The Food Medic - S7 E9: Building a healthier body and healthier planet with Ryan Andrews

Episode Date: March 2, 2022

Do you want to live in a way that not only supports your health and fitness goals, but also supports the planet? This is the episode for you. In this episode Dr Hazel is joined by Ryan D. Andrews - a sustainable food systems advocate, dietitian, yoga instructor, and strength and conditioning specialist. He currently writes and speaks about health and sustainability, is an instructor at Purchase College, is an expert reviewer for Insider, and is an adviser with Precision Nutrition. He has recently released the e-book Swole Planet : How To Build A Better Body And A Better Earth. This episode covers:- The pursuit for gains vs planetary health - The impact of a typical body-building diet on the planet - Is our only way of saving the planet to go vegan?- Mindful sourcing of animal based products - Sustainability of plant-based meat alternatives- Tips for those transitioning into a plant-based diet and gut issues - The impact of food waste and what we can do about it - Other ways we can reduce our environmental footprint- How movement can benefit us and the planet If you loved this episode make sure to give it a review, rating (hopefully 5 stars) and share it with your friends and family. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Wendy's most important deal of the day has a fresh lineup. Pick any two breakfast items for $5. New four-piece French toast sticks, bacon or sausage wrap, English muffin sandwiches, value iced coffee, and more. Limited time only at participating Wendy's Taxes Extra. Hello, and welcome back to another episode of the Food Medic Podcast. I'm your host, Dr. Hazel. So, I've got a question for you. Do you want to live in a way

that not only supports your health and fitness goals, but also supports the planet? Yes, me too. As liquid habit, I know a guy, Ryan D. Andrews. Ryan is a sustainable food systems advocate, dietitian, yoga instructor instructor and strength and conditioning specialist. He currently writes and speaks about health and sustainability, is an instructor at Purchase College, is an expert reviewer for Insider and is an advisor with Precision Nutrition. He's recently released the ebook Swole Planet, how to build a better body and a better earth and that's exactly the topic that we're going to dive into today. If you could just start by telling us a little bit more about who you are,

what you do, and what you're passionate about. I have been involved in the world of nutrition and health and wellness for most of my life. And I kind of think of my life in different chapters. So in my teens, I was really focused on competitive bodybuilding. And that was my gateway into the world of nutrition and health. In my 20s, I was a lot more focused on going to school, going to graduate school, completing my dietetic internship and starting my career. So it was a very intense time. And then in my late twenties and early thirties, the next chapter switched into really immersing myself in the food system and learning about all the different angles of the food system. And I've done that through

kind of traditional learning, reading the latest journal articles and reports, but I've also really made off as I had a very narrow view on nutrition, and it just continued to widen over the years. So yeah. And at this point, I mean, I'm passionate about minimizing suffering within the food system. Yeah. And so you've just released a new book. Let's start there. What's the premise of the book and how is it different to your usual nutrition book on how to get fit, how to look fit, how to look strong and healthy? Yeah, there's a little bit of that. I wanted to bridge the gap between swoleness and sustainability because throughout my life, I've been involved in both worlds. I've been very deep into the world of

getting as swole as possible and winning bodybuilding competitions. And I mean, that's kind of the more extreme end. I've also just been involved in wanting to have a healthy body composition and be fit. And then I've also been pretty deep in the world of sustainability and farming and kind of more like the hippie world of things. And a lot of times I feel like both camps are kind of missing out. People in the fitness camp are totally focused on meeting their macros and nutrient needs and getting as fit as possible. And they're not at all thinking about anything in the world of sustainability, anything beyond their plate. And in the sustainability

world, it's kind of the opposite. They're really, really focused on doing all things sustainability and benefiting ecosystems and improving farm production and farm worker welfare and animal welfare, but they might totally forget about their own fitness and health. So I really wanted to bridge the gap between the two and try to find some synergies between the two. What behaviors can we engage in that benefit both worlds? Yeah. And so just going back to a typical bodybuilding, we're very much generalizing here and thinking about a stereotypical bodybuilding diet, which is inclusive of animal products. Like,

how is that impacting the planet? Yeah, it's a big question. So when I think of a traditional bodybuilding diet, it's a diet built around a lot of animal products. Animal products are one of the big variables in how we can make adjustments with our eating to benefit the food system. So generally they're higher in animal products and generally there's not much concern for things like food waste. I mean, I remember when I was bodybuilding, I would have a 12 egg omelet every day, but it was 10 egg whites. So 10 egg whites and two whole eggs. So I'd throw away 10 yolks, like just 10 wonderful nutritious, like nutrient dense yolks were gone every day. So that's a lot of food waste. That's

one small minor example, but I don't think there's much concern for food waste. I don't think there's much concern around sourcing. So where am I getting this food from? What kind of farm was it coming from? How are the workers treated? How are the animals treated if it's an animal food? The one thing I would say that bodybuilders do a pretty good job with is minimizing highly processed foods. Usually it's a very simplistic kind of minimally processed diet. But the other thing with bodybuilding, there's often not much variety. And that's another factor with our diet that we can incorporate a lot of variety. And that's really good for soil health and pollinators and our health and a lot of body building diets don't do that. So those are some of the big things I think of when I think of

traditional body building diets. Yeah. And so do you think the pursuit for like physical gains and strength and the pursuit for planetary health are mutually exclusive? And if not, how can we strive for both? What are the big principles? Yeah, I spend a lot of time thinking about this. I think there are some synergies between the two worlds. I mean, if somebody is at a very high level of physique or performance, then there might be some compromises at that point because you have to be so highly focused on improving yourself to win. But for most people, I think, interested in fitness and health and body recomposition, there are most definitely synergies between the two. And that's what the bulk of the book is about. And I kind of highlighted them when I was talking

about bodybuilding diets. So the big five areas for adjustments are finding your minimal effective dose of animal products, minimizing wasted food, supporting sustainable farms, eating a wide variety of minimally processed foods, and minimizing single-use plastics. Those are the big five behavioral adjustments we can all make. And in general, those adjustments not only benefit our health and longevity and body composition, but they also can have this cascade of effects throughout the food system, whether it's farm workers or animals or ecosystems. So I do think there's some synergies between the two. Yeah. And so one of the first things that you mentioned there was finding your minimal effective dose of animal products, which is a good way of putting it. So I guess the way you phrase that you're not

insinuating that everyone needs to go vegan in order to support the planet. Correct. I mean, I have a fondness for veganism. I would say I have like a vegan leaning diet. One of my gateways into thinking more about the food system was starting with my meat consumption, my animal food consumption. But when somebody is eating a vegan diet, they're eliminating animal products. And that is a big variable when it comes to sustainable food systems, no doubt. But as I've mentioned, there are other variables to consider. So it doesn't directly have any impact on wasted food. It doesn't directly have any influence on sourcing or farm worker treatment, variety, plastics, anything like that. So there

can be some trade-offs. I mean, veganism is not automatically the pinnacle of sustainable eating. I wouldn't say it's necessarily the diet to strive for either because there's also the big factor of our own health when it comes to sustainable food systems. And I don't, I'm not comfortable at this point, recommending a vegan diet for the masses and saying, this is the diet that everybody needs to follow at all times, no matter where you live or your age or your situation. I just don't think that's the case. It definitely is a good diet for some people, but it's not one I would say is one to strive for for everybody in all situations. and then a vegan diet whenever I'm having these conversations with people there's often the counter argument that oh but you know you need x tons of water to grow almonds and almond milk is more unsustainable than dairy and avocados are flown over like to the UK and all of that like

emission from that and air miles and etc etc and I'd be interested to know kind of your take on those points and how you navigate that. So for someone who is say, switching towards a more plant focused diet and going for plant milk alternatives, like how do you know whether the milk you're choosing is actually sustainably produced? I mean, the first thing I would say is there's, there's no diet that's perfect. So I think sometimes people will say there's no need adopting that diet because it's not, there's still these downsides. Every diet has a downside, ecologically speaking. There's a cost to every diet. So we're trying to just minimize that cost overall. Animal products are so resource intensive in general that simply eliminating them can go a long way towards creating a more sustainable diet. But there are certain foods that can require a lot of irrigation water, a lot of chemical inputs, a lot of transportation, and that's a cost. And I think we need to be aware of those. And if somebody's eating a vegan diet, being aware of those and

are there ways to minimize those costs? Sure. One of the golden rules of sustainable food production is pretty much any food can be a lot more sustainable. It depends on how it's raised and how it's grown. So there are almonds grown in the US, in California, that they flood the fields using a lot of irrigation water, a lot of chemical inputs, and it's pretty destructive for ecosystems overall. There are also farmers growing almonds in California and they use dry farming techniques. So they're very precise with the amount of irrigation water they use. It might be an organic farm, so they use very little chemical inputs or some that are just more friendly for pollinators. So they're both almonds, but they're different. And you

could extend that to avocados and on down the list. Yeah, but it's difficult for the consumer then to know kind of the impact that they're having. You're trying to make these positive changes and then you could be actually contributing unintentionally. Yeah, it can be a lot. When somebody's sitting down to eat and they're thinking, gosh, I want to be healthy. I want to look good. I want to be swole. I want to perform well in the gym and recover. I have to stay within my budget. I have to figure out what I can get at my grocery store in my neighborhood. There's all these things that people have to think about. And so when you add on top of that, the irrigation water of almonds or the conditions for animals, it's, I think, oftentimes too much for people.

And unless somebody's completely, they love this and they want to spend time thinking about it and investigating it, I don't necessarily think you have to always do a deep dive into every single ingredient. And that's what I hopefully convey in some of the book is if you generally adopt these five behavioral adjustments without getting too detailed, you're going to be moving in the right direction for an overall more sustainable food system. Yeah, I agree. The other kind of note that often comes up is where you source your animal products. So, you know, there's obviously a range of processing and different types of farming methods and things like that. So people often say, well, you know, it's fine if you go for grass fed or like locally produced animal or sourced animal products. Does that make a big difference in terms of carbon footprint?

It does make a big difference. Some of your listeners might hear this and get a little bit frustrated because there's a little bit of an argument in the sustainability world where, without boring your listeners, if you get really detailed and look at all the various inputs and outputs of animal products, you can pretty much make a case for local pastured, but you could also maybe make a case for some of the more intensive factory farmed. But that's more of a very detailed input output kind of viewpoint. and consider what we're trying to do with the food system and what we want to do moving forward into the future. I definitely think going for the 100% pasture option and local option is the better option because one of the big reasons is if you're buying an animal product and it's raised on

pasture exclusively, that pasture is very likely land that we can't grow crops directly for human consumption. So it's a very efficient use of that land. If we can't grow crops for humans and it's just pasture and forage, and we can allow cows to graze and eat some of the forage and sequester some carbon into that soil and then eventually get some sort of a nutrient dense food from them, whether it's meat or milk or whatever the farmer's producing. I think that's a fairly sustainable thing. I say all that, like I said, I think some people would kind of push back, but I do think it is the more sustainable option. Plus, I will also add, we're talking more about ecological metrics here.

But when you're also considering animal welfare and farm worker welfare, I am completely convinced that's the way to go would be a pastured option. Yeah, that's good to know. And then kind of thinking about meat alternatives, which have become really huge over the last couple of years in terms of like fake meat burgers and sausages and things like that how environmentally friendly are these products in general if you're comparing where most animal products come from where most meat comes from and plant-based meats plant-based meats will be more ecologically sustainable. That's my very broad general response to that. Now, can you come up with scenarios where that's not the case? Definitely.

If you're getting the best of the best locally sourced, pastured local meat, and then you compare that to the worst of the worst plant-based meat, where it's grown using soybeans and peas in a conventional way with a lot of chemical inputs and a lot of irrigation water, and they're transported very far. And then you have these other additives like coconut oil or palm oil and salt. And all of a sudden it kind of becomes not as convincing to say, yeah, go for the plant-based meat. So in general, I would say, yeah, they have a slightly more favorable outcome for the future of food, but you can definitely come up with scenarios where that's not the case. The one angle where I get most excited about

plant-based meats is minimizing the potential for antibiotic resistance. So the way we raise animals, especially in the US, it's just dense populations, very dependent on prophylactic antibiotics, and it's creating this situation of more and more antibiotic resistance. If we can really get away from that, and people start to eat more plant based meats instead, I think that can minimize the potential of antibiotic resistance in the future. Yeah, that's so important for human and animal health. I think what I really like is how you keep bringing it back to that intersection between planetary health and human health, because you just mentioned there, it's not always like for like. And when we're considering the environmental impact of meat-based alternatives

and things like that there is a huge variety of foods that come into that category you know there's a spectrum of how they're processed so some of them that like I've had to analyze as part of articles and things are so processed and are so full of additives and coconut oil as you mentioned which shoots up the fat content and things like that and you take a product which starts as a plant and it's become so far from that and if you're consuming it regularly may actually not be supportive of human health but then it's got this label on it that it's made of plants and it's vegan and it's supporting the planet. And so I guess my point from this is for people to be very aware that just because it's made of plants doesn't automatically mean it's

therefore healthy for you. Yeah. The level of processing in plant-based meats, yes, the original products were legumes and grains and seeds and things like that, but they are very far removed from eating a bowl of lentils and rice or something like that. I actually recommend to people not only finding your minimal effective dose of animal products, but finding your minimal effective dose of plant meats as well. I think the lower amount you can eat, probably the better and more sustainable. Yeah. But also you can make your own veggie burgers or vegan burgers from lentils and brown rice and things like that. And it's not that difficult. And it tastes good, in my opinion. Yeah. I mean, nine times out of 10, that's what I would prefer and gravitate towards anyways.

So yeah, I mean, then you get the best of pretty much every world there yeah okay well i think we've probably you know convinced people that they can support the planet through what they eat but i think there's a lot of people who may be skeptical that moving towards a more plant-focused diet will run the risk of them losing their gains or any muscle building potential. So what advice do you have for people who are in that kind of category? It's possible. I'm not going to lie. I mean, plant foods can be very filling. And if somebody's training quite intensely, you need to eat a lot of food. And if you get really full and you don't eat a lot of food, you can lose weight, lose muscle mass. So I think the big thing I always come back to is making sure you're eating enough food overall. places or protein supplements in certain places, or maybe even foods that aren't as fiber rich and filling in certain places like bars or something like that, whatever you can do to keep your

overall intake up. I think that can be helpful and go a long way to maintaining muscle mass and keep it simple. I mean, wherever, if you're eating three meals a day, how can you maybe add a little bit more into those three meals? If you're willing to add another meal, how can you do that? Maybe it's post-workout or kind of a window of time where it's not going to be overly filling for your body to handle. But it's possible. It's possible you could lose mass, but with I think some adjustments, you can prevent that loss. Yeah, absolutely. And as you mentioned, like supplementation, vegan supplementation actually has improved a lot in the last couple of years, not only in terms of taste and texture, because generally they don't taste very good or

very grainy, but they have improved. And then, and also in terms of the quality of the protein as well. So yeah, I think, although I'm not like a big pusher of supplementation, I think it has its place. And especially in especially if you're a very active person and you're on a plant-based diet, I think it's a sensible thing to include. Yeah. I think it's extremely helpful. And like you said, protein powders have come... I had my first protein powder when I was 14 and it was bad. It was really bad. They used to be unflavored or it would just come in like vanilla or chocolate and it tasted like the medicinal supplements that you take to gain weight. Yes, very medicinal.

Flavor was not a concern for the companies at that point. No. And now you can get like birthday cake. Yeah, it's interesting. The other kind of thing when transitioning towards a more plant-based diet and I'm and when I say like more plant-based diet I'm not necessarily meaning veganism but like for a lot of people that might be going from a diet that is very meat heavy to reducing the meat a little bit and then increasing the plants a little bit and when you do that you're naturally

increasing the fiber because of like all the legumes and pulses in there. And that can cause a lot of gut issues for people, which can almost hinder their process or make them more reluctant to do this because they're like, I feel sluggish. I feel bloated. I'm in pain. What kind of tips do you advise for people when they are coming up against this? Three things. Take it slow, experiment, and get to know FODMAPs. So first off, taking it slow. If you're starting to include more legumes for the first time, don't feel like you have to go from none to like two or three cups a day overnight. Start with a couple of spoonfuls, then gradually increase to a half cup or a cup. Allow your GI tract some time

to adapt. It can get better at digesting and processing legumes. So start slow. Experimentation. If you try one type of bean or pulse and you notice just a lot of bloating and discomfort, try another one. I've noticed a lot of individuality with legumes. So some people do really well with one, but they don't do well with another, even though the fiber might be the same. So just experiment, try some different ones. And then finally, get to know, if you continue to have problems, get to know the world of FODMAPS. So FODMAPS, F-O-D-M-A-P-S, it stands for this group of fermentable carbohydrates that some people can be really sensitive to. And when you can learn the different categories of FODMAPS, you can make really easy swaps that can help. So instead of relying on sweet potatoes, you can do more potatoes, and that can be an easy swap with less FODMAPS. You can change from cashews to almonds, and that can mean you're consuming less FODMAPs. And down the list, there's a lot of different adjustments you

could potentially make that could help. Yeah. So we use that over here as well for people with Irritable Bowel Syndrome. But again, you don't need to have the diagnosis of IBS to learn and implement some of the principles. I'd just be cautious if you were going, getting too bogged down about the fault maps in your food because it can become quickly restrictive and just be a bit of a pain in the ass as well. Yeah, it is a pain in the ass. That's true.

Okay. One of the other things that we mentioned as part of the principles is food waste and of all the food produced in the world it's like a third of it goes to waste which is like when you sit back and think about that a third of the food goes to waste and for me that that's really hard to believe and i'm wondering like how are we doing that? Like, what are the main ways that we're wasting food? Is along the food supply chain. In developing countries, we see a lot more food being wasted early in the food supply chain. So on farms, during transport, that's where the bulk of food is wasted. Maybe they just didn't have labor to harvest the crop, or there were pests, or they didn't have a truck to transport the food, something like that.

In more developed countries like the UK, the US, Canada, we see food waste taking place at the other end of the food supply chain. So at grocery stores, at restaurants and at home. And there are a couple of big reasons for this. And one of the reasons is we eat a lot more fresh food in developed countries. So fresh vegetables, fruits, meat, seafood, dairy, eggs, and these foods have a short shelf life. So if you buy them and you don't use them, then they can go bad and you have to throw them away. Another reason is there can be confusion around expiration dates printed on foods.

Some people don't know if that's a food safety thing or a quality thing or a taste thing. So food might be perfectly fine, but they might see a date printed and just get nervous and throw it away unnecessarily. And the other big factor is food might be perfectly fine, perfectly safe, but it's a leftover and somebody just discards it. And people just don't eat as many leftovers as they used to. And I think when I step back and think about this, I suspect it's due to our disconnect from food in developed countries. So not as many of us are working in agriculture, so we don't see the time and resources that go into food production. So I think we might be a little bit quicker to discard a food without giving it much thought versus in those developing countries. I mean, the idea of a food, making it to your kitchen and without giving it much thought versus in those developing countries. I mean, the idea of a food making it to your kitchen and then throwing it away if you don't absolutely have to is like unheard of because more of those folks are working in agriculture.

So I think a big part of it is just kind of our disconnect from food production as well. Yeah. And I guess, you know, if most people listening to this, like are in a place of privilege where food isn't like scarce. And so when you have this like abundance of food and accessibility to supermarkets and things like that, like, it doesn't seem so bad to throw away, you know, the last of a slice of bread or whatever it might be. And yeah, I do think, you know, there's like this disconnect between what it actually is that we're getting rid of. And I'm not really sure if people are acutely aware of the magnitude of food waste. I think more and more it's getting spoken about.

And there's apps available over here like Too Good To Go and another one called Oleo and things like that, where you can essentially get food that's going to get thrown away. And there's also apps where people can put up food on that they have in their home that they're not using. So it could be like the ends of carrots or whatever, and your neighbor can come pick them up and use them. So that's interesting. Well, yeah. And it's a big deal because I think when you bring up food waste, a lot of people kind of think, yeah, that's not great, but does it really matter for the planet? And it does because all of the resources that went into producing that food, the water, the land, the labor, when you throw the food out, you're throwing the resources out. And then the other, on the flip side of that, when you actually send a food to the landfill,

it breaks down and releases greenhouse gases. So it's like a, it's a double whammy. It's, it's bad news for the, for the flip side of that when you actually send a food to the landfill it breaks down and releases greenhouse gases so it's like a it's a double whammy it's it's bad news for the for the planet yeah absolutely and obviously in this conversation we've focused really heavily on food and you're very well placed and researched in the space of the environment and sustainability and there are some really there's some huge things that we do as humans that contribute to our carbon footprint. And I would love to just kind of touch on some other big things that we could potentially think about doing in order to reduce that. The three big factors that I consider when thinking about the future of the planet is everything we've been talking about food, And then the other two big areas are electricity and transportation. So however,

you can move towards renewable energy, whether that's just contacting your energy provider and saying, switch me over to more of a share of renewable energy. That goes a long way. And then transportation, I mean, whether it's walking, biking, mass transit, instead of driving or flying, that makes a difference. I mean, those are the other two big areas when it comes to our overall footprint as human beings. I mean, the undercurrent with all these two is population. I'm reluctant to ever talk about population because there has been quite a leveling off in many developed countries of population growth. So I think we're heading in a more sustainable direction. But that's, I'll mention it. It's there. People use resources. So just being

responsible with our contribution to the population of the world. That was a very pragmatic way of saying it. One of the other chapters that you touch on in the book is movement and how that supports the planet. And I guess I find that really interesting. And how do you see movement and physical activity and its relationship on the planet? Yeah, two of my favorite ways of blending these two worlds is volunteering and purposeful exercise. So with volunteering, I, for many, many years, when I'm building my workouts for the week and looking at my workout schedule, I'll have a day of volunteering.

Oftentimes for me, it's been on farms and gardens and things like that because I'm trying to learn more about that. But if you spend a workout day volunteering, it accomplishes a lot. It not only challenges you to potentially move your body in a different way. So it's like an active recovery day almost. Not all volunteer positions would do that. I mean, I guess you could be like in a library sitting in the back, like entering data or something. But if it's maybe on a farm, for example, or in a garden, you're moving your body. So you're physically active. You're also outside. So you're benefiting from fresh air and sunlight. Plus you can be around like-minded people, build some closer connections with people, which I think a lot of us could

benefit from. So overall, it's a win-win for mental and physical health. And the other suggestion I make to people is trying to have some sort of purposeful exercise. So if you like to spend a day maybe riding a stationary cycle or walking on a treadmill or something like that, I think that's great. Feel free to continue doing it. I do it occasionally. It's great. Listen to podcasts, whatever. But instead of that, sometimes you could swap that out and walk to the grocery store that day. So instead of walking on the treadmill, walk to the store, walk home. So you minimize your driving and you're getting physical activity. I know these sound, I always am a little hesitant. I feel like they're like in a pamphlet you'd find at the doctor's office. It's like old school. Walk to the store. But collectively,

if we did more of these things, I think it would have a win-win for us and for the planet. I agree. I think I'm often in this position, well, similar to you, although coming at it from an angle of just getting people to move more and like incorporating activity into normal everyday things that you're doing anyway almost like habit stacking I think is a great way of doing it and like one of my favorite things when I was working at the hospital was you know once a week just running home and that was one way that my commute I could tick off my commute and not use transport even though I was just getting the tube. But another way I was getting outside and also I was moving my body.

And so I was doing all these things. And it's such a small measure. And if we could do more of those kind of things, it goes a long way. Yeah. And another side note to this too, is I think sometimes with people, especially people who maybe notice that they find it difficult to kind of muster up motivation for exercise, when you incorporate some of these bigger than self goals or greater good goals, I think it can give people a lot of extra incentive to do these things because it's not just their own health and their own world, it's accomplishing things beyond yourself. And I think that can be pretty, pretty powerful. Yeah, that's a really good point. This has been really interesting. But to wrap up, I've got three questions for you that we ask every guest, which I already gave you the heads

up about. So hopefully you have some ideas. No biggie. The first one's easy, though. What's the number one takeaway you want people to take from this particular episode? And I think that captures a lot of what we talked about today. When you step back and get real about your values, one of the top ways to live out those values is through our food choices. That's so good. I love that quote. The second question is, if you could go back and give your 18-year-old self one piece of advice, what would it be? So my 18 year old self probably wasn't open to advice from my 40 year old self. It would, I wouldn't have been. Um, so I would say two bits of advice. Uh, I'd say start practicing yoga now because it'll very likely benefit your mental health. Cause you have a very sensitive nervous system. And I'd also say, spend more time listening to Jay-Z. Because Jay-Z was becoming really popular when I was 18. And I didn't give him enough credit. So if I if I could go back in time, I'd say, listen to more of Jay-Z's albums.

Very talented. For any reason other than like, because of his artistry talent or because of the lyrics? So I am a lifelong hip hop fan. I absolutely love it. And Jay-Z is one of those artists who, as he was becoming more popular, I just kind of brushed him off. But the more I've read about him and read some of his lyrics and his life, he's a really admirable person and he's gone through a lot and he's told some really important stories in his songs. So I think I would tell myself to go back and spend more time learning from him and his lyrics and appreciating his music. Amazing. I wasn't expecting that. I have the same birthday as Jay-Z, so I have this fondness for him. Wow. Yeah, I know. December 4th.

And the final question is, what is one book that you recommend everyone reads and why? I could give you 10 books. I'll give you one because this book really had a big influence on me starting to see this coexistence between sustainability and health, our health and planetary health. And the book is called Pharmacology and it's Pharm, F-A-A-R-M ecology. It's by Dr. Daphne Miller. If you're new to thinking about this, talking about why soil health matters for our health and like connecting the dots between all but between those worlds. Amazing. I love that. What good answers. I don't know why you were fretting. They were great. Thank you so much for your time today. It's been so fascinating and such an important conversation. If people do want to

learn more from you, and obviously you've got your book out, where can they find you and where can they get the book? Yeah, you can check out my website, ryandandrews.com. I have information about the book there. And if you're interested in checking the book out, I have a promo code, foodmedic. And you can get 15% off of the book. Amazing. Yeah, and from the website,

I have some social media links and things like that. So good. And I have read the book and I 100% endorse it. So definitely check it out. Thank you. Okay, guys, I hope that's left you with some food for thought and offered some solutions on little changes that you can make to support your health and the health of the planet. If you did enjoy the episode, you know the drill. Please rate, review and share the podcast with someone you think will enjoy it too that's all from me until next time