The Guardian's Women's Football Weekly - England come from behind to storm into semis – Women’s Football Weekly

Episode Date: July 21, 2022

Faye Carruthers, Suzanne Wrack, Anita Asante and Ceylon Andi Hickman reflect on England’s dramatic extra-time victory over Spain which sealed their place in the final four of Euro 2022

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Cast Lucy in bronze, erect a silver statue of Stanway and stick Millie Bright up front. She gleams and will surely grab us gold. England will head to the Steel City as they come from behind to beat Spain 2-1 to reach yet another major tournament semi-final. We'll dissect that rollercoaster 120 minutes of football, get overexcited again about England's Euro 2022 chances. Take your questions and that's today's Guardian Women's Football Weekly. The Guardian Women's Football Weekly is supported by Visa,

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increasing visibility and future-proofing the women's game. Find out more at theguardian.com slash all hyphen win. Well, what a panel we have today. Susie Rack, welcome back. You're supposed to be recovering, but was that the longest two hours of your life? Yeah, it didn't help the recovery process, did it? I mean, having a heart attack for 80 minutes or whatever it was, 70 minutes. No, definitely not. Anita Asante, first time we've spoken to you since your announcement,

the new first team coach at Bristol City. Congratulations. Thank you, Faye. Yeah, I'm absolutely buzzing to just be able to get that out there now and get started with the girls at Bristol and start my coaching journey, finally. Can't wait to see what you can do. Sorry, the lionesses have stolen your thunder a little bit, I'm afraid. Salon Hickman I mean how fresh were you for your gym session this morning did you even make it I did not make it no I've I've I'm willing to trade off and sit with the disappointment my PT might have in me for the elation that I experienced last night so I'm okay with that I'm surprised you even made it. You got stuck in woods on your way out of the Amex. Where were you going? We did. We thought we'd been really clever by being that farmer standstill

traffic right by the stadium and the train station. So yeah, we took some back route and ended up walking through a woods for about 20 minutes with no light. But we did actually find the road on the end. And I'd like to shout out to the woman and her mother who were with us, who we helped the whole way through. But I was worried at some points I thought we might lose people in the woods and that wouldn't have been a good story after last night well we wouldn't have seen you this morning would we which would have been a travesty listen it's hard to know where to begin at what point did all of you convince yourselves that England were out of the tournament? For me, it was around about 60 minutes, I think. Halftime.

I was pretty disappointed with the performance until, well, until pretty late in the game, to be fair. I think most of us were. It looked like a very hesitant, nervous performance, I thought. You know, they sort of, for want of a better phrase, showed Spain a little bit too much respect let them play their game didn't sort of take the game to them much I expected a bit more of a press on that Spain passing game and obviously that's easier said than done that's not that's not

a straightforward thing to do but whilst I felt at half time that things were not looking positive at all and that I was missing the quarterfinal and not going to see England play in the semi-final which is what I was obviously hoping to be back for was incredibly disappointing at the same time I also didn't think Spain looked like they would score again necessarily so there was a slim sliver of hope at that point for me but but not much I was sat behind the the goal when Spain scored and it just took all the air out of me and and to be honest the crowd was so nervous throughout the majority of the game it's the quietest that I've heard them, which I think just kind of gave it that extra edge. And by the way, for anyone who missed it,

A, where were you? B, who are you? And C, why are you listening to this podcast? England conceded their first goal at the Euros, going 1-0 down to Spain before that 84th-minute equaliser from El Attun took it to extra time and Georgia Stanway smashed in the winner

six minutes into the extra half an hour. Salon, what did you do when Georgia Stanway scored? Oh, I can't remember. I can't remember. It was just a complete blur at that point. What was beautiful about that goal was you saw her having the space and

time to carry the ball, which she just didn't have throughout the rest of the game. Credit Spain who dominated our midfield but she just drove with that ball and I do think there was a there was like I don't know if you polled the crowd at that point a 50-50 split between she's going to pass it pass it pass it the sensible thing to do is to pass it and the rest of them going shoot and she chose shoot. And thank God she did because it was an absolute rocket. I think the keeper also thought she was going to pass it. And therefore, I sort of set herself slightly wrong. And therefore, the shot didn't need to be top corner, but the power that it had meant that there was no way she was stopping that.

And I thought at that moment when the ground erupted was just like, this is what a home Euros is about. These are the moments that are just, yeah, you'll remember for the rest of your life from that moment when that Stanway goal rocketed the back of the net. Oh, it was an absolute beaut, wasn't it? I mean, there were questions, Anita, before this game about whether England had been properly tested in this Euros. And I think it's fair to say that they have now.

Yeah, that for sure was their first proper test. And you've got to give credit to Spain as well. You know, they stepped it up a level compared to the previous games they'd played. They hadn't really shown that kind of quality on the ball. Of course, we expected them to have a lot of possession, but they hadn't dominated a game like they did in that way against England, which made it difficult for England because we all know once they get into their rhythm, they're hard to stop and they're hard to press. But at the same time, this is exactly the sort of test that England needed to not necessarily be in that cruise control button and feel like you're in a knockout phases. Now you're here to play the best teams in the world and it's just going to keep hopefully raising the England team's levels

as well. And this was not an easy test for them, but they had to go through it. And I think from a mental point of view, it's really good for the psychology of the team now to know, you know what, we don't give up, we're resilient and we'll keep going we'll find the way to the end and that's a great asset for those players to have because football is about moments and it is about suffering sometimes you suffer and you get through it and the girls did that and all it took was one moment as Salon mentioned with Stanway and and that's just about being brave and she was brave in that moment dribbling and carrying the ball when the easier thing might just be to pass the responsibility on.

And boy did we suffer I mean it was so tense I don't think I've got any nails left the crowd behind the goal that I was sat behind were literally either had their arms crossed or fingers in their mouth it was it was so so tense but Anissa makes an interesting point there Susie because you also described it as a gutsy confidence fueling performance would you say it's one of the best performances that we've ever seen from England maybe not in terms of quality but in terms of of that determination to get over the line yeah in terms of belief for sure I mean it's definitely not one of the best performances we've seen from England but yeah in terms of the desire to actually do something and to not give up yeah completely I

mean I think they benefited from tactical errors from Spain some weird decisions to sort of sit back quite early on in the game still and really let England sort of back in but they really took advantage of that and you know when you see Serena take off Ellen White Frank Kirby Beth Mead you you know you are sort of thinking wow okay that's a lot of faith in some some, quite inexperienced players on one of the biggest stages that they'll probably ever play on. And that's a very brave thing to do. And I think it goes back to when they were playing sort of under-19, under-20 free football, you know, the confidence of the sort of youngest group in the England squad to take games to people, to not give up,

to real, real battle, that have a real good understanding on the pitch as well between each other. I mean, that link-up play with Alessi Russo and Ella Toon is, you know, it's tried and tested, not just at club level, but at international level through all the different age groups for years. That belief in and of itself

that yes you can do something even without these big players on the pitch like it's going to have an impact it's going to sink in and gutsy the whole thing was just really really really gutsy i'll tell you what i found fascinating to watch was serena viegman on the touchline because she's normally so calm and chilled and she'll sit in the dugout, come out every now and again. She was out for a lot of the time. She was shaking her head. Her body language was negative and frustrated. You know, she was so animated on the touchline

and we're just not used to seeing that at all. And I wonder whether that kind of negative energy almost transferred onto the pitch in the opening 50 minutes in particular. As soon as they went down to that goal, she was like, get those substitutes on straight away. She's not usually that quick and reactive, but she was frustrated, wasn't she? And of course, first time we're seeing her back in the dugout after missing the Northern Ireland game. She tested negative finally for COVID. It would have been a boost for the players.

And actually, could you imagine if she actually wasn't there last night, Anita? What a difference that would have made because they wouldn't have had her screaming at them. Screaming? Screaming. Screaming at them from the touchline. No, Steve. There was no Wally with no brollies last night, that's for sure. But I found that quite, quite fascinating. How would the players have seen it, Anita? Yeah, no, it's a really good point that you're making there, Faye.

I think ultimately we are used to seeing Serena Wiegmann be super calm and relaxed and transfer the energy to the team but sometimes it's you need a manager to react to the situation and and give a bit more impetus and and be firm with the players and and and just you know give them a shove up the arse with lack of better words you know we all need it sometimes and and players know they know when they're not necessarily firing from either a mental standpoint or physical or whatever and and that little injection of someone's telling you, come on, like, I know you can do this. Come on, do this, do that. Just gives you that boost and that lift that you need when you're feeling deflated or you're feeling that momentum is against you. Because it's really hard when you're spending so much time as well defending

players that are so good on the ball and you're trying to press and you feel it in your body, you're not getting close enough. That just psychologically puts you maybe in a negative spin where you just feel like you're always running backwards and sideways as opposed to going forwards, which is the direction England want to be going in. So I like seeing that from Serena because the point is she's a human being. She has emotion as well. It means a lot to her as well as the team. And she'll get a reaction out of the players because she isn't that person that's doing that all the time. If she was a screamer and a shouter in the changing room or on the pitch, she probably wouldn't get the reaction she needs out of her players.

But because they know her and they trust her and there is that trust between them, I think when she reacts like that, players know okay our manager you know she's just willing us on she believes in us and this is her way of just getting us to the quality that we know we have it's going to strengthen the bond between them as well right isn't it like when you see your manager behave that way behave very differently behave in a way that is both influential on the game but also is is packed with emotion like they've not had a moment like that where they've really really been up against it in the heat of the moment and they've really needed their manager to pull them through it and that's only going to strengthen the trust that they have in her and uh and vice versa

which is which is really cool and obviously like i don't know if you saw it on telly we all saw it her leaping into the arms are really bright really bright lifting her into the air was just like the cutest thing I think I've ever seen after a football match I missed that because I'd had to run down to the tunnel it was one of those really awkward things at 2-1 it's like do I have the faith to go down to the flash zone five minutes before the final whistle or will I have to run back for penalties what do I do when I did speak to Serena Vigman it's really frustrating actually because you only get a certain amount of time in in the flash and I got wrapped and I had so many things that I had to to speak to her about but what she said in the press conference afterwards

as well that she just she said I lost it completely I just went crazy and even when I was interviewing her she normally straight bats every question I give her she's really short with her answers and she was just waxing lyrical she was off on one it was it was brilliant to see Salon this almost feels like a bit of a therapy session that's what producer Lucy has just said to me and I feel she is very accurate with this there's so much adrenaline that we all have from this match Spain were so impressive but the same problem that they've had perhaps all tournament that you know impressive in possession but just not really then doing anything with it but England just couldn't get out of this kind of vortex that they'd created

oh absolutely I think Spain just wouldn't let us play how we wanted to play and that was one of the most frustrating things against an opposition you have a game plan you want to go out and execute it you know you have the players and the talent and the belief and all the mindset to go and do it and then suddenly you're faced with an opposition that say, nope, we're not going to let you do that at all. I think they controlled the space brilliantly. How England like to play is get out to our wide players, send in a beautiful through ball to our number nine. And Hemp and Mead couldn't really get on the ball. Or if they did get on the ball, they wanted to take a few different touches and try and run at a player but by the time they'd received the ball they were completely shut down and pressed and i think they they kind of cheated a little bit spain by stopping

us from getting out their positioning was so that they knew that that ball was going there and their players were quick enough and fast enough to get there and close our players down we haven't really been pressed like that at the back either they were completely relentless at times I think when you describe a game when you're like it feels like there's so many more of them than there are us it shows that they're just controlling the space and dominating so much better than we were and I think Spain will rue that they did not score more goals in that first half because we were just completely on the back foot and Mary Earps did play phenomenally I think Millie Bright obviously woman of the match what a player in the last five minutes of extra time I was cheering that's why my voice is

completely gone but I was cheering every defensive intervention like it was a goal I think people quite upset with me in my area because I was just like on my feet like any time it was a goal I think people quite upset with me in my area because I was just like on my feet like anytime it was cleared anytime Alex Greenwood kicked out for a throw in and I was there celebrating like it was a goal but it was like you knew those really desperate measures and tiny margins that if Spain did break and Spain were running it your fullbacks probably we were in danger at that point so yeah I think Spain deserves so much credit for how they played last night and it is a shame that they've gone out at this stage in the tournament when they are so technically brilliant and masters at controlling the space but they

didn't create enough chances and if you don't do that then you don't win football matches so there's my cliche to end on absolutely love the cliche it's so true though isn't it and actually Spain have never never won a knockout match which is just incredible when you think about it shout out to Max Rushton what a legend tweet of the night a lot of Caldente's work for Spain has been really well done which is quite quite ironic. Well done, Max. Loved that. I mean, the Esther Gonzalez goal after 54 minutes came from Athenia del Castillo, Susie. And actually, he's had a lot of criticism, Jorge Vilda. And he did make a lot of really weird decisions.

But that was perhaps one of his better ones. Yeah, totally. I mean, she was fantastic when she came on. But I mean, I would say it was probably a mistake not to start her um Athenia has been incredible for uh Spain and uh last season as well and yeah well deserving of a starting spot one of their best players um particularly when they're out uh without the likes of Petelis and stuff and I mean honestly you you kind of felt very very sorry for Rachel Daly she was absolutely owning her every single time i thought that the smartest thing spade did was stick bon matti like glue to kira walsh uh was just so intelligent and i think

if other teams you know sweden or belgium or germany or france or whoever it may be, followed that blueprint of really, really kind of having someone stuck like glue to Kira Walsh, then England are in trouble. They also, I don't know about you, but for the first 45 minutes to an hour was incredibly frustrated by these snappy half tackles. The most infuriatingly annoying thing to happen but also incredibly intelligent and you have like a little bit of respect for and if it was your team doing it you'd think yes come on we're really really frustrating them but just not allowing anyone sort of room to breathe or move or or think about a second touch on the ball then you've got the big

errors late on taking off your goal scorer on 77 minutes who's had a really good game is causing all kinds of trouble to go more defensive waiting until like there's 20 minutes left to bring on Sarigi who is a phenomenally good player and I saw Sophie Lawson the journalist's tweet you've basically showed no like zero faith in this player and then you're basically asking her to come on with 20 minutes left to play and save Spain when you've basically told her you think she's no good repeatedly strange choices tactically but really intelligent Spanish performance yeah Yeah, they set the tone, didn't they? Five seconds in, Ellen White balls straight to the face and down

and you thought, oh, they mean business. Big shout out, by the way, to Bonmati because in the mix zone at the end of the match, you know, when many players have lost, you'll know this, Anita, you just want to go straight through the mix zone and not have to talk to anybody. But Bonmati stopped for every single journalist English or Spanish she did the interviews in English just said can you just bear with me is it pre-recorded I just need to gather my thoughts she was

absolutely incredible because that defeat will have really hurt um we talked about the Serena Wiegman in-game management and I think it's quite key to focus on that as well, because we mentioned Rachel Daly there. She had a torrid time all game. She's not a left back. I was saying before the tournament and, you know, I'm not a manager. I just watch the football. In my opinion, Alex Greenwood was starter at left back for me the minute we got to the knockouts. We all know how amazing Rachel Daly is and we know what she can do defensively and going forward

and she's a tough tackler. But I really thought we needed an intelligent defender in that position and the minute Alex Greenwood came on on 82 minutes, it allowed Millie Bright to go up the field, create spaces and that's how then Ella Toon got her goal. And it was a beautifully, beautifully worked goal as well. But the chance of Toon when Ella Toon came onto the pitch were also amazing around the ground, Salon. She's really captured everybody's imagination, hasn't she? Yeah, definitely. And I think going back to Rachel Daly, I think there's, it's always a toss up with when you're selecting fullbacks, unless you've got the perfect all round player who's brilliant going forward and creative and brave and has a wonderful shot and across and can win their 1v1s in an attacking sense, and also can defend their 1v1s, cover for their centre backs, tuck in when they need to tuck in, make really good recovery runs. You could argue maybe Lucy Bronze is that. But Rachel Daly is

definitely more on the attacking axis, more towards the attacking end. And I completely agree with you that we needed a much more defensive-minded defender playing in a defensive position against one of the best attacking teams in the world so you really did have to feel for her she's also right footed playing the left back role but Johnny Liu texted me in the second half when the equalizer went in from Tooney he saw a beautiful moment where Jill Scott just lent over to Rachel Daly who looked like she just had the weight of the world on her shoulders ever since she came off and just gave her a hug and a kiss and he said it was a small and beautiful moment but it meant a lot in that in that moment to Rachel Daly when you you know those feelings you come off and you feel like you've absolutely messed it up for your entire team in a tournament that means so much to so many

people and then suddenly Ella Toon comes off the bench and a scrappy goal you could argue but actually quite perfectly curated a lovely ball from Hemp. Rousseau wins the header, knocks it down. Tooney's in the perfect place to get that goal. And what a relief that was in the stadium. Faye, I've got a question for you. Go on. Why Greenwood? Why not Stokes? I just feel as if Greenwood has a better connection

with Leah Williamson and Millie Bright than Demi Stokes has, and Demi hasn't had as much game time. And because the pairing of Greenwood and Bright in particular was working so well, I feel like she's there to back up Leah and Millie in the middle if she needs to from the left-back position. That's no disrespect to Demi Stokes in the slightest. I just feel that she has the more assured performances. Is that good enough reasoning, Susie?

I feel like I'm on trial. Yeah, that's decent enough reasoning. I think it's also because she's a set piece threat. Yeah. Right? Her delivery, she offers that as well, which in a game like this when it's so small margins and you're not dominating the ball all it takes is one free kick one corner and you level up the game and I

think she offers that as well as balance being left-footed when you're getting high press get us out with her quality because of her range of passing yeah don't get me wrong like I love Alex Greenwood um unfortunately should have started the tournament at centre back um and even you know asked the question on whether you drop your captain to make that happen but um she's always underwhelmed at left back for England for me and maybe she's improved as a left back as a result of being excellent at centre back and having like learned that new role and understanding the relationship between the two positions and all that kind of stuff but we've not seen her a lot under Serena at left back and

I don't think I'll be totally comfortable with Alex Riewen at left back for a while until I've seen a whole load of games where you have the quality of Laikafinia and staff running for 90 minutes. I'm not convinced yet. You mentioned Georgia Stanway's goal at the top there, Salon. But Anita, you have to just sit back, applaud, watch it again and again and again. Yeah, of course. I was punching air when that went in. I was just like, what a beautiful strike you

know and it's what you expect from Georgia as well she has that in her locker we've seen her do it time and time again for club and you know it couldn't be a better player for that to happen too I thought she had a brilliant game in terms of you know I think some people are nervous that she's playing in the double pivot role defensively is she gonna get fouls against her maybe yellow card that type of scenario because we know she's a tough tackler in there but she had a very mature performance in terms of trying to you know cover spaces and support Walsh as well in that defensive role but when the moment arrived and she could carry the ball, which she's so good at doing, getting the ball between the lines

and driving at defenders, you could see that as soon as she started running towards that Spanish back line, they didn't know what to do. They were like, should I press? Should I drop? And they were actually even. They were 2v2, full-back, centre-back. Mappy Leon's there and doesn't commit to her. And what I love about what Georgia did, she didn't hesitate. She made a decision and she committed to it. And that's what you want from your attacking players. You want them to

believe in themselves and go, I'm taking responsibility in this moment and I'm going to take the shot on and anything can happen. And that's exactly what happened. She scored a beautiful goal and we're all delighting in the fact that, you know, we're progressing to the semifinal. I know. And Spain didn't make it easy either. They just kept throwing everything they possibly could, but just not clinical enough in the end. And I have to say, I feel as if we have analysed that 120 minutes of football as chaotically as the game felt itself. We went all over the place, from start to finish, to back to front.

I mean, it was every part of the emotion. Let's just compose ourselves, shall we? Because that's it for part one of the Guardian Women's Football Weekly. In part two, we will look forward to the other quarterfinals. This podcast is supported by Visa. So we wanted to tell you more about how they're helping develop

the women's game all over the world. One of their initiatives is providing football camps in places like Turkey where less than 1% of licensed football players are women. That's why Visa are working with social enterprises like Kizla Sahada to give young girls in the country the chance to play football. Today, we're joined by Chansu, who recently participated in one of these camps. Chansu, lovely to see you. As we've heard,

women's football isn't as big in Turkey as in other parts of the world. So how did you first become interested in it? I never had the chance to play until the age of six. And in our neighborhood, boys used to play football all the time. One day they had a player and he didn't come to the match. One of the bigger boys told me that, would you like to be our goalkeeper? That summer, I started to go to a summer camp to play football. And you recently took part in what sounded like an amazing football camp,

which was supported by Visa. You won a prize as well. Can you tell us a little bit about that and why it's a real dream come true for you? A few weeks ago we went to Kızlar Sahada's camp and participated to win the prize to go to the Euro finals in England and the dream come true part is in 2016 while I was coming back from the US to Turkey we couldn't catch our flight from London to Turkey and we stayed in London for a day I wanted to go to Wembley but because I didn't have a visa they told us that we won't be able to go inside the Wembley and check the place so this year I will go to Wembley and will be able to see the Euro finals and be a ball kid in the Euro finals so I'm really happy about

that. Chansu thank you so much for your time I really hope you enjoy your trip to Wembley I will see you at the final. See now back to the show welcome back to part two of the guardian women's football weekly i'd love to say we have composed ourselves but we are just as frantic as we were in the first part i'm two coffees down it's early in the morning and uh yeah the adrenaline's kicking in after four hours sleep. We are continuing to dissect the England win over Spain. Who stood out predominantly for all of you? Salon, was it Lucy Bronze and that Teckers after she'd been told off by Serena Vigman on the sidelines?

Was it Millie Bright and her performance at both ends? Mary Earps, perhaps perhaps you're not letting me have Bon Matty if you would like I mean listen she she has gained my respect after what she did in the in not only on the pitch but off it afterwards no yeah Bon Matty obviously from from a Spanish perspective was incredible Del Castillo also stunning performance in that second half but for England I think I have to go with Millie Bright I want to be like Millie Bright when I grow up honestly like what what a player I think when you need a player to dig in and to ensure that this win is yours she did that and I think

withstanding that amount of pressure knowing that you are playing at some of the technically best players in the world in attack, and you withstood their pressure, weathered the storm at multiple occasions throughout that game, won every header, you kind of felt like you could rely on that as a fan and feel quite safe when that happened when you didn't feel safe was when they were exploiting our maybe defensive weaknesses yesterday but you can't say that Millie Bright was a defensive weakness so for me yeah deserved woman of the match I'd say is there a case and look this is this is a debate sometimes unpopular but Anita Alessia Russo has impressed so much whenever she's come on obviously Ellen White does so much more off the ball than what we see necessarily in the 18 yard box but who starts for you surely there's a case for Alessia Russo to to start the semi-final now if you'd asked me this uh maybe a few hours ago I would have said no Ellen White you know she's she's got her play because

of her tireless work that she does up there that people don't always see or think about in terms of her off the ball but at the same time I think going into the next game it's really important for England to stamp their authority and take their game to the opposition and we don't want to go long bouts without getting into our rhythm. And I think what Alessia Russo offers is that focal point. So, you know, I probably would go with Alessia because not only does she work hard and she works the channel, she, you know, she runs in behind, she comes short. I think there's a bit more maybe dynamism that would allow Fran Kirby to come alive too. We didn't see enough of Fran in the last game, but I think Fran, you know, she can see her pass and that connection, obviously, that she has with Toon,

we've seen has been effective. And I think it's going to be more important for England to get into the game early, create more chances earlier in the game to just settle their nerves as well and calm them down and get them into their own possession game. What I like about Alessia Russo, she's a handful. She's a handful in the box because of her physicality, but she's so good in the air. She's so effective with it and her timing and her movement.

And I just think perhaps at this moment in time, she offers that little bit more than we're getting from Ellen White. And maybe she has slightly more confidence in what she's doing at the moment. But there's kind of a fearlessness about her that I really enjoy when I watch her play. So for that reason, I think I would like to see her start. And I think if you're judging on her previous performances, she totally deserves a start as well. Yeah. And Susie's nodding along and and i hope that we've answered both of your questions uh emma on twitter who said do we need to review who plays at number nine and left back for england would it be a russo and a alex greenwood starting for

you suzy if serena veegman was going to make two changes for the next match i'm definitely bringing that i'm changing my mind mid-sentence that's this entire pod isn't it part of the chaos i said i was gonna say i'm definitely bringing alex greenwood but at the same time like rachel daly's had a really good tournament up until this point and her confidence after that is going to have taken a knock and in a sense there's a case for putting your faith in someone who like had a blip right it that's that was an unorthodox performance from her so i'm not totally wedded to the idea of just floating in alex greenwood but then again do you have the luxury of time and football to be able to sort of do a confidence boost to a player whose confidence is shot I don't know so that's a difficult managerial question in terms of Russo and why I agree with

everything Anita said but the one thing I've sort of is in the back of my mind is whether like she's almost done too good a job Alessia russo as a sub because if you start her where's the threat off the bench up top i mean beth england isn't really doing it at the moment does not have confidence coursing through her veins has not played a single minute of football in this tournament ella white is a great player but is she an impact player off the bench i'm not so sure and then you're looking at the likes of maybe switching beth mead into the middle or something during the game and to find that alternative or bringing chloe kelly who started off as a forward on in the middle and they're they're things that haven't been tested so in a way i'm sort of like a

i can understand why she would stick with Ellen up top and Alessia off the bench because regardless of whether we think Alessia may have done something a little bit sooner in the game it still worked it came on it changed the game and it had the sort of desired impact and I'm not sure if the other way round it would. There's something fantastic about Russo's young, terrier-like energy coming onto the pitch when your opposition are getting a little bit tired. Yes, that would be my only hesitancy in making changes. I can see why Serena wouldn't as much as I can see why there's arguments for her doing so. I want to play devil's advocate a little bit. And I promise this isn't because Lauren Hemp beat me at basketball the other day in the media versus the players. But something's just not quite clicked right for her in this tournament. Is there an argument that you could potentially put Rachel Daly

in that Hemp position, bearing in mind what she offers up front. Anita. Doing it to me. Yeah, no, of course there is. You could say that about a number of players, but again, that's not been tested. Do you know what I mean? Up until this point in terms of her getting exposure,

playing some of the stronger nations in that role and finding that chemistry and relationship with the players in and around her in that attack. Of course, we know what Rachel Daly can do in forward areas. She's done that at club time and time again, and she's got so much quality there. But I don't know if you would make that decision now. Maybe that's a punt you would take, dying late in the game

when you're running out in the game when you really need, you're running out of all options and you're not sure how else to change it. Maybe you do it then. But at the moment, I just think I don't see her replacing Hemp in that position or Mead on the other flank at the moment, because I do think and do believe that they are our two best forward wingers, if you like, at the moment, that would be a tough call to make. I don't think I would make that one. I actually agree with you, Anita.

I was literally just playing devil's advocate because I felt like it. Just quickly, Susie, this is England's fourth consecutive semifinal stretching back from the World Cup in 2015 to Euro 2022 in terms of major tournaments we have to give the FA some some real credit here don't we that's a pretty decent record oh 100% but I mean they've if they hadn't have done it at the same time given the amount of money and time and infrastructure that has been invested in the team comparatively to the rest of Europe say or the rest of the world even you would see it as a massive failure so there's there's

that element there as well in football you sort of get what you pay for to a certain extent you know there's a reason why Man City win the Premier League it's about how much you invest and support the team and the people around them. So you sort of expect a return. And the FA always had in their plan that this tournament and next summer's World Cup were the ones that they were targeting as being really competitions that the Lionesses should be competing to win. And the previous ones you know 2019 2017 they were they were surprises they weren't necessarily expecting to be as competitive

as they were in those tournaments they hadn't factored that into their their planning so if they had lost last night it would have been a huge failure I was sitting there thinking oh this is obviously gutting from just you know an England point of view but I was sitting there thinking, oh, this is obviously gutting from just, you know, an England point of view. But I was dreading having to write on it, like on having to write on what an utter failure it was. And, you know, I saw a couple of journalists tweeting about, you know, rejected top lines and stuff that were really scathing and things as time went on and you know they managed to like and when England scored when Toon scored you know suddenly they got to throw those really scathing ones

away and that like the fear of having to sit down the next day and write write something that was like this is an absolute disaster for the FA and for the Lionesses was very, very, very real. So, yeah, a lot of credit, but also I say the credit is more to the investment and support that has got the team to this point.

It's good that we are at a stage where we have these high expectations of the team and want them to do really well. I think they should do really well on the basis of those things. I think your point there Susie about the headlines the scathing headlines I definitely had that feeling I think you asked us right at the beginning when when was the moment we thought this was done I was taking notes throughout the game and about 70 I just completely stopped and was like this is it and a real sense of similarly to watching England in the men's Euros last year, a feeling of such expectation and hope, but also a significance of, well, what does this mean societally, culturally for these players if we don't do well, if we don't have the success it's not just

england and we want to go and have fun in the summer and win a tournament there's this added pressure that we create as media the players probably feel the nation creates in the sensation of how much this means and what it will do for the women's game and i think that gut-wrenching feeling last night for about 60 70 minutes of feeling well 80 minutes really 85 minutes and saying this is it and this isn't the way the script was supposed to go and this completely contradicts the narrative and how do we deal with that and it's quite an interesting thought experiment to think would those papers say today what would the the reaction be today? How does that create a new territory in the women's game and the way that we talk and report on the women's game as well? And what impact that then has on the team and the squad and still is the semi-final all we could have all of those feelings again for 85 86 87 minutes who knows and that is also what the professionalization and the just natural experiences of football and supporting a team is and it was really visceral

last night to feel that I think do you know what it's interesting I feel as if just getting to the semi-finals even if they lost the semi-final it wouldn't feel as much of a failure as if they'd have gone out last night because it would just equal what they've done that adversity in the quarterfinal they know how to get themselves out of the coldy sack they've driven themselves down into is this the European champions we've been watching yeah I believe so I believe that they they can to be honest I think they needed this experience they needed to play a top side like Spain. I don't think they'll meet another team who controls the ball and has ball possession in the way that Spain does moving forward. So, you know, I think it's going to be tough. Of course it is because you're at the knockout phases and everyone is motivated to win, but we didn't see the best of England in that performance you know

there's another level and another gear to this team and this squad and I think from this experience they'll they'll know you know that they gotta be braver they gotta you know be able to play out of pressure they've got to be able to try and find their influential players sooner and be clinical and and have that quality in the final third. But as long as we maintain solid performances like Millie showed and displayed, the team will feel confident that we've got rocks behind us that will be secure enough to allow them to go forward. And, you know, Hemp hasn't really come alive at the moment, you know, and we know what quality she can produce and meet.

And if you look at it potentially being Sweden or Belgium in the next game, then I just think England, in my opinion, as a squad, are slightly better in terms of that star quality that we have in terms of individual magic. If we get to our quality and we earn that right, I don't see no reason why we can't win in in the semis okay stream of consciousness and therapy session over it was very cathartic i

have to say but we need to try and focus and look ahead to those other three quarterfinals quick fire guys otherwise i'm gonna have to start charging overtime. Keep it quick. And Salon, three quarterfinals to go. Germany face Austria tonight. Do you think the Germans might be a little bit more nervous about this one, having seen some of England's struggles? I don't know. I don't know. I do think the Germans will feel very confident going into tonight.

That's it. They'll be confident. Well, that was quick fire. Anita, France versus the Netherlands. Why should we all watch that? It's going to be a cracking game, I think. Netherlands have shown that they're a resilient team. But I think France, just quality throughout the squad,

such an exciting team. I think it's a France win for me. England, obviously, Sweden or Belgium in the semi-finals on Tuesday Susie who do we want I think we all know the answer to that don't we I mean we'd like Belgium wouldn't we but I think it's fair to say that like without playing down Belgium too much I think we all expect Sweden to roll through that game with relative ease. I think Sweden in a semi-final is going to be a really, really tough game, having watched Sweden at the World Cup and at the Olympics as well. But England will get a lot more of the ball,

and I think that is the game-changer for me, and the big difference to playing Spain is whether Sweden can sort of take many of the lessons of that Spanish team and adopt them very, very quickly. I told Marcus, one of the football editors at The Guardian, that he has to go on gardening leave because they told me he's actually back home in Sweden during the semi-final, so I didn't need to worry

because I was worried about the direction our coverage might take of that game. We're just not going to speak to him, are we, for the next week? Exactly, yeah. Just cut ties for a bit. But it's a straightforward quarterfinal on paper and a very, very tasty semi-final

if it goes the way we all think it will. So when I asked you for quick fire, Susie, you failed miserably. Yeah, I did. I did. Your second red card, in fact, after I annihilated you on Twitter for your opening article in The Guardian that you wrote, which you used, seminal moment, a banned phrase on this podcast that you in fact introduced the rule for yeah I mean it's true but I did write that over a week before the tournament and before we had made the rule so I'm sort of gonna like claw onto that little uh that little caveat as my as my saving grace it was supposed to be out pre-tournament and then they changed the deadline

for it so uh yeah that yeah, that's my excuse. There's no excuse. You made the rule. I'm not having it. Susie Rack, a pleasure as always. Cheers, Faye. Anita Asante, see you soon. See you soon, Faye. Salon Hickman, get yourself back to bed. Thanks, Faye, I will.

Or go to the gym, maybe. That's it for today's Women's Football Weekly. We'll be back on Sunday as we find out what our semi-final line-up is going to be. The Guardian's Women's Football Weekly is produced by Lucy Oliver and Jesse Parker Humphreys, with additional help from Silas Gray and George Cooper. Music composition was from Laura Iredale, and our executive producers are Chessie Bem, Max Sanderson and Danielle Stephens. The Guardian Women's Football Weekly is supported by Visa. Do you have business insurance? If not, how would you pay to recover from a cyber attack,

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