The Florida Roundup - Book removals, COVID-19 vaccine availability and the government shutdown

Episode Date: October 10, 2025

This week on The Florida Roundup, we spoke about book restrictions in public schools first with Sophia Brown, program coordinator at PEN America Florida, (00:00) then with Julie Gephards, parent and member of the group Moms For Liberty in Hillsborough County (11:10). Then, we looked at the legal challenges and court cases involving the state law governing book removals with Douglas Soule, ‘Your Florida’ state government team reporter (16:52). Then, we spoke about the availability of COVID-19 boosters in Florida following changes to CDC guidelines and the state’s messaging around vaccines (20:26). Plus, we spoke with U.S. Rep. Randy Fine about the ongoing government shutdown (29:34). And later, we spoke with the director of a new documentary film that examines seashelling on Sanibel Island before and after Hurricane Ian (44:10).

The Florida Roundup is sponsored by Covering Florida Navigator program, providing confidential assistance with health insurance enrollment through the health insurance marketplace. Assistance is available at 877-813 or covering Florida.org. This subject is about language, and you will hear words and phrases that some may find sexually explicit. This is the Florida Roundup. I'm Tom Hudson. Great to have you along this week. The stolen life, tricks. This book is gay.

All the boys aren't blue and lucky and haunted. These are some of the books the Florida Department of Education has said are inappropriate for public school students and are not permitted on school library shelves. They are on a list of more than 50 books the state banned this summer and added to the hundreds of books that have been removed as their presence in school libraries is challenged. Florida has led the nation in book restrictions

for public school students. By one estimate, 40% of all book bans in the country happened in school districts here in Florida. And the Free Expression Group, Penn America, says Hillsborough County Schools removed more than 600 books, the second highest of any school district in the country. Hillsborough disputes the data, saying it has only removed 59 books. Other books are under review, but not officially banned, it says. This spring, the state sent letters to Hillsborough County Schools demanding the district remove six books. I believe one was called, call me by your name.

The other one was Jack of Hearts. And then the Attorney General highlighted four books. What girls are made of, beautiful, breathless, and choke. Ben Gibson is the chair of the State Board of Education. In June, Hillsborough County Schools Superintendent Van Ayers was called to its meeting to answer for how the books wound up in school libraries. Ayers said he removed them as soon as he learned about them and then made this pledge. No inappropriate material will be in front of our students in Hillsborough County Public Schools when that school year starts up next year.

I've read through these books. This is board member Ryan Petty at that June meeting. These are nasty, disgusting books that have no place in a school in Florida or even California. They just have no place being in the school. They serve no purpose. And board member Kelly Garcia questioned how the books found their way to school libraries in the first place. These people that you trust to review these materials are abusing the children of your county. They're child abusers.

Board member Daniel Fogunoli claim the books are part of what's pushing parents away from traditional public schools in Florida. People want to point to vouchers and all these type of things. But as long as you continue to push pornographic materials in the libraries and continue to push these things in our kids, kids, people will continue to pull their kids out of school. Since that meeting, there have been two court rulings in cases involving a change in state law, allowing parents and others to challenge a book and broadening the criteria for removing a book. A federal judge in Central Florida threw out most of that law in August declaring it unconstitutional. The state is appealing that ruling.

Earlier this month, a different federal judge ruled that Ascambia County Schools did not violate First Amendment rights of students by banning the book and Tango makes three. The book is about two male penguins living in a zoo who raise a chick named Tango together. So who decides what school library books are appropriate or not in Florida? What is the balance between parents' rights and freedom to read?

305-995-1800. 305-195-1800. You can write us a short email, radio at the Florida Roundup.org. Sophia Brown serves as the program coordinator at Penn America, Florida, a plaintiff in many of these cases. Sophia, welcome to the program. Hi, Tom. Thank you for having me.

So what does Penn America consider a book that's banned versus one that's restricted? Right. Well, a book ban is exactly what it sounds like, prohibiting access to a book. And there are times in places where governments have banned books from public circulation. But what we are seeing right now in the U.S. and in Florida is that school districts are removing books usually to appeal to state leaders or particular vocal community members. This often happens without following the long-established procedures for reviewing books, meaning that books are also often disappeared without clear reasons. Books can also be suspended for review indefinitely,

but regardless how you look at it, if a person who once had access to a book no longer can, that is a ban. Penn has been tracking book bans across the United States for many years, as Florida leads the pen list over the past few years, are there positive effects of books in school libraries that are challenged by parents that lead to a temporary or permanent removal? Well, you are right that for this 24 to 25 academic year,

a most recent year, over 6,000 books were banned nationwide, and about one-third of those came from Florida alone. But we find, I mean, as a free speech organization, we say there are no upsides to banning books ever. And in fact, in 2023, a first book study was released to show that book bans not only make it harder for teachers to do their jobs, it also makes it a more difficult environment for students to learn and chills speech across the board. Are there instances, though, where Penn America would agree that certain books may not be appropriate to be in a public school library, an elementary school, middle school, or high school in Florida?

No, that is not our position. Our public educators and librarians are trained professionals who are there to curate appropriate collections for children of all ages, of all interests, of all reading levels, and we trust these professionals to do their jobs. So what do you make of the process to assess books at public school libraries in Florida? This is a process that has been addressed at least twice in recent years in state law. Right.

So here in Florida and nationwide, we abide by something called the Miller Test, which is a national Supreme Court standard that has been in place for over 50 years now. All of our librarians are trained under this Miller test, and the Miller test exists explicitly to prevent obscene materials from being in our libraries. So these procedures have long existed. Again, these are trained professionals. It's not the Wild West out there. It isn't that simply any book is making its way into your school libraries. It is not as though our librarians have on AWOL over the past five years. These processes do exist, and really the pro-book banning argument would have you believe that it is the Wild West, that anything can get into your children's hands, but that is simply

and provably false. The Miller test dates back to 1973 with the Supreme Court case. That's what the Miller test gets its name from, and it was to apply contemporary community standards and consider a work of expression as a whole, as opposed to parts of it. One federal judge here in Florida has ruled that authors do not have a First Amendment right, though, to speak through a public library. What do you make of that reasoning? Well, we at Penn America do believe that people do retain their First Amendment rights in a library. And this argument only works if you assume that they do not.

But it is a public space. Public spaces, by definition, serve everyone. And again, we trust our librarians to curate collections that meet the literary and educational needs of the public and the people that they are serving. Is there another remedy to have parental choice in Florida but not remove books? Yeah, I do appreciate parents that want to have an active role in shaping their children's educations, and they have every right to do so that does not resort to appealing to censorship. Parents have every right to attend school board meetings, get involved in local PTAs, have these

conversations with their children. It is only natural to want to do that. But we at Pan America do take issue when it is that single parents or a single group of parents wants to control what all families can access. And I would also love to briefly mention that there are dozens upon dozens of parent organizations, parent-led organizations here in Florida that are fighting for the right to access books. So it's also not simply a parents versus everyone else issue. There are families that want access to diverse books.

Sophia Brown is the program coordinator at Penn America, Florida, with us from our member station WUSF in Tampa. Sophia, thanks for your time today. Thank you so much. We will be speaking with the representative from the Hillsborough County chapter of Moms for Liberty in just one moment. We want to hear from you.

Doug has been patient in Alachua County near Gainesville. Go ahead, Doug. You are now on the radio. Well, hello, thank you. Yeah, I agree with a lot of what your previous guest just said. I think that I'm totally against book banning, and I think this whole parents' bill of rights thing that has been created in our political environment is a big farce, and I think that what parents

have a right to do is interact with their children, and they have a right to look in their backpack and to talk about with them what they're reading and what they're seeing and just locking issues that you disagree with into black boxes, be it sexual issues, transgender issues, racial issues, and saying, oh, we're going to just take it away. That's not being a good parent and that's not exercising any parental rights. That's just enforcing your will on the community as a whole. Doug, thanks for lending your voice to the conversation from Alachua County. Let's go to Lake Worth in South Florida, Melissa, on line three. You're on the radio now, Melissa. Go ahead. Yes, good afternoon. Thank you for allowing me to speak. I just had a few comments and hopefully

it's not redundant. And I think that this goes, aligns with just distracting from the bigger issues. and the bigger issues are homers insurance, car insurance, health care, affordable, and quality, cost of groceries. And then my bigger question is, you know, I raised two children. It was hard enough to get them to read it all.

Never mind, ban books. Are you crazy? So I remember, you know, some of the books that they first started reading, I think it was Captain Underpants, and it was a little bit obnoxious. But you know what? It got them on to other literature.

It's made them literate. And so my other question is, is they're so focused on banning, why aren't we banning social media platforms? Why aren't we banning YouTube? Why are we banning books? Melissa, really good points. And we appreciate you lending your voice to the conversation there from Lake Worth. I will note when I woke up before dawn,

I have two children, my oldest home from college for fall break. I saw a book on the kitchen table. And I had to do a triple take to see an actual book, an actual novel on the kitchen table this morning. Julie Gabharts is with us now. She is with the Moms for Liberty Chapter in Hillsborough County. Julie, thanks for your time today. Welcome to the program. Thank you for having me. How do you define parental rights related to books in public schools here in Florida? Yeah, well, I think every parent has the right to oversee their educational upbringing of their own child. And when you put school library books that have a lot of controversial content, including, you know, things like felching, anal sex, 609ing, groping, vibrators, all these different things that it just makes for an environment that doesn't allow the parent to guide their child because these books are available apart from their oversight. The Miller test was noted by the representative we spoke to earlier from Penn America. That's this legal test that dates back to 1973 to kind of use three points to decide if material is obscene. Community standards, contemporary community standards is one of those and considering the work as a whole. Do you believe that how Florida has used, used the state law regarding school library books depicting sexual conduct follows that legal

standard? I think that there are people who have abused that law. That law was intended for adults in a public setting, an open public setting. School libraries are actually not considered the same type of public setting. They're a limited setting because they're limited in their First Amendment. And so the Miller test doesn't focus on what's harmful to children. It focuses on what's obscene for adults. So it doesn't say that you cannot have explicit sex scenes in books, rated R, rated X scenes in books.

But it does say one should consider the work as a whole. Do you think that the Florida law and efforts consider the work as a whole in Florida? Is that how movie ratings work? Do they say, look, if it's considered as a whole, then the movie actually has a positive message. No, the movie is rated R or rated NC17 because it has those scenes in it. And we don't want our children to be exposed. Many of us don't want our children to be exposed to those types of scenes. I mean, we're talking about five-step instructions for a sex hookup app being available in schools,

including the benefits, quick, easy, and uncomplicated sex, a threesome detailed rape murder scene, including biting off the flesh of a woman's private parts, sawing off her head and using her severed head to pleasure himself. Does that belong in school libraries? Is there another remedy, do you think, to have parental choice but not remove books, not restrict books in public libraries, in school public libraries? If you put a rating on every book that was done, apart from librarians, apart from what they want to call themselves as professionals, how about we have parents, go ahead and do a rating system and say,

every book, one to five rating maybe, and if it has a five, it gets put into a different section. I don't imagine. If you can explain the educational benefit of what I've just described to you, including anal sex, felching, anal sex followed by sucking out the semen and feces, passing it back to a partner through kissing, this is what we're talking about, has been removed,

and I'm really glad that it has. It's shaping an entire generation of kids. It's taking down their walls. It's breaking them down, making them far more susceptible to a whole host of things. Julie, let me ask you, social media was brought up by one of the callers that you heard before we introduced you. What consideration should access to the internet or social media at home play for parents objecting to a book? Yeah, that is 100%. I agree parents should have control over their children's, their young children's social media, because of course there's a lot of nefarious content there.

But we're talking about school library books where sanctioning of these types of materials is an entirely different thing than a parent. having control over their own children's phones. Cell phones aren't purchased by the schools for the students. Books are. Julie, finally, let me ask a larger question about moms for liberty. Liberty is defined as the state of being free within a society from oppressive restrictions. What's the liberty that Moms for Liberty stands for in relation to this debate over public school library books? Yeah, it's the freedom for parents to be able to choose when they want to introduce these topics to their own children.

We want that freedom. And we don't want you taking that away from us by exposing our own children to things apart from our consent. That is what liberty is, not the government forcing things down our children's throats. And to be clear, the presence of the book in the library is enough to trigger that? Well, you're making it accessible to somebody else's children. And so, yes, that is a violation of my parental rights when it's available to someone else's children. When you're putting that in front of not your own children, you can do that. but putting it in front of everyone else's children, that's not okay.

Julie, the books that you describe, the passages you describe, what level of schools were those in in Hillsborough County? Does that really matter? You think that that should be accessible to a 13-year-old? My question does not presume my acceptance or not. I'm simply asking what schools were those in. So some of the, some of them, there's been some found in elementary schools, mostly high schools and a handful in middle schools. Okay. I don't see how that really matters because these are children. They're minors. They're still under their parental authority. Julie, I appreciate the conversation. Thanks so much. Thank you very much. Julie Gephardz is with the Moms for Liberty chapter in Hillsborough County.

Now, one place that has been in the spotlight over books and school libraries is Ascambia County, one of the original counties that became Florida and the westernmost. The first major lawsuit over efforts to restrict books was filed there more than two years ago. Douglas Sol is with the Your Florida Reporting Project with our partner station WUSF. Explain quickly these cases in Ascambia County, Douglas. Yeah, so there's two high-profile federal cases. These are incredibly important cases. They could be precedent-setting in First Amendment law. One was filed by the authors of Antango Makes Three.

It's a children's picture book about a same-sex penguin pair raising a chick together in a zoo. It's actually based on a true story. School officials removed it from school libraries. Certainly no sexual content in that one. Trump appointed federal judge actually very recently rejected that lawsuit, ruling in favor of the school board. But the authors are appealing. There's also a lawsuit filed by Penn America, as well as the big book publisher, Penguin Random House, and others. They're saying the removal of a bunch of the different books was unconstitutional.

That case is still ongoing. You've been looking at the legal costs of these challenges. What's the tab look like for Escambia County Public Schools so far? Yeah, so the school has spent more than $300,000 defending its removal of the picture book about penguins and Tango Mix 3. For context, the housing website Zillow estimates the average house in Escambia County costs $275,000. The other lawsuit, which involves Penn America, has cost even more, a price tag of more. than a half million, approaching 600,000, probably more than 600,000, honestly. I got the data recently, but there's a few months backlog in the numbers. Before we get to your next good question,

I want to point out something important. Yes, school districts in any party that sued has to defend against lawsuits that cost money. But look at Nassau County, a school district. They were sued for book banning. They settled by agreeing to put books back on shelves that limited litigation and legal cost. So the money scambi itself, more than anything maybe, represents the priority of local school officials. They obviously think it's worth it spending hundreds of thousands to keep a picture book about Pequins off the shelves. Douglas Sol, reporter for Your Florida Project

with our partner station WUSF. Thanks, Douglas, for sharing the reporting with us. Thanks for having me on. Our inbox is always open. Let us know your thoughts on this. You can speak to us by typing out a message, radio at the Florida Roundup.org. Radio at the Florida Roundup.org.

You're listening to the Florida Rondup from your Florida Public Radio Station. The Florida Roundup is sponsored by Covering Florida Navigator program, providing confidential assistance with health insurance enrollment through the health insurance marketplace. Assistance is available at 877-813-92115 or coveringflora.org. This is the Florida Roundup. I'm Tom Hudson. Next week on our program, a charter school company wants to open in public school buildings in several cities across the state, including three in Sarasota and more than two dozen in Broward County. It's using a new state law allowing charter schools to move into traditional school buildings rent-free under certain circumstances.

So we want to hear from parents, grandparents, aunts, uncles, teachers, and students from charter schools and traditional schools across the state. What do you think about charter schools moving into traditional public school campuses? How is school choice affecting your neighborhood schools? You can send us a note now, radio, at the Florida. Florida Roundup.org, radio at the Florida roundup.org, and we may share your stories next week. Now the COVID vaccine. This week, the Centers for Disease Control announced a change in its recommendations for COVID vaccinations. Individual-based decision-making. Vaccination based on shared clinical decision-making. These are phrases about how the CDC decided and describes its

guidance. The most recent guidance from the Florida Health Department was posted online more than a year ago. In that statement, the Surgeon General recommended against MRNA COVID-19 vaccines. So have you gotten your COVID vaccine? Are you confused by the guidance? What questions do you have? What does it mean when the CDC says, quote, the decision to vaccinate should be based on patient characteristics, end quote. What questions do you have? You can call us now. We're live here on this Friday. 305-995-1800. 305-995-1800. The change this week from the CDC comes after its advisory committee on immunization practices unanimously approved the change last month. Dr. Jason Goldman is with us, president of the American

College of Physicians, a liaison to that committee by the CDC, and a primary care physician based in Broward County. Dr. Goldman, welcome back to the program. Thank you so much for having me. Do you support this new guidance that was released this week from the CDC regarding COVID vaccines? Secretary Kennedy's vaccine committee has completely destroyed the entire process and how we recommend vaccines. They do not use any evidence or good basis for their decisions and are just creating confusion and harming the public health. These are not how we make vaccine decisions and that is not an appropriate recommendation. Individuals should get vaccinated. The CDC new recommendation talks about individual-based decision-making as opposed to age-based

decision-making. What does that mean, doctor, individual-based decision-making? when used in reference to vaccinations? That's an excellent question. That's not a term we have used in the past. They just made that up for this meeting. What the CDC is supposed to do is recommend a vaccine, not recommend a vaccine, or use shared clinical decision makings. All vaccine decisions are individual choice.

CDC does not mandate. Every individual can choose to take a vaccine or not. The CDC is telling us or should tell us how they should be used and who should get them. So a shared clinical decision making is when there's some data to suggest benefit, but there may not be enough evidence to recommend it for everyone, but it could help if an individual has that discussion with their physician to benefit from the vaccine, which is different from what they came out with. Who should be involved in that individual decision, that consultation? You mentioned your physician. Is that the only individual that a patient should consult with? Well, a physician and their patients should be having that discussion. The physicians, the ones providing the care, the leaders of the health care team are the ones who should be having these educated discussions with the patients based on good recommendations and guidelines of their patients. We're speaking with Dr. Jason Goldman, President of the American College of Physicians, a primary care physician in Broward County, liaison to the CDC's Advisory Committee on Immunization Practices.

Linda sent us this email, doctor, writing, I have heard that even for seniors and those with certain medical conditions, there will be a requirement that you have to have a prescription for your doctor to get a new coronavirus vaccine. What say you, Dr. Goldman, does a Floridian need a prescription to get a COVID-19 vaccination? The Secretary of Candide's committee tried to pass that. They voted against requiring prescriptions. I've seen some pharmacies are requiring it from my patients. I think that's ridiculous. that we have to write a prescription for those vaccines, patients should be able to have access to care and get the vaccines if they want them, and they should take them.

But if one in Florida wants a vaccine, they do not need a doctor's orders in order to get a vaccine. Is that accurate? It depends on the pharmacy and what the individual pharmacies are requiring. I see. Is the vaccine fee covered by most insurance,

by Medicare, for instance? It's supposed to be. We have heard that many of the insurers will still honor coverage, but again, it's difficult to know with the changes being made in the CDC by Secretary Kennedy's Vaccine Committee, as well as the government shutdown is making it very unclear as to if there will be coverage. It should be covered. Is the vaccine that is available, a MRNA vaccine? MRNA is one of the vaccines available. They're also adjuvented vaccines as well, but the MRNA vaccine has been safe and effective and helped to get us out of the pandemic.

What do you think of the Florida Surgeon General's recommendation from last flu cycle against MRNA vaccines? I disagreed with it then and I disagree with it now. MRNA is an effective, safe tool, and message RNA technology has been around for decades. It has been applied to vaccines in recent years, but the technology is not new and has been available for many years and has proven to be safe. We've got some phone calls and emails here, Doctor. We've got Janice, who's been listening in in Jacksonville.

Go ahead, Janice, you are on the radio. Hi, I'm 65. My mom is 90. We both have diabetes. C of MDS, which is a form of leukemia. And I've been looking for the vaccine ever since it came out. was not available. Finally, I found it available, but you needed prescriptions, which is a lot of work for a 90-year-old. Then it was approved without a prescription, at least in Florida.

We went and got it a month ago. We've had no problems. We got the Moderna next bike, which is the one we recommend it, and we've had no problems, and I'm really glad we both got it because now hopefully, you know, we'll be safe. Janice, thanks for sharing your story. and happiness to you and your mom here. We really appreciate you listening and sharing that story from Jacksonville. Dedey is listening in Jacksonville Beach. Go ahead, Dedy. You are now on the radio. Yes, hello. I've had a question for some time since September 14th, to be exact, when my primary care physician by telephone diagnosed in her view that I had, what she described as the new COVID, and that was based on my symptoms.

which I had given her on the phone. I'm still trying to learn what is the new COVID, and what am I supposed to do next time? Because I had had my COVID shot previously. So I really don't know what this new strain is. And I spent 20 plus days in my home, not going outside my door and masked for a week after that just to be safe. and keep others safe.

So tell me what. Yeah, let me put it to Dr. Goldman. What is the strain of COVID that folks should be wary of? Well, you know, they look at the different strains each time when they make the formulation. So I'm not sure what you're referring to by the new COVID. You know, when we look at the COVID-19 disease, you know, we're vaccinating against the more common ones that we expect to see. But more importantly, if you've been continuously vaccinated each year, here, you're building up protection from getting hospitalization and death. And that's really the

key point for vaccination is to prevent hospitalization and death and bad outcomes. What about the recommendations for the precautions there that Dee-D took after her telephone diagnosis of COVID about, you know, staying indoors, masked away from people? What's the, what are some of the general guidelines this time around? For any respiratory infection, you want to use common sense. You want to stay away from other people, especially those who are immunocompromised, weakened immune systems. You know, common courtesy that we've always had. Cover your mouth when you cough. Keep yourself isolated if you're sick. Try not to infect other people or good guidelines for any respiratory illness. Just 20 seconds here, doctor, but the CDC also has recommended splitting up the MMR vaccine,

measles, mumps, and rebel into three separate shots. Is that something you support? Not at all. And I spoke at the meeting against the chairman, and that was an un-evidence-based decision that actually is going to cause more harm and decreased access to care. And real quick, they, on the same set of data, took two contradictory votes, one to remove it from the entire schedule, but then they turned around it would only allow it for the vaccine for children program saying that lower social economic levels. I appreciate it. Dr. Goldman, President of the American College of Physicians. My pleasure. Thank you. The government shutdown is nearing the two-week mark now.

Republicans want to continue spending at last year's levels through late November to negotiate the budget. Democrats want to extend enhanced subsidies for Obamacare health insurance as a condition to reopen. Randy Fine is a Republican representing the Daytona Beach area. Representative, welcome back to Florida Public Radio. Let's just start here. Do you support extending the enhanced subsidies for Obama? Obamacare at some point in the future? Well, I have to challenge the premise of your question.

We're not having a debate about subsidies for Obamacare. Subsidies for Obamacare were created when Obamacare was created. What the Democrats want us to declare is that we are still in the midst of a COVID pandemic, an emergency extra subsidies that were created because we were in COVID should continue. And I think we should have a debate over whether we're still in the midst of a COVID pandemic. pandemic and then people can vote however they'd like. Well, how would you vote on enhanced subsidies, these COVID-era subsidies that were added into Obamacare during the pandemic? I believe that Democrats need to admit that the Affordable Care Act is not affordable, and then we go on from

there. If it was affordable care, we wouldn't need to be debating continuing emergency COVID-era subsidies. So it doesn't seem like there's much ground that has been made toward any kind of of middle moment for Congress, particularly in the Senate between Senate Democrats and Republicans. The Democrats, as you know, are holding out for the enhanced subsidies. Republicans want the clean, continuing resolution. And has there been any movement toward any kind of resolution in your estimation? Well, I reject the premise of that question, too, because that's not the only hostage demand the Democrats have made. They've also said... Well, to be fair, representative, I didn't say it was the only issue. I said it was a issue.

But they also have said they want $200 billion in free health care for illegal immigrants. They want us to return to a lot of the insane international spending on transgender clinics in Botswana. They basically have said we want to overturn the results of the November election if you don't give us what we want. Everything that has been passed since Republicans took power they want to undo in order to pay soldiers. And we simply think that's an immoral position to take. We have to pass a budget eventually. We can have all of these debates, but you don't keep the government closed because you don't get what you want. I'm Tom Hudson. You're listening to the Florida Rondup from your Florida Public Radio Station. We're speaking

with Republican Congressman Randy Fine about the government shutdown. Let's talk about that claim about health care for folks without legal status in the United States. The Democratic Senate proposal would repeal a portion of the Big Beautiful bill that restricts Medicaid to U.S. citizens or an immigrant who was lawfully admitted for permanent residence. And what that would do would roll back the rules to what they were before the Big Beautiful bill, right, before July 4th and the president signed that, which would return Medicaid to those who had been eligible before the Big Beautiful bill. And most of the restrictions that the Big Beautiful bill puts on to Medicaid don't go

into effect for another year. So isn't the current status of Medicaid eligibility for those immigrants still the case today, as you and I are talking, and the government is shut down? I actually think you've made a great point. In order to keep the government open for seven weeks, Democrats demanded that we change the next 10 years of policy. It's part of what makes their demands so ridiculous. And you're right, they want to undo what we did when we passed. the Working Families Tax Cut Act, and that will cost $200 billion over the next 10 years. People ask me, how do you say $200 billion?

It's not over seven weeks. It's over 10 years. They're not saying give them eligibility for the next seven weeks to keep the government open. They're saying we want it for the next 10 years. Well, they're saying we want it to what it was before the Big Beautiful Bill, which was what federal law was. They want 1.2 million illegal immigrants to get free health insurance, while at the same time, they're talking about how unaffordable the Unaffordable Care Act is.

And what's worst about all of this is even if we were to give them what they wanted, this $1.5 trillion, none of it's paid for. Let me ask you about one other issue on the shutdown that came up this week. There was a draft memo from the White House that talked about federal workers who had been furloughed because of the shutdown may not be guaranteed back pay. Where do you land on that issue? I want everybody to go back to work. I mean, the law is what it is, which is why I voted to,

keep the government open. The Democrats put us in this position. The Democrats sent everybody home. The Democrats furloughed everyone. The Democrats have had six or seven opportunities to reopen the government, and they continue to vote no every time. Well, do you support providing back pay for furloughed government workers if and when they return to work? That's my understanding. But look, I think the president needs to take a look at letting some of these people go permanently. I'm a big believer, for example, in getting rid of the Department of Education. Well, this is a great opportunity to do it. Just let them all go. This week on a separate issue, Representative, let me ask you about the Mideast. President Trump announced a ceasefire deal between Israel and

Hamas. The Israeli government has approved that deal on this Friday as you and I are talking. Are you satisfied with the agreement? I think it's an extraordinary achievement. It's in my opinion, if the hostages are released and President Trump brings peace to the Middle East, it's not the end of the two-year war in Gaza. It's the end of a war for Israel independence. started in 1948. Israel has never been at peace with its neighbor since it was created. And if President Trump can do something that's never been done in the most difficult and tractable issue that we've ever seen, it will be the greatest domestic, I mean, it'll be the greatest diplomatic achievement in American history. And so I'm very hopeful that in the next few days

we'll see those hostages released. But I'm holding my breath until I see if that happened. Let me ask you about one point about the Trump peace deal. It establishes a dialogue between Israel and the Palestinians to agree on what it calls a, quote, political horizon for peaceful and prosperous coexistence. How do you think of that word coexistence in this case? I look back to what Israel did in 2005. Israel in 2005 left the Gaza Strip by force removed every Jew that lived in the Gaza Strip and dug up every dead Jew that had been buried in the Gaza Strip and removed them to Israel and said, here you go, have a country, govern, and we see how that turned out. So Israel's made clear it's willing to make peace with its neighbors. The challenges its neighbors haven't been willing

to make peace with it. Does that coexistence language lead to that so-called two-state solution? Well, it'd be a three-state solution. When the British mandate of Palestine was taken down, there were two states created. The Palestinian state is Jordan. The Jewish state is Israel. So it would be a second Palestinian state. And I do think there's the possibility of that down the road, but it's going to be a very, very long road to get there. Representative Randy Fine, thanks for your time today. Appreciate it.

No problem. Thanks for having me. Share your thoughts about the government shutdown. How it's impacting you? Do you support it? Do you oppose it? How do you find middle ground in all this? Send us an email, radio at the florida roundup.org. Radio at the Florida roundup.org.

Still to come, seashelling in southwest Florida. And one way we mark time this time of year by storm anniversaries. I'm Tom Hudson, and this is the Florida Roundup from your Florida Public Radio Station. The Florida Roundup is sponsored by Covering Florida Navigator Program, providing confidential assistance with health insurance enrollment through the health insurance marketplace. Assistance is available at 877-813 or coveringflora.org. This is the Florida Roundup. I'm Tom Hudson. Great to have you along. It has been a quiet season, hasn't it? This season that shall not be named. You know, the name of storms is kind of how we mark passage of time, this time of year.

And this week marks one year since Hurricane Milton brought flooding to many parts of the state. Some families are still struggling to recover. And for one family in Central Florida, that means saying goodbye to their home. They've spent the past year fixing after the storm. Molly Duregg, from a small. our partner, Central Florida Public Media, reports from Volusia County. It's a mid-September day. The water flowing through Spruce Creek is lying quite low. But when heavy rains hit Volusia County, this gentle stream running through Claire Venable's backyard

morphs into a terrifying site. When the waters start rising, they're not just sitting there stagnant. They are traveling very, very quickly. That's what happened in the middle of the night during Hurricane Milton. Venable says she and her daughter, now a college student, almost didn't escape the floodwaters in time. When Milton hit, it was only six weeks after the Venables had moved back into their home

after repairing damage from Hurricane Ian two years prior. Ian destroyed everything, you know, seven, eight hundred thousand dollars worth damage. That's Claire Venable's husband, Mark. The family has lived here about 15 years, but for the past few, they say it's barely felt like home. We've been here probably three, maybe four months in the past three years. For the rest of that time, they've stayed with friends and at motels while the house is under construction. It's taken a while, partly because the place is so big, 5,600 square feet. We are almost done. I'd say within a couple of percent done.

Today, contractors are here cutting tiles for the master bathroom. But Claire says she's been doing many of the other necessary repairs. I've managed to paint the house, all the rooms. I've put baseboard in. I've learned to use the saw. which I'm very pleased at my age that I finally achieved that skill. The Venables say they rolled up their sleeves and got to work while waiting on their mortgage company to approve insurance payouts. A slow, circular process, Mark says.

You can't get the money to do the work until the work is at least partially done. Had we had the money, this house would have been finished on the market in March. The families decided they're done. Not with Volusia County, at least not yet, but with this house for certain. They're hoping to sell it. People won't always want to come and buy a house that's flooded. We realize that, so our market's smaller. Especially since state law now requires sellers to tell buyers about a property's flooding risk,

including any past insurance claims filed for flood damage. On the Venable's sprawling five-acre lawn, the ground is still drenched, about a week after a rainstorm hit the area. There's lots of pooled water around, and I've noticed that this time the water hasn't gone down, quickly, which have to be honest, it does scare me. Claire says in the heart of hurricane season in Volusia County, she's filled with a sense of dread. You know, we want to be able to think about future. We want to think about what's happening in six months' time. But right now, we've just got to hopefully get through hurricane season unscathed. So far, this hurricane season has been quieter than

expected. In Volusia County, I'm Molly Durrig. Before Milton a year ago, there was Helene. That storm brought the sea into Columbia restaurant on Lido Key in Sarasota. It's one of the locations of the restaurants that go back more than a century. Andrea Gonsmar Williams is the fifth generation of the family running the restaurants. It's such a relief to be one year out from the hurricanes because it was truly a very stressful time for everyone, I think, in Florida. Because, I mean, the storms that hit us were unprecedented. I mean, outside of our lifetime, my parents' lifetime, we've never experienced flooding like that. We took on about four to five feet of water.

We lost so much. Almost all of our kitchen equipment had to be replaced. Being closed for two months, you know, it's the revenue not coming in, and then obviously the money that we had to reinvest in to our restaurants to be able to open them buck up, and we also continue to pay our staff. The financial effect was it hurt. It was definitely six figures. We did not do an insurance claim because at that point, then we realized what our insurance deductible was. You know, it's funny when you're renewing your insurance, you never think it's going to happen. But, you know, luckily, we have wonderful construction partners that were able to get in there very timely and do it at a minimal cost.

Just being able to open our doors again and have our staff come back and being able to pay them and have them come to work, that was the most rewarding part. So it's not about money. It's about, you know, being able to go back to normal operations. We're the oldest restaurant in Sarasota, so it felt like it was only appropriate for us to be one of the first restaurants to open back up. You can fix things. It's the not being open. You have to give your employees hope. You have to give your community hope. And so being closed for two months was so disappointing. It's that not knowing, the not knowing when we're going to be able to open up, but it was all hands on deck. I would like to think we handle it in true Gonsmart form

and with the grace that my grandparents would want it to be done. Andrea Gonsmart Williams is the caretaker of the Columbia Restaurant in Sarasota. Carrie Sheridan with our partner station WUSF provided the reporting. I'm Tom Hudson, and you're listening to. the Florida Ronda from your Florida Public Radio Station. The third anniversary of Hurricane Ian passed just about two weeks ago. It's the most expensive storm to hit Florida, coming ashore just north of Sanibel Island. Jamie Winterstern was out on the beaches in and around Sanibel weeks before the storm.

He was filming a documentary about seashelling and the people who hunt and collect shells as a pastime and as a livelihood. And then Ian hit. Jamie's film is entitled Sanibel. Why decide to make a documentary about seashells? I used to collect shells with my mom when I was a child. Being from Montreal, we were snowbirds and we'd come down to Florida. And I would walk the beaches with her. And then she unfortunately passed early in life to early onset Alzheimer's.

And it was around that time that I discovered the west coast of Florida, which shelling is the capital of the world. And it made me feel close to her to walk the beaches and pick up shell. shells, and Sanibel was such an epicenter for this sort of thing. Well, I'm sorry for your loss so many years ago. What does a shell represent to you? You know, it's just nature. It's very therapeutic. Nature doesn't think, right?

We think. And nature just is. And I find that when we're close to nature, it's a very spiritual experience. There's a reverence early in the film that is conveyed clearly through the visual and especially the music that you have selected to use underneath these gorgeous visuals of beaches and beaches of shells in southwest Florida. There's a reverence, there's the undertone of faith, and you talked about this religious experience. Where do you think that comes from? When I lost my mom, I had a lot of questions about mortality, and it made me feel more at peace with the world.

The documentary was never supposed to be about a hurricane. That just happened. And the irony of that is as much pain as the hurricane caused, we end up finding our way back to the same beaches. There is that before and after in the documentary, before Hurricane and then, of course, after Hurricane and the utter natural devastation that the storm brought. And, of course, all the personal devastation that it brought to the characters that you highlight. One of those characters doesn't loom large in your documentary, but is a collector by the name of Nancy Black. Welcome to my shell collection. For one reason or another, Nancy's story kind of resided with me of someone who just loves shells for their own purpose.

She's not in the business of making jewelry or selling them, polishing them up at the local corner store. Window traps, little baby, window traps. You know, you see them in a jar or anything. They're all exactly the same. But when you line them up side by side, each one is a little bit different, just like people. And then you catch up with her after Hurricane Ian. I had over eight feet of water in my lower level. And her collection of countless thousands, tens of thousands, maybe hundreds of thousands of shells, are all gone. It's gone.

Wiped out. Every single shell is gone. I mean, there were thousands. and thousands of shells. Sad? That's the thing. Shells are resilient creatures. That's the whole idea behind a shell.

And we ourselves are very resilient. We tend to not give ourselves enough credit. And I think in times, like a hurricane like Ian, and the cost that it did to the islands and the community, they're still there. And they're rebuilding. And that's just symbolic of what we are as creatures. we will keep coming back to the same beaches

and we're going to rebuild the community and there's something very powerful and profound about that. That's Jamie Winterstern. He's the director of the documentary film Sanibel. The film is available on Apple TV and Amazon Prime. So with a quiet Florida tropical forecast for this weekend, we thought we'd go out this week, rounded out, with the sounds of the sea

and the shells from Southwest Florida. That's from the film, Sanadol. And that is our program for today. It is produced by WLRN Public Media in Miami and WSF in Tampa by Bridget O'Brien and Denise Royal. WLRN's vice president of radio is Peter Merritt. The program's technical director is M.J. Smith, engineering help each, and every week from Doug Peterson, Ernesto J. and Jackson Harp. Our theme music is provided by Miami jazz guitarist Aaron Leibos at Aaron Leibos.com. our inbox is always open send us a note tell us what you're up to email radio at the florida roundup

dot org radio at the florida roundup dot org thanks for calling emailing listening and above all supporting public media in your slice of florida i'm tom hudson have a terrific weekend the florida roundup is sponsored by covering florida navigator program providing confidential assistance with health insurance enrollment through the health insurance marketplace. Assistance is available at 877-813-92115 or covering Florida.org.