The Game with Alex Hormozi - Reps, Sales, and Pounding the Meat (with Andy Frisella) Pt.1 - Mar. ‘23 | Ep 557

Episode Date: July 1, 2023

"If you truly want to be an effective leader and salesperson, the best thing that you can do (…) is to make them understand how it's in their best interest to do those things." Today, join Alex (@AlexHormozi) as he guests on Andy Frisella’s Podcast REAL AF to share his journey from a 22-year-old gym owner to a successful entrepreneur. He discusses his innovative approach to sales and marketing that helped him launch five gyms without any capital. He also emphasizes the importance of gaining experience through repetition and the value of effective leadership and sales skills in running a successful business. This is part 1 of the interview.Welcome to The Game w/Alex Hormozi, hosted by entrepreneur, founder, investor, author, public speaker, and content creator Alex Hormozi. On this podcast you’ll hear how to get more customers, make more profit per customer, how to keep them longer, and the many failures and lessons Alex has learned on his path from $100M to $1B in net worth.Check out the episode on Andy Frisella’s YouTube Channel!Timestamps:(1:47) - How Alex started his entrepreneurial journey(12:24) - Sales skills learned through experience and on-the-job education(26:42) - Betrayal from close ones can happen with good intentions(42:00) - Pressure and pain can bring out brilliance and lead to success(50:01) - Opposition fuels determination to succeed(53:05) - Risks lead to success; handle betrayal gracefully for successFollow Alex Hormozi’s Socials:LinkedIn | Instagram | Facebook | YouTube | Twitter | Acquisition

Most people who are like in the beginning of the game, like you don't have a passion yet. Most of you, like most people are like, man, I just love this one thing. But everybody has shitloads of pain. Like that, whatever it is, the first rule of entrepreneurship is use what you got. And so like if that's what you got, then burn that. Welcome to the game where we talk about how to get more customers, how to make more per customer, and how to keep them longer, and the many failures and lessons we have learned along the way. I hope you enjoy and subscribe.

Without further delay, I've been telling you. you guys, we had a big guest coming on the show. And this is one of my favorite guests that we've had on the show. We haven't even done the show yet. But this is a guy that I've become friendly with and we've become friends over, I don't know what, the last year or so. Very, very, very brilliant man, somebody who's been very successful in business and life and somebody that I'm excited to have a conversation with. Please welcome to the show, Mr. Alex Hermosey. Thank you so much for the intro. Yeah, man. It's great to see you, dude. I'm pumped to be here. Yeah.

Hopefully I can live up to the intro. That's always the goal. Look, dude, all you got to do is be you. That's it. You know, out of all the people, and this is real shit, like all the people that I have watched on the internet over the last decade or so, there's only a few of them that I'm really like, okay, this guy really, really does understand how to build a business. You know, there's a lot of coaches.

There's a lot of pseudo, you know, knowledge out there. There's a lot of hucksters. There's a lot of people who, you know, are great coaches, not great operators. But, dude, you know, when I watch your content, there's a few other guys out there. And some of them really don't have a bigger followings. It's very apparent that, you know, you're very, very, very intelligent when it comes to business. And, dude, I'm just excited to have a conversation about it. So I'm stoked.

Yeah. So what we're going to talk about, dude. Let's start with your story, dude. Like, how did you like, how, because I, you and I, we've talked about all kinds of different things via text. You know, we talk about chat, GTP. We talk about GPT. We talked about, you know, different things going on in business, but, you know, I've never really got to sit down and talk to you about your story. So this is a perfect time to talk about it. It was wild. It's been, it's been, well, I'll give the quick, the TLDR. I was a gym owner in Southern California. So I had a consulting job. I did defense contracting, space cyber intelligence through a subunder booze Allen. Hated that job, actually. I hated it so much that I ended up quitting and driving across the country, not telling anyone until I was halfway there because my dad was going to talk me out of it and be like, hey, you don't need to, you know, like, let's just follow the path that we had.

And he was doing it because he just wanted to look out for my best. But I didn't want to do that. And so I showed up in California with no plan, showed up at a gym owners. Jim and was like, hey man, can you teach me? He was like, I don't know. Like, why are you here? I got shit to do. Yeah, yeah. Slept at his place. How old were you at this time? I was 22. Okay. Yeah. So I graduated a year early. from a school in Tennessee. And then that way I kind of got a jump start of my career. I saved my extra money. And then I had about $50,000 saved up when I was 22 to start a business. And I wanted to start a gym.

And so that was because I was into fitness and I hated everything else. And so that was like, I guess I'll just do this. From there, I spent 12 weeks with that guy. He started work at 4 a.m. And work until 4 p.m. 4 to 4 was his shift. And so I did that. And then I also stayed at the gym after that. Learned a little bit of the ropes.

Started at Jim in Huntington Beach. didn't have enough money for both, slept on the floor there. Because, you know, I could only pay one rent. Yeah, I get it. It's very similar to how I got started, dude. Very similar. And it was by chance, I went to a weekend workshop two weeks before I started the gym. And it was this guy who was teaching something called Facebook ads.

This is 2013. So I was like, I mean, I was like stroke of luck, crazy, you know, coincidence. And I was able to run Facebook ads to get like my first 25 members in the gym and we were able to grow by 5,000 a month every month for the first, you know, seven or eight months. And at that point, I, you know, started bringing people in and getting a manager and all that stuff. And then it pretty much started working out. Open a new location every six months after that until I had five locations. At that point, I met Layla. And I got asked to speak at this event. And like, I was not in that world. You know what I mean? I was like, I'm a gym

owner. He's like, no, I want you to talk about how you're marketing for like brick and mortar. And I was like, all right, man. So I went up there and I was like, this is what I do. This is how, so I was able to open all my gyms at full capacity on the first day. That was kind of like the unique thing. So what I would do is I would sign the lease, put the deposit down, and then I'd start running ads immediately. And it would take me 30 days to open the gym. And so like I would spend 300 bucks a day, is. And we were getting like 30 to 1 back on our ad spend. So we're making $100,000 in our first month. And so, like, you know, as the cash is coming in, I'm like buying flooring.

And then I'm like painting the walls and like getting the equipment in it. Like I had this whole order because I knew that like by the time the equipment got like I had to have the paint like, you know, all that kind of stuff. And so we'd open at full capacity only using the cash that I got. Hold on. Those stories are the fucking ones that people love. Like you, we got plenty of time. Yeah.

We got plenty of time. Just because I talk fast in the intro. Like, dude, I love that. So you pre you, so you pre sold the memberships. And then use the money to actually build the gym out. So what I would do is we would do these challenges. We do these six-week weight loss challenges. And the whole shtick was that it was free if they lost the weight.

And so people would basically bet on themselves. They bet $500, $600, $600 that they would hit. I think I had, I think it was 10% body. I'd change the challenge. But it was like 10% of your body weight. So if you were 200, you lose 20 pounds, et cetera. And they had six weeks to do it. And they'd work out as many times they wanted.

We'd give meal plans, grocery list, food preparation, instructions, eating out guides, all that kind of stuff. And so every week I'd sign up, you know, 25, 30, 40 people. And this was all one-on-one consultation. So, like, I would do 20 to 25 consults a day every day. And I did that for years. Even when I had my own gyms, like, I still sold better because I just had more reps than the other guys.

So my guys would, like, set appointments for me. So I'd like, every day I'd go, they'd had set like three days worth of appointments. So it was like stack, sex, sex, like, and so you just get, you know, just get the reps in. And I was, I was referred to that as like my rocky cutscene. Like, no one knew where I was. And I was just hitting the meat in the basement and just getting those repetitions in. And so anyways, I'd put the, just have $5,000 to put down for the lease and just enough money to start the ads. And for us, we'd get ads, we get leads for like five bucks.

And we'd sell one out of four leads into a $600 thing. So it's like, it would cost me 20, 25 bucks to get a customer and I'd make $600 up front. Yeah. And then two days later, I'd sell them supplements, you know, $200, $300 for the supplements to go with the program that they just bought. And then the stick was three weeks in of their six weeks. I'd be like, hey, Dorothy, you know, let's be honest, you have more than 20 pounds to lose. what's your plan after this, you know, things over. She's like, well, you know, what's the ultimate goal? She's like, I just want to get to my high school weight.

I was like, okay, so you just so work clear, you know that in the next 21 days, we're not going to do that, right? And she's like, no, I understand that. I was like, but long term to the goal, she'd say yes. And I was like, all right, then you won the challenge. And she was like, because you realize it's not about six weeks. And so I was like, so this is what I want to do for you. You have the 600 bucks. I was like, I want to credit towards the goal that you really have, which is the high school weight.

I was like, I'm just going to put towards the year. And that way, like, you win today. You're in. You're one of us. Here's the T-shirt. You know, like, you're part of the family now. And so I just set my membership at 50 bucks higher than it was supposed to then I usually ended up selling it for. So it's like 250 a month, got dropped down to 200-month because I take the 600 divided by 12. And so that credit them 50 bucks a month. And so just like that, we were able to go 600, you know, 250 and sups. And then I'd be able to get the membership all in the first month. Compare that to the business model where someone's going. going like free month up front and then converts one out of three into a $99 a month membership. Yeah. My ability to convert cash so much faster was front loaded so I could outspend everybody in my market, which is also why I could launch them all for no money out of pocket because every day I'd spend $100,000, I get $2,000 back. And so that cash is what allowed me to open so quickly without having capital of my own as a young guy.

And that's how I was able to scale. That's awesome, dude. How, how did you think of that? Like, how, like, what? it's a long so I'll tell you the story so that gym owner that I that I went out to right so I Googled like successful I mean you know because whatever it was 10 11 12 years ago Google like successful gym owner and this guy had this like crappy HTML site and it said seven figure Sam all right and I was like cool seven figure Sam I'm going to go talk to this guy and so I get to

California and he's got like a little group of gym owners that like all just share their you know share their stuff it's just gym owners and And I didn't have a gym at the time. And I was like, is it okay for me to be here? He was like, yeah, sure. And so that way actually got to learn all the stuff that they had done wrong before I started my first gym. So I was like, oh, don't go too small because of this.

I don't go too big because of the rent. Like, hey, keep it under this per square foot. Like all these things that like I would have no idea. Like, I would have known that. And so one guy was there and was like, hey, I got this promotion. He was in Wilmington, so like South Carolina. It was like, I've got this promotion that's like doing really well. And so he was doing this like eight week thing.

And what happened is some rich guy, some rich entrepreneur apparently, was like, I won't pay for it. But he's like, but if I hit my goal, you give me my money back and you can use my testimonial and I'll like promote the shit out of you. And he's like, and the thing is he did that. And like all these other people like, yeah, I want that thing. And so he was doing an eight week thing. And so Sam started doing it at his place for his personal training side.

And I was like apprenticing under Sam. And the thing is like, I just saw like the ratio of how many we could sell versus how many trainers. I was like, this doesn't like make sense. And I was like, what if we put it in the boot camp? Because then we just put as many people as we want in there to get people go on. He's like, you think people pay 500 bucks? I was like, they care about the weight. They don't care about like what the experience was. And so I ran an ad with that. First was technically for Sam spot. I ran the ad before we even knew that Facebook ads even worse. So the first ad I ran for Sam. And I think, I can't remember what we spent, but we made money on it. And

it was like, holy shit, this works. And so I sold the first 10 or 12 people or whatever at his gym. And then that's what I, when I went to go plant my Huntington Beach spot. That's awesome. But it was like an iterative like he did the first guy did eight weeks and it was like, it was all about the testimonial thing. Sam cut it to six weeks and it was all about personal training. And then I added in like a nutrition template thing.

So I template it so it was like faster to move through people and made it one to many rather than one on one. And that was kind of like the, and added Facebook ads to it. Like, that's what when those, when those came together is when it just like flew up. That's awesome, man. Dude, you said something in there that really caught my attention. It's something that we talk about on the show a lot, especially on the Q&AF episodes. A lot of these young dudes, young girls, too, they want to learn how to get good at selling and

they want to learn how to sell. And you said the answer in there, reps, reps. And I just wanted to point that out. Like, you know, you guys ask that all the time. Like, how do I learn to become an effective sales. person, which by the way is the most effective skill that you could ever have. You could ever possess, ever, ever. If you can, if you can learn how to sell and you can learn how to manage people, there's always going to be a demand for your skill set. And what Alex said in there with his reps,

I'm assuming that's, this is where you really, like you said, hitting, you know, pounding the meat. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? I don't know what I got a girthy meat pounding going on. Yeah. I checked the CRM like, because I still had access to it right when I sold my gyms three or four years later. And I had 4,000, like, confirmed kills. So, like, closes, not consults. And, like, that just, that's a lot of sales. Yeah.

It's a lot of conversations. Face to face, every single one of them, one on one, just like. I tell the people, I'm like, dude, get yourself in a good retail job. Get yourself in a retail job where you can, like, people that, I don't want to work retail. Well, fuck, you're an idiot, them, dude, because, like, you can learn, what you're learning in a retail operation is so much more valuable than what you're actually getting paid most of the time. They're working for you.

Like your employer, like, especially if you're newer, your employer is working for you and also happens to be paying you. Because like most people come in with basically no skills. And so then like on the job, that person, it gives you an education and pays you to learn, which is why like nowadays it makes almost so much more sense to just skip straight to just the on the job education, whatever industry you want to be in because you'll learn about the industry at a broad spectrum. But then you also learn more tactical sales. But to your point about like selling being the most valuable skill, if you just like boil it down to first principles of. okay, if I want to do something, you can either learn how to do everything or you can convince somebody else to do that thing for you who's awesome. And if you can convince somebody else to do every other thing that is required to do in the business, then like you can have an amazing

business and only know how to do one thing, which is get other people to do stuff. That's right. Leadership and sales, if you like, okay, well, what's leadership? Well, it's being able to influence other people to do the thing you want them to do. Sales is pretty much the same thing. Yeah. One's more transactional, like depending on the type of sale, but yes, I 100% agree in every way. Dude, what I found too, man, is that like if you truly want to be an effective leader and salesperson, the best thing that you can do to get these people to do what it is that you need them to do as the manager or the CEO or the operator is to make them understand how it's in their best interest to do those things.

And a lot of people don't operate their business that way. I found that out after coaching an Artae group for so long with Ed. You know, I found, and, you know, the point of the group is that people need to learn things, right? I'm not knocking anybody. but a lot of people don't understand that like your mission, your purpose, your, your values of your company really come from you showing the people that work for you how their lives are going to benefit by actually listening to what it is that you ask them to do. And a lot of people bail out on that, dude.

They come in, they want to run a business. They want to put their feet up on the, on the, they want to go to the lake on Thursday and come back on Tuesday. And they think that they're running a company. You guys ain't running shit. You're running yourself out of business. I don't know, man. It's just interesting.

The whole dynamic of small business is super interesting to me, dude. It's what I really like. Like running bigger companies is and like it's fun. I love coming here. I love being around everybody here. I love what we do. I love what we do for the people that are customers or companies. I love all that.

But man, there's something about that like the beginning, like where you're really hustling and you're really learning. And like I do miss that a lot of times. That is exactly the, I mean, that, what you just expressed is the reason that we decided to go with Acquisition.com, which we can get to later. Yeah. Because we can pick companies up right at that like, you know, one to 10 million in profit size.

And like they're still figuring out some of that stuff. And so like there's a, you know, there's a chain of teeth wetting studios that we're looking at and like in the diligence process. I was like, man, it's like, your physical product sales are low. And they're like, yeah, we're still struggling with that. I was like, I fucking promise that I know, like, I'll figure out how to get everybody to leave with a kit. I promise. And like when I was figured out, so we have a chain of 38, I think, photography studios. It was our first personal investment, Layla and I made outside of like the

normal real estate and stocks and stuff. And now when we spent like six months trying to figure out a way to just like re-engineer the sales process and ended up just massively increasing the ticket size and the take rates at the same time. But anyways, all of that comes from like a thousand tiny conversations that you notice someone paused. You're like, I said that they didn't hear it the right way. How can I rephrase this? Or is a way, if I put this first, does that influence how they see the rest of the conversation? You can't do that without the reps. No.

And dude, it has to be like this. It cannot be through a text or through through through, I mean, now it probably can be. But when you're learning, you know, for, for you guys who are trying to learn these skill sets, dude, the acuity that you have to have to read someone can only come from that scenario. There's no, there's no coach that can teach you that. door knocking, cold calling, and or retail where you have 20, 30 people a day walking in. At least. Yeah. And when you do that, it's like, that's the, it's the tiny little pauses where someone says something. And you have to, like, if you have to, if you have to be reminded, you don't know it well. So, like, it's a sales guy. Like, if you have to think about what you're going to say next, it's kind of like wrestlers when they're on the mat. Like, you sure don't you know what you're going to be shooting to counter something. Yeah. That someone else is, like, you're not like, okay. They just pulled my wrist. So now, and it's like, you're fucked already.

Yeah, you're done. Yeah. Do you wrestle? I did in school. Yeah. Yeah. Not that great. No, I did.

Yeah. No, that's cool. Wrestling has been an awesome, awesome life teacher for me. Yeah. Awesome. Talk about reps. Yeah. Like, okay.

Yeah, do a single leg take down and do it a hundred times every day. Walk out. Just, just walk out to a match where everybody's watching you. And it's just you and one other person. And there's no hiding whatsoever of any sort. Like, it's a, totally different kind of thing, but that's a whole other conversation. But dude, so when we're talking about, so you got the gyms open.

And because I do want to talk about where you are now and what you do because secretly that's what I want to do. So I, I'm to the point now where I'm just like, dude, I love the creative process. I love the lay of the land. I love showing people, you know, like your dental, teeth whitening thing. Yeah, right. Like I love, like I'm like, you guys are missing it here. Yeah.

I love being able to show those kind of things. And that's, but I don't want to do them. Yeah. I don't say, I don't want to do them anymore. I've been doing them for 24 years. I might do it for 25, just to say 25. But it's, it's cool what you're doing. So where did you go?

So you got the gyms going. Yeah. Now what happens? So got the gyms going. I spoke at that conference, right? And I talk about this, hey, this is what I'm doing. I showed everything. Like, I didn't, I was just like, that's my ad.

That's my landing page. I was like, here's my phone script. Here's like I just showed I didn't know how presentations worked. It sounds ridiculous. I got off the stage and to this day, even with all the media and press, I have never been more bombarded my life. Like there was like a three rows deep circle around me and like for the next two days that like guys were like peeing in the urinal next to me like, hey man, like the whole thing.

For context, I got 150 business cards just from like the stage to the bathroom. Like it was insane. And I got back and I was like, man. And they were like, what can I buy from you? I was like, nothing. I was like, I own five gyms. I was like, they're like, how do I do it? I was like, that, that thing. That's how I do it. And so what happened is, or sorry, no, I'm just saying, like, I'm, I'm sitting here and I'm just like reflecting on all of the shit you're telling me and how parallel it is to my story, dude. It's like so parallel. Like, it's so parallel. That's how I got into speaking too. That was the exact same

thing that happened to me. I got asked to talk about our retail success because we had supplement superstores, which we still have. And I got asked to come talk about it and show how we were how we were able to grow it. And it's the fucking exact same story. Supplements, fitness. I lived in the back of that first store. Bro, like, it's just crazy hearing it. It's cool. It's probably always see the world in a similar way. Yeah, yeah, definitely. Definitely. Well, that's funny because you guys don't know. So Alex and I, we know each other, but like we've never actually met in person. We text and we talk about things that are important that are going on. Like, hey, what do you think of this or that. Like when something's

truly big that's happening, like when Chet GPT came out, he and I were talking because I wanted to get your take on it because like it was so, so huge to think about. So when these big huge things, I like to get Alex's brain on it because Alex has a nice brain. All right. It's girthy. Yeah.

So, you know, smart people do that with people that are smart, you know? And so, but we haven't got to sit down and talk about the actual story. But what was funny was this was probably just like what in November or whatever when it started in December. And we started talking. I was like, dude, you sold supplements, didn't you?

And he's like, yeah. And I'm like, I could tell. Because it was so like the thinking, like we were talking, we were talking about this before the show actually aired. Like how you have to think about product that you're going to sell to someone that they don't actually want but need is a completely different mind process than selling it something that they want. Like, bro, if I was selling shit that people.

want. Like, I would be worth a hundred billion fucking dollars. Like, but I sell people, all the shit I sell is shit that people they need, not want. And it's just a totally different game. Anyway, I didn't want to interrupt your story. I'm sitting here thinking, there's a lot of parallels there. This is the same story. How old are you? 33. Okay, dude, I'm 10 years older than you. That's awesome. Yeah. Maybe I'll be here in 10 years. Now, bro, you, you're fucking doing it. Anyway, sorry. So, uh, so this guy reaches his arm through and he's like, here's my credit card. He said, run it for $5,000. Tell me what I get later. And I was like, what? Like, what? I didn't like, I don't, I don't even, I don't do anything. I'm a

gym order, right? So anyways, mind you, I'm not that rich. And so like, you know, all the money I had would open new locations, et cetera, et cetera. And so I get back home. I put all the business cards into an Excel sheet. And I start hitting people back up because that's, you know, I was like, hey, thanks again, you know, whatever. And so this guy's credit card. And I was like, I called him up. I was like, do you really want me to run this for five grand? I was like, because I will. And he was like, yeah, run it. And I was like, okay, so I swiped it.

And I'm still on the phone with them. It goes through. And he's like, all right, what do I get? And I was like, I don't know yet. I was like, but I promise I'll make you more than five grand. Yeah. That was what I said. And so he was like, well, you know what?

I've got a gym opening up in D.C. Why don't you fly out and just do your launch thing? And I was like, okay. I'll do that. And I'll spend all the money on the launch. And I'll get to keep all the upfront sales. But then you get all the customerize I sell for free. So like, after the six weeks is over, you convert them.

and I'll show you how to convert them, and I'll give you all my plans and all the stuff. And you can put your love on it. Right. It was free customers for him. Yeah. And so as soon as I knew I was fine out there, I was like, okay, well, if I'm going to be there,

let me see what else is going on. And so this is like unfortunate, but my mom got really sick at the same time. And she was in Baltimore. So like they're right next to each other. And so I was like, shit. So I actually had to go there early. And while I was there,

I only had a couple hours a day of visiting hours. And so I was like losing my mind, just like trying to stay busy. I was like, I'm nothing to do. And so I reached out to a friend because I'm from Baltimore. And he was like, hey, my buddy's got a gym and he's sucking wind. Like, if you want to help him out. So I give the guy the same pitch.

I was like, hey, man, I got nothing to do all day besides my visiting hours. I was like, can I just work your front desk and like sell shit? And he was like, sure. And so in like 14 days or something, I think I made like 60 grand. And I was like, man, and I don't have to do any of the employees. I was like, this is the shit. I was like, I'm all about this. And then I did the lunch in D.C.

and then he referred me his like father-in-law who had a gym or something like that. So I went to that gym and I did the same thing. And I flew back and had this big stack of contracts. And this is just when I met Layla. Like we'd met like within 30 days of this period. And this is like how I convinced her to quit her job. So I stack because I first date, I proposed to Layla. But I proposed that she quit her job and joined me.

Not like proposal proposal, but I did propose her at a first date. Like, damn, man. You move it. It came in hot. And so every single time we'd see it. I was like, you quit yet? And she was like, no, I just fucking met you. No, I'm not quitting my job.

And so finally, she picks me up from the airport. And she was like, you're taking me on a date. It's been like, we've hung out like 30 times and you've not taken me a day. I was like, yes, I did promise that. And we will go on a date, but can you do me one thing first? She was like, I got these contracts. I haven't processed any of them because I'm a sales guy and like, I don't do details. But like, I have all the credit cards and I'll show you how to do it.

And she's like, fine. So a zillion, you know, two phone books of contracts later. she like rent she was like that was like $125,000. I was like dope right? And she was like, is that legal? I was like, first question she asked me. I'm still some dude from the internet. She met at a frozen yogurt, you know, like whatever. And I was like, yeah, it's legal. And she was like, art of man. And that was it. Bro, that's like a wolf of Wall Street. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I was 20, I think I was 26. That's crazy. And that was from like a month of sales. So I was like, and that was just like, right?

my father was like, this is, I like this. This is way better. So I told her, I was like, I want to do this. Like, and all started because that guy was like, run five grand, tell me what I get. Yeah. I was like, dude, way more money. Yeah, he forced you into it, dude. He did. And so, anyways, I was like, all right. That's so crazy. It was nuts. And so I was like, all right, well, I'm going to go see if I can get other gyms. I still had all those numbers from the business, the business events. So I start calling these people up or whatever. And so I start booking out like launches. And she's like, all right. So she flies with me. So mind you, now, We're living together. It's like 30 days later. She's living with me in a motel room and I'm teaching

how to like close this stuff. But she was, to be fair, Laila was number one salesman in triangle square, which is the most popular 24 hour fitness in California. So she was the number one salesman at the most, at the most trafficked gym. Like she could close. She got skills. Oh yeah. Yeah. Real quick, guys, if you can think about how you found this podcast, somebody probably tweeted it, told you about it, shared it on Instagram or something like that. The only way this grows is through word of mouth. And so I don't run out. ads, I don't do sponsorships, I don't sell anything. My only ask is that you continue to pay it forward to whoever showed you or however you found out about this podcast that you do the exact

same thing. So if it was a review, if it was a post, if you do that, it would mean the world to me and you'll throw some good karma out there for another entrepreneur. And that's why I picture on the first day. When she told me that I was like, if you can sell, I was like, we can make a shitload of money. Yeah. That's the first day. And so anyways, we start flying out and doing these launches, right? And so she gets all of her friends to quit her quit their job. And this is where the story goes wrong. So I was like, okay, I don't want to split my attention. I've got these five gyms. And so I sold those gyms. And that first guy did the $5,000 thing was like, hey, man, I think you're leaving a lot of money on the table because you're

like literally launching these gyms and you have no equity in these businesses. He's like, I'm a really good operator. He's like, I'll come behind you and I'll just like staff them up. So you just, you fill them. I'll staff them and you just do the next one. He's like, we can open like two gyms a month. And mind you, because we didn't have to put any, like, real capital down, because we could front it or whatever. I was like, all right, cool. Let's do it. And Layla was like, I thought we were doing it. I was like, oh, yeah, change of plans. Even though you quit your job, it's all good. Right? Layla's tough. Yeah. So I do this. We go to this, I sign this lease. He's like, hey, I've got bad financials. So like, you're going to have to personally guaranteed.

I was like, sure, no problem. He's like, yeah, in the build out, you know, you'll front all that. That wasn't a red flag of you at that time. Yeah. Well, I'll tell you. Yeah. And so, you know where it's gone. Well, I've had a couple of those. I'm not one thing to two because I seen a thing too. Yeah. So I took the cash, put all of it into the now the new account, because that's what I thought you did. I sold them. And I was like, oh yeah, well, he's, he's my partner in this new. Makes sense, right? I already know. Yeah. And so I sell my ass off at this next launch because I'm like stoked. I got rid of the five gyms that I felt like free. Like I had backpack, you know, like me and me and my voice and just like go collecting credit cards.

I saw 376 people in six weeks, which is a lot, like 600 to pop. Right. And so there's cash from my sale and the cash from this to like launch this gym, week up one morning, all the cash is going. And I was like, oh, fine. And I was like, what happened here? And he was like, I took my half. And I was like, what?

Hmm? He was like, I know you've been skimming. And I was like, I put the, skimmed for myself. Like what? And so I've never been accused of stealing ever, my entire life. So I was like, I don't even know how to handle this. So I just called a mentor and he's like, print out the bank statements and just go line by line with him. I was like, that sounds reasonable. I'll do that. Yeah. So I print out the bank statements and I like literally did the whole thing. Went and I, and I drove over to where he was. And as soon as I sat down with the thing, he just took it.

He was like, I don't need to see any push it off the table. And I was like, oh, you don't actually think I stole. Like as soon as he didn't want to look at the numbers, that was like my. Yeah. I'm taking, I'm taking a show. shit and it's taken. Yeah. Yeah. And so he um, he had, uh, wired the money to his, uh, girlfriend who lived in Sweden. Um, it was, it was, it was gone into oblivion. And he had been indicted for fraud two years before that. Um, shocking. Here's where the, here's where the silly Alex part comes in. I already knew that when I started doing business. And he was like, it was just a big misunderstanding. And I was like, I believe you. Bro, that's what a good heart does. Dude, I've been

burned like that same shit. I would want a second. I was like, you're not going to. I was like, You're not going to ruin for life. You know, like, it was a misunderstanding. Like, it was a technicality, you know, whatever. How much older was this guy than you? Was he since 40s? Yeah. I was 26.

Right. Yeah. Dude, I've been burned so many fucking times by that same mentality. That same thing. It's, it's, but good heart syndrome. Well, no, dude, it's the second chance thing. Because, like, dude, what it is is like, you, you know, like, at least for me. Like, I know that I'm not a perfect person.

And I know that I've done a lot of things in my life. where had just a certain thing gone in a different way, I would have ended up completely fucking different. So when I cease people who have like made a mistake or they, you know, serve jail time or whatever it is and they're out and they're doing their thing, I don't really hold it against those people because I say, okay, well, they probably learned a lesson because I would have learned my lesson. Yeah. And then what ends up happening is they didn't learn that lesson. Yeah. The scorpion and the frog. Yeah. Now you got to learn the lesson. Yeah. And that's like that I never, I never like, it never really dawned on me that whole saying like when money meets experience,

experience gets the money and the money gets the experience. But like, that's a good one. Yeah. I heard that and I was like, that's what that was. That's exactly what that was. And so now I've got this gym that has payroll trainers, lease, and there's no cash. And I had just sold my gyms. I was like, wait, I don't want to operate these gyms.

And he's like, well, you got to manage that one now. And I was like, dude, I didn't go from five plus one, whatever you want to call this one to to go back to work in the front. Like, I felt like I had, like, moved up. I want to do these launches, whatever. And so... That's crazy because, dude, had that guy not gotten greedy,

how much fucking money he could have made? You know what I'm saying? Like, dude. And so what ended up happening is I basically, whatever savings I didn't put into everything, like the vast majority of what I had, I put into there. But I couldn't sell anymore,

which is the only thing that I'd ever known how to do really, really well. And so I was like, I felt like neutered. Like I had like handcuffs. I was like, I can't fight back because if I sell more, I have to keep this gym open and I don't want to keep this gym. And so I drained my savings every week with payroll and rent and overhead because I couldn't bring new cash in. And all the things were prepayment.

So there was no new cash flow at all because that's how the sales cycle work. Right. And so it went down. And in six weeks and I had to tell everybody like, hey, I'm actually closing. They're like, you just launched this gym. What are you talking? Like, it was horrible. And like, it's like, Lela.

I just gave her my checkbook and I was like, you have to write the checks. Like, I can't like, it just, it just crushed me. You know what I mean? And so basically drained me down to, I think I had $20,000-ish thousand dollars left. So, mind you, like, I had five, six gyms. I could crank cash if I needed to, like, all the way down to $20,000. I was like, and nothing coming in. No, and I just given up four years of my life building the gyms and I had nothing to show for it.

Yeah. Like, I had nothing for it after all that, you know, effort. Sleeping on the floor, I was like, for another. Right. Yeah. And so she was like, for nothing except all the skills. That's right. And so we're now, this is what's going on.

There's this launch that I got a guy in San Diego to do. And a guy who had seen me speak at that conference or whatever hit me up. He's like, dude, do you have any sales work? And I knew he was a pretty good sales guy. And I got this gym in San Diego. He's like, that's right down the street for me. And this is like a national like, whether they're not. You know what?

This might actually help me out because I can like build all the shit I need to be building. you go do that thing. So this was going to be my get out of jail free card. We launched the gym, the guy crushes it, does $170,000 in sales. And it's like, fuck yeah. And now I'm sleeping at Layla's parents' house. Yeah. This is when she, her parents first meet me.

They're like, where did you find this dude? Yeah. It's like, oh, from the internet. He's the guy who put everything and live in motels with, Dad. He's a winner. Oh, man. This is my first, yeah. Oh, man.

And so it's December now, right? And December of 16. And so he crushes this launch. But I'm like looking at my my bank account. I was like, where's the fucking deposit? Like Tuesdays are my day. Tuesdays was always the big one because I got all the weekend and then it would all settle.

And I was like, where is this damn deposit? It's like Wednesday, Thursday, Friday. So I call on Friday. I was like, hey, what's going on? They're like, oh, we're doing a standard review of your account. And I was like, I've been with you guys five years. Like, I've never had a standard review. Anyways, they're like, just call.

It should be fine. Next week is now going into Christmas Eve. All right. So it's Christmas Eve now. And I'd call it a couple of times. They just gave me the run around. And I got on and I was like, I am not getting off the phone until you give me the money. Like I need the money to pay the sales guy to run my business. And this is the point where Lela had told all of her friends to quit their job. So I have $23,000 left. I owe the sales guy $22,000 in commission. He needed because he had a sob story, new baby, blah, blah, blah, whatever. And I hadn't gotten the money from the sales yet. And so I didn't want to get myself a chance to think about it.

And so I wired him 22. So I had $1,000 left. This is the 24th Christmas Eve. Her dad's like, he seems a little stressed. It's supposed to be a joyous event. Oh, yeah. So two days later, the 26th of December was basically when Jim's kick off the New Year's sales stuff. Like the day after you just start, because it's this dead week where everyone's got time and they feel fat.

It's like you crush sales. It doesn't start January 1st. It's because everybody's going to do it. Yeah. So they're willing to pay for it now. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, yeah. I'll pay today. I'll start in January.

Exactly. And so the campaigns were going to kick off with her six friends being the six sales guys. Because like big ambition Alex was like, oh, we're going to go from doing one to doing six. Makes sense. Let's do that is the first real thing we do. It was 3,300 a day in hotels, airfare, car, rental, ad spend, et cetera, before commissions. I had a thousand dollars left. And I was starting 48 hours later because I was expecting to get the money that I never got.

I also, by the way, never got that money. Still to this day. Never got the money. What the fuck could they go? They said they're going to hold on to it for six months because it was a regular So I was basically running my national launch thing through my local gym. So like I'm processing stuff in Canada for a gym out of like they were right to do it. I didn't know any better. I just thought it was like, yeah, you process money through the POS.

So like I'm running memberships at my gym that has more memberships than like any other gym but no one's actually there. Anyways. And so we do these, we start these launches and we start getting like 60, 80 contracts a day. I have no way to process money. So I'm spending 3,300 a day and I can't make money. I'm just getting all these credit cards, all these contracts, and I have nothing that I can do.

So all the way, so this is like the 26th of December, all the way to January 29th, I don't have a processor. Because at this point, if you get kicked off of a processor, it's like going to jail. I remember that. It's like a, yeah, it was a big, you get a big black mark. It was hard to get another one. Yeah. Because there used to only be a few, a few processors.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. If you heard of them. Yeah. Yeah. And so, and they had all the power. There wasn't any, you know.

Yeah. And they were, they didn't care either. No. Yeah. And I was a, like, they're like, fuck you. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. And so. Yeah. But when you get big, it's different fucking tune. You know, now they come in here and suck dicks to get our fucking business. Canada. That's fine. Well, that's it.

I don't think I don't fucking remember, assholes. Right. Just saying, because I've had to deal with the same shit. It was horrible. And so it's one of these crazy things that is a business you forget about. But, like, if you cannot process money, you, fuck. Like, there's nothing you can do. And so anyways, I talked to everybody I knew and got a porn casino, high risk, whatever guy

to take my money, right? So they were going to get like 8% processing fee. And then they had a 10% reserve on top of that. So like 18% of my sales went straight. 10 was held in escrow and then gets deposited six months later on a rolling basis. And then 8% just goes to them for the risk thing. I was like, whatever, I need the money. So 29th, I processed.

And he's like, oh, by the way, you only have a $50,000 limit. And I'm like, dude, I need so much more than that. And he was like, tough. I run 50. He's like, oh, but by the way, it's per month. So like February 1st, he's like, you can run another 50. So I ran 50 on January 29th, 50 on February 1st. And that was the $100 for the $3,300 a day that I owe.

code and my credit card was at zero, still was broke, but I was at zero and then got two, three more processors, got them going. And then all of a sudden, we're at, like, we did like 170 or 180 that next month. And I made like $30,000 in profit. I like looked at it. I was like, I think we got out of it. You can breathe now. Yeah. Next month comes, taps me on the shoulder one morning. And I was like, what's up? And she was like, there's a problem. I was like, what do you mean? There's a problem. She turns her laptop towards me and there's this like waterfall of negative transactions. She just keeps scrolling

as she's talking to me. And I was like, holy shit. And each one of these is like as big as my rent. Because $500, $600, $600 was like my rent. And there's just hundreds of them. And I was like, I just felt like my stomach drop. And I was like, what is this? She was like, oh, one of the gym owners told all the members that we filled up at that gym

to refund and sign up through him for half what we charged. Because we held the processing risk, which was part of the issue with the first thing. And so So charging you back at this point. And so this is all my new high risk processor. Yeah.

And I'm like, fuck. And you're just starting to get some rapport with this fucking guy. Right. And so another guy, that guy tells another guy or something that. So two gyms do this. It's $150,000 in refunds that I didn't have because I just. No, because you know the one guy I fucking calls the other guy and says, hey, this is what we're doing. And so, because we would sell and we'd leave and we go to the next gym.

But they had all the customers. And they built the relationship, which is a flaw in the model. You know what I mean? Like, I didn't get it yet. Mind you, there were other gyms that were totally cool, really appreciative, awesome, hardworking people. Like, absolutely. We did 30-something launches.

Only two of them had that happen. But like, those two were big. Yeah, they were all my profit. And so I'm like, how the fuck am I going to kind of come up with 150 grand in profit, not revenue in the next 30 days? And so Lela, being the smart woman that she is, took all of her personal training clients and brought them online when she came with me to do this flying around the country.

thing. And she was making like three or four thousand a month. And I was like, wait, tell me more about that thing you do. And she was like, it's all margin. Yeah, I don't work that hard on it. And I was like, okay, you're the business now. I'm going to market and sell it. I'll bring the sales guys in and we're going to push your thing. So in like two days, I write a sale, a whole sales letter. We white label everything to Queen Transformation. And we start running ads and she starts closing in a thousand bucks a day, all profit. I was like, okay, if we get eight in, we can do 8,000 a day, minus ad spend that's, you know, like, I'll be at 150-ish in profit. Like, we could do this. And so we start doing that. So I'm going to call all the guys that, all the gyms that

were supposed to launch the next month. So we had, I think eight gyms that were supposed to launch the next, the next, you know, the next month. And I get on the phone with the first guy. I was like, hey, I'm getting out of the business. I'm selling straight to, you know, straight to consumer, like new chapter. Sorry. And they didn't really pay me anything because I made my money on the, on the sales. And he was like, dude, I just refinanced my house. like you did this from a buddy of mine. I know you can do it. Like I need your help.

Whole thing. And finally I was like, dude, I'm not flying out there. And he's like, fine. Okay, can you just show me what you did

at his place so I can do it here? And I was like, all right, fine. He's like, well, how much? And I remember just knowing you was broke.

And so I just picked a really high number, a high number I could think of just so we'd just say no and I can just like move on with my life because the other thing was working. So I was like $6,000, which I know that sounds ridiculous now, but that was like, who would pay $6,000 to them, right? Yeah.

And he was like, 6K? And I was like, yeah, $6,000. Dollars, U.S. And he was like, oh, done. I just remember, like, looking at the phone and being like, you just know you made a shitty-ass deal, bro. And I was like, but I still get goosebumps. I'm thinking about it now because I was like, holy shit, six thousand.

And I was like, oh, what car do you want? Because like, it's like, if you have to think about it, You don't know well enough. Like, I was already asking for the credit card, but like, my head was like, what just happened? Yeah. And so then I was like, shit, I got seven more guys to call. So I call the next guy.

And I was like, well, now I got to make this damn thing. Right. I just promised this guy. Same conversation. How much? I was like, eight grand. And he was like, done. And I was like, next call.

Same thing. 10 grand. Done. Next thing. This is just to teach them how to do. Yeah. I was going to license in my whole thing. So I was like, you'll use my ad.

So like, we don't have to test shit. Like, it's a video of me. works. Yeah, like every, like the whole thing. And I'd already built 80% of it because it was my internal training. Like how I trained my sales. Like all the sales training was done. All the nutrition's, all the stuff was done.

The only thing that wasn't to them was how I ran the ads in the landing pages. That was the only thing that was like missing that I had to build. So anyways, in one day, I did $60,000 and like cash collected selling the air. And Layla had been on the phone all day closing because she's still closing the weight loss thing. Like she's trying to like give us food. Yeah, yeah. And she comes in and I was like, Hey, babe, was out of sale?

And she was like, yeah, I was like, I think we might have had a change in direction. And she was like, what do you talk? And mind you, think about how what she's been through. Yeah, this is you've already gone. We're here, here, here, here. She's like, again, and I was like, I think we're still in the gym business. It's like, I think I was just doing it wrong. And she was like, what do you mean?

And I like told her. And she was like, well, is this what we're going to do now? And I was like, I guess so. I was like, it made a lot more money than the other thing. And I was like, I think we could cover all the refunds with this. And she was like, well, how are you going to get gyms? I was like, well, I have 30-something gyms. We already did the turnaround.

So I'll call those guys up. They know what it works. And so that's what I did. And so I called all those guys up and sold almost all of them into the thing. We did like $300,000 like in profit. I think it was $2.15. I remember that it was $2.15 that next month. And I covered all the chargebacks, all the refunds, everything.

And what happened now is that all those gyms that I did the turnaround thing with, they ran the play. And the average amount of cash they collected new cash in the first 30 days of you in the system was $30,000. So context, that was the average. So for context, everyone's listening,

the average micro-jim owner, like, so that CrossFit guy down the street, he's probably broke that you know, or that boot camp owner, like, I'm telling you right now, he's, yeah, the average owner takes home $36,000 a year, net income.

And they work 80 hours a week plus. You know what I mean? Like, it's less than minimum. It's, yeah. Anyhow. So for them, this was life-changing money. Right?

And that was the next, month they could do the play again. You could relaunch your gym. The problem that they started running to is they're like, dude, my gym's full. I want to sell more people, my gym's full. And I was like, that's why I started a launch and go model. Because I had, I had more ability, I had more firepower to sell in market than I had square footage to sell into. And so from there, because it's the tight-knit community for micro gym owners. And then the word of mouth just took off like wildfire. We did 300, 480, 780, 1, 1-2, 1-5, 18, 2, 2, 3, 25. that was per month the next

each month like I can still remember it and we finished that year that like which was really just the half of the year because remember it was like January I'm still doing the launches thing that got all fucked up so like Juneish is when that we switched the licensing so we finished that year 6.8 with 3 million in profit

and the next full calendar year we did after that was 26 million top line 17 million in the EBITA yeah and it was just like I you know what's crazy you're nuts you know what I I hear when I hear this. Because obviously I'm thinking, like as you speak, I'm thinking, like, dude, you talking about like the credit card processing.

Like we've had those issues, the same, all of that shit. But dude, the main theme, I think that people need to pull from what you just said for you guys that are out there. And you tell me what you think. But I know this. My best shit comes when my back is against the fucking wall, bro. Like, like the ability to somehow, my. my brain, I'm sure yours must work the same way.

When shit is really fucking bad, that's where the brilliance comes out. And, you know, sometimes it takes that pressure, man. Sometimes it takes that real pressure to really think and also push us into the positions that we're meant to be in. You know, that's an incredible story. I mean, one thing that I got a lot of, you just kept showing up. Like, you just don't fucking stop. You just don't quit.

Yeah, when you got to pay back $150. fucking grand. Like, what do you do? You got to show the fuck up and figure it out. Otherwise, like, at that level, that ruin your life. That'll ruin your whole life. I'm even thinking of it from the standpoint. Like, I have to keep reminding myself while you're talking.

I'm like, he was fucking 26. Yeah. 26. He's 26. Like, and thinking, like, you know, the day and age that we're in right now in society, I can't think of another 26-year-old that would fucking be able to do it. I can't think of a 36-year-old. You know what I'm saying?

Like, I'm like, listen. Let's separate step mentality. from just not fucking quitting. What is the separator? I have two cents on it. Just for the record, I do think that there are some savages out there. Yeah, I agree.

Who would order it. You just don't really recognize. Look, dude, nobody knew who Alex Hermose was when he was doing Alex Hermosey building Alex Hermose. Nobody fucking knew. Nobody knew who Andy Priscilla was when he was learning the shit. Like nobody fucking knew. There's plenty of people out there right now that are fucking,

especially with the technology that we have that are 19, 20, 21, 22, 23 years old that are fucking savage motherfuckers. And dude, this is why I go so hard on the technology. I'm like, dude, do not get yourself funneled into a one-trick pony where, you know, because what you've done well, and this is, this is a very, this, you're the example of the, of what I try to tell these young, these young bucks is like, look, dude, you, yes, you know Facebook ads. Yes, you know, that's a tool.

That's not the brand. And if you can, like what Alex has done is leveraged his one tool into many skill sets into branding that now he's doing, and we're going to get to that. But now do an amazing shit with. But dude, I love hearing that story. I fucking love it because it's very, very parallel, dude. It's very parallel, man. I think a lot of times the, because it depends who you talk to, but sometimes people talk about how like the hard times build you. I'm not sure if I totally agree.

I think a lot of times the hard times reveal you. Like I think a lot of people have that savage that's inside and they just haven't had the environment to pull it out. To pull it out. Yeah. And then give themselves evidence that it's there. Yeah. But like to your point, we were saying earlier, like I knew just on like whatever,

whatever the level that is that like I didn't know when I would be successful, but I did know that I wasn't going to stop. And like I feel like, I don't know if that comes off the way, take it the way I mean it. No, I think that's the true. You know, I understand what you mean. Yeah. I just knew. I was like, I just know that I won't stop.

Like that I can commit to. I was like, I just won't stop. When I was growing up, dude, like when, when you were growing up, like as a kid, were you ambitious around like making money and stuff? Like entrepreneurial-minded? No. Really? Really.

But what I did want to do is make my dad prop. Yeah. And so that was my, you know, driving force. And then, you know, I won't get into the nitty gritty. But basically, like, I think you either have to have a really big carrot, which everyone talks about, like, finding your passion, whatever. And, like, I actually am pretty against it. And I'll make my point in a second.

But, like, I think that most people who are, like, in the beginning of the game, like, you don't have a passion yet. Most of you, like, most people are like, man, I just love this one thing. But everybody has shitloads of pain. Like that, like a lot of people that can't find passion. I was like, can you find pain? And they're like, yep, I got lots of that. I got anger.

I got shang out of pain, whatever it is. I'm like, cool. Well, the first rule of entrepreneurship is use what you got. And so like, if that's what you got, then burn that. Yeah. Like, you don't need to necessarily find this passion like this beautiful carrot. Because that, to me, that's not what got me going. That's not what got me going.

Who was the mission of gym launch? Don't be broke, Alex. That was the mission of Jim. Like, people were like, what was the big vision? I was like, I had no vision. It was like, don't fucking lose all my money. Like, that was the whole vision. Yeah.

And so all that, all that to say, like, for me, I think it was like away from fear, which is like I, I was, I knew, like, in my bones that I would rather die than go back home of, like, bailed. And then have to, like, basically do whatever. It's zero option mentality. It's zero options. My dad, I knew that, like, it was the hardest thing for me to leave home because, like, my dad had a lot of influence. And I say this is not a bad way. Like, he just wanted what was best for me.

It's strong Middle Eastern father. I had no siblings. basically no mom. So it's just me and him. And so like imagine all of the authority power that you have in your life and all the love that you have for your siblings. It's just with one person. So like his opinion mattered a lot to me. And he did not want me to do this. And so like I defied him to go do this gym thing. And I was afraid, which is why I left and didn't tell him until I was already physically gone. Which obviously he wasn't happy about. And like that kind of put a little bit of a rift in our relationship for a long time. But like I just was like, I won't.

I just like, I don't want to prove him right. I was like, I'm not going to let him be right about this. Like, I will just keep fucking going. And I almost was happy if we didn't talk because I was like, it just gives me more time to keep doing. Like, I didn't want to update him because I was fucking sucking. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

I agree with you, dude. Like, I think there's, I think, and this is, you know, I caught a lot of heat about this for a long time until people figured out who I was. But like, you know, when I started making content, like, they got recognized back in like 2015, everybody thought it was fucking insane because I would talk. about like the dark side right like dude like listen i'm gonna shove it down your fucking throat like that's what the fuck i'm gonna do i'm gonna fucking do that forever like and i still i'm still that way like i just don't talk about it that way anymore like now when i see someone say oh you're not

you're crazy like you're not gonna build the next nike you're gonna motherfucker just sit there and watch like you've been watching for the last 20 fucking years give me another 20 and we'll see where the fuck i am you know what i'm saying like i i have no problem with that and i feel like the use what you got is what's got me here. You know, now I do feel like when you get to a point of where you have to, you have to manage many humans, hundreds of humans,

thousands of humans, there has to be a, there has to be a mission and a purpose to motivate and, and propel people in that direction. Like if I walked into my meeting and I said, motherfucker, we're gonna fucking crush everybody.

And like, that was it. Like, everybody's like, yeah, but like who? Like where? Like so, you know.

Yeah. And I do feel like there's a, I feel like, you know, there's a point to where that transitions, right? But, but dude, I totally agree. And I agree with the, with your perspective on the, on the revealing too. I think there's a little of both there. I think the hard times definitely, like, dude, that whole time, right? That did build you, right?

Because like, look at all the reps and all the skills you learn. Right. They've carried through. Yeah. And I bet, you know, you probably learn more during that time than probably any other time. I know for me, that was true. You know, I learned more the first 12 or 13 years I was in business where I really got my ass beat than I've learned in the last, you know, 12 or 13. But I do think that's true, dude.

I do think a lot of people don't put themselves in a position to ever truly know what they're actually capable of. They quit too early. Or they're just too afraid of the discomfort. You know, like, I think people tend to look at risk the wrong way. Like a lot of people say, well, what's going to happen if I do this? And I think the question really is what's going to happen if I don't do this? I've always thought that way. That's how I always think.

Like, if I get a big idea in my head that I think needs to happen and it scares me, my question is never like, what am I going to lose if I go after it? It's what's going to happen to me if I don't do it. It's always been that way. but I think there's way I think you look at it both ways yeah you know that entire

story is so it's just so relatable to to what I've been through to be where we are it's just it's fucking cool to sit here and listen to it I want to do the guy so the first

the older gentleman that fucked you did he like whatever happened to him nothing no he just stopped he just continues to do what he did then yeah bro sometimes you you got to chalk those things up too dude

like because like you got to just chalk like because I been burned like that too. Yeah. And, you know, real talk, like,

I'm not going to say what I was going to say. Because like, those people don't get away from me. So, but, but, but you can't let it eat you up, man.

Can't let it fucking eat you up. You got to look at it as what I learned. Yeah. And, when you, when you fucking, when you said, I,

I, I, I, I, I, I, I, what you said exactly, but you said something about him not or doing this in the past or something.

Like, I'm like, oh, here we go. You knew it. It was like, of course. Yeah. Fuck, it's brutal. People are brutal, dude. Yeah. They don't give a fuck, especially when there's large sums of money involved or perceive large

some money, you know, and you can tell a lot about people, too, how they judge large sums of money. Like, that guy's a fucking idiot because had he stuck with Alex, this guy would be worth 100 fucking million dollars right now or more. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. Or way more. So anyway.

So what happened after this? And to that point, you know, I had a mentor that I was just kind of like talking my life through at this point, which was like in shambles. And he was like, all you do is do write by everyone. He's like,

and then he's like, the only way you can walk out of this is by knowing that you don't have any strings in the back your mind of like something's going to come back. He's like, you have to write every one of those refund checks. you handle every chargeback he's like pay every debtor or whatever you know like everybody you owe

he's like he's like because then you walk out clean he's like it's the only way you can get out of it and so that's what we did during that that's when I gave Layla the checkbook and all that kind of stuff and then I had a different mentor where it was actually my high school that was 15 years old but it was always just like less than he increased I was like

I'm sure like many of us like when you're younger, you're a little angrier right yeah I just get really pen up about some guys who I just thought were like douchebags to me and I was like man I can't wait to come back for our 10-year high school reunion. I was like, I'm going to show them. Like, blah, blah, blah. And he's like, no, you're not. Yeah. He's like, if you go up to somebody at a

10-year high school reunion and you say, like, look what I've done, motherfucker. He's like, they're going to be like, you've been thinking about me this whole time. Yeah. He's like, just remember this. He's like, success is the only revenge. That's right. And like, he's like, and all you do, he's like is you just become bigger than them. He's like, so that who they are in reference to you shrinks into irrelevance. Yeah. He's like, so you don't, he's like, you don't crush them. He's like, you shrink them in comparison to you. That's right. And that was like, like, whenever I had like these hard, hard situations, like, with that, you know, with that gentleman, like, the goal was like, I'll just be so big that he

will become irrelevant. Yeah. And so I, that's at least how, how I handled that.