So I got that. I got trickin' osus years ago from raw bear meat. What, why'd you do raw? Well, just being dumb. We we were even so even I know not to do that. Yeah. I'm a city boy. So here's a couple. This is all got it right. Four of us got it. It's the rest of the story because the worm. Yeah, some worm deal. It's a worm deal. So the the the state where I live in Montana back in the I don't know when it ended, but back in the I don't know when it ended but back in the late 90s you could uh the state would do free tricking osu testing so when you killed a bear you could send that bear in and they

would just want a little chunk they wanted a golf ball sized chunk of the muscle tissue and they would just want a little chunk. They wanted a golf ball sized chunk of the muscle tissue. They wanted it to be from the tongue. I think the tongue was preferable or the neck or the shoulder. And they would send you a slip in the mail of whether it was positive or negative, but there was a delay. So if you got a bear and you were curious if it was positive or negative, you would submit your sample But you still just had the butcher the animal and get it frozen because you couldn't you know You know really cuz it could be month or two months or whatever the hell it was So one time the one one time I sent a sample in And it was a big bear. I remember we had we took the we off this bear

We took the loins and the back legs for roast and ground the rest and I had 87 pounds of just ground meat off this black bear. What's a bear burgers? Well, hear me out. So this is a lot of wrinkles this story. It's a good story. My roommate at the time, became a, he became a, fishing writer, editor, J. Nichols. He was at that time working in a grocery store in the meat department at a grocery store.

He and I took that bear down and processed the whole thing after hours in the meat shop. This is a moral story. That's a funny trick in the whole thing. Well, we cleaned all the shit out good, right? But it was funny because later, we even had it where I did all this bear meat. You know when you go to the grocery store and they got those little styrofoam trays with the saran wrapping shit. So all of our bear meat looked like shit out of a grocery store.

We even had like, we did that like foam tray with the wrapper. You could have a little label and shit, you know. We did the whole bear like that, man. It looked amazing. And then I get the results back and it was positive. So I bought a meat thermometer and just started cooking it. And I realized that it's like, the temperature at which it dies is pretty low.

But this is like, when you were a kid, or whatever, going back, your grandma's like really cautious about cooking pork to well done. That was for the same thing, tricking noses. And it's only spread from an infected animal, eating an infected animal. They've now gotten out of commercial pork. When they got it out of commercial pork is when they banned restaurant slop. So when I was, when I was, when I was abandoned. Well, so when I was 13, I worked at a,

I watched dishes at a summer camp near my house. And when all of them kids would come through, we would scrape all their plates into a garbage cans. And then every afternoon, a hog farmer had come by and get those slops. And get that slop to fat and hogs. Well, it's not that the food, the kids were getting served,

had trigonosis, but rats and mice and shit would get into the slop. Oh, wow. And so you didn't have a closed loop. Yeah. So when they banned restaurant slot from commercially inspected hog, you like, you don't get trigonosis from hog anymore.

Oh damn. That's right. When I got trigonosis, 90 some percent of the cases of trigonosis in America all came from bear me. And I got registered, because it's a CDC reportable disease. I got registered in King County, Washington.

And the dude that got it before me. I think I got registered. I can't bear what year I was. Whatever year I was, I think there were seven cases. We were four of them. And the dude that had it. Seven cases, you were. The dude that had it before me. He had it from out had it from outline. What? Yeah. So it's super painful. Oh, here's the deals we we're hunting bears and We're like sitting around cooking bear me on a campfire and it was raining out We had to get down to our plane to get picked up and we're joking about that it wasn't cooked that well And we're joking about getting trigonosis

so well and we're joking about getting trick noses so I'm with these I'm with handful of guys you know so Janus was yeah yeah yeah Yani was there a couple of our dudes no yeah but then we're not together I don't see these guys for a month okay so I haven't been with them for a month, but I remember as July four weekend, I am just hurtin' man, I can't barely cross the street. Oh, damn. That's a mess. Muscle aches.

And what's that? Did you know right away? Man, I knew Sump was up and I was taking a lot of ibuprofen and it felt like the worst like weightlifting injury spread across your whole body. Damn, that's terrible. And I wound up talking on the phone with Yani. And he's like, oh yeah, me too, man.

And he goes, and Mike. And then, also in like another guy, and we haven't been together for a month, and we all got the same symptoms. Okay, so I was like, haven't been together for a month. We all got these same symptoms Okay, so I know I was like I get so I know I got tricked notes in my buddy my brother Danny Would at the time hang out with the state epidemiologist in Alaska And I call that guy up. I'm like here's what we all got going on. He's like yeah, that's that's That's definitely what you guys got going on. He goes go to your doctor and have your doctor call me

So I go down to like a doctor just a walk doctor, and I got a sticky note, you know? Like, hey man, call this guy. And he'll tell you, I got trickin' those, he didn't know what trickin' those was. He wrote it down on a piece of paper. I said, it's trickin' those, T.R., right? I spelled out for him. He leaves, and a while later comes back,

and he's sittin' there again, and I could tell he went out like they always do. Like, you know what, he'd like doctors, I always do, they go read shit. He is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy who is a guy Call the guy so he leaves again comes back he goes sounds like he have tricking those No, so you just take antibiotics. I took a $1,200 pill No one else treated it. I was too late. I took a deworming pill and when I picked that shit up The pharmacist said I'm not telling you what to do, but I sell this we give this to animals for $7 Wow go get it from a vet but I sell this, we give this to animals for $7. Wow. Go get it from a vet. Yeah, she's like, I'm not getting into it,

but I'm just letting you know that this is used to be where am critters at 7 on the Y is 1200. I take, we all got better to save that. Let me ask you this, you know, you know a lot about Native Americans, and you've written this stuff. But didn't the Native Americans, did they have any restrictions on what they ate?

Did they eat, bear, did they bear did they like well i mean you got it you when you say native americans and you're talking about obviously made of right well you know you're talking about like a hundred cultures yes hundreds of cultures that all had sets of taboo's and prohibitions but we're taught before we said record we're talking about the uh... there was some very avid bear eaters.

I'm assuming, I don't know. I've never heard in the, I've never read the historic record of people eat raw bear meat. Right, they cooked it. But the biggest, the biggest, most interesting about like trick-noses, lions, bears is what they're finding out now is it's not,

to kill it, to disinfect the meat, meat pork too if you raise your own pigs You know if you're like a hobby farm and you raise your own hogs and you don't know what they've held they've gotten into Yep is When we say that that you had to cook pork to 165 or whatever the hell they used to say It was a being that it's like a great you got imagine as a graph If it's like temperature and time temperature and time exposure meaning 145 Well eventually Kill it if held for a long time. It's like it this the instant it hits 165. It's dead

But I don't know what it is exactly, but maybe at seven minutes. It's dead at 145 It's instant at 165. So you could actually with sous vide cooking and stuff, I haven't done it. You know what's sous vide? You could theoretically, like a water bath. You take, you put it in a plastic bag and you put it in boiling water.

And it actually is a really good way to make meat because it really tender. But it's not, it's less than boiling. Yeah, it's less than boiling, sorry. Sorry, but it takes a long time, right? Because of what water boils at 2, 12? Yeah. Like I think the highest you'd set a sous vide wand

is somewhere around 190 or whatever, but you could, I haven't done it, but you could put bear meat in that water bath. And get rid of it. And leave it in there at 145 and eat raw bear meat, or not raw, eat rare bear meat, which I haven't done yet because that's just it's not Aptatized to me because of all this shit. We're talking. And you'd have to do the same with like line

Like I'm not talking about the outline, but like african line you do you do the same. Oh, yeah I know that yeah They have their own like we have there's like trick-and-hell of spiralist all these different trick-no-strames They have there when I the woman had told me they give the same pharmacist that told me that they give the same medication to animals for seven bucks, but it's 1200 for a person. When we were on the phone, she used to be in the Peace Corps. And when they were in the Peace Corps, when she was in the Peace Corps in Africa, they would, as a matter of course,

go into villages and deworm everybody. Oh wow. It's just as, like not even testing, it was just like the assumption was, you were just going in deworms. Yeah, but I grew up overseas, I had to be dewormed. And I had, I'm not kidding, I had long pink worms. Me and my sister had long pink worms coming out of our ass.

So I grew up in the 70s in the developing world. So I get such a kick out of people like complain about the United States. We fucking, you couldn't drink the water. You had, if you ate ice, you'd be fucked. But I got hepatitis A, I got fucking Jardia, I grew up with all that shit. I had it all. I mean, I'm talking about, I saw what malaria actually, you ever see what malaria does? Somebody? You ever seen that with your own eyes?

No. Woo. This guy had malaria and malaria kills, you know, I don't know, I mean people a year, but he was, he couldn't, he had, he was under blankets like this and I remember watching him as a little kid, he was going, because he was that cold. It'll fuck you up, man. It is like orgasmically cold. Yeah, orgasmically cold is right.

Is it? Oh yeah, and it sits in your liver. What about the black plague, do you see that? I did not see the black plague. I did not see the black plague, but keep away from rats if you know what I mean. Cover your wells. Do you, why did you make that noise?

Because you've taught me a lot about Native Americans. I would always like to listen to you But they're all it's all over the place right? Oh, yeah, because I mean I know like about there's there's areas where I've read a lot about Like on the great plains, you know The black fee the black fee were huge right some yeah the Cherokee really big. Yeah Like the Moss Eye or something some like people that white soldiers during the Indian wars would be very intimidated by the physical. Physical.

Statures. Giant. Yeah, but that's all I meant. There's some areas where I've read quite a lot about the presence, but there's other areas I'm pretty ignorant to it. Right. You know, like in the southeast, that is having read much about that. Northeast.

I haven't read. But the Comanche, the Apache, the Nesperce. Yeah, I like that shit, man. The most warlike, when they had horses, the horses came from the Spaniards. The Comanche, or was it the Apache who spent most of their time on the horse? We just had a historian on my podcast, the historian named Elliott West, that we talked about the way the Spanish horses. There was this famous occurrence called the Pueblo Revolt. When the Pueblo tribes kicked the Spanish out of New Mexico, they were like in northern Mexico into what's now in New Mexico. The Pueblo tribes had a revolt and expelled the Spanish for quite some time.

And that's what initiated, I think that was around 1690 or 1690. And that's what initiated that spread of horses to the north. And it causes really dramatic power. It completely changed the power dynamic. Because the people on the horse are the people on the horse. Yeah, like at a time, if you go back before the horse The real powerhouses were agrarian, you know people that would live in the West elsewhere

They would grow squash beans corn and it had they'd develop pretty like powerful flourishing cultures After the horse came into the American West, you merged out of that was a question in nomadic bison hunters and and and fierce and nomadic warriors. Do you say O'Garrion or a Grarrion? Are you saying an Aryan or a Grarrion? A Grarrion, sorry, a farmer's, a farmer's, a farmer's, a farmer's, a farmer's, a farmer's of the land. But once the horse came, also you had these, you know, you had the ability to create, you know, like the equivalent of like a mounted cavalry, you know, and then you had this huge

power dynamic. So yeah, these tribes that, like with the Comanche, they weren't, the Comanche came from North and West. And they did follow the the bison, right? Yeah. Well, they adapted the horse. They got on the horse as quick, gave up farming, gave up on having a static stationary village and Just became writers and they lived on mayor's milk and like crazy shit Yeah, they were able to just to travel around it was funny. They tap their horses veins the way the mongol Oh, not a little about that. Yeah, drinking that drinking no do it. There's this is like a statement No, I read that that to open I've that in Ian Frazier's book about Siberia, he talks about that

thirst crazed, mongol warriors would tap a vein with a straw. Yep. And drink. Drink that. So they'd be on their horse and they would drink their horse. They'd be on their horse. Yep. And drink. Drink, drink. So they'd be on their horse and they would drink their horse blood. Yeah, they're going, yeah. And then they would drink the mirror's blood.

So the problem was when other armies would follow them, they would like lead them into the desert, they'd lead them further up, but they had to bring water and supplies. Then they'd wait till their waters, when their supplies were... And they didn't realize they were drinking the blood. Yeah, they'd be like,

just suck on the horse, like bad luck. Yeah, exactly, exactly. When you have blood run into your body, blood. Yeah, they'd be like, just sucked on the horse like bad. Yeah, exactly. When you have blood run into your body, dude. Oh, you can only imagine. That's the real thing. She is very hot. How did you become like the, basically the Michael Jordan of hunting?

Like, I don't know much about hunting, but I know you. Can I give you one thing that he would do? I'd rather him. No, no, listen, this is not good. This is not good. This is not good. As far as a massive hunter.

He would go like this. We'd be, remember we'd be like at a bank and he'd go, he'd go, he'd do this with his foot and he'd go smell that. And I'd smell it and be like, the fuck? And he goes, you know what that is? I go, what? Because that's a male beaver, Mark and his terror truck. I'm like, how the fuck you know that?

That's how good. But I assume other hunters can do that. Oh no, man, there's a lot of you away better at hunting I am But how do you how do you be because I just talked because I just I was I talked about it at a time I Talked about it in a way that people weren't talking about it and I talked about it at a time that people weren't talking about it in the way that I talked about it It's fair. Yeah, there's a lot of low-hanging fruit You know about it in the way that I talked about it. It's fair. Yeah. There was a lot of low-hanging fruit, you know, at the time, you know, like.

You can talk. Yeah, a lot of the things that, you know. What? Wait, what? What did you say? I only go camping. Hey, he's not a piece of meat. He's just a meat eater.

So, I, you know, we grew up doing a lot of hunting and fishing and trapping and ate a lot of stuff. And I just talked, I just, I wrote about that. I got it. As a kid, you grew up doing this. Yeah, grew up doing everything. Your dad was into it, I assume. Very into it.

So we ate a lot of wild game. Um, in a different way than I do now, but you know, like, Steve, your personality, come on. Your personality is also rather alpha. You get in an argument with Steve? It's like, but I don't know a bit again. All that doesn't accumulate, like I don't know the hundreds who are baited. No, no, no, what I mean by that is that he's very, very, he'll, he knows what he's talking

about, but he does his research. And so I think that kind of personality when, like if you have an argument with him about certain things, like, like, Joe and you have that argument about how many people the Mongols actually killed. You have the legit argument? Oh yeah, dude. And Steve's not given an inch because he knows what I'm saying. I'm sure I was arguing about that,

because that's something I know about well. He must have said something really crazy. Well, he said that Dan Carlin said something about a lot of broke sides in the Torah. A number of like the crazy number of people had died. And you were like, like it changed the carbon footprint of the Earth, literally. Oh, I got it. And you were like, I just have some...

So, but you grew up, you said in Detroit? Nope, I grew up in Western Michigan. Okay. Yep. Can you tell by that? Yeah, my dad was big. My dad, he was born in Chicago. He was raised by his Italian immigrant grandparents.

So he was very drawn to wanting to be a hunter and fisherman and would try to be growing up, but very poor. Then when he got back from World War II, he was just all in. And so by the time I was born, you know, he was a lifelong Hunter so we hunted a lot fish a lot. I trapped a lot for trapping to sell stuff and and

studied writing and so As I became a professional writer I was just dealing with this as I became a professional writer I was dealing with this world that I knew pretty well. And I didn't pay attention to what outdoor media, hunting media really looked like that much. So I just, when I looked more at writers that I liked and movies I liked. You did it your way. Yeah, so I just took this, I just started writing I looked more at writers that I liked and movies I liked.

You did it your way. Yeah, so I just started writing about and talking about things that a decade ago, you know, maybe a decade ago, more ago, whatever. I mean, I've been in the business for 20 years, right? It just was not shit that was getting, it just wasn't getting discussed the way I discussed it at the time.

Yeah. Yeah. Look, when I drink my coffee, you don't happen the other day, and my coffee went, what's that a gallon of macadamia nut? Oh, you do? You mean, how about macadamia milk?

You want some macadamia milk? I need a more. But I do. I use a lot of it. So I need a lot of people use milk. They use cream, they use oat milk all that stuff. Coconut, almond milk. If you've never had a macadamia nuts, the best nut.

It's a buttery, beautiful nut with some of the most, literally some of the healthiest oils you can have. Omega seven fatty acids driving milk. Keto friendly. And very good for satiety, so it's satiates you when you're trying to lose weight. We got a lot of famous, a lot of people who are into longevity eat their macadamia.

Not sure, man. Including my year and a half old, who had an entire bag. Oh, my kids are going through a stomach. I don't go through those chocolate countries. They love them. I love them, I bring them on the way. Macadamia milk, you can put in your coffee

to 100% pure macadamia, is no added sugars, oil, stabilizers, or preservatives, like the other nut milks contain. Yeah, but they're not crazy enough to give away a giga gallon, are they? How about this? Yeah. Be an entire gallon for free of macadamia nut milk. That's insane. All you gotta do is go to houseofmacadamias.com.sas. TFAK. No. Just add milk to your cart with any products and use the co-TFAK by products. I mean, chocolate covered macadamia

is assaulted macadamia in the past. Macadamia in the past. Oh my God, 45%. They give you the variety. It really is the best, not, they're delicious. Oh, they're delicious. I was looking at how much they were. Macadamia, that's where over at this million dollars.

Million dollars. They're million dollars. Million dollars. A million dollars. Thank God they're sponsored. So it doesn't have to cost your house payments. Again, house of macadamia is.com size TFA K and you get a free gallon macadamia milk when you visit and then you were just doing it and then the the man eaters show came

along that was your meat so man ears my show that's your shanieters mom we're gonna have to get the name of the no I take not like to come on this show you camp and then we fuck each other that's not the gay yeah that's it Netflix hasn't bought that show yet but I'm trying to sell it no it's not the gay. Netflix hasn't bought that show yet. Oh no, I'm trying to sell it. Yeah, yeah. And so we just take the trigger notes. And we just, we don't kill animals, but we fuck.

Yeah. And you see the outline of the tent. So you can see the outline of the tent. And the episode's one's called hunting cock. It's got guy, oh guy love. No, but it's the first episode. So, and every episode. Medieter came about, that was your idea?

Yeah, I had done a show, a really, I had done a show real short, long time ago, I did eight episodes of a show for travel channel. And we had an even fit, finished filming those eight shows. And we knew we weren't gonna be making any more of those. You could tell, like, how was it? Well, no, no, we did finish. It was literally, we like wrapped.

We like we literally wrapped the eighth episode and we're sitting at me. We like wrapped the episode. It was sitting a van and got a call. And it was over because they'd already premiered the first episode. Like we're all set. We're all set.

We're all set. We're all set. We're all set. We're all set. We're all set. We're all set. We're all set. We're all set. We're all set. We're all set. We're all set. What was you need about your show that I always thought was really interesting that I don't think had been done before was that you would shoot an entire episode and if you didn't shoot an animal that was the episode and you still that was later though that wasn't this shit

I got involved it was crazy. I couldn't do that at the beginning though. I Like it's a killer. You can't fly that up. They have. We didn't have the ability to ditch we couldn't spend time working on something to ditch it So I did this show that I don't like and I wish I hadn't ever done it. But out of that, some of the guys I worked with on that, bunch of dudes that worked. So the production company I worked with was the same one that did all board ains shows all those years, 0.0. And I was working with guys that worked with board ains. And I was working with guys that work with Bourdain. Nick Brighdon, Moe Fallon, Jared Andrew Canis, and when we got, we started thinking, let's do a show that just really stripped down and clean.

Let's just do a straight up hunting show. Maybe no one's even on the show except you. There's no guests, or we'll go with one guest, and it'll be really tight. Just go to Uspot and film the A to Z of a Hunt. So that's what we started doing. At the time, I had a brand new, my first boy was a baby, just a little kid,

and I would read him books, and I like to read him books about wildlife. So, the meat you got stuck in my head, because you'd get to the part about like a tyrannosaurus racks or a polar bear. That's what the kid wanted. And it'd be like this meat eater, you know, lives off seals or whatever. That's where that word, that's.

So when I, when we're trying to come up with a name for the show, what would be my long running hunting show, I was thinking about that like kids books. It wasn't like a diet, it wasn't initially meant as sort of a statement about human diet. It was just like, I just thought like aggressive predators. It was like predators, right? So that's why I named the show that. And then we went on to make,

I don't know, we made 12 years where the episodes of that show. Where's the craziest place after 12 years are the most exciting place you've haunted because you've been I think all over the world now. The most impactful. The most impactful things I've done is a handful of times I've been able to go down and do river trips for, you know, seven, eight, nine, ten days in South America with a Amazon. Well, one time in the Amazon base and one time in a river system that is split by a ridge, so a river system that flows north and not out the Amazon, not our time in the headwaters of the Amazon

with like Amerindian groups. How about rivers? Yeah, no rivers. And hunting fish with those guys, who were your hunting fish with people who, they hunt fish 250 days a year maybe. Too much fishing, yeah. And all within maybe like a 50 mile radius

of their home, and also you're hunting where your dad, your grandfather, your great grandfather, stupid fish, you're like in the same spot. Yeah, like using these same techniques, are they strictly fish or they hunt money and fish? What are they hunt?

Man, we hunted a lot of stuff. We had fish right. Wanted these guys, I was with the Chamane, their favorite thing that read howler monkeys. Really? Wow, they're he monkeys out there. Yeah, man. And then, but then, other, like, you know,

what girl you asked about when he was asked about, like, native use practices. So I also got to a couple of times hang out for a chunk of time with, hang out for a chunk of time with, uh, I feel like he's easy to kill. What's that? I feel like he's easy to kill, right? Yeah, they shot at a shotgun that they killed some monkeys with- You've been there with them.

Not with both narrows or darts or anything. But other groups would have a taboo against. Other groups I hung out had a tat they don't eat. They don't consume monkey. Yeah. So you can get weird diseases from monkey. Like eating- I don't think that- I don't think that that's why.

Just there they had like a very like fish focus, but also poca, and then I'm gonna call it a poca, which you also call lava. Looks like it's the cross from the chip munk in a deer fawn. This is all poca fish. I don't know shit about that. Pocca. Oh that, that has the riches.

Is that tasty? You look delicious. You look delicious. That right there, dude, I'm telling you, is one of the best, craziest, like, cutest. One of the best, most unexpected things I've ever eaten. And how do you eat it? They roasted it.

Damn. It's white. The meat on it is super white. They're nocturnals. You go out at night looking for them. Wow. The meat on it was super tender and like white white. Yeah, sure.

When you're out there in the nighttime, you gotta worry about snakey snakes, huh? Yeah, but you know, you're with people that know everything. So it's like, yeah, they grew up there. Yeah, it's like, why's it being super chill? Cause they see shit you'd never see, and they see it way before you'd see it.

But what I was with this dude, and we went up to anaconda. You know, and he's telling me, I mean, his anaconda is like, you know, like 10, 12, 13 feet long, late basking there. Did they eat him? No, they don't touch him.

But he said that the one time, like when they will use them is old people can kill them to get the fat. So you know, like hearing the snake oil. Yeah. Salesmen. Old people, it's okay for an old person with arthritis to kill anaconda to get the fat to rub into their joints. But otherwise, don't touch them. How old? Whatever age you're after. They're the thing. Yeah. I'll be right back. Yeah, so he was telling me this dude was telling me and they're I mean, I don't want to discredit it by calling it mythology, but it's their belief system if you were to

touch that anaconda with your bow It would it would kill it it would cause it a slow death You can touch it with a stick, but if you touch it with a bow, it would cause it a slow death. You can touch it with a stick, but if you touch it with a bow, it will suffer a slow death. So not to touch it with a bow. You're not insane, right? He, the same dude, so this is the crazy thing, because this is a guy, you don't know.

This is a dude I become friends with, but this is one of the best things in the world is like, what do you ask about why that area? I'm sorry dude, there's a friend of mine his name's Alvin and he has So he's got the name Alvin He has an email address. Okay, you can email him But he's telling me and I don't laugh and man. It's just like just the different world view perspective sure One time I was down there and they had a lot of white lip packeries around

One time I was down there and they had a lot of white lip packers around. Not good deed. They love them. Oh, they do. Way better than collard peckery. Okay. Everybody would say that. No, I know that.

They know they love the way. They don't even like the collard peckery that much. They like the white lip peckery. Why be on the white lip? And they would have hundreds of them around. Check its lips. And he's telling me how a Shaman from a neighboring village had grown jealous of his village

and had locked all of their packeries into a mountain somewhere. Son of a bitch. And their own Shaman needed to train up to develop the necessary power to unlock the white. The white lip pack. He's the training. Take any sex.

I don't know. I didn't get into the detail on it. We don't get into the sounds. But like that, and we were talking about the planes tribes. Sounds insane up there. Yeah, and the planes tribes had a lot of, there was a lot of mythology and the planes tribes in our own great planes, a lot of mythology

and the planes tribes that Buffalo would enter the world from certain sacred mountains. And when they couldn't be found, they were in, they would go back into mountains. Psychedelic, yeah. Yeah, it is a psychedelic. Yeah, it's psychedelic as shit, right? It's right tough for you to be like,

oh, crazy. But you gotta go with it. I go, yeah. Oh, no, with that, I was like, man, tell me more. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Have you done any hunting in Africa? No, never, man. No, never stepped foot on the whole continent.

Why not? To have, I've almost a couple of times I've almost gone. I want to go. Have you been hunted yak or anything like that in the cold countries? No. No. But when we do,

I'd like to go to Africa now. Yeah. Because I met some dudes. I just, I wanted to go, but I never could find who I'd go with. Like a lot of stuff I do, like a lot of places I go, I want to go hunting because I met people or got,

had people I know who No people or no If you've been to Zealand because my buddy owns like the more land than anybody else in New Zealand I take it to fight it you to really my wife just yesterday brought up going to New Zealand I thought personally I thought it was too far if I'm gonna fly It's so far dude that long I want to get out of the plane and there's people with bones in their hair. Yeah, I know what you mean.

Yeah, I mean, to get out of the plane, I want to basically, I landed them back in Montana except everybody's wearing blood stones. Yeah, it's like, yeah, it's a little New Zealand. I was like, oh, you guys sound just like the fucking people I just left. I agree, I couldn't agree more. It's like, I can go down to the south

and they sell more. It is LA. Oh no, it's Sydney. That's how I feel about vacation. There's too far to go for like a bunch of dudes that seem like me. Although I was in Jordan recently and they hunt everything in Jordan in the desert

and they do it year round. No, that I would do. I got a connection. I feel like. If you offer him one more connection, you don't think he's a number one hand owner. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no New Zealand, no one in the audience. That's like having Kanye Weston, like, I got a buddy. Who has a track? Our boy, our boy Joe,

owns 55 feet. I got a friend who wants to feature on your album. Why can't you connect you with the guy? If I may, sir, the Prince of Jordan, and I have been texting, and I was invited there, and because I was talking about hunting on Rogan, and I'm trying to get Rogan to come to Jordan. So the king found out that it go. It was, oh yeah, I know he's,

he was like, oh fuck yeah. No, he's not that, no, that's not true. Because he's an American hunter. Yeah. No, he's, he had other reasons, but he wanted to go to Jordan. He would do it too far.

Right? He kind of intrigued by it. You know, it's, look at how long it took us about. It took us two days. 11 hours by, 11 hours I think. 11 hours. I've invited, I've invited Joe to go, look at how long it took. It took us two days. 11 hours by plan. 11 hours, I think. 11 hours. I've invited Joe to go just cross the border in Mexico.

Oh no, he wants to. And I have it. It's a tough sell. No, I don't want to do it. He's a friend of that, but he would do Jordan. Maybe, but the prince of Jordan said, you've got to come out. It's 20 hours.

Oh, he just pulled up the flights. You book right now. 20,000 hours. Didn't took me that long, I'm on. So you're, let me do you get this straight. You're in with the Jordan has, I didn't know Jordan had a prince. Has a prince Jordan, you guys are like this. That's came the prince Jordan, so the prince Jordan heard me talking.

You can't see his are fart or the ones you want to get back to America. No, it's a great country man. It's awesome and the food is amazing but they hunt there and I was there and this better one can't show me. What were you doing? I was in Israel and went over to Jordan to see Petra and Wadi Roman. Vacation, yeah.

Vacation, dad to them. What's Petra? Petra is one of the seven wonders of the world. It's where they shot Redis of the Lost Ark. It's all the, they didn't even know it existed until like 1840 or something. Wadi, Wadi wants to say is there, there's the built-in. Oh, wow.

Yeah, it's incredible. It's fucking incredible, man. I wrote on a horse. You've been there, Grin. All the sort of things. Yeah, I think. No. No, I know.

So like when you're shooting your shows, I'm sure that you have like a staff song that's maybe careful of this, right? What do you mean? Like if you're hunting in the Amazon Brazil. Oh, yeah, but we so just to be clear, so Cal we mo yeah, the the you know, 90% perhaps more than 90% of the all the shows you made have all been in the US. Like we filmed in Alaska. So you know, we film, yeah, like like I'm a very, Yeah, plenty to do here.

I'm a very American type person. Brage. Yeah. Like I like, like the reason I like it, I mean, it's great stuff all over the place. And I just, I'm not like here, though, right? Well, we just have a really good system

of wildlife management that makes a lot of sense to me. One of the things that you wait into, you know, when you go, I like, I appreciate content, I like a lot of context. So when you asked about Africa, it was hard for me that they manned, they have a completely different wildlife management structure in Africa. So I've always wanted to go, but I wanted to go in a way where I would be able to hang out with people that would be able to speak about it and, and, and I would be able to see it in a way that

felt very contextualized meaning that there'd be Educational and not like someone rolling out a Rolling out like a tour for me. Yeah, more like that you would be that I would kind of like get a broader understanding of for me, but more like that you would be that I would kind of like get a broader understanding of everything that you hear that goes on, meaning like the poaching, how they wildlife management plans, how people that live there interact with wildlife, how people that live there interact with hunting, all the things you'd get if you went, you know, if I go to the South Carolina on turkeys with a body mine, you kind of get,

that's nuts. Yeah, you get this sort of, there's turkeys, and there's the broader culture, and here's how people that live there think about it, approach it, and hunt for them, and eat them, and this is what their families, you know, and you see how they relate to their environment. But I finally now found, I've met some guys who, from Tanzania, that

guide, Tanzania, and live in Tanzania, at least part of the time they live in Tanzania and have been grown up in Africa. And I really want to go home with them because now I feel like, by spending time with them, it'll be, it'll help me paint a better picture of, that makes sense. Of what goes on there. So I'm excited to do it. That's cool. When I talked about going, the first time I went to South America, I had a friend of mine

who's a fisheries biologist. She was doing work in Guyana trying to catalog catfish species. Watch out for Crocodiles. Yeah, and so she, I have a catfish. Like she introduced me to people there. She's like, if you're gonna go hang out with these guys, these guys are amazing.

They know their stuff. And so then I went and hung out with those guys. So I like that sort of. Yeah. You ever come across any Aeroanas down there in South America? Yeah, man. We bow fish for Aeroanas. Oh, he killed him.

Yep. They like him a lot. He has he owns. I have two Airwannas. My kids trying to buy one right now. Do you really? I bought it for my son. It was like this, and I didn't do my research on it.

And the guy was, hey, they get pretty big, man. So you might have to upgrade your tank. I'm like, all right, whatever. A month goes by, grew two inches. Another month, two inches. Now this thing, I have a 500 gallon tank. I'm doing this. They're like this.

See, he's I-Ball-one. He's I-Ball- one right now for 75 bucks. Yeah, I bought mine for 75. They eat some hits. And they'll eat all the fish. It's a blessing. They know they're cool. But you have to have a top on,

cause they jump. Yeah, they don't even know the jump. They'll eat spot, they'll eat monkeys. What? They'll jump out and grab monkeys. Yeah, bring it up. Well, there's a rare pie, yeah. The solar's aero pie. I'm talking about which is the biggest scaled fishing world. I know this, I'm gonna go ahead. What? Go jump out and grab monkeys. Yeah, bring it up. Well, there's the air, yeah, the soldiers,

air a pineapple, which is the biggest scaled fishing world. I know this. I'm gonna go ahead. Good. God, you're so good at, you know, a lot about the biggest, a lot about Amazon scale, fresh water fish in the world. Who is the air a pineapple? But there's the air a one and the air a one and the bad. They're covering teeth.

They can live up to 20 years of, eat anything, even monkeys. And they're lucky and in a, in a, in, even monkeys. And they're lucky and turtles. And turtles. In China, they're like super lucky. They're called dragonfish and they come in red. They're about five grand to get one hand in America. They're legal.

They're legal in California. What, did you know that? No. Yes. Do you guys aren't allowed to do that really surprised? Okay, all right, man, take it easy, dude. You know what I'm gonna say? You know what I'm gonna say?

I didn't even say anything, dude. Even didn't know about airwanns like that. All right, you're getting the coming gold. You're getting worked up, bro. Yeah, sorry, man. I'm sorry, I was talking airwanns. All right, yeah, the Bakushi people. The Bakushi, you know what I'm saying?

You've heard a lot of airwanns. You've heard of them? I didn't know that I'm glad to hear that. If you and mine, I would like you to text me a photo of your airwanns. Set up, because my boy is real hot on the airwanns. And what's cool about them is you don't need, I would like you to text me a photo of your Airwine. Set up because my boy is real hot on the Airwine. And you know what's cool about them is you don't need a real deep tank because they just say at the surface

and go back, they swim laps back and forth. So I had the juvenile like a hundred gallon tank and then I expanded to 500 gallon tank and they just swim laps back. You just throw monkeys and shit in there and it's really expensive. He throws red hounders in there. Red hounders.

He's a steaks, David. I'm like, a lion. My son doesn't care about him now. Hey, red hounders. Stake, Steve, but I'm not gonna lie to you. My son doesn't care about him now. I take her from full time. That's right. I post a video this morning. I have a catfish in there. Again, bottom is a juvenile.

In a month, he's already like this. Yeah. They just get big, but they're lucky too. Since I bought them, it's been pretty lucky. It's what rough years do. It's not rough. He uses them to keep his blood pressure. Of course, it's all that for you. Very rough year. Someone stole money from us. It's what rough years do. He uses them to keep his blood pressure. And of course, all of a sudden.

Very rough year. Someone stole money from us. That's right. But you know what, the arrow line. You got money stolen from you? Oh, a lot. But you know what? I come from the Dr. Goh School of Learning.

Good. Good. Yes, what we say. A lot of money. The arrow lines were bad luck. They're supposed to bring good luck, too. You've been tough this year though. Yeah, that's yeah Maybe I think it bigger the big better. Yeah, but you know the dawn always comes before the darkest hour of night

Yeah, I'm just glad you didn't know that that's cool. No, that's not true. Oh fuck The dawn is what the night wraps it up. Yeah, fuck There it goes again Steve Rinalov I can clip my wings Every time I think I can soar, I get my wings clipped. Now I'm back to waddling around the old farm. I'm still thinking how I made the Royal Mistake call on your show Man-Eater. Yeah, well, wait a while. Oh no, that's, you're not the first dude.

So, you're a messed up dude. Yeah, that's all right. No, I know. It's all right. I sometimes wish I would have just done it just to have it be over with. Man-Eater, yeah. Best of me in the world is how still

If if I was gonna eat one thing We played this game all time at our dinner table if I was gonna eat one thing it would be I would just eat Mildir Mildir I'll never have no deal. Oh, it's so delicious. What before you go. What's the weirdest thing you've ever eaten? Monkeys Like dogs domestic dogs and monkeys you ain't kind of dog weirdest thing you've ever eaten? Monkeys. Like dogs, domestic dogs and monkeys. You ate dogs. What kind of dog come in like a lab or what are you? No, the dogs I ate, the dogs I ate would look like a lot.

You know, if you go to a place where you'd have street dogs and there's no, there's no, kind of controlled, there's no control breeding you know like people you know, it's not that people are like Having labs and like breeding like you don't need you don't need pure breed dogs Of course it be that you took a bunch of dogs and let them run for generations and generations Unchecked by Contemporary dog breeding you'd wind up with this like semi-pip bullish looking. Oh Yeah, like you know, it's different different parts of of the world it's always different what part of the world do you eat dog well

I'll take you dog no I ate dog in I ate dog in Vietnam I did it very deliberately and I was writing a story for I was I was a correspondent for outside magazine and I was writing a story about It kind of came out of do you remember like years ago? I can't remember who I Can't remember what country hosted the Olympics And there's a beer stir because they made all the yeah, they made all the dog meat vendors shut down Yeah during the Olympics and it was a big stir And that got me interested and so I went to

Hanoi What I was raised to call Saigon Not known as Ho Chi Minh City. I went there. I went to the train In Vietnam all these places I went right, I went to the train in Vietnam, all these places. I went right at the lunar New Year. And in the lead up to the lunar New Year, it's customary, especially in the north, it's customary to like, it's a very auspicious time to eat dog meat because it is regarded as a hot food, meaning it can generate a lot of activity. Like I had a guy explain to me.

Sexual, like, yeah. Yeah, like a guy explain to me that, he explained me I was never able to have children. And he rolled the dice and ate dog. And then he and his wife had a child. Yeah. And now he can't eat dog again because he ate it and it shifted his lock.

She, yeah, I was locked. And it would be playing with fire to do it again because you could shift it back. You're interesting. And so in the lead up to the Lunar New Year, you know what's funny? You know that lake they fish John McCain out of when he was shot down over Hanoi?

Yeah. That lake, part of that lake is just ringed with seasonal, what they call fitcho meat dog. A part of that lake is just ringed with seasonal dog restaurants. Damn. Yeah and you'd go in and it'd be like, it'd be common to go in and have dog seven ways.

And some of the dishes would be these paws, like a puppy paw suit. And you'd have all these different preparations. Dog ribs, everything. Yeah, all these preparations, I have my wife with me. We weren't married at the time, man, in chute. Tuffed it out and I ate it for a whole, I ate it every night for a week.

Interesting. And it was, no, you know what? I still couldn't tell you what it tastes like because it was like, you know, they call it hot food and I would get hot from guilt. That makes sense. Like sweating and they'd be like, see? It's like it's stirs you up. I'm like doing my stir up is not your

Kill a dog in America. I don't do that. I'm sweating for like weight of a reason. Yeah, it's really not sexual So interesting. Yeah, it was I couldn't get used to it and it was like um It's funny because I used to have I I had this friend that, uh, she had this dog that had been shot in the hip. Uh, it was, she had a dog she found as a while, running wild dog. And at some point in time, we got shot in the hip and had a paralyzed back leg. And I used to take that dog and I put that dog in my lap. And you could like tickle its ribs and that paralyzed leg and stick out. And we stack it goes like the whammy bar on a guitar. So anyways, you like work the dog's stack, and I go like the whammy bar on a guitar.

So anyways, you like work the dogs teeth as the frets and the whammy bar be as paralyzed leg. And every time I hate that puppy paw suit, I think about that poor paralyzed. I could get out of my head that poor dog paralyzed. That's American. It's a American, it's tough, man. That's American, it's frickin' tough.

Oh yeah. But you know what dude, like that's the thing is you get in all their places, there's's like, that's American, it's freaking tough. Oh yeah. But you know what dude? Like, that's the thing is you get in all their places. There's just like, there's just, and that's kind of a thing I explored was, was, and I think I explored with this, is just we all have these expectations taboos. But when I'm telling a story,

I always like to get to this part, because I think it's the punchline of the story. I hired a translator when I was a Vietnam. And one of the things that delighted me is he would refer to the American War, which I always thought was interesting. He was injured during the American War. We're at his house in Hanoi.

And they don't have sidewalks, man. Like this guy lives in downtown Hanoi. When you step out of his door, you got to be careful opening the door and stepping out of the door because you're going to get run over. Oh, yeah. The way it's constructed against this street. And he's got, we go into his house, he's got a dog,

like, it's in a cage. I'm not a kid, you know, man, it's about the size of that table you got next to you. Damn. With a bowl rice and a screen underneath it. Covered in sweet and sweet. And like an exquisite trap. No, did not look like it was a breed dog.

Not like a fit-cho dog. Oh wow. It was just like a regular dog. I came out to hell, it's like a white dog, whatever. But it did not look like the meat market dogs. And you'd go over to these meat markets and they'd have dog heads that they'd burn the hair off, stacked in pyramids. I have pictures of it.

This is shit that you would not put on social media. I would love to see it. I'll show you. But a lot of us, this is stacked in pyramids. Damn. But anyways, it's just different way of living. Different way of living. And I'll tell you a little bit more.

No, it's not wrong. No, I'm just kidding. But let me tell you about this. We have the luxury of not eating dog, right? That's a luxury. He tells you. No, it's, in. No, I'm just kidding. But let me tell you about this. We have the luxury of not eating dog, right? That's the luxury. He tells me. No, in other words, we don't, I think if you, you know, this is not a necessity thing.

For the Vietnamese, it never was. That was not, no, it's like, it's wrong again. It's a cultural, it's not a necessity thing. It's like, it's like, see, I don't want to tell, I don't want to tell all these stories, like I'm talking about someone being backward. It's just, it's like, it's, yeah, I don't want to, I don't mean to, I don't want to tell all these stories act like I'm talking about someone being backward. It's just like different shit.

You can go to countries where it's really bad to eat cows, okay? So, whatever. That's true. Different people have different attitudes. This guy's telling me, I don't eat dog because I have a pet dog. And I'm in his home and he's got the dog

and the thing that big. And I said to him, so you'll just take it out for a walk Because I was kind of marveling how hard it is to get in his home because of traffic and he's like well, he didn't know what I meant He'd never had that dog out of that box It was kept like a bird. Oh wow It's kept like a it's Oh wow. No. It's kept like a, it's kept as a, it's kept how you'd keep a bird. So he's torturing this dog,

this dog would rather be eaten. But he's like, I don't eat it. I have a pet dog. Oh wow. And that was, that was, that was, that was, that was so sad. That was like so deputatulation.

And later, I went outside and a train and went up into the mountains. And I met a kid just like totally, for two days, like I, it's crazy a circumstances where I met the student and this guy was actually a hunter that I met and he had a small farm and the mountains outside of the train and they had dogs and he was and and I was able to communicate with him and the way it works he he has a farm, they had some cattle, they had some pigs, they had chickens, they would hunt for these like arboreal

marsupials. He raised sugarcane, if I remember right, he raised corn, he raised a handful of other crops, they raised peppers, okay, all this stuff. And they had dogs and periodically, they don't stay in neuter. So periodically, the dogs you keep on your property will just get too numerous. When they get too numerous, there's a guy that will come around and just like you would sell, just like he would sell chicken to market, he would sell pork to market, he would sell cattle to market, he would sell excess dogs to market. And those dogs would enter the same way his chickens cattle pork would enter the broader distribution meat market.

Just the different. His excess crop of dogs would enter the meat market. Would enter the meat market. And it was just like normal. Just as simple as that. But you are right. So if you were to go to India, certain just like normal, just as simple as that. But you are right, like they'd like, so if you were to go to India, certain parts of India, you wouldn't need to cow.

It'd be sacrilegious, right? So there's a lot of examples of that, you know, we're just some animals, we're just taboo and others are not. Or you go to certain countries and they don't want to eat shrimp. Yep. Because God said, shrimp have feelings too.

So it's yeah, like I very much hesitate to lay this out as I love talking about it. have feelings to. So it's yeah, I very much hesitate to lay this out as, I love talking about it. It was a really interesting experience, but it's not, and I would never present it as a backward opinion. It's just like, it's just like, there are shit, looks as crazy.

Yeah, well, we let our, you know, they might look and be like, these people, when their parents get old, they lock their parents up. That's right. Yeah. And don't go visit them. You want to talk about some fucking barbarians? Or the fact that we are a nation of alcoholics and drug addicts,

I mean, you know, comparatively. So, like, yeah, we'll eat a little bit of joke. At least we don't fucking lock our grandparents' problems. We got a lot of problems. There's no doubt. Yeah, that's interesting. That's pretty wild. Do you do a lot of bo. We got a lot of problems. There's no doubt. Yeah, that's interesting. That's pretty wild. Do you do a lot of bowhunt? Mm-hmm.

More so or? No, I mostly, no. Well, I bowhunt a couple of times this year. But I bowhunt, generally I bowhunt when it's bow season. Meaning, I got friends that are very diehard archers. And they'll bowhunt, they'll hum with their bow Meaning I got friends that are very diehard archers and They'll bow hunt they'll hunt with their bow When you could hunt with a gun

Right, yeah, exactly which is great. Yeah, but I hunt with a bow. I like to use the archery seasons You know like pretty soon I'll go hunt I'll go hunt white tails and in In Oklahoma it'll be like I'll bow hunt and it'll be boa season right I'll Bow hunt and dear of my boy the other day and we were bow hunting because it's Bo season those gun season we would been going hunting so that's my attitude I use it to like expand my opportunity what about wolves are you have a lot of wolves in Montana are they are they making a lot yeah I mean we have relative to other states in the lower 48. How many states have wolves?

So you have wolves in Michigan, Minnesota, Wisconsin. Timber wolves, huh? Well, yeah, gray wolves. Just wolves, man. Let them get through it. Different wolves. You have wolves. And then you have, so then you have wolves, all the north, like, those northern tier,

so you have the northern gray lakes, and then you have wolves all the north, like those northern tier, so you have the northern gray lakes, and then you have wolves all through the Rockies, and then you have wolves down into the Mexican gray wolf in Arizona, New Mexico. You have a new population of wolves that just showed up in Colorado. Oh boy. Everything from Colorado north

through the spine of the Rockies, but you have wolves of wash. How big do big. They get Oregon you have wolves in California We have them out here. Yeah, I'm out here So your guys wolves that are here in California not here here But the wolves in California that pop up Those all came from the reintroductions in the Frank Church wilderness area in Idaho so they so The northern great lakes never lost them. A lot of the

Rockies, a lot of the southern Rockies lost them and they did reintroductions in the late 90s into Yellowstone and Frank Church and those wolves that really spread out and what's funny is had they not done that. We wouldn't be quite where we're at right now, but they would have come down through Canada anyways. They would have come in regardless. It wouldn't have happened as rapidly. This way is like in Colorado, they just voted in. They just passed a referendum which basically mandates a voter referendum which basically mandates Colorado's state fishing game agency to explore and implement a reintroduction of wolves. Literally, while that referendum

was going through the ballot proposal process. I knew family showed up. Yeah, wolves came out of Wyoming and showed up anyway, which I thought would have neutered the whole initiative. But the initiative still passed. So even though they had a wolves naturally come in, they still are pushing to do this to accelerate it. They would have a con farmer's, right?

It's what we got to get. Yeah, the main, yeah. And there are, they pull these out of these programs. Like when you buy a license in Montana, you can, you can hunting hunting license in Montana, you're as prompted to make a donation to mitigation. So the livestock producer loses livestock to wolves. They can apply for and receive compensation. It's a very flawed system from a producer standpoint because the producer needs to prove that's what happened.

But if you turn 300 cows out on summer range and 280 come back, like, you know, you're not going to prove what the hell happened to them. So they'll people are always quick to point out like, oh yeah, but they can apply for conversations like they can but it's You know you got to prove it. Yeah, and it's not always able to prove it So there's a lot it causes a lot of tension with agricultural producers and When they firt when wolves first get brought into an area especially when they do these reintroductions where just boom, you know You see dramatic dramatic declines in big-game.

I mean, they're killers. They kill and don't eat them sometimes, right? Yeah, they will. They kill a lot of shit. And what happens is, they're, they're, wolves are able to come in and exploit a resource that has no awareness of wolves.

Yeah, they have no idea. So like, he's like, what the hell is that thing? And then, you know, it's too late. And so you'll see her, you'll see herds of 9,000 elk be reduced to 2,000 elk. What? She heard of 20,000 elk be reduced to 9,000 elk. You serious?

That much? Well, that one, killing five a day or something crazy? Yeah. Well, seven pounds a day. That's why they're getting so big. Well, yeah, so like, you figure like, a wool's gonna eat seven pounds a day or something crazy. Yeah, well seven pounds a me today. That's why they're getting so big Well, yeah, so like you figure like a wolf's gonna eat seven pounds a me today Um, how many are there? How many wolves it's usually a family right? Yeah, so you'll yeah, you know, you know

You'll have in some of these areas so they make these things called distinct population segments around the country and you know A DPS is gonna a distinct population segment would generally would need to be in the hundreds to be viable to be really viable to be 100 to close. Yeah. Taking out just her low hundreds you know but you could you could get places I think I don't know Minnesota's got I think Minnesota's at thousands right now and it's very hard It's like one of the most vexing wildlife management issues in the country is how do we deal that in its sociology question, more than anything else,

a management sociologist, how do you simultaneously have wolves but have healthy hunting, right? Like, and have stable big game populations. And oftentimes, if you argue on behalf of, if you're like me and you argue on behalf of a fairly nuanced perspective, which is that I'm that anti-predator, I like to see all native wildlife on the ground. I like to see them manage and I don't think it's bad to argue on behalf

of big game resources for human exploitation. But some of you would be like, well, they just want deer, those hunters, they just want deer so they can kill them. And you'd be like, uh-huh. Yeah. Yeah. That's the one. That's like a thing. That's a thing. So they could kill them and you'd be like, uh-huh? Yeah, yeah That's like a thing as a thing. Oh, there's a there's a there's like a long tradition of hunting deer and elk for food and

And so I'm not gonna be bashful about me saying that that that's a thing that we're interested in is is ensuring That we have healthy populations of deer elk mo, mues, because we like to hunt them at the same time having viable populations of wolves. We don't have an endangered problem in any animal, do we? Well, so they've been the wolf, they've been deep. The reason they create, that's a great question. We talk about wolves and grizzlies. When they created the Endangered Species Act and they listed wolves and grizzlies in the lower 48. So Alaska has wolves and grizzlies occupied

like 99% of historic range in Alaska, so it's not an issue. When they list, when they gave wolves and grizzlies, ESA, Endangered Species Act protection in the lower 48, they gave wolves and grizzlies, ESA and dangerous species act protection, the lower 48, they did it in a blanket way, where they came in and said, basically, the lower 48, wolves and grizzlies are ESA protected, but it wasn't nuanced enough. And a way to think about, think about like this, elk, have only been recovered, Like Elk only occupies, I think 20 some, 20 some percent of their historic range.

Meaning Elk were in Michigan, Wisconsin, all of Appalachia, out to the East Coast. Like all of the Midwest was Elk country. Elk were everywhere. We've only recovered Elk, I don't know what it is, 17% of the range, something shit like that. We recovered Elk on one-fifth of the range, but we hunt elk all over the damn place.

In the wet, you hunt elk in Kentucky, you can draw elk tags in Michigan, you can draw elk tags in Pennsylvania, you can buy elk tags over the counter in a gas station in Idaho, Montana, elsewhere, right? So we're hunting elk, but we haven't recovered elk. We've only recovered a month of small portion of the range. When they came in with grizzly bears and wolves, they took this whole lower 48 and it said endangered, meaning, but we're never going to recover grizzlies in Golden Gate

Park, which is native grizzly habitat. Too dangerous. Yeah, they don't want them. They're not going to want them. The people that live in Golden Gate Park don't want you to dump grizzlies in Golden Gate Park. So if you can't recover them everywhere, what do you do? Well, you got to go and look like where could they actually be?

Where do we have a chance of them actually being and then manage those places? Yeah. So we're never going to recover grizzly bears across their historic range, because you had grizzly bears in Western Kansas to the California coast, and you had grizzly bears from the Sierra Madre

in Mexico to the Arctic Ocean. Like, we're never going gonna recover them all the way so that what they've done is they've created these, there's six areas. Yeah, there's six areas that are viable for grizzlies. I don't know how many areas are viable for wolves. And so the move now is to take the isolated pocket, not isolated, to take the areas and say,

they're recovered there, but not there. Meaning they're recovered in the northern Rockies, but that doesn't mean that they're recovered in California. So remove protections where they're recovered and don't remove protections where they're not covered. And that approach, when the animal rights groups want to litigate these issues, they attack that approach. Meaning they're saying, how could you say they're recovered here when they're not recovered everywhere? And I'd be like, well, here's how I can say that.

We do it with big horned sheep, we've done it with elk, we've done it with myriad other animals. It's like, there's a lot of work to be done, but that doesn't mean the work's not taken care of in the northern Rockies. Like wolves are delisted in the northern rockies they have to delist grizzlies in the northern rockies or else you're a hypocrite you know if you push for grizzly listing in the first place and you and you are pro endangered species act you look like a fool

when you gonna go to not delist in the northern rock when you go on hunting on him bites me. There you go You want to go? I'm down. I've never been we're gonna go I'd go with the Great man eater. No. Yeah. Well, I'm an eater. Yeah, I I stalk and I rub myself down in moss and urine I've never been but I feel like I'd slow you down. I don't talk you're gonna carry all the stuff Yeah, I can't stuff. You're the pack. Oh, I'll carry so you slow you down. I don't talk about it. You carry all the stuff. Yeah, I can't stuff. You have the power. No, I'll carry it. So you would have zero problem.

Not even. You'd be like, physically? No, I'd be fine. Oh yeah, you have zero problem. You can carry everything. Yeah, yeah, that'd be fine. You have a jog and stuff? Oh yeah, I run all the time.

He's a seasoned chick. Yeah, he'd smoke me up a hill. Yeah, he's a monster. I don't know if I'd smoke you, but definitely. No, you're pretty good. I don't think so, but I have one physical talent and it's like walking. Not running.

Yeah. You can just walk away. Just like I do really well at the one foot in front of the other. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, he was just trying to go away. I was like, fuck. I'd be down though, yeah.

There's a lot of people who could kick my ass, fight and run and, but I can just walk. Walk, walk, yeah. He'll beat anybody in a race as long as you don't run. Yeah Yeah, the midday run away good trade Crush you and walking uphill just no trail walking is as my through Grires and trees where would be before we end it? We're would be a good place to start if I've never been

Like I grew up I grew up up like camping stuff and you know, and Rocky Mountain stuff like that. Like what was a good place? War be a thing that would be fun to go do? Yeah. Well I'm not miserable. I mean there's just so many things. But I like to suffer a little bit too.

I don't want to keep your cake walk. Like you want to know, I want like do griles where we're like filming there. Like right let's get out of here and helicopter takes us to four seasons. I don't want that. No I'm with you. Yeah, we would go on like maybe like a overnight,

little backpack hunt overnight. Couple of. We could even go hunt birds, grouse. I don't want to hunt birds. You want to hunt something big. Yeah, yeah. You want to rifle, you want to be. I want to scare me a little bit.

If it's a bear, I'm like, what? No, elk, elk would be great so we can get some meat. They're going me old, you're hunting. You just include yourself into this. I did. Yeah, I want some me old. He's got all that urine and all that. He's going to wipe himself down. I'll wipe himself down. We're going me old your hunt. You just you just include yourself into this. I did. Yeah, I want some you got all that urine on that he's going to wipe himself down on myself down where are loincloth and the and Anna. I the number one landowner and George. Yeah, we know

that would be the prince and the other one is a New Zealand his friend of mine. Yes, of course. So we'll go and hunt red stag in New Zealand. Stephen, we appreciate come on. We know you got a busy day, my man. Thanks for everyone. John for a while. Even Rinella. Yep. Appreciate brother. Great to see you. Let's see. We can look clean. Queenborough, North Carolina. If you ever want to come there, I'm doing stand up there October six and seven. Everybody.

We're in Vegas this week's Yankfest. Let's get it Saturday. Right. Saturday in Comedy Zone, October six and 7, Comedy Zone at the Greenboro, North Carolina. Never been there. Have you been there? Can I plug? Yeah, go ahead, please. We have a lot. I'm doing a live tour, which would do periodically just December. Ooh, what do you mean? What are you doing live tour? We do theater shows.

Damn. Like a podcast where you talk. Yeah, kind of like, but it's not recorded, but it's like the same kind of, has the same vibe as my podcast when we do live. You and I, you got a big lot. You got a big lot. You've got to ask you questions or no? Yeah, a little bit, in the first part we do,

then there's like a trivia component. We just cover kind of like news and funny shit. That's great. Yeah, we've done them. We did a lot before the pandemic, but haven't done them since the pandemic. Oh, good. Yeah, we quit.

We had a whole shitload of shows, and then we canceled them, because, yeah, you guys live that whole deal So we're just a little slower to get back to I'm in Iowa in October, but outside that It's gang fest. Stephen. I appreciate man. Thanks. I'm in LL and gentlemen. That was awesome