The Guardian's Women's Football Weekly - Hat-trick heaven for Chelsea and Tottenham – Women’s Football Weekly

Episode Date: October 24, 2023

Faye Carruthers is joined by Suzanne Wrack and Ceylon Andi Hickman to discuss all the latest news and talking points

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starting at $19 per month at zensurance.com. Be protected, be Zen. This is The Guardian. Hello, I'm Faye Carruthers and welcome to the Guardian Women's Football Weekly. Four games into the season as we enter the international break and this week was a bit of a goal fest. A couple of hat tricks to boot. Yes, we're saying two as Shuka Nuskan and Martha Thomas run the show. Wins for Chelsea, Tottenham and Manchester City see them occupy the top spots

but Aston Villa and Bristol City are yet to get off the mark. We'll round up all the WSL action, chat championship and ask whether it's ignorant and arrogant to want to change to the Champions League format. All that plus we'll look ahead to the Nations League. Take your questions and that's today's Guardian Women's Football Weekly is supported by Google Pixel, the only phone engineered by Google and official mobile phone of Arsenal Football Club, Liverpool Football Club and the England teams. Google Pixel is helping fans get closer to the game they love

with access to fresh content and never before seen footage of their favorite players and teams the new pixelate and pixelate pro are fast and secure with the most advanced pixel cameras yet and google ai powers amazing features for photos and video so you can get even closer to the game. Search Google Store to find out more. Good morning to you, Susie Rack. No hangover this week? None. Zero. I was on the orange juices last night at the women in football event at the House of Lords. So very well behaved. I'm very impressed with you. Very dull though. I have to say, no, it's not dull at all. Normally I'm on the orange juice to be fair.

And I actually had a glass of wine last night. Yay me. Salon Andy Hickman, I have to tell people what you were dressed in earlier because you looked absolutely fabulous. She rocks up onto the Zoom looking cool as anything in a leather jacket. And Susie just went, why are you wearing a leather jacket this time of the morning? Why were you? Why wouldn't you wear a leather jacket at eight o'clock in the morning? It's a very good point. Touché. Yeah, absolutely. Well, you two have both been up super early and organised, which I'm very impressed with. We're going to give a big shout out to Claire Rafferty. Bless Raff. She was supposed to be on with us this morning, but she's lost her voice. She was with us last night at the House of Lords.

She was shouting from the rooftops, wasn't she, Susie? That's why she's lost it. No, she wasn't at all. She was very well behaved. I hope you'll feel better, Raff. Let's begin at Kings Meadow, shall we? Where they're still arguing about whether Shuka Nuskan can keep the match ball. We say she can. It finished Chelsea 4, Brighton 2. shall we, where they're still arguing about whether Shuka Nuskan can keep the match ball. We say she can. It finished Chelsea 4, Brighton 2. They came from behind to beat the South Coast side and extend their winning home run to 18 games. The club posted a picture of Nuskan with

the ball holding up three fingers but the official record, boo, shows her third's been credited as an own goal to Brighton's Guru Berg's fans. I'm sure she doesn't want it either. Whoever scored it, though, it was an impressive turnaround after a shaky start, wasn't it? Susie, Nishkin put on quite the show. Yeah, and I remember it made me think of the Women's Super League Media Day before the season started, where we had Satyana Mvich and joanna writing companions sit down and chat to us for a bit and i can't remember which one of them but they were asked who had most impressed them in pre-season of the new signings like what had anyone been a bit of

surprise and one of them when the german girl nushkin is brilliant and really has been there like outstanding player of pre-season and the one that's really caught them off guard that they knew nothing about her and then she came in and was performing really well and I think you know probably a lot of people thought oh Chelsea assigned another sort of player who's going to work their way into the team and you know we may see sort of having a bit more of an impact next year which is generally the sort of Chelsea theme it takes a little bit of time for players to adapt to the level that Chelsea play at and then also the league as a whole and I mean we saw Lauren James do it take a bit of time to get used

to things at Chelsea so I think like a lot of people sort of thought that was going to be the case but she's just sort of sliding straight away and I mean her performance was incredible you've got to give her the hat trick I mean when you watch the replays it's really really hard to see um what has actually happened for the third goal I don't know about you but the if you're watching on the FA play the camera work was the most horrific I've ever seen and I'd seen people talking about it on Twitter while I was traveling and things like that. And I was like, surely, surely it's not that bad. Surely it's not worse than I've ever seen it.

And it was literally like shaking and blurry for most of it as well. You couldn't really make out like any definition of the players. But yeah, that's an aside. But yeah, I think give her the three. Yeah, and she cycled to the game. So definitely give her the three. I mean, she cycled to the game. So definitely give her the three.

I mean, for goodness sake, did you see this on Twitter? She cycled there, scored a hat-trick and cycled home again. I mean, what a legend. Absolutely love it. I absolutely loved seeing it at WSL level because I imagine quite a few of them do cycle. I imagine quite a lot of the Arsenal girls probably cycle, a lot of the Chelsea girls cycle. Seeing her roll up to Kingsmeadow on a match day on her bike like

it was beautiful we do it at Dulwich loads of us cycle to the game because we all live local and all the men roll up in their cars and we're all just there on our bikes it's quite evident of the gender pay gap I'd say as well do you know what you've mentioned Dulwich and I forgot to say congratulations what a win for you at the weekend in the FA Cup first round, Salon. Thanks very much. Yeah, big 6-0 victory. We've just drawn London Bees in the first round proper, who are two tiers above us, but not doing too well in their league. So I'm hoping for a cup set and it's at home on the 12th of November,

so it should be a really good tie. Tasty. Absolutely love that. Back to the game. Sorry, back to this game, should I say, because as far as Salon's concerned, her game was the game. But at Kings Meadow,

Pauline Broma put the visitors ahead. It was an onslaught from Chelsea, though. Frank Kirby hitting the crossbar twice. 30 attempts at goal they had. That's the most of any team in a WSL match this season I think Emma Hayes would have liked them to be a little bit more clinical with those amounts of shots but massive credit

to Brighton keeper Sophie Bagley she was in goal because Nicky Everard couldn't face her parent club and she made some inspired saves she was phenomenal you can see she's learnt a lot from being Mary Earps' number two at Manchester United and actually despite the scoreline salon there was plenty can see she's learned a lot from being Mary Earps' number two at Manchester United. And actually, despite the scoreline, Solon, there was plenty of signs for Melissa Phillips to feel positive

about her team. Yeah, definitely. I think Brighton, Chelsea is always a bit of a chaotic game and they definitely guaranteed us that chaos to match the camera work, as Susie has already mentioned. But I think Chelsea were absolutely relentless and Brighton did well to kind of get those two goals and also to minimise damage, I'd say. Yeah, even Emma Hayes right at the end of the game, she said Sophie Bagley had an absolute worldie in the first half. I think she had to pull off nine saves or so.

But Chelsea were just, they were just flowing. I think even though you had those kind of chances from Kirby hitting the woodwork, they were just flowing. Like, I think even though, you know, you had those kind of chances from Kirby, you know, hitting the woodwork, there was just something that was completely relentless. I think every time you looked, if you could work it out from the camera angles, how many attacking players were in the Brighton box at that point? There were Jess Carter's down by the corner flag. That's your centre-back whipping in crosses for an assist. And I think just to go back to Nuskan,

like she is 22 years old. That is wild. She's born in 2001. Shh. You can't say that. I graduated in 2001. That's terrifying. It's terrifying, isn't it?

But it's also like, I don't want to make comparisons to the men's game all the time because it's not helpful but I feel a bit Jude Bellingham-y about Luskin after that performance like the age the maturity the dominance the versatility she can be you know a defensive midfielder she can be a centre-back for Germany she can be a defensive midfielder absolutely dominate in that position and then she can play up there in the eight and the ten as well and she didn't just get a hat trick and we are giving her that she got hat trick and an assist and just she played with a maturity that was unbelievable for a 22 year old plus she arrived

on a bike plus she's ginger so I think I've got a new favorite player in the WSL. Yeah her assist was for Aggie Beaver Jones who got her first senior Chelsea goal and you could see how much it meant to her. Great to see a young English player getting a chance for the WSL champions. But some news

that's going to cause a lot of concern for Chelsea fans. Susie, Emma Hayes has confirmed Guru Wrighton has an ankle ligament injury and is currently in a boot. No timescale on her return.

What else do we know? Not much. I think Chelsea's reputation for not giving out the most details of injury information has become a little bit of a thing after millie bright's uh injury last season and she's fine she's fine she's fine she's having surgery she's fine she's fine she's fine all the way up till the end of the season and you know setting panicking ahead of the world cup but it's like a huge blow i mean you just can't over till the end of the season and, you know, setting panicking ahead of the World Cup. But it's like a huge blow. I mean, you just can't overstate the importance of Guru Iyotin

to this Chelsea side. You know, last season, she was so influential. One that I heavily argued that she'd be on the player of the season list, if not the player of the season. I thought she was phenomenal. So, huge blow. But, I mean, they've got so many players in that squad that it also isn't um in the you know when you've got a player like Nuskan stepping up straight from the off you've got Lauren James you've got Kat Macario coming back

you're just stacked for talent and that's without even saying Frank Kirby and Sam Kerr so it's a big blow she's a big loss but they can cope with an injury or two. Yeah, it gives good signs for the Champions League, fingers crossed, which we'll talk about later on. They've always had good squad depth, but it certainly feels as if they've got even better this season. At Sunday's late game saw Katie McCabe strike twice. Arsenal beat Bristol City 2-1 in front of a club record women's attendance of 12,008 fans at Ashton Gate. I mean, the first goal was an absolute screamer, Solange. She loves scoring worldies, doesn't she, from distance.

What did you make of McCabe and Arsenal's performance overall? She does love scoring a worldie. And the two goals were fantastic. And both goals in kind of the second phase from corners, both goals from a little bit of distance, although the second one was kind of in the box. But she takes that second one brilliantly. It's the thigh control to then just get it on the volley on her apparently weaker foot, on her right foot.

And you can argue perhaps the keeper should do better for that second goal. But Bristol deserve their props. They've come from conceding five goals the week before and everyone having question marks over their ability to be in this league, their ability to kind of defend, and they've come out, put five at the back. And they've done really, really well to hold Arsenal to 2-1. But also, critically, they forced Arsenal to only score two worldies, or one and a half worldies, let's say the first one was,

and the second one was okay. Can you have half a worldie i don't know half a worldie yeah i mean i think the keeper could do better the bristol defense have switched off slightly and let i have to way too much time to be able to thigh control the ball and then volley but i think i don't want to do the whole narrative around arsenal of like warning signs, panic, whatever, but to rely on beating Bristol City after they've just conceded five to apparently your, you know, kind of peers the week before, to rely on two K2 McCabe individual goals when you should really be putting quite a few past and winning that game comfortably. But then again, you know, we saw Viv Miedema come back.

We saw instant impact as soon as she's on and that connection with Beth Mead. And Russo's only going to benefit from having those kind of players around her. So maybe it's a matter of time and they just kind of need to grind these results out and get through until the things start clicking and flowing again. Well, let's ask our resident Arsenal fan, Susie Rack. Salon mentioned there, Viv Miedema back, a last minute substitute, 11 months out with that ACL injury, of course. I mean, she's going to be absolutely massive.

But what do you make of what Salon has said? Because it does feel as if Arsenal are kind of grinding results rather than, you know, making anything look spectacular and that they're potential league winners this season. Yeah, and at the same time, they're dominating chances-wise. I mean, and crosses as well. I think it's 105 crosses so far this season, which puts them ahead of anyone else. I thought it was in that game and I was like,

oh my God, what kind of game was that? God, Steph Catley must be absolutely naked but also the the lowest cross accuracy of anyone in the league so the most crosses but the lowest cross accuracy is 20% of those converted into decent chances so like it's they've got something there you know that they're not completely devoid of attacking talent and creating chances but it's the final ball it's the the intelligence behind the final ball for me is the problem like they're quite predictable and they're quite easy to defend against at the moment we saw it against Villa with Beth Mead coming on late and like making an impact and providing the assist and finding a pass that many of the other players

on the pitch probably wouldn't have taken they probably would have tried to get the ball through a million bodies which said tends to be the way they're going at the moment and I thought you know Middermere's pass to me sort of pretty much the only thing she was able to do in her few minutes on the pitch but was indicative of what Arsenal had been missing, is that the intelligence of the pass is just going to open up defences that are really banking up against you. Because otherwise, they're just hitting the ball into bodies over and over and over again and building up this incredible shots and crosses tally.

But it's just very, very easy for teams to handle. And I think when you get Miedema playing more, you have a spine there who are both able and sort of willing and want to play through the middle and play quite creatively. I think we've seen it. We saw it against Villa. We saw it on Sunday night with Lotto Uwe Moy at the back. She starts a lot of those moves because she wants to drive out.

She doesn't always look for the wide pass. She does look for the splitting pass or the pass into Russo's feet, which misses a line out. And then I think there was the point in the second half where there was a save and a triple block made from Palova. But that move starts from Lotta driving out seeing that pass to split which is the progression that we didn't see in the kind of you know early opening games where all we had was going out wide and getting crosses into the box and i thought as well i didn't watch the whole post-match but

jonas idevelds maybe feels like he's got a bit of a point to prove. And, you know, I think he was really explicit by being like, we went direct, we varied it. We didn't just, I don't know, he's probably online. He's probably seen some stats about his crossing and the commentary about just what are our options? Just stick it out wide and fizz it into the box. And he was like, no, no, we can play in different ways.

And I think that will only get better when you have someone like Viv Miedema who loves to drop deep click the ball turn or get on the half turn and then slide like Russo does so well right when she gets onto the end of those balls so I think it will build and it will get there but at the moment it's kind of ish like let's try and just get the three points and and move to the next game. Yeah it's gonna be really interesting to see what Arsenal can do after the international break, isn't it? Now that they've got some players coming back in and how Alessio Russo kind of fits in with the rest of that attacking line as well. But let's just chat Bristol City quickly, Susie, because Rachel Furness did get them back into it pretty quickly afterwards.

I think it was just under 10 minutes that she got the equalizer and they did you know frustrate Arsenal for large spells but they still don't have anything to show for their efforts this season do you feel as if there are signs that they're learning and potentially growing into the league definitely I mean you can see the progression right and like the fact that the goals came from like second phases of play offset pieces was indicative of the fact that you can clearly see what you've got to do right like there's a problem there it's a very simple thing to solve just don't switch off um so there's really great signs i thought the goal was fantastic jamie napier's cross brilliant finesse's head great poor defending from arsenal i thought olivia clark goalkeeper really really

really solid game you can see it from the first half against City five goals down to then keeping a clean sheet in that second half when you know most teams would have completely crumbled and then coming out and putting in a performance like that getting a goal against a team that would like to consider themselves as WSL title contender whether they are or not is maybe a little bit up in the air. There is, there's real signs of development and there's a lot to be excited about because they're quite a young team.

Laurence Smith is a, feels like a really grounded, down-to-earth manager as well. Like I get a really good, a good feel from her. She's very realistic about their prospects and really wants to give young players a chance so yeah I think we're seeing young players learn as they go and I think it's you know you can see the progress there it just in the past couple of games yeah they've got West Ham Aston Villa and then Everton and their

three November games before they then have Manchester United and a couple of cup games in between there. So potential for them to pick up some points at least. And they'll fancy it against Everton, who were beaten 5-0 by Manchester United at Walton Hall Park. It was a big response from United, actually, after their Champions League exit. Mark Skinner said after the game, his side were back to what we do best in a win that included second-half braces for Nikita Paris and super sub Rachel Williams

after summer signing Melvin Mallard had opened the scoring after 14 minutes. She's been brilliant for them this season, hasn't she? And actually, I think Mark Skinner's going to be chuffed to bits. There was no sign of a hangover from that midweek disappointment out in Paris Salon. No, and it's all they've got to focus on now, right? And I think they maybe had a bit of a hangover from that midweek disappointment out in Paris Salon. No, and it's all they've got to focus on now, right? And I think they maybe had a bit of a dream of progressing into the Champions League

and what that might have done for their league chances. I think you would, you know, you kind of want the fairy tale of the Champions League run, but maybe it's played into their hands that they can really focus on the league. And they've, you know, they've got off to a good start I mean battering Everton was I thought Nikita Paris was brilliant I thought there was a kind of quiet brilliance of Katie Zellum as always where you know her set piece delivery her ability to you know put the ball in the box and get really good assists and play some split and passes was fantastic and also just really, really promising going forward. But yeah, Everton, in my notes for this game, I've written one thing.

I don't know if you can see that under Everton. Useless. Useless. I'm like, what do I even say? I dare you to tell Marva Creel that. Useless. Like, honestly, they just looked absolutely shocking. Were they useless though Susie because

you said in your talking points round up in the Guardian that their performance wasn't as embarrassing as the scoreline suggests but I mean they have to tighten up defensively don't they? It's the defence is the problem they were shambolic and I felt like 3-0 was the fair scoreline and then the defence just collapsed completely. And like for me, they're really, really missing Gabby George and Bikisoveke. Two really, really significant players. And I think a lot of people are wondering how they're going to sort of cope without them. And the answer is not that well.

Yeah, just defensively, the shape, the connection between those three players at the back, Natalie Bjorn, Megan Finnegan and Katrine Veggie like just not that great they're not fast enough to cope with a attack like Man United's yeah I just found it quite disappointing they didn't really defend as a team you didn't see the wing back sort of dropping deep enough in a like really organized fashion obviously when you're two nil down they they sort of went man for man and you know went more attacking and thought maybe we can get a goal out of this and that then opened it up a little bit at the back and made it a little bit easier so i mean you could say that the change in structure was them attempting to go for it was maybe the fault of uh of conceding those last uh three goals

but you've just got to do better like there's just goals. But you've just got to do better. There's just a line where you've just got to do better. And, yeah, Brian Soroson was very much, you know, we know what we've got to do. We know we're a good team. The game against Liverpool showed that. But, I mean, you're now three defeats in four with Liverpool the outlier.

There's only so long you can sort of do. We were really great. We could have got a result here, but we didn't until you start addressing the more serious problems there. Also, what a terrible weekend for Matt Beard. The team that beat you in the Merseyside derby at Anfield, then go out and lose 5-0 to your longest rival, Manchester United, and then you concede in the last minute and only get a point against the dodgy West Ham side.

I think someone needs to check in on Matt Beard. Well, we'll check in on Matt Beard in part two. But I mean, I have to say the 5-0 scoreline for Manchester United was even more impressive because they were missing the Brazilian playmaker Giza and Leah Galton as well through sickness which hit the squad. Can you imagine if they were both playing as well? It's actually a pretty professional performance from them in the circumstances. Good performance as well from Tottenham Hotspur at the Bescott Stadium. Spurs romping to a 4-2 win over Aston Villa coming from behind thanks

to a stunning hat-trick from summer signing and one of the stars of the season so far, Martha Thomas. Robert Villaham said it was a joy to watch his side and you can't really argue with him, Solon. They've kind of been the surprise package of the season. They have and it's really fun to see them do so well, I think. Oh,

oh, Zuzi's going, no! I am a follower and supporter of Arsenal women as well but I also I like to see when the top the top half of the table doesn't have the usual suspects sitting there I love seeing Leicester and Spurs at the top agreed much more fun it is really fun and also the Martha Thomas I don't know maybe the revenge tour line is a bit overused, but the Martha Thomas season of her life has started well. And you can tell that she is just loving her football at the moment. And it's such a beautiful thing to see in an attacking player.

Susie, she needs to take a massive bow, doesn't she, Martha Thomas? Six goals for the season, three goals in this game and it feels like she's completely reinvigorated this Spurs side in the absence of Bethany England what's going to happen when Bethany England comes back she has to sit on the bench no obviously not it just means that options are really good but I was thinking back to over Martha Thomas because I remember that when she joined Man United I remember a lot of the United fans were a little bit sort of underwhelmed by her signing and I remember thinking oh she's been quite good for West Ham she could be good she could be all right and then obviously she you know massively underwhelmed at United didn't really get any sort of serious runs in the team

which I think is clearly you know what she needed But I also sort of was slightly guiltier thinking she's a really confident player in that she comes across as someone who really, really believes in her own ability. And I've almost felt like that that was slightly unjustified because, you know, she hadn't really shown it. And, you know, I'm like happily eating my my words my views because you know she's been phenomenally good and clearly if you give someone the support the belief a decent running aside the right people around them you know you can get the best out of them in ways that maybe people didn't expect um and the fact that she's alluded to the fact, or her manager's alluded to the fact that, you know,

it's putting a bit of support around players like that and giving them some belief. It's almost been, I think, a little bit of a dig at Mark Skinner that maybe that environment wasn't provided at Manchester United is something to think about and to keep an eye on at Man United. That maybe if you're not sort of in the starting 11 and the favoured set, then maybe there might be a little bit of a bigger problem there.

I don't know, but, you know, that's what the sort of signs indicate based on what managers and former players are saying around players that used to play there and are now doing very well elsewhere. That's the word on the street. The word on the street, as they say. For Villa, though, it's the third time in four games

they've taken the lead, only to squander it. We featured Luke's email last week. He got in touch on womensfootballweeklyattheguardian.com and he's emailed us again, identifying a number of issues for Villa, but basically saying a lack of depth is the biggest problem and they don't really have any game changes that can come on and he's worried in January that the club could start losing top

players and also in the summer transfer window fascinating isn't it but what do you make of those observations from Luke Stallone how concerning is it for Carla Ward? Yeah, I think Luke's right. I think what was brilliant about Villa last season was that things seemed to click and there was a sort of overachieving energy about the team that was like, look, everything says we shouldn't necessarily do well, but we are pulling together

and we have got both the kind of team group cohesion the tactics and the individual brilliance from players like Rachel Daly that will grind out results here and almost had a bit of a you know they they did kind of upset things last season this season it seems like all they really have is a little bit of individual brilliance I haven't really they are missing Kenza Dali right and that things could change when she comes back but i think if your results are you know premised on the fact one player then you know it's like if rachel daly was out we'd probably be having the same conversation and it'd be warning signs but ultimately i think maybe teams have just worked out how to play against them then you know they

they don't have that shock factor anymore because you go to Villa now and you think, right, well, Villa are kind of best of the rest. Then we're going to give them a good go. It is concerning. And if I was a Villa fan, I'd be asking quite big questions of Carla Ward. I think she has to think quite creatively. She has the team that she has now, right? So something has to change with with how they're

you know training how they're playing and yeah I think it's always I don't know maybe maybe indicative of what Avila Ham said at the end and he said this is a really hard place to come this is a hard away day to come and they've won quite emphatically so emphatically that Ash Neville has pulled out a knee slide at 2-1 in front of zero fans in the box. We've got to give her credit. I know she's a defender, she doesn't score that often, but a knee slide in front of no fans. She hadn't even left the penalty area.

It was amazing. But if I was Villa, I'd be like, that's insulting. Thanks, Ash. Love it. One thing I was wondering was whether this, like, we're not making enough of the turnover in the summer at Villa because it makes me reflect on Everton and Winnicurk and whether, you know, just before he was sacked,

they had made, like, nine new players were signed in the summer and then they have a really really shaky start to the season they're trying to gel that new side everyone expecting them to go on on challenge for top three or top four after having such a good season and then he gets sacked and i'm just wondering if this is villa's moment because we forget that they got rid of 11 players and they had seven come in and that's quite a high turnover I mean obviously some of those players signed were players that they had had and then on loan and then like tied down like kind of pattern of Kirstie Hanson and things but I just wonder whether that's maybe having a bit more of an impact so maybe we give uh thought to it may not be that may be too much of an excuse

I'm starting to think that maybe we dismissed Luke's email a little bit too readily last week and there's more to the point he's got but yeah I think turnover in the summer and time for players to gel in together and cope with the personality changes and stuff in the dressing room as well and then the lack of Ken Zidali is really really costing him that minute shows that when you don't have that squad depth that it's it's a big big issue Yeah, he did mention Daphne van Domselaar, who we know is a superb keeper, maybe taking a little bit of time to find her feet as well. That's it for part one. In part two, we'll wrap up the rest of the WSL action, talk Champions League qualification drama,

and look ahead to the Nations League. welcome back to part two of the guardian women's football weekly let's just round up our final couple of wsl results chloe kelly's 10th minute strike sent manchester city to the top of the table and ended leicester's unbeaten start to the season at King Power Stadium. Just the solitary Chloe Kelly goal after 10 minutes. And it means Gareth Taylor's side sit level on 10 points with Chelsea, but top of the power because of their superior goal difference. It's also an impressive three clean sheets in four games for Kiara Keating and co. Of course, Kiara Keating called up to the England squad as well.

We'll talk that in a second. Plenty of chances for City, but credit has to go to Leicester for that brave showing as well. Willie Kirk says his side were just half a yard off being excellent. I don't think little Leicester are so little anymore, he said. We've made a statement in these opening four games. And actually, he's right, Susie, isn't he? They tested Manchester City and made them work hard for those three points oh yeah they've been brilliant and it's great to see

sort of reflecting on you know what we said towards the end of part one uh when we're talking about Villa and Everton and when Willie Kirk was sacked from Everton I that felt so unjust to me given what he had done at that side and how much turnover they had had in the summer and how much expectation there was on him, it felt like a really, really premature thing. So it's really, really nice to see him take on a club that is destined for relegation, turn it around, save them and now have them seriously organised and contesting the top teams in the league and getting results off of them. It's obviously not in off of them like it's obviously not in this case but it's it's really really refreshing and i think it speaks to what a good manager he is at not just going out and signing big stars but finding players that fit

the way he wants to play and then getting the best out of them because they're playing in the exact way that he feels will best suit their system. It's just very, very organised, very clever, intelligent, putting together a team phenomenal against the team that looks like they're going to run away with the league unless Chelsea and Arsenal pull their socks up. Yeah, and actually I think we need to give a bit of a nod to Manchester City because Gareth Taylor's had a bit of a bumpy ride on this pod in the past, hasn't he? But actually he's doing the business this season

and all plaudits to him for that. Solon, you alluded to this game earlier on. West Ham won, Liverpool won. Late drama of Victoria Road. Rico Weki scoring a last gasp injury time equaliser to snatch a point for West Ham in a one-all draw with Liverpool Marie Hopinger had deservedly put Matt

Beard's side ahead shortly after the half-time break and despite dominating the game and the Hammers not even having a shot on target until added time Wecky bundled home from close range in the 95th minute to snatch a point and as you said Liverpool will be so frustrated. They absolutely bossed the game, switched off at the crucial moment.

I hate for the old cliche, but it doesn't matter how much you have the ball if you don't put it in the back of the net, you know. And I think Liverpool will be feeling that. I think Matt Beard was, yeah, he was kind of rightly pissed off at the end. He knew that his team were the better side, but weren't able to convert. And you will be absolutely fuming 30 seconds left on the clock for that goalmouth scramble for West Ham to pull it back and equalise and steal a point from that game. But if you're going to be a top team

and you want to be able to, you know, get those three points out, you know that you cannot let that happen in the last 30 seconds of a game. So Liverpool will be absolutely fuming, but they'll learn from it. And I don't know if Matt Beard will let that happen again.

Let's talk Champions League, shall we? Here's an email from Chris. He says, Hello, Women's Football Weekly. The hello women's football weekly the mooted very vaguely mooted reforms to the women's champions league after next season cannot come soon enough it's not fit for purpose it is surely meant to be an elite competition between the continent's very best teams the way the qualifying rounds are organized currently seems designed actively to prevent that this is not the bitter rant of an Arsenal or Manchester United fan. I'm

not a supporter of either, but I do want to see them compete in the UWCL along with the likes of Juventus and Wolfsburg. If, say, Lyon get a real test from their group containing Bran, Slavia Prague and St. Poulton, then I guess I'll eat my words, but it seems unlikely. The longer the Champions League carries on with so many big clubs absent, the more damaging it will be to the competition, the viewer numbers and the game as a whole. And Jim has also messaged us to say, Is the Women's Champions League better for having a more diverse selection of teams qualifying for the group stage? Or does the quality suffer by missing out on some of the world-class players from teams like Wolfsburg, Arsenal and Manchester United. Food for thought on both sides of that, I would say. So much talk

in midweek about the qualification process for the Champions League after Manchester United were knocked out by PSG 4-2 on aggregate in the end after that 3-1 defeat in Paris. Here's what Mark Skinner had to say afterwards. We deserve to be at this level. I've no doubt about that. There are teams going through to the group stage that aren't good enough. And he later apologised for those comments. Gareth Taylor, the Manchester City boss, said it's a shame to lose teams of a good standard before the group stages. But Jonas Eidevall and Emma Hayes weren't quite on the same page. Jonas said, we can't say that's anyone else's problem but our own. We need to improve the quality in the league

so that when English teams are playing in Europe, they're winning their games. And Emma Hayes went a little bit further and said it's ignorant and arrogant to suggest that the qualification process isn't fit for purpose. I mean, look, it's been a really hot topic, not just this week,

over a sustained period of time, actually, Susie. Where do you stand on it all? I think, firstly, the group stage is a relatively new thing, right? So that was a really, really great change to competition that pushed it forward, centralising the rights, all of that. That was good progress, right? Yeah, there's clearly a need to change and to develop it and i don't think anyone necessarily predicted that it would be so successful so quickly and warrant change as soon as it has but at the same time like some of those comments are just so insanely disrespectful to champions of their leagues who have earned the right to compete in

the champions league over teams that finish second or third in their league of the top leagues in europe like i'm not being funny but if arsenal beat paris fc they're you know heading in the right direction if wolfsburg beat paris fc they're heading in the right direction straight to the group stage. Man United should have done better against PSG. They had enough chances to win that game. Regardless of whether they were pitted against one of the best teams, they have five years of existence under their belt, have not contributed to the Champions League coefficient in any way because it's their first time in the competition,

have not won a league, have not won a cup other than uh the championship like they have no right to be in there ahead of some of these sides that are really really good teams but on top of that it's also really really disrespectful to the development of women's football in europe right because all of those teams that make the group stage get 400 000000 euros just for making the group stage. If they qualify from the group stage, they get another at least 25,000, potentially more if they go on to draw, win the games or whatever it may be and get a little bit further. But you look at that group with Leon Brand, Slavia Prague and St. Poulton in, one of those three teams is qualifying for the knockout stage with Leon Brand, Slavia Prague and St. Poulton in. One of those three teams is qualifying

for the knockout stage with Leon, right? Let's face it, Leon are going to progress from that group, but one of those other teams is also going to progress. They're going to get another chunk of money that is going to go directly into their club and into their investment in their league. It's going to push the level of everyone in their league because they'll think, I've got a chance of getting there, right? I've got a chance of playing in this elite competition in Europe. Sparta Prague often challenged Sl prague for the title in the czech republic they're gonna up their game thinking well yeah we've got a chance of doing this we've got a genuine chance of doing this it's real money into the leagues and it helps keep the level up right

it helped pushes the level across europe now i'm not saying that we shouldn't expand it. My argument is expansion is better than necessarily changing the qualifying stage to make it easier for the big clubs to get through. I think that would be outrageous. But expanding it so that you get a mixture of both, I think, is the way to go because there is something that is lost in, obviously, those clubs not being there. And in terms of like you know the broadcast rights deals and all that kind of stuff and the hype around it and the media coverage like it's

always going to be bigger if those big clubs are involved that help grow the game as well but it should never ever ever be at the expense of clubs that have earned their right to be in there through winning their leagues even if their leagues aren't very good or semi-professional they deserve to be there and yeah like ignorant and arrogant is what Emma Hayes said and she's right and speaking of clubs that deserve to be there none other than Paris FC let's put some respect on Paris FC's name they have beaten Arsenal and Wolfsburg to a finalist and a semi-finalist from last year and they are now

they're sitting second in Ligue 1 they've played 5-1-5 in the league they're sitting above PSG they are now in the Champions League group with Chelsea, Haken and Real Madrid I am a Paris FC fan and if people are Arsenal fans

who are now homeless in the Champions League or you're Man United fans homeless in the Champions League Paris FC is where your support should go because they are going to go on a bit of an upset and if they they do qualify in that group they're knocking out either one of Chelsea or Real Madrid to add to their tally of Arsenal and Wolfsburg like that is what the Champions League is about it's so exciting and it's so fun so I think I completely agree let's just expand it rather than change it i'll just caveat that obviously those wins for paris fc like they've had the whole summer pretty much of their entire squad to prepare for those games

whereas obviously arsenal wolfsburg have had players like getting to the latter stages of the world cup arsenal like 17 days between the end of the world cup and the start of their champions league qualifiers, which isn't enough for players. So that needs looking at, but you can't take away from, like, regardless of all of that, their teams that should be winning those games will stop. Like, they have the level, the quality, blah, blah.

So, paraphrasing, you can't undermine their achievement at all. But that is a small caveat, and that is something else that needs to change to make it fair in that respect too yeah agreed 100 so the groups barcelona fc rosengard benfica and eintracht frankfurt are in group a leon slavia prague st paulton and sk brand in group b by munich paris saint-germain roma and iax Ouch in Group C. And Group D, Chelsea, Real Madrid, BK Haken and Paris FC. Cannot wait for the groups to kick off. Now, on Monday evening, Arsenal released a statement in response to criticism of their team photo

because of the lack of diversity in the squad. It said, We acknowledge our current women's first team squad doesn't reflect the diversity that exists across the club and the communities that we represent. Increasing participation among young women and girls from diverse backgrounds is a key priority for us at academy level, with specific measures in place to improve pathways and accessibility. Across all our teams, including our men's and women's academies, we're proud of our players from diverse backgrounds who've contributed to our history, success and culture. It's a priority for the club to continue to drive greater diversity and inclusion and create a sense of belonging for everyone connected to

the club. It's an issue that's garnered a lot of attention on social media, Salon. The lack of diversity amongst the Lionesses is something we've also spoken about before. What do you make of the move from the club to acknowledge it publicly? I'd encourage it. I think it's important that they are aware of the criticism and also there are people in that football club, everyone will know that when they put that photo out, that that is the criticism that they're going to get

and they'll be very aware of the issue. I think the worst thing they could have done is kind of ignore it or bury their head in the sand or come out defensively and i they didn't right they came out and said yeah it's not where we want it to be and i think that allows us to then you know to keep highlighting that issue to keep talking about that issue if the clubs are going to be receptive and say yeah you're right to spotlight this this is what we're doing this is where we want to to. That allows us to have a dialogue about it. And I don't think if we repress those conversations or those conversations are just limited to just 140 characters, Twitter discourse, we don't make the progress. We don't really get to the crux of these issues. We have talked about

it at length on this podcast. Many other people have talked about it, written essays essays on it why this happens and we all know the reasons right that where the academies are based the kind of football becoming more and more middle class because the academies are based out of central areas and cities and it takes so much effort and resource to be able to get kids from working class backgrounds on their way to training and we you know I see it every single day at Football Beyond Borders and it's part of the reason why we exist and I think I would welcome more conversations at club level publicly to say that keep holding us accountable keep telling us what we need to be doing better and we will put the things in place with people support with expert support to be able to change that picture.

And the sooner that they can change it, the better. Yeah, actually, Natalie has asked us on Twitter, Susie, what do you think of Arsenal's diversity statement? Should they be looking in different markets for players? I think the statement's great. I think Solon's completely right to acknowledge it. I also thought it was really great that, you know, you're sat at the Emirates for the Aston Villa game. Shortly after the photo has gone online.

They had a whole bit pre-match on the Black Pioneers within the Invincibles team on the men's side. black in that like historic team over sort of course the season which you know is again great to acknowledge that piece of your history and celebrate it particularly in the context of of the discussion that's going on but yeah i mean do you go out and sign players just because they're black obviously not but i think you do have to at some stage look at you know what is in front of you as an entirely white squad and say that there is something missing from this team you know diversity doesn't just make a photo look pretty it brings a lot to a group as a whole and if you're not seeing that as a vital cog of what you're doing then then maybe that's a problem. Obviously, there's a lot of international diversity there. The manager is Swedish.

He's signed a lot of Swedish players. There's so many issues. It's a discussion that's going to keep coming up, I think, until something is done, as is this, by the way. And we will get into more of this in depth because we don't have time today during the international break next week because Saudi Arabia want to host the 2035 Women's World Cup. That's according to the

technical director of the country's women's team. The Gulf Kingdom's already lodged a formal bid to host the 2034 Men's World Cup. This is what Monica Stab had to say at the Leaders Week conference at Twickenham. I believe it's a bright future for the women's and girls game in saudi arabia just a really quick one on this suzy because we will go more in depth on it next week but what did you make of the comments i mean it's frustrating because like in a way you know if they are developing the game in Saudi Arabia in a genuine way and they are investing in teams and things, then, you know, why not? Why shouldn't they bid for it? At the same time, when you've got a huge number of players

that couldn't live their lives there comfortably because they're gay, like, it's just... It's really, really difficult to see it being progressive in any respects to have it in a country that is to all intents and purposes using sport to clean up a reputation that that is marred by human rights violations and like horrific laws against uh women's rights to participate in society in a normal way, as we would see it. I'm not surprised by Monica Stab's comments, because she was the first manager of the Saudi Arabia women's team, managed Qatar before that, managed Bahrain before that. So she's obviously

going to be a big advocate for the Middle East hosting a World Cup. What her motivations have been for going to Saudi Arabia when there's a lot of money on offer and a lot of talk around that is is hard to say maybe it's bigger than that i know that people have gone to work in saudi arabia who genuinely think that they will be able to improve things for women and girls there in a really really i would call it naively innocent way personally but for them it's it's been genuine like it's a genuine desire to do good so it's a really really difficult one but um but yeah I just like there would have to be such extreme change in society and government and stuff in Saudi Arabia for for me to ever see

there being it being possible to host a World Cup there. And I don't think players would accept it. And I hope they wouldn't. Yeah, it's going to be fascinating, isn't it, to delve in because actually, I sat in at Leaders Week to a couple of discussions about sport in Saudi Arabia and what they're trying to change societally. But you have to actually see that change. And maybe I'm a naive person that I like to see good in the world and really hope that they're looking ahead and do genuinely want to change what that society has been and what people have experienced. Because I know people who live in Saudi and enjoy living in Saudi as well.

So we shall certainly see. The first international break of the season is upon us. England are in Nations League action. Back-to-back matches against Belgium coming up for Serena Wiegmann's Lionesses. Leicester's King Power Stadium is the venue on Friday night before they then head out to Leuven in Belgium on Tuesday evening. I mean, that 2-1 defeat by the Netherlands back in September in Utrecht, Susie, means that it's a pretty important week for Serena Wiegmann's side to regroup and find some rhythm yeah definitely um I had forgotten about that result so thanks for reminding me yes it is a big week it's not going to be the easiest of weeks

they're two tough games but that said said, there's optimism around the side. You know, we're starting to see players come back. Obviously, you know, we've not got Beth Mead backing the squad yet, but she's on the cusp, surely, of re-entering. And there are reasons to be relatively optimistic. I think Niamh Charles has been brilliant of late. Yeah, it's not going to be easy. Having competitive fixtures so soon after a major international tournament I think Niamh Charles has been brilliant of late. Yeah, it's not going to be easy.

Having competitive fixtures so soon after a major international tournament is a bit of a new thing. And there's not really any time to rest. So yeah, on paper, England should beat Belgium. But at the same time, Belgium have impressed lately for me. Yeah, squad-wise, Frank Kirby is back, as is Keira Walsh. Great to see Grace Clinton and Chiara Keating rewarded for their excellent starts to the season with call-ups as well. No room, as you said, for Beth Mead yet after her return from injury

and the likes of Laura Coombs, Jordan Nobbs, Lucy Staniforth and Katie Robinson all drop out. A special mention, though, to our friend Anita Asante, who's now part of the England Under-23s coaching team. That news was revealed as part of the new phase of the England Elite Coach Programme for the development teams, which was announced on Monday. Elsewhere, Canada captain and the world's all-time leading international goalscorer Christine Sinclair is retiring from the women's national team. 40 years old she is now, and she's scored a record 190 goals for her country in 327 matches playing across six World Cups. She is going to continue playing at club level, though,

with Portland Thorns next season. She's going to have two send-off games for Canada taking place in November and December before retiring. She said, you can't play forever. This seems like a good time to be done. Like Megan Rapinoe a couple of weeks ago, end of an era for another legend of the game. And just a quick wrap up of what's been going on

in the championship because it's competitive and unpredictable in the second tier. Sunderland have surged to the top after their 2-0 victory over Lewis. They took advantage after Southampton were beaten 1-0 by London City Lionesses. A surprise given they'd lost their last four on

the bounce. Charlton continue their fine form. They beat Crystal Palace 3-2 and it all means that Sunderland are three points clear at the top with 18 points. Southampton sit on second alongside the Addicks on 15 points. We need to keep an eye out for Birmingham though as well.

They're on the charge after finding their feet following a poor start. They beat Watford five goals to two. And I know I say it every week, but we will, I promise, do a little bit more in-depth in the championship because it's looking like a really competitive league this season. Susie Rack, it's been a pleasure as always. As always. I'm going back to bed. Oh, I'm very jealous. I've got stuff. As always. I'm going back to bed. Oh, I'm very jealous.

I've got stuff to do and then I'm going to the gym. But I shall see you at King Power Stadium. Salon, lovely to see you. Thanks, Faye, and you. Now, it might be the international break, but we will be back next week to round up all the action and big stories from across the women's game in the Nations League and beyond.

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