The Guardian's Women's Football Weekly - Six WSL titles in a row for Chelsea and London City go up – Women’s Football Weekly

Episode Date: May 6, 2025

Faye Carruthers is joined by Suzy Wrack, Emily Keogh and Jamie Spangher to reflect on Chelsea’s WSL triumph, a dramatic final day in the Championship

This is The Guardian. Hello, I'm Faker Rothers and welcome to The Guardian Women's Football Weekly. It's felt like an inevitability for a while, but Chelsea are champions. Can Sonia Bonpastor's side finish the season as invincibles though? London City Lionesses will be playing in the Barclays WSL next season after a thrilling end to the championship. We'll focus on all the games from the weekend, discuss the big talking points from the week, plus we'll take your questions.

And that's today's Guardian Women's Football Weekly! Guess who's back? Back again! Suzy's back! Tell your friends! Oh I've missed you Suzy Rack! I've not missed the singing! Oh no sorry about that! I couldn't help it I thought you needed an entrance theme tune. How are you? Yeah, I'm good. I'm still here. We're about to find out whether all my podcasting ability was stored in my gallbladder, basically, is the way I look at it. RIP, gallbladder. Emily Kehoe, how are you doing? I'm good, thank you. How are you?

Very well, thanks. It's been a while. I'm assuming you've had a very busy week. Yes. It's that point of the season where just nothing slows down, nothing calms down. And then you kind of look at the next calendar, it's like, well, it's not going to calm down in time soon. So just get on with it. Yeah. Yeah. This is crash time, isn't it? For sure, Jamie Spanger. It definitely is. I feel like the run-in is coming isn't it? WSL but then you got the Euros so no time, no rest for the wicked is their fave. No, that's always a pleasure, always a pleasure and it has been such a busy week so there's lots to get through.

But I feel like I need to take everybody back in time. We love a little bit of chronology here on the Guardian Women's Football Weekly. So we're going back to Wednesday night here on the Guardian Women's Football Weekly. So we're going back to Wednesday night and the big news that Chelsea had won the Barclays WSL for the sixth time in a row and I have to say Manchester United must be so fed up with watching Chelsea win the trophy. That narrow victory in Lee marked the third time that they've secured the title against Mark Skinner's side. I mean there's rubbing it in and there's, I don't know what the next stage up of rubbing it in is to be honest. It finished Manchester United nil, Chelsea won thanks to a 74th minute winner from Lucy Bronze in front of their travelling fans. Feels like a while ago but they had been helped by

Arsenal earlier in the day, sorry Suzy, only needed a result to become champions but you know once again found a way to get over the line as they do. An incredible feat actually for Sonja Bonpas and her team Susie, the domestic treble and unbeaten season is still alive as well. Yeah and I think, I mean what will be disappointing for them is the lack of European football you know, obviously having gone out because that's what they want right. What is weird is that they could go unbeaten and have a domestic treble and they will finish the season disappointed and that's like the standard that they've set free for themselves, you know, it's that high, the demands are that high, the Champions League is such a white elephant that nothing, no matter how sweet is like quite good enough if they don't get there so like

that's testament to what they've built, what MHA's built prior to Sonia but yeah like an incredible feat if they go the season unbeaten and what's been impressive and has perhaps been a downfall in Europe is that they've not always played the nicest football whilst winning. They've managed to score goals and win despite, yes, at times sort of slightly scrappy performances, which is the testament to what they've built and like a mark of champions to be cliched. But that's, I think, where they've come unstuck in Europe and that will be the frustration that they'll be looking to work on next season.

But yeah, I mean, who would have thought at the start of the season? I mean, actually, a lot of people probably thought because it's Chelsea. I actually think we got our predictions right this season for the first time ever. We probably did. But in terms of a new manager coming in to compare, you know, M. Hayes to Alex Ferguson, say, poster manager of that influence and longevity of a club. For someone to come in and then not to really be any kind of rupture to the momentum that they have domestically is like just so impressive. I just, I think we almost gloss over that a little bit too much because it's been so easy because

they are unbeaten in that sense. Yeah, and actually, Ceezy makes a good point there, Jamie, because the victory came off the back of that 8-2 drubbing by Barcelona in the Champions League. And it is a cliché, but champions do manage to find a way. Does the context of that, rather than them collapsing and thinking, well, we've done the domestic before, so we're not bothered about that, we wanted the Champions League, does it actually make a win over Manchester United more impressive, or is this the kind of team that should be doing that anyway? It's a hard one to balance, isn't it, Faye, because I agree and I echo exactly what Suzie said there. It's a team that, at the end of the day, they brought Sonja Bonpas-Storin as Emma Hayes' successor to win the

Champions League. This is someone that's done it before. We need to, you know, we've dominated the domestic front. Okay, now we need to win the Champions League. Let's bring in a proven winner. So it's hard. And I think it goes to the culture that Chelsea fans, the players in the club have built. They're disappointed in the fact that they might go invincible in the league and they might go and win the domestic treble. So it felt like it was kind of celebrating that trophy at Lee. It didn't think that the players in the club were as excited as they would be had it happened. Maybe it spurs on the weekend because they're still coming off the back of a really bad semi-final performance. But I think it goes to show like we spoke about this ages ago, I think in terms of Chelsea's really narrow like results. They've been winning goals later. They've been winning games, sorry, late on. They've been

scoring late goals. It's been one, two-nil margins against teams in the lower half of the table. You get to a team like Barcelona, they punish you. They don't hold you to the same standard as say like an Aston Villa or a Tottenham do. There was a one-nil result against Spurs on the weekend. It came from a penalty. So I think it's a shock, right? It kind of shows the Gulf. And I'm not saying that Arsenal and Chelsea aren't up to this scratch, but it's very obvious that Barcelona have come and they've shown them a new raise of quality. And I think this question to be asked in that is the WSO challenging Chelsea enough to kind of compete on the Champions League stage?

Are they getting complacent because they're kind of getting these results, they're dragging them over the line in the league, and then they're coming to the Champions League and it's a different ballpark for them, it's a different ballpark for everyone. So yeah, I don't think they were too excited as they would be over that WSL lift because it felt like it was coming, it was in the mail and then they're kind of recovering from a really hard loss in Europe. Yeah, it's a really good point actually, are they challenged enough? I hadn't thought about it in that way.

What did you make of the game itself, Emily? I mean, the Manchester United fans looked pretty disappointed afterwards to not come away with all three points. Yeah, I think it was a really interesting game. It was a really interesting evening because by the time a lot of us got to Lee Sports Village, we all were watching the Arsenal-Arsenville game. So everyone kind of knew what was happening going into the game although suddenly said the players didn't talk about it so they didn't know unless they whether whether they knew and they didn't say anything they weren't talking about whether they'd be going to win the league that night which i think is quite interesting to where their mentality is as well that it wasn't a discussion that hey if we win tonight we're

going to win the league that wasn't in the dressing room it was just we want to win the game because we want to win the game which i I think was quite an interesting thing to talk about after the game. But yeah, it was, I do feel for Manchester United at times because I think they've had some really strong performances and they were pretty much on top for a lot of that game and their lack of clinical finishing really let them down, but they had some really good chances and there was a couple of consecutive three time saves from Naomi Germer and Hannah Hampton that were really, really impressive.

But it is just that different between a team that can just pull something out of thin air and just get the goal they need and a team that almost trying too hard to get that goal that they can't get it. And I do think kind of off the back of Jamie's point as well that part of Chelsea's run in the driver's cell that's been so impressive has also been because other teams haven't been up

to the mark. That you know would they be 12 points clear, would they be unbeaten if other teams hadn't been dropping needless points in games where they should have been winning them. And I think that's also kind of speaks a little bit to the Gulf that Chelsea have figured out how to make sure they're winning these games in the league but other teams like Arsenal City United who are dropping points in games that you'd kind of expect them not to be dropping points in like we've seen with Arsenal the past two WSL games it's sort of where kind of Chelsea have figured things out and other clubs haven't and I think that's probably also why potentially then there's that Gulf with other teams in Europe that there's still a question mark over certain things in the league and how you pull out

results against teams that are very difficult to break down and it's not going to be as easy week in week out anymore, we know that. But for some reason, Chelsea have figured out a formula to make sure they're getting results where other teams haven't and I do think they've been helped by other teams potentially not performing as well as they should be when they're challenging for a title as well. Yeah, it's a good point. You know, two games to go, by the way, is the earliest time in WSL history that teams won the title. And we have talked previously about how, you know, certain teams have walked to the title. But actually, that just shows that it's not the case two games to go when you think, you know, if you look at the Premier League as an example, you know,

Liverpool have it wrapped up already and there's four games to go, possibly they did it with five, I can't remember the maths actually. You know, they have won it in the last six years which does, you know, go to the point that Jamie made that perhaps it's not been as competitive a Barclays WSL as we've maybe seen in the past. They then went on to Tottenham, Jamie mentioned that, Caterina Macario with that first half penalty. It was a heavily rotated team as well but how are Spurs going to look at the result, Susie? I mean it progress, I suppose. The last time they met in the league, Chelsea were 5-2 winners. So a 1-0 defeat is a step forward, I suppose. But what did you make of the game at the weekend?

Yeah, I mean, like Chelsea were so heavily rotated, nine changes for the game, that they were quite disjointed in that respect. You know, me official starting up top, Captain Macario just behind her, those kind of things. Players that, you know, we've not seen get starts for quite some time, in me official starting up top Capricario just behind her those kind of things players that you know We've not seen get stops for quite some time in the official especially so yeah, it was a very different looking Chelsea But spurs looked decent and they had chances and they could have scored You just sort of wish that anyone but Charlie Grant had sort of been through one-on-one at that moment when they could have Definitely scored and probably should have scored you. Not that she's not a great player, but they have gone more

instinctive forwards that would have, I think, made a little bit of a better decision in how they took that shot in that moment. So they had opportunities. I was chatting to some of my friends who were Spurs fans afterwards and were at the game. I met them up with them outside afterwards and they were very much not overly disappointed, like pleased that it was a narrow margin, felt that they could have nicked something from the game. But then, like we've said, it's sort of the Mark of Chelsea that they don't allow teams to do that. They always find a way through. So yeah, interesting game from them, but like a disappointing season overall so nothing really kind of matters too much for them at this stage I think. Like yeah, narrow defeat meh.

You have Spurs fans as friends, how very 2025 of you. Listen, I'm going to make you talk about Arsenal in a second, I'm sorry. It's hard to call it a chastening week for Arsenal. In the league, yes, 100%, but obviously they're still on this massive high from reaching the Champions League final. And actually they have secured Champions League football for next season via the league, but that fight for second place is going to go down to the last day of the season because they've had heavy back-to-back defeats in the week. So Wednesday they travelled to Villa Park losing 5-2 to Aston Villa who have had a shocker of a season. They then paid bright on a visit on Monday afternoon and shipped four more goals in a 4-2 defeat to Dario Vidovich's

side. It's been quite the week, Susie. Similar mistakes as well in both games. Where did it all go wrong? Where did it go right? I don't know. I don't really know where it's gone so wrong. I think there must be a big mental aspect there because the collapse across these two games and the amount of goals conceded is just so unlike unlike Arsenal under René Sleggers that it's really hard to pinpoint. I mean it perhaps feels a bit harsh but to pick out Zinsberger but I think given the record with and without her and Gal versus Daphne van Domselart there's a huge, huge difference in the stats and you can't blame her for every goal, but if there's a lack of confidence in her ability from the players in front, they do look a

different side when they've got Vandomsala sat behind them. I think there is more confidence in the group there. But then I don't think you can put that entirely at one player's door, group there. But then I don't think you can put that entirely at one player's door, that level of collapse, obviously against Brighton as well. They probably should have been four goals up before they started conceding. So it's a really, really weird one. Are they holding back from challenges because no one wants to miss out on a Champions League final for injury? Are they minds elsewhere? Mentally switch off from the league now Champions League is secured but that's like a high risk strategy when you could lose out on seconds and you know have to go for an extra round of qualifying. It just it doesn't

add up but if I was Barcelona I'd be feeling very very happy right now. Yes, well, yes. Nine goals in 180 minutes of football, which is actually, I mean, this stat is really damning. 40% of their total goals conceded in the league all season, which is quite incredible. So actually, I do think, Jamie, regardless of the reasons why, I think Renée Slaygers has a right to be concerned about the defensive performances. Certainly. I think there's a vulnerability in that archery defense that we've actually seen for a little while now. We saw it in the first home leg to Lyon and then Joe Montemurro almost over corrected it in the second leg and picked the wrong lineup because you can

see how much Arsenal struggle in transition. Like Lee Williamson and Steph Catley, they're playing well as distributive centre backs, but they're not quick enough when the ball goes the other way. And I think that when you put that against Asson Villa, all of those goals were scored in high transition. They were counter attacks, right? I'm not going to say that Natalia Arroyo like coached in masterclass. It just felt like it was a heavily rotated side. Arsenal, that kind of result was in the mail. Not that it's a great result. They should never be losing that game. However, like that happens when you rotate. But then you look at Chelsea, they rotate against Spurs.

They've got Gura right and playing at left back and they still get results. So there's a difference in those two teams, how much they can rotate, but there's a vulnerability in this Arsenal defense. And I think that we can kind of nitpick Arsenal and say they perform really badly across these two games. But you also need to praise,

especially the Brighton performance, because I actually think Dario Vidicic really coached a victory in this game because he plays Kigoseki and Nikita Parac so centrally, and he doesn't allow Arsenal's fullbacks to dominate that defensive area because he knows that the centre backs are where the vulnerability is. And I think exactly what Suzy said, whether it's the players are more comfortable with Daphna van Domslaer or whether she just corrects their mistakes a little bit more. I think she plays a lot higher. So she picks up the ball a lot more. She like really guides the possession, whereas Manu Zinsberger, she sits back a lot more. So I think that makes it glaringly obvious that there's an issue with these two Arsenal centre halves. And it's been corrected for the last six months with this Steph Gatley makeshift centre back.

She's been good, but in high transition games, she's not good enough. So there's a vulnerability there. And you look at a team like Barcelona, their midfield is so, so strong. They can play through the forward lines as well. So yeah, if I'm Renee Sligars, I'm a bit concerned about that back four and not really the back four, but the back two, because I think the full backs, they're quite good at coming in. But I think Daria Ovidisich and Brighton, they played on that vulnerability and they executed it really well. Yeah, it's really important to give credit to both oppos, Vita, Sich and Brighton they played on that vulnerability and they executed it really well. Yeah it's really important to give credit to both oppositions actually Emily and Aston Villa were having great fun out there. It feels like the

Aston Villa of last season that we've not really had the opportunity to see didn't it and Natalia Arroyo did get her game plan spot on. Yeah I think it's really nice when you kind of see things start falling into place because Villa at one point were facing relegation and it was really difficult watching them because you have so much quality in that side and it was almost kind of like where is it going so wrong for Villa this season because obviously they've had quite a lot of off-pitch sort of turbulence to navigate and then you look at the quality in the side and you're just thinking like, why is it not working?

You've got someone like Rachel Daly, but she's playing so deep. She can't get on the ball high enough up the pitch. Like it just wasn't working for them. And it's nice when obviously like, Aurelia was brought in with the knowledge that they could be relegated. And I think it was good that she was given some time

to really work with the side. And obviously Villa wanted to play a brand of football. They didn't want to just kind of play to get the points. They wanted to to play their style and I think it does take time to kind of get players on page and I think that's probably what we've seen with that first run of games without them getting points and now when it starts to work for the players, they're aware of it, they understand it, they get the system, they're reaping all the benefits from that and I I think it is really nice to see, call me a romantic whatever, I love it when things start to work and I think for them especially knowing

that they were safe from relegation, the fact that then they've not dropped down their standards is really positive that they're going to have something to play for next season. You old romantic, wanting football players to play good football. For Brighton there were actually several standout performances weren't there Suzy? Sophie Bagley had to come into the lineup late on when Melina Loeck picked up an injury. Ten important saves from her actually. It was more of a statement performance I felt from Brighton who flattered, you know, we really thought that they'd do something special this season. But for Sophie Bagley particularly, a player we've not really seen much of this season.

Yeah, she was phenomenal. And when you look at the stats of like how Arsenal dominated that game in terms of possession, 76, more than 76%, 25 shots, 12 on target, 63 touches inside the box, 25 shots, 12 on target, 63 touches inside the box. The fact that she was able to hold them at bay, obviously not unassisted, was hugely impressive. Some really, really impressive saves. She's been a highly rated goalkeeper for some time, but has had a little bit of bad luck with injuries, with personnel ahead of her, not necessarily picking the right clubs to move to. She just needs a good run of starts in

a team and then I think we'll start to see her quality shine through again. And that was a great example of it. Fantastic performance from front to back. You can't take away from that apart from this anomaly that is Arsenal at the moment as well being just really, really bad. Arsenal have now got to go and get a result against Manchester United on Sunday at the Emirates and then of course the Champions League final against Barcelona. Right that's it for part one, in part two we'll look at the rest of the Barclays WSL action and we'll discuss that dramatic conclusion to the Barclays Championship. Welcome back to part two of the Guardian Women's Football Weekly. Right, we're starting at Old Trafford with the final Manchester Derby of the season. And Manchester City knew that

only victory would do if they were to play European football next season. But it finished. Manchester United 2, Manchester City 2. after United's Grace Clinton and Melvin Mallard cancelled out goals from Lyre Alexandre and Rebecca Kinnock. The Reds reduced to 10 for the final 20 minutes as well when Ife Eamanyan saw a second yellow card. It was actually a game Jamie that lived up to its history and hype. What can we take from this one? Yeah, certainly it was definitely a good old-fashioned Manchester derby. I feel like we haven't seen one as strong as that for a couple of seasons now. So it was good to see the contest.

Obviously, the rivalry is there. It's at Old Trafford. I had a couple of friends that were there and said it was the best they've heard. Old Trafford had a women's game, so it's good to see, you know, that's actually coming. They're bringing the stakes to the game. The fans are showing up, but I think the action lived up to it. Obviously some red cards from sending off. There's a for Manian gets a double yellow, but I think for this game, like Man City had to do everything that they could. And they've obviously been bolstered with Lauren Hemph and Alex Greenwood returning last week. There's, there's hope in, in who they've got in their playing group, but

I don't think that they looked like the team that we're going to put them away even at times where they were playing the better football. And I think that goes to show what Manchester United have done this season. I'm really happy for them. I'm really glad that they've secured that top three spot. I think they deserve it. I think there's so much to say about Man City's squad and where it's gone wrong this season because there's so many talking points in terms of head coach, in terms of the playing group not being at an injury crisis. What we can diagnose is the issue there. There's so many points but yeah it brought everything. And I think it was highly transitional.

I thought City really were gonna get the job done, but Manchester United have found a way. And I don't think that's something we've seen a lot of them in the last 12 months, 18 months. We haven't seen this side that really have character and grit. I think when things aren't going their way, they struggled to get back at it. And that's something new we've seen in Manchester United

since the turn of the year. So I'm glad they got it back and I think it was a great end to a really strong derby. Yeah, it was. But for Manchester City, Emily, missing out on Europe is a massive blow. They're going to be really disappointed with it. How much of an impact might that have on recruitment over the summer, do you think? I think a lot. I think this is probably one of the summers that for a lot of clubs we're going to see a lot of clubs need quite a few players. So I think it's going to be one of these big windows where there's a lot of movement. And I think City really would have been at the

heart of that. I think they still will be, but I just don't think they're going to be able to attract the calibre of player that they maybe want to know and they haven't got Champions League football. You look at the likes of Carolyn, who signed last window last window last January sorry would she have moved knowing that they wouldn't have Champions League again? Probably not. I think it's one of those that it does make a massive impact and we only really see that in the following season once kind of everything settled those players are embedded how effective will it be? I do think it's really it is a really disappointing season for City and I think it's been one of those that like, nothing has gone right

for them really when you look at kind of off-pitch injuries, everything like nothing's gone right. I think you look at it in terms of depth, you take four key players out of any side, obviously they're going to struggle. But again, then you look at someone like Chelsea, they've had multiple injuries, you just don't notice it because their depth is so deep. And probably knowing that they are serial winners has helped them develop that depth. So it's almost like you're consistently playing catch up because the history is not on your side and then you're not getting the results you need

and so you can't develop that depth and it goes in a cycle. So I do think it's probably gonna hurt them. The good thing is that that core group of players that they signed on longer term deals last season and the season before still have another year and two left. So they're not going to have a mass exodus this summer, which would have been the worst thing for them right now. So I think it's just about rebuilding for next season and trying to get some consistency and try and kind of those cover those depths so that if

you end up with a few injuries, how do you cover that? How do you prevent more players from getting injured? And, you know, it's something that may not be such an easy fix, but it's almost like the only option you've got really when you're looking at what's gone wrong and getting a manager in that's going to lead them and stick with them through to the long haul. So it's going to be interesting for them and I think they'll look back on this season as probably one of the worst that they've probably had. Yeah, United though, one of the best and this is why I'm a little bit torn on this one, Susie, because you know if you end up having a brilliant season despite what's going on off the pitch, all that does to me is then allow those running the club to not invest

and support the women's team because they're thriving despite what's going on off the pitch. But they have secured a spot in next season's Champions League. They know that a win on the final day against Arsenal would secure them second place, which, you know, has to be a really impressive finish bearing in mind what's gone on, Susie. Yeah, I think Champions League is critical for that argument that they've got to have internally now for resources, right? Like, yes, they're in another FA Cup final, they've got Champions League secured, but they have to have investment if they're going to compete in four competitions next season and not just crash out of qualifying again.

Like, they have to have that. If the club don't give them the right investment. They've backmarked Skinner, they've given him a new contract, they've got to back him in the transfer window and give him a calibre of players that is going to elevate the quality of the playing squad overall. It cannot just be that they have a starting 11 that they rely on to the extent that, you know, Elatun has to have personal tragedy and an injury combined for her to be able to have a rest away from the game for a little bit. Like, they've got to be able to rest players and rotate players based on choice. And, you know, whilst I think, you know, some of the fans probably be quite critical of Skinner's lack of rotation

generally, like I also do think that there have been players that have warranted coming in but he also has not had a huge pool of players at his disposal to choose from in terms of rotation. So they really, really need to back him if they're going to have any kind of progression in Europe next season and that's going to be the real test of their commitment to the women's team. Like, yes, they've sort of defied the odds a little bit in terms of how well resourced they are comparatively to particularly the other teams around the top four. But that is not enough in Europe. Look at Chelsea, right? Possibly the most invested in team in Europe, still

struggling, still battling injury crisis after injury crisis. You have to have a deep squad at a minimum to compete in that competition. So yeah, real test of Jim Ratcliffe and Ineos's commitment to the side. Aston Villa continued on their positive week, narrow victory over West Ham. It was a brilliant five-goal thriller finishing West Ham 2, Aston Villa 3, Ebony Salomon open up the scoring before Shakira Martinez scored her tenth of the campaign. What a signing she's been. Rico Wecki then put the Hammers into the lead but Rachel Daley hit back three minutes later before

Chastity Grant scored the winner early in the second half. Might not have been much riding on this one, Jamie, both teams were safe but it was still a brilliant game of football, two sides in form, two sides scoring goals. Are we starting to see more of what we can expect from both of them? Yeah certainly, I think Rhianne Skinner showed what she can do with West Ham for the last six months and there's obviously been a drastic change there. I think that it was always gonna come down to, she came in the summer,

they had a couple of weeks before the transfer window closes, she didn't have time to kind of insert her say into West Ham. Last season struggled, and then now we're beginning to reap the rewards of that. But I think the praise needs to go to Aston Villa for this game. Obviously they've won, so that's obvious, but they were a relegation threatened team a month ago,

and they've gone and won four straight games against impressive sides like Liverpool are an impressive side kind of in and amongst it they've obviously beaten Arsenal and West Ham have been unreal in the in the last couple months so I think with Natalia Arroyo like going off the back of what Emily said earlier it is just about this summer for Aston Villa they've got a lot of talent they had a really big window last summer but it felt like it was transitional there was a lot of talent. They had a really big window last summer, but it felt like it was transitional. There was a lot of turnover. Robert Depeo, he wasn't the man for the job. He couldn't get the best out of these players. I think we're finally seeing what Aston Villa can be under Arroyo, and she gets a summer with the squad. She gets a summer in the transfer window to have her say, and I think we're going to see an Aston Villa squad that are going to return to what we had believed them to be before this season. But yeah, this is a classic game of two good sides that I think are up and coming.

They've got a lot of young players. Shakira Martin is what player I'm absolutely buzzing because I've been there for two weekends straight in my WSL fantasy team. So smashing. I think me and Susie gave up on WSL fantasy in the first week. I need to win my family league, otherwise it's going to be embarrassing. So I'm just I'm pulling away there. But yeah, two good sides that I think we need to watch this space. They've got managers that have their head screwed on.

And I think it's just about going off the back of what Suzy said about Manchester United. It's about these owners actually caring about the women's team, investing in the women's team, because you've got some superstars. Can you hold on to those players, especially at West Ham? Can you hold on to, you know, I say, can you hold on to Mart to Martinez now that she's attracting attention from big clubs? So this is a game that sums up their seasons and I'm excited to see what they've got to produce over the summer. Yeah, particularly from a Villa point of view, Susie, what kind of a rebuild are you expecting over the summer, bearing in mind West Ham are not that much different to what they were

last season, but Villa have had such an enormous drop off from what we saw from them last season. What do you think is going to happen? Well, I think there'll be some turnover, like that's only natural and it's hard, right? When this good runner form at the end of the season almost distorts what we've seen before that a little bit and the view of it. You know, if you're going off the base of the last four games, you'd say, oh, nothing needs to change, it's all great. So like, you've got to kind of look a little bit before that as well. And yes, that's Arroyo's like, plan clicking into place, playing the right teams at the right time, that kind of stuff, you know, Arsenal, when they're still hung over from Europe and all those kinds of things. But yeah, there will have to be some turnover.

What is good for them is that they've got this boost in terms of like the project works, right? Like the blueprint makes sense now. And that's something that they can build on. I spoke to Kirsty Hansen a few months ago, and like, shortly after she had come in, and they were really, really bought into it. She was like, really into the way the new manager liked to play, the style of football, like how she was making them feel as players, the work she was doing with them one on one. They were really enjoying that side of things, but they weren't getting results and now they're seeing like the fruits of that labor and I think that's going to be like a big pull in potentially keeping some players that possibly were already looking

to leave and hopefully will attract some players that possibly were already looking to leave and hopefully will attract some players that, you know, when they dip into the transfer market. So I think we'll see more movement, but I think we'll also see some players stick it out. Whereas, you know, a month ago, two months ago, you'd be saying that the turnover would be much greater, I'd say. Yeah. Everton love a Merseyside derby, don't they? They continued their good form at Anfield with a 2-0 win over Liverpool. Goals from Katja Snoyce and Karen Holmgard. Liverpool dominated the stats actually. 61% possession, 27 shots created. Playing over 10 minutes

as well with an extra player when Sara Holmgard saw red. How frustrated will Amber Whiteley be with this one Emily? Yeah, probably quite frustrated I think. I mean it's a massive result for Everton. It's the first time they've done the double over Liverpool since 2012 which is a pretty impressive thing when you look at how consistent Liverpool have been and potentially how inconsistent Everton have been over the years. I do think it's probably a mark of where Liverpool are at this season that they just they have some really good games in them but then ones that you kind of expect them to get, or at least be in there and

getting a goal, you look at the calibre in their squad and then they just can't get anything through. I think it is quite reflective of the season that they've had. I do think kind of, have potentially flown under the radar for a lot. They've pulled out some pretty good results. I know they've had a pretty rough time away from home, but they've picked up pretty key results. And I think it's them considering where they could have been backing further Brian Sorensen, keeping a core group of their players together and renewing their contracts. It's pretty positive signs from Everton. And I think they've kind of been in and around that middle place. They've kind of struggled to kick on and kind of break into that top half But I think we're seeing the signs of a club that are willing to do to do that

And I think with the takeover as well with the club like the possibilities are there that they could really start climbing that table Next season. I do think for Liverpool though. Yeah, it is pretty disappointing I think they would have wanted to at least kind of try to end the season in a bit more of a positive way. And now everything they're going to finish or they could finish ahead of them, but are now kind of two points behind them. When you look at kind of where they started the seasons, it is quite a big gap where they've dropped down and other teams have picked up points.

So I do think it's, yeah, it's been a tough run and I do think they're going to face a bit of a battle this summer to kind of keep some of their core players. I think Olivia Smith has been incredible but are they going to be able to hold on to her? We know that there's been a lot of interest in her already and I think that's going to be key as to whether they back Amber Whiteley, whether they bring in a new manager, I think that's going to be key to who they can retain and who they can bring in because again like a lot of other clubs they need to start developing some depth. They're another one that every time they have a couple of injuries it does derail the team. So I think yeah I wouldn't

be surprised if this summer transfer window a lot of clubs are focusing on developing depth and trying to kind of broaden their squad so that when inevitably they have one or two injuries that doesn't completely derail a season as we've seen quite a few teams this year. Yeah, the final game in the WSL was a dead rubber, but it did provide plenty of late drama and injury time goals. It ended Crystal Palace two, Leicester City two with Abbie Larkin's 98th minute equalizer cancelling out Shannon O'Brien's 94th minute goal.

What can either team take from this one, Jamie? Yeah, I think for Leicester City, they're going to be really disappointed with this result. It's been 462 days since they've won on the road. They have not won a game away from home this whole season. So that's a very, very hard start for a team that we've kind of expected to maybe improve this season. They've been in and around the relegation zone and they need to figure that out. They need to dissect that because right now Crystal Palace have nothing to play for and sometimes that does boost teams. Sometimes it's like, okay, we've got nothing to lose. Can we put on a performance, maybe run out the season on a positive, but usually the teams have nothing to play for. So they're not going to

be performing with any hunger. So to not get a win away to Crystal Palace for Leicester, it's a really, really damning indictment of what they've got on the road right now because they got flattened by Arsenal at the Emirates two weeks ago and they're struggling. But then when they're at home, they're a lot of a better side. They're playing good football. So it's hard because Amanda McKelley, you kind of want to back her because you kind of see the philosophy she's playing strong at the back. She's had a lot of injury. She's really not had any fit forwards. So it's kind of hard to analyze Leicester City's season and really put a line through it because they've had just about as injury crisis as Man City has, just no one's

really talking about it. So yeah, that's a really disappointing result for the Foxes. They won't be happy. For Crystal Palace, it's hard. You know you're going down, you've got to fight in the championship again next season. If you know that you can go toe to toe with a team that's still in the WSL, it gives you a little bit of hope. But right now Palace will be focusing on the summer. Who can they retain? What are they going to do? Leafs married the guy to take them forward. He obviously they've committed to that, but what players are they going to be able to keep because they're going down? There's some high quality players there. They've got a lot of players on loan that are of the WSL quality. So yeah, I'm a little bit worried for the turnover that Crystal Palace are going to face this season.

Yeah. And we know who's replacing them now in the WSL because the 2024-2025 Barclays Championship came to its conclusion on Sunday with the kind of drama we've come to expect from this league over the years. London City Lionesses held off Birmingham City's comeback to lift the trophy and secure promotion to the WSL next season. It finished Birmingham City 2, London City Lionesses 2. Isabel Goodwin and Chantel Boyk-Lawker saw the visitors race into the lead at the start of the second half. But Amy Merricks's side fought back through Emily Van Egmond and Cho So Hyun to lead a tense and extended period of injury time. It's a massive achievement for London City Lionesses.

Susie, just 18 months ago, they'd been flirting with relegation. We know that the investment has come in, but has it still been a surprise how quickly the turnaround has happened? I don't think so. In that like, I mean, yes, in a way, obviously any turnaround like that, like, I mean, yes, in a way, obviously, any turnaround like that is surprising, but

the level of investment is, like, huge relative to the league, right? So in fact, even if you look at the WSL, right, like, it's not a huge amount of money that is needed to have a significant impact on a team. It just needs serious investment, some experienced players being brought in, but it's not a lot of money in the grand scheme of things. If you invested five million in a WSL team, you'd have them pushing towards the edge of the top four. It's not a huge investment that's required to get a return in terms of women's football, like the professional women's game in

England. So in that sense, it's not that much of a surprise because they brought in a top manager, they brought in some really experienced players and gave them money to incentivise them dropping down into the women's championship in England. And they have put processes and staff in place around them to make sure that they are successful. So in that sense, I'd say it's not surprising. Maybe the pace slightly, but even then, it does not take a huge amount of money to have success in women's football at the moment. So in a way, it's really stupid that there are owners in these various leagues that don't

invest because at some point it will become expensive to compete in this league and at the moment it's not. So get in and get your team good while it's still cheap to do so and not when it gets too expensive. Yeah, I'm wondering whether this kind of success could actually end up starting a period of heavier investment in struggling teams with investors trying to get in, not early because it's still not early, but it is still early in its infancy in a way. I think Michelle Kang is like a unique person though because her level of wealth and then

also her commitment to doing something in women's football is quite a unique combination. So like finding more Michelle Kangs who like have the level of wealth where they can essentially just throw money away for a number of years before they expect a return is going to be quite hard. So like, I think there, there will be owners, like pre-existing owners of teams and stuff that look at it and think, yes, I can, I can put a little bit more in and make a real difference here and get promoted to WSL and start to maybe see a return on investment come back, but I don't think to that level necessarily.

And also I don't think there's a large number of people who like are ideologically committed in the way that she is to it as much as she is putting her money then where her mouth is as well. So like, I think yes, we will. And I actually think we're going to see everyone in the WSL have to raise their game right, because it's not going to be automatic that London City goes straight down because she's going to put money in to make sure that they don't, which isn't, you know, a given by any stretch of the imagination. It's not just about how much money you put in. It's

about how you build that team together into a like a viable team to be able to compete. But every single team in the WSL, if they want to stay in that league and compete with what she is going to invest into that side are going to have to up their game. So that's going to be hard. It's vital actually. I mean, obviously heavy backing,

but Megan Campbell said after the game, this club has no ceiling. How do you think they're going to approach the WSL next season, Emily? And then I'm going to ask Jamie a question off the back of that as to what exactly it means for the other teams who are operating at the moment at the bottom of the WSL. But first of all, how do you think they're going to approach it, Emily? I think again, they're going to be a club to watch in the transfer window.

I think you look at the players that they've already brought in, and yes, a lot of them are kind of towards the end of their careers, but they're so vastly experienced that we've seen Michelle Kang overhaul the squad for each of her goals. So she overhauled it when she wanted them to stay up, and then she overhauled it again when she knew that she wanted them to double sell. I wouldn't be surprised if you see another overhaul. I was saying, you know, it's quite interesting,

the celebrations at full time, knowing that quite a few of them may not be in the side next season because it is going to take a different group of players that are going to get them to stay in the WSL. By the way, love her being part of the trophy lift or not? What do you think? Hate. Oh, we actually had an interview with her a few weeks ago that's going live tomorrow and Jeff and I, my colleague ESPN did a conversation about it yesterday.

And we were both saying it is such a new thing. Like you wouldn't have anyone, anyone else involved in like the ownership would ever do that. But Michelle Kang is this kind of woman of the hour where like it kind of makes sense for her to do it. Like, I know, I like CCC shaking her head, but it's one of those that's like, she's been like this big prominent figure that like, the club is hanging, they wouldn't be here without her. So I do understand kind of her being involved in that because they wouldn't be where they are if she hadn't have come in and invested heavily.

And I think that's the key point. I know kind of with, with, with different things, like, I do think that what she's brought to the team is really interesting. I think it's also quite interesting that she loves the idea. Well, she was saying to us that the plan is to kind of have a club in every continent and kind of branch out that way.

And I think her focus for England is gonna be London City. I know there was a lot of thoughts that she was gonna bring in a second club, a third club, whatever. Like she's gonna keep that one. And then, yeah, I think it's a pretty big step for them. And I do think that she's got the ability to kind of keep them in the WSL.

And I think it is just going to encourage every other team to step up, which is what she wanted. You know, she was saying to us that she wants more people to invest. She wants more people coming into the game that are going to support women's football. So if she gets that from the WSL and it's forcing them to spend more money, then I don't think that's a bad thing at all. Listen, she is a brave woman, but none braver than a woman coming down in a cream suit to celebrate with champagne spraying players. In my opinion, Susie, you have a different one. Yeah, Emily's laugh mid sentence there was because I was like heavily gesticulating that I wanted to come into this conversation. It's no slight on Michelle Kang. Like I think she

is a very well-meaning individual. We all know I'm not a huge fan, like I'm quite left wing of private finance investment in women's football full stop. But I do think she has genuine intentions, has done some impressive things, is putting money in like good places. If that's how she wants to spend it, I think that's, you know, an admirable thing to want to spend it on. I don't have a problem with that. It's just when you watch the NFL, right, and you watch the Super Bowl and the first thing they do is hand the trophy to the owner of the team to hold it aloft and celebrate with it before they give it to any of the players. It just feels like the superbolification of women's football and the idea of that, the

idea that you have the person who just puts the money in and not the players holding that trophy first. For me, it has to be them the owner should not be involved in in those initial celebratory moments with that trophy between it's a connection between fans and players and yes she's got a connection with them too and has put the money in to do it but you know give her the trophy afterwards and she can have a photo with it and you know hold it up in front of the fans afterwards but that that first moment of receiving that trophy, those players have just battled for that. That's their moment. And that's what I've got issue with. Like, it's every time I see it at the Super Bowl, it makes me want to vomit. And I don't want that to come in here.

Fair enough. Listen, last one on the London City Lionesses, and then we'll just focus on Birmingham. But Jamie, Jim has sent us a message on Women's Football Weekly at theguardian.com, our email address. Given the backing that they have, can London City Lionesses break the curse of newly promoted teams and actually be competitive in the WSL next season? If so, which team or teams are more likely

to be nervously looking over their shoulders at the drop zone? I think certainly. I think certainly they'll come into the WSL with real intent next season. That's what we expect from Michelle Kang. She's gone and signed the Sweden and Japan captain while in the championship. Like we don't know what she's going to do when they come into the top flight. And I think the biggest indicator of this is when Tom Garry

put out the like the agent fee spread and London City had spent more money on agent fees than Crystal Palace, Liverpool and Brighton and they were just shy of West Ham and Leicester. And that's them in the championship. That's an investment coming off the back of exactly what Emily and Susie both said. Michelle Kang is putting her money where her mouth is. She's very, very certain that they want to stay up. And I spoke to Isabel Goodwin before the game,

a couple of days before the game. And she said, I've been saying to the team, like, if we go up, I think we can stay up because our goal isn't to just get promoted, it's to win the WSL in the next few years. Like, this team aren't coming up and they're saying, oh, let's stay, let's fight. They're saying, let's win the WSL, we need to take this to a level where we're

a competing team in the league. So it's interesting, because we definitely wouldn't have heard Crystal Palace say that this time last year, are we going to win the WSL in the next few years. So it puts a lot of pressure on these bottom stragglers of the WSL that have been kind of floating along, not really committing to their women's team, not spending a lot of money. Obviously you see someone like Liverpool

who've won the Premier League for the 20th time, they've spent $70,000 on agent fees. That's the second least amount behind Crystal Palace. Like that is shocking for a club of that stature. So if they're gonna come in and they're gonna compete with these teams, it puts these bottom teams at a risk. And I think obviously a team like Leicester City, Aston Villa, these kind of bottom teams, they're going to struggle a little bit. I think Aston

Villa, I really am optimistic of how they'll be. However, I think a club like Liverpool, they've gotten off with some results this season and Emily touched on it earlier. They're not consistent enough. If their club's not going to invest, if their owners aren't going to invest, a club like that's in trouble, because Michelle Kang's sole purpose is, this is the women's team. We're only focused on the women's team. We only have a women's team.

We're going to throw money at it and we're going to want to compete. So I think LCL will firmly stay up. I think those bottom teams, like I said, Leicester City in big trouble. I think Liverpool actually need to really get their work together. I'm not worried about Brighton's,

West Ham's and Aston Villa's. I think they'll do the work enough, but it'll be interesting. I'm excited because I think the WSO will be much more competitive than it has been over the last two seasons. Painful for Birmingham though, Emily, so near yet so far. How do they use the hurt of this experience to spur them on next season? Yeah, I think it was really tough for them and I think at one point, especially at the end of that game, they really looked like they could get another goal and I think that 10 minutes of stoppage time, I generally thought they're going to get another goal here. And apart from that moment where London City lobbed the ball over the top,

noticing the goalkeeper off the line and it nearly went in, which would have been a really crushing end to the game. But I do think it is really tough for them. I think they haven't been able to kind of get themselves back in the WZ. I mean, they're relegated in 2022 and have just kind of struggled to, I think this is the closest they've really been

to getting back into the top tier. And I do think, you know, Amy Merricks came in in April last year and has had time, but potentially with another year and another, especially with the development and the money that's going into that club as well now, I think next season it could be theirs. But I feel like we do kind of say that every season, so maybe there's a few issues kind of behind closed doors that need to iron out. But I guess what Hope Powell's done behind the scenes, kind of moving into that more of a kind of managerial

director role, has been pretty effective. And I think a bit more time under Amy Merrick. So I think again, Antung Hero at the minute, like she's done great stuff with Birmingham coming in, really young coach, obviously spent eight years at Brighton, was in Ingen Youth and has now just really kind of took this on on her head and done a pretty good job with it. So I do think kind of it might be their season next season, but I do think that maybe when you look at it that just what London City have invested is just too difficult to match at the minute. And maybe that's where they've fallen off, that they just couldn't really reach what London City have done. But yeah, I think there's a lot of learnings to

take and they're going to be hurt for a little while knowing they came so close and that literally came down to a goal that meant they didn't get promoted. But that's football and that's the game and you just got to rally and regroup for next season and hope you can can break up into that into that top tier really. Yeah, Jamie, just a quick one. And this is a weird question to ask because actually, yes, I know we need the broadcasting money, but it feels like broadcasting is changing enormously and there's money coming in from elsewhere. And obviously YouTube have been brilliant in terms of airing many women's games. But it was the first time that a women's championship game has been shown on Sky Sports, didn't disappoint as well. How much did the league deserve that

moment and how important is it that it's not just a one-off? Yeah, certainly. I think, look, the Stars did align for the final day. Obviously everything to play for, Birmingham City are playing London City. Both clubs have a go at promotion. So the Stars did align and I don't believe that if that had happened, it would not be on Sky Sports. And then we need to talk about that a little bit more because the perfect scenario was there. Sky Sports capitalised it on it and these broadcasters, they need to do that. And it's very, very positive that they did. But this is a league that, in my opinion, is far more competitive than the WSL.

Like every team is kind of competing for something. There is a lot more to play for every week. Even the relegation battle, like it was a lot more exciting in a way than the Crystal Palace relegation battle was. So there's a lot of meat on the bone there for like opportunities for investment. And yeah, it is a bit disappointing that it took this long.

However, I think it's also, you can look at it as a positive. There is a bit disappointing that it took this long. However, I think it's also, you can look at it as a positive. There's a league there that really needs to be looked at. Crystal Palace are going back down. That's a Premier League back squad. Birmingham City, as Emily said, that's a squad with a good strain of investment. They're going to keep competing.

So it's how do we kind of look at this as an opportunity for women's football? The championship is a great league. We love the EFL in the men's side. Like it's almost as exciting. It is more exciting than the premier league. So we need to kind of get that to translate across to the women's game, because it's there.

The proof's in the pudding. The league's good enough. It's exciting enough for television, but we kind of need to see that go a long way. And I think when we're struggling to get the, you know, the women's game at the top flight level to be paid attention to, there's obviously plenty of work for us to be rallying behind the championship. It deserves to be on that stage, but there's an opportunity there. I'm really glad that a broadcaster took it. So yeah, that's all.

That's all. We'll hope for more in the future. Yeah. Let's just run through the other final day results. Newcastle United secured fifth in their inaugural season with a 5-1 victory over Blackburn Rovers. Shania Howells scored a hatick but missed out on the golden boot by just a goal. Charlton and Durham beat Southampton and Bristol City respectively to seal third and fourth places. Meanwhile Sunderland beat already relegated Sheffield United by two goals to one to finish in seventh. Right, look we do have to talk about the news that broke last week. There's been a lot of anger and frustration and I know that many of you listening to this are going to have your own views on it, but the FA announced that from the 1st of June trans women will no longer take part in women's football in England. A statement from the FA said,

our current policy which allows transgender women to participate in the women's game was based on this principle and supported by expert legal advice. It's a complex subject and our position has always been that if there was a material change in law, science or the operation of the policy in grassroots football, then we'd review it and change it if necessary. The Supreme Court's ruling on the 16th of April means that we'll be changing our policy. Transgender women will no longer be able to play in women's football in England and this policy will be implemented from the 1st June 2025. We understand that this will be difficult for people who simply want to

play the game they love in the gender by which they identify and we're contacting the registered transgender women currently playing to explain the changes and how they can continue to stay involved in the game. Suzie, you were on a march at the weekend. I think, you know, we know your thoughts are clear, but what did you make of all of this last week? Yeah, I mean, I joined the Gold Diggers football club in London, all over London, that is an inclusive club. I enjoyed their walk to report on it. I've written an article about it because they basically marched from Hagerston Park to Wembley, which is 12 miles from their training pitches to Wembley to deliver an open letter they had

written calling for a reversal of this ban. Mark Bullingham, the FA chief executive, has responded to that. In that, he makes it pretty clear that, well, I mean, he literally says it was not an ideological judgment, but a difficult decision based on legal advice and that a change in policy was necessary. Basically they've been forced into it by, as I understand it, the threat of legal action. And from my point of view, it's really disappointing because anyone involved in women's football, particularly players, but anyone around the game has spent decades having the argument and advocating for the right of women to be able to reap all the benefits that sport provides to a person, right?

So be it socially, emotionally, physically, mentally, all of those different kind of ways. And that's meant that women's football has become a real like place of inclusion and solidarity and I put all of this on social media, the sport holds very, very dear to itself that it is a place where, that we have fought for that, that means that we can enjoy all of those benefits that sport has, regardless of whether you're an elite athlete turning it into a career or someone playing in a park with their mates. So like to see that sort of be taken away from a section of society, one of the most vulnerable sections of society and have them banned from playing in women's football, which is inherently inclusive and more accepted place than say if they were to go and play mixed football

or men's football. It's just really, really disappointing and sad in my view. And I think one of the things for me that gets lost in the conversation on trans participation in sport is that the conversation is like, the starting point is exclusion. And instead for me, the starting point should exclusion and instead for me the starting point should be what is sport for, what is the purpose of sport, like, why do people play sport,

and it is for all of those things, it's not necessarily to win, you know, the tiny few at the top who are able to make it a professional career is the tiny minority of people who are participating in sport and the overwhelming majority of people who are participating in sport and the overwhelming majority of people are involved in sport for the social, the emotional, all of those kinds of things. And so for me, the starting point has to be like, how do we make sport a thing that everyone can benefit from? And that is the starting point. And yeah, you have conversations about how you do that safely and stuff, particularly in obviously contact sports and things, you know, you have to do that safely and stuff, particularly in obviously contact sports and things.

You know, you have to do that a little bit more carefully. But I think the FAs previous policy, which is in effect until the new ban comes into effect on, I think it's June the 1st, was problematic in and of itself. But it did the job right. Like transgender women had to provide medical records showing their testosterone levels were below prescribed levels for at least 12 months, had to provide a record of hormone therapy an annual review of treatment and they were bringing in a new formal process which involved match observation by an FA official to give the FA ultimate discretion on a case-by-case basis

to check out you know any kind of safety issues that there might be of different level of physicality that could be dangerous, that kind of stuff, because there isn't science around this. So that case by case basis and the discretion to do it, I think there are problems around that, but it was a policy that was designed to try and maintain the ability for trans women to be able to play in women's football and have some level of inclusion there. And this sort of forced through blanket ban by sort of the threat of possible legal action for me is really disappointing in that regard because it's starting from the point of exclusion rather than how do we make sure that one of the most vulnerable sections of society that are marginalised in so many ways and particularly at the moment facing a bit

of a societal backlash, we should be looking at how we make sure they are included in sport like excluded Robert. Yeah, very good point. Right, it's been a brilliant pod as always. Thank you for all of your input. Jamie, thank you. See you soon. Thank you. See you soon guys. Bye, Emily. See you later. See you later. Suzie, hopefully I will see you this week. I'm hoping I'll see you on Wednesday.

Wednesday? What's Wednesday? Our Barclays lunch. Well, you were not going to see me because I'm going to the Chelsea FA Cup Final Media Day. Oh, of course, the FA Cup Final... Oh dear. Too many clashes this time of the season, always. So many clashes. Oh, that hug will have to wait in that case. Right, keep having your say, sending in your questions via social media.

Email us at women'sfootballweekly at theguardian.com and as ever, a reminder to sign up for our weekly women's football newsletter. All you need to do is search Moving the Goalposts sign up. The Guardian Women's Football Weekly is produced by Sophie Downey and Silas Gray. Music composition was by Laura Iredale. Our executive producer is Salamad. This is The Guardian.