The Greatest Generation - The Crystal Direction (DS9 S2E15)

Episode Date: June 4, 2018

When Sisko and O’Brien discover a crashed freighter on a desolate planet, they find the hat enthusiast survivors have formed a society around their unhinged leader. But when they discover that hotboxing is being used as a form of punishment, it’s up to O’Brien to discover the secret of why no one can escape. Do Adam and Ben need an eye exam? What wouldn’t we give for a Juan Ortiz box of DS9 cards? Does a hand phaser have a setting for wood? It’s the episode where we don’t hate you, we hate how nude you’ve made us become!

Priority 1 message from Starfleet coming in on Secured Channel. Hey friends of Disodo. Before today's episode, we just wanted to take a moment to talk about the historic labor actions being taken by writers and actors in the American Film and Television industry. If you're a fan of the work done by the people who make Star Trek, we hope you'll join us in standing in solidarity with the folks who actually bring these adventures to life. Over the past several years, the AMPTP, the organization that represents the American Film and Television Production Studios, have reduced the profit from movies and TV going to workers. And in so doing,

they've attempted to weaken the labor unions that represent those workers. They wouldn't even engage the unions on many issues in their negotiations. And so a strike was the only course of action to take. Adam, Wendy and I have been having a lot of internal discussions about how best to stand with the unions and we are continuing those conversations in a dynamic situation. We're doing our best to understand where the picket lines are in these digital spaces,

and we would never intentionally cross one. With the information we have, we feel like we can do more good talking about and supporting the strike and continuing our show as planned. We'll keep you informed about what all this means for greatest trek specifically. Today we're making a contribution to the Entertainment Community Fund. This fund exists to help all the people whose livelihoods have been put on hold because the AMPTP refuses to negotiate

in good faith with the unions. It provides financial support for writers, actors, and all the thousands of laborers who make the shows that we talk about here and without whom we wouldn't have Star Trek to cast pot about. Those folks are all out of work because billionaires, company shareholders, and the executives of these companies don't want to compromise on the length of their yachts. We hope you'll join us in supporting entertainment workers in a challenging time, especially after they've already endured several years of challenges brought on by the pandemic

and season two of Star Trek Picard. We've set up a page where you can also contribute. It's at friendsofdecotoforlabor.com. That's friendsofdecotoforlabor.com. That's friendsofdisotoforlabor.com. Link in the episode description. Okay, now let's get on with the show. Here's to the finest crew, Deep Space 9. It's a Star Trek podcast. A couple of guys who are a little bit embarrassed to have a Star Trek podcast.

I'm Adam Pryantica. Let's go, let's forget. I've been Harrison. You almost forget what show we were doing today. There are a couple ways I could answer that question. The one I'm going to choose for the purposes of this answer is I was really marinating in the idea of that of what I was about to say. Yeah. Still true to our words, still a little bit embarrassed. Well, we marinate for between five and 35 minutes

at the beginning of every show, Adam. Right. That's what we like to call our Marin Open. Lock the gates! Big fans, do you want to do something with this Marin open? Namely, open packages of Deep Space 9 trading cards? Let's do it, Ben. It's a beloved bit.

The game is five cards, the game is exceeding. It's simple. One of the suggested cards there. Time to pluck a page. How we usually do it is we turn this into a little contest and we try to go into one of us gets a special card right? Right. I think last time we opened a lot of packages. Which I'm fine with. The gift of this case of cards was mighty generous. Yeah there's a lot of them in here. The issue with these cards specifically is that they're stuck together. Yeah, what did they do?

Were they stored in a humid warehouse or something? Listen to this, I have a stack of cards to get here. They are one solid object, I'm gonna put a little flex to see if they break apart. See if the mic picks it up. Oh yeah. You got that? How about this one? Oh yeah. That's the sound of semen being, I think, separated from paper after it's dried, right? If you say so. I'm sure a solid percentage of our listeners don't know what that is because they were born

in an era where it was not possible to find a porno magazine in the woods. Those innocent times. The first card in my pack is a photograph that is totally out of focus. It's an episode card. It's for an episode called distant voices, and it looks like maybe an old bishier with like a party hat, standing next to a garrick and a lady, but that's only a guess because the picture is very blurry for an unknowable reason. It's uh, it's hard to offer fair criticism of these cards without feeling a little uh,

ungrateful. But if I may be allowed to do that, these cards are shitty compared to the TNG cards. I'm just gonna say it. Like, Bill Tilly finds eight better stills in every episode than some of these. Right. I have two cards in this pack. One is just season two and one is just season five. And one of the things that's fun to see is Jake and a onesie that we're very familiar with in season two and then a much more groans up Jake and a much more grown up get up in season five. I think the highlight of my pack of cards is for the episode called Resurrection and it

is a shirtless Vedic barile. Hill yeah. On the card with what looks like a freshly fucked major Kira with her hand on his unclothed chest. She's got that freshly fucked look about her. Yeah. I'm going to open up another pack of cards. We're going to get letters.

Oh shit, Ben. The top card is the card for today's episode. No kidding. I've got paradise. That's fun when that happens. Also, out of focus. I have a special card. It's a like a foil embossed card. Oh.

It's an image of the space station and it says ships of the Dominion War and I guess the ship of the Dominion War that this one is here to commemorate is Deep Space Nine. One thing that's interesting about it is that the back is upside down relative to the front. That's weird. The one card that sticks out to me from my pack is another out of focus shot. This time of Deep Space Nine itself and it's got a broken pylon. Oh! It's floating out into space the episode is called To the Death. Oh snap! Hey I've got one for Whispers the episode we watched last week. I like that up. Yeah that was good. I'm gonna open up another pack. I don't know what we are hoping to find here, Adam. If you get five cards that are all in focus, I think that should be another way that you win.

What are they working at the card company and they're like, yeah, that's good enough. But it's not in focus. Nobody cares. Oh, I got an Aliens and Anemies card for Jake Sisco. Oh, I got an Aliens and Anemies card for Grand Negus Sec. Hey, I got whispers too. Hey, fun. I have cards in here that I'm not even aware of,

because they're stuck to the back of other cards. I'm gonna keep opening. I really want one with a piece of costume in it. Oh, there's another sanctuary. That's two sanctuaries so far for me. Oh man, I have one for far beyond the stars. Do you know that episode, Adam? I just read about that.

Yeah. It's gonna be a heavy one. Ships of the Dominion War, a Romulan Warbird in this one. Weirdly a shot of Romulan Warbird facing away from the camera. I don't know why you would pick that as the angle to show. Not its best angle. No. Alright, last pack.

Last pack. I think you're clearly the winner at this point. The only way you can dig yourself out is if you find a fragment of costume. That would be amazing. Who's costume would you want? I guess the answer... I should put the... I should put the caveat, don't be creepy. Hahaha. So it can't be a... a kid and it can't be... a lady. I think... yeah, I think that's fair. I guess just Cisco then. So it can't be a kid and it can't be a lady. Yeah, I think that's fair.

I guess just Cisco then. Yeah, I guess that's the only one. That's the only one that's acceptable to say. Oh, I got an allies and enemies card again. This one for Lita, a very fetching bejure and lady. All right, I'm going to play a little game with you. I'm selected 5 cards and these are all episode cards and I'm gonna tell you the title of the episode and you guessed whether or not the card is in focus.

Wait, what are the rules of this again? You just guessed whether the card is in focus based on the title. Okay. So, if you get three, I don't know. I'll postmate's six pack of beer to your house. Whoa! Ha ha ha! Challenge accepted!

Alright. First card is an image of Odo looking not great and the title of the episode is Broken Link. I'm gonna guess Infocus. Yeah, I'd say you got that one. That's one in the W category. It's not super in focus, but it's more in focus than out. It's not in the filmmaking parlance tack sharp. In a sophisticated monitor you're not

going to get that nice red outline. Yeah, your peeking is not coming in. All right, here's an episode called Little Green Men, the images of Quirk and Rom looking very excited. I'm gonna guess also in focus. Well done, Mr. Pranika, you are one away from six pack of beer being delivered to your house by somebody who's probably not being paid a living wage. Uh, a six pack of Heineken for... for Pranica. One of them is empty. That's my tip. Uh, alright. Next episode.

An episode we've already watched at him. Uh, it's the episode... Malora. And it's an image of, uh, Bashir and... Andsen Malora having a... Zero G make-out sash. This is tough. Like, I'm trying to get into your mind a little bit. Like if I'm running

this game, do I really want to offer three Infocus cards in a row? Especially if I've already guessed two Infocus cards in a row. But do you think that I think that youth would flip three and focus cards in a row? All I'm saying Adam is never go up against a Sicilian when death is on the line. I'm gonna say out of focus, Ben. It is very out of focus Adam and you have won the game. Do you want to try and go for perfect? Yeah, let's keep going. Okay.

I'll send two six packs if you're perfect. Oh. Can you get beer delivered in the state of Washington? I should have checked that before I made that offer. How about... How about we drink that beer on your porch when I come down to visit for Max Funcon? Oh, that sounds great! How about we take the non-living wage labor out of it?

I feel good about that. Yeah, enrolled belief about the sharing economy app that I have never used because I'm worried it's exploitative. Should they want a sponsor or show in the future? Fucking asshole. That's cold blooded. Yeah, well, you know, nobody, no ethical consumption in capitalism at him. Alright, your fourth card is for an episode called Second Site. It's an image of Jake and Ben Sisko. Ben Sisko has his arm around his son. I think it would be hilarious if the second sight card was out of focus.

So just for the lulls I'm gonna say out of focus. This one's actually in focus. Yeah, Jake is not in focus, but he's closer to the camera and the point... But that's a depth of field thing, right? The focal plane is on Benzisco and it's like actually well printed. Sure. The Molota card by contrast looks like they may have taken a picture of a television screen and just printed that. All right Adam you've got three out of four do you want to guess on this on this fifth card? I do what are we looking? Okay, this is for an episode called Homefront. It is Ben Sisko in a TNG style uniform.

So he's got the red, has the main color of the shirt with the black, yoke part, and then you've got Jake, and I think that's Ben Sisko's father, And Benzisco is like holding his father up, his father is in distress. Jake is, is there comforting both of them? Very dynamic, a lot of movements in the shot. Um... I feel like you're trying to throw me off with all this detail.

Well, I'm just trying to, I'm just trying to describe it. But, yeah, it's, it's the main thing that you notice in this is that Benzisco's father is in a great amount of distress. I think they're going to want to give those characters the respect of an in-focus shot. And so I will say in-focus is my guess. Sadly Adam, this card is really out of focus. Ah man, what I wouldn't give for a one or two to S9 pack. That's terrible.

Are you at one? Come on! Get it together, one! Don't you know the people want some cards? Wow. That's a pretty fun game? It is a game that makes fun of the product and the work that went into it. Yeah, that's kind of a sort of like our show.

That's the biggest kinds of assholes we get to be on this show, I would say. Yeah. I think there are other DS9 cards out there though. I feel like we could find some other. All right. I don't think we were married to these. I mean, our standards for DS9 cards are basically one. Do they not stick together? If not, good enough for us.

Yeah. Well, let's pivot on over to show and talk for the rest of the episode about Season 2 episode 15 Paradise. Do you realize how many credible this seems? No, of course you don't. We're going on a road trip at him. Or more specifically, Cisco and O'Brien are going on a road trip. This is a fun moment of, oh yeah, Ben Cisco is a character on this show. It feels like it's been a long, long time since we've seen him.

Yeah, since he got an app. Yeah. It's true. I think boy did they give him one this time? They really did. This is a Ben Sisko app. They're having a conversation early in this episode about the idea of O'Brien taking Jake on as kind of a protégé, too. I think this is something that Jake wants, too. Jake really feels like he has a lot to learn from O'Brien.

I mean, it's like this conversation really plays off of the conversation between Jake and the Replicant in the last episode where Jake is like interested in building a ham radio and O'Brien is the local radio nerd. And what if the only difference between the O'Brien Replicant and the real O'Brien was that the Replican O'Brien was like a great teacher and and real O'Brien just fucking sucks at teaching. Chicks, I thought this is going to be a good deal for me. This is terrible.

They should have been observing him more closely. That would have been a dead giveaway, like drinking coffee after 3 p.m. Yeah, I like this amount of exposition up front because you get a little bit of backstory into how O'Brien got the career that he did. Yeah, we didn't talk about that coffee thing, by the way, in the last episode.

Did you think that they were having him drink coffee a ton in order to make, is like a bit about Keiko saying he would never drink coffee after 2pm? Like really, really sticking it to her about not really knowing her husband. Yeah. She fails the newlywed game on Deep Space 9. Yeah. Yeah. I like the, like, we know a lot of the broad strokes of this, but it's kind of providing connective tissue to how O'Brien came to serve on the Rutledge and how he got putting that uniform and stuff. For the entire run of Star Trek, we have been trained to understand that when you're on

the Enterprise, you're one of the best of the best, right? With very few exceptions. But I don't get the sense that if you're on deep space nine, that is what your reputation is. No, it's not the, I mean, like Bashir sees it as potentially that. Like he can go distinguish himself here. Right, but for Bashir, I feel like he knows he's slumming it a little bit because he wants to be Dr. Bashir medicine man.

Yeah, he does. Yeah, so the story here, though, is that they're looking for M-class planets that are kind of in the Bajurin wormhole neighborhood so that the Federation can have some more some more like easy proximity to the wormhole kind of feels like they're They're itching for any excuse to go on a road trip one one thought crossed my mind that O'Brien is looking for more away time after his ordeal in the last episode. My other thought is like, things have to be pretty slow around the station for the station commander

and the head engineer to just like, peace out for a couple of weeks and go hunting for planets. But maybe that is the case, you know, maybe your average span of a couple of months on Deep Space Nine are not that exciting. Yeah, I mean, a lot of ships don't even want to take short leave there.

So maybe this is a great way to put some variety in your job for two guys who have pretty boring jobs. So they end up scanning for life forms bin on this planet. Yeah, there's actually a song for that, Adam. Do you know how it goes? I'm sorry, you sort of broke up. Yeah, no, there's a song for when you're gonna

scan for life form because it turns out the sequence of buttons that you have to push on the panel actually make kind of a pleasing melody. You know what's great about this is that I know I'm editing this episode and that drop will not be played. You wouldn't edit it out when I say life forms. You precious little life forms. And then he does like the,

one of the best parts of this episode is when the O'Brien breaks out in song. They find the life forms but because their sensors cannot penetrate the scattering field above them they decide to investigate these life signs the old fashioned way. They've detected humans down here but they can't get in touch. So they beam down, and the second they're on the surface, tricorders are dead, their communicators are dead. One one fun thing that happens is O'Brien pulls out his phaser and starts pressing the trigger of it without like looking down range to see what it's

pointed at at all. That was one of my favorite parts of the app. Just waving it around. Like, you know that's a beam weapon. Chief, like he just saws down 14 trees. Oh, he's worked. Everything else is broken, but the phasers are good. Fasers are good. The Timbersaw setting. We're ex-great. They are set upon by a couple of dudes, one of whom has a bow and arrow. Put your hands up.

And that's our throw to theme song. Yeah, after theme we come back and we meet Joseph and Vinad who are wearing tattered clothes. Humans that live outside of the Federation are always weirdos. Boy is that the case. They get brought back to camp where they find the remnants of a crashed ship and the town that has sprung up around it. It's a bit like a medieval town where there's like a cathedral in the middle and then everything else just kind of radiates out from it.

It looks to me like this was a cargo ship full of floppy hats. Hahaha. Because half of the town wears one. Yeah, when we were getting ready for my wedding, at some point my father went to like a hardware store to pick up some stuff and invested in like six really big straw hats because it was you know LA and everybody was working out in the sun. And so there was just a moment where I was like looking out at

the place I was going to get married in a couple of hours and looking at like my dad and my future father-in-law and like a whole bunch of people writing these just like giant super dork yeast draw hats Real flashback to that. They were all dads though, right? They were all dad types. Yeah, right That's why yeah when you're a dad type you put on a hat like that no question. Yeah These people they don't even have to be dads to make that fashion choice no question. Yeah. These people, they don't even have to be dead to make that fashion choice. Really a great familiar that lady in this scene, Ben, is one Julia Nixon. As Cassandra, she is one of the bubblier townspeople. Everyone has really got that cult happy vibe to them, you know, like they are so warm and greeting

O'Brien and Cisco as so welcome to be there. Yeah, you know, I welcome this warm is not without strings attached, you know. Yeah, and welcome this warm usually comes with an orgy not long after. Yeah, we're all married to you now. Great news. These people have been here for 10 years, so they're not completely disconnected from reality. They do want updates on sporting events and how women's fashion is going lately. That's one thing that Julia Nixon is very keen to find out about.

Julia Nixon was on TNG as a Helms person. Yeah, I wonder if it's the same character. Oh, canonical Julia Nixon TNG type. Yeah, she was like, yeah, it was a Helmsman on the Enterprise for a little while, and I decided, Starfleet wasn't for me. Then I heard about this lady Alexis, and I just really dug what she was saying. So I decided to throw my lot in with her. I love that head cannon.

I don't think the timeline quite works. I don't think this is 10 years later. I'm not going to look it up. I'm just going to believe it to be true. Well, maybe if you believe that like months and years go by on Deep Space 9 without much happening, and that's why Cisco and O'Brien decided to hit the road, maybe it does work. Julie Nixon's great. Yeah, so amidst all these updates, they meet this woman Alexis.

She's clearly the leader and she's got major goshiven vibes where she's, oh. She's like, very convicted in everything she says. Like she's never, you know, tossing something out as a trial balloon or saying something that she doesn't believe 1,000%. That is a great call about the Goshiven thing.

I also got a heavy dose of the most toys vibe from her throughout the app, right? And that she wants to impose her belief system on other people. Yeah. With a nice dusting of yoga teacher slash homopathic medicine specialist. Yeah, she's telling everybody about toxins and... She's wearing that crystal deodorant that doesn't really do any deodorizing. Yeah. It's like $8 a thing at the natural food store. I don't know who buys it. There are many crystals that she believes in the powers of, and this one, the failure

of that crystal is easily demonstrable unlike the one that's supposed to make you have better relationships within your family. You know, for a couple of years, I used the crystal deodorant, Ben. I'll cop to that. I'm just not going to make fun of it. I'll admit to having used it for about a year. Yeah. It didn't work.

It's a salt crystal. So like logically it made sense that it would absorb moisture. Right. But it did not, Ben. Said like check often in Wrath of Con. It did not. Is the idea that you're just getting enough salt in there?

Or is it just that it's so saline that it's killing the bacteria? I think that had an idea at all. Is a fallacy about the product. I mean, I've definitely knocked it off with using so much soap and shampoo. Like, I don't really use shampoo that often. Once every two weeks. It seems like we've been sold a bill of goods, W slash R slash T, what it requires to be clean,

that is not entirely true, but it's possible to over-correct in the crystal direction. BELL RINGS I'm, yeah, I'm like a once every four or five day hair wash person, and I don't think that's wrong. I think the thing about that is hair that is a little bit dirty looks better. I think freshly washed hair, it's all frizzy and poofy.

I don't like that look. Yeah, you don't wanna look like a frizzy poof. You know what the best hair is? The best hair is post pool or ocean hair. Oh yeah what the best hair is? The best hair is post-pool or ocean hair. Oh yeah. Post-ocean hair is a great look. Like the kind of hair you can't even run your hand through because it's all tangly. I like that look.

Yeah, that's a rugged look at him. You know what that is a look of? That is not the look of a person who's been marooned on a planet for 10 years. Yeah. Everyone's hair looks fucking great. They landed with a two craft, one of which was just stocked to the gills with shampoo and conditioner. It's nothing but straw hats and spray conditioner all the way down. Gold to cotton, gold to cotton, so. They've got a very like a grey and lifestyle. They've got you know, they've got crops that come right up to the edge of their little

town play set. You know, they've got rules like they're like, yeah, you can hang out with us for a while, but we all work for our supper. Everything feels cool at first, but this episode is really good and has great performances and stuff, but one thing that is not so great is that the writing really can't get out of its own way. And one example of that is that like multiple times they're standing around going like, yeah, like, you know, I'm an engineer and I didn't believe in all of these kind of, uh, uh, lead-ite ideas that Alexis was putting out initially, but then I got into it and

It's been so great ever since and then somebody comes in and goes there's somebody sick and dying Right as a counter example to the truth of the statement that was just uttered Yeah, you can see the threads of the formula throughout. Yeah, like working in the field and O'Brien is talking about how Kako, you know, he sucks at plants, but Kako loves them. She'd love it here and then suddenly, like, the hot box is revealed. Joseph's like, yeah, I mean, she sounds cool and everything, but do you have orgies? Have you seen the butt-sized pairs we have

like the continental breakfast? Yeah, so they do a little bit of reading of what Alexis is about. And she's one of these, she's kind of polymath thought leaders where she's written a lot of the things she believes down in books and has commented on everything from, you know, art to literature to philosophy and she's a back-to-the-land anti-technology

radical. She really doesn't think that technology has much to offer. Obviously, the technology of like living inside of a house or cultivating crops is okay. The technology of shooting an arrow out of a bow is okay, but any like electromagnetic-based technology she is against. And that includes medicine. She's a fairly substantial collection of vanity press books. And like so many Gideon's Bibles,

she has placed them throughout the compound. Yeah, yeah, Cisco gets into his room and checks the little end table next to his bed. Sure enough, a couple of her books in there. Into the toilet tank, you go. Yeah, I read that Ian McKellen rips out the homophobic stuff in Bibles in hotel rooms that he checks in too and throws them away, which I'm not really clear on like whether that's like a property crime or not, given that like

it's not really the hotel putting it in the room, but I think that's a pretty rad move. I think a rad room would be to not put Bibles in hotel rooms. That would be pretty cool. I can get behind that. I think there's hotel rooms that have like the declaration of independence in the constitution instead of the Bible. Yeah, that's great.

Yeah, I mean, if you're putting reading material in there, I feel like there's a lot of different directions you could go. One specific religion might not be the right one. What we're getting at is how uncomfortable prostilizing is, and that is what Alexis is all about. She is more and more forcefully prostilizing her way of thinking upon Ben and Miles, who they choose to call by their first names in kind of an overt passive aggressive act to me.

Like, there are no ranks anymore for them. They're trying to get the passive aggressive act, eh? Yes, Ben. You can read about it in my book. Is it just a book about Seattle? Yeah. There is. Yeah, I think that it kind of first becomes urgent for Cisco Nobri, and when they see the

sick girl, and she's like wasting away on this bed and they've wrapped some leafs around wound on her arm and I say that there's like a local disease carrying insect and she's willing to victim to this and they're like, oh fuck, well we've got a medical kid on the runabout. We'll like work a little harder on getting in touch with that and we'll beam that thing down. We'll get her squared away. And she pushes back really hard. If you want to put your efforts to good use, search the forest for something else we might use. And her stated belief here is if we spend any time thinking about a safe coming from outside of this community, this community will die because we've got

there's a field here that prevents any technology from working and anytime we waste like pining for a technological fix to our problems is time that is killing us. And the creep factor really gets pegged here, because once you start talking about controlling people's thoughts. Eee. So back on the station, Dax and Kira have received word that a Starfleet admiral is going to be coming by the station for reasons and DAX expects that the real reason is that Benzisco is a terrible poker player.

And this Admiral wants to wants to enjoy beating Benzisco at poker. Who is this DAX you're talking about? Is she a character on the show? Yeah, she's she's back She's replaced Odo and Quark All right, okay And Dr. Bersier makes sense Take the week off guys

They really leave the the main cast aside in this episode like it's it's really just like aside in this episode, it's really just like, Kira Dax, O'Brien, Cisco, and then all of the colonists that are characters in this. Yeah, what they end up doing is taking a runabout out to find the missing runabout, which has been reported at warp, just cruising, un-piloted. Which is the episode really revealing that something is very wrong. And I appreciated that they revealed

that there's something very wrong without doing like a dun dun dun. You know, there's no riker eyes to commercial or anything. That's just a puzzle piece that's there for you to incorporate as you like. It's very interesting to me the idea of a runaway runabout. Like that's fun. But Dax and Kira choose a life-threatening course of action to recover just basic federation

material. Like Kira is like, okay, cool, I'll transport over while we're at warp. I know it's not ideal, but people do it all the time. Let's get it done. And DAX is like, whoa, hold your horses here. Why don't I instead attempt to do a thing that is very dangerous, and we see if that works. Why risk just you when we could risk both of us?

And- Why didn't they do the reliant trick where they punch in the the code? Yeah. I agree. I think this scene only needs a little bit of punch up to make a lot more sense, which is more specifically describe the danger in out of control warp capable runabout is like it could be headed for a populated system or a planet. But they never mentioned where it's heading.

They only mentioned that it skimmed off of a star on its way here. I mean, there's some pretty exciting special effects stuff in this part. Like they do some cool model work with the two runabouts. And I almost, I mean, not to excuse the flimsy writing, but I almost wonder if you have to get that stuff locked down earlier so that the Special Effects Department can create those shots and then, you know, like there's less time for revising those concepts. Yeah.

I wonder. I don't know. Production wagging the episode. Yeah. production wagging the episode. Yeah, they go grab this runabout and really just barely save it by the skin of their teeth. Remind me to send a thank you note to the assembly teams. Back on the planet, we have discovered the punishment box, which is a place where candle Steelers go to spend a day.

It looks like it's a largely airless box out in the middle of the sun. Doesn't look like a pleasant spot to be. Well, they're like the Edo, you know? They're like, we don't rock quite as much Nuck and we don't kill you for your crimes, but all crime is punishable by one punishment. Yeah. It ends up being Chekhov's box here, Ben, because you just know one of our favorite characters is gonna get put in it later.

Yeah, but not before Cassandra is showing up at Cisco's apartment like late at night. She's brought some lubrication. It's wonderfully soothing. She's offering to rub them shoulders. Boy, when an attractive lady shows up at your apartment, bearing lubricant, I mean, Cisco's a single man. I think he reads this as a not entirely consensual situation, because he is fucking pissed when he goes to Alexis and

and he draws out of her that indeed Cassandra was sort of sent there on her suggestion to sort of ease him into the colony via sex. It's not what I'm used to. I think Cisco is also upset because a mentholated massage oil does not make a good lubricant. Yeah. And in fact, could be very painful, probably doesn't work well with latex. I'd say even bigger liability for her than him, even. Yeah, that's not going to be fun. It's much more sensitive stuff on a lady.

I've heard. It has that reputation. I love this next scene, though. You're right. Cisco marches into Alexis's office and it's like, Did you send her to my room? Yes. I think you're comfortable.

Alexis is like, I noticed you're still wearing your uniform. Why don't you have an action vest? Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha them because I'm also the RA for this community and I can provide those. But this is like, this is where it really breaks, you know, like from jump, she has been trying to encourage Cisco and O'Brien to just abandon any hope of rescue to take off their Starfleet uniforms, stop pretending that they're in Starfleet and commit to the idea that this is where they live now and this is the rest of their lives and they better get into the the Alexis lifestyle or it's going to be a problem. And their resistance to her way of thinking and living is made clear pretty fast when

Cisco is made to get into the box, taking responsibility for O'Brien's repeated attempts to contact the runabout. Right. There's like this scattering field that they really want to find a way to cut through so that they can communicate with their ship because this girl is dying and they want to, they want to get the medical kit. They want to do what they know how to do to help her. And that is tantamount to a crime in this community. But despite the fact that O'Brien is the one that was

caught fiddling with his tricorder, Cisco is the one to receive the punishment. We get the single brass instrument of unjust imprisonment. Yeah. You know, it's one thing to stick Kalamini in that box. Right. But in an agrarian context, when you're forcibly imprisoning Avery Brooks, did you feel the racial implications of this context,

or was that a projection on my part? I think that this show is aware of that. And I didn't think that in this episode it was implying that Alexis is doing this for racial reasons. But more doing it for, I like this town is not big enough for two leaders reasons. And Cisco is a leader and is diametrically opposed to her philosophically. I totally agree with what you're saying that for character reasons, that's not the thing. But I think for emotional reasons, it serves commander Cisco sacrifice that makes it more deeply felt. Right, because she gives him the opportunity

after 12 or so hours in the box to get out of the uniform and integrate himself into their way of life. And instead of doing that for the prize of a glass of water turns around and walks himself back out to the box. I mean, we've done a lot of comparing this episode to other episodes, but this is Cisco's There Are Four Lights. Yeah, absolutely. Right here.

It is a really powerful character moment for him. And he's not Picard, but this is what a Starfleet captain does, you know? At this point, I mean, there is a lot of nonverbal communication happening between O'Brien and Cisco in this scene and in most other scenes, whether together on the planet surface. But if I'm seeing my commanding officer treated this way and I have a garden implement in my hand, I think I'm going to try to kill someone here. Alexis is a threat to these people. People are dying because of their lack of access to medicine. People look like they have probably died in that box before and your commanding officer

is looking like he's in pretty bad shape. At what point do O'Brien and Cisco consider violence? That is never on the table in this episode in a very weird way. Well, you know, they're so outnumbered and the people in this town are true believers, you know? If he's standing there with a rake, but... Cisco's in no position to fight either at this point.

I mean, he might get one or two of them, but he's gonna be overwhelmed eventually. And then they're in worse shape than when he started. His play is the long game of I need to actually get connected to the ship. Right. And so he goes up to where his buddy, the engineer that he first met on the planet works.

He's like, hey, Joseph, I kind of need, either need your help in building something to find my ship where I need you to shut up about it. And Joseph is willing to be Irish-neck punched. Yeah, what kind of move is this? I don't know, like the Vulcans have the neck pinch willing to be Irish neck punched. Yeah, what kind of move is this? I don't know, like the Vulcans have the neck pinch and O'Brien has a move he can do to knock somebody out that won't hurt at all.

Is this part of Starfleet training or is this just classic O'Brien? Well, you know, in a war with the Carties you gotta learn all kinds of things. So he knocks his buddy out and builds kind of a gourd compass, where he's got some kind of metal thing embedded in a piece of wood that's floating in water and a gourd. And he's like running around in the forest. And he finds kind of an image that really reminded me of the end of the first season of Lost.

He finds a computer system underground in the forest. He's just kind of looking at this readout when an arrow plunges into the tree trunk behind his head. Yeah, Vinad's kind of a good shot with that bow and arrow. Not a great shot, but kind of good. Yeah. The thing that Vinad does have are some fucking pipes. Yeah. He's rocking some beefy arms. I mean, Cassandra is definitely an arms girl. I'm surprised that she hasn't had her eye on Vinad. Maybe rub some of that icy hot on there. Yeah, bring out a little bit of a sheen with the ripples kind of stand out a little bit more. Now when you rub it linaments onto some saw muscles.

You're going to want to use some small even pressured circles. That way you loosen up the sawness. That way, you're loosen up the sowness. What is this Tom Silver went to the gym? I don't believe that for a second. When you're through with the bench press, you're gonna want to wipe down the bench afterwards. That's just common courtesy for other people using the gym. But, you know, Vinad is just a dopey 22-year-old that has lived in a Luddite society for the

last 10 years. So he doesn't really have the tactical prowess that one miles Edward O'Brien is rocking. So he falls for the classic shoot the uniform trick. O'Brien learned to take off your clothes defense during the Cardassian war. That's a part of his strategy he doesn't like to talk about. I don't hate you, Cardassian. I hate what you made me become nude. It's mostly about O'Brien's body shame.

It's not even about the conflict that's about his vanity. I just like getting to see what Starfleet underpants look like though. Same color as the turtle neck that they wear, that's kind of cool. A little bit longer in the shorts than I would have expected. Totally. Totally. Yeah. An interesting little reveal. Kind of a basketball short.

We're seeing a lot of O'Brien this season. Yeah. Well, he kind of storms back into town after getting the literal drop on Vinad and he has disabled the field emitter that has been disabling all of their equipment and that means his phaser works. So first order of business, shoot the phaser at the box that Cisco's in, keep your fingers crossed that it doesn't punch a hole through the box and kill Cisco, I guess. The door flops open and Cisco comes out and O'Brien reveals to the

townspeople what he found in the woods. A Pornomag! This is Alexis' Q to have her monologue about her redefinition of man, about how they all got what they wanted, right guys? What any of you have learned who you really are at the core if you hadn't have come here. I mean, I got your subservience to me. That was a part of it. But you also unlocked things about yourself. That you would never have learned about if you were to work in a fucking cubicle. Like, she basically cubicle shames everyone in the camp.

Yeah, but interestingly, she has to go stand for the crimes of preventing medicine from being administered to these people. And I guess probably kidnapping, like a little unclear what the list of crimes is, but it seems like it's probably long. And she and her son are going to go stand for those crimes, but the townspeople fairly unanimously decide to stay and keep a living for lifestyle that they've had for the last 10 years. God, I had such a glimmer of hope, but then it too, Joseph. This is our home.

Fucking Joseph, I thought he was my guy. He was a little bit complicit in O'Brien finding the box, but then Joseph, Joseph is either an idiot or he's fucked Alexis, or it's a power grab, and now that she's gone, Joseph runs the show. Right, I think that that's maybe my read

is that like he sees this power vacuum forming and leaps into it. Because here's the thing. You're talking about a group of people being told that they've been living a lie. They've been deceived this entire time. They're doops. It's not really something people like to believe about themselves. And I think that him providing a narrative in which they're not doops, they just happened to come here with a lady who is not entirely honest is something that I think people would be willing to latch on to. But also that kind of embarrassment provokes a very strong reactions and those are the reactions

you don't get in the scene. Yeah. What's a suitable punishment for Alexis? I don't know. Like this you go to Federation Jail. Are these people still considered to be citizens of the Federation? Like what's the process of separating yourself from it if you like have your own planet and you just don't want to be a part of it?

It's not wrong to give us a little more information here because I think that information is satisfying. Instead what you get is the very last shot are two little kids looking at the punishment box after the four being back up to the runabout. What do you make of those kids? It's not their choice to be there. It looks like they have of the age where they were born there. Yeah, it's a little bit like the genetically perfect society that Ron Canada lives in. Where it's a problem if any of them leave. I feel like Ron Canada could be brought in as a consultant here.

Right. To work with the people on the planet. Like, you want to bring in a thought leader, someone who's really been through it before. Yeah, somebody who didn't necessarily see the wisdom of what Starfleet was putting out there initially, but eventually had to kind of deal with the reality that it existed. Yeah, that makes a lot of sense.

And I think you tack that 10 minutes on at the end. You contact Ron Canada, you bring him in a slideshow. You tell all the syndication partners, hey, this is not a 44-minute episode, this is actually a 55-minute episode. But the good news is Ron Canada is the last 11 minutes of it. So buckle in, people. Hey, you know what we could also use for a group of people who have been in distress for 10 years?

I mean, can we get an empath up in this bitch? That might be nice, right? How many empaths are there in the start right universe? I think we need one line of the scene here. What they should have done is like that thing where if like a girl and a boy or it make out point in a car and the cops rap on the window,

they like get them out of your shot of each other, like they walk the boy down the road a little bit and they ask the girl like, is this, are you feeling safe with this guy? Is this cool? Is this a chill situation? That's great. Like they take each town's member and go like say like in private hey like you can come with us or

you can stay here totally up to you you know and and you can change your mind whenever you want. Also here's a communicator. Show me on this box where it touched you. More, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, more, set of story beats for that very Star Trek-y premise. And I love the character stuff that it does for Ben Sisko and for O'Brien. And I love the like Kira and Dax rescue mission. It's like the boys road trip went real bad. And now the girls are gonna go on a road trip to save them.

Yeah, that part's fun. I like that. There also seems to be a scarcity to the runabouts that make their mission very important. Yeah. So, yeah, I thought, and I loved the lady Goshavin character. I loved seeing Cope Bow. Yeah. In something.

Yeah. For all of it, added up to an episode that I tremendously enjoyed. I like the up to bin. I think there are some areas that we talked about wanting to punch up a little bit. Yeah. Fun app. Pure Trek. An adulterated trek. You want to check some pure p1s?

I love checking p1s whether or not they are pure or cut with baby laxative the effect is often the same yeah priority one message from star flees coming in on secured channel from Starfleet coming in on Secured Channel. You need a supplement only. supplement? supplement? supplement? Yes, extra. But the interest alone could be enough to buy this ship!

Ben, our first priority one message is from Phil. It is for Austin Harper and the FOD's. Those are the friends of the solo. It's right, Austin, one of the mods of our Facebook group. Message goes like this, I'm a bit late for this. March Madness Brackets normally pay the winner. Instead I'm paying for this message. Thanks Austin and all who participated in TGG's March Madness Brackets.

While my Wolverines lost on the end. As in Red Dawn, I won the Bracket because of them. Props to Adam Ben and all the folks who put this together. You make Mondays rock! Hell yeah. No you rock Phil. Yeah Phil is the one who rocks here. Adam, we have another priority one message here.

It is from Mike and it is for Meg. It goes like this. Congrats on your master's degree. Glad you finished your degree, unlike the boy? Wesley Crusher. Next time, you're in town, let's be drunk Chamotus. I hope this is a decent backup gift, since I could not afford a real doll.

Kevin needs to think about a layaway program. Ha ha ha ha ha. My products really showed COD. Mike, would you have to understand as a businessman, I have to manage cash flow. And if I can't count on full payment when I put a product to market, it really causes problems with ordering raw materials for my business. And we all know how difficult it can be to obtain raw materials. What you don't seem to grasp is that I'm a craftsman.

I make these fuck doors one at a time. There's no layaway program. I guess you could say I put the anal in erudis anal If you have a priority one message for a friend a co-worker or someone you like to sell sex dolls to commercial messages are $200 personal messages or $100 and they are a great, great way to support the ongoing production of the greatest generation That is true. Thank you everybody. Hey Adam. What's up, Ben?

Did you find yourself a drunk Shimoda? Drunk Shimoda! Indeed it is a time code Shimoda, Ben. Ooh snap. If you cue the episode up to 40 minutes and 53 seconds, I think what I have found is another replicant because they do a little bit of reaction shot, a go-go here, to Alexis's monologue. And the lady in purple shows up twice in subsequent cuts.

She's next to one person and then she's in between two different people later like in the next shot What the fuck is up with that? maybe it's like Like that episode of TNG where where there were like multiples of everybody Well, I think the dark secret of this camp is becoming more clear I think they're they're fucking around with with jeans and clones. Yeah. And straw hats? Yeah, she's very anti-technology,

but she didn't reveal that she's also very pro-cloning. That's the same woman, right? That is the same woman. She is really not feeling the speech. Yeah. And that's my Shimoda. Who's yours Ben? I could not give Chief O'Brien the Shimoda for that,

just punch in the phaser button without looking where he's pointing it. Yeah, give me a break, miles. Like I laughed when I saw it, that's a real idiot move. Very incongruent, the character doing something that makes no sense. I have expected him to aim at his own face. Like what would the protocol be for that?

Aim it at the ground? Aim it at the sky? Maybe aim it at the sky. What is the effective range of a hand-faser? I don't know. It's confusing. The whole thing is confusing. The whole thing is confusing.

A greatest-gen live show is something you don't want to miss. Why? Well, it's a great opportunity to see me and Ben in person, but that's not all. FODs from all over gather at these shows to cosplay, to do pre- and post-show hangs, to make friends, and share their embarrassment. Hey, let's make a pretty great name for a tour. Let's do it! The Share Your Embarrassment Tour is coming in August 2023, and we've got a bunch of dates

in a lot of great places. Go to GreatestGenTour.com to get more info. That's greatestgentour.com for dates and ticketing information for the Share Your Embarrassment Tour. I'm Jordan Morris and I'm Jesse Thorne. On Jordan Jesse Go, we make pure, delightful nonsense. We were open awesome guests and bring them down to our level. We get stupid with Judy Greer.

My friend Molly and I call it having the space weirds. Pat Noswald. Can I get a ball-rock burger and some air-gorn fries? Thank you. And Kumail Nanjiani. I've come back with cat toothbrushes, which is impossible to use. Come get stupider with us at MaximumFun.org. Look, your podcast apps already open.

Just pull it out. Give Jordan Jesse Goatry. Being smart is hard. Be dumb instead. Whoa, rats, hey, hey, hey, oh, I'm about to count you in line. These clouds are really freaking me out. I hate having to stand in line and boy, what do I? These giraffes do not smell good. No, they do not, and they've such short nacks.

But I'm hearing we need to get on this arc. We've got to get on the arc. It it's about terrain. Got us about to destroy humanity Hey, oh sorry, sorry, sorry. Are you Noah? Yeah, I know we look like humans. Oh, we're actually we're podcasters We are podcasters, so it's different. Have you heard of Ono Ross and Carrie? We investigate spirituality Cleans of the paranormal stuff like that and you have a boat and say the world's gonna And so same like something for us to check out. We would love to be on the boat. We came two by two. What do you think?

Ona Ross and Carrie, available on MaximumFun.org. And the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night, the black night appearing without explanation. Hmm. What says Netflix? Well, Adam, of course, Netflix always has a slightly different encapsulation. And this one, it says in the game, a quadrant, tax and auto detect an unusual particle field on the surface of an unexplored planet. Hmm. I mean, I think that the moral of the story is, Dex is in the episode. You want is, DAX is in the episode. You want to see if drinks are in the episode?

Yeah, we're pretty close to drinks, right? Yeah, we're on square 45, and a quarks bar is just one square away. You're required to learn as you play, role. That is exciting, Adam. Do you want to roll them bones and tell us what the people might win? Yes. Oh, and I rolled a six band. Tula!

Did I win? Hardly. Oh, wow. One, two, three, four, five, six. That leaves us on square 51. A mere three squares away from another quarks bar. A different quarks bar, right? Square.

And also within the danger zone of a looking at each other during, which I believe is an episode that requires one of us to buy a plane ticket. Is that correct? Sure has been. Maybe we can time it in such a way that if we have to land on it, we can do that during Max Funcon. But we do this game straight up.

There's no cheating. No fingers on the scales. It could just be a very expensive lesson. Yeah. Don't write things on your stupid game board that cost hundreds of dollars that you don't really have. That's fun. Almost as much fun as all the great music that dark material and Adam Raguse you make for every episode.

That is true. Another fun thing is talking about the show on social media using the hashtag GreatestGen. We really appreciate especially the folks who go to Apple Podcasts and leave a nice review tell people what they like about the show. Yeah, how are people gonna find out about the show unless people leave a nice review? We have so far gone ignored by the Star Trek Industrial Complex. Yeah, which is probably a good thing.

It's a long run, but I mean, and it's not like we're interested in getting offers of big rod pocket status, but there's like a legitimately cool Star Trek community out there, and it's not being acknowledged in a way that I find a little irritating. All I want is what Alexis wanted for her people.

I want a redefinition of Star Trek fandom and Friends of Disodo should be that definition, and I want more offinition of Star Trek fandom, and friends of DeSoto should be that definition, and I want more of them. And if all the friends of DeSoto act in subservience to us, then that's just what happens, Ben. That's just what happens making us their leaders. We didn't want that. No, that's not what we set out to. I mean, we may have lied and told them we were going to one planet and we really

wound up being on another. If a couple of friends at a desodo end up staying in the box for a day, then they clearly did something bad. They deserve it! They agreed to these rules. They agreed to these rules. They agreed to these rules. They agreed to these rules.

They agreed to these rules. They agreed to these rules. They agreed to these rules. They agreed to these rules. They agreed to these rules. They agreed to these rules. They agreed to these rules. They agreed to these rules. They agreed to these rules. I'm a kid. Listen to our show, Greatest Discovery, about Star Trek Discovery. And also our show, Friendly Fire, which is about war movies, but it's really more about culture and history. And we use war movies as kind of an interesting device

to change what culture and history thing we are talking about from week two weeks ago. Check out the cards the Bill Tilly makes for every episode over on Twitter at Bill Tilly in 1973. Never gonna do that. And with that, we will be back at you next time with another great episode of Star Trek Deep Space 9 and an episode of the greatest generation Deep Space 9 generation deep space nine which promises to include DAX. That guy that was in there for stealing a candle and she says like, oh, you would have been just living in jail

if you'd stayed in the federation. It's like, really? That guy would have been living in jail. Like, you can't steal a candle in the federation because you can just replicate one. You're only allowed to fuck them. Ha-ha-ha-ha. Maximumfund.org.

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