The Food Medic - S4 E9: The Plant-Based Athlete

Episode Date: July 17, 2020

On this episode, Dr Hazel sits down with Anita Bean - Registered Nutritionist specialising in sports nutrition, published author (of 29 books!), and former British bodybuilding champion. Anita is also the nutritionist for the London Marathon and Good Housekeeping.In this episode they cover:- The benefits of a plant based diet for health and performance- Nutrients that are a bit more tricky to obtain from a plant based diet.- Good plant-based protein sources and meeting protein requirements.- Low carbohydrate diets in athletes.- Gut issues in athletes following a plant based diet.- Plant based examples of what to eat before, during, and after exercise.- Carb-loading before an endurance event.- Hydration and electrolyte replacement. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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exclusions, and terms apply. Instacart, groceries that over-deliver. Hello, and a very big welcome back to the Food Medic Podcast. I'm your host, as always, Dr. Hazel Wallace. Today, I'm very excited to introduce my next guest, Anita Bean, who is an award-winning registered nutritionist, author of 29 books, including her most recent book, Vegetarian Meals in 30 Minutes, a health writer and former British bodybuilding champion. She specializes in sport and exercise nutrition and is passionate about helping athletes improve their performance. Anita was actually my very first podcast guest and her episode was an absolute hit so I've invited her back on to chat all about vegan and vegetarian diets in the context of sports performance. Okay so Anita we've had you on the

podcast before actually you were my very first guest and that podcast did incredibly well. And I'm very happy to have you back again. One of the reasons I actually wanted to invite you back was after you released your new cookbook, The Vegetarian Athlete. And I think that's something that we're starting to see more and more, not just in athletes, but in just people who are changing their diet for whatever reason, whether it's environmental, health, ethical reasons, to be either vegetarian or vegan, somewhere along the plant-based spectrum. And so I guess the first question I would love to pose to you is, what are some of the health benefits of a plant-based diet? Well, you're absolutely right, Hazel. There has been a real boom in people

adopting plant-based diets. We certainly know that one in three people have either cut down or cut out meat within the last 12 months. And the number of vegans has actually quadrupled in the past five years. So there are two aspects to the health benefits. First of all, there's health in terms of longevity and chronic disease. And the second aspect, which is really interesting, that is the effects on performance. So we can cover both if you like, I'll take each one in turn. Yeah, that would be great. Yeah. So health wise, we know from a large number of prospective studies. So these are studies that follow populations over very many years.

So we know that populations that eat less meat generally have less cardiovascular disease, less type 2 diabetes, fewer cancers or certain cancers anywhere less prevalent and greater longevity. We also know that colorectal cancer is more common in people with high consumptions of meat or processed meat in particular. So there's a lot of information that we've got from these prospective studies, but also the cross-sectional studies are interesting because they suggest that many of these health benefits are attributable to having lower blood cholesterol levels and lower blood pressure, lower BMI or lower body weight. so there is a real link between diet and chronic disease but in terms of exactly why this is happening it's still not clear it could simply be that people are eating more plants they're getting more fiber more of the plant nutrients we call them phytonutrients and more antioxidants and all of these things improve gut health and are associated with less risk of disease. But at the same time, plant-based diets, they tend to be lower in saturated fat, lower in added sugars and

ultra-processed foods. And the third thing is that vegetarians and vegans generally adopt healthier behaviors. So we're talking about taking more physical activity. They tend to not smoke and they tend to drink less alcohol. So it's quite difficult to disentangle exactly why plant based diets are associated with greater health benefits. So chances are it's a whole mixture of things. It's not simply the absence of meat or animal products. So that's the first thing is the health. And we can talk also about the performance benefits as well, because obviously a lot of your listeners are very much into exercise and healthy lifestyles. And I think this is really one of the most exciting areas of sports nutrition research. So we've got a lot of anecdotal evidence at the moment.

And we've certainly got a lot of high profile sports people such as Venus Williams, Chris Froome, the cyclist, we've got Tom Daley, Lewis Hamilton, Scott Jurek, the ultra marathon runner. So there's a lot of high profile exposure to plant based diets and people are watching the benefits. And then we've got Netflix documentaries which are promoting the benefits of plant based diets. And what these athletes are saying or advocating is that the diet is giving them more energy. It's helping them to recover quicker after exercise, and that they're experiencing fewer injuries or at least quicker recovery from injuries. When we look at the science behind it, at the moment, there are only a handful of studies.

And what these do, they don't say that the plant-based diet is the best diet for athletic performance. However, they are suggesting that if you are consuming a well-planned plant-based diet is the best diet for athletic performance. However, they are suggesting that if you are consuming a well-planned plant-based diet, it can support athletic performance. And contrary to popular belief, it certainly doesn't put athletes at a disadvantage. And perhaps the best review that I've come across is an Australian review, which was published in 2016. It looked at eight studies that had been carried out to date. And it concluded that plant-based neither hinders nor improves performance. So in other words, it's very supportive of athletic performance. But you could ask me, you know, what's the reason behind, you know, why are

athletes saying that, you know, we experience all of these benefits? Well, it could well be that the high content of plant nutrients, and this has a positive effect on the gut microbiota. So, as you know, we're talking about fiber, about phytonutrients, polyphenols, antioxidants, and all of these components in the diet. They feed the beneficial microbes in the gut, which produce these short-chain fatty acids and other compounds. And these have a huge impact on health. So it's likely that there's an indirect effect.

So by boosting immunity, there's less oxidative stress in the body. There's lower inflammation in the body. And these are key factors for performance and recovery. So in other words, I suppose just to summarize, it's not necessarily the absence of meat that's helping athletes perform or recover better, but it's their higher intake of plant nutrients and their lower content of the ultra processed foods that tends to provoke inflammation. So in other words, there really is a net health and performance benefit when people switch to a plant based diet. Yeah, I'm glad you clarified that because I think I did mention that you were coming on the podcast to those people who are following me on Instagram and

asked if there is any questions and a lot of people brought up Netflix documentaries and whether they are accurate or blown out of proportion and I think you summarized it right, a plant-based diet neither helps nor hinders performance and really it also kind of depends on the athlete and also the what the diet is made up of yeah absolutely um the key really is in a well-planned plant-based diet because as you know vegan or plant-based doesn't necessarily equal healthy. You can eat a diet of biscuits or sweets, and it might be vegan, but it doesn't mean that it's necessarily healthy. So it's really important that before you become totally plant-based,

that you educate yourself. I'm not saying that you have to do extensive amounts of research, but it's a really good idea to look at good quality sources of information, to listen to healthcare professionals with nutrition training, and that you ensure that you are getting all the nutrients that you need. Yeah, and I would love to chat about that next. And that's kind of just touching on what are the nutrients that are a bit more tricky to obtain from a plant basedbased diet and obviously this will vary depending on where you are on the plant-based spectrum whether you're totally vegan and exclude all animal products or whether you're vegetarian and include some eggs and things like that but maybe if we cover off some things just as a starting point so people can put their nutrients

in their head yeah definitely um i mean there are a number of nutrients that are more tricky to obtain when you're plant-based. So these are iron, vitamin B12, omega-3s, if you're not having fish, calcium, iron. So there's quite a number. So to start with, it does seem a little bit daunting. How are you going to get all of these nutrients in that case? So we can cover protein separately actually, because obviously that tends to be the number one question. So plant-based, where do you get your protein? But in terms of the micronutrients, so iron, well, theoretically,

if you're not having meat in your diet, you're at a high risk of low intake, mainly because the type of iron in meat, it's called heme iron. It's more readily absorbed than plant iron. However, a lot of studies have actually found that iron deficiency anemia is actually no more common in vegetarians and vegans than it is in the rest of the population. And the reason seems to be that the body is very adaptive. So in other words, if you've got quite low iron status, the body adapts by increasing the amount of iron that you can absorb over time. So iron isn't such a scary thing when it comes to vegan diets. But the main way that you can get your iron is through whole grains, pulses, nuts, seeds, and green leafy vegetables. And the best tip that I can give is to ensure that you are consuming a source of vitamin C at the same time, because this increases the amount

of iron that you absorb. So it means adding perhaps red peppers to a stew that you're making, or maybe adding some kale or some pak choy, because they're really good sources of iron or having some fruit at the same time. So that's iron. We can move on to B12 because this is a really big one, particularly for vegan diets, because there are no plant sources of B12. And we certainly know that it can be a problem. So a long term deficiency of B12 can lead to a type of anemia and that would definitely affect your endurance if you're an athlete. So you need to get your B12 really from fortified foods, but that's not nearly so much of a problem as it used to be. So nowadays, most plant milks are fortified with B12. So just check that the brand that you're opting for has got B12 added to it. And then most yeast extracts

and nutritional yeast flakes have got B12 added. But if you don't do that, then taking a supplement, perhaps a multivitamin supplement that contains 10 micrograms of vitamin B12 would be a good option as well. And can I just ask a quick question? Sure. With your client who are vegan, if they're having foods which are fortified with vitamin B12, are you typically happy for them not to supplement or do you advise to supplement as a just in case? I would say either or actually, I don't think that it's necessary to do both. So if you are, if you've got a fairly high and regular intake of plant milks that's fortified and you regularly include nutritional yeast flakes or yeast extract, that's likely to be enough. But if you're not sure whether you really are having enough, then there's no harm in taking a multivitamin supplement

that's designed for vegans, and it will have B12 at the right level, the 10 microgram level that the Vegan Society recommend. Great. Okay. We should talk about calcium, because actually that's a really big concern that vegans have, is where to get the calcium,

because obviously dairy milk is a major source. But the best solution, I believe, for vegans is to make sure that they're opting for a plant milk that has got added calcium. So nowadays, most of the big brands have got added calcium to equivalent levels that you would find in cow's milk. The second good source is tofu that would be set with calcium. So that calcium is actually added during the manufacture of tofu. And then there are lots of other sources like beans and lentils, broccoli, pak choy, sesame seeds and tahini. So perhaps the best thing to remember is to try and get a whole range of different calcium foods in your diet. And you probably will have to work quite hard at that one to get to your recommended daily amount. I think omega-3s are really worth

mentioning actually, because obviously oily fish is the major source for most people. And if you're not consuming fish, then you do need to get your omega-3s elsewhere. So, you can get a different type of omega-3s. They're called short-chain omega-3s called ALAs or alpha-linolenic acid. And they are found in certain plants. And these can be converted in the body into these long-chain omega-3s. It's not terribly efficient. So, the idea is that you actually need to work quite hard at consuming your plant omega-3s. So, we're talking about flaxseeds or flaxseed oil. Kea seeds are really good. Hemp seeds are really good. And then using rapeseed in your cooking. And that's something that I do. I do use rapeseed oil.

And you can add walnuts and pumpkin seeds to your food. But if those foods really don't appeal to you, which is fair enough, I would say supplement with an omega-3 supplement that's made from algae oil and that's quite widely available nowadays. So I think we've probably covered the main nutrients that might be quite tricky. So just to kind of summarise for people, we mentioned iron, vitamin B12, calcium, omega-3. I think one of the other things that comes up quite a bit and maybe doesn't get as much airtime is iodine. Yeah, of course. You see, so iodine, again, the main sources in people's diets are fish and dairy. So that means if you're excluding those foods from your diet, you will need to get iodine from other sources. So we need iodine for making thyroid hormones. That's important for your metabolism and it's particularly

important for pregnant women because it's used for baby's brain development. So vegans will really need to seriously consider taking a supplement of iodine which you can get from vegan and vegetarian multivitamin and mineral supplements, but just check that it contains the RDA, which is 150 micrograms. Avoid relying on seaweed. I do know vegans who say, well, that's fine. I include seaweed in my diet. Well, that's not really recommended as levels can actually be very variable and sometimes they can be excessive. And again will create a whole host of new problems so iodine yes iodine is one supplement that you may well have to consider on a vegan diet yeah and then I guess what you mentioned is um protein and that's a question that everyone

wants to ask is where will I get protein if I don't eat meat? Yeah, you're absolutely right. That is probably the number one myth, really. So it's a myth that you can't get enough protein without meat, particularly when it comes to athletes. People assume that you will end up losing muscle and losing strength. But the answer to that is you can get enough protein from many plant sources. So I suppose the main categories that I like to talk about for protein are legumes. So I'm talking about beans, lentils, chickpeas, peas, and peanuts. The second category are the soya categories. So we're thinking here about soya milk alternatives, soya yogurt, tofu, tempeh is another one. So all the soy products are really good um the next category be grains and and then also nuts and seeds a fourth category nuts and seeds so we do know

actually that most people unless you're an athlete it's actually likely that you're exceeding your requirement we know that from the epic oxford, which is a large scale perspective study that actually found, and I was really surprised to read this, that vegans are actually exceeding the RDA. They're getting on average one gram of protein per kilogram body weight. Now, the RDA is 0.8. So in other words, they are having more than enough. So it really is quite a myth that people don't get enough protein. Remember that virtually all foods contain some protein. It's just that plant foods generally contain lower amounts than animal foods. And although athletes need more than the general

population, so the official guidance for athletes is between 1.2 and 2 grams per kilogram body weight or roughly 20 grams per meal. You can achieve this really by having bigger portions of plant foods because as I've just said they contain generally lower concentrations and the second thing that you can do is to consume a variety of plant proteins throughout the day. So the reason for doing that is that plant proteins have got a different amino acid profile compared to animals. They generally lack certain amino acids, particularly lysine, which makes it slightly less digestible. And it's perhaps less readily converted into muscle and body proteins. But that really isn't a difficult hurdle to overcome. It literally means all you need to do is to have more than one source of protein over the course of the day. So you might have for

breakfast, for example, you might have plant milk with your porridge, perhaps with kia seasons, you've already got at least two or three types of protein there. And then during the day, you might want to have a salad with quinoa and avocados and black beans. And then later on, you might have a three bean chili with rice. So there are lots of different proteins that you've consumed throughout the day. So that's probably the most important thing to make sure your diet's really varied. And the final tip that I would give for anyone who's thinking of going plant-based and worrying about protein is to try and include tofu and tempeh in your diet because these foods are probably the most concentrated protein sources

and they also contain all of the amino acids. So you know that you're getting everything and you're getting everything in quite high amounts as well. Yeah, exactly. So one of the things that you mentioned there was how great tofu is for a source of protein. And obviously, it's a soy based product. And one of the concerns a lot of people have is the link between soy and breast cancer. So would you be able to kind of cover what the evidence is with regards to that? Yeah, this myth really, I think, stemmed from studies that were carried out

about 20 or 30 years ago when scientists discovered that soy contains phytoestrogens. This is a plant estrogen that's biochemically quite similar in structure to estrogen in the body. However, this estrogen has much weaker effects in the body. So in fact, biologically it behaves in a very different way. And there really is no evidence that these phytosevents that found in soy products promote cancer at all. And in fact, the evidence is quite the converse. In fact, soya could actually be protective and may even prevent recurrence of cancer in people as well. So I think that's a myth that's really got to be squashed.

Yeah, absolutely. I think you've covered that off really well. And it's the phytoestrogens that tend to crop up quite a bit. One of the other things that I just wanted to touch on while we're on the topic of protein is protein supplements. So I think this is a question that lots of people have, regardless of whether they eat animal products or not. And that's, are protein supplements necessary and should I consider them? Yeah, well, if you're not vegan, so in other words, you're having dairy products and eggs in your diet, then consuming enough protein really isn't a problem. So generally the advice that I give to athletes that you don't need to, you know, protein supplements aren't necessary.

By having a wide variety of foods in your diet and really paying attention to protein foods, that's the better option. And certainly the IAAF, which is the International Amateur Athletic Federation, they recommend whole food sources of protein rather than supplements. The reason is that you're going to be getting a greater range of nutrients. And it's this interaction of nutrients within this food matrix that will actually promote better absorption. So having said that, it can be harder for vegan athletes to meet their requirements, mainly because having very large amounts of pulses and grains and nuts and so on means that the diet can be quite bulky. And that makes it quite difficult for athletes to meet their protein intake from food alone. So in those cases, I would say that vegan protein supplements can be quite useful, particularly if you are very active. So let's

say you're exercising more than three times per week, and that means your protein requirements will be quite high. So when it comes to choosing protein supplements, I usually say you'll go for soya because it contains a better profile of amino acids. You've got all of the essential aminos in there. But also you can get some good blends of pea protein and soy protein, rice protein. So you're kind of covering all bases and they can be a good option as well. Yeah. And moving on from protein to another macronutrient, which is carbohydrates. Are low carbohydrate diets suitable for vegetarian or vegan athletes? I mean, it would be very tricky to do so. Yeah, definitely. So these low carb diets have become really popular

amongst athletes in the last few years. So I think they're popular for two main reasons. Firstly, is that endurance athletes have cottoned onto the fact that by limiting their carb intake, then they will force their body to burn more fat. And that will ultimately lead to enhanced endurance training adaptations. In other words, it will allow them to exercise longer because the body is more dependent on fat and less dependent on carbohydrate. So that's the theory behind it. And then the second reason why athletes are going low carb is to try and lose weight, again, for the reason that they think that they will force their body to burn body fat rather than burning glycogen for fuel. However, in practice, there are quite a number of large problems associated with low-carb diets,

particularly if you are vegetarian or vegan. So although you might be increasing fat burning during exercise, you'll find that exercise feels much harder, particularly if you're doing high-intensity exercise. So what's happening is that the body adapts. So you will actually literally lose the ability to exercise at high intensity. So these are the enzyme pathways that would normally break down carbohydrates into energy and ATP. So the enzymes are actually reduced. And what that means in practice is that your performance will drop, you'll feel fatigued much sooner, then you'll

have to lower your pace and you are probably going to experience fatigue much quicker, particularly if you are trying to do something at a high intensity. And we know perhaps the best study that I've seen, there's a series of supernova studies which were carried out by Louise Burke in Australia. And she found that the athletes who followed a low carb diet actually reduced their exercise efficiency. And what that means in English is that they required more oxygen in order to produce the same amount of energy. So they actually had a slower performance compared to athletes who had a higher intake of carbohydrate. So it's really important to remember that if you are on a low carb diet for whatever, maybe you believe that it will give you endurance training adaptations, but

it's actually a big stress for the body. You're going to increase your production of cortisol and over time that will decrease your immunity and increase your risk of illness. And it could result in muscle loss. And I just don't think that that's something that most athletes are after. So in a nutshell, there's very little evidence to back the value of low-carbohydrate diets. It's a chronic strategy. It as a chronic way of eating. And if you're after weight loss, well, there are plenty of other methods of achieving weight loss that don't require limiting your carbohydrate intake. You simply need to create a calorie

deficit over a period of time. Yeah. And kind of on that topic of carbohydrates, for a lot of people, when they transition from maybe an omnivorous diet to a plant based diet, it requires a shift in the diet. That means there's a lot more fiber in the diet. And obviously for athletes, this could be problematic in that if you're not used to having all that fiber on board it can lead to a lot of GI upset so gastrointestinal upset and I guess just thinking about people who may be doing endurance sports so maybe it's triathlons or long runs what can they do to help reduce the risk of having you know stomach upset when they are doing the long runs if they are having a high fiber diet yeah i mean the really good point there so two aspects of this so firstly when you transition onto a plant-based diet make sure you do it gradually so don't go overnight from a low fiber

diet to a high fiber diet because it does take time for the gut to adapt. So, both in terms of the gut microbiota and also in terms of the digestion and the number of enzymes that you have. So, make sure that you step up gradually. So, over perhaps a number of weeks rather than doing it from one day to the next. Otherwise, of course, it can increase the risk of stomach discomfort and GI issues. But of course, these issues are surprisingly really common in endurance athletes. And in fact, one study that was carried out at John Moores University found that it was close to half of all endurance athletes said that they experienced problems like stomach discomfort, excessive wind production, and wanting to go to the loo during their long runs. So this probably wouldn't set in during a 20-minute jog, but this is something that you would experience perhaps if you've been running

for longer than an hour or perhaps 90 minutes. And what's happening here really is that the gut motility reduces, so everything slows down. The blood is being diverted away from your digestive organs and to the exercising muscles. And so obviously that just changes everything in the gut. And that's why you can experience these symptoms. And especially when you put that in with the jostling of the intestines that occurs during jogging, because it's a high impact activity. And then there could be other factors as well. For example, if you have then had a lot of high fiber foods,

perhaps if you're dehydrated at this point of your run, and then some people are just simply more sensitive to certain nutrients and perhaps to the hormones such as cortisol that are released during exercise. So there's a lot of things perhaps to be vigilant about, particularly if you are quite sensitive to these symptoms and you do experience these gradually. Firstly, try to keep a food and symptom diary and try and pinpoint any particular triggers, any foods that you notice would trigger off the symptoms. So for some people, it actually might be caffeine. And this is quite ironic because a lot of athletes like to have caffeine before they go out on a long run or before an event. But actually, that can exacerbate the GI symptoms. They live to regret it in the latter part of the race. So there might be certain foods that you want to avoid. If you find that you're quite sensitive to fiber, then try to switch to low fiber alternatives, perhaps the day before,

at least the hours before your event or your run. So instead of having whole grain cereal, so perhaps instead of whole grain pasta or brown rice, then you go for the white versions. And then don't have a lentil curry just before you go. You'd want to choose a much lower fiber meal. And the second thing you can do is to train your gut. And what that means is getting gradually accustomed to having greater amounts of carbohydrate during your run. So you might think that, oh, I can't eat anything during my run because it makes me feel nauseous or it makes me feel like throwing up. Well, if you just do it gradually, so perhaps a bite of banana, and then the next time you run, you'll go for two bites of banana. So it's a case of training up to be accustomed to having carbs in them. You will develop greater numbers of enzymes that absorb the carbohydrates. And so symptoms

over a period of time will improve. So those are the main things. And there have been some really interesting new studies carried out at Liverpool John Moores where they have given athletes more probiotics, perhaps I think it was seven days prior to a marathon and they found that the athletes who did that were much less likely to experience gut issues, particularly in the latter part of the race. They felt much more comfortable. Oh, interesting. And in terms of, you know, chatting about competition, when it comes to pre-race nutrition, i.e. the night before and maybe the morning of, how do you feel about kind of carb loading?

Is there any specific protocol that you advise over the other protocols with your clients? Yeah, the old fashioned, it's quite surprising how many people still go for the old fashioned protocol, which is tapering, going on a low carb diet and doing exhaustive exercise for three days at the start of the pre-event week and then going for a high carb diet only the last three days. Nowadays, we now know from all the research that that isn't really the most effective way to do it. What we advise now is simply tapering your training over the last one to two weeks. That means reducing the volume of training and then increasing your carbohydrate for the final two to three days, nothing more than that. And in fact, some of the elite athletes

will actually only carb load for the last 36 to 48 hours, but they will do it in quite a serious way. So, you're kind of tipping the balance there. You're not necessarily consuming more calories, but you're tipping the balance by having more carbohydrate and less fat. So you're keeping calories roughly the same. So the best way to do that is to consume your carbs little and often. So you're probably having four or five meals or smallish meals throughout the day. You don't need to have those big pasta parties at night. In fact, it's a really good idea to avoid overstuffing yourself in the evening. Otherwise, you're just going to

feel really uncomfortable. You'll probably have difficulty sleeping and then you'll end up waking up in the morning feeling rather bloated. So it's better to do your carb loading in the first part of the day for your breakfast, your snacks and your lunch. So meals based on porridge, on potatoes. Rice works really well for a lot of athletes. So pad thai, again, is another really good option. It's a noodle-based dish, not two fillings. You want to keep the fiber reasonably low unless your gut is, of course, very used to it. So yeah, those are the main main things really carve a little enough into the last 48 hours or so and avoid over stuffing yourself the night before

that's really useful thank you and then on the first podcast we recorded we obviously covered pre-intra and post-workout nutrition and I know that we just chatted a bit about competition nutrition but for people who are just everyday athletes i.e they're just going to the gym or they're just going for a short run and there's no kind of competition element in it can we just briefly run over the principles of pre and post workout nutrition and possiblyworkout and when that's relevant? Yeah, sure. So before you're exercising, ideally you want to be leaving roughly three or four hours between a meal and exercise, and that just gives your body enough time to digest and you're not going to feel uncomfortable. But it's better that this meal is reasonably high in carbohydrate, particularly if you're doing an endurance type of workout. You'll want to have some protein and you'll also want to have some fat, but

lesser amounts. So you don't want to have a big fry up or you don't want to have anything that's going to be too high in fat because it takes longer to digest. So by having a combination of carbs, some protein and some healthy fats, you're going to get sustained energy. So we're looking at foods such as, dare I say it, good old fashioned porridge, but you'd add your bananas, add your bananas, add your almonds and your nut butter. If that doesn't take your fancy, you could have perhaps yogurt and add in some bananas, berries or nuts. But in terms of what would be the best meal, so if it's not a breakfast meal, I would go for something like a pita filled with falafels and

avocado, or I would go for perhaps hummus on toast, or a simple risotto. This is my number one meal actually. So the night before a competition, I would go for a simple rice dish and add in perhaps, you know, you want some veg in there. So maybe a little bit of broccoli. You could perhaps add in some beans. It could be some red kidney beans, but not too much for obvious reasons. And then probably my number two dish would be something like a potato or a sweet potato. I would add some hummus and perhaps some salad to it as well. So it's easy to digest. So that's before exercise. And after exercise, you just simply need to remember the three R's, rehydrate, refuel, and rebuild. So in other words, you want to put the fluid in that you have lost,

you want to be refueling with carbohydrate and you want to be rebuilding with protein. So the main difference between your post and your pre-exercise meal will probably be the protein content, especially if you've been doing resistance exercise. So perhaps the best food, the one that's been studied very extensively by sports scientists, would be anything based on milk. Now, that might jar a bit with plant-based principles. So, if you are truly plant-based and you're on a vegan diet, then go for soy. So, anything based on soya milk would be a good alternative to dairy milk. And that has been shown to be almost as effective in promoting muscle building post-exercise.

So good options for snacks would be a smoothie, which you can make from yoghurt, and that could be soy yoghurt if you don't want dairy yoghurt, and you can add in your berries and perhaps some nuts or nut butter, or simply just mixing yoghurt with granola. I think that's a really quick, easy and highly nutritious thing to do after exercise. But there's plenty of good meals that you could have. You can add in more pulses now because you don't need to worry so much about the GI discomfort. So you could have a chickpea curry with some rice. You could have tofu. So I mentioned

earlier on about how tofu is particularly useful for vegans. So perhaps have tofu and vegetable skewers. Or you might want to have something like a vegetarian chili made with lots of different beans. My real favorite is dal, actually. So that's literally a lentil curry with rice. So there's lots of different variations of dhal that you can add in cauliflower, you can add in butternut squash. So you're getting a really, really delicious mixture of pulses as your protein, you're getting in your vegetables with all of the antioxidants, all the phytonutrients, and you're getting in your carbs as well. So yeah, there are lots of

different ways of achieving the same objectives. Amazing. And then just to touch on fluid, then lastly, we're kind of often told to drink our eight glasses a day and to drink loads of fluid when we're working out and also when we're doing races and things. But what are the risks of having too much or too little actually? And also as kind of a second question to that is electrolytes and electrolyte drinks and when we should be considering them, if at all. Yeah, sure. So you're absolutely right, Hazel, to say that it's important to avoid being under hydrated as well as over hydrated. So that's something actually that's risen to the fore in the last few years. We've seen more people suffering from a condition called hyponatremia towards the end of long distance races and marathons. And this can happen if you're consuming too much water and it results in low levels of sodium in the bloodstream. And that can lead to a potentially fatal condition where the brain swells and you will experience nausea and dizziness.

So sometimes that's mistaken for the same symptoms of underhydration. So what you're really aiming for is to be in that zone in between those two things. So the most important advice, and this is given out of the London Marathon, whom I work for, is literally to listen to your body. There are no strict rules. So you literally drink when you are thirsty. So clearly your sweat rate will depend on your pace. It will depend on the surrounding temperature and humidity. And it will also depend on your body size, actually. So bigger people will tend to produce more heat than smaller bodies, as well as your individual chemistry. So some people are simply, they will sweat more heavily and they will produce more salt in their sweat. So to give you

a rough guide, if you're running, then you only need somewhere between 400 and 800 mils per hour. And it's better to do that little and often. So don't just drink once an hour. I mean, if you're out for, say, half an hour, you probably don't need to worry too much about the rehydration. But if you are exercising for up to an hour or longer, you really do need to listen to your body carefully and to drink whenever you're thirsty. When it comes to electrolytes, well, they are kind of overrated, I think, for regular exercises. If you're exercising

generally for less than, really less than about two hours, you're not going to be sweating enough to be losing enough sodium to have an impact on your performance. So, consuming electrolyte drinks is really going to be a waste of time. I mean, it won't do you any harm, but you are wasting your money really on something that you don't really need. Now, electrolytes will be useful for heavy sweaters and certainly if you're exercising in hot conditions and you are sweating profusely. So in that case, you might want to go for a specially formulated sports drink that contains the right levels of sodium, or you can make your own either by putting some salt, water, and perhaps some sugar-free squash into a drink, or you can use electrolyte tablets. And there are a lot of these commercially available ones

they're quite widely available now but that's really only if you are losing significant amounts of sweat and therefore sodium amazing that was really helpful so if people want to find out a bit more about you and also get some inspiration for vegetarian cooking where can they find you and where can we get your books yeah sure well i am on social media so i'm on instagram as anita bean one i'm on twitter as anita bean and uh you can go into my website anitabean.co.uk where i have got lots of free recipes i should say actually instagram I put a lot of my recipes up there on Instagram and so I'll say go onto my website free recipes lots of articles and links where you can buy my books and I've got three cookbooks which are out at the moment I've got vegetarian meals

in 30 minutes I've got the vegetarian athletes cookbook and the runners cookbook and you also have um your complete guide to sports nutrition which um for anyone who's studying nutrition I highly recommend but also if you're looking for a bit more deep dive into nutrition it's very helpful yes thank you Hazel for reminding me of that one. That probably is my best book, actually. But it is aimed at the more serious exerciser, the more committed. And as you say, it is actually recommended for people who are studying nutrition, both in higher education and universities as well. So thank you very much for that. You're very welcome. Well, thank you for joining us. Well, thank you very much for that you're very welcome well thank you for joining us well thank you very much you're more than welcome okay guys that was anita i hope you had a pen and paper for all that information don't worry you can always listen back i hope you enjoyed it and i'll see you again next time