The Fumblerooski Podcast - Sudden Death -Ep 149 The Fumblerooski Podcast

Episode Date: January 7, 2023

Did the NFL make the right call with their recent AFC playoff adjustments? Will the outcome of Titans @ Jaguars indicate who controls the AFC South in the coming years? Who has the edge in a Lions @ Packers NFC North showdown? Who deserves the postseason most between the Patriots, Dolphins, and Steelers? Adam Wright, CJ Medeiros, and Justin Tucker host special guest Patrick Edwards to debate these topics and more!

Here's Edelman broken up and the pass is no sign yet. Edelman comes down with a football and they're saying it's a catch. It's a catch! It's a catch! Side- a catch. Oh! It's a catch! Side-line! Touchdown! Unbelievable! Swings it way down the field.

The walk-out! Sammy Watt takes for the touchdown! We welcome you to the Fumble Ruski podcast by Power88 and Secret Weapon Consulting. Well, Damar Hamlin is awake and responsive, which is a beautiful, beautiful thing to hear about. And with that, um, thoughts and prayers continue to go out to DeMar Hamlin and his family, uh, for wishing, wishing him a speedy recovery. But with that, um, we are going to resume our regularly scheduled NFL content. We're going to talk about the NFL owners agreeing on a neutral site for the AFC Championship for certain scenarios. The Jaguars-Titans win-and-in matchup. Whoever wins that game gets the AFC South for week 18. There's also, we're going to touch on the Patriots, Dolphins, and Steelers fighting for that final playoff spot in week 18. And joining us to talk

about all of these things, we have special guest, Pat Edwards, student at Marist uh at Marist College and my personal friend Pat Edwards Pat how are you doing man I'm good how about you I'm doing great thanks for coming on to the show we have some new listeners since the last time you were on which was how how long ago a little while ago. Yeah. Long enough ago that the Packers were actually good. Yeah, and we were previewing that season. I believe that was right before the 2021 season, correct? I think so.

I was angry about a championship loss, and it went downhill very quickly. Yeah, man. very quickly yeah man well uh would you be able to give brief uh a brief uh introduction for some of our new listeners i'm pat i am from new england and i annoy everybody being a packers man that's pretty much pretty much sums it up all right well we are going to jump right into it and so so week 17 bills at bengals uh is not to be resumed um an alternate uh and there was a alternate solution agreed upon by league owners uh so the afFC championship is to be played on a neutral site for certain matchups. So 14 and three chiefs versus 13 and three Bengals, 13 and three bills. So all of this kind of hinges also on some of the outcomes for week 18. The 13 and four chiefs

versus 12 and four bills and 13 and four chiefs versus 12 and four Bengals. So all three of those matchups would be on a neutral site. If, uh, that would be the AFC championship matchups. Um, however, a bills Bengals AFC championship would be in Buffalo. And furthermore, the Bengals have been crowned AFC North champions, but if the Ravens win their matchup versus the Bengals, their wildcard matchup location will be determined by a coin flip. So it's also worth noting that the Bengals were the only team to object among league owners for this possible solution.

It was mainly on this coin flip issue and also on the fact that if the Bills face the Bengals again in the AFC Championship, then that would be in Buffalo. So, guys, I'll start with you, Pat. Did the league make the right call with this AFC playoffs plan? I don't know if there was a right call. And there's no good solution. And part of the problem is that this happened so late in the season. This happened in week two. We have bi-weeks to figure out how to re-finagle the schedule.

There's no way to do it now. Ultimately, I think if any other solution was implemented, Buffalo was going to be happy. Obviously, with this solution, Cincinnati is not going to be happy, and that's understandable. But the NFL did come out and say there really isn't enough time. If they were to redo the game, they'd have to push the season back and cost everybody

else momentum. I think part of the problem is the fact that it happened in week 17, and there's really no way to keep everybody happy. Obviously, the biggest thing is that DeMar Hamlin is okay, but trying to salvage the season beyond that point, somebody was going to get angry, and they just chose Cincinnati. Yeah, that's a fair point. All right, Tuck. You're muted, Justin. Yeah, you're muted, dude. Sorry, I keep muting myself because there's cars passing by.

Overall, I think it was, regardless of what was going to happen, like Pat said, somebody was going to be upset. I'm personally glad it was the Bengals. No bias to that at all? No, of course not. I'm unbiased as there is. I never hold grudges. But it was just an unfortunate situation for all parties involved.

Thankfully that DeMar Hamlin is okay, but it's just an interesting situation as a whole. Now that we have a neutral site for an AFC championship game, I find it very fascinating to see how everything pans out in the end. I find it weird that even though if Buffalo and the Bengals meet in the AFC championship game, it'll still be Buffalo. But other than that, I think overall it's okay. I don't care if the Bengals are upset about it. The game got canceled either way, and they ended up AFC North champions. But I think then the NFL did the best they could with what they had to go on.

All right. CJ? the NFL did the best they could with what they had to go on. All right. CJ? There's... The Bengals are obviously getting shafted, but that's just kind of how it goes, you know? And, you know, you hate to say it,

but there's an old adage that says when you try to please everyone, you please no one. And that's basically what's going on with the NFL. No matter how you shuffled it out, whether it's neutral site or not coin flip or not, no matter what they did, someone was going to get the short end of the stick.

And it just happened to be Cincy. And I think, and some people are saying, Oh, but the game's as important as one man's life. And I'm like, you know what? I agree. And the most important thing is that Tamar Hamlin's okay.

It truly is. However, you can't diminish what Cincy's feeling here. I truly believe Cincy has every right to be upset. But unfortunately, that's just how it goes. And hopefully the NFL will be, you know, we'll take this, learn from it, and forbid some tragedy like this happens again. Maybe they can react a little differently, but let's just hope, like I said, this never happens again.

And there is one thing I would add on. If it is a neutral site, then, and if let's just say it is Bills, Bengals, Chiefs, and I would say move it to like a stadium in the AFC South, so that way AFC East or West or North fans don't just crowd into one stadium to try to throw the other team off. That's just me. Yeah, so the way I look at it i have i don't have i think the more i've thought about this solution

the less of an issue i've had with it because it kind of it accommodates every team except the bengals and i would have had a better i would have liked it a lot more had they have included the bengals and the bill the beng Bills potential matchup on neutral ground. Because if you look at how it played out, if the Bengals won that game, the Week 17 game, this is all hypotheticals at this point. If they had won, then the Bengals move up to the two seed and the Bills are knocked all the way down to three, which is significant because that would have given an AFC championship the Bengals, that would have been them hosting. But on the other end, if the Bills won that game,

then that would have been, they would have hosted. So you kind of have to put that on neutral ground as well on the coin flip that is kind of weird um for the nfc north excuse me uh af the afc north who wins that uh who gets that uh that you know that wild card matchup but it's the wild card so it's not as important but it kind of is important. Um, but I mean, that, that's the only issue that I have is that like, what, what happened that they weren't able to include that game. And it just seemed like, it seemed that they were trying too hard to, um, that they were trying way too hard to please the bills in this situation. Understandably so because, um, they, um, because of what happened to, uh, to their young player, but still you kind of have to keep, when we're

talking about these schedules, you have to, you have to keep it all on the field. And if they could have, they could have included the Bengals in this situation. Um, when it comes to facing the, when it comes to facing the bills and a potential matchup and they did it and they really could have, I don't, I don't see the issue with it, but that's kind of, that's kind of my two cents on that. But I did want to move on, change gears and touch on a matchup that I've been kind of i mean it's not it's it doesn't have too much of a bearing on the playoff um on on the on the uh playoff picture but jaguars titans so what was interesting about this is no matter what happened in week 17 week 18 would be the winner take all

game for that division and they would they would host a playoff game and we're going to talk about all the ins and outs for that matchup don't go anywhere this is the fumble ruski podcast Here's Edelman broken up and the pass is no sign yet. Edelman comes down with a football and they're saying it's a catch. It's a catch! It's a catch! Sideline! Touchdown! Unbelievable! This is the Fumble Ruski podcast by Power 88 and Secret Weapon Consulting. Adam Wright, CJ Medeiros, Justin Tucker, special guest Patrick Edwards. So, this is a tale of two different teams going in two different directions, right?

So the Jaguars started 3 and seven. They're now eight and eight. The Titans started seven and three. They are now seven and nine. So in this matchup for week 18, it's going to, it's literally winner take all whoever wins this matchup winds up, um, getting the AFC South and only that, hosting a playoff game. So guys, I'll start with you, Pat, again. Could the winner of Titans-Jaguars be an indication of who will control the AFC South for the coming years? I'm not sure, and I say that because we need to see what the Titans do with Ryan Tannehill after the season he could still be under contract for 2023 he could still be

under contract for 2024 and the Titans are a much better team when Ryan Tannehill is under center obviously Malik Willis has done very little so little in fact that he's going to be on the sideline this weekend but But who's to say whether Ryan Tannehill will be coming back next year? That would have a far greater effect than anything in this game. I will say the Jaguars are the team with the momentum. The Jaguars are the team with the young quarterback. The Jaguars are the team that have the competent coach. The Jaguars are the team that look like they have the brighter future. Five years down the road, I think there will be too many roster changes to pinpoint this to one game.

But this could certainly give the Jaguars the momentum, particularly if their roster stays healthy, their roster stays intact, and if Ryan Tannehill doesn't come back to the Titans next year. All right. Tuck? I'm not sure if it will have any precedents going forward. I got to see who the quarterback is depending on who wins. Because if I see Trevor Lawrence in the playoffs and he does well, then yes, it gives me precedence to believe that, yeah,

I believe the Jaguars going forward can reign over this, at this moment in time, weak AFC South division. But if it's the Titans, it's kind of like same old, same old, I guess, because Ryan Tannehill's going to be under center. Derrick Henry's going to be running the ball 30 to 40 times a game, because quite frankly, they don't have a competent quarterback to pass it 20 to 30 times a game. I respect Ryan Tannehill, but they don't even trust him right now. So it's either Derrick Henry or Bust for them right now. They have quality weapons, but that defense is not as healthy as it once was. All in all, it really comes down to can the Jacksonville defense stop Derrick Henry? And I'm not sure if they're there yet. They did stop him this year.

I mean, I say stop. They did beat him, but they didn't really stop him. So I don't think it has any bearing going forward, but it'll be an interesting thing to see how this pans out and how it'll affect the division and who wins it. All right. CJ? wins it all right cj i would argue yes because as you know within the nfl a lot of these things it comes down to the quarterback and i'm sorry ryan tannehill cannot be your qb of the future i when i gave him that ridiculous deal i said they shouldn have, and now he's on the tail end of his career.

Malik Willis, who was once touted as a first-rounder, I believe is taking the third round, and rightfully so, I do not believe is the answer. Because when he's played, he's been very bad. In fact, everyone says Lamar jackson has haters well yeah but if basically if what the haters said i'm trying to think of like how to word this but like every negative perception of lamar jackson if you made that a person it would be malik willis and then and they don't trust him to the point where they're having josh to start as quarterback. So, yeah, but Jacksonville, you've got your quarterback. You've got Trevor Lawrence. Lawrence has shown that he can lead.

And if he wins a playoff game, that's great. I mean, you don't expect him to do anything now, but he's starting to put it together. And, I mean, look what other teams in their division, the Colts, who go from bridge quarterback to bridge quarterback every year. I mean, I don't know. Maybe if they draft someone, then maybe. But I think the Titans, if you remove Derrick Henry from that team,

they're a bottom 10 team. Ooh. I'm sorry. It's true. Like, you know, they traded away A.J. Brown, and then they just got that much worse. Their defense is hit or miss. And then there's just the Texans, I guess, that are not going to be good for a while.

But, yeah, I would say that this is like the ball is in Jacksonville's court now. You know, it's their game to lose. And if they win, then I think I'm not going to say crown the new champ, but they're just going to be that much closer. Okay. So the way I look at it, the rest of this Titans offense and their whole team around them is – that I'm not too worried about. Their wide receiver core is probably going to need a year to get their feet onto them. Traylon Burks looks like, I mean,

he has some potential. Robert Woods, I believe he might have something left in him, but he's coming off the ACL tear. So if he does still have anything left in the tank, it's going to be, he's going to show it next year. but it all comes down to the quarterback situation and not just ryan tannahill malik willis it clearly looks like that that they have lost complete confidence in him but even if they do draft a new quarterback it still usually takes a couple of years for them to develop and to be able to build a team good enough around them. So to that I say, yeah, if the Jaguars win this game, then I think this is their division to lose for the next couple of years until the Titans can find a good enough quarterback

and to be able to develop him in the years after that, then it's going to be the Jaguars division to lose. And they've done such a good job with building up their team, basically from the ashes, which was the Saxonville Jaguars back in 2017, when they had their guy, Blake Bortles and the defense who was basically carrying them. And, you know, that was really, that was really their, their glory days. And they've been able to build their team from scratch up until this point. And I would say they're the only spot that they really need to work on next, uh, for this next season and beyond is their defense. Their defense looks good, but they could use some pieces in that

secondary i would say uh maybe a new corner they could draft in the first round but trevor lawrence has proven he's shown he's shown flashes that he could be i mean i am not exaggerating when i say that he has the potential to be mentioned in the same breath as the likes of a Josh Allen or a Joe Burrow. And depending on how good he winds up being, maybe even Patrick Mahomes as well. So he has had an incredible year, just in the sense that he's really developed. And I would say that this Jaguars team is at the up and up, and they are no longer the little brother to the Tennessee Titans in that division. I got a question.

Yep. If Jacksonville wins and Tennessee loses, and it looks pretty decisively because the offense can't move the ball, do you think Tennessee would draft a quarterback in the first round? That's actually a good question. It depends on where their draft spot is because there are quarterbacks in this draft, but it's towards the front. So if they have a pick in the top, let's say, I'd have to look at –

it depends because I thought it was going to be the quarterbacks we're going to go one two three but it looks like some some mock drafts have quarterbacks going in the top 10 15 so yeah they do and they're wrong yeah sorry i didn't want to jump in there but i'm uh i'm trying to see where the titans are right now but i don't think they're wrong yeah sorry i didn't want to jump in there but i'm uh i'm trying to see where the titans are right now but i don't think they're even in the top 20 yeah like they i think what about buying a quarterback who do you have who do you have in mind for buying like trading for a quarterback or signing one trading or signing and the only

reason i ask i don't think that the quarterback market is going to be necessarily fantastic but they pulled ryan tannahill out of miami and ryan tannahill had one or two fairy tale seasons where they did very well in the immediate future and then he started to tail off. Do they pull an Indianapolis Colts-type move that have a greater degree of success where they can pry a guy from another franchise and maybe resurrect a career? Not to say that Baker Mayfield or Carson Wentz is good enough to be that guy,

but do they sign that guy, pull off a fairytale season or two with a guy like Derrick Henry in the backfield and be able to stay on top of jacksonville that guy stays healthy and performs yeah tuck mentioned tuck just mentioned a name derrick carr if they were to trade for him um it just depends on it would just depend on their price because um i'm not sure how much they would want that first round pick because I feel like Carr is at a point where he still is kind of a franchise quarterback. So he would fetch a hefty price. So how much do they need that first round pick and how much, and more specifically, how much confidence do they have that Traylon Burks and woods can uh bounce back for better seasons next year

um because that's that's what's going to indicate whether or not derrick carr will have success over there um but yeah that's that's a fair that's a fair question is can they uh can they can they go out and look for a short-term answer and try to find maybe a bridge until they find a draft where they're like, okay, this is the guy. We're going to take him. And thank you, Derek Carr, for everything you've done, but we have to move on to our next guy. But that's something.

What's up? As it sits now, the Titans have pick 11 because they had one of Philly's first rounders. Remember? Because didn't Philly, the Saints or whatever, I remember what the particulars were going to trade, and then they got that picked during the A.J. Brown trade. So the Titans are at pick 11.

But here's my thing. So as you know i i i do like the draft and don't say it all right i'm not gonna say it i was gonna but i decided not to but yeah 11 if you're out of the top 10 you have no shot at bryce young or cj stroud maybe you gamble gamble on will levis leave us how pronounce it? I'm not high on him. But I don't really see anyone being there. I would say you punt next season, kick the can down the road, or maybe get Caleb Williams or Drake May in the next draft.

My point is, if you want a franchise quarterback, you ain't getting it this offseason or next year. Yeah, so if they were to trade their first round pick this year and maybe package in a second, then maybe someone who's looking to trade up, you find a way to trade for a first round pick that's earlier in the draft, maybe in the next one or the year after that, that's that's earlier in the draft maybe in the next the next one or the year after that something like that but you also have to make sure that the quarterback you're fishing for in that draft is the guy because it's hard to just you know just take a quarterback and then um then hope that hope that he turns into something i mean that's that's the criticism

i had for kenny pickett when they took when the Steelers took a quarterback just because they needed one, you know. And whether or not he turns into something is another conversation because he's actually been fairly decent in the past couple weeks. But, like, you don't want to just – because it is a thing where first-round quarterbacks are taken and they just wind up being god-awful once they get into the league. Like Zach Wilson. Zach Wilson, Josh Rosen comes to mind. What did he say? Like 15 mistakes were taken before me? Or it was like there was nine mistakes made ahead of me or however many.

Yeah, no, that's funny and he turned out to be so much of a bust that they had to go back into the first round the next draft and go like okay we're taking kyler murray so that that was an interesting one uh but you guys have trey lance hasn't proven himself in san francisco even though mr irrelevant has there's another one yeah that's that's one and i don't know what they're gonna do about him because like they he hasn't had much of a chance to pan out but he also in the in this limited chance that he's had he hasn't really he hasn't impressed and judging by the fact that they haven't really been committal. They,

they haven't really committed to them. Something's going on in those practices that they don't like. Like there's something they are seeing because they, the coaching staff sees more of them. That's, that's obvious. So if they're seeing something in him, then I mean,

the fact that they took, they spent a number three overall pick on a quarterback. That's, I mean, that's what I'm saying. Like, I mean, you, you have to make sure you're, you're committing to the right guy in the right draft. And I don't know, like they, like there were, there were, so there was Zach Wilson and Trey Lance who were taken with two top three picks, but Justin Fields was taken number 11, and so far in his NFL career, he's looking a lot better than either of those guys. So you just kind of have to be smart about these drafts.

But is there anything else we wanted to touch on with this, um, with this topic before we move on? I'm good. All right. Well, um, so we're going to change gears, but we're going to, we're going to remain in the AFC for now. Um, so it's not only this matchup between the Titans and Jaguars that has a lot at stake, but there is still three teams who are fighting for that final playoff spot, which is the Patriots, Dolphins, and Steelers. So we're going to debate which one deserves it more and what implications that could have for the future for these teams so that's next this is the fumble ruski podcast

here's edelman broken up in the past is no sign yet edelman comes down with a football they're saying it's a catch And the pass is no sign yet. Edelman comes down with a football. They're saying it's a catch. It's a catch. What? It's a catch. Side-line.

Touchdown. Unbelievable. Swings it way down the field to Watkins. Sammy Watkins for the touchdown! You are listening to the Fumble Rooski Podcast by Power 88 and Secret Weapon Consulting. Adam Wright, CJ Medeiros, Justin Tucker, special guest Patrick Edwards. So, the Patriots, Dolphins, and Steelers are fighting for that final playoff spot,

and Week 18 is going to be indicative on how that is going to turn out. So the Patriots make it in if they win. However, if they don't win, they're not necessarily eliminated. If the Jaguars beat the Titans and and the dolphins lose to the jets and the steelers lose to the browns then that then the patriots get in the dolphins are kind of the same are kind of in the same boat except they do need to win they need to win their game. They need the Patriots to lose and the Steelers to lose as well. Steelers, it's kind of the same way. They need the Patriots and Dolphins to lose.

So it's a shot in the dark for a lot of these teams, but one of them has to make it. So whether or not we think one is going to make it is one thing, who deserves it more? Because it is the last playoff spot one thing, who deserves it more? Because it is the last playoff spot. Pat, I'll start with you. I think the obvious answer is none of them.

But I think all three of them are in very similar scenarios, and all three of them got there in entirely different ways. A lot of people had a lot of expectation for the Patriots after they made the playoffs last year. After Mac Jones made a Pro Bowl, was an Offensive Rookie of the Year candidate, a lot of people expected a lot of things out of this Patriots offense in particular that has largely fallen flat and has had a couple of embarrassing losses. If you reverse that Bengals loss, you reverse that Raiders loss alone, this week is nowhere near the fiasco that it's going to be. You compare that with the Dolphins, who've been streaky as all hell. They start off

3-0, then they're 3-3, then they're 8-3, now they're 8-8. Do they start to get hot at the right time? I don't know, but it certainly beats where Pittsburgh is, where Pittsburgh's just kind of been on the back burner all season. Some way, somehow, Mike Tomlin is still fighting to keep his winning season streak intact. But I think that the most likely thing, the Patriots are going to play the Bills, who have a lot to play for right now, and are the best team out of any that these three are facing this week. I think the most likely scenario is that the Dolphins get in, but I don't know. I think this week could be a toss-up in any way.

I think that the Dolphins are so much of a question mark as to when they get streaky. I think that the Browns are so much of a question mark with Deshaun Watson coming in halfway through the season and playing subpar football compared to where he was before he sat out for a year and a half and i think that the patriots are just who knows every week i think the dolphins are the most likely to get in but i wouldn't necessarily go place a bet uh that that would happen you're muted

that's my thoughts those are my take yeah i mean you said it with the this being a complete fiasco i mean like you you could see any of these teams making it in and the fact that even if the patriots lose that they can still get in just underscores how hectic this whole situation is but talk i hate this question so much because i really wanted the ravens to win yes the sunday night just so this wouldn't be a damn question but now that we're here i can't stand it i can't stand the steelers are still in this i can't stand the fact that they actually have a chance to be in the playoffs now. It bothers me. The Patriots don't deserve it. The Dolphins don't deserve it.

The Steelers deserve it. But I'll be damned if I say the Steelers, so I'm going Patriots here. You guys need to make the playoffs just so that team doesn't make the playoffs. The Steelers have been dealing with adversity nonstop, with TJ Watt going going out with a multitude of quarterbacks under center with the multitude of injuries that they've had all season then for them to turn it around for them to actually have a chance to actually make the playoffs is a testament to how good Mike Tomlin actually is a coach and that bothers me because I don't like Mike Tomlin or the Steelers to be honest I think they deserve it the most but I'm most, but I'm too much of a Ravens fan to

acknowledge it. So I want the Patriots to win mainly because they've been doing all this without an OC and they're still in playoff hopes. So I need the Patriots to win. Please bring this home, Patriots. You're on an episode with two Patriots fans who disagree with you. CJ, tell them that he's wrong. Look, I don't want the Pats to go to the playoffs because if they do, they're going to get curb stomped, and it's just going to be embarrassing. I'd say right now punt the season. You get a better pick. Get a real OC, then you come back next year.

None of these teams deserve to win. Mike Tomlin is just – I mean, he's a decent coach, but I don't know. I'm just not sold on the Steelers. None of these teams are going to go win the Super Bowl, and none of these teams deserve it. They're all fraudulent. And yes, I said Miami's fraudulent. And for those who don't know, the Dolphins organization is extremely unhappy with Mike McDaniel. runs the risk of potentially being fired if they lose,

which I personally think would be an overreaction, even though he's horribly overrated as a head coach. But yeah, Mike McDaniel's not even safe. And I mean, the Patriots don't have an offensive coordinator. The Steelers are just a Frankenstein's monster of random names just stapled together. It's just none of these teams deserve to win and i can safely say it literally doesn't matter so what's your what's your answer probably miami because buffalo because see here's the deal buffalo is going to crush new england

because they're so fueled by love for demar hamlin that and let's face it, the league will not let Buffalo lose. And I mean, the Steelers, eh, I guess, maybe. But I think it's going to be Miami because you're playing the Joe Flacco-led Jets. And I swear if Miami loses to the Jets, heads need to roll. Joe Flacco. They have their third string option as well skylar thompson so and there is one last thing i'd like to bring up it's basically uh it's funny because tua seemed to have silenced all the doubters and i just think it's funny how now there's new questions

about him now whether or not he can play but whether or not he can go five minutes without getting a hit to his brain that man needs to retire because let me tell you miami has killed him all right let me tell you why miami deserves it the most it wasn't long ago when the dolphins were eight and three and we were looking at this team as not only a contender for the number one seed, but also potentially a team to represent the AFC for a Super Bowl. What happened? They looked – I don't even know. Listen.

Organizational issues. They got exposed. Organizational issues. So here's what I saw. I saw a team that had been red hot all season long when they were healthy and during that three game stretch they had a bit of a dry spell which i mean it happens in sports all of the best teams have small have hiccups but what you can't control is injuries and their quarterback has missed their starting quarterback has missed this will be his fifth game that he misses

fifth sixth somewhere around there but i know he missed three during in the start of the season and then he suffered the concussion for the green Bay game. And they were leading before he, before he got hurt. Then he, then he gets hurt, throws three picks. We can't really confirm whether or not that was the, that one play that people are talking about was the one where he suffered the concussion, then through three picks and then the game ended. But it's a strong possibility. Then after that, they lose the two games afterwards, or at least they could. So, I mean, it's just a lot of bad luck for them.

And, like, I just feel like that team has the most firepower where if they did get healthy and if Tua does play in a playoff game, they could potentially make a run. Or at least they could take a, after they lose in the playoffs, they could at least look at themselves in the mirror and say, listen, we had all of, we had the personnel. We had some bad luck. Let's regroup, maybe make a few roster roster tweaks and then we'll go into next season and then stay in the same direction we're going that's something that they could do with the patriots if they were to sneak into the playoffs i do not want to hear a word from any patriots fans or any like anyone outside of the outside of Pat's nation saying see see Bill Belichick could figure it out with an imperfect roster no no listen you guys need to go we need to go in a different direction they need to find they need to find a better offensive scheme

and take a closer look at their at their quarterback situation in Mac Jones. Once they figure out the offensive coordinator situation and the offense runs smoothly, I want to see how Mac Jones does with that. And if it turns out he's not the guy, we go in a different direction with quarterback. Because I'm seeing so many teams in the AFC get quarterbacks and have them actually work out i mean it started with patrick mahomes then josh allen and then joe burrell and then justin herbert lamar jackson has looked really good i mean the list goes on and potentially tua as well and and then trevor lawrence and we're sitting here still wondering whether or

not mac jones is the guy and i really hope he is because we i mean we we invested a number top 15 overall pick in him but they just don't deserve to be in right now they haven't played that well this season a lot of the wins that they've gotten have been against bad competition. It just feels like it would be fool's gold if they made it in. And I don't want to look at this season as a positive. I want to look at it as a lesson to be learned and to go into next season to make the adjustments possible to course correct and build towards a real championship team. That's kind of what I would like. The Steelers, I was really negative on them for most of this season,

but the more I look at it, the more I think, this team kind of might have something in Kenny Pickett, but they still don't deserve to be there because their offensive line is imperfect. They have pieces everywhere else, and jury's still out on Kenny Pickett, but they're a little bit behind. They need a couple of years to prove that they can make a playoff run. But the team I think deserves to be in is Miami. They built their team up. They did all the right

things for the most part. And that's's the team uh that should represent in that final playoff spot the only thing i have to say is y'all know y'all gonna trade it back either or so why are we even doing this doesn't always happen oh when was the last time patriots outside of the mac jones uh 20 uh 2021 they they drafted mac jones i sit outside of that because you know outside of that quarterback um didn't they didn't they draft didn't they trade up to draft dante hightower and they also use the first round pick on chandler jones i want to say you're going 2011 for dante hightower uh cj is out for some reason but just know what you guys normally do you know you trade back to the late first round early second round and try to get some developmental

player on the defense or on the line y'all know what y'all do right that's what they've done but I mean they also got lucky in in finding a diamond in the rough when they drafted Tom Brady. And like, I mean, that happens from time to time, but I don't, that's not, that's not, that's not a template that I want to invest in. That's not something that, I mean, look at, look at how all of these other teams have drafted. They've drafted a quarterback in the first round. In fact, I believe all of these, except for Patrick Mahomes, have been top 10.

Patrick Mahomes is top 10. Was he 11 or 10? 10. So he was 10. Okay. I hear 11 because I hear so much from the Saints saying, if he was around for the pick right after, we would have taken him. Believe it.

Like, no, you weren't. You just saw that he panned out and then now you're saying it um but like it's like you see all of these teams drafting in quarterbacks in the first round investing in the right guy in there and it works out all of them i mean joe burrow justin herbert we're seeing trevor lawrence right now before our very eyes. And sometimes it doesn't work out. We've highlighted that during this show. But a lot of times it does. And that's what's been working out.

Before you go the quarterback route. He looked good his first year, made it to the Pro Bowl, even though some players decided not to go. He still made it to the Pro Bowl. His second year, he doesn't have an OC. Give it some time. He doesn't have an OC, and he doesn't have a competent receiving core. Especially Jacoby Myers if he's willing to pass it back to Mac.

I mean. Now, look. Here's the thing, Adam. Adam. So he looked good his rookie year, and after one year, one, have you ever heard of a sophomore slump? And two, you cannot deny the cast of characters around him got significantly worse. The coaching staff got significantly worse, and it's 100% Mack's fault.

Two of those go hand-in-hand. So his personnel getting worse with the offensive coordinator change, I think that goes hand in hand. I mean, Hunter Henry and Kendrick Bourne have barely been involved in the offense, and that's 100% on Matt Patricia. Yep, and see, here's the thing. I've said it before that this season we've failed Mac, not the other way around. I agree.

I'm just saying improve the offensive court i'm sorry improve the offensive coordinator position and maybe add some pieces on the on the offensive side of the ball because it is it isn't perfect i can tell you now hey trust the process unless we get mac a wide receiver one nothing's gonna happen because there's a trend josh allen was awful and he was middling at best his second year. Then they got him a crutch in Stefan Diggs. Tua got his crutch in Tyreek Hill. Hell, Jalen Hurts was considered, this was his big put up or shut up year. Philly hated him and then they got him A.J. Brown.

I'm just saying there's a trend. I agree. I agree. Do all of these things and see how he does that's what i'm saying and everyone's saying oh the patriots can't draft and my point is even if we could draft would it matter would it really matter it was like oh we took sony michelle we could have had nick chubb we took nikhil harry we could have had a.j brown do you think we would have paid them do you really think we actually

would pay them see it's not just a coaching thing it's a belief it's it's it's what's the term here you know what i mean philosophy yeah it's a philosophy it's a systemic thing how it's like we could have drafted justin jefferson and we still would not and i and I am adamant on this, we could have drafted Justin Jefferson and I would bet both my legs we would not resign him. So what difference does it make? Yeah, but you still want to make sure that you, that's more on the GM, isn't it?

Yeah, it is. It's just like things need to change. And if Mack doesn't pan out, I will maintain that it's because we failed him and not the other way around well it's i listen i think it's also it could be two things out two things could be true at once because like yes they've failed him but we also haven't gotten confirmed he's had no confident oc or wide receiver. We also haven't had confirmation that he is, that he is the guy because we see, we see like,

this isn't the best, this isn't the best situation around him, but with a lot of quarterbacks who are in their developmental years, we still see flashes that they could be better than better than they have been with Joe Burrell. He had, I mean, for his first two years, he was in the top five in the

league in being sacked and he still showed us something with mac jones and literally went to the playoffs rookie year granted we didn't win but we still made it we still had a positive record mac jones took a team that was supposed to be tanking and win five, six games, and they went to the playoffs. This wasn't a, I'm going to waltz into a good program. This was a team that wasn't supposed to be that great, and Mac Jones took it to the playoffs. Mac Jones made a Pro Bowl.

Whether or not he deserved to go to the Pro Bowl, he was in that conversation. Cam Newton couldn't do it, and I know that's not the best example, but was that not a win for the O. OC? See, they spent through their faces in free agency that previous offseason. So that's the reason I had higher expectations for the Patriots that season just because they spent over $200 million on the likes of Kendrick Bourne, Nelson Aguilar, Jacoby Myers came through for them, and Hunter Henry had a very good year for them as well.

Johnny Smith still needs to show that he can play in that Patriots system, and he's not doing it in Patricia's. They're going to have to wait until next year. But, I mean, their offensive line was, while it was hurt for most of that year, it was still on paper a solid one. Yeah, I had higher expectations. I don't know if anybody else did, but, yeah. I think you were just being too high on your Patriots then

because you just said, let me add Nelson Aguilar to your team, and I immediately think, oh, we might be contenders. You don't mean that. You saw how he played, and I respect him, but his hands are just for decoration at times. You know that. You spent $200 million in free agency, spent a 15th overall pick on a quarterback,

and they had a 10-and-7 with Bill Belichick, one of the best coaches of all time, and a 10-and-7 record to show for it. And by the way, they had the number one seed for a lot of that run. But then later on in the season, it kind of fell apart. And then they got their doors blown out by their division rivals. What's that? You had to face Buffalo twice.

You split with them. And then you had to face Miami again that was a loss it was just some of those games where you're like yeah these are obvious losses here right that's what listen the bill the the Patriots didn't they had a they had a good season but they were supposed to they were kind of supposed to have a good season weren't they no no you are literally the only pats fan who thinks this the only one all right i'm gonna digress and how about we just move on to our next segment all right so we're going to touch on lions at packers, the showdown in the NFC North. We brought Pat on to talk about this segment.

Packers in a win-and-in scenario. We're going to talk about the ins and outs of that matchup. You're listening to the Fumble Rooski Podcast. Here's Edelman broken up and the pass is no sign yet. Edelman comes down with a football and they're saying it's a catch. This is what? Diggs! Sideline! Touchdown! Unbelievable! This is the Fumble Rooski podcast by Power 88 and Seek a Weapon Consulting. Adam Wright, CJ Medeiros, Justin Tucker, special guest Patrick Edwards.

So we talked about the Titans-Jaguars matchup in the AFC, and this is kind of a similar situation. Two teams that did not, at least one, at least, well, both teams here had not the best starts to their season. Four and eight were the Packers at one point. The Lions, what were they, two and six? It wasn't good. And now both of these teams, and so the Packers are a win and in scenario. The Lions, they not only need to win this game, but they also need the Rams to

beat the Seahawks in the earlier game at 425 PM. So between these two teams, so, Pat, give us some of the ins and outs for this matchup. This is the first playoff game of the NFL season. And it could very well quite literally be a playoff game atmosphere if Seattle loses. But we just got to see if the Packers' defense can hold up. Obviously, there have been a lot of problems with the Lions defense over the past year or two. MCDC has done a lot to shore up a lot of issues. Jared Goff has come to light, particularly at the start of the season, in a way that a lot of people didn't expect him to when he came to Detroit. I think a lot of this is going to be on can the defense perform to the extent

that they performed the past few weeks? Can Keyshawn Nixon and the special teams continue to play better? Amari Rodgers cost us a couple of games. The defense has cost us a couple of games. And the biggest question mark, can Aaron Rodgers be vintage Aaron Rodgers in a last-week scenario a la 2013 versus the Bears or Miracle in Motown I mean this is this is no Rodgers is no stranger to playing in a scenario that we're about to play in Rodgers hasn't played as well as he has in past seasons for most of the year. He's had a hurt hand. He's come out that he's been on DMT during games.

It's been a wild ride, and it's not Vintage Rodgers, but can Vintage Rodgers pull out one more performance while the rest of the team coalesces? Can he put them on top of a resurgent Lions team in the frozen tundra in prime time in the clutch. We can't hear you. You're muted. My bad.

CJ, what are your thoughts on this matchup? I'm hoping that it's going be a good one i mean frankly this really doesn't matter to me you know being being a fan of the team from the afc but there is something i want to point out a quote from lions safety deshaun elliott on aaron rogers said quote the way he carries himself nobody Nobody likes that expletive. A-Rod doesn't respect us. He doesn't respect anyone. That team doesn't respect anyone.

And we're going to fight our expletive off. So I'm hoping it's going to be a good game. Now, I think the Packers are going to win, but I would not be shocked if Detroit pulls it out. That's pretty much all. I'm going quick. I'll agree with that. That basically sums it up.

I think it's very winnable for the Packers, but it's far from over. Yeah. I'll touch on this last talk. Oh, my God. This has the potential to be game of the year. The Detroit Lions actually, I'm not going to lie, under Dan Campbell, I'm actually impressed. I didn't think at the start of the season, I'm like, they're at least two and six. So I think they started off better than last year. But then they started to rack one right after another.

I'm thinking to myself, these Detroit Lions, can they make the playoffs? Can they actually get in? I thought it would end if they lost to Minnesota, but they got past Minnesota. I'm like, oh, okay, now let me see what they got. And now we're here against the Packers. I thought the Packers were done themselves, but somehow, someway, when it comes around December, Aaron Rodgers and Matt LaFleur just figure out a way to come alive.

And I'm kind of excited for this matchup. But something we're kind of overlooking here, what's going to happen in Seattle when the Rams and the Seahawks face each other? Because that game has a lot of playoff implications on it. If the Seahawks win each other because that game has a lot of playoff implications on it. If the Seahawks win, I think Detroit gets eliminated and kind of takes some of the luster out of their sails. But if the, whatchamacallit, if they lose, Detroit still has a chance. So it's like, we'll wait and see on that game. But it probably would still feel nice to knock Aaron Rodgers and the Packers out of the playoff game just to stick it to your divisional rivals one more time.

And they already got the early season one against the Packers. So, oh, this is a game that I'm looking forward to watching. And somehow, someway, I think Aaron Rodgers brings it back one more time to be Vinton's Aaron Rodgers. And somehow, someway pulls away with the dub. All right. So, like, this is going to be an incredible game. I really hope it is. This has been a great story for both sides.

I mean, two teams that had not the best starts to their seasons. It was actually 1-6 for the Lions, it turns out. They were 1-6, and the Packers 4-8. And both of these guys now 8-8 and a chance to make it into the playoffs here. And honestly, with the teams that they have, they could potentially, for a 7 seed, make a little bit of noise.

And look, as Tuck alluded to, this could turn into a spoiler game for the Lions because if the Seahawks beat the Rams in the earlier game, then the Lions are eliminated. But I'm sure they would be plenty happy to play their asses off and go out there and eliminate their division rivals in the Packers as well. So this will still be a good game either way. Now, the fact that the Lions are traveling to face the Packers at the Frozen Tundra after what the Packers just did to the now three-seeded, thanks to the Packers, Vikings team, I mean, I have to give the advantage to the Packers. And looking at this Packers team, led by Aaron Rodgers, an imperfect

team, and also looking, this is a sub-point, looking over at Tom Brady and the Tampa Bay Buccaneers with their team, they haven't had the best seasons, but they have still scraped together what they have had to find a way to sneak into the playoffs. Obviously not going to count the chickens just yet, but the fact that they are still knocking at the door just tells us that these guys might still have it. Both of them. And it really has been a pleasure to watch.

And I haven't really been able to take the time to really appreciate these two guys during their primes. And now seeing they're kind of getting towards the end of their careers and they're still making an impact and knocking at the door at playoff contention. It really is a pleasure to watch. And I'm going to miss these guys in the league as we start to now transition into some more younger quarterbacks that we've discussed earlier. And, you know, it, it really, it is a transitional period here. And it's, it's sad to see these, to see these guys go, whatever they do.

Oh, do you need me to play you a song on the world's tiniest violin? All right. All right. Whatever. Listen, this this is like like it is a this is an exciting time for young quarterbacks because we're seeing a lot we talked about the afc i mean that that place that's it's loaded with quarterbacks who look like they're going to be uh they have a bright they all have bright futures but i mean we're also thinking about the fact that from the 2010s, a lot of those top quarterbacks from then have already moved on to retirement. And Brady and Rodgers are kind of, they're a relic of a bygone era. And to see that they are still kind of they're still holding their own it's pretty

it's pretty impressive stuff and like i said i'm gonna i'm gonna miss it because i grew up watching these guys play as much as i hated aaron rogers he still is a pretty damn good quarterback listen after the season we had this year you'll know how excited I am to see these one more important game Aaron Rodgers plays in his career. Do you think he's going to remain a Packer after this season, or do you think that he still has something left with the team he's played his whole career? I hope he comes back.

I think that last year was the same thing. I don't think he's going to go anywhere else. I think it's between staying in Green Bay or retiring. But I hope he comes back. I think the fact that Keyshawn Nixon has come out of nowhere, the defense has picked up the pace, and Christian Watson and Romeo Dobbs have really emerged as big targets that he can trust.

I think that does a lot more to get him to want to come back. I think this streak that got us back into competitive football might give him an edge and an inkling to want to come back next year. I think the answer now is going to be a lot more difficult to say when he was 4-8 and playing some terrible football yeah and like it they're going to want to prove those two guys in the wide receiver core that they can play at a high level because even if they sneak in this has been a down year by the packers standards, especially with how they've been playing the past few years. I mean, they've won 13 games and they had won 13 or more games

in three straight seasons. And to go from here down to here, that sucks. And we all know how the Packers have been with committing to high-end wide receiver talent, or at least in the draft. So, like Christian Watson and Romeo Dobbs, I hope they pan out. Looking towards the Buccaneers side of things, I don't know if he is going to come back. I think he might go to a new team. He could stay, but I think Brady is at a point where he's just trying to look out that last ounce of football he has in him.

And I think he still has it, but we'll see. We'll see. I wanted to look at the Lions, though, because that is a team that has played better than expectations, are now in the playoff hunt. And we were thinking that this was going to be a team that would be looking to get a quarterback, but is that really what their plan is at this point?

Because Jared Goff has actually played pretty good football. And if you look back at Goff's whole career, he's been a pretty solid quarterback and he has, he has led a team to a Superbowl before. So looking at that and like, how do you think that they're going to build this team going forward? I think the one biggest thing to think of when you think of the Detroit Lions is we said a lot about the fact they were one in six. We said a lot about the fact that they haven't been good in a few years, but under Dan Campbell, they're losing a lot of one score games. I know a lot of noise has been made about Minnesota this

year. The fact that their record is so good with such a terrible negative point differential i mean it was little things that needed to be tweaked in order to get detroit into a winning spirit and those things have obviously been tweaked because they're going to be playing for a playoff game on sunday but you know i i don't think that the changes were as drastic as everybody seemed to think at least judging by the record and judging by the team's history. I think the culture is there. I think little things are being tweaked. Maybe they go out and they add a few pieces in the offseason,

whether or not Sunday pans out. But I think they got their coach. I think the quarterback is more confident than anybody gives him credit for. I think the team has been better than everybody realized. It's just little things that have changed that are now going in their favor and hopefully for their sake it continues to do so maybe not sunday but the season's going forward yeah they're certainly trending in the right direction um the lions and the fact that they're not they're they're almost into the playoffs right now is a good sign for their rebuild process. And they probably did draft, or they probably did trade for Jared Goff to be a throw-in, but their plans might be changing now

because he's having a pretty good year. And on top of that, I mean, he's not old either. So they could have him for a few years and really build around them. That offensive line has been looking a lot better in the past couple of years since they've been drafting in that spot. The wide receiver position has gotten better through free agency trades. They found a late gem in Amon Ross St. Brown. Their running game is looking better too. So what they really need to look at is probably that defense. The front seven is looking better, but the secondary could use some work.

But they're trending in the right direction. That is one good thing to look at. So that could be a playoff team in a couple of years as well. But do we have any other thoughts before we end the show tonight? No, i'm good nope nothing all right well pat thanks a lot for joining us it's been too long since we last had you on we'd love to have you on again if if you're up for it thanks for having me you know i'm always down so hopefully the packers are better next year. I have more things to talk about. Yeah, that might be ideal.

All right. Well, that'll do it for us tonight. Thank you for listening to us. We have new episodes out on Tuesdays and Fridays at 7.30 p.m. Eastern Standard Time. Be sure to subscribe to our YouTube channel. We also have all our episodes available on Spotify, Spreaker, Apple Podcasts, iHeartRadio, Google Podcasts, and so

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