The Fumblerooski Podcast - Unsung Heroes -Ep 254 The Fumblerooski Podcast

Episode Date: March 15, 2024

Has Aaron Donald revolutionized the DT position in football? Are the Vikings planning something big with their two 1st round picks? Does the Bears trading for Keenan Allan confirm the Bears are taking a QB at No.1 overall? Adam Wright, Chris Costich, and CJ Medeiros debate these topics and more!

aaron donald retires after 10 seasons the vikings make a draft day trade and keenan allen is traded for a bag of chips this is the fumble ruski podcast it may not have always showed it in the stat sheet but you can see him making throws when he needs to make the throws back-to-back games where he has three touchdowns someone's gotta get that six or seven spot he's an elite wide receiver as a rookie. Truly a lose-lose scenario for both sides. Welcome to the Fumble Rooski podcast by Power 88 and Secret Weapon Consulting. I'm Adam Wright with CJ Medeiros and Chris Kostic.

We have a great show planned for you guys today. A little bit of everything. Some draft day stuff um a trade that just went down and uh aaron donalds a future hall of famer retiring after 10 seasons so we'll start off with this one um so this guy just to name a couple of small accolades emphasis on small he was a pro bowler in all 10 of his seasons. He was an eight time all pro. So eight of those 10 seasons, he was the best of his position, 2014 defensive rookie of the year and three time defensive player of the year. This guy in his brief time in his decade

in the league has absolutely dominated. And he went out with a ring as well, which is fantastic on his part. So many elite defensive players go through their entire career without ever winning a ring. And it's great to see that Aaron Donald is not one of those players. And I'm going to say this right now for my takeaway. I think defensive tackle, the interior defensive line is one of the most, if not the most underrated position in all of football. It's a position where if this, you know, it's very hard to get into the backfield as an interior defensive lineman, but when they do, when they do consistently, they are much bigger game wreckers than the edge rushers are. With edge rushers,

you hear about them more because it's easier to be a, I'm not saying it's easy to be a good edge rusher, but it's easier to win against a tackle than it is against a guard. Guard and center is an easier position to be good at. With tackles, you don't see as much of them out there. So you see the edge rushers racking up a lot more tackles. With interior defensive linemen, it's rarely run into one that's good enough to get into the backfield, but once they do, when they take over games, it's almost automatic that the team wins the game, right? So the last couple of years, Chris Jones has taken over

during the postseason. The Chiefs have won two championships. In 2021, Aaron Donald led them to a Super Bowl himself. You can even look at 2020. Vita Vea and Ndamukong Su, they took over the Super Bowl to a Super Bowl himself. You can even look at 2020, Vita Vea and Ndamukong Su, they took over the Super Bowl. This is a position that is extremely underrated, and we are starting to see the value of it go up. And I think Aaron Donald is the embodiment of that. And I think he kind of revolutionized the defensive tackle position. But I don't know what you guys thought. Yeah, no, I agree with all that that you just said right there.

I mean, most running plays end up between the tackles, between the guards too. I mean, yeah, you have a good amount of your outside runs and whatnot, your outside zone runs and whatnot. But the interior is where most of your running game is going to end up taking place. And a guy like Aaron Donald was consistently blowing that up. And so, yeah, in that sense, the edge rusher would be not as important as an interior guy. But, I mean, Aaron Donald was basically, at his position,

he was basically the equivalent of Calvin Johnson in terms of, you know, you see all these pictures of Aaron Donald being doubled up or tripled up, quadrupled up, and it kind of makes you think of that one picture of calvin johnson getting doubled up on the line of scrimmage so it that kind of just tells you how dominant of a force aaron donald is and i'll just say it right now aaron donald's the the goat when it comes to nose tackles or interior guys in general yeah i'd say i'd say i agree with that do you as far as interior defensive line goes

yeah and you know you you just mentioned a couple good names there too uh they're not the the dominican sue uh vita vea chris jones is obviously one of the best in the game right now if not the best in the game so there's a lot of really good names that are in the game right now, if not the best in the game. So there's a lot of really good names that are in the game right now, but there's probably going to be none that are going to be as legendary or just as good in general as Aaron Donald. Oh, yeah. CJ, what are your thoughts? Aaron Donald, obviously, we all know, first ballot hall of famer and i like this from a

different perspective do you think that he has a case to be considered the best defensive tackle of all time i certainly do i mean i think the only two defensive tackles that are even like in on the same planet as he is are probably guys like mean joe green and john randall yeah and maybe the only one you could argue is better is like mean joe but i don't know aaron donald being an elite run stuffer an elite pass rusher um i've ordered his uh stats like over 500 tackles 100 oven sacks 20 some odd forced fumbles across 10 years i mean granted you know like pro bowls don't mean anything but he made the pro bowl every year and which is kind of impressive when you remember that it's basically a popularity contest and he was able to stay popular that long three defensive

player of the years meaning that you were voted the best defensive player in the nfl for three years probably could have been more yeah there's some where that maybe him losing was a little iffy, but Chris, you make a valid point. And, of course, the ring. Now, some people would argue that the ring might just be gravy. I disagree because that's kind of like what can separate you, you know what I mean? Yeah.

But when it comes to what Adam mentioned, where he brought up about edge rushers versus defensive tackles, I just want to say one thing. You're not wrong, and I think you all made some good points. However, I would just say it's easier to find a good edge rusher than like a truly elite defensive tackle and i will also mention that the ceiling as far as being a game wrecker goes is a lot higher for a defensive tackle right but the floor is also much much lower i can see that whereas if you take all the edge rushers, right,

and all the defensive tackles, and you were just to randomly pick one, there's a good chance the edge rusher you pick is just better than the other defensive tackle just because, you know, you have a better odds of getting a better edge rusher, just like I said, because the floor is that much higher. However, but when it comes to, like, the absolute best, the game wreckers, a lot of these defensive tackles, like the Aaron Donalds, the Chris Joneses, like I said, go back in the day to, like I said, John Randall, Mean Joe Green, Refrigerator Perry, those guys, they rule the game. Well, let me tell you the nature of that position and why if they do get in the backfield, then it becomes crippling

to the other offense, right? So Tuck made this argument to me a few years ago, and I thought it just blew my mind. So when the tackle position gives out on offense, the quarterback, it's obviously still devastating either way, but the quarterback can at least step up and step into his throws in order to make an accurate read. Also the quarterback, most of the time can barely see him. So they're not seeing ghosts. Um, when the defensive tackle gets into your face, not only is your vision partially impaired and you're kind of seeing ghosts because he's right in your face, but he has you throwing off your back foot. So it not only, it not only scares the quarterback, but it quite literally affects the mechanics of the quarterback throwing the ball. This happened three times in this past Superbowl when Chris Jones was in Brock Purdy's face on

three potential game winningwinning touchdown passes. He hucked it deep three times and overthrew him because guess who was in his face? I'll do you one better, Adam. The play where in the AFC divisional round, or the AFC divisional between the Bills and the Chiefs. Josh Allen missed the throw to Shakur because Chris Jones was hitting him. He was on the verge of hitting him or at least was shoving the lineman into Josh Allen,

which kind of helped Josh Allen not make the throw. And that could have been the game right there. And it ended up being the game for, well, I mean, like that could have been the game for the bills to win, but instead it ended up being the play that helped, uh, make Buffalo have to kick the field goal, which they ended up missing. Yeah. You can name a million examples of it yeah i'll even go to the 2021 uh nfc divisional round uh buccaneers buccaneers rams buccaneers and uh ryan jensen the buccaneers center was on

one leg or did he even play i don't even remember if he even made it in the game i'm pretty sure he made it back and played but he was like on one leg aaron donald was obviously winning every single matchup and you could clearly see there was a difference in tom brady's accuracy on his throws now they were able to figure it out and eventually come back and very nearly win or at least well they did tie it they could have forced overtime but we'll talk about that one play where they left Antoine Winfield alone with Cooper Cup another time. That's a big example. Tom Brady's one of the greatest quarterbacks of all time, and Aaron Donald made him look human. Same thing with the 2020 Super Bowl, Super Bowl 55. Patrick Mahomes, his center hadn't been able to practice all week because he was on the COVID list.

And you could clearly see Vita Veya and Dominic Nsou were getting into the backfield, getting in his face. he was forced to throw in all different kinds of angles. And obviously they lost 32-9. So all of these different examples, I think it's the most underrated position not only in football, but also sports. Because if you get in the backfield as a defensive tackle, the game's over. If you can consistently do it, you have won yourself the game,

which is something that not everybody completely understands. This is the reason why the Ravens brought back Justin Matabike. He's doing a similar thing over there in Baltimore. All right. If we don't have anything else on that, I'd like to move on. So the Vikings made the first splash on the draft boards, as far as the trade, the trading area goes, getting a second first round pick from the Texans. We'll talk about exactly what that might mean and how this could potentially shape this draft. That's next.

This is the Fumble Rooski Podcast. It may not have always showed it in the stat sheet, but you can see him making throws when he needs to make the throws. Back-to-back games where he has three touchdowns. Someone's got to get that six or seven spot. He's an elite wide receiver as a rookie. Truly a lose-lose scenario for both sides welcome back to the fumble ruski podcast by power 88 and secret weapon consulting

i'm adam right with cj madero and chris kostich so the vikings have made the first splash on the draft boards and uh so to give you the exact trade, so the Vikings did acquire the Texans first round pick. They did not give their first round pick back. So the exact trade was the Texans would get two second round picks. One of them is pick 42 in this year's draft. And the next year is a 2025 second round pick. So the Texans have two, two seconds in this year and next year's draft. And there was a seventh round pick thrown in there. The Vikings get pick number 23 and a seventh. So the biggest takeaway here is that the Vikings did not have to give away any first round picks for this. So they still have number 11 that they already have. And they have number 23.

This is a head scratcher because they don't have any needs at the wide receiver position. And on top of that, they are in the market for a quarterback. And they are one of the teams that has been rumored to be interested to trade up to go and get one of the quarterbacks at the top of the board. CJ brought this to our attention first, so I'll let you finish that off, CJ, if you'd like. I was going to say, I'd like to let CJ take over anyway. Yeah. All right, cool. like to let cj take over anyways so yeah all right cool so when you look at this year's draft right quarterbacks no matter which order are projected to go one two three there's usc's caleb williams

north carolina's drake may and lsu's jayden daniels those like the top three put them in which order you want but we all know they're going one, two, three. And the Vikings have their own first round pick at pick 11. And maybe there's like a JJ McCarthy floating around there, but which, and he's fine. He's a bit of a project, but come on, everybody wants, you know, the top three. And, but I know what you're thinking. And Adam mentioned, you already have two really good receivers you're in the market for a quarterback but the quarterbacks are up front so why would you accrue this extra first well for me the answer is simple i do not believe that the minnesota vikings are going to use both of those first round picks and you heard it here first kids

i think that they're going to use those two first rounders as bargaining chips and make a run at one of those top three. Now, the thing is, Chicago, as we know, demands a, and I quote, historic haul to move down from number one. And despite that, I don't see them dealing with Minnesota just because you don't deal with a division rival. That's just common sense. Then there's the commanders. Now the commanders are number two. However, what we have heard in the pre-draft process is even though Caleb Williams is going to go number one, they're absolutely smitten with Williams. And they, I think the commanders are more likely to trade up than trade back. And that leaves New England. Now in the first round, for better or worse, they have traded back in the first round of the past two years. Now I know what you're

thinking. Oh, that was a Belichick thing. Bill Belichick's gone. And if the way New England is approaching this free agency is any different, it might go a little deeper. So as a Pats fan, I hate to say it, but them trading back for the third straight year is definitely in play. So I, frankly, would not be shocked if this is what it comes down to. I would not be shocked if the Vikings are trying to accrue more draft capital to trade back probably with the Patriots to move up to the third pick and take whichever quarterback lasts the longest, be it Jaden Daniels or Drake May. Muted again. are drake may muted again um yeah and to piggyback off of that there are plenty of rumors out there that if drake may is left on the board the patriots may not even want to may not even want

to remain there they might actually be open trading back now i always thought they would trade still within the top 10 so that they could get one of the other elite wide receivers out there in Romo Odunze or Malik Neighbors. But if they get 11 and 23, that's something that someone else is going to have to argue for me because um i guess they would go offensive tackle with one of those picks or if jj mccarthy is still there maybe they they take him at 11 but i just i never i i never liked the idea of them taking marvin harrison jr

number three overall just because I think a generational talent like that, I'm not denying that he's going to be a great player. I'm just saying that when you have a player that great, it becomes more of a luxury than a need. So if you can take Odunze and get an extra first round pick out of it, that's what I've seen the most sense in. But New England has been rumored the most to trade back. So that's what kind of concerns me here as a Patriots fan. Yeah, I feel like, I don't know, I feel like that the only way that the Vikings would end up taking that third pick is if they end up giving up Jeddahs. But, I mean, I could be wrong.

Could be wrong because, you know, the pats do work in very mysterious ways. I mean, they, they thought that Keenan Allen would going for a fourth rounder higher than that was too big of an app or just a fourth rounder in general was too big of an asking price. So I, I could see that if the pats were to trade back with the Vikings, then Jettas would probably not even be part of the deal at all, which kind of sucks to say because I'd like to have Jettas on the Pats. I think any Patriots fan would love to have them on Patriots and whatnot.

But truth of the matter is, if Keenan Allen, you're not willing to give the charges a fourth rounder for keenan allen then what are you willing to give jettas or give the vikings for jettas at that point the fact of the matter is um to trade up from the middle of the first round into the top three that takes a lot that's very pricey. I don't really have much interest in pick number 23. Of course, a first round pick is a first round pick. They're still valuable, but I might see more value in getting number 11, a first rounder next year, and Justin Jefferson. Because if they have to overpay for him, then they have to overpay for them. That's fine. I'm okay with that. They have plenty of cap space to do it. And on top of that,

they have an extra first round pick for in next year's draft in order to take one of their guys, or if they feel just, uh, JJ McCarthy is the right guy. Not saying I do. I'm saying if the Patriots feel that way, the Patriots get their guy at number 11, they get the wide receiver they always wanted, and they get an extra first round pick out of it for next year's draft to fill whatever needs they have left. I feel like that's a good road to go down. Well, that's also JJ McCarthy's even available at that point because the recent rumor mill right now is that the Giants looking to get jj mccarthy and they might try to move on from daniel jones this year and try to have jj mccarthy as that guy to to go to at that point so jj mccarthy might be going six and he's not even going to make it to 11 yeah well if that happens, then throw away everything that I'm saying right now.

But at number 11, maybe there's somebody left. Odunze, he could make it back. No, he won't. Okay, then he won't. Yeah. One of them is going to be drafted by the Chargers. Yeah. And even still, if you don't get Odunze or Dunze

or whatever the heck his name is, then you could say, oh, what about neighbors? Because you have to remember, like, is neighbors even going to last that long? No. And second, it's just like you say you would much rather have Justin Jefferson. And with all due respect, I did hear you say the term the Patriots had the cap space to resign him. Justin Jefferson? Yeah. My response is, yeah, my response is okay. And just because they have it doesn't mean they're going to use it.

I mean, this team has spat out bold face lie after bold face lie regarding what they're going to do with their cap space, you know, burn cash, get in some new guys, weaponize the offense. Yeah, no, no, no, no, they're not. And mark my words, if we trade for Justin Jefferson, Kraft is going to close the purse strings and he will be a one-year rental. So no, it's not worth it. And second of all, you're going to say, oh, you know, Marvin Harrison Jr. is is too good he becomes a luxury he's so talented he becomes a luxury that is literally the definition of an oxymoron and here's the thing adam can you see new england

going out and swinging a trade for t higgins or brandon iuk i know you want it but can you see it no no you can't and you know and and can you see them getting one of free agency? No. New England has not had a really at least serviceable wide receiver since 2019. Do you think Romo Dunsey is not going to be a wide receiver one? Do you think Malik Nabors won't be either? On Harrison? No, I'd much rather have Harrison.

What do you mean? I'm not saying one's better what do you mean i'm not saying one's better than the other i'm not arguing that at all marvin harrison jr is obviously the better one but if you can still get a wide receiver one why not get the extra first out of it by trading back and getting odunzi okay who would you be trading with you would be trading with the falcons you would be trading with tennessee you would be trading with the Falcons. You would be trading with Tennessee. You would be trading with the Giants. You would be trading with... All right, first of all, do you really think Tennessee is going to trade up

because after they just drafted Levis, that's extremely unlikely. Falcons just signed Kirk Cousins, so who would they be trading up for? Who would they be trading up for? Maybe Marvin Harrison Jr. Maybe they want him. Drake London, Marvin Harrison Jr. Maybe they want him. Drake London, Marvin Harrison Jr. The Falcons would have to basically give up Kirk Cousins to

get up to the third. They literally would. They'd have to trade up so much and they just built up so much now to make a run. The Titans are the same. The Titans are the same.

Marvin Harrison Jr., if he is not drafted at number three, is going to Arizona. Yes. Neighbors or Odunzi is going to the Chargers. That's a slam dunk. Outside of all of that, the other players, the other teams in this top 10 are not slam dunks to take a wide receiver. The Giants might take jj mccarthy that's probably

the most the most likely team to go and get um to go and get a wide receiver but if they get mccarthy then he's off the board atlanta they have all of these they have all of these targets already i don't know if they're going wide receiver. Well, you literally just said they might trade up for Harrison. So, like, but that doesn't matter. If you go to 11, do you really? Can you as a GM really in good faith be able to just say, all right, fine, we're going to roll the dice and just hope either Odunzi or Neighbors falls to us. Because if that's the case and that's what you're going to do,

then you should probably just stay at three and hope Jaden Daniels falls to you. If you're really going to sit there and roll the dice, why not stay at three? Why not stay at three? I just think a wide receiver of that caliber is... Well, if you're going to have that mindset of, oh, I really hope, then just, then why bother? Well, it's not hoping. If you do your homework, I mean,

New England should have an idea of where these players are being drafted. And if you're not... They should, but do you really think they do? If they don't, then why are we having this conversation at all? I'm sorry, but Marvin Harrison Jr. at three is not a good idea. I don't believe in that. How is it not a good idea?

Explain, yes. I don't think that's not a good idea. We haven't had a guy of that caliber unironically since Randy Moss, let alone 2019. I do not trust New England. You see, here's the thing. He's already NFL ready. I do not trust New England to continue to develop neighbors, to continue to develop Odunze. And I do not trust them to swing a trade. I do not trust them to sign a blue chip free agent. It's time to stop pussyfooting around. It's time to stop dancing around the issue. We need to take the bull by the horns. And if you don't like that, then you're probably not a real fan. It's so much of an issue

that you can't get out of the three spot. There's no, why would you get out of the three spot and handcuff yourself with and take a risk on two guys that aren't as nfl ready as marvin harrison and also you're banking on the fact that they could potentially even be there to begin with like marvin harrison is going to be at that three spot most likely if they trade with the giants or chargers then they will be there one of those two will still be there sure if you trade with the six but we're talking about the 11th pick here it's the 11th pick that we've been talking about with the whole vikings and whatnot and you just can't bank on that fact that they're going to make it out of the top 10 it's just i don't see the chargers trading up like at all you know that they're in a they're

a very fragile team right now and i don't think they want to waste jim harbaugh or justin herbert's time with the rebuild i mean maybe the giants but i don't even know what's going on there that work that whole team is just might need to be completely sold but after that brian burns trade i don't see it well if they take jj mccarthy then you can pretty much bank on you can pretty much bank on one of those two wide receivers still being there. If they could all – I unironically could see them also going wide receiver. I mean, I don't know. They could.

But every mock draft that I've seen for a bit has them going either of Dunze or Neighbors. Right. Honestly, the Chargers are probably going to, if they stay there, they're probably going to get a receiver as well because, once again, who's going to catch the ball? They're just going to go areas by inspiration. Johnson, absolutely not. I'm not arguing against that.

They are taking a wide receiver, and so are the Cardinals. So at least two of those three wide receivers is going to be gone. They are taking a wide receiver and so are the Cardinals. So one of, so one of the, at least two of those three wide receivers is going to be gone. But if they trade within the top 10, then you're going to end up with at least one of those three guys. And you still get an extra first in, in next year's draft.

I'm not debating it. I'm just wondering who is really gonna trade up because i really just don't see the giants doing it i mean i'm not ruling it out but it's not likely well tennessee chicago no tennessee and chicago i'm saying i'm not tennessee and chicago are set at wide receiver I think we can pretty much close the door on that. Arizona is going to – in this hypothetical scenario draft, Marvin Harrison Jr., Malik Nabors or Romo Dunsey is going to the L.A. Chargers. So between the Giants and the Atlanta Falcons and the New York Jets.

Which one of them are taking the wide receiver? Probably the Jets because they're actively shopping Lazard. Cobb is gone. I mean, you have Garrett Wilson, but that's pretty much it. Maybe they might go line, but I know they're going offensive side of the ball. Honestly, if Ed Rogers runs for vice president, they might go quarterback. You never know they might as well go quarterback regardless if rogers goes this isn't even a new topic i was

making a joke right so if the chargers so one of those teams and the jets by the way, they're at number 10. So the most likely team to take a wide receiver is way down on that list. So if they're still within the top 10, whichever way they find out, figure out how to do it. If they figure out how to do that, there is a very high likelihood that they will end up with malik neighbors or romo dunsey but um the nfl draft is a crapshoot so anything could happen here and we could all be wrong one of us could be right we could all somehow be right we'll see how it ends up going we'll definitely get more into it around draft season, but we did have our first draft trade to get the Vikings another first round pick. So we'll see what happens, what ends up happening with that. The Vikings could be looking to trade up. Maybe

they just want two first round picks because there's another player they like in the first round we'll see but i'd like to move on keenan allen has been traded to the bears for a fourth round pick we'll get into all the ins and outs of this and some other rumors that were swirling around it involving again the new england patriots that's next this is the fumble ruski podcast it may not have always showed it in the stat sheet but you can see him making throws when involving, again, the New England Patriots. That's next. This is the Fumble Rooski Podcast. It may not have always showed it in the stat sheet, but you can see him making throws when he needs to make the throws. Back-to-back games where he has three touchdowns. Someone's got to get that six or seven spot.

He's an elite wide receiver as a rookie. Truly a lose-lose scenario for both sides. Welcome back to the Fumble Rooski Podcast by Power 88 and Secret Weapon Consulting. I'm Adam Wright with CJ Medeiros and Chris Kostic. So, Keenan Allen has been traded to the Bears for a fourth round pick. So, the Chargers have been in some cap trouble. They were thought to have figured it out when they released Mike Williams. Turns out it wasn't figured out entirely. They had to get pay cuts out of Khalil Mack and Joey Bosa, and they did go up to Keenan Allen asking for a pay cut. He he declined and the chargers put him on the trade block who answered the chicago bears who now get another wide receiver to pair up with dj moore and they also already have cole comet um they have deandre Swift to hand the ball off. This is, uh, you gotta say this is quite

the team that they are putting together for Caleb Williams. And if Justin Fields is still there, then that's great for him. He finally, he finally has a nice number two target as a wide receiver. Uh, but I would say that this, my biggest takeaway from this and i'll get to the the patriots rumor in a second um my biggest takeaway is that this means it's you're most likely going to go quarterback at number one because if you were to trade back with the with the pick if you were trading back that would mostly mean most likely mean you're just going to draft a weapon for Justin Fields. And you're kind of already set at the tackle position. But since they traded for Keenan Allen, now their only need would be hypothetically at quarterback if they don't believe Justin Fields is the guy.

But I'll let you guys discuss. What are we thinking? Why don't you go first CJ? Keenan Allen to Chicago, like Adam mentioned. Oh my God. What that is great for Caleb Williams. Let's face it. Don't buy into the Justin Fields hype. This is who they're drafting. And when you look at the fact that i think adams mentioned before how their offensive line has been improved over the years and i think that is true it could use a little bit of patching up but overall it's solid but oh my god those

weapons a keenan allen dj moore receiver duo with cole comet and another good tight end in Gerald Everett and DeAndre Swift. Just, I don't know what the ceiling is for Caleb Williams coming into the league, but I think it might have just gotten a little higher. I'm not going to say this puts them in play for the division, but they could probably be around.500. And who knows, maybe they could finally get their first 4,000-yard passer ever with Williams. I mean, maybe, but this is the Bears we're talking about. And when you think about the Bears and their quarterback woes, be it drafting or whatever,

when was the last time when they were drafting, we said all right this guy could be a generational guy like an actual like a generational talent i don't know if that's ever happened at least not in our lifetime so overall this is a great just a massive move for the bears and you know it's funny obviously i say this in jest so can we not bite my heads off fans he's got a better receiver core already than patrick mahomes does yeah that's crazy that's actually crazy how like and because the bears aren't really a terrible team and we have to remember they only have the first overall pick because it was dealt to them from Carolina. And so you have a team that's already not terrible going to get what could be potentially a generational talent.

I don't know. And if he gets some time, you know, to really, like, get some wins under his belt in, like, a year or two, they could actually be a problem. If of course he pans out, but that's, you know, there's no use trying to predict that.

I think he could potentially, the bears could potentially be a problem this year because they, let's face it like that. They still, they got a good defense. That defense really stepped up that second half of the year and they got some good guys on the line. I mean, they got freaking Montez Sweat.

And they beefed up the offense like a motherfucker too. So let's be real. If Caleb Williams is that guy, then this team's going to be more than just a 500 team. This team's going to win the NFC North. I'll pump the brakes on that i forgot about the lions but this this team will compete for the nfc north and pretend potentially win a playoff game next year i i think the ceiling is a lot higher than what you may be saying could potentially be here cj I mean, if they do end up being 500, then, yeah,

I'll give it to you on that. But I feel like that – or are you saying the ceiling for them is 500, or are you saying the ceiling is more than that? No, I'm saying the ceiling is more than that. I'm just saying how a lot of people who don't see the Bears is great. I mean, I definitely think probably not. I wouldn't say quite the floor, but probably the expectation is the ceiling, although it's a high ceiling, is going to be like a playoff berth.

Okay. That's kind of what I was going to go towards because I guess I didn't understand the 500 thing for a second there. But regardless, the ceiling definitely is at least a playoff berth and maybe even a playoff win, but getting a playoff win with a rookie quarterback is very tough. It doesn't happen too, too often.

So there's that. And we also don't really know if Caleb Williams, like obviously he is the undeniable first overall pick regardless, but we also don't know if that's going to end up panning out, especially with all this off-the-field talk that's been going on, rumors and whatnot, him going out in dresses and whatnot. Is he even an NFL quarterback? There's a lot of off-the-field stuff that kind of is hindering Caleb Williams,

which it really shouldn't, but there's potentially could. So, yeah, if Caleb Williams can – this is all going to be on Caleb Williams, really, and this is basically the same thing as us talking about Jalen Hurts and how Philly's going to perform, is if Jalen Hurts – their season is going to depend on Jalen Hurts and his performance. And that's how the Bears are going to be. It's going to depend on how well Caleb Williams can play, especially with all these targets that are being gift-wrapped to him.

Yeah. I mean, the way i see this uh i mean we're going to figure out real quick whether or not caleb williams is the guy and this could either be a rude awakening where it's holy crap maybe we should have drafted different quarterback or should have stuck with Justin Fields or it'll be the, uh, the bears are going to be looking like geniuses at this point. Um, I would personally believe that Caleb Williams, I think he will pan out, but I don't think he'll be, I don't think he'll be the type of quarterback who's like Patrick Mahomes where he's legitimately winning Superbowls. He's, um, he's always in the mix. I think he's going to be

a top 10 quarterback, but not the type of quarterback who is, um, who you're mentioning in the same breath as Mahomes. Um, which is, I guess it's fine. I mean, it's hard to find a quarterback like that already, but, um, they're definitely at least doing everything that they can to protect that quarterback. They worked on that offensive line. Maybe it could use some help, uh, especially on the interior with the release of, of Cody white hair. Um, their tackles, I think are fine. They're okay. I don't think their offensive line is great but it's fine um but they have some good weapons for him now dj moore is a good wide receiver one keenan allen he's around that level as well he may be a little bit on the old side but even if you get an 800 yard season out of him he may not get 1200 but 800 i think you could get 1500 out of him. He may not get 1,200, but 800? I think you could get 1,500 out of him.

Dude, he had a – come on. Keenan Allen had 1,200 yards and 108 receptions, and he only played in 13 games. Right. 13 games. If he was younger, I would – I'm not saying he won't. I'm just saying when you look at his age, you're not taking it as it's a year-by-year thing,

especially with the fact that he gets injured a lot. So maybe he'll still do that, but he has to stay healthy, and age needs to not catch up with him. Also, Caleb Williams needs to pan out. So those are all things to consider. I'm naming his floor when I say on 800 yards. Can we at least agree on that? I'd say the floor is higher than that.

The floor has got to be higher than that. Sorry about the door going there for a second there. But I think the floor has got to be 1,000 yards for him at this rate. I know that he's a little bit on the older side, but, geez, he might be on the older side, but he's still putting up these numbers. How can you say that? Now, if you want to say that it's going to be the floor because we don't know how Caleb Williams is going to pan out, sure.

I can live with that. But I think that if Caleb Williams can live up to the. Sure. I can live with that. But I think that if Caleb Williams can live up to the hype, the floor is a thousand. Hmm. All right. I hear you. If DJ Moore wasn't on the team, I would say his floor is definitely a thousand because you're trading him to, for him to be your wide receiver one. If Keenan Allen doesn't work out in the way they want him to, but you still have DJ Moore, 800 yards is still acceptable because Keenan Allen is getting older. He's on the wrong side of 30. He's going to be 32 this year. And he also has a long history of getting hurt.

So my floor for him, because DJ Moore is on the team, is 800 yards. If he can get 800 yards, I think that's still a solid season. I think that's still a good pass-catching core, especially when you still have also Cole Komet, who's a top-10 tight end, who can get you 700 yards himself. I think that you could have both Keenan Allen and DJ Moore at 1,000 yards this year. You can. You definitely can.

I'm not saying you can't DJ more and Keenan Allen, their floor should be at one K. I'm not saying they can't do that. I'm saying Keenan Allen's getting old and he's very injury prone. So I don't have as high expectations simply because of that. When you get to the wrong side of 30, then you're taking it year by year. But when, even with the, in like 30 then you're taking it year by year but when even with the in like the injury riddled year that he had he missed four games and still put up those numbers when you have keenan allen on the field he's going to give you numbers he's going to make the offense work for you and whatnot he's going to get shit done it's like yeah he's gonna be 32 but with the few like you're gonna miss him for

maybe four to five games but when you have them for those 12 to 13 and then the playoffs oh boy it's it's gonna be reckless out there with keenan allen and it's gonna be awesome yeah i'm not telling you what i'm not telling you what I would want out of Keenan Allen. What I would want is definitely at least 1,000 yards. You're getting a $20 million a year wide receiver and a guy who's been perennially one of the better wide receivers in the game. I'm telling you what the floor is for what we can expect for him to happen, what we think will happen versus what we want to happen.

I think he very well could get 1,000 to 1,200 yards. Very, very much achievable. I'm saying at the very least he'll get 800. Yeah, he's definitely going to get 1,200. Sorry, I didn't mean to cut you off. I'm just saying, like, no, that's reasonable. And also, I just think that's reasonable and also i just think that i think that's a reasonable floor result and it's not just that he's old and perhaps injury

prone you know we you mentioned this but it all depends on if caleb williams pans out and even if he does you know you're sharing a space with dj moore andomet. And remember, DeAndre Swift is a receiving back in and of himself. And on top of that, new scheme. He's going to a completely different scheme. This is not just the chuck the ball down the field, the Keenan Allen chargers. This is the weird gadget Bears offense. Okay, I'll give you that one. I mean,

like I said, you make a great point with the scheme part difference, the scheme. Yeah. That'll, that'll definitely be somewhat of a hindrance. And what I think we can all agree that it really all comes down to the performance of Caleb Williams at this rate.

Yeah. That's I think we can, regardless of if I'm'm gonna bitch and moan about keenan allen should be getting 1500s and his floor should be 12 one whatever it's really all gonna end up depending on how well caleb williams can perform yeah i'd say i agree with that if he can't i mean if this kid can't throw the ball, then every single receiver on that team is going to have trouble racking up yards because we've seen how it has been with Justin Fields. His best success has been with running the ball,

and when it comes to throwing it, he can get DJ Moore, his top top receiver to blow up the yardage but when it comes to darnell mooney he can't make him better and uh if keenan if caleb williams is the same way they may all suffer i think at least one of them will i think i'm willing to bet regardless at least one of them breaks 1 000 yards out of willing to bet regardless at least one of them breaks 1,000 yards out of those three pass catchers. Can we agree on that? Absolutely.

I'll make a prediction and say both DJ Moore and Keenan Allen break 1,000. They could. But it also probably depends on how they end up playing around with it. I mean, like Keenan Allen, like in the Chargers offense, the chuck it deep type of offense, like, yeah, he's going to – you can definitely rely on him as the deep threat, and you can throw it to him 20 times a game and whatnot. But it also depends on how the Bears are going to end up calling their plays

around all these towns. Yeah. But I think that if they go about it the way i feel like that they probably could then yeah let me and before we end the show here i want to shed a little bit more light on that that bears offensive line everyone says it was bad again this year because Justin Fields was sacked top five yet again. Top five most sacked quarterback in all of football. Justin Fields held the ball longer than any quarterback in all of football. Out of all 38 qualifying starting quarterbacks, because there were some backups who stepped in um according to next gen

stats 3.23 seconds that amount of time to throw the ball was the worst out of all starting quarterbacks across the 2023 season if he's taking that long to throw the ball and you have you've got these sacked top five most in the league. That tells me Justin Fields more than the offensive line. And that goes back to that advanced statistic as well where sacks are more detrimental to the game than interceptions are. Yep. Which is very weird to think about because you throw an interception from your own 20, obviously depending on where you throw the pick,

but you throw a 10-yard pass, it gets intercepted, and you set up the other team for a score. But if you get sacked, then that's a huge loss in field position in itself too but the stats read that you know sacks are way more important in terms of how your um terms of how your offense is going to perform than an interception because i think another thing too about it is like say you got like Josh Allen. Like Josh Allen definitely has a turnover problem, but he takes a lot of shots downfield. So a lot of these shots downfield that turn into interceptions end up being –

it's like a 50-yard punt at that point. Yeah. Yep. And that just goes down to quarterback play. Knowing when to buy time to find an open receiver, when to stand in the being knowing when to buy time to find to find an open receiver when to stand in the pocket when to leave the pocket when not to leave the pocket too early uh knowing to how when to throw the ball out that's all game managing it's all stuff that's important taking care of the football not turning it over not taking sacks um that's all important

to a quarterback and it all comes down to decision making uh something that a lot of quarterbacks who may not be as physically gifted uh are able to do masterfully in order to stay in the league and be and have some level of success they pointed it out in the dynasty documentary too uh one of the first two episodes when they're explaining uh the reasons why they ended up going to brady over bledsoe and it was because um when bledsoe was faced with pressure it was like ernie to quote ernie adams not verbatim but it was like a wildebeest was going to was just standing still waiting for the lion to prey upon him. Now, granted, there's other factors why they ended up being like that for Bledsoe

because he didn't have the greatest line in the world in the 90s and he took a lot of shots. And so that's why he ended up freezing up a lot. But regardless, once you get to that point, there's not really any going back. Yep. Yeah. All right. That is all the scheduled content we have for today but do you guys have any other thoughts before we end the show tonight uh no not really unless you want to talk about the

patriots and the keen noun thing but right i did say i was going to go over that um yeah well i mean it's pretty simple uh the patriots were going to they did call on keenan allen and when they heard that the fourth round pick was the price they stuck their nose up and they said that's too pricey i think the the term that was used in the tweet was too rich. Yeah. Um, very interesting stuff considering he, yes,

he's some, he's pretty expensive, 20 million a year. Um, yes, he's old, but you're only giving up a fourth round pick. And also you have the cap space to do it. So there's kind of the issue um if you guys had any last last minute thoughts on that part but i mean we already kind of

bashed the patriots for not paying their players paying their wide receivers last segment but i mean the the the issue is is there and they they were already in on calvin ridley and it looked like he was about to sign there actually until the titans swooped in with an offer they offered more money than the Patriots, and the Patriots did not up their offer to leapfrog the Titans. Well, I mean, I know that I do. However, $92 million for Calvin Ridley is kind of obscene. I agree. I mean, I wanted him, but I feel that's kind of a blessing in disguise, you know. But then again, you know, you don't go after boyd or hollywood brown or try

to swing a trade because we know they're not gonna you might want them to but they're not so i mean at this point it's just you know it is what it is i'd have rather i've seen i mean i've already suggested who i've wanted for quite a while now i think T. Higgins is available for trade, then you go and get him. He's young. He's a tag in trade, so in all likelihood, he's going to end up going for a day two pick at the most. And if you pay him, he's 25. It's not like he's not going to pan out during that time.

We got some breaking news. Breaking news. The Rams have agreed to terms with Jimmy Garoppolo on a one-year deal. Understandable. He's not going to do anything, but understandable. Nice backup. Nice, as we said, game manager.

He doesn't have the best physical abilities, but he still wins games. So I think at his very best, he's a nice little game manager i don't hate him i never i never hated jimmy not great physical abilities are you referring to the fact that he's not the most physically imposing faster strongest arm or the fact that he is quite literally medically incapable of staying healthy both yeah both he's he's I mean, there's a lot of reason the Patriots traded him. I kind of, at this point, I'm kind of glad they did. He could have gotten traded a little earlier so that he could have gone for a first round pick.

But at the same time, I mean, the guy's just not a franchise quarterback. He helps you win games. He's a high-end backup, think to low-end starter i think that's probably the best way to sum it up yeah like he'll help you win games um he might even f around and take you to a conference championship every now and then but i don't see him winning a super bowl he'll take you to one super bowl he'll take you to a super bowl if if it's loaded with talent um but yeah i i do i like jimmy garoppolo i think he's a little overhated um all right well that it everything yeah unless you want to talk about ken Kenny Pickett get traded to the Eagles.

That's it. I don't. It's a non-factor. We don't need to talk about that. That guy sucks. I'm surprised he found a new team. Yeah. I mean, the only other thing really to talk about is that the Steelers basically solidified Russ as the number one at that point. Well, that was what we expected. Yeah.

All right. Well, that'll do it for us tonight. Thank you for listening to us. We have new episodes out on Tuesdays at 7.30 p.m. Eastern Standard Time and Fridays at 5 p.m. Eastern Time. Be sure to subscribe to our YouTube channel. We have all our episodes available on Spotify, Spreaker, Apple Podcasts, iHeartRadio, Google Podcasts, and so much more.

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