The Guardian's Women's Football Weekly - James returns to haunt Manchester United – Women’s Football Weekly

Episode Date: November 8, 2022

Faye Carruthers, Robyn Cowen, Karen Bardsley and Mayowa Quadri round up a wild, weather-hit WSL weekend

This is The Guardian. Without insurance, your assets are at risk from major financial losses, data breaches and natural disasters. Get customized coverage today starting at $19 per month at zensurance.com. Be protected. Be Zen. Hello, I'm Faye Carruthers and welcome to the Guardian Women's Football Weekly. Manchester United's unbeaten start to the season is ended by Chelsea as Lauren James, who else, comes back to haunt Lee and leave with three points. Arsenal are now the only side left with a 100% record in the WSL. Rain, rain, go away? Not when it comes to raining goals though.

More please as West Ham and Brighton play out the most exciting game of the season but the weather wreaks havoc elsewhere rain stopping play at Spurs Lewis and Crystal Palace meanwhile Rachel Daly's back on villa penalty duty and it's a bad day at the office for Emma McCandy we'll discuss all of that look ahead to England's international break take your questions And that's today's Guardian Women's Football Weekly. Well, today's panel have 82 England caps between them. However, they all belong to Karen Bardsley. How is retirement treating you, Karen? Yeah, it's going good, thanks. It's pretty busy at the minute. I actually just set the Northwest football awards last night. So bit of a late one, but yeah, really enjoyable.

Watched the Lionesses bring home an impact award for their impact in obviously women's football from the summer. So that was really cool. And then I saw Jill Scott and Ellen White earned the Maurice Watkins lifetime contribution award. So that was quite nice to see them acknowledged for obviously all the contributions to women's football. But yeah, it's been busy. Just took a new role as a project officer at Manchester City Women. And it feels like I'm drinking out of a fire hose.

I'm going to ask you more about that later on in the pod. But you mentioned Jill Scott, Robin Cowan, very important question probably the most important question of the pod today is Jill gonna win I'm a Celebrity? 100 million percent she is outstanding I mean supportive funny and I was speaking to Farrah Williams and Alex Scott when I was on with them last week. And the main question for this is if you get hangry, that can really damage your chances. And they just said she's like that all the time.

So she'll be absolutely fine. The only way she can ruin this is if she's nice to Matt Hancock, in my opinion. If she goes up in the face of Matt Hancock and says what she said on the pitch in the Euros final, crown her now.

Yeah, stop the competition. That'll be it. No point in carrying on. I got a big thumbs up just there from broadcaster Maio Akwadri making his pod debut. How are you doing? I'm well, I'm well. The thumbs up was necessary. I feel like being a former professional footballer is almost perfect for that setting because, you know, you need the sort of ability to work well with teammates. You need to be able to deal with adversity. And essentially, you have to be used to everyone watching you 24-7, which she's very used to. And she's got, you know, the benefit of being a national hero at the moment, too. So I think it's a shoo-in. I think it's a shoo-in. It should be so easy.

And I mean, ultimately, as you mentioned, if we do get that moment like we did in the Euros final, then we're laughing. Oh, that's it. She's crowned for life. Make her queen. OK, let's kick things off, shall we, with Manchester United 1, Chelsea 3. United's fantastic start to the WSL season. Crane crashing down to earth as Chelsea beat them in a record crowd of more than 6,000 at Leeds Sports Village. Goals from Sam Kerr, Lauren James and Erin Cuthbert. Their fourth, and this is weird, the stats this season are so weird,

their fourth 3-1 of the season. Robin, how do we sum up this Chelsea performance? Can we do it simply with the familiar crowd chant of that's why we're champions? I think so, yeah. Because I don't think they play particularly well, but they don't have to and they still win. And I think that's the difference

between Manchester United and Chelsea at the moment. Man United, when they come up against one of the top three, have to basically be perfect. And when they're not, you've got this Chelsea team who just, they can cruise through these games because they've got the quality, the depth and a sort of fear factor almost. I mean, I think we shouldn't write off Manchester United completely because of this result you know they've had an amazing start to the season particularly defensively but I just think it just shows that as the crowd said they're champions and this is what champions do and even though Manchester

United again they weren't that bad but as Mark Skinner said afterwards you know just that decision making in the moment was a little bit lacking and a Chelsea can do that to you yeah and also champions take top players to weaken their opposition as well and uh Maya where we talk about Lauren James every single week on this pod but she just keeps giving us things to to talk about she looked like she was loving every minute of playing against her old team. A hundred percent. And you just have to give credit to the way Chelsea have handled this, because there was a lot of expectation when she was brought in. There was a lot of conversation about what she needed. And the whole conversation was, we're going to ease her into this. We need

to load her properly and make sure she's ready physically, mentally. And now you're seeing the player that you saw glimpses of at Manchester United and the connection she's making with her teammates, this lovely sort of sisterhood she has with Sam Kerr. It's honestly beautiful. And as you mentioned, Robin, when you have that sort of depth, that sort of danger in your team, it's no disguise that when Manchester United come up against Chelsea there is this sort of factor of oh we're essentially going to lose this game because as you

mentioned they've been so good all season but you come up against a team like this where you have one of the greatest strikers in the world that doesn't have to be in great form and can just score a goal out of nothing you have a former player that wants to prove a point it is a very difficult task and of course I wouldn't write United off but we know what happens with this league one result can be the difference so it is harsh United after such a great start after such momentum after as you mentioned a historic day with a record crowd but this is the level that they are trying to get to now of having this inevitability that wherever we go you will fear us so a good lesson them, but that's what Chelsea do. That's what their champions are.

Absolutely. KB, we talked in last week's pod about how this was going to be a real test of United's title and perhaps Champions League credentials. You were part of that City squad that had to establish yourselves almost from scratch in the WSL and play a little bit of catch up to the likes of Arsenal and Chelsea. How hard is that experience? Manchester United obviously going through it right now, trying to bridge the gap to the more established teams. Yeah, I mean, when we started in 2014, it was a massive, massive gap. There was just this huge chasm. And I think there were maybe five of us that were full time and we

were just kind of pulling all the strings like puppet masters. So interestingly, I think there were maybe five of us that were full-time, and we were just kind of pulling all the strings like puppet masters. So interestingly, I think United have done really, really well to bring in some top talent. I think it was nice to see Alessia Russo get back on the pitch, and she's always dangerous. But yeah, in terms of building that momentum, I think they're certainly playing, up until that point, really good football. And I think they're also building a lot of belief and a lot of momentum and

come up against a team like Chelsea. Something I've really been impressed with by them is that they've kind of developed into this team that plays both sides of the game, if you know what I mean. So it doesn't always have to be pretty, but they've become like really effective, you know, in those key moments. You know, we've seen them play on waterlogged pitches and still find a way to win. So it's a testament to their mentality and the depth in the squad and how they're managed. So yeah, I think it says a lot about Chelsea in terms of their belief, their momentum, but it's also setting a bar, isn't it says a lot about Chelsea in terms of their belief, their momentum. But it's also setting a bar, isn't it? You know, something to aspire to for the rest of the league.

I think Arsenal are just as dominant at the minute. And it's kind of like this race between who can manage the gaps the most. So, you know, it's fine margins, isn't it? What we've seen in, you seen in the previous season around Man City just pipping it at the last minute to get that Champions League spot. And in that league back in 2014, we missed out on some big, big moments because we let a few results kind of slip through the cracks, if you know what I mean.

So it's really important to pick up those key points, regardless of how you're playing at the time. I think what's really difficult for Manchester United is that they clearly have a deeper squad this season and they've clearly improved. And we've seen that on a sort of club level. But the problem is no Chelsea in Arsenal and to an extent Manchester City, none of them have stood still either. So you're kind of always playing a little bit of catch-up I think that's also why you know Manchester City under KB you I mean you won the title in 2016 which was really you know really soon after you kind of became a full-time team which is really impressive but it seems like everyone has a few more resources so Manchester United I don't know they're gonna have to do

something like big to kind of bridge that gap now aren aren't they? I think it's going to be huge, you know, in terms of what you think about where we were in 2016. You know, it was like big investment. And what was the ecosystem doing? You know, there wasn't a lot of other people doing the same sort of thing. So it was quite easy. You know, it's like a young player coming into football. They're going to improve really, really quickly. But someone that's kind of established established they're going to have those real small moments of of improvement so it's it's kind of taking into the entire context of everyone to your point robin moving at the same time so it's going to be hard and you're you're right it's going to take some big improvement we're not going to see teams like leon anymore you know take five six european champions league titles you know it's just not

going to happen it's going to be so spread out, you know, moving forward. From your perspective in that situation with that sort of game where the team have been doing so well, performing so well, and you come against a side that is, you know, champions, how difficult is it to bounce back knowing that you are on the right path, but you're just not at that level? Does that make it harder to sort of keep going and do what you're doing? It's funny, isn't it? Because I think they are still at that level. I think now it's about getting the experiences into the players. You know, I mean, you look at the likes of Chelsea and the world-class internationals that they have

and those types of experiences. You know, you've got World Cups, you've got European Championships, you've got all the various championships that take place all over the world. And that level isn't quite the same. Do you know what I mean? In terms of at United, they've got like some brilliant internationals and some brilliant domestic players as well. But the breadth of the experience is something that probably differs the most,

in my opinion. And I think when you're kind of on a run like that and you're building momentum, like you're building that belief, it can be a bit of a shock. But at the same time, it comes down to what Mark Skinner touched on is that key decision-making, that mentality. And I think that's something where now that United have experienced that, it's going to propel them forward even more because now they know where they need to be. Yeah, because they were the architects of their own downfall, Robin, weren't they?

You know, Katie Zellum passing the ball to Sophie Ingle for the opener. And with the context of everything that we've just been talking about, do you think then that there is not a mental block for United against these bigger teams now? Or do you think that that's what translated on the on the pitch at the weekend I mean there might be it's not something that I would

I would know for sure but it does seem like they they still haven't had a really good statement win against one I think they had one against Arsenal under Casey Stoney when Arsenal was sort of on the on the slide a little bit under Joe Montemuro. But it's just these, yeah, these consistencies. And they just are really... So I did the Manchester United game against Everton and they were sensational. They're playing out from the back. They were so brave and it always paid off.

And it just seems like, you know, that's great against certain opposition. Maybe Chelsea, you need to change things up a little bit although again I wouldn't want them to to change too much because it's a really good watch I mean I think in terms of personnel you know Ona Baggio is big miss you know you've got Torres Dottier playing at left back she was great against Everton but it's different against Chelsea and Chelsea I mean they can rotate basically as much as they want and not really drop off. Or if they do, they just find a way to win, even if their

performance level does drop off. Actually, there was an interesting switch, KB, from Chelsea. Khadija Buchanan and Millie Bright switching round in defence. Did it give Buchanan a little bit more confidence and help her a little bit because we've seen her struggle a bit this season? Yeah, I mean, only she can really answer that, I think. But yeah, you're right. This league is different. It's difficult sometimes to come straight into because you're not really sure what to expect, not only from the opposition, but your own squad and the level of detail that you get. That's why I think we're starting to see players like become more gradually vetted in and exposed to the game but yeah I think I was more kind of focused on Chelsea going forward when I was watching this game and kind

of the holes that they exposed in Manchester United's midfield and backline particularly when United were in comfortable possession, they became really, really stretched when they're looking to play out, which is what most teams do. They're very expansive. However, they weren't necessarily in positions to kind of prevent defensive counterattacks, if you know what I mean. So they weren't quite close enough.

So where the ball was in transition, they were just exposed straight away, mostly down the middle of the pitch as well from the likes of Sophie Engel, the runs from Sam Kerr. from the likes of Sophie Engel, the runs from Sam Kerr, you know. So the really clever thing about what Sam Kerr does is takes up those positions on the back shoulder or just slightly away from the back four or whoever she's playing against, where she's always kind of in a position just to kind of get a bit of a head start if the ball does kind of turn over. And those types of things are probably things that maybe some of the United players aren't used to seeing on a regular basis. Some really good news from Chelsea manager Paul Green after the match that they're expecting Emma Hayes back on the touchline after the international break. She tweeted at the weekend, I'm so ready to go back to work, but what a team, staff, players and fans we have. So

proud. I can't do this home watching for much longer. Myra, it's going to be a big boost for Chelsea to have her back, but massive credit to Denise Reddy on the pitch and Paul Green off it for navigating this period and winning all six games. 100%. I think one thing that's well known about Chelsea is they have a great family feel about that club. And ultimately, you see that with the performances, with the success that's come. So even though Emma is not there, there is a hunger to make sure that Emma's proud while she's not there. And everyone has done what they need to do. And I think ultimately, Emma coming back will be amazing. And I think as, Emma coming back will be amazing. And I think as well, this game coming up at Stamford Bridge is a real interesting one.

There's loads of things that the players have incentives to keep pushing further for. And I guess it's a really interesting dynamic because when you're always winning and competing, sometimes having these sort of side missions gives you that momentum to keep pushing and keep going forward. So I think it's been handled so, so, so, so well. Ultimately, Arsenal are top of the table, yes, with a game in hand. But this is almost a replica of last season where those two teams seem to be running away with it. So credit's all involved. It's been a good start to the season. Yeah, 20th of November, that match against Tottenham Hotspur at Stamford Bridge.

Very much looking forward to that one. The result, though, up at Lee Sports Village leaves Arsenal as the last remaining unbeaten team. Top of the WSL, 18 goals scored, one conceded as they beat Leicester 4-0. Goals from Frieda Marnham,

Caitlin Ford, Steph Catley and Stina Blackstenius. Not necessarily all positive for Arsenal, despite me racking through their goal scorers there, Robin. Sue sent us in a question. With Hurtig and Nobbs being added to Arsenal's injury list, do they really have the depth they seem to have at the start to see this campaign through?

It's a good question. That's been their downfall a couple of times, hasn't it? The injuries and then they drop off. I've been really impressed actually with, you know, I thought with Williamson and Raffaele, you know, this first choice centre-back partnership missing and they've still managed to maintain a really good defensive record with two sort of makeshift centre-backs, although, no, not Lotte Wilburn-Moy, of course. I think she's been fantastic, actually. Catley is sort of, yeah, a sort of makeshift centre-half, but kind of an odd partnership between those two. Yeah, I mean, that's going to be the big question. We still don't really know how long it's going to take to get these injured players back.

And I know Susie Rack has brought this up. It's frustrating in women's football. We don't really get this information. So that's the thing we can't really comment on. Because if Leah Williamson and Raphaeli and Nobbs are not long term, then, you know, it'll be all right. Well, it looks like Kim Little could be even longer, almost three months, I think, potentially.

And Miedema, I mean, we're not sure how long she's going to be off recuperating. I mean, that's a lot of players, isn't it? It is scary, but's a lot of players, isn't it? It is scary, but in a weird way, when I look at how Arsenal start the season, I mean, it's WSL record now, 14 consecutive wins, 18 points, 18 goals. They've had injuries.

I think that the harder part of this is it's not just injuries. You're having injuries to your leaders in your team, which can be very, very detrimental. And I think this next period is going to be very key for Jonas to how he keeps his team together because they are still top of the table they had the situation last season where it was essentially one game that kind of cost them the title if we're being honest and it's about how can we hold out for long enough to make sure that we're still in contention? So it's at the top of the mountain.

That's the positive. At the top of the mountain, these players will come back eventually. But how do you keep it all together with your leaders not there? Who's going to step up to the plate? You mentioned Lotte, who's, for me, she's been amazing. It's a situation where, as a player, it's really unfortunate

because you don't want your teammates to be injured. But to get that moment where you're going to be called upon, you have to perform, especially for World Cup next year. It's an amazing opportunity. And I feel she's grasped it with both hands, but it's how they managed to stick together and really graft that results now.

Because so far this season, they've been clean sheets and free scoring. Now they might have to revert to the 1-0 or harder results now. And that's where it's going to be interesting. Can Beth Mead be enough firepower to keep going? Can Blasthenius keep going? that's where it's going to be interesting. Can Beth Mead be enough firepower to keep going? Can Blas Deneas keep going? That's where it gets really, really interesting. And I think they've got the camaraderie to do it.

I think they've got the camaraderie to keep going despite these injuries. If there was any team that I would bank on doing it, it would probably be them because of that feeling they've got. We'll talk about their match against Manchester United shortly, but Robin mentioned Viv Miedema there, KB, and given this time off, obviously missed the game, not going away with the Netherlands on the international break either.

What do you make of that as a former player? Well, I think firstly, you need to make sure the person's okay. You know what I mean? I think that's the priority here. It's always the priority. So I think address that first. And that's obviously something that we can't comment on. But from the outside to some of the earlier points around not having all the information,

there's a lot of question marks. And from the outside, when you start to see something like this, you do just kind of start to question, you know, is everything okay, kind of in their world. And then you start to think about, you know, what is actually affecting that. And football is a funny thing. Like it's not, it's not linear at all. You know, you never, you're riding the waves all the time. You know, when things are going great, it's really easy to kind of run away with that and when things are going bad it's it's really easy to kind of like just you know end up feeling as low as a snake's belly so it's difficult to kind of maintain you know kind of

that neutral approach the entire time but a lot of it I think will come from more internal pressures, you know, than necessarily external. She's an incredibly successful player, a very competitive player. So she's obviously going to want to be playing every single minute. There could be an element of obviously external pressure from, you know, the contract faff that kind of came along with everything else in terms of making sure that, you know, she wanted to stay at Arsenal. But I also think it's important to take into consideration, you know, what it is that Jonas actually wants the team to do and the specific roles in every single position. So he's

clearly expressed by the player selection and the way that he's asking his team to play, that he wants every single player to work both sides of the ball. So attacking players are going to have to press, they're going to have to work back defensively. And I think in years past, it has been something that's been exposed in terms of Miedema's approach to the game. So if he feels that she's not performing the role and someone else will, then at the end of the day, it's a results game and you have to make sure that you're getting those results. Yeah, absolutely. They need a result against Manchester United.

They face them at home after the international break. Maioa, we were talking there where Arsenal might need the odd 1-0 dirty win, if you like, and perhaps this is the game that they might need that. But United perhaps going into this match deflated from the Chelsea match or riled up to make sure that they do take that statement win. And of course, they did knock Arsenal out of the League Cup last year, so they're capable of it.

I think this is exactly it. Speaking to KB's point earlier, United have to be in a place where they have to eradicate any sense of fear against these big teams. If you want to be in contention, you have to take it to your opponent. And to put a blemish on Arsenal's unbeaten start would be a massive, massive moral boost for them, especially coming up with their massive game at Utrecht towards the end of the year as well. It's just all about building momentum. So they will be looking.

I mean, players, they see everything, right? They might even have more information about when players are coming back, but they'll be looking at that squad and thinking, we've got something for them. We've done it before. We can do it again. So 100%, especially after the Chelsea loss, you want to bounce back. You want to make sure that it's not two losses on the bounce, because then you're definitely out of contention.

I know we're probably touching City. City are the team where they're in form and creeping back to where they need to be. So a win against Arsenal is, it's very much the order of the day for United. They have to really go and try and do something. It'll be difficult, but what a result it would be for them. It's as if you knew what was coming up in part two, Maewa.

That's it for part one. In part two, we'll go through the rest of the WSL action, including Manchester City. Do you have business insurance? If not, how would you pay to recover from a cyber attack, fire damage, theft or a lawsuit? No business or profession is risk-free. Without insurance, your assets are at risk from major financial losses, data breaches, and natural disasters. Get customized coverage today starting at $19 per month at zensurance.com.

Be protected. Be Zen. welcome back to part two of the guardian women's football weekly uh before we speak about karen's new job a three nil win for manchester city at the weekend against reading robin gareth taylor's side perhaps relishing a little bit of time away from the spotlight maybe quietly just going about their business getting the points on the board yeah that's a really good relishing a little bit of time away from the spotlight, maybe, quietly just going about their business, getting the points on the board. Yeah, that's a really good way of putting it. Yeah, they've had a really good run after losing their first two games. And it just seemed like in this one, Lauren Hemp, I know KB, spirit animal, as we know, just went, right, come on then.

I'm going to take this game. I'm going to win this. And she absolutely rinsed down the left-hand side and took it upon herself to sort of, all right, let's stop messing around. We're going to win this game now. And she can do that, obviously. And yeah, she gave them a really, really hard time. And yeah, great to see Bunny Short again on the score sheet.

I mean, what a season she's having I mean we knew this you saw the numbers she came to the WSL with with club and country and she's just deadly isn't she in front of goal absolutely deadly she's frightening that's seven and six appearances though crazy Karen you announced this week you were staying on with Manchester City as projects officer. Tell us a little bit about what that role is going to entail. Essentially, I think I did my, for a bit of context, I did my degree in sports directorship in 2017 and finished in 2019. And over the course of that, I realised there was quite a lot of things that, you know, I was interested in learning as a player, you're kind of a bit removed from the business side of

football. And I wanted to understand why a lot of things happened the way they did. And I felt pretty curious about how that affects the football on the pitch, but then also how it can be better. So that kind of led me to have a few conversations with Gavin Macle over the course of some of my rehabs from my injuries. And we came up with this plan essentially that would help me develop in that career space for my eventual transition off pitch. And essentially, you know, it's going to be about looking into some research projects for Man City in terms of the women's football lens and seeing where we can get the competitive advantage from. So how can we be pioneering in that space? You know, it's talking about transitioning players and talent off the pitch into keeping them at the club and making sure that people know that obviously you don't just fall off the edge of a cliff after you retire from professional football so i think it's important to obviously make sure

that people see that but then also you know to help people understand what women's football is like give people who are making the decisions some context in terms of you know what they need to take into those considerations when making those decisions. But then also alongside it, it's going to be, you know, a really exciting learning journey in the various, I don't know, aspects of what it is that City have to offer. So within, obviously, City Football Group, there's multiple clubs and then there's multiple departments in those clubs. So getting a real understanding of what it takes to get a football team

on the pitch at the end of the week. Yeah, it's fascinating. I'm doing an MBA in football industries. And just looking at the business side of football is a completely different way to analysing what's going on the pitch to playing on the pitch, obviously, which I wouldn't know in the slightest. Mate, how are you doing that as well with a child and everything you do. What is wrong with you? There's so much wrong with me. So much wrong with me. I have parked it because of the World Cup very temporarily again.

It feels like it's like the longest, most drawn out NBA in the world. You must have a lot of extensions. Yeah, absolutely. Well, I tell you what, we wanted an extension to this game because it was an absolute cracker. West Ham-Brighton, the first ever 4-5 result Elizabeth Turland, Georgia Fox and Victoria Williams' own goal as well. And, Maiwa, this match had every single twist and turn in the book. It was a thrilling end as well.

But does Brighton's performance maybe suggest this team have a bit of a point to prove? And maybe they're playing with a little bit more freedom since Hope Powell has left. I think so. I think ultimately Hope has done so much for football and essentially it just felt like a lot of situations in football, the time was right,

where things had become a bit stale and if it doesn't happen now, when is it going to happen? And I mean, when you look at the way Brighton started, you think, okay, something's happening here. But it was almost like a manager bounce that nearly turned into a burst because they started off so well and then in the last few minutes of the game ah go in there let's concede a few goals and it's like whoa this is a lot going on but I think ultimately what was great about the performance was they looked like

they really won this pre-report as you mentioned they really went for it and always with the especially these teams in the league you need people that are going to put numbers on the board having Danielle Carter get her first two goals this season would have been massive because she now has the confidence to move forward and keep going you you need goal scorers in this league goals are everything and we saw it with West Ham if I say you're getting the dog out at the end to try and bring it back goal scorers are everything in this league so I was impressed with what I saw they definitely look some more confident, more passing patterns,

a bit more aggressive, but they will be hoping that they can do that without conceding the four goals that they did. It's all about balance at the end of the day. Yeah, it's all about balance, Robin, isn't it? And this West Ham team feel very hard to figure out in terms of balance because one week they're testing Arsenal

and the next they're 3-1 down at half-time to Brighton. I don't quite know what's going on there. You're asking the wrong person. I was just like, I was trying to kind of draw some conclusions from this. It's just impossible. I mean, for Brighton, how can you go from an 8-0 defeat to scoring five? I don't know how that works. I don't think, I'm not sure that is a managerial bounce it's just i mean that a lot of the goals in this game were really weird like lisa evans that was a cross you know and then obviously the goalkeeper had a bad touch and daniel carter capitalized on that and as i say i don't know what we can you know glean from all this to be honest west ham are a really good watch if you don't mind what the result is.

I will say that because they, yeah, they concede, they score. It's pretty exciting. Two good teams to watch as a neutral, perhaps. You'll get your money's worth. Yeah, yeah, exactly. A Rachel Daly penalty gave Aston Villa a 1-0 win over Liverpool,

their first win in four games, but Liverpool continuing their five-match losing streak. They obviously had that statement win on the opening day of the season, KB, but are you feeling a bit worried for Matt Beard and Liverpool now? Yeah, it's a bit concerning. They're going to have to pick up points,

but now it's getting to the point, isn't it, where you just have to be better than everyone around you. So I think this is highlighting some of the gaps. A lot of people have this perception that the WSL isn't going to be as difficult as it actually is. But I think most managers and most players, and now hopefully the wider audience, really can see the quality across this league. So if you really want to do something special you have to invest and look they've got some very experienced players but it doesn't seem like they have enough in the key positions at the minute as well but yeah listen they're gonna have to pick up points

somewhere um but perhaps maybe their goal for the first season is to stay in the league. And that's how they're going to view success. I think that's the key point, KB. They do have the experience. And when you can compare them to teams around them, like, for example, Redden, that may be what gives them that slight edge that they've got players that have seen a lot. In those game scenarios, they know what I can and can't do because there is a little bit more experience but there is a sort of mini-league already developing between those bottom three

Brighton may try and pull themselves away with that win but maybe bottom four teams in this mini-league to who avoids the trapdoor which is a bit worrying because you would have thought that they would try to keep momentum somewhere but yeah you have to get points

against those teams around you. So when those fixtures come up, Liverpool will need to show something. They just can't score, can they? That's the problem. They scored three goals. Two of them were penalties on the opening day. And didn't Leanne Kiernan win last night the Northwest football? Yeah, it was nice to see her get recognised for her contributions, but she's a big miss. A huge miss. It just seems like she's central really to everything. You know, she's really, she's so quick.

And she also added that finishing touch in the championship. So I think they're missing big players as well, like Van der Sanden. We still haven't seen her. So maybe in the second half of the season, when they get them back, it might be a little bit more positive for Liverpool. How much of a boost will she be for them because ultimately the injury record has been spoken about a lot but again so much experience is that the difference between Liverpool struggling and Liverpool potentially going

a few runs where you have this player that has the ability to find the net but the availability you just don't know. It's a big risk. You know, when you start squad building, you know, I think that's something that Arsenal and Chelsea have obviously shown that they do really, really well. We're having conversations about the depth of squad and rotation and how, you know, obviously Jonas and Emma have been phenomenal in terms of getting them to understand the expectation. They might have limited playing time, but they will have the opportunity when, you know, they just need to understand the expectation they might have limited playing

time but they will have the opportunity when you know and they just need to take it when they get it now i think in terms of liverpool and you know the teams that are kind of struggling at the bottom of the table like how are people actually approaching bringing in talent is there kind of a strategy what does this look like in the longer term you know are there kind of pathways coming up through the academies and stuff and yeah they are probably in the works but I think it just highlights the understanding that the talent pool is incredibly small in women's football and it's hard to get um you know top quality players to compete with the top four and then you also lose as Brighton have done over the summer those kind of players that you do enhance and develop you lose them to the so-called bigger

bigger clubs which is where there's you know this will obviously change as women's football progresses as more investment comes in as younger players come up and and improve and there is a bigger talent pool as you say Karen to choose from right that rounds up the football from the WSL this weekend but we were also down quite a couple of games because of some really heavy rain. It's been disgusting out there. Tottenham Everton called off in the WSL. Lewis versus Bristol City

and Crystal Palace versus Sheffield United also washed up in the Women's Championship. Some really strong words from Everton players over the WSL postponement, in particular, Robin.

Megan Finnegan tweeting professional league, Pinocchio emoji, angry emoji. really strong words from Everton players over the WSL postponement in particular Robin um Megan Finnegan tweeting professional league Pinocchio emoji angry emoji whilst Izzy Christensen said we want women's football to be elite visible with fan bases growing by the week etc etc postponing games so late does not bode well for the above very disappointed about today apologies to our traveling fans hope you get home safely how big of an issue do you think these kind of postponements are for the division in terms of you know like growing a fan base and stuff it's bad isn't it you know because everyone everyone's kind of when you when you decide to go to the football you've got your routine planned haven't you and and

and you want to go I mean it's tricky because on the Saturday it seemed all right and then the Sunday it's not it's not great because obviously and I'm sure Karen you've probably traveled you stayed overnight too many and it must be the most annoying thing ever as a player like okay we've done all this and we're gonna have to do it again at some point probably midweek and it must be just so irritating so but I know some people are saying you know they should they should be playing on better pitches and stuff like that I mean it's Leighton Orient isn't it it should be you know that's a league two team it should be all right I think the whole purpose of moving to to Leighton

Orient was kind of to improve the consistent playing condition so I felt oh that's quite ironic isn't it you know like yeah that's unfortunate but yeah in terms of postponement waterlogged pitches it's a real pain in the butt you know especially with the fixture congestion coming in a lot of stages of obviously the season as well so there's there might be these moments you know when it comes down to like a big fixture like say randomly Arsenal Chelsea gets postponed and now you know Arsenal have obviously got these injuries and then does that change you know the momentum of of the game the momentum of the season when these fixtures were meant to be played and so you could like unpick it till the cows come home but

oh we've spent the last two years doing that haven't we with Covid postponements and and and the such like I understand the frustrations. What I am sort of happy about for all of this is, especially within women's football, the fact that the players are voicing their opinions on things, especially like this, because ultimately we can't escape it, right? We had an amazing summer. It was an amazing showcase of football in this country.

And I think every single player that plays within these leagues knows that we have a standard that we have to keep to. And they are professional competitors. They want to be competing. So to not be able to do what they want to do after working so hard is frustrating. And you hope that by them voicing their opinions, that it puts pressure to make sure that these things are kind of looked into a bit more intentfully and make sure that this doesn't continue to happen because as you mentioned kb it must be the most frustrating thing you know you're traveling you know you're leaving your family you're prepped and everything's go and then so close to kickoff we're not going to

do it today it must especially for the fans as well it is an annoyance so hopefully we can figure something out because we don't want to see best moments yeah i mean there were times i think we it must especially for the fans as well it is an annoyance so hopefully we can figure something out because we don't want to see best moments yeah i mean there were times i think we had like sunderland away and it was snowing and we're like we know it's gonna be postponed just do it now and then they waited and waited and waited and waited as long as they could and they're like yeah sorry we're just like oh okay yeah it is it is really annoying it's so difficult though isn't it you know everybody would prefer the timing to be absolutely spot on and people not to be making journeys but at the same time if you're desperate to get a game on and actually see it played there will be some people complaining

about the fact that well you didn't try hard enough to get the game on so kind of damned if you do damned if you don't in uh in some ways and it's a really difficult call to make and one that i'm very grateful i don't have to make because I can imagine that, you know, you just get it in the ear from whichever way. But there were some games that did go ahead in the championship. There was a 3-0 win for Southampton over Coventry midweek on Wednesday.

Then at the weekend, a 2-1 victory for Charlton over Durham. Blackburn 1-0 winners over Sunderland and a 3-2 win for the London City Lionesses over Birmingham. There were also some issues lower down the leagues. It was suggested Luton Town ladies game was called off partially due to the weather. And partially due to a training session being held on the pitch for the men's team the following day. Which actually didn't happen in the end because the pitch wasn't playable. Luton have said they're currently running an investigation into it. The team's independently run from the men's club,

but uses their naming license, which is important to note as well. It's also important to note that this is my team, this is my club. So this is something I'm very, very passionate about. And I also know that my club really support women's football and they want the Luton Town ladies to play on the Kenilworth Road pitch as much as possible. The plan had been two games before Christmas and two games after Christmas. They've played one game already. The second game, which 800 fans turned up to play, you know, wasn't able to go ahead. There is an investigation ongoing. There are some things that I can't really say, but needless to say, I have spoken at length with the club about it.

And basically, if anybody played on the pitch, stood on the pitch, was on the pitch, it was going to damage it because there was such a huge deluge just before the kickoff against Colney Heath was due. And that's the issue is the timing of it. It was literally a few minutes before kickoff when the ground staff decided that, you know,

it would be a huge damage to the pitch going forward if they were going to play on it. Massively disappointing for everybody involved. The frustration, Maiwa, around this kind of, in a way, if we're going to kind of zoom out and look at it as an overall in women's football, that there's a bit of a distrust perhaps in the way women's football is prioritised throughout the pyramid. And that is going to take a little bit of time to rebuild.

A thousand percent. I think even out of the pyramid, if you just look at football within, you know, many people's lived experiences, whether that's grassroots, there has always been this it's not feeling because it's the truth where boys football and then men's football seems to be prioritized which is not right why is that why is there pitch access for for young boys and not young girls why do young girls have to use football pitches at unsociable hours and then when you then see it at the top level or further up the pyramid it does give you this feeling of well that's not right of course we don't know what exactly the situation was in this case but it is going to take a long time to to get around that sort of feeling that is there

and i know that there has been work done so of course um junior euros post euros are lots of brands lots of clubs loads of local institutions run initiatives sort of provide access for pitches to make sure that women and girls could play but it's going to take a long time you have to remember that you're speaking to people's lived experiences people have lived with looking at football and feeling that i don't have the same access to a men's counterpart so when it manifests like this, there is going to be that feeling intrinsically that is this happening again, really?

And people become numb to it, don't they? So I know so many young women's professionals that all of their stories will tell you that, oh, we had to move because there was a men's train, et cetera. It's just something that's happened for so long that even when it's not happening, you think it is. So hopefully once the investigation is done, this isn't the case.

And ultimately you can just hope and pray that, you know, the authorities, football clubs, local county FAs are doing more to make sure that there is provision for young girls, for women, and that there's not a parity between boys and girls or men or women at any level. Yeah, and that's an important point. And Luton Town have put out a couple of different statements,

including the one where the ground staff confirmed that a championship game wouldn't have been able to take place right then and there. They'd have had to delay it to let the pitch drain and all sorts and the rain continued as well so it's a really difficult situation and I and I feel for all the players who weren't able to play because I know they were excited about playing on on a championship pitch as they as they should be but you know it's uh something that women's football has had to

contend with for such a long time and unfortunately will do in the future as well but all we can do is is highlight any potential issues and and make sure it doesn't everyone off on an international break now as england head to spain to face japan and norway in two friendlies quite a few late dropouts from the squad though frank kirby lauren hemp and jordan knobs all staying at home but that does mean call-ups for jess park and gabby George. Karen, what do you think Serena Wiegman's going to be looking to see from the Lionesses over this break? Yeah, I think it's obviously going to be, you know, continued fitness, continued form.

She's probably going to be working on the next iteration of Serena Wiegman dominance, you know, for the World Cup. Yeah, you know, and it's disappointing to obviously see Lauren Hemp and Jordan Nobbs pull out. I am slightly concerned for the world cup yeah you know and it's disappointing to obviously see lauren hemp and jordan knobs pull out i am slightly concerned for the both of them my spirit animal is uh is not normally injured i don't like to see that but you know it's it's important to obviously protect both of them um both domestically and on the international stage in preparation for what's next but particularly concerning is just the spate of injuries that Jordan Nobbs has experienced over the last few years.

And I feel like this girl just can't get a break and she deserves to be seen. You know, she's such a good player. She's such a good girl as well. You know, like it's just, it's just really, I'm frustrated for her. So Jordan, if you're listening, big love. But yeah, you know, in terms of bringing in the likes of Jess Park, Fran Kirby and Gabby George and Maya Leticia, I think it's just really important these young players get a look in.

You know, if we continue to see what we've seen in the summer, this is going to have to be a continual pathway of talent, you know, and exposing these girls to the international stage, trying to continue to create like a really cohesive group in this level, you know, in terms of personalities, in terms of understanding the skill sets, the strengths, the weaknesses, those types of things. It's really, really important to kind of set that level of expectation pretty

early. So when you come into the England environment, you know exactly what to expect. So I'm looking forward to it, you know, like fair play to Gabby George and Maya Letizia in particular. She's been outstanding. So I hope she enjoys it. Yeah, Robin, those call-ups for Park and for George, potential debuts in line for Maya Letizia, as KB says there, and Katie Robinson as well. I'm so excited that Serena Wiegmann is willing to give younger players a chance and has an opportunity going into the World Cup as well. Absolutely, yeah. And, you know, we've got to keep evolving. They've got to, especially because, you know, I know not necessarily in the same

positions, but we've lost Ellen White Ellen White, lost Jill Scott's retirement. And also, you know, you never know, you might lose certain players to injury. So they need this exposure. And who better than Serena Feigman? Honestly, she's she's my spirit animal. And I always just love her to take me under her wing and just I don't even know, just mentor me in life. I love her. But yeah, as I say,

this is going to be really exciting to see. Hopefully they will get a few minutes. Even if they don't, it's just being in that environment, isn't it? I think being in that

environment is massive. There's been a real family feel and camp built when they go to St. George's, the way they all interact with each other. So to be amongst that,

to be amongst players from other teams and know that you're within it, especially leading into such a massive tournament, is a massive, massive thumbs up to the work these players are doing. So great to be amongst it. Hopefully they do get some minutes. And even if they don't, it's an amazing experience. But on the flip side of that, much as I'm excited for the youngsters, Maya, we have to look at the older, more experienced players, perhaps, that we mentioned last week on the pod as in great form. I'm talking Ashley Neville here and still not selected. Is that a surprise to you? Because ultimately, the conversation is always, if you're performing at a level,

then you deserve to be in with a shot. And that's what, you know, Ash has been doing for quite a while now, probably over-exceeding any expectations on her. I guess with where Serena's at, maybe it's the profile of players she's looking at. It's very difficult to know without, you know, being in these rooms.

But if you're being overlooked there must be a justification Serena's always had a justification that makes sense that's one thing I can definitely say about Serena anytime she's made a decision the decisions made perfect sense so I don't think it's an indictment on Neville or her performances I just think it's something that Serena's looked at and thought that's great and it's amazing but this is what I'm looking at right now and ultimately maybe a conversation has even been had there I would think Serena's probably had a conversation said listen it's nothing personal this is what it is so it is a tough one to take though especially when you're playing out of your skin you're performing everyone's looking at you like wow we didn't

expect this and then to not get a call up it's's hard. It is a tough one, but I'm sure there's justified reason to it. Yeah, I'm looking forward to these two games. That's everything from us this week. Maiwa, how much did you enjoy your debut? I've loved it. I've kind of been like, you know, some of the recruits that are going to the England camp. It's like, oh, do I get a few minutes soon?

You know, I've been in and amongst it. So it's been great. Thank you for having me on. You'll do your initiation song later. Exactly. Oh, what would you pick? That's on the spot. I'm Every Woman, maybe.

Oh, no. Brilliant. KB, I mean, I kind of skirted over the fact it was also your debut, technically, but I've worked with you so many times, it didn't feel like it was your debut. He's just catching up with old friends, isn't he? Exactly. And new friends. And new friends.

Good luck for the new role as well. Thank you. I look forward to checking in with you and seeing how things are going. Thank you. Robin Cowan, I shall see you in Qatar. You will, fleetingly. But yes, you will. Right, that's everything from us.

We're off next week, but we will be back after the international break with all the latest news from the world of women's football. So join us then. The Guardian Women's Football Weekly is produced by Lucy Oliver and Jessie Parker-Humphrey. Its music composition was by Laura Iredale. Our executive producer is Sal Ahmed. This is The Guardian.

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