The Highwire with Del Bigtree - “IT’S WAR ON THE INNOCENCE OF CHILDREN” – MIRIAM GROSSMAN, MD

Episode Date: August 12, 2023

Author of Lost in Trans Nation: A Child Psychiatrist’s Guide Out of the Madness, Miriam Grossman, MD, discusses the tsunami of children questioning their gender identity in recent years and the frightening push from the medical community to provide permanent treatments that can lead to disastrous outcomes. Hear how to protect your family from what she believes is a social contagion.Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/the-highwire-with-del-bigtree--3620606/support.

Here's a topic that is really starting to be on all of our minds. We're seeing lots of videos out there and things that are just hard to wrap your head around. And this is something that this is a precarious space that we're going into. I don't mean to be judgmental at all. What I will say is I am confused by this. Trans women can breast fade so they can experience one of the most natural, bond in parts of motherhood. I've always wanted to be able to lactate.

And today, my doctor, after my EKG results, said that she's feeling confident enough to start me on this medication, regularly. I'm going to be a mother that's in the works, in the process. And part of that process is that I am working to induce lactation to be able to breastfeed our youngest child. Transwomen who do breastfeed typically take hormones to help their bodies produce milk. These transgender moms do something called breast and nipple stimulation. It's been 40 minutes since I've been pumping. Yeah. This is what I'm able to get up to now. Not much. I put it in the corner. It's not bad for only a week of going on.

I've actually already successfully induced lactation. Like, I can actually make milk now, um, which has been a very, a very interesting and very cool experience. The baby has been able to latch, but, I've not been able to produce any milk. It's okay. Because we're gonna supplement the feeding with formula so that my baby's still getting the nutrients that they need. It's like very biologically affirming too.

It's just something that's like gate-kept from trans women, like so, so difficult. Trans women can be mothers. We are mothers. I'm your mother. I'll say every time we get into this topic, we probably get more comments from you and emails from those of you out there that think this is a very dangerous subject to cover and that we don't want to sort of speak about anyone in a way that's not kind.

But if you've been watching the Highwire, you know that what we're doing is following our questions. We have questions about this. We're trying to understand this world we're living in and why it's changing so fast. Is it moving in the right direction, especially when the work that we do with ICANN, our non-profit, informed consent action network, is around protecting children. I think this issue starts really. really getting into some very precarious gray areas.

Well, one person that is not afraid to dive straight into those gray areas and bring some reality with a clinical understanding, a medical understanding is Dr. Miriam Grossman. If you do not know who she is, then you probably missed all of these moments out there in the news. Dr. Miriam Grossman.

Dr. Grossman. Dr. Grossman. The child psychiatrist, an author of, You're teaching my child what? Dr. Grossman. a psychiatrist, medical doctor, and you've done a lot of work in child psychiatry. The rates of kids who suddenly proclaim that they are identifying as the opposite sex or some other gender are actually up about 5,000 percent.

And when I went to medical school 40 years ago, the cases were so rare that none of us ever expected to see even one person in our entire lifetime. Kids are being taught by some teachers that men can have babies and that boys menstruate. And this is dangerous. This is a dangerous ideology because it's not true. A lot of them were hurting themselves. A lot of them were suicidal before they even discovered gender. That is never part of the discussion.

And they say, what would you rather have? a living daughter or a dead son. If this is what the professionals are saying, it's terrible emotional black men. This is grooming, right? Technical textbook grooming. Grooming is the emotional and psychological manipulation of a vulnerable person, often a child,

in order to, at some later time, exploit that person, especially teacher activists who are manipulating, psychologically and emotionally their students and recruiting them into radical sexual and gender ideologies. We are giving them medical treatments that cause cardiovascular problems, blood clots, heart attacks, cancers, kidney failure. We're putting girls into menopause.

There's a celebration of denying reality. There's a celebration of being confused. Who wants the government stepping in between doctors and parents and children? Of course, we ideally don't want that. But when there's something that is so wrong that's going on, then I think we have to. It's my honor and pleasure to be joined now by Dr. Miriam Grossman. Hi, Dr. Roseman. Thank you for taking the time today.

Well, hello. That was great. Great. Can I have that series of clips? Absolutely. We'll send it right over when we're done talking. That's great. So just very quickly, for people that may not have been tracking your work, and you have a book that we would love to be celebrating here. You can't even find a copy within 100 miles. It is that popular. Lost in Transnation, a child psychiatrist's guide out of the madness. What is your background that sort of has put you into the center? of this very intriguing, maybe disturbing and confusing discussion?

Well, my background is I'm a medical doctor, and I specialize in child and adolescent psychiatry. And around, I don't know, maybe 15 years ago, I became interested in learning more about sexuality education because I was on the staff of a counseling center at UCLA for UCLA students. And so many of those kids that were coming in for counseling had a sexually transmitted infection or they had had multiple abortions and they were going in for frequent HIV testing. So I became alarmed and wanted to find out what exactly are these kids learning about

staying healthy, staying sexually healthy. And I delved into sex education and what kids are being told, including younger kids in elementary school and even in maybe in kindergarten. And I discovered that sex education really is not about maintaining health. It's not about remaining free of disease. What it is is it's about sexual freedom.

And it's about promoting a lifestyle of sexuality from cradle to grave, and it's about eliminating any Judeo-Christian values from our society. So in the midst of that research that I was doing, and then that also culminated in a book called, You're Teaching My Child What? I discovered at that time, and this was in the late 2000s, by the way. I discovered that kids were being told that humanity is not separated into male or female. Kids are being told that is a myth, that's a falsehood. There's actually many, many, a spectrum of sexes. And male and female is just two of many choices. And that a person determines their own identity, unrelated to their biology,

and they can decide what their identity is, regardless of their biology. So it was essentially teaching kids a belief system. That's what I call it. It's a belief system because it is not based in medicine and is not based in science. They're teaching kids to believe that there's such a thing as being born in the wrong body,

and that however you, feel about your identity as male or female, that takes precedence over what your biology says you actually are. And that once you determine or decide on your identity, even though that identity may be fluid and change from day to day, everyone else is obligated to affirm and indeed to celebrate your identity as separate from your biology. Now, I discovered this was being taught to kids, you know, more than 15, even 20 years ago. And I know that's going to come as a surprise to your audience because most people think this is new, but it is not new. What's new is that we have this tsunami of teenagers and some of them under teenage kids and young adults

who are suddenly declaring this new identity. And it's been, you know, since about 2015 or so, there's been an astronomical increase in the number of kids that are making this claim. And there's also been an astronomical increase. in the number of doctors and clinics that exist in order to provide the medical treatments. So let's see, you asked about my history. I became extremely alarmed about this way back when I discovered it because, you see, it's a very destabilizing idea to tell a child that something that's at the core of their

humanity, which is their identity as male or female, that that could be wrong. It's an extremely destabilizing idea to lead them to believe that being a boy or girl is just randomly assigned by a doctor or midwife who happens to be in the delivery room when they're born and that that could be a mistake. Now, of course, there are extremely rare individuals, extremely rare. we're talking 0.02% of the population that do have some sort of chromosomal

or other abnormality. And they may have genitalia that appear, you know, it's not clear whether they are male or female. But even those individuals that we call intersex individuals, they still, each one of them, their reproductive systems are organized around the production of either sperm or eggs. They may be infertile. They may be unable to produce sperm or eggs. But that does not mean they are not males or females.

So this whole thing, this whole belief system that has, you know, engulfed us. It's just, you know, you can't get away from it. And our kids certainly can't get away from it. it's all based on on on on on on there's no foundation to this belief system let me let me ask you some questions because I don't have a a doctorate or a science background certainly not in this space but when I look at it I'm just really inquisitive here and I'm sure I'm going to get into trouble for making comparisons but growing up when I was in school one of the big issues was like anorexia and bulimia, right? And we were sort of told, you know, when I was growing up as a teenager, that some people, because they lack control in their environment, they, you know, use control of their body, whether it's starving themselves or things to try and manage that.

And it was considered to be, you know, a psychological issue. It seems to me, and correct me, This seems similar in that it's a control of your body. I want to cut parts of my body off. I want to change my body. Am I just way off base in making that comparison? Is there any sort of similar psychological connection that would refer to science in what we used to understand about these things? Well, in comparing the transgender identities, comparing them to eating disorders is actually not too much. way off. And I'll explain why it's not two way off. First of all, we know that eating disorders

have a social contagion element to them. A social contagion is when feelings or beliefs or behaviors spread among groups of friends. And those groups of friends can be at school, you know, in the neighborhood, they can be online as well. And we are seeing clearly. seeing evidence of this with the transgender phenomenon. So we know that we see like entire friend groups, groups of girls arriving at a gender clinic together, asking to be placed on hormones together. Their feelings and their beliefs are influencing one another. And that is called a social contagion. And we know that that was the case also with eating disorders. It can be the case with sometimes with suicide.

So that is a legitimate point that you made. The other point that you bring up is simply, you know, eating disorders are an emotional, they have an emotional basis to them. The people that end up severely restricting their diets and, you know, end up anorectic or bulimic and they're harming themselves in doing so and they have a just distorted perception of themselves. They look in the mirror and they think that they're obese and they weigh like, you know, 82 pounds and they're five feet eight inches. So that's a distortion of their self-perception. Now, these kids who, and my practice consists of helping these kids in their families, by the way,

And I'll just mention again, the name of my book is Lost in Transnation, a Child Psychiatrist's Guide Out of the Madness. So these kids, you see, they have a lot of underlying psychological issues. Many of them are on the autism spectrum. They have anxiety, depression. Many of them have been through trauma. They might have family issues, ADHD, any number of conditions. These are kids that are not altogether happy with themselves and their lives. And transgenderism is presented to them as something that could be the solution to all of their problems. And they go online, they go onto YouTube, and they listen to these influencers and other individuals that are grooming them. And they are led to believe that if they feel uncomfortable with how they look, and they don't

and they don't like getting their period, or they're embarrassed about the changes of puberty and how other people are looking at them, well then they might just be the opposite sex. This suggestion is made to them, and it's made to them by people that they look up to, older people, more experienced people. And these kids are vulnerable,

And they'll do anything to feel better. They want to fit in at school. They don't have many of them a peer group that is accepting of them. And when they declare themselves as transgender, they will automatically, their social status is automatically going to be elevated. And they're going to be celebrated. And they're going to get lots and lots of attention

from the adults. So you see, this is a complicated thing. But the point that I'm trying to make is that this is an emotional disorder. And my profession, the medical profession, has really lost its way here because they are treating an emotional disorder by changing the body. So by giving blockers and cross-sex hormones and surgeries and changing the appearance of the body. they're promising kids that they're going to feel emotionally better and we don't know

that that's the case at all to the contrary we have evidence that they they might feel worse on the other end of this plus have to deal with being I would say disfigured and sometimes uh sometimes sterilized we had a D transitioner named Luca on our show a few monks back, a really tragic story. You know, she had listened, a psychiatrist, I guess, that really promoted this idea that she was in the wrong body, and so made all of these changes, and then has to detransition. It seems to me this argument that's happening in this country right now, I think all, you know, I want to believe we all care about children, and we want children

to feel accepted and okay for who they are. But this idea that changing your body, I saw a beam that said something had a picture of a mom talking to a daughter saying, you're beautiful just as you are unless you're transgender. In that case, we need to cut a lot of body parts off and get to work here. And it just seems like such a mixed message going on with children. But the fact that we're discussing, you know, transitioning to children, like making them think about to – and let me ask you this. When you looked at the languaging of this education,

Are they talking about sex? Because it seems to me just a few years ago, you weren't, if your child started talking about sex in first grade, second grade, a counselor was supposed to report that something must be going on at home, that this child is thinking about sexuality at such a young age instead of just being a child. And I feel like that's been thrown out the door. Now we are asking children to decide what sexual partners they plan on have. you know, 15 years down the road and 10 years before they've hit puberty. Well, of course our kids are being sexualized to an appalling degree at very young ages. Now, you said a minute ago that you think that everyone has the, you know, well-being of children,

gives priority to the well-being of children. And I hope that you're right, Dell, but I think that some people care more about the well-being of their bank accounts. And I'm referring to surgeons who are performing bilateral mastectomies on girls as young as 12 or 13, who clearly have emotional problems and who clearly cannot give informed, consent regarding such a procedure. In my book, I speak extensively about these medical and surgical interventions that are being done all over our country on these young kids. I describe the procedures in detail. I talk about my patients who have gone through these procedures and how it shattered their lives. I

I provide evidence of these surgeons talking about how, for example, one of them said that he has no lower age limit, that anyone at any age could come and get a consultation with him about the removal of breasts. There's another surgeon that talks about looking forward to a day when gender will be no big deal. and all these medical interventions that, again, disfigure, sterilize, and leave kids with a laundry list of serious medical problems, cardiovascular problems, issues with urinating, sexual dysfunction, inability to orgasm. The list is endless. And there are doctors out there, these are my colleagues. I take no place. pleasure in having to talk about this. But, you know, we all took an oath to do no harm. I want these doctors to, I want them to be placed on the hot seat. I want them to be subpoenaed and brought into Congress and asked questions about what they're doing to these kids. Yeah, it's really, it's very difficult to,

to understand it. And when we, and we're being told that somehow we are bigots or, you know, all sorts of names for even trying to have this conversation right now. I'm sure there's people going to be upset that are in my audience that I'm, and I'm trying to be as objective as I possibly can be in this space. But at the beginning of this, we're talking about nature. And in the video that we showed where a man is trying to get a baby to latch,

onto his chest and they're taking drugs like Dom Peridone to try and create lactation. And when we talk about the children, it says on that drug on the label, don't take this while breastfeeding, it can lead to heart issues and brain development issues in the, in utero, child and baby could lead to problems. And yet, the CDC is now promoting this drug use for transgender parents. And I look at these videos and I'm trying to not be judgmental, but I ask myself, are these mentally stable people, you know, a man with a man's body, trying to make it do what a woman's body does, excreting some sort of what looks like toxic chemicals now out of their chest being brought on by a drug that's an off-label usage. And where is the concern for the baby that is

being put through this. Where is, you know, where is it okay that we're taking babies and making them latch onto men's chests? And where is it okay to have probably toxic excretion so that this person feels good about their lives? Have we just forgotten about the rights of the child? Del, what we're looking at here is mentally ill men who, for their narcissistic, pathological, reasons wish to believe that they are mothers who are nursing their babies. Nothing could be further than the truth. All you have to do is find a nursing mother or any woman that ever nursed, and she will describe to you how she was careful about every molecule of food that she ate and every drop of liquid that she consumed. And if she felt that that that may be,

be harmful to her infant in some way, she would avoid all those things. That's what a mother does. We're not looking at mothers here. This is offensive to me. And mentioning, you're talking about the kids. Of course, this is abusive. This is just outrageous that we would, that the CDC would actually come out and put their stamp of approval on such a thing when they know that, you know, they know that what is in that so-called milk? It's not milk. It's a nipple discharge. It is not milk. It's a nipple discharge, and God knows what's in it. When I think about this, one of the questions I have is that we're going to get into some dangerous territory. because we can't avoid it, but they are.

I'm gonna ask the questions as I see it. There seem to be a shift for me in this idea that you're born this way. I do believe some people are born, you know, with certain different sexual perspectives, but I also believe that it can be socialized. As you've said, I do think you can shift, especially in a young child, they're thinking about themselves.

And I think that that's really at the core of what we're gonna be arguing about. out right now because they want to tell us you're just born this way. Well, if you're just born this way, then we have to accept furries and we have to accept pedophiles. We have to accept all of these different things. Where does the line get drawn for a society? Del, I'm going to have to make, I'm going to have to correct you here. Forgive me here. Okay, please, please. You're speaking about sexual orientation, which means to whom is a person attracted. Are they attracted to men, women, both?

That's a romantic sexual attraction, who you want to be with. We are speaking right now about having a transgender identity. Gender identity has to do with if you experience yourself as male or female, not related to sexual orientation. So it has nothing to do with who they plan on being attracted to, or who they think they're attracted to? attracted to. Oh, so it's just so explain that to me because that I think that's where many of us

are confused. This is just about your own body and not about your attraction space. That's right. It's about how you experience yourself, who you are, whether you experience yourself. Now, of course, I'm not saying that I have to be careful over here because gender identity itself is a very difficult term for me. And I explain in the book why it lacks clarity and it's, it's something, I mean, that's a whole other thing, okay? The language here is a very unclear language and it's Orwellian language as well. So without getting too deep and going into that direction, I just want to explain to you in your audience again. So being gay, lesbian, or bisexual, refers to who a person is romantically attracted to.

Being transgender or one's gender identity refers to one's inner experience of being male or female. Now, it's true. It is, you know, it does, it gets a little bit complicated over here. And I don't know if we want to, you know, we could spend hours talking about this.

Sure, we could. I think that there's more, there's many, there's many more important messages of my book that I would like to get across. Okay. Parents need to be prepared, no matter what your background, there's no family that's immune. This is not only happening in blue states. This is happening all over the country in every sort of family. You have to be prepared beforehand for one of your kids to perhaps come to you one day. say that they're the opposite sex and ask to be called a different name and different pronouns and

to be taken to a gender clinic. You have to know how are you going to handle that? And I don't care what age your kids are. The younger, the better. I mean, perhaps this is something that may not happen for many years. I want you to be prepared. I have talked to hundreds of parents who have gone through this calamity in their families. And they all tell me that they were blindsided. They didn't expect it. They have kids who were never uncomfortable with being boys and girls. And sometimes the kids were actually very stereotypical boys and girls. So they never expected it. They weren't prepared. They didn't know what to say. They didn't understand. And they go to a gender a gender affirming therapist, which is what 99% of therapists are, and they're told by that

therapist to put their child into the driver's seat. The therapist automatically rubber stamps the new identity, the new name, the new pronouns, tells the parents that they have to do the same, that they have to tell the school that the kid should be called socially transitioned at school, begin using the bathrooms of the opposite sex, and so on. So I want parents to be prepared because I'm advising them not to go with it. I'm advising them that we do not have any research, long-term research, that indicates that these kids are going to benefit from so-called affirming them. And by the way, when you affirm a child in their new identity,

it means that you are denying their biological reality. And I'm arguing in the book that that's not doing them any favor because you cannot deny your biological reality without paying a price. And sometimes that price is going to be very, very high. So parents need to be educated and need to have the tools so that they're ahead of the game here. and I provide them with information about how to put the school on alert. Again, years before any of this might happen, your kid might be going into kindergarten.

I want parents to put their schools on alert, not only public schools. You may go to a Catholic school. I want that school put on alert as well. Wow. I explain to parents how they have to be in control of their child's Internet use. I can't emphasize that enough. Kids are, you know, kids are being influenced to a degree that you cannot imagine on the internet, on social media, on YouTube. That's where they're learning this stuff.

That's where they're meeting people who are influencing them. And by the time they come to you and they say, mom, dad, I'm not your son, I'm your daughter, they may have already spent a year online being influenced by these. people without you knowing about it. And by then, you're in trouble because it's very hard to break through to them. How has it gotten to this point? Where, where is the protections? Where, I mean, again, you know, this is, it appears there are websites that are grooming children. You have teachers now grooming. God knows what are those private conversations happening with our kids. And we have a government now and a group of regulatory agencies that are promoting what it seems 10 years ago

would have been considered a jailable illegal offense on children. How did we get to this point? Was there some heroic, iconic figure in this world that came forward and just changed policies as we know it? Or is it a group thing? I mean, how did this happen? I mean, I think this is where we're at and your you know your book is you know guide out of the the the madness many parents right now are like what has happened to my world and why didn't I see some gradual you know progression here no no it was all it was all out in the open what do you mean this was all very clear to many of us and the problem is that people closed their eyes to it because they considered it an extreme right, you know, religious right of preoccupation and that it was homophobic and transphobic

and all the names that we got called for pointing this out, for pointing out that our kids are being sexualized. What do you mean? This has been on the agenda, you know, it depends where you get your news from, but this has been very clear to many of us for a long, long time that we need to fight this war on children. It's a war on the innocence of children. So I get upset when people say that this suddenly happened. Didn't suddenly happen.

We've just been reelecting the same people who don't do anything about it, who don't care to do anything about it, and they let it get worse and worse and worse. So that's why we are where we are. What is our way out now? I mean, is it, do you think that pulling your kids out of the education system, homeschooling if you can? I mean, what are, you know, it just, it feels like. the school system has your kid for longer than you do.

And then, you know, as you add YouTube and things like that on it, parents aren't even involved in the process of raising their kids. Do you think we start moving in more extreme measures, you know, educating our children ourselves? Well, there's a lot that parents can do. And I wrote this book for parents, not for professionals, for regular moms and dads. There is so much that you can do from an early.

I'll give you one example. From an early age, start telling your child that they are a boy or a girl and they have always been a boy or a girl and will always be a boy or a girl from the moment of conception. I'm not saying give them the sex talk, birds and the bees. That's not what I'm talking about. I'm saying you tell your little child that from the moment that you existed, that you were created on this bird, on this earth, you will. were a boy or a girl, and that is permanent. Now, there are people that might feel that they're not boys or girls, but everyone is a combination of male and female. Everyone is an interesting mosaic, but we do not change our bodies. We do not damage our bodies because we may feel that we have some elements that are more masculine or feminine. And furthermore, I want parents to tell their kids,

and to believe it themselves, that there are many different ways of being boys and being men. And there are different ways of being girls and women. There isn't just one way. And not every boy loves football and climbing trees and building things. There are boys that like fashion and dancing. And there are girls that like more masculine things. These stereotypes, you know, we, there was a time when we were trying to,

to throw those stereotypes out the window when I was younger. We tried to smash those stereotypes. And now gender ideology is back in force, telling kids, telling boys, oh, well, if you think you're more feminine and you fit in better with the girls and you don't like rough and tumble play and you're more interested in what the girls are talking about, well, maybe you are a girl. What a terrible, terrible thing to tell a child. But parents can fight, they have to reach their child first. That's what they need to do. So that when the kid begins to hear, for example, when the kid hears sex assigned at birth, boy, do I hate that phrase. Yeah. Nothing's assigned.

Nothing's assigned in the delivery room. In the delivery room, something, it's recognized. It is not assigned. When you use the word assigned, you lead kids to think that it's random and that it could have been a mistake and that they could be mistakes. You know, when I look at this, you know, I think about, and not to wax religious,

but it feels like we are, this is the ultimate end of an atheistic society, which is there's no longer a creator, There's nothing that creates us. There's nothing that has a greater power than us. But it's not that there's no God. It's really doctors acting like God. Doctors now want that ultimate decision, which is you and I, let's have a conference

and we're going to decide what sex you are. We're going to decide what life you have. And I feel like these doctors involved in this really see themselves as the deciding factor with this child versus that there's some larger force at work. Is there a spiritual issue going on here or a religious one or however you look at it? You did say Judeo-Christian society is really in trouble. It does feel that some of this is an attack not just on our children and our sexuality, but on our spiritual perspective of ourselves.

Well, you know, again, my book is focused on helping parents, and I'm focused on families and on the kids. However, there are, there are, you know, very competent, brilliant people out there that are looking at all this from a different vantage point from sort of like a, from 30,000 feet from that perspective in terms of where this is coming from, also the money trail. I would mention someone by the name of Jennifer Belak. She has a blog called 11th Hour, and she has done brilliant research on this issue.

Just to briefly summarize, she explains that there's a movement called the Transhumanism Movement, which is behind and funding much of the transgender ideology, the promotion of the ideology, the medical centers, the clinics. So these are individuals, some of whom are transgender themselves and very wealthy. And they have this idea that we're going to transcend what it means to be human. It's going to be a redesigning of humanity 2.0. And a part of that redesigning is disembodiment so that it's a separation out of the body. and transgenderism certainly promotes disembodiment.

We're teaching kids that their bodies don't matter. They can be in control of or they can make decisions to alter their bodies permanently, and they're being led to believe they're not going to pay a big price for that and that it's no big deal. And they do believe it's no big deal, by the way. I'm going to ask you just one more just curiosity question. I have a million we'll have to do this again sometime because it's all really very fascinating. I'm sure you've seen a lot.

But I ask this question, if children are being challenged with you may be in the wrong body and what are you thinking about yourself at a very young age, I wonder if will we have gay men and gay women in the future? Because it seems like now, if they express

that there's an attraction there or something like that, because I know you said it wasn't about attraction, but won't they then be sort of guy to change their body parts and are we going to see the end of gay as we know it and everything will be trans changing their bodies? Is that possible? Okay, well, I, you know, I'm going to go back and maybe make an addendum to something that I said before. And that is that, yes, there is an element here of homosexuality or same-sex attraction that kids and teenagers may experience. And because they aren't comfortable with that

or they are worried about how people may respond, they may think, oh, well, this is easier. I'll just, instead of being a girl attracted to girls, I'll just transition to a boy and then I'll be a heterosexual attracted to girls. And that's more acceptable. So that element. The other element is Yes, definitely. You know, there's many voices in the gay and lesbian communities that are objecting to the medical interventions with these kids because they're saying exactly what you just said. This is just doing away with people that are going to end up gay and lesbian. And, you know, they're saying if I was younger, if I was a teenager now, I definitely, you know, my pediatrician. or my guidance counselor or whoever would be saying to me,

oh, you're really not a boy or girl. You're actually the opposite sex and you should look into this. And so, yeah, they, for sure, they are arguing and they are passionate about these arguments, as you can imagine, as they should be, that an entire population of gay and lesbian kids are now being, are going through these medical procedures that you see, you see, I didn't have a chance really

to explain that these medical interventions are actually interfering with their sexual development. Yeah. So that many of these kids, if they're put on blockers and cross-sex hormones at an early age, they are never going to develop normal genitalia and normal sexual response. Right. So it is creating a generation of, of, of, of, asexual, infer, sterilized young people. I think that's horrific too. And I agree. It's essentially castrating our children. And I know that there's some people in that

transhumanism space that think that that's on purpose. It is Orwellian. And, you know, we think of brave new world and sexuality is the, was always the conversation. You know, more and more, a society that's asexual can be controlled in many ways. I know we've taken a lot of time with you. It's all very interesting. I think what's important, what we try to promote on the high wire is an ability to have the conversations, that a lot of the problems in this world is we've stopped talking about these difficult issues because they can create conflict that we don't want conflict.

And so the world is just running away from us. Is there a way in which you can recommend that we language this conversation so that we cannot trigger people but can have a conversation? Is there a way? Do you think we should be talking about this with our loved ones at dinner tables and Thanksgiving tables? Because it certainly is affecting our children. It's affecting our society. But I think so many people sit quietly going, oh, you know, you know, a palm-pom cheering you on, Dr. Grossman, saying, thank God somebody's saying it,

but you must feel really lonely out there because not a lot of people are. How do we inspire people to have this conversation? How should that conversation sound? Well, if people are not inspired to say something about these atrocities, I really can't help them. There are atrocities going on. I'm getting emails from mothers saying my 18-year-old is going to have her. breasts removed next week. I have a patient who's been castrated and his penis turned into a, what he was promised would be a vagina. And now he has no penis or vagina. So, you know, if people are not

motivated to say something about this and to fight it, and they're worried about triggering other people by bringing it up and and fighting it. I mean, I provide in my book all the ammunition that you need. I wrote this book as a medical doctor. You know, this is medicine and psychiatry that I use. And there's about 40 pages of references in the back. So, you know, this is a guide for parents. But it's also, you know, I also provide conversations in there that parents can have with, other people, therapists, doctors, and relatives about this issue in which it's just laid out. The arguments are laid out. We didn't get a chance to talk about the myth of suicide that we're told about.

But I'm trying to just focus on answering your question. People better start speaking out. They better start speaking out. And if you're worried about being triggered, you know, triggering other people, at this point, I just don't know what to tell you. I mean, you're going to be, you're worried, you know, during World War II when people were being placed in ovens, you're afraid to trigger people by bringing it up? Is that where we're at right now?

Dr. Grossman, I love your passion. You fit in very well here at the High Wire. This audience is used to me being very passionate. I think this is an incredibly important issue. And there's only so sensitive you can be about it when our children are hanging in the balance. I want to thank you for writing the book. I want to thank you for taking the time. I want to thank you for your courage to step up

and really speak the truth out there. It's so needed. And I think that we're just, we were becoming such a nation of scared people, afraid of our own voices and our own words. And we're losing our ability to lead the world. And I think that we do have to have a reckoning. We have to be brave and say what we think.

Well, thanks so much for having me. And the book, I want to warn people, though, if they do want to buy it, which I hope they do, is that there's a lot of bogus books on Amazon that are trying to trick people into buying the wrong book. So the best way to buy the book is to either do it through my website, which will take you to the correct place on Amazon instead of one of those bogus books. So that's Miriam Grossmanmd.com. And I'm also on Twitter. There's a link right at the top there to Amazon. Miriam underscore Grossman.

I hope people will follow me. I hope people will speak up. It's very dark. And the more people that speak up, the more better chance we have of getting out of this darkness. I agree. Thank you for your time. And I look forward to having you on again.

There's a lot more to this topic. So hopefully we'll be able to get into some of those other details in the future. I really appreciate it. Thank you so much. All right. Take care.