The Highwire with Del Bigtree - THE FOOD BABE’S NEXT BIG BATTLE

Episode Date: October 17, 2024

Founder of Food Babe & Truvani, Vani Hari, joins Del in the wake of her powerful testimony at Senator Ron Johnson’s roundtable discussion on health. They discuss what started her passion for uncovering dangerous chemicals in everyday foods that led to her becoming a leading activist against America’s food industry. Hear how you can get involved in her fight against Kelloggs to remove harmful food dyes and BHT from kids cereals.Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/the-highwire-with-del-bigtree--3620606/support.

I think we're one of the only, you know, news institutions that actually does something about it. But actually, my next guest, I think, falls exactly into that category. It's really easy to bitch about the problems of the world and point out how, you know, it's all a disaster and how you do it better if you had a chance. But it actually takes some ingenuity to figure out how to have a voice to inspire people to want to make a difference. but then figuring out how do you talk to the corporations you're trying to change instead of just insulting them and putting them on the defense, there's the way to actually just convince them they'd be better off making the change. That is what makes this next guest really one of a kind.

Of course, I'm talking about Vanie Hari, the Food Babe. You probably know who she is, but if you don't, take a look at this. We have my good friend Bonnie Horry in the house. She's the food babe, Vanie Harry. Bonnie Hari, known as the Food Babe. The Food Babe herself, Bonnie Hari is here. Here's Vonnie Harry, the Food Bays. Bonnie Hary joins me now to talk about her efforts.

She calls herself Food Babe. She's an activist blogger who's blowing the whistle on a major food chain. I grew up like most people on the standard American diet, eating all of the junk food, all the processed foods, all the fast food, and it really affected my health. When I started to clean up my diet, all of my ailments, all of my health ailments, banished.

I started Food Babe out of passion of telling the people around me what's really in their food. And they wanted to know my friends and my family wanted to know what I did to transform my health. I wrote a blog post called Chick-fil-A or Chemical Filet, and it got so viral that I think Chick-fil-A took notice. And shortly thereafter, Chick-fil-A reached out to me and invited me to their headquarters to talk about these ingredients and see where the consumer's heads were as far as it brought. improvements they could make. Back in 2012, I did a thorough investigation of subway ingredients because I wanted to really know if we were eating fresh.

And what I found out was horrifying. Kraft has not responded to any of my emails. I've even tweeted to their executives. I've left them voicemails. And all I want to do is sit down and talk with them. And I'm hoping being at their front door, at least they can do is let me in. I hope to meet with someone from Kraft today to discuss removing these controversial dyes from mac and cheese products.

Well, when the own FDA admits publicly that they're not capable of regulating the chemicals that have been added to our food supply, that they don't even know the amount the American people are consuming, it's not a regulation or an agency that we can trust. The FDA is asleep at the wheel, and the food companies are using the lack of regulation to their advantage. But now there's a significant wave of public awareness spreading about this corruption, and more people are asking for change. We deserve the same safer ingredients. other countries get. We cannot allow our own American companies to treat us this way anymore.

We have had enough. It's unethical and it needs to stop. Thank you very much. She's a New York Times bestseller. She's also an absolute warrior. It's my honor and pleasure to be joined me, Vani Hari. Bonnie, you know, first of all, what you do is amazing. But most importantly, your success at really moving companies in the right direction. That takes a special type of energy. But before we really get into that, what got you started in this sort of food crisis that's happening in America? It was my own health. For most of my life, Dell, I had been walking around like a zombie. I was on nine prescription drugs by my early 20s. I had two different surgeries, I hit rock bottom and it was recovering from an appendectomy that finally woke me up.

The doctors all around me told me, you know, you don't need your appendix. This is just an extra organ. It's something you don't need. It's easy to take out. I mean, these were the things I've been told in the operating room when it was about to burst. And something just didn't make sense. Like how does an organ just suddenly fail you in your body in your 20s? And why do you have an organ that you don't need?

Like things just weren't making sense to me. And I started to use my own common sense and my own research ability that I learned in high school where I was a top tier debater. I was recruited to go to college and debate. I was number one in the state three years in a row. And back then we didn't have Googles. We actually had to go to library research, check out huge journals and books and look through microfiche. And I used the same skills to investigate my health. and I found out actually your appendix is actually a useful organ.

It's populated your blood with good bacteria. And when it becomes inflamed, it's because your body has become inflamed by the food that you have been eating. And when I figured that out, every light bulb in my head went off. And I started to just learn as much as I could about the food industry, what I've been eating, all the chemical labels that were on the back of the packages of my favorite foods. including all the different fast food that I relied on thinking it was healthier than the mainstream fast food. And I started to tell people around me the truth about what I was finding out. And when I was having these everyday conversations with coworkers, with friends and family, they were shocked.

They couldn't believe the stuff that they were hearing. And they begged me to start a blog. And that's when Food Babe was born. I wanted to call it eat healthy, live forever.com. and my husband, who's the technique in the family, thought that was a terrible name and nobody would remember it. And he found who paid $10 on auction a few minutes later, registered the name.

And I hid really behind that name for a year and a half before I finally quit my day job. I was working as a consultant for C-level executives at big banks. So I've worked at all the big banks, working at these high-level jobs, doing this really important, work but for some reason I found myself at work daydreaming about the next blog post I wanted to read or to write rather and the next company I wanted to investigate especially after food companies started to respond to my writings because I started to have a start I you know the people started reading the blog in a way that I never thought was possible I really thought it was just going to be

like my mom my couple friends I didn't know it was going to grow into this movement of people that not only care about their own health, but they cared enough to actually share the information with other people and then demand change from these companies. It's really amazing because, like I said, a lot of journalists, bloggers, writers sort of ostracize industry, but it doesn't really go anywhere. What is it, what's sort of your secret sauce? because even we're going to get into your, you know, your newest battle. But one of the things you were saying to me is I don't want to make them angry, Del. I'm not, I want them to let me in the door, which is something I haven't heard from a lot of people.

So how is it you do that? Like how do you, how should we see? Because I think we're so used to seeing everything is our enemy. Do you look at these giant corporations you're up against as your enemy? Or how do you picture it so that you can do this work? I really try to let companies know that, first of all, the public will rally behind them. They will celebrate these changes, especially when you look at what's happening in the food supply, where we have American companies selling one set of ingredients here and another one overseas.

Yeah. The one overseas has safer, better ingredients, and the one here in the United States has more toxic ingredients. And these are for the exact same products that they're selling. These aren't like new versions of the product or new product inventions. This is like fruit loops here and fruit loops over there. And it's really disheartening when you see this black and white ingredient label and you notice the differences in how an American company can choose to serve their own American citizens less safe ingredients.

In Europe, about 20 years ago, they started requiring a warning label on products that says may cause adverse effects on activity and attention in children when a manufacturer used an artificial dye. These companies didn't want to put the warning label on their products. So they voluntarily removed all of the petroleum artificial food dives that are linked to hyperactivity in children, autoimmune disorders, allergens. They are linked to cancer in rat studies. So they removed all of that and chose to use real. ingredients like paprika, turmeric, carrot juice, watermelon juice, blueberry juice. And they know that their product causes harm because they voluntarily removed those chemicals. So they're liable for this

information. They know they've been hurting American children for 20 years now since they found this information out in the South Hampton study that was so groundbreaking in Europe. And they choose to keep doing this. And I feel like everyone should say that they've had enough. I mean, the fact that we allow our own American companies to do this to us is insane. And anybody trying to argue this, I don't see an argument on the other side. They already do it. They already have to reinvent the wheel. It's not like we're asking them to do something hard. This is literally just serving us the same ingredients they see. serve other countries. I mean, fruit loops sold in Europe, in Australia, in Canada, in India,

even, have better ingredients than their own American children. Well, we have you. I remember we're at the Senator Ron Johnson hearings. I think it's just two weeks ago now. You made that point. I believe we've got that on tape. So let's take a look at this. This box of fruit loops is from Canada. It's colored naturally with watermelon, blueberry, and carrot juice. This is the U.S. version. It contains four different artificial food dyes with the preservative BHT, which is an endocrine disrupting chemical linked in cancer to cancer. Consumption of artificial food dyes has increased by 500 percent in the last 50 years, and children are the biggest consumers. Forty-three percent of products marketed towards children in the grocery store contain artificial dyes. Food companies have

found in focus groups, children will eat more of their product with an artificial dye because it's more attractive and appealing. You know, I had a kid I was working with. He was mentoring him on a video team that I was using for a production company, and I would watch him drink like six Red Bulls. He would do, you know, a day and drink double shots of espresso, and he was always taking Ridland, you know, and I said, you know, I'm curious when your parents took you to the doctor, for I'm assuming having ADD or something,

did the doctor ask you about your diet or does anyone know that you drink what appears to be about four and a half gallons of caffeine every day? He's like, no, no, no one asked me. And I would, and I think now at the work you're doing, how many kids were putting on attention deficit drugs? You know, with boys, it seems to be an attention deficit problem. With girls, their issues seems to be more depression issues. They're on drugs. We're, you know, at that hearing, we're talking about a drugged society. I mean, I think one in four kids is leaving elementary school on a drug.

They will be on the rest of the life. And most of it's for things that we could remedy. As you're pointing out, it's well known. These chemical dyes and preservatives cause attention deficit. problems and instead of a doctor I mean I mean forget about you know Kellogg's or Nabisco or any of these companies craft that you've gone up against these doctors why don't they ask why do you tell me about your diet what are you feeding your child every day how do they start their day are they starting it with oatmeal or they starting with

fruit loops just seems so obvious and this is something that was so beautiful in that Senate roundtable that you were you were a witness to Dell by doctor Dr. Casey means from Stanford, how she talked about in medical school, they don't talk about this. They don't have the nutrition research. They don't look at all the studies behind metabolic disorders. And they don't give doctors the root cause information on how to prevent a lot of these problems in children and in the American public. And it was such a courageous testimony that she gave on behalf of all of the medical professionals in the world. I believe there needs to be a revolution with doctors demanding that medical schools change and this information gets into the

curriculum there because they could literally save thousands and thousands of people. I mean, this reminds me of a time when I was at work and I was having, I had a terrible boss. He was harassing me. It was so awful. I went into my primary care doctor's office. And she, because I couldn't sleep and I was anxious to go to work, she didn't tell me, hey, Bonnie, you should think about quitting your job. You should, you know, think about maybe looking at a different career. She didn't give me any of that advice. She put me on three psychopatic drugs.

You know, she put me on a clonopin, Xanax, and Ambien, right there in the doctor's office, just wrote the prescription and gave it to me. I mean, that kind of stuff is absolutely crazy when we're not even looking at what's actually happening in someone's life. What are the environmental factors they can do, whether they quit their job or, maybe they stop eating artificial food dyes and cereal. We have to look at the root cause of a lot of these issues. Absolutely.

You've been so successful at doing that. Jen Sherry, my executive producer and I were sitting back, I was like, I'm pretty sure I worked with you when I was on the doctor's show. We started looking at images of you at CBS. So I feel like we go back further than I had remembered before. But how many companies have you gotten to change, you know, their product based on your petition so far in the work that you've done. Dozens.

And I mean, just some off the top of my head, you know, we've gotten subway to remove azodicarbodomide as well as every bread manufacturer in America. This was a chemical that you'd find in yoga mats and shoe rubber band all over the globe. You get fined $450,000 if you get caught using it in Singapore. We got Starbucks to remove a caramel color level four, which is an ammonia-based dye, linked to cancer, according to the International Agency for Research on We got them to post their ingredients for all their menu items, which they hid from the public for such a long time. We got the beer manufacturers, Anheuser-Busch and Miller Coors, to release the ingredients and beer for the first time in history.

You know, it was so funny. Every time I would open up the fridge, the one thing I didn't know the ingredients for was my husband's Newcastle beer. And I was just like, well, knowing what they had known about the food industry, I was like, they've got to be hiding something in there. And I found out all kinds of stuff the beer industry was doing. And they're putting natural flavors, caramel coloring to make the hops look darker than they should. High fructose corn syrup and corn syrup and beer. I mean, all kinds of things were being added to beer. Whereas, again, in Europe, they have a German purity law that you can only use certain ingredients to call it beer. Right.

You know, we've gotten craft to remove artificial food dyes from mac and cheese. We've gotten general mills to remove B.HT from their cereals. I mean, Chick-fil-A to remove several different chemicals from their entire menu items, including artificial dyes and TBHQ. They went antibiotic-free for a long time, and they just actually went back on their promise this year, which was so sad. Oh, no. Yes, yes, they did, and they cited problems in the supply chain,

and it's just a really sad thing that happened. But it just goes to show you, there's got to be somebody holding these companies. accountable. Where are the people in Washington? Where are elected politicians? Where are the other activists that are actually holding these companies accountable? Yes, there could be regulation changes and all of that. But I feel like if we go directly to the companies that are making these products and we target them, they will change. I have shown it over and over again. And that's why I chose Kellogg's because they are targeting little children, the most vulnerable of children, with new products like Baby Shark and Disney's Little Mermaid.

Their latest product they just released yesterday is Squishmallows made after a stuffed animal that all these kids of the day love. They're making a cereal about that. And it's crazy that they would have gotten all the positive press back in 2015 for removing these dyes and BHT and then decided not to do it. And so they got all the wonderful press and all the... the people wrote about it and then they never did it like like like hold on hold on a second so you're saying i know europe you know that for kellogg's changed fruit loops they're using but you know real vegetables

and fruit dyes um and that was being celebrated but are you saying that kellogs was even planning on changing the products here in america and were so the articles came out saying they were going to do it And they, and they, go ahead. Yes, in 2015, the media went crazy and wrote about it everywhere. And I have all of the documentation on foodbabe.com if anybody wants to see the headlines. And then they said they would do it by 2018. And then they never did. And that's when I started my position because I was like, wait a minute, what are you doing?

And then you're creating all these new cereals. Wait a minute, at least create the new cereals without artificial dies. Like, I don't understand. Like, okay, you can't change fruit loops. but like, what are you doing over here? So not only did they lie to us, but they got all the positive press, which is like one of the most sinister things a company can do.

And then you think there would be someone in the government or in legal or somewhere would like, could sue them or do something to hold them accountable, but I've been trying to figure out how to do this. And the only way that I knew how to do anything was just public pressure in a petition. And then this year we had renewed focus because Jason, carp from Human Co, the founder of Hugh Kitchen and a bunch of other really great for you food

brands. Yeah. Became a Kellogg's shareholder and sent them an activist letter using one of the most powerful lawyers in the United States, Elon Musk's lawyer, Alex Spiro, and said, hey, as a shareholder, you need to do this. This is really important. This is about children. You will be celebrated as a company doing the right thing. You'll be on the right side of history. And they, started to go down the path of having a conversation with Jason and they wanted to bring in lobbyists from the Consumer Brands Association and they basically shut him down from inviting any doctors on his side or anybody else they really just wanted to railroad him in a meeting and you know what he wasn't going to do

that um but they eventually decided after he said hey well if you're going to bring two people can i bring two people right they said no we're not going to have the meeting and they shut it down and so that At that point, I knew something else had to be done. And Callie Means, who's just an incredible person, as you interviewed just last week, he has the ability to bring people together in a way that I've never seen in terms of, you know, getting the right people in the right rooms and everything. And if he ends up being, you know, in this next government or in the FDA or in charge of anything to do with food or health, man, watch the heads roll.

because he is a unpowerful cookie. But he got involved in this fight with me. And it's just been so cool because he's like, hey, Bonnie, come to the Senate. Let's talk about this. And I'm like, hell, yeah, I'm coming. And it was just this beautiful moment. And I just want to thank Senator Ron Johnson too

for allowing us to have an unfiltered say on what's happening in the food system. Nobody tried to stop my testimony, right? And say, oh, you can't say this, say that or you can't bring up this chemical and all causing cancer and all this other stuff like they're like go for it this is your floor and it was such a beautiful moment that i have never witnessed in the history of any kind of food activism at that level that we were able to do for four hours straight not one partisan party talking point it was all about saving humanity it was so beautiful and it's just

it's been so awesome because it's just completely electrified the conversation on the web and everywhere. And I have been receiving so many positive messages from mothers and fathers and concerned citizens everywhere that they're going to join this fight with me. And it feels so good to finally feel like we have like our movement going in a direction that is just unstoppable. And we're going to be doing this, you know, on October 15th. All right.

So let's talk about that. I mean, you're absolutely right. What is so exciting. I mean, you have been at this for years. you have been accomplishing things, you know, that people say one person can't do it. Actually, one passionate person can inspire enough people to make change, you've been doing that. But it really must feel like the cavalry has arrived. I feel the same way.

I think so many of us, you know, when I was interviewing Cali Meagis just last week, I was like, what happened? I mean, I saw you on Tucker Carlson. But just, you know, so many people have been laying out this evidence. I wouldn't say Casey Means is saying anything differently than you. you were, but I just feel like maybe it was COVID. There's things around that, but people are suddenly paying attention, which means the next person that gets up and says it, this thing's going to explode and it's happened. I mean, we really do have a movement now across this nation of people are saying, hold on a second. So you're using that momentum now to really try and bring this change

with Kellogg's Fruit Loops, as your example, the two different, you know, cereals, you know, being used in Europe and here. So October, what's the date? Because you want people to show up for this, right? So tell me what's happening. That's right. So we are going to be going to Kellogg's headquarters at 10.30 a.m. We're meeting at Friendship Park. We're going to hold Kellogg's accountable, not only for fruit loops, but for every single cereal that they make with artificial food dyes. We're asking them to remove artificial food dyes and B.HT. BHT is an endocrine disrupting chemical. And this is something that isn't over 40 of their cereals. This is something that causes cancer, promotes tumors, lung tumors, and it is affecting fertility, all kinds of different issues

with VHT. And this is something that they line the packages of cereal with as a preservative. So it's merely there for to make the food companies more money so they can leave the product longer on the shelf. But they don't use this camel again overseas. So we're going to be removing artificial food dies and BHT from Kellogg cereals. I guarantee they're going to have to change this. This is going to be unfortunately a big public shaming. I have reached out to the CEO of Kellogg several times at this point. I sent him a letter a week ago after I got back from the Senate and I said, hey, I'm coming. I'd like a meeting with you. I'm going to be sitting down. Callie and Jason Carp are going to be with me. What would you like to do? Let's sit down and maybe schedule a meeting.

It was Crickets. So we're going to the headquarters now with a very. massive grassroots movement. I've got hundreds of people already RSVP. I've got 10 different health leaders across the nation coming with me. They've already signed up and more people are constantly texting and calling me and sending me direct messages. How can I get involved? What can I do? I have the A-list actresses in Hollywood texting me too going, what can I do? I don't like politics. I don't want to get involved in politics, but what can I do with this? And I'm like, this is not a political issue. This is about humanity. This is our children. Cancer doesn't know whether you're Democrat or Republican. This is something that everybody can get involved in. And I am inviting all your viewership,

Dell. I know you guys are going to be there. Yeah, we're going to be streaming it live, by the way. So anyone that can't make it, we're going to stream it live on the high wire. So everyone can be there. And for those people that decide maybe to not show up, I hope we, I mean, bodies matter. You know, we were, you know, the events, it really matters. is when we pack these rooms, when we pack these parks, when we're showing them we're present to account for. But for people staying at home, they can sign your petition, right? How do they go about doing that?

Tell me about that. You can just go to foodbabe.com. It's right there on the homepage. You can sign the petition. You can also call the headquarters, the day that we're going on October 15th, and demand they sit down with us, demand that they have a meeting with us,

because they should receive these hundreds of thousands of voices, and they need to hear the stories of mothers that have been impacted by removing artificial food dyes from their children's diets. And what a big impact it would make for American children everywhere. All right. Give me the camera here for a second. Let me just talk to all of you out there. I want Vani Hari to call me in about three or four days after this week and say, I don't know what it is with your audience.

But we had so many people signed that petition. It was insane. At least do that. At least do that right now. Please go to foodbabe.com slash, is it, Baby Shark and get in their color. We have artificial food dyes and VHT from your cereals. You can find it, obviously, if you just go to foodbabe.com. Sign this petition.

You don't have to write a novel if you don't want to. Just say, hey, this is United States of America. Why would an American company be poisoning us more than you are in other countries? Why are there two different products? Go ahead and harmonize and go with the safer product for everybody. That's the statement. It does make a difference. every single one of those signatures makes a difference.

This is something you can actually do and feel good about. And then, you know, let's join you out there in person and online and make this an incredible event. You're such a powerhouse, Bonnie. I really, it's just an honor to know you to watch you through the years, just showing what, you know, what passion and someone that decides to make a difference, the difference he can actually make. It's really inspiring. Thank you, Del.

I really appreciate, and I feel the same way about you. You should be earning medals for the reporting that you've done over the years, especially during COVID. Thank you very much. Well, look, we're going to be there in support. We're going to be streaming live on the high wire as you make the trip over to Kellogg's. Hopefully they open that door, receive your petition and do what's right. This is how we do it.

But the pressure, the moment, you all right, this is a time to be very excited in the United States of America. because we're waking up and we're taking our power back. And it's great seeing you in the front of that line. Thank you so much, Del. All right, good luck. We'll see you very soon. Take care.