The Flop House - Ep. #353 - The Turning, with Hallie Haglund

Episode Date: October 9, 2021

The star of the show has returned, to answer all of our questions about ghost-sightings, but also to discuss the somehow both boring and wild adaptation of Henry James's The Turn of the Screw, The Turning.Learn more about Max Fun's Block Party here!Wikipedia entry for The TurningMovies recommended in this episode:The FlyTo Live and Die in L.A.BreakdownWe Need to Talk About Kevin

On this episode we discuss the turning from the twisted mind of Henry James because it comes another tale of terror. Terror? Yeah, that gets too scary for you guys should I take a less scary take or more scary take. It was just scary enough I think. Hey everyone and welcome to the Flap House, I'm Dan McCoy. Hey, it's me, Stuart Wellington. Hi, Ellie Kaelin here and we got a special guest, guys. Hi, Tally Hagling. The star of the show has returned and look, we all know you're just waiting for me to shut up.

So how I can say wonderful catch phrases like we do the D or what's one of your catch phrases Halle. This needs more milk. A lot of Halle episodes of the show Halle, about Mac and G's. Yeah. Yeah. But before we get into our show, the network our show's on. Max Fun is throwing a virtual block party from now. Whoo! Actu 22nd.

And you're invited. What's that mean? The weeners are on Dan. Well, during block party. Just one. No, I'm talking about hot dogs. Yeah. Oh, oh, oh oh i'm covered in

yeah oh you were in that west made out of hot dogs yeah clather me with mustard because i'm covered in hot dogs during block part of the hit 80 song pour some mustard on me because i'm covered in hot dogs that's my catch phrase how is this this needs more milk

can mine slather me with mustard it's all food related. During block party, Max Fun shows are releasing episodes that are especially welcoming to new audience as well. We fucked it up already guys. I didn't do that with all these shenanigans. So the new audience is like, okay, how is the star of the show? Dan is covered in hot dogs. That's his thing. You has mustard on them. Yeah. Yeah. If. Yeah, yeah, if you like Unfortunately, if you like how the best and many of our listeners do she's not normally on the show She is a frequent guest host and

But that's why you got to listen to every episode. Yeah, you just never know when Yeah, yeah, we've gone back through our catalog and deleted any mention in the show notes whether or not you are on the episode Yeah, I just got a guess And I may not come in till the very end Listen to them all through or as much as whatever metrics Podcasts listening are measured by if you listen to them over half. That's probably okay. I don't know It's a it's the Wild West out there, but anyway. Oh, yeah, them over half, that's probably okay. I don't know. It's the Wild West out there. But anyway, it's in the Block Party, huh? Oh, yeah.

It's in a Wild West Block Party. Yeah. If you've been encouraging a friend to try out our show, this is the perfect episode to share with them. It's also a great time to check out shows you've been curious about. Since they're also releasing episodes geared towards new audience members as well, the Block Party has games, recommendations of volunteer event, a limited edition poster, and more you can find out about that stuff at maximumfun.org slash block party. Tell your friends, tell them to come to the podcast block party and they'll say, nerd, but maybe some of them will come.

Elliot is looking very stern. I went off my suitcase. Yeah, I was thinking, you know, what else I gotta do? It's more basically still in a pandemic, so. Yeah, that's true. I'm not going to go to one of the two and do a virtual block party, yeah. Yeah.

Well, that's a good thing. We were supposed to have a block party on my block, we got canceled because of Delta. So, so Dan stuck with all these winners. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Take it on me. Mustard filled weeners.

So you wait, you filled the must, the weeners with mustard? Like you injected them full of mustard? Yeah. Yeah. Like a cher. Uh huh. Are cherries easily filled with mustard? Covered in mustard.

Yeah. Yeah. That's why we're in Dan's apartment right now. There's plastic sheeting all over the floor and there's syringes that are been discarded that are partially filled with mustard lying every which way. Dangerous.

And you're like, Dan, this is for inserting into hot dogs and Dan's like, yeah, sure. Yes, hot dogs. Sure. So what do we do on this podcast? This is a podcast for us. Let's tell all those new listeners what we do. It's mostly making funny about your hot dogs, right? So what do we do on this podcast? This is a podcast for us. Let's tell all those new listeners what we do.

It's mostly making funny about your hot dogs, right? Yeah, the premise of this podcast, which seemed a lot more unique about 15 years ago, is that we watch a bad movie and we talk about it. And every October, we celebrate Shoktober, the time of the year. It used to be when we watched slightly more horror movies than normal, because the early years were pretty horror movie heavy. These days, they've been sequestered mostly to the month

of October. I guess I don't get to pick the movies anymore. It's always mild mountain time and other movies that might make Dan Cry, yeah. And pretty frequently we've had Halley on these episodes because she's a horror fan. I know that a lot of people on Twitter have been wondering, Halley, have you seen a ghost? No, I haven't seen a ghost. Yeah. Only, no, I don't even have a joke.

You can see why Halley is so close. Joyce Carol Loats would appreciate you not joking about ghosts. Or should I call her Joyce's Carol Ghosts? I won't. So today we watched the turning, Dan. Yeah. Based on the turn of the screw, the Henry Jane James novella, you know, family. Heavily and frequently adapted novellum return the screw

the innocence i guess is probably the um... sort of the definitive as the patient the innocence is a great movie uh... did not haunting of uh... blithe manor the series on uh... netflix is it based on the i mean it's pretty heavily influenced by the scene that one okay so what is the deal it's just like The original haunted house story or something. I don't really understand what this movie was supposed to be about so I don't understand

A very clear premise which is that a governess is taking care of two kids who seem to be Possessed or at least being controlled by the ghosts of two people who used to be at the house. And really confuses it up quite a bit. And I have to admit that, and we'll get to it, I guess. But I really want to talk to you guys about the ending because it was one of the few times that I've seen a modern movie recently

where I was like, what? I don't even know what that was supposed to represent. You could evoke any moment from the movie and I would be like, oh, that was the ending. Oh, okay. I don't even remember which moment was the ending. Well, the ending, I think, I mean, we'll get there, is meant to capture the ambiguity of the story, which is the other big thing about the turn of the screw. You can, it has been subjected to a lot of literary

criticism and interpretation over the years, and you can either read it as a straightforward ghost tale, or you can read it as the story of a governess who has gone mad through possible mad through possible, you know, a combination of sexual confusion and gaslighting and gaslighting nerves, all these, all the typical things that in the old days, in horror stories, women were, we're going through. But you're saying, so the turn of the screw is one of the originals of the, it's a horror movie or is it all in their head? Yeah. Yeah, I think it kind of, yep, exactly. That's why they say things are twisted, Elliot, is because they're referring to how when you turn a screw, you twist it. It's just amazing how, it's amazing how Al Goldstein, he was so inspired by this story that

he went on to find, he went on to found Screw Magazine, but he could have easily called a Turn Magazine, because it was the turn of the screw that inspired him to found screw magazine. Yeah. That's really interesting. I'm glad you shared that anecdote. So the movie begins night. A woman question, governess, flees from a mansion, but is stopped at the gate by a ghost. Yeah. Saying, hey, hey, do you have your passport to leave ghost town? Okay. Then we saw that. So those town you need a passport to leave,

it's a sovereign territory. Yeah. Yeah. So it's a city state. That's why Bill Juice has so many pockets to carry his fucking passport. So then we hear over, we hear a TV tell us that Kirk Cobain has died. That's a fucking bummer. The clumsiest time period setting, I think I've seen in a movie in several years at least

two of it. It's just like, oh, Kirk can't wait to die. Let's turn the television off immediately, if I'm hearing that. I mean, it is right up there within the wedding singer when the guy goes, hey, J.R. just got shot in terms of like, and there it's deliberately a joke, but here it does feel like a jockey way to set up that time period. But it's to create that aura of, I guess, young doom

that I will follow our main character. And Halley, here's the thing I was wondering, you've always wanted to see a ghost. Did this movie make you want to be a governess so that you could maybe see a ghost in that job because you are not a governess right now, right? I feel like one. You're not a pain.

I mean, I'm not a child. No, but it's your own children, so it doesn't count. Well, I kept wondering, is she getting paid because we never saw her get a patient. It's true. Nobody handed her a paycheck or a bag of money. No, that's true. The kids certainly are not tipping.

So. Yeah, so Kurt Cobain, RIP, Mackenzie Davis decides to stop teaching in order to be a rich kid's private tutor under the explanation to make a difference. It's a very weird moment where she's like, this is a rich kid who needs a mother, because her parents are gone.

I could really make a difference here. It's like, wait, but you're already teaching like a classroom full of not rich kids with me making more of a difference? No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, This might chance to be the Aristotle to her Alexander the Great influencing a future world conqueror. And it's like, all right, okay, in a world without Kurt Cobain, I guess anything's possible. Wait, question, real question. Do we know, did I just miss where it's supposed to be said? I think I assumed it was Seattle because Kurt Cobain was mentioned, but then now in

reference to that was... You know, that was worldwide, dude. Yeah. Yeah. And in local regional news, I do feel like I had a similar feeling though. And maybe it's just because there's it's always misty. I thought maybe this was the Pacific Northwest, but does the Pacific Northwest have a lot of like beautiful manor houses?

It could be, it could be like a logging magnet of the 19th century built that estate or something like that. I think it does feel like more of a like East Coast, the kind of estate you might have found then. I mean, it's an English, it's a story that's originally said in England, right? I think because Henry James, though American, spent his life over there. So like, it makes more sense that there would be like a manor house, but it could be like a robber baron house, you know But by the way Is there a reason beyond I guess I guess we're setting everything in the like Recent past because of cell phones like That this like 25 years in the 90s

Well, that's recent pass on the human time. I mean, if on the geologic scale, uh, 70 AD, you guys are right. It's a fucking turn of the screw. It's recent past compared to turn of the screw. They wanted to set it at the turn of the century. I understand whether that like is not like, oh, remember how there are so many ghosts hanging around to the 90s. Like, I mean, there were a lot of ghosts in the 90s. They were the ghosts of decisions made by baby boomers.

And they're now still haunting us. Yeah. But the, and of course they were the ghosts of Mars in the 90s. But they were the early 2000s. No, it's early 2000s. I think it is, I think it is to, they're setting it then so it feels a little bit like the past, but you're right, to get get away with Not otherwise when she showed up she'd have to be like what's the Wi-Fi password and his grows the the old lady would have to be like We don't have Wi-Fi and then we'd have an interminable scene of her walking around the ground

Yeah, trying to get a signal on her cell phone and like it who cares set it in the 90s. Why not, you know, you know, you know I love the 90s. Yeah, as I never said that I mean, I think the 90s. Yeah. Has anyone ever said that? I mean, I think it was like a CD collection. So McKenzie Davis decides to go visit her mom at a kind of stylish mental hospital. This is kind of when I realized like this, this movie looks pretty good. Like everything is fairly stylized. The like this, this is a person, the director mainly has, it looked like music video credits and TV. Her first feature was the runaways about the band, the runaways, which was pretty good.

And so she visits her mother, played by Julie Richardson, who you would know from the Patriot and that BBC lady chatterly adaptation was shown to be due to this stuff. She's a lot of stuff. She's part of a long time. She's part of a long time. She's part of a long British acting dynasty. As the Amazon trivia told me, she's the fourth member of her family to be in an adaptation of the turn of the screw.

Wow. Going all the way turn of the screw. Wow. All the way back to the innocence. Yeah. So she's a, you know, she's, she's a red grave, Julia Richardson. So like, you know, families, they're red-shacting royalty, you know. Wait, was Vanessa Redgrave in the Devils? Um, I can't remember. It's a good, shocked over name though.

Yeah. Red Grave. Okay. Is she Vanessa Redgrave's daughter? She has been us a red graves daughter. Yes, she loves Michael red graves Granddaughter. Yeah. Yeah, the she looks like Vanessa grave because it's her mother. Yeah, that's like Red grave is a scary it runs me. There's a kind of there's a breed of apple called gravenstein and And and I'm always the assignment was like gravenstein And I remember I see a sign of him and I was like, oh, Graven's time. Daniel's like, it's not scary, it's an apple.

Yeah, so it's like, Frank is signed with Graven. It's scary, Ethel. I think the movie is beautiful. I think the answer to that, that Vanessa Redgrave was in the devil's directed by Ken Russell. And then Jolly Richardson was in, lady chatterly, there was also directed by Ken Russell.

It's got Ken Russell all over it. So let's get back to this movie, shall we? Ken Russell, the father of Kurt Russell. Oh, yeah, exactly. Okay. And Kurt Russell, the father of Kerry Russell, anyway, could do. God damn it. So she's in this stylish mental hospital.

She's doing art in an empty pool. She explains your mom. Yeah. Her mental hospital. Yeah, I mean, yeah. Before anywhere. I just watched a barben star and it just reminded me of their motel where there's an empty pool where a guy's playing solitaire on a on a little card table at the bottom of it. I mean, this is the 90s. Maybe this is a statement about how back in the 80s Reagan cut all the funding for the mentally ill. Yes, so they had to lose their pools. Yeah, the like we can afford water, we can afford water, we can't afford both.

Yeah. So our, our, our heroine, her name is Kate. After leaving her mom goes to this, uh, palatial, not palatial, this, this manor house. It's pretty palatial. She walks, yeah, she walks around a lot. It's for such a large, well groomed home and grounds, it is sparsely populated. And it's filled with a lot of foreboding noises.

I, and junk, Halle's right, there's a lot of brick in this house. Yeah. I don't have broken dolls in this house. They have a surprisingly large number of rooms dedicated to antique shattered mannequins. It's a pretty gothic story. So I guess you can get away with the stuff

when you're creating that kind of mood. But Audrey did point out that it's just like, I don't think in a horror movie. Like in the first 10 minutes, you shouldn't have like a bunch of scary noises. Like you want to like ease into that a little bit like like, like, fake your way into like, okay, this is like on at least one foot in the normal world. I mean, it is, it does feel like she, she does walk through a portal and enter into the like, fairy land from Jonathan Strange and Mr. Noral where there's just like, like,

diabolical masquerades going on all the time. Yeah really just feels like as soon as she gets to the house, yeah, she's entered a nightmare realm. It's, she's entered the world represented by the illustrations and the original scary tales to tell in the dark. But like, it does not, yeah. And I think that's an emigrory illustration or something from the beginning of mystery. Yeah, yeah, she's in the mystery opening title credits.

She should be like, this isn't right. Speaking of illustrations, we, she meets the, I guess, older housekeeper, Mrs. Gross or Miss Gross, who is exclusively looks like she has been taken out of a black and white photo, kind of like detox in the season five finale of RuPaul's Drag Race. It's an interesting choice because this is a movie that features ghosts. And yet this woman who looks like a ghost

the whole time is not one. And has a British accent. She does, and it makes her there confused me about the whole issue. Me too. Yeah. And it's also, if it would make more sense if she was a ghost because the whole movie,

Kate would be like, let's do this, Flora and Ms. Gross would be like, no, no, she can't do that. And I'd be like, well, why aren't you the governess, Mrs. Gross? So like, you don't seem to do anything else all day except ride Kate's ass about what Flora can and can't do. Like, why did you hire Kate? Like, this is your job. I was confused about the situation there. Like, like, the, the flow chart of who's in charge and also like who has a guardianship of these kids. Is it that woman or like that's? They're owned by the house. The house inherited them.

Yeah. Yeah, so we meet after there's a lot of walking around this property. If, yeah, I mean, like, it's basically a fucking Zillow ad. So like a spooky Zillow ad. Like, you rent, you rent to a haunted house, you know. Yeah, it's what happens when you go to Zillow in October all the houses in the next week. It's so funny, all the listings,

of coasts and cobwebs on them. Yeah, yeah. It's so hard to buy a house in October because all the real estate listings make them look like abandoned band-in-old mansion Now all this will be cleared away later And they're like we have to stage the house when did you want to sell it October? Oh October? Okay, get me cobwebs get me broken mirrors Get get me a coffin for a table. That's how you have to stay. Stayed in my punny dictionary.

Somebody start peeling the grapes. Well, real Christmas, they just have a spray that smells like freshly peeled grapes. Yeah, yeah, let me bring you through to the ensuite master death. Master math. I mean to say master math. Come on. I thought you were going to say master bath. Come on.

Oh, I thought you were going to say deadroom. Oh, better. Oh, better. That's OK. Tell me how to do my job. Sure. Maybe you're the real estate agent now. OK, fine.

With a squeal estate agent. Here, you're gonna be the best. Here, you do it. I'll buy the house from you. Oh, this place is lovely. I don't like the color. Anyway, goodbye. We're just going to surprise. You can always take the house.

No, no, no. And now I've transferred the curse onto you. You're now the real estate agent in this house. I'm free, I'm free, I'm free. I'm just glad he stopped saying, squeal estate. OK, so we meet Flora, who is a spooky little girl. We walk around to spooky hedge maze, then we tour the house,

and we see a crazy, crazy dummy of a dead grandma. We learn that Flora can't leave the property, you know, normal rich people stuff. Yeah. Flora played by the young girl from the Florida project, by the way. Maybe that's why they named her Flora. Oh, that's right.

She was, I mean, I thought I named her flora. Oh, that's right. I thought I thought I recognized her from somewhere. I mean, she's good in this movie too. The movie is not obviously as good as the Florida project, which is amazing. Yeah, this movie is way less willum to foe. That's 100% less. This movie. What a big grade in this. Mary's Yanooky. Yeah. He should have been Mrs. Groza. But we're, Kate, frankly, a male governess. Why not? A governor, if you will. I think the problem with this movie is not the acting. I think all the performers do pretty fine in it.

But it does, it is, Stuart, you're saying earlier, or maybe Dan was about how the movie looks pretty good, but it looks all very samey. I think you guys are saying, there's no difference between the spooky scenes and the non-spooky scenes and how it looks. So it all kind of turns into kind of like a gray glob at a certain point.

Well, I have that thing about the acting. So I don't know if this is a, I don't know if you attribute this to a flaw, the acting or a flaw in the conception of the movie. But I thought the kids should have been spooky. They're like actually not spooky at all. They just seem like normal kids in a spooky house. I mean, they seem like assholes.

I mean, the brother Sun is an asshole. He's an asshole, but he doesn't seem like, he seems like not as creepy as he should seem. I feel like. I think you're right. This is like, this is a case, like the girl is a sweetheart and the guy who will meet soon in the synopsis that Stewart is so kindly.

Played by Stranger, thank you for your spin, Wolfhard. Yeah, Finn Wolfhard are old daily show co-hosts, a daily show writer, Dan Amira, once tweeted, well, Wolfhardira once tweeted, well, Wolfhard or Wolfholm, I guess. And I was one of like five people who favored it. That was really speaking to me versus. I love the idea now of Dan Amira. This will mean nothing to the listeners

who don't know him as a co-host of the Daily Show. Because he's a man who has very little emotional effects when he talks. No, he is. Yeah, imagine me but more so. Yeah, but we're talking. So she spends the day. So I just, I want to take the kids aren't spooky. I want to mention that I think this shows that the children who play the parts, their names are are Finn Wolfhard and Brooklyn Prince and their names are spookier than the character names Which is miles and florida fair child and I think you're I think it's a it's a conception problem I think that's feels like a directing problem to me that the kids yeah, I think you're right or not

There's nothing eerie about them and so much the movie is is Kate wandering around the house getting spooked by mirrors and things like that But when she sees the kids, they're not like, there's nothing ghosty about them. Yeah, Miles is kind of creepy in a teenage boy way of being creepy, not in a creepy eerie way. It's not like this guy's gonna be able to do anything to her. He's very tall.

It's not like, is this kid, is this kid of a ghost inside them? It's more like, hey this kid, is this kid have a ghost inside them? It's more like, this kid is gonna go. I mean, at a certain point, every teenage boy has a ghost inside them. Yeah, so we, yeah, like there's a brief scar.

Or, Allie, it's Block Party episode, please. Come on. What if it's a horror porn? It's a horror porn called Ghost in the Dick. It's like, It's a horror porn. It's a horror porn called ghost in the dick.

It's a very weird adaptation of ghost in the show. Yeah, yeah. And the ghost busters are, I guess, porn stars that help you get it out of your dick and they're like, we gotta get that ghost out of you. You know, yeah. So we have a couple of us. We have a couple of early scares. There's a point where the first moment, after spending the day with Flora,

Kate sees a ghost of a woman in the window and has a kind of muted reaction. She seems like a little creeped out, but not like, I mean, she just saw a ghost. What Harry dreams about. And then she, then she, you know, there's a few other minor scares. For all those listeners out there, you'd get a much better reaction from yours truly.

Quit trying to impress McKinsey Davis. Yeah. How can you give us a taste? Can you give us a taste of what your ghost reaction would be like? I don't know. That seems like about the same actually. And I know I just sprang it on you but a ghost is gonna spring it on you too So my baby is napping Okay, like that. Yeah, she was biting your fingernails for She we as she meets miles who's the elder child We talked about him a little bit. He's a little bit twisted.

He's been expelled through school. He's got a bad attitude. He sticks pins and mannequin boobs, you know, normal teenage boy stuff. Cape finds the diary of the former governess. So we get a little bit, she starts to do a little bit of detective work. There's a scene where she's in Miles bedroom or no, not even his bedroom. It's his like music room and there's a moment with a spider that was pretty cool, right, a little trap door spider.

Yeah, he just lets the spider crawl on his hand. He's like, hey man, I got a spider on my hand basically. And then he, he, he's a CGI spider and then he puts it in a tank and a CGI trap door spider jumps out and eats it. Uh huh. It's amazing. And I think this is going to somehow be relevant to the rest of the movie. But it's not. Yeah, you think the movie's going to end with Jake Chillinghall opening a bedroom tour and there's just a giant spider there and that's the end of the movie and you're like, what?

And that guy's making dude now. It's crazy. Okay, so she then she hears Flora scream from outside and she runs to the window and sees Flora floating in the pool appearing to drown. So she runs outside, she jumps into the water. Uh oh, it's just a honeypot for the ghost because a ghost tries to grab her. She climbs out and then the kids are there laughing at her. Wait, was it a trick from the kids or a honey pot from the ghost? Who knows? Dan, what do you think? Well, I mean, the ghosts are possibly controlling the kids.

Beans go away. You know, you can be like that gift. This is why not both. Yeah. Um, okay. So we get a couple more ghosts. Like, to be honest, a lot of this plot summary, she's gonna be like, ghost scare, ghost scare.

It's kind of the opposite of House of the Devil, which is super scary, even though it's just a babysitter walking around a house for most of the movie. And without much happening, this is a babysitter or governor's walking around a house with lots of jump scares, and you're like, all right, okay, where's the next one? Yeah. And like, once again, she's walking around this big house

and it's pretty clean and organized. And you would think, shouldn't there be, like who's taking care of these fucking horses? Right. Well, that's like as they mentioned. So one of the things that come up is that Quint, the old horse, Caper,

has died. Didn't hire anyone else to take care. So I guess Mrs. Grossa was like, another thing to add to my to do this. I'm already cleaning the house and cooking. I guess I'll take care of the horses. So I'm just shovel out the stalls. Yeah, we get a little garden horse ride

where Cate is learning to ride a horse while Miles whips it a bunch. And it's just kind of, like, there's a strange power dynamic already going on here. And then they ride their horse to the coy pond where he then stomps on a fish, which is also not cool. Well, he's putting it out of its misery. It was it was being eaten by a raven.

Yeah, that's true. Because you know, ravens love to eat his fish. You see it all the time out of it. I mean, I'm sure of raven we eat some fish. It had the chance. I don't know if it's right into. I mean, I'm sure of Raven. We eat some fish. It had the chance. I don't know if it's right into I would want a fish care of Dan McCoy if they're in here of Halley Haglund or They can tell me whether you know Corvids grab

Fish from ponds or not or whether that's not a thing that a raven would normally do. Yeah, I'll have an insta poll vote. That's so raven or that's not so raven. Okay, well that road leads to more alley-grang. But also, also another confusing detail. So it's like he stomps on this fish and then she's like, my, why would you do that? And he's like, nothing should have to suffer. So then you get the sense that that's going to, that's foreshadowing and that's, yeah, life is going to have something to do with the plot. It does not. It does not. No, that's true. No, like even if there was, even if there is an evil ghost inside him, at least like that sentiment isn't that evil, like you should think that this ghost is a good ghost. Okay, well, we'll talk about good ghost later. When we review.

A good, good, good, good ghost. Yeah, so there's a, there's a thank you, Hallie. There's a lot of sequences where. I'll take it. I'll take it. I'll take it. I'll take it. I'll take it.

I'll take it. I'll take it. I'll take it. I'll take it. I'll take it. I'll take it. I'll take it. I'll take it. I'll take it.

I'll take it. I'll take it. I'll take it. I'll take it. I'll take it. I'll take it. I'll take it. I'll take it.

I'll take it. I'll take it. I'll take it. I'll take it. I'll take it. I'll take it. I'll take it. I'll take it. I'll take it. I'll take it. I'll take it. Are we all in fucking killing Murphy's mind or something? What's happening? Okay, so there's, Miles makes a weird comment

about how Kate has a sexy tattoo and we learned that she has an Uraburro's tattoo on the back of her neck, which depending on the time and where she got it, that might have been the legal tattoo, right? Okay, a legal tattoo? It's so interesting. Yeah, tattooing wasn't legal in a lot like in New York until I think the mid 90s.

Huh, wow, interesting. That's the most interesting thing I've ever heard. Stu's tattoo talk corner. Oh, cool. Wow, I didn't know I was going to be impressing you guys with my knowledge. Right in, of course, was that little knowledge drop Raven or not so Raven? Well, it's going to confuse the other results. Oh, no, I'm not really related to the Raven thing. But that's so Raven, Colin Tattoo issue in the, in the, in the, like, email.

Well, that looks good. We could start, we could start a new mailbox for this one, but I guess okay, we don't need to. Well, I didn't want to catch it. You know, we, one, I guess, okay, we don't need to do. Well, I didn't want to contra, you know, we have to, yes and, Elliot, even if it's using issue. That's fair. Oh yeah, New York City band tattooing, which from between 1961 and 1997, it says. Oh shit, man. You know, what do I do when I'm right?

Cause I'm not right very often on this podcast. Do I get, should I do a little dance? Yeah, do it. Okay, Dan. He's dancing, wait, okay, he's up. Up, what, he's doing a Charleston. He's on the table, yeah, okay, stop weaving that around. Okay, the pants need to stay on still.

All right, okay. Okay, okay, so the dance really took a lot out of you. Yeah, yeah. Okay, so she's like, okay, this place is fucking weird. I gotta get out of here. So she decides to take the kids on a little trip and the kids's like, okay, this place is fucking weird. I gotta get out of here. So she decides to take the kids on an old trip and the kids are like, okay, but only if our, you know, secret protectors as we can go. And so they get in the car and they're about to leave.

And I was like, oh great, we're gonna have another location in this movie. No, no, no, not so fast. This is a cheap horror movie, not only one location. So they can't leave. Flora starts to have what appears to be some kind of a panic attack. And then Miles gets very aggressive,

which is again, not cool. Do we mention that their parents died at an accident right by the gate that this is perhaps the source of, like this is a police den is a, this is a, this is a, this is a, this is a,

this is a, this is a, this is a, this is a, this is a, this is a, this is a, this is a,

this is a, this is a, this is a, this is a, this is a, this is a, this is a, this is a,

this is a, this is a, this is a, this is a, this is a, at by a raven maybe right into that so raven or that's not so raven care of Dan McCoy let us know okay so you know Kate's Kate's pretty shaken uh shook up shaking it's shook and shake it whatever let me check with let me check with Elvis he says all shook up okay so she you know she's having a little bit of a crisis she is talking to her friend her former roommate, and the stakes are pretty clear at this point. They lay them out. That she could just bail and go back to her old life, she could go back to her old living

situation, or she could try and stay there and help the kids and the ghosts. So she decides to try and make up with Flora and Miles to mixed results, I would say. Because she pinkies, she made a promise, crossed her heart, hope to die with Flora, that she would stay. Now, as somebody who doesn't spend much time with children, that kind of a promise seems like garbage to me. Yeah, that's what we believe in.

Yeah, I believe in kids' court. Kids' courtically. Right, but the promise is all the time today. That's what I'm saying. Oh, I think five times today, I've made an agreement with my three year old, and then he's immediately gone back on it. Kids are, yeah, they're weasels, you know.

They'll say anything and they'll do anything. Yeah, they're wild. Okay, so. Round them up, lock them up, that's what I say. Yes. What's the value of the kids today? Finally, she starts to do a little bit more detective work on what is it?

Miss Jessup? Is that the former governor? Miss Jessal. Jessal. We have to assume of George. Yes, one of the great old time comedians. Yeah. Who has gone missing and Quint? I mean, George, Jessal has long since died. No one's looking for him.

Oh, you mean Miss Jessal? Yes. I'm glad that me getting a fact right as inspired LA to correct me on all my facts. Quint, the now dead groundskeeper, stable master. So she's doing some detective work on this pair, but really not that much. Other than we find out that Miss Jessel was frightened of Quint that he was a threatening presence and that will learn that he is what abusive, assaultive, a murderer. All we love.

Yeah. If the ghosts are to be believed. There's a bunch more ghost dreams. She decides to play a game of fucking hide and seek. Pretty far into the movie. Yeah, it's like basically. Like, basically. Yeah, like, these people are supposed to be the crux of the whole movie and we like just sort of learned

who Quint was. Yeah. Yeah. And I got to admit, you know, I've I read the turn of the screw, you know, back in college and I saw the innocence last year, I think, which was maybe the second time I've seen in my life. So I've had at least some grounding in other, like the original and adaptations of this. But I don't know that it would be very clear to me what the deal was with these two characters, these missing, you know, like other servants. If I didn't have that background,

I would agree. It's not a movie that is welcoming to people who don't already know the story of the movie. I mean, to be honest, if you didn't already know the story, you might not even know it was a ghost movie until very far into it. Yeah, it, I mean, I feel like one of the things this movie suffers from is that we're comparing almost everything to other interpretations of it, other adaptations. And it just doesn't stack up. So she, let's see. Oh, this is, this is a, you know, she decides to play a game of hide and seek. She gets scared a bunch,

she gets a bloody nose. I mean, this is the sort of thing where you're like, this is ghost house 101. Like at this point, why are you playing hide and seek? I totally want to see a show you host now, a steward called ghost house 101, where you're, it's like a haunted house competition show. Yeah, I mean, obviously the first lesson is like, oh, yeah, you got some spooky ghost stuff. Just go stay in a hotel.

If the ghost follows you, then that's a different kind of ghost. We can deal with that. Yeah, that's. If there's a big stain on the wall, don't look in there. Or maybe do if the ghost wants you to do something with their bones. Exactly.

But it's hard to know that until you go into the room. Now I can see the commercials that were used. It's this ghost house 101 and Stuart Ghost Class is in session. And that's how the commercial ends. If you find ghost bones have somebody you don't like, deal with them first,

in case putting them into the stain on the wall causes a negative result. Yeah, you know what the ghost wants? Almost always, you don't know what the ghost, but none tell the truth. The ghost are that, yeah, They're very hard to predict. After the fact, it seems like they could have just told you the thing that they wanted, but they don't want to do that.

Ghost love head games. Do you guys have the same experience I had in the movie? I got a therapy. Yeah, maybe it's a ghost therapy show, Stuart. Maybe you're a therapist who deals with ghosts. The hardest part is getting them to do it clearly. Why do you find it so hard to ask for the things you need, Ghost? Yeah, this is all great stuff.

Let's start tending this. Let's write it up. By the way, Ellie, if you said that already, every once in a while you keep cutting out. So we just have to play a game where we guess what you're saying. I know, my internet connection today is not so great. You've been doing a great job so far.

Have you guys, did you guys have the experience I had on the haunted mansion ride as a kid? Where at the end, you look into a trick mirror and there's a ghost in the car with you. And it says, oh, he's gonna be going home with you. And I was young enough that I thought a ghost might be following us the rest of the day. And it really spooked me out.

And it was until years later, there was like, there's no way a successful theme park is just gonna be throwing ghosts at people. Like, there's no way, hold on a second. I thought you were gonna be like, there's no way a successful theme park is just going to be throwing ghost people. Like, there's no way. Hold on a second. I thought you were going to be like, there's no way a successful ghost would want to come home with me. He has his own.

Yeah, he's got his own stuff. No, you don't know with ghosts. Like you were saying, you don't know, and they're not very clear in their communications, that you never know what they want. But it was like, you know what, if this, if this ride was really sending ghosts after people, they'd probably shut it down. They'd probably change it to something else. They'd run out of ghosts.

Yeah. So, limited resources. They're having a meeting. The Imagineers are having a meeting. They're like, we're low on ghosts, everybody. The attendance has been very high this year. We don't have enough ghosts. We had to start hard-gurring people.

That's one answer. Okay, at least someone's giving me solutions. And not just problems. So she gets a package in the mail. It's it's from her mom, of course it's filled with some spooky art that is basically just like a lot of charcoal smeared on a piece of paper. Yeah. I think that was going to be something too, because it had all these holes in it and I was like, oh, I bet she made those balls with the screw

Famous screw And then in planet Hollywood you could see you could see the screw a famous screw from the turn of the screw Yep right next to my Bruno sunglasses so Your Bruno sunglasses? Yeah. Warren Leicester Wellington. Yep. Bruce Willis is actually just Stewart's alter ego, just like Bruno's. Bruce Willis is alter. Yeah. I have to, I was bitten by a radioactive egg. So I turned into Bruce Willis on a full. Okay. So she of course follows a ghost to a pond and she finds Miss Jessel's dead body in the pond.

She's like, it's time to get the fuck out of here. So she goes back to the house where she witnesses a ghostly assault where she watches ghost quint, strangle, ghost Miss Jessel. And then ghost quint, a strangle, ghost mist jessle, and then ghost quint starts to attack her and then pushes, gross, gross, grossa over the property, gross, yeah. I don't know why Elliott has reinvented the pronunciation

of this, I think that's the way it spelt. Just goes the way it's spelt. Yeah, so I mean, I do want the character to be more interesting than she is. Because Mrs. Gross is just a bit on the nose as a character in the horror movie. She is pushed over the balcony. Hello, I'm your boss, Mr. Spooks. Okay. So she gets pushed over the balcony and we get like a kind of fun lull stun.

And then Kate runs through the house. She tries to get the kids to join her and escape the grounds. But then as she's, as she's what, driving up to the front gate, it cuts back to her opening the package with her mom's artwork. Yeah.

So that stuff was all, I guess, a dreamer in her head. Yeah, with the fuck. Is it more interesting to read it as something that did happen, but the house has kind of caught her in some sort of loop of existence? Yes. Because it is much more interesting. It does feel, because I had the same feeling when I was reading, watching it, I was like, oh, okay, so she imagined all the ghost stuff

and the exciting stuff while she was looking at this charcoal drawing full of holes. Maybe it's a commentary on the powerful effects of art can have on people. Like I know when you go to the museum, don't you stare into the paintings and then imagine a whole lifetime of experiences. Very much so.

Escaping some ghosts. Yeah, they're trying to escape a ghost house. I mean, think about light start. I'm not like I'm tattooed. It never ends. Yeah, right. But you know what? This is a great movie.

It makes sense. I mean, you're saying Stuart this is more of a velvet buzzsaw type reading of the movie where it's art that's so powerful that it kills. Uh-huh. Yeah, that was a movie I liked.

It's a world of velveteen wrap with a movie. Yeah, that makes that movie. Oh, she's talking about that movie. Yeah, I mean a movie I liked. I'm a well-developed team. Yeah, I like that movie. I was just talking about that movie. Yeah, I mean, it's basically what, like a final destination movie, but with a lot of good actors in it, and not quite as fun as a final destination, whatever. Okay, so then she tries to run over to the kids and be like, we gotta get out of here.

This is a ghost house, let's break out and the kids are like, what are you talking about? And she just comes off as appearing very unhinged and then while this realization is hitting her, she then wakes up, she is now in the mental hospital with her mother where her mother is scratching away on her charcoal. Well, they zoom into her eye.

I wouldn't say that she wakes up. There's a zoom into her eye where she is with her mom in this black space. Uh-huh. Yeah. Okay. I'm sure that clarification is gonna help the list. Well, I don't, it's not like you woke up.

It's not a dream. Like it is different. I don't know if this is... Stu, I feel like Stu, you're imposing an explanation on to a scene that is very unclear in the movie. Yeah, you guys are both right. And then she approaches her mother who's scratching away with charcoal. And then her mother turns and she freaks out. Is it because it's not her mother?

It's her? Who knows? Maybe your mother looks extra twisted. Because we don't see her mother's face. We see the back of her mother's head and Kate screams and then the movie's over and that's when I was like, wait a minute. So what did I, I had to rewatch that little bit of thing

because I was like, did I miss something while I was doing the dishes? Oh no, it's exactly that, you know. Yeah, it's the trunk of the car from repo, man. Well, it's kind of, I mean, like the movies seem to sort of be doing, so okay. It's playing off the ambiguity of turn of the screw, right? It's playing off like, is there a ghost? Is she having a mental breakdown? And I, trying to do, I feel like a lady in the tiger ending where we see both things happen. You know, like, like what have we made a movie of the lady in the tiger and we see the lady behind

one door and then we see the tiger behind the same door except for the way that movies work. The chronology, you know, like the thing that we see last takes precedence, right? So like, that's the clue principle. Yeah, the last ending of clue is the real one. Yeah, the movie seems to be landing on the idea that she is, you know, has some sort of dementia like her mom and then like that last bit is kind of representing her, like being terrified, like that it's true that like she is the thing that she was fearing, but it's so confusing the way the movie does it. Now, if-

But that only made sense if they had set it up the whole time that like every spooky thing was seen through her eyes and it wasn't. Like there were tons of events where she would close a door like like when she sees the grandmother mannequin and she like puts it in the other room and then she closes the door and she's not witnessing when the mannequin like moves along. We already believe that this house is haunted so how can can we also believe that, you know, it's either both, but, or, or she's didn't go crazy,

but it's not that she just went crazy. Maybe the movie doesn't wanna have it both ways, where it is a haunted house, and she is mentally unstable, and is doing mad, and it's all, like, or here's another, okay, here's another, here's another explanation, here's where I get my no prize from the makers of the turning.

The reason that that mannequins turns its head like that when she's not in the room is because she's actually telekinetic. There's no ghosts, but she is creating all these things with her mind. She's both imagining it and making it real at the same time. Well, Marvel Comics can send me my no prize.

I know this is not a Marvel comic story. It's a movie made by other people based on our Henry James story. But they can send it to me at my address, which is, is that so Raven or is that not so Raven? Care of Daven's house. One, two, three, fake street Hollywood America. Oh, four, five, six, nine, that's so confusing. Now it's going to be 100. If you had seen the movie clue in the movie theater and you only got one of the endings, would you have felt a little ripped off or no? Well, that's apparently what kept a lot of people

from seeing clue in the theaters is that they advertised. There are three different endings. These are the theaters where ending A is playing. This where ending B is playing. This running C is playing. And people were like, I don't like the bad ending. I'm just not gonna see this stupid movie. And so it did hurt clue quite a bit, you know.

And it wasn't until it was on TV and on video that they included all the endings. And people were like, oh, that's funny. Which is... So, we've reached the end of this, you know, pretty simple film. A simple little ghost tale. Yeah.

So I think it's a movie that is it's reaching towards ambiguity and it manages to instead reach only confusion. Does that how you guys felt about it? Well certainly in that like I find you know do your ambiguous ending where it's like okay one thing happens and then it's revealed to maybe be a fantasy and just the product of her mind. But then to like add a third thing, we're like, let's zoom into her eye and she screams at someone whose face we do not see. That's the part that adds just a little extra cherry

of like, wait, why did you do it that way? Uh huh. She's like, how many times do you think they had to go back and punch this movie up? Because like, it feels like the movie won the B. 10 jokes. Yeah, that's what I'm saying. I mean, it's hilarious.

How much extra work had to go into making hilarious? Yeah, Pat and I was in a room somewhere, like, fishing a D.R. Oh, yeah. Hey, I'm a ghost. Don't close that door. Oops, I'm like that. Yeah, I don't know, man. He'd be great at that.

No, but the, like, I feel like there's definitely scenes where they were like, okay, go back at a ghost to that mirror. Yeah. Goast to the, put a ghost behind her. That was the scariest stuff was, was only like the ghost in the mirror, the ghost behind her, the ghost in the wall. That was the only stuff that was scary. There was one part I liked a lot,

actually, where there's that ghost hand that keeps crawling onto her shoulder. I mean, it did look a little bit like thing from the Adam's family, but it was, but I thought that was it, when you realize that that hand was not connected to anything, that was really creepy to me, but otherwise, yeah, it's mostly,

what's that in that mirror? And there was one point at the end where it was like she got scared, it's something in a mirror, but I could not, I didn't see the ghost. So I thought it was the ladder that was scaring her. And then she was getting the ladder wasn't there. And I was like, so is it a dead ladder that's haunting her? Like, I don't know. She realized that she walked under that ladder earlier. And, you know, all bad luck was terrifying her.

Yes. What do you guys think of the ghost effects? So like the most ghostly part of the movie. Mostly ghostly, yeah. Was the scene where ghost, quint is strangling, ghost, miss, jessil. And it was, I was not a huge fan of these ghost effects. They were like very, I don't know, like blurry. Yeah. And I don't know, like blurry. And I don't know, yeah, just,

like I guess if I was in the room and that was happening, I would be pretty scared. You certainly would be. You certainly would be. The goosebumps for theory. I don't know. I guess if I was in a room and some blurry, a blurry guy was strangling a blurry woman, I'd be like a little weirded out, but I'd be like, oh, let me see it. Let me see it. It is like a like a Dave McKean cover for

an issue of Sandman where it's like, okay, this is like a blurry picture of something. Okay. Yeah, that's, especially at the end when Quint's ghost is kind of chasing after them and it looked like they'd taken a picture of like Lemmy from Motorhead and just kind of smeared chicken grease on the lens and and we're just it was that was facing them around it was all I could make out was That was a man with a mustache that was you know hard to see I think I Only thought the only thing that I thought was scary was when they would show Miss Jessel just like She would walk by and Ms. Jessa would be like her drowned body would be low-may or something.

Like those quick, optic things were scary to me, but yeah, like seeing the assault and stuff was not particularly effective. Yeah. That's coming from somebody who wants to see ghosts. I'm here. I'm your audience. And again, show us again, Hallie, how you react to that ghost. Yeah. She's chewing on the fingers again. Okay. Good stuff. Okay. Well, is this, let's do our final judgments. You know, we're not, oh, and it's shot tovers. So I'm pulling them out of the closet, the old Shacktober judgment categories.

Okay. Let's hear a spooky closet sound. Is he a spooky closet? Yep. So was this movie... Wait, wait. Eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee Is it terrifying? Was it totally snorrifying? Or was it frighteningly funny? Oh.

And again, these are terrible, terrible categories that are confusing. I want to say, for a large part of this movie, I was like, this isn't so bad, honestly. It is definitely just kind of like pro forma ghost movie making. But I like McKinsey Davis a lot. The kid from Florida Project, his name, I forget Brooklyn, something. Brooklyn Prince, I think is her name.

Very, very good child actor. I've liked Finn Wolfhardt and things. Like I think that the movie looks pretty good, even though there's the blurry ghost smeariness of it. But I, it just, it really falls apart more and more as it goes along. And, uh, yeah, I think it's like reaching for being a better horror movie and not just like forgettable schlock because why would you choose oh, we're gonna adapt turn to the screw if you were just gonna you know cash in on making horror movie but it doesn't make it there. So I go I guess I'll go with snorifying. Yeah, I think I'm gonna back you up on that one day, and I think it was pretty snorf-ing.

Like, it's stylish. It, I get the feeling like it was a project that they're like, hey, we have the rights of this, let's remake it. It's a horror movie, it's pretty easy. And the director tried to have a specific vision or the screenwriter had a specific vision, and they, I think they gave it their go, but I don't think it really worked out. It's stylish. I think they tried to go at least

at one point we're trying to go for the psychological like women is losing her mind, take on the story, but I think it ended up being kind of a mess. I just want to say off of that, I did do some background reading. The reason this originally got put into development was Steven Spielberg wanted to do a new turn of the screw adaptation. I don't know whether he ended up being involved with the version that finally got made, but it has a pedigree. There were like, that's where it came from anyway.

Alia. No, I agree. I weird both you guys. I think when as the first half of the movie, I was like, okay, this is fine. Like this is a fine straightforward kind of, but if I had never seen a horror movie before, if I was like a, if it was a sleepover,

if I was a teenager to sleepover, then I could be like, oh, this is fun. But then it kind of went off the rails and in terms of confusion. And it just becomes very one note. So yeah, I would have to call it snorifying, but it's fine sleepover fodder for 15 year olds, 14 year olds, I don't know, seven year olds, probably not seven year olds, but something like that. How many, what do you think?

Well, I hated this movie way more than you guys did. Wow. This movie was offensive to me. I feel like the fact that it did look good and the fact that it had been people in it made it all the more offensive because it was like, when you watch something that's really popular with a bunch of people

and you're like, I don't get it, why does everybody else like this? It's like this, you know, the patina of should be good that completely obscures that like nobody put any thought or any effort into making this, like all of the flaws of it are things that could have totally been avoided if any effort were put in.

It, I don't even understand, you know, it's like, there's no plot, it doesn't even understand, you know, it's like, there's no plot. It doesn't matter where you dip in or where you end the film or where you start the film because it's all just like this shitty mood piece sort of, like the chain of events has no coherence. And like it makes me mad that whoever made it was like, well, we can get away with it as long as we like put some big stars in it and like the wardrobe

is good and you know, we have some cool music. So I was deeply offended. It was more of the star of that. Wow. I think Halley represents more probably the general audience member out there who has not been numbed by so many bad movies like the three of us had. But at least like, you know what it left me thinking because I also watched that awkward moment with you guys. Do you remember? Oh yeah, you loved that movie. You thought it was amazing.

It made me think it was even better because I was like, there's a movie in McKinsey, Davis should be doing, which she was in. I was like there's a movie in McKinsey, Davis should be doing what she was in I was like, no, that's quality because at least at least some stuff that we watched that's really bad Even movies that I've said I didn't like on this are at least weird and bad like this isn't even weird. This is just stupid Sorry, oh, we almost broke it. Yeah. If ever the movie that I did, it's not a movie I expected you to get so mad at, but yeah. Nice, but. And it made me think of that movie, the Louise, the Steve Mnuchin's wife movie, the watch, I was like way better than I gave it.

Okay, added to the box. Well, way better than I gave it credit for Ray's alley haggleons. And then on that offer moment says McKenzie Davis should be doing this alley haggle. Upon seeing worse movies, I realized it wasn't so bad. Hey, excuse me everybody, I just wanted to say a few words about the beautiful couple. I've known you two for a long time and you get along like peanut butter and chocolate or, you know, like comedy and culture,

like a maximum fun podcast. Actually, they're having a block party from October 11th to October 22nd. And that's kind of like your party, right? You have a community of friends and family, and Max Fun has a community of shows and audiences that support them. You're having a new start with your life together, and Max Fun will be putting out new episodes that are especially welcoming to new audiences.

So it's a great time to introduce your friends to your favorite show or jump into one you haven't tried before. And they're setting up a volunteer event where we can help out our local communities. Plus, maximum fun is gonna have games, prizes, episode wrecks, so much other fun stuff. It's wrong with Kyle. Is he okay? Oh! Anyways, anyways. Sorry for getting carried away there. If it's alright with everybody here, let's always our glasses for a toast.

To the Max Fun Block Party, which you can learn more about at maxmumfun.org slash block party and don't forget to join in on October 11th. Actually, that, that sounds pretty cool. Hey, the Flop House is sponsored in part by Storyblocks. Storyblocks makes it possible for creators to keep up with the growing demands for modern video content so you can bring all your stories to life and stop sacrificing your vision due to time, budget, or resources. Storyblocks Unlimited All Access Plan gives you unlimited downloads of the over 1 million

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with the most affordable subscription plans and tools on the market that scale to meet your needs. For the Super Mario Brothers show, which unfortunately is by the time you listen to this, you will no longer be able to watch it. You snows and you lows. I'm sorry to say, but I did another intermission, stock footage, comfortable knowing that this is stock footage that I had access to, didn't have to pay extra for, could find whatever I wanted for whatever silly idea I had, and it was a great experience. So you too can explore their library and subscribe today at storyblocks.com slash flop. That's storyblocks.com slash flop. The Flop House is also sponsored in part by Smalls.

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and moisture. Better quality ingredients means a better healthier life for your cat. Since switching to smalls, cats have experienced improved digestion and less smelly litter box, right, Dan? Um, softer and shinier coats, plus better breath. Uh, yeah. So just go over and take a short quiz on smalls.com slash flop to customize your sampler. And then if you use the code flop, you get a total of 30% off of your first order. That's right. That's smalls.com slash flop with code flop. Yeah. And I also have a jumbo tron to read. That's right. Jumbo tron. It's the biggest tron. There is jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jumbo jum uh... this is a message from angela and it says to my husband gengi

happy second wedding anniversary sad we can't be together on the actual day but i'm pretty sure you'll save the flop house episodes for us to listen to together even though seventy five percent of our marriage has been during a pandemic it's been a beautiful journey here is to adventures with our newborn love angela

a house we adorable nice thank you uh... for Angela. Ah, how sweet. That's adorable. That's all nice. Thank you for getting a jumbo tron. If you want to get up on the jumbo tron, you can go to maximumfun.org slash jumbo tron and there are different rates whether you have a personal or a business message, but that's how you do it. And now we should just get back to the show unless you have Elliot. You look like you have some good plug. I'd love to plug one thing.

Long time listeners will know, or just fans of me, will know that I recently had a series from Aftershock Comics called Maniac of New York. It's a horror slash or comic with a little bit of a satirical edge. That's right. It's a little bit of a Jason Takes Man hat and but better. Anyway, the trade paperback collection of the first five issue series will be coming out

mid-October. I think October 13th, but I'm not sure about that. Ask at your local complex store. There's a second series coming out soon. Issue number one, a volume two. It's called Maniac of New York. The Bronx is Burning is now available for pre-order. So go to your local complex store and tell them, them I want maniac of New York, the death train,

which is the trade paperback of the series that came out already. And I want issue number one of maniac of New York, the Bronx is burning. That's way to plug. And on the subject of comic books, right up now, depending on when you're listening to this, but at least for the time being, there is a Kickstarter going on for the Psycho Gorman comic book magazine,

which I have contributed a short story to, which character do I write about? Of course, the character I did the voice of, the iconic hero of the movie, Tube Man. So yeah, if you want some space terror with a host of amazing creators, and me, you can go check that out at Kickstarter, just look up Psycho Gore Man. I contributed to that Kickstarter because I wanted to see that story from Stu. Yay, we're too late to live. Let us move on to letters from listeners. Listeners like you, the listener, circular, like the oraboros on her neck. This is from Eric Lasting with Held.

And Eric writes, just after I listened to your boss baby episode on which you asked what an orchestra contractor is, I happen to read this piece, and there's a link in polygon about the fellowship of the Ring score. To quote it, orchestra contractor Isabel Griffiths was responsible for finding musicians for the unusual instruments composer Howard Shore hoped to use. So they're basically casting directors for the musicians, musicians recording the score. So that mystery solves, but Eric also has a question. I would like to increase my awareness of world horror cinema.

Are there any particular films or directors off the beaten path that you would recommend? Did the Czech New Wave ever venture into genre territory? Um, I would like to, one that came to mind was, uh, is it pronounced Vi? I don't, it's spelled Vi. Do you know what I'm talking about? V? V? The, uh, DIY. The, uh, it's a Russian horror movie.

Is it the aliens with Mark Singer? No, it's, it's a Russian horror movie aliens with Mark Singer. No, it's a Russian horror movie. It's from 67. I think it was the 1967 not 67 AD. Yeah, I think it was the first making movies then. They didn't even have a Russia then. It was the first horror movie to be made in Russia. It's sort of derived from Russian folk tales. And it's a, you know, someone has to stay. The rest is just life in Russia. I'm like, no. A priest has to, for movies, you. In America, movies scare you.

In Russia, we scare movies. There's a witch that has died and a priest has to watch over her three nights in a row in the tomb and things get nuttier and nuttier over those nights. It's a very like for 1967, it has very impressive effects, I think, and it has sort of some of the same spirit that you see in something like Evil Dead 2 or House 2, where it's just like, let's throw a lot of stuff at the screen. It takes a little more to warm up than those movies, which are Gonzo all the way through. But it's a very fun movie if you want to look for a classic foreign horror movie.

And it is on Toobie. Yeah. What are you grinning about, Hallie? You're laughing at me. I'm just kidding, Conzo. I know horror movies. That would be great. That would be great.

I mean, chickens at you. Do you think it's one of those movies? It's him and Camilla and they checked into like a haunted hotel. Oh. I mean, I feel like there's, I mean, there's a lot of countries that have long horror movie is him and Camilla and they checked into like a haunted hotel. All. I mean, I feel like there's, I mean, there's a lot of countries that have long horror traditions, whether it's Japan, you know, South Korea has a long tradition of great, like slasher and thrillers, super violent stuff. Obviously, there's a lot of Italian filmmakers, whether it's, you know,

your zombie movies or your geolos or whatever, and then there's, of course, the whole French wave of torture like new extreme French horror. Yeah, the extreme French horror stuff, if you like, the really gross stuff. So yeah, I mean, I think there's a ton of great stuff out there. And also, I feel like, I feel like shutters are really good resource, actually, because they have such a well-curated collection of stuff from all over the place, especially a lot of foreign language stuff that you might not normally see. Elliot, do you have any check new wave horror? Specifically addressing check new wave.

The two things, I mean, I don't know all the check new wave movies, but the ones that most clearly to me are like horror movies is one is a movie I recommend on the podcast a while back called The Creamator, which is not a supernatural horror movie, but is a person being driven into murderous madness type of horror movie. And there's this very ominous atmosphere to it.

And there's also Valerie and her week of wonders, where it's sometimes called Valerie's Week of Wonders, or sometimes just Valerie in the Week of Wonders. And that is more of a dream-like kind of horror movie, where there's a vampire rat man and this girl who is approaching maturity and dealing with all sorts of dream-like things, that's more of a, it's not one of my favorites, but it's a little, both more straightforward,

horror and also stranger. And there's also, if you just want short stuff, there's the animator, Jan Spankmeyer, who stuff is not specifically horror, but it is very scary. And he came out of that same world of check-field making at the time. And he's been working for decades and decades and decades

and has a lot of scary shorts and features to his name. So those are the ones from the Check-N-Weve. I'd recommend. The cremator is the one of those that I like the most, I think. Although I like Spankmire's stuff a lot. He has a lot of good stuff, too. Do you have anything, Halle? If not, we can. Yeah, it's almost as wistful as when you said you hadn't seen a ghost.

Um, well, okay, there's one more letter from Gwen last name with held. Who writes, I write to you today about how Elliott's Star Wars trivia saves me money. Yes, real money. my girlfriend and i stopped by the sounds like something i i'm supposed to like invest in now it's a real money and we'll tell you how my girlfriend and i stopped by a merchant booth at a local convention and the dealer had a game of geeky trivia set up with the price for correct answer being a five percent discount

though not a star Wars trivia expert myself, I picked that category specifically because the vendor warned me it was the hardest one they had. My question was, who was the male aqua-ish thug that partnered with Dr. Evezone, became a successful smuggler and bully Luke Skywalker in a bar on Tatooine. You know it, Ponda Baba, baby.

Yeah, out of the four possible answers, I chose Ponda Baba because it was the only one I could remember hearing Elliott talk about on the show. And because of that angelic voice, singing with nasal sweetness in the back of my mind, I won. So don't give our favorite- Be careful with who you pick to be friends, is the story of Panda Bob. Yeah, our favorite walking wiki article too much. Guff his antics might someday save you some cash. Sincerely, when last name withheld, you know what? Elliott, I don't know that Elliott saved me cash, but his antics certainly have helped

make me money. So, yeah. No, by getting you jobs, yeah, certainly. Yeah, yeah. So, you see all of it, you know, and I don't know, rub his head for luck. I don't know I'm saying. No, my hair is already falling out. I don't know that. But here's the thing about Ponda Babe. The guy is already dealing with the hard fact that his face looks like a butt and he can't speak basic English. He has to be interpreted through his friend

Dr. Amazon who is not a reliable narrator. So he just got to feel bad for the guy. Now he's got one less hand poor guy poor walrus face, you know. Yeah. That's what I say too. Cool poor walrus face. Yeah. Okay. Yeah catch man, I mean, yeah, that's the song from the song from Oklahoma poor wall or spaces dead. Just claiming catch phrases. Okay, well, let's cap this episode off with recommendations of movies that you could watch that are better than the turning, let's say.

Is that possible? Just last night, I watched the original The Fly from 1958, starring Vincent Price and two more generic people in the actual leads of the movie. And it's a very silly movie in a lot of ways. It seems like the first half an hour is just the scientist transporting various things from one side of the room to the other. And to remember Dan, back then, transportation technology

was new. Yeah, it was a transporter. And it's like whatever. Let's use a processionate Jesus or something. But back then, it was a totally new technology. Yeah. Well, there are a lot of filigrees in the story that aren't necessarily necessarily.

It's all, it all has this framing device of like, why did this woman kill her husband and it turns out, spoiler alert, it's because he's the fly. Let's say it's the fly. But is there a part where after getting mushed together with the fly, the dude gets a little bit sexier? I mean, it depends on what you like.

Do you like a big hairy sort of like claw hand and big fly eyes? Okay, well then yes, he got sex here. Just like Jeff Goldblum. Yeah, but even with the silliness of it, it's a very like I found it also very sad. Like it's an inherently sad story of like this person who's like You know like trying just to you know come up with a new invention makes one mistake like Seize how he's you know devolving sees how like you know He can no longer be the husband. He wants to be like hope training Allways is as goofy as it is it also also is strangely effective as horror movie. And I had always remembered, I'd sought once before, I always remembered it as being a black

and white movie, but I was wrong. It is in glorious technical, it's actually very pretty that way. So if you've never seen it, or if you only seen the remake, check out the original The Plights. It's fun. Anyone else? Yeah, and this isn't a horror movie. Next week, I'm going to visit my friend Elliot in Los Angeles. And so to prepare for that, I watched a movie from 1985, directed by William Friedkin, called To Live in Die in LA. That's exactly what my life is like out here stew. So I'm glad you watched that. You know, you'll be ready for it. Uh, it's, yeah, it's great. Um,

it, you know, it like it's all the things that people say about it are true. The soundtrack by Wang Chung, totally rips. The car chase is incredible. Like I remember like, uh, I, you know, I was watching this movie this morning while very hungover. And it got to the car chase scene. First I'm like, oh, yeah, okay. Yeah, this is pretty good, I guess. And then, you know, a couple minutes in, I'm like, I audibly said, I love movies. Yeah. Yeah. It's just fucking great, man. And like, you get to see Willem DeFoe hanging out in a gym, working out, it's awesome. Watch that shit.

That's that movie. I recently rewatched it and it's like the movie is so to watch a movie set in a world with almost no morality. It feels like or like where the characters are so morally compromised. The entire way through like it's such it's a bracing movie that way. Yeah. Yeah, you don't know who to root for and they're all constantly fucking up. It's great. Yeah. And it's and it's a world where the villain is constantly going to an art dance show that his girlfriend's performing in. That's great. He's

super supportive. He's a great supportive boyfriend. The bad guy character that is a very, is a fascinating character. Yeah. The guy in there. A lot of turtle necks. Lost turtle necks or a lot of turtle necks? I said a lot of turtle necks. I also, I also, there's a sequence where early on where Willem Dafoe is counter-fitting money and it's very like technical about the process and I just love that kind of shit,

man. Like, having recently watched Theefe, there's a lot of technical shit in that. And it's like, I don't know, like I love the like, the physicality of watching the process. I don't know, that was awesome. Well, it reminds me of what a friend of mine once said about when he finally saw

the original dawn of the dead. And he was like, here's what I like about that movie. They mess up all these zombies and they go, we gotta clean this up. And then you watch them get the janitor supplies and clean it up and then put the janitor supplies away. Like, like, the things that show you the, like, the physical actions you have to go through to complete a task. Like, you know what, did you guys, did you guys watch that show the fall with Jillian Anderson and, uh, uh, uh, I was the first Jamie Dornin

is a yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, what's the first season? That was so good about it. They had all these scenes where you'd have someone rushed into a hospital room and they were doing triage on them. And then they'd show like they attendant cleaning up the room afterwards. It's just covered in blood. All the sort of technical stuff that they never show you. That's cool. Show me the stuff.

Yeah, show me the stuff. That's Stuart's catch phrase. Show me the stuff. Our catch phrase is now. Yeah, from from Georgie McGuire, the the the the asylum pictures rip off of Jerry McGuire. Show me the stuff.

Elliot, why don't you recommend a movie? It goes in the end to the end. She says, you had me at high there. That's how it ends at the end. So I'll recommend a movie now. So it's not, I guess, a horror movie, but it is a frightening situation to be in. And it also involves car chasing, so it fits true both.

And I recently took a revisit to the movie Breakdown from 1997. Oh, yeah. I was on JTWALS. Kathleen Quinlan. And it was one of these movies I remembered seeing as a teenager and being like, that was fun. And I wanted to go back and see if it was as good as I remembered it.

And it was, Corussell and Kathleen Quinlan are a married couple. They are driving to their new home in San Diego, I think. And along the way, they run a foul of a home in what San Diego, I think, and along the way they run a foul of a trucker played by J.T. Walsh, who it turns out is a super bad guy, criminal who kidnaps people. And Kurt Russell has to find the inner savage in himself to fight back and turn the tables and save his wife. And it's just like a super-taught, small-scale thriller.

It's really good directed by Jonathan Mastow, who also made a flopphouse movie, Surrogates. So don't go see Surrogates, go see Breakdown. Yeah. Yeah. I think- I remember having like just like one of those classic thriller premises, you know? Yeah.

Like you're just like, let's make it as simple as possible for the audience to- Give this hero glasses to start with. Yeah. And you civilized and you know those shits are going when he goes all crazy. He's going to lose those glasses. It will not affect his vision at all.

So I don't know why he was wearing them. But yeah, that it's, but yeah, their car breaks down. This trucker offers to take his wife to go use a pay phone. And then she disappears and everyone pretends they never heard of her and that's it and then they've got to do great and it's like a and it's one of the movies where like they do a really good job where each time you think that they're like okay they got it they don't got it something terrible happens again they got another obstacle to get over and it's only 93 minutes long it's great anyway that's breakdown.

Howie what have you got? Okay my recommendation is, okay, I had never actually seen this movie. I had only used it as an OTS pun when we were at the Daily Show. But I actually want to know T.S. is. That's a nice insight look behind the curtain. It's an over the shoulders.

It's the way we would title the pieces and they were uh... clever little takes on movies you recognize mm-hmm um... the men who stare at votes for instance when there was the the algor george w bush hanging feds thing that was a one of the last six

during the long process uh... when the obama care health bill was being debated we went through all of the hell all the hell title so he did drag me to health and health razor and health razor to and we ran out and it was so hard to do more of them because it went over months but yeah that's what we call those ot s's right so i finally actually saw the movie we need to talk about kevin have you guys ever see that yeah actually saw the movie we need to talk about Kevin have you guys ever seen that yeah it's so good yeah my husband suggested that I was like nobody

actually watch was that movie yeah exactly but you know if you yeah it's it's it's while not under the for it well Well, you won't find it in the horse section of Blockbuster. No, I if you have a kid pretty harrowing to imagine. Yeah, I also think that now out of the four of us only Elliott has not recommended. It's great to talk about Kevin. I also love maybe I'll do

it next time. I also love a world where Tilda Swinton and John C. Rylee are married. Okay, that was the only thing that I was like, I love him as the weird goofy, clueless husband, counting. Like I thought it totally worked in the hours, but in this one I was like, no, this isn't it. Tilda Swinton is too sophisticated for this. Uh-huh. Basically, that like, that like cool BDE, you know? And you know where you can find we need to talk about Kevin. Where?

It's on 2B. That's right. Shimmer movies on 2B turns out. Yeah. Wow. This is where we reveal the entire round of the flop house has been a stealth advertisement for 2B. And 2B you can get in on this.

That's where they spent all of their money. They're headless. Yeah. I mean, they should. That'd be fine. Yeah, yeah. Somebody was like, Hey, you guys maybe should advertise on the flop house and they're like, well, why? They're already talking about us all the time.

Yeah, we're giving away for free. We call that the Popeyes conundrum. Yeah. Mm-hmm. They're getting the milk for free. And as Halley knows, we need more milk. You need more milk. So Halley, what movie that you've talked about for years but you've never actually seen or you're gonna go after next?

I don't know. Do you guys hear my baby screaming? That's what I'm distracted by. Well then let's let you go. Yeah, a few more of yours. Is it a real baby or is it a ghost? It's to get me out of this question. I know.

No. No. Okay. Yeah, let's let Hallie go. What do we do at the end of the show? We say, we let Hallie plug in, she wants a ball. Yeah, we go.

Dan, are you one of the new listeners who's joining us at the block party? I heard an ad for this on Alonso's show. And I was like, this is for me. No, howdy. Do you have anything to plug? I mean, this is the only thing I'm doing this episode. So I plug, you know, rewind, listen to it again.

Mm-hmm. And you're going to have those t-shirts with your catchphrase coming out soon. Yeah, exactly. On my Etsy store. Oh, nice handmade. Well, thank you to Alex Smith for being our producer, making this sound as good as we do. And thank you to Max from Fun, go to Max from Fun.org to look at other podcasts on the network or listen to them. If you look at them, they won't do much, but if you hit play and listen

to them, you'll be identified and you'll enjoy yourself. Yeah, and if you're a new listener who is just tuning in from the Block Party, we have a whole bunch of episodes, years and years of them don't go too far back, but you know, whatever, check it out. Some are worse, some are better. Oh, just take a chance. Just need more milk. Sorry, I know, let's go here again.

But for the flop house, I've been Dan McCoy. I'm Stuart Wellington. I'm Hallie Hagglin. I'm Elliot Galen. Bye. Owing. Bye. Owing. From the twisted mind of Henry James, the horror master who brought you the golden bowl. You sick fucks! audience supported.