The Hockey PDOcast - Adjusting Your Game Over the Years, Sticking With the Process When the Results Aren’t Coming, and the Toughest Teams To Play Against

Episode Date: January 21, 2026

Dimitri Filipovic is joined by Brenden Dillon and Thomas Drance to talk about the first 50 games for the Devils, how he's adjusted his game over the years to make it to 1000 games in the NHL, the challenges of not having a consistent defense partner and how your approach changes in those situations, sticking with the process when the results aren't going your way, and the toughest teams they've played so far this season. If you'd like to gain access to the two extra shows we're doing each week this season, you can subscribe to our Patreon page here: www.patreon.com/thehockeypdocast/membership If you'd like to participate in the conversation and join the community we're building over on Discord, you can do so by signing up for the Hockey PDOcast's server here: https://discord.gg/a2QGRpJc84 The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Media Inc. or any affiliate.

dressing to the mean since 2015. It's the Hockey PEDEOCast with your host, Dmitri Filippovich. Welcome to the Hockey PEDEOCast. My name is Dmitri Filippovich and joining me here in studio, fresh off of 44 plus minutes and a back-to-back, a couple victories in Alberta. Joining us for the trilogy of PEDYO-Cast appearances, his third, getting him in a rarefied air here,

my good buddy, Brendan Dillon, what's going on in? It is good to be back. Good to be back on the road, a couple days in Vancouver to, you know, enjoy. couple wins before right back on the right back in the wagon i'm excited to have you on i mean obviously it's always wonderful whenever you come in studio here to chat but i feel like this is a bit of a different dynamic for us because the past two times it's been in the middle of summer you know you're you're doing your offseason program you're trading you're getting in the best shape of your life but now

low anxiety low anxiety now in the midst of the season uh you guys are 50 games in i'm i'm excited to pick your brain on some stuff uh in terms of how this season's gone some of the stuff we're seeing around the league in general, and we're going to have a really fun conversation. I thought this would be a good place to start, especially fitting for what's been going on with the Devils and especially your Blue Line Corps this season. I feel like one of the challenges for you guys, and this isn't necessarily unique to just the Devils. It feels like generally around the league there's more injuries than ever before.

I don't know how much of it is the condensed schedule, how much of it is the physical demands of playing in the NHL in 2026, how much of it is randomness. But more times than I can remember in recent history, I tune into a game and two or three key players are out of action for any given team on any single night. But in particular for you guys Blue Line, right, where I believe you and Jonas Seganthalor are the only two guys on the D-Corps that have played all 50 games. Yeah, I'll knock on some wood here. Yes, yeah, I don't want to jinx it.

No, no. Hey, hey, hey, hey, it's honestly, as you said, it's been crazy when you're looking at the rosters of four games and the certain lineups. And, you know, as you mentioned, we of course saw right from training camp, Florida, you know, losing their big dogs. But for us, I can only imagine as a GM or a coach, right, you look at your roster going in the season and training camp goes well. And you're like, okay, here's how everybody slots in.

And then next thing you know, it's off your answer. Look at that jacket. There we go. Some of the listeners, our pal Thomas Dranz, is storming into the studio here. A couple minutes late. Devils were into town, so there's high traffic. Yeah. Understandable.

Yeah. We had to have them on. Listen, Tom's always on on Sundays. So I don't want to confuse the listeners doing our Sunday special here on a Wednesday, but we had to get them in. Well, and in classic Brendan Dillon and me fashion, you're wearing Grizzly's gear, I'm wearing Grizzly's gear, we're killing it.

Obviously. We would be a heck of a deacon. Yeah. It would be a bit much to match my coat with your hat for the audio listener. It's a very sick hat. It wasn't planned just so that everybody got. Yeah, it never is. Well, thanks for joining us.

Thanks for accommodating me, gentlemen. Yeah. For my lateness, for my storming in here abruptly. But yeah, I'll let you get back to it and weasel my way into the conversation. We're just talking, talking injuries and the devil's, back in Brett Pesci, it was seven weeks. Well, I feel like you guys started,

like the first, whatever, it was the first nine games, right? You guys were settled into a really nice groove. You had Pesci playing with Lou Cues. We were settled in nicely at 8-1, too. Life was good. You were. Life was good.

It was exactly what I expected in terms of heading into the season from like a defensive environment, this pace you guys were playing with, some of that suffocating sort of defensive pressure up the ice. A lot of the hallmarks from when you guys were healthy

in the previous couple of seasons. And then Pesci goes out. and misses an extended period of time, rotating cast now and most recently, Luke Hughes as well, kind of throwing the pairs Nemitz was out for a blender. He was.

Dougie missed a couple games. Kovicevich obviously missed the first 45 games of the season before coming back. I was going through your game logs and you've played 763-5-15 minutes. 254 with Luke Hughes. 180 with Nemitz. 150 with Golden White.

70 with Dougie. 44 with Jonas Siegenthaler. 28 with Pesci, 25 with Shalowski, and 12 with Seamus Casey. You've pretty much played with every single defenseman on the team out of the 10 guys. You've used so far. Yeah. And this is what I'm curious about picking your brain about. We know that like the rhythm of establishing a defense pair in terms of getting those reps together,

where you're almost working as one brain in a way where like you know the, you know the tendencies, you know where your partner wants the puck, you know how he's going to play a certain situation. you don't have to think about it. You can almost close your eyes and know exactly where he's going to be at any given time. You obviously throw that out the window

when you're playing with these guys. Now most recently, in Edmonton last night, you're playing with Dougie Hamilton again. It's fortunate that you got as many reps as you did with them last year where I think you played 700 plus minutes together. But all these guys are going to have a different requirement for you as their partner.

How does that kind of work in terms of that lack of continuity and sort of for your processing on ice and decision-making process, how you go into that, if you're playing with someone you compared to the previous night in terms of like what's going to be asked upon you to do when you're out there. It really has you just laid out there.

Like it, for me this season, it's, it's been just, you know, left side, right side, you know, high-end riverboat gambler, defensive, stay back, whatever my partner, you know, consists of, you know, I'm kind of the, like a Swiss Army knife in that sense. And I feel like for most of my career, it's kind of been like, okay, hey, you know, you're going to play with the young guy that's got lots of skill that, you know, you're going to have to take a couple extra two-on-ones, or sometimes it's been like, hey,

you're going to play with this defensive guy, and all I want you to do, you don't have to cross the red line tonight, let's just shut this down. For me, I try to pride myself on that, you know, being able to kind of almost be a, you know, be a chameleon and fit in whatever ways needed, and I didn't realize that that's, that's as many guys. I was thinking to myself the day when I was like, yeah, you'll play with Dougie tonight. I was like, oh yeah, okay, you know, I feel like I've played with everybody almost at this point in time. And it's... If they could put you with Brennan Dillon as your Yeah, you know, I'd at least know what that guy was going to do. You know, I think when you

look around the league, can you trust them now? You know what? I know she's going to be physical, hard to play against, to move pucks to his partner. So I don't know, I'd be passing myself a lot. But when you look at a lot of the, whether it's sometimes forward lines, or, you know, the two guys will be rocks all together, and then it'll switch in the winger, you know, McCar and Taves, um, I know when it was here at Hughes and Veronica.

Um, like a lot of times. J.J. Mozer and Darren Radish. That's a nice pair. That's a real nice pair. And you know what? I don't even know if they're getting, they should be even getting more credibility with how good they're.

Oh, they are here on the BDO against us. Yeah. On the West Coast, you know, they're, they're big fan. I mean, it is nice when you get to know that, I mean, I know when I was in San Jose, which I was with Carlson for two years and, like, I swear by, you know, three months in, you just know what the guy's going to do when he's going to a puck that's a soft dump. Like, you just know he's going to do this when it's a hard rim, when he's on the ozone blue line. I'm like, yeah, okay, it's a hard, you know, bounce off.

I'm pretty sure he's going to walk to the middle, fake shot, keep walking, and it's basically like Dilly just get out of the way. Like, you just, you start to pick up on things. Even with our guys, you know, when I was playing with Luke, like, he was playing his offside for most of it. And even for him, like, that at the NHL level, like, it's hard to play your offside. And, you know, on top of that, when you're trying to create a offense every shift. You know, there's going to be, you know, some trials and tribulations with that, you know, when you're playing with, you know, guys like Dougie, like, you know he wants the puck, you know he wants to shoot it 99% of the time. So Brennan, get him the puck. You know,

and I'm out there with Sieg's or Pash. It's like it's going to be a little bit more simple game. And, you know, maybe I have the more opportunity to join the play and be that. But, yeah, whatever's needed, you know, that sets my job and, you know, keep your call. When you're playing with a guy like Dougie, as you said, like you kind of, he's been in the league for a long time, you know what he's good at in terms of where he's going to want the puck, what he's going to do with it, trying to create offensively.

Does that make it more complicated for you as his partner in terms of like knowing that you're going to have to do something very specific to get it to him there so that he can thrive? Or do you prefer playing with a guy who's more simplified, as you were saying, like let's say a Jonas Seagintel for example, where like, you know, you're sort of, you know, route tree is going to be. very condensed of like, all right, I do this one thing.

Yeah. And it's good. And it's maybe like a lower leverage play, especially like in an offensive zone where you got to go D to D or whatever to set him up for that point shot. Like, what does that look like? You know what I love, you know, I really enjoy both. It's kind of like the in-between vanilla where it's like, you know, a guy tries to be offensive, but he's not really not.

Or he tries to be simple, but he's not really not. Like I like when I know when I'm playing with the offensive guy. Like when I'm with Dougie, I know he wants the puck. I know he wants to join. You know, I know when the puck comes low to high, like I can almost start kind of collapsing into the zone for that rebound or whatever it is. And at the same time with the defense of, you know, Seganthal or Pesci, it's like, I know those reads even more so too. Like I know, like I'm almost kind of in their head.

They're kind of in my head. Like I, we think the game the same way. So, you know, on a time when it's going to be chipped out of the zone defensively, you know, I can kind of start to get into that open ice. Or if I know we're going to slow it down and wait for the change. Like there's just, I feel like learning. those tendencies of the defensive guys versus the offensive guys. I enjoy the offensive side because when it comes off the, you know, when we come off of a shift and we're sitting there on the bench,

I'm kind of like, you know, whether it's talking to Luke or Dougie or Nemo and I'm, you know, they make a play and I'm kind of like, geez, like, I didn't even see that, you know, and they're kind of like, yeah, you know, this is what I saw and I'm like, wow. And then you kind of get the nerd of the game. And then now, you know, you're like, oh, I got to shift another in 30 seconds. So I probably got a tone back in. But it's, it's really cool. And for me, I like, I just love talking hockey.

So when these guys do some of these really just unique and cool plays on the ice and I'm part of it, I'm kind of, wow, I didn't even expect that passing while I was right on my tape and now I'm in a great spot. So that's why I enjoy, I do enjoy both sides, but I'd say, you know, playing with these high-end

offensive guys is special. Brendan, when the Canucks rolled through the New York area in December, I saw you play live and, you know, that game. Absolutely not. Absolutely not. No, no, no, because you actually had a shift in that game that was one of my favorite defensive defender shifts I've seen live all season. And I don't know if you'll remember this, but you had the puck high, like high left side point. And you were one-on-one

with a checker who'd broken his stick. Do you remember this? Okay, and high, do you remember? And you just ragged the puck and ragged the puck and just like waited and waited like a preposterous amount of time until finally one of your forwards got open for like a quick outlet. You made the quick outlet, and then you immediately changed. But the entire sequence took like 25 minutes. And then I think Nemo replaces you, right? And it's just like, I was just watching that and I was like, that's exactly what I want.

Every defensive defender to do in that situation because it was a preposterous amount of time before one of your forwards sprang open for the outlet at the half wall. Like it was a wild amount of time where you were just dragging the bottom. Usually, I'm actually surprised I didn't just go to the net front because if it's like a delayed penalty or something

or if it's one of those situations, where I'm like, oh, geez, wow, look, this is, like, I got kind of comfy cozy. It's like either I'm the big man, I'm either going to the net to try and create chaos or in that sense get one of the guys to hopefully score a goal out there. And since we last talk to you, I mean, congratulations because you played a thousand games, which is an unbelievable accomplishment for an undrafted defense-first defender. I mean, truly, congrats here on a short list of guys from the lower mainland who've played, and a lot of them are like Glenn Anderson and Joe Sackick, you know.

What are we at, like, a thousand and 24 combined games in this room right now between the three of us? Yeah, oh yeah, that's not too bad. It's not too shabby at all. Look at us. Yeah, I know. There's a reason people are listening to talk hockey. I'm not special here. We're probably some specialist tripod, yeah.

And I'm just curious to, like, sort of situate that shift I saw with the milestone itself, right? And honestly, too, the conversation that you've been having with Dimitri about complimenting different guys, right? Yeah. There's an extent to which you've overcome preposterous odds. And yet also. so much of your success is based off of a level of self-awareness and an understanding of how to fit and complement different guys, Eric Carlson-type freak shows, right?

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I'm just curious to sort of understand how you think about how your longevity has been impacted by that level of on-ice awareness. Yeah, I think kind of being able to read a room was something that at a young age I kind of had to figure out, You know, with those junior coming into pro, like, you know, my last year in Seattle,

I'm like this power play guy that's putting up points and blah, blah, and you go to the American League and you're playing the Power Play too. And, I mean, everybody wants to be that guy that throws up money and makes, you know, $9, 10 million a year. But as I got into the NHL,

I had some incredible coaches that were just kind of like, look, Dili, like, you know, there's Russians, there's Swedes, there's Finns, there's American, like you're competing with a lot of people for, you know, that offensive run the blue line, you know, we're going to rely on you to score 10, 15 goals a year.

But there's other, you know, guys can make a career doing other things. And I enjoyed the physical part of the game. I enjoyed learning about the game. I would say that's one thing with me that I forget who told me it, but I've tried to live by like, it's okay being Robin to another guy's Batman. Sure. Like, like, be okay, you know, not being the guy in the spotlight. Like be okay complimenting somebody.

be okay being someone that guys want to play with and not necessarily being, you know, the first pick over all that, whatever. And I think going to San Jose and learning from, you know, Pete DeBoer and his staff, like Bob Boogner was our de coach there. And like, I remember him just being like, look, like, you're on the third pair right now. You're playing with, you know, Roman Polack and David Schlumpko. But like, there's going to be a time when we're going to need you to play with Brent Burns or we're going to need you to play with Eric Carlson.

And like, whether that's the puck touches after practice and, you know, being able to pick off a rim off the yellow and put it right on their tape where they want it or you know if they get run you make sure that they know you've got their back and you have to fight a guy like you just need to be ready for it and I still remember when like somebody got hurt and it's like all right you're playing with Brent Burns then I was like like I'm playing with Brent Burns and sounds nice like you know this could be good like your big break whatever call it might be and things went really well and you know I kind of built some traction on that and then I've been just very fortunate between

Bernsey and Eric Carlson and go to Washblood, John Carlson, and then, you know, come and, you know, the Neil Pionks of the world who can create offense. And then now with the Lou Cues, Simone Nemich, Dougie Hamilton, like, it's just been something that, it's crazy that, you know, it's been over a thousand games now. But, like, just finding ways to impact the game. And yet, you know, every summer building on that,

working on your shot, working on all these boring things. But ultimately, that kind of just a wearing of like, hey, like, yeah, you're holding this, you're creating offense in the zone. But, like, because this guy's got a broken stick now and you can get a higher skilled guy that can create and help your team win that game, like, you know, whether the coach recognizes that

or Nemo comes on the ice recognizes that. And, you know, I don't need the guy to come up to me and dab me up. And, hey, dude, thanks for giving me that ozone ship. But, like, I'm okay with taking the D-Zone stuff and P-K and blockage. Like, I don't need that stuff. Like, I just, you know, it's,

It's for the greater good and ultimately you get that individual success too from all that other stuff. I mean, the reason why I love talking to you on these shows, I mean, there's many of them. I'm not going to get into it now. It's a long list. But something we've spoken about in your previous two appearances is sort of the off-ice work that goes into it. In particular, that evolution process are adapting along with the league around you, right? Where you come in in 2013, I believe, during that short and season, that was your first full year. And then what not only the people around the league look like, but the way.

way the game is played in 2026 now, right? And your role within that and how much thought you've put into like meticulously working on sort of the margins in your game to fit in with that and get to this point where you've played a thousand plus games. I feel like this year we're once again going to an even greater level in terms of like what teams are doing offensively, kind of trying to optimize their approach in zone and stuff like that. And I was looking at your numbers and looking back to like the Dallas, San Jose days. And then you're shot right now individually. And it's like essentially been cut in half.

And I'm not sure how much of that is obviously like playing a different role, being at a different stage of your career, how much of it is subconscious or just byproduct of an environment versus like a deliberate choice on your part. But we are seeing that with teams around the league where on the one hand, the list of responsibilities for a defenseman, even in the offensive zone, is greater than it's ever been because there's so much movement.

And you have to recognize it in. see it before it happens. But on the other, it's happening in a much different way where you're not being the trigger man necessarily just hammering from the point. You're now being asked to get it to your outlet on the half wall and forward or look for some of my favorite plays I see from defense and around the league are like either that little slick shot pass with a guy streaking into the slot looking for a tip or even that sort of diagonal where you stretch the zone and then you're looking to go from point to the opposing circle for a one-timer if the guy, if the lane's there and stuff like that is just like.

Like probably if you go back to 2013, that wasn't even part of the consideration necessarily. It was like, you get that look load of high. You put it on net, hope for a rebound and rinse repeat, do it all over again. Oh, yeah. Well, that's just it's it. Like, even I remember my first couple years, like defending was skating backwards. Like it was like you stay in the blue line, you accept the rush. You know, your back checkers come in.

And now, like, you know, probably the last four or five years, like defending, skating forwards is how it's done. Like that's how you break up plays. It's how you're able to transition. and use your feet, use your size, and, you know, these types of things. Whereas now even offensively, as you said, you know, for us, we like to try and get into that one-three-one look, like almost like a power play look at five-on-five, where you're kind of getting in the middle of the ice,

the dangerous part of the ice, you're having guys attacking downhill, you're hoping for a rebound, a tip, whatever it is. And also personnel, right, like, you know, if I'm out there with Jack's line, like there might not be a heavy net front presence, but if those guys get the puck on the outside, line between him and Brad are like, you know, they can create something out of nothing and they can really, you know, use their agility, all this. And then at the same time, if you go out there with your, you know, third or fourth line, you've got more of a net front presence, like that's just the knowledge to know who you're on the ice with and let's get puck to the net, let's simplify, create chaos, you know, Carolina Hurricanes type hockey, which works too. And for myself and who I'm playing with, right, like I, I, you know, again, if I'm out there with Dougie, like I know he wants the puck, I know he's going to create off. And so, you know, I think from my standpoint, yes, should I maybe be shooting the puck more and getting it in there? Yes.

But I also know there's a good chance of some positives happen and getting the puck, you know, into those guys' hands, too. And the ozone is the same way that me going back to break a puck out or have to get the puck in the corner or maybe more comfortable in some guys, too. I'm curious about the shot variety too, right? Because, you know, the pounded in from the point thing, I mean, I see a lot of games where I don't see a slap shot the entire night. Right. Honestly, I feel like it's a throwback when I get to see one, like someone in the NBA doing a Bob Coozy behind the back. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. What's been the conversation from, whether it's been Boogner or some of the other defensive coaches you've worked with that's sort of driven that evolution as a guy in the league? Is it about being connected as a defensive player to the puck? Like is that, is it partly a cautionary thing or is it more about sort of, you know, exploiting their traffic and. prioritizing accuracy over velocity from the point? Like, what's been driving that from the perspective of a defender? Like, I've gone down in flex.

Like, I went down this summer, actually, from 95 to 85. Like, you know, your stick, you shorten a little bit more, too. I was all worried. And then this year, I actually scored a couple goals early. I'm like, I'm like, okay, it's not changing my completely. I'm still like, we're okay, you know, it's like I didn't do. Yeah. I don't know.

Our text is back to differ. You were referring to yourself as Kel McCar. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, obviously, there's the Calgary guy, the Vancouver guy, yeah, no. But I would say, you know, a big thing, kind of when Vegas won, Vegas won the Cup, we played them, we lost them in the first round there with Winnipeg, and they had like D-Sting at the net. Like, like, their big thing was like the D-Were at the net,

the center would go around the zone, you know, whether it was side to side, and then the forwards, the wingers were up top. So getting the puck past the first layer, like, which was kind of like the goal, you know, you talk about the evolution of the game. It's like, if I get it past my winger, it's a win. Like I did my job, coach can't yell at me. Now it's like, no, you've got these two D-Men that are six, four, six-five, that are fronting the pucks and not just fronting them,

but then able to make the breakout pass, join the play, get ahead of your forwards, and now all of a sudden there's an odd man rush back, and it's kind of like you got your forwards yelling at, you get the puck through, and then you got your coach yelling too, and you're kind of like, well, I got it past the first guy, you know, past the second third. So, you know, the slap shot, you know,

I've scored a couple goals with the slap shot, and yeah, when it works out, it's great. At the same time, you know, whether you miss the net and it's an automatic breakout for the team or you hit a shin pad and ends up going back in your zone anyways. It's kind of like if you take a little bit more, whether it's patience or time to find that lane, to maybe find that stick back door,

to maybe find even that spot to put it in in the ozone to keep the forecheck going and maybe wear down that other team, I think there's just a little bit more a better chance of a positive outcome from that sense. And, you know, I've heard over the last probably a couple of years, three, four years even, like a wasted shot. You know, like you do all this work to get down to the Ozone. You do all this work to forecheck it, get it out, get it low to high. And then you just throw a puck right into the goalies glove.

And it's like face off. You got to win the face off again and get back into that pressure. So these are things that, you know, you talk 2013. It was like, just get down. They're get a shot on that. Get a rebound. Hopefully create chaos. Now there's, you know, players are so good around the league, too.

Whether you're defensive defenseman or you're, you know, a high end, you know, Austin Matthews, Jack, like, they want to create offense. Not just that, but like make sure those opportunities count. So those are things, I think, for a defenseman when it comes to shot selection, play selection, continuing on where you're at in your shift personally, too. Like, are I able to, like, if the puck does turn over, get back in my zone? There's so many different things going through your head and during the fastest game in the world that come into play. Well, yeah, and I think among this sort of changes the idea of like a more precision-based sort of offensive

approach that we're seeing from talent. And honestly, this is just me asking you to gut check my biases as a guy who's not playing on ice level. I'm just curious to get your thoughts on it. But as we get into a league where, say, percentage on average is literally in the 890s now, not 900, not 915 the way it was in 2013. Yeah. You know, it feels to me like that is largely a credit to the players individually.

I think whether it's the forwards, whether it's defensive defenders, you, Luke, the guys who are spending a lot of time thinking about area passes and how to survive as defensive defenders, too. I honestly feel like so much of what is causing the game to evolve is more based off of the incredible commitment and skill of the players individually to maximize sort of the efficiency of their touches, as opposed to what we see in some other leagues where like hand checking in basketball or the way they protect quarterbacks in football, where that opened it up. Because I don't feel like the rules have necessarily changed to disadvantage defensive players. And this is what I really wanted to get your, and favor the offensive guys. I literally feel like it's, oh, these guys are faster and slicker and are attacking goaltenders more intelligently and are managing the puck differently. Well, we just, I mean, we played, you know, Connor last night.

And, you know, like, that guy is just, it's, I guess there's no pass interference, you know, penalties. But, you know, it is hard to defend when, you know, you can't clutch and grab. and even something is similar, simple, is through the neutral zone. Like forward just getting in his way. Like making him make that one extra turn he's got over not be able to accelerate with a crossover as opposed to get out of the way.

There's things from the defensive side where like every millisecond is actually huge. Like going back for pucks, like the ability, like for a rebound, that one extra second turn and get the puck cleared out. When you think about, these high-end guys and their touches that they're getting, it really is crazy. Like every year these guys come in that are drafted,

and you see, like, Maclin-Colabini's two years in the league, and he's already arguably one of the best players in the league in the world. Like, everybody's, you know, like you said, 8-90 being the safer dissenters now, like, I don't know if goalies are getting yelled at across the league, but man-oh-man, like look at penalty kills. Like the top penalty kill in the league is, I think, like 84%. And I want to say there used to be higher 80s,

maybe early 90% of it. Absolutely. So whether it's guys taking the onus upon themselves to get better in the summers, guys working on their shots, like video is, it's crazy, the amount of video on a game day. You know, we're talking almost an hour for some guys that are in all situations, just to do the homework for one hockey game. But we realize like every two points in this league is so important.

You know, like it comes down to, you know, games 81, 82 for some teams just to make the playoffs. So the importance of that one goal, the importance of that one key play, making your chances count. Like all that stuff comes into it. And we've seen, like, we all want more goals in the league. We want more celebrations. We want more power plays.

And we're getting it. And we're getting it. Yeah. So, yeah, so you defensemen, you guys, you know, good luck. You know, that's what we're working on. And, you know, there is stuff in the summer, too. Like, you know, have it, like your stick work. Like, there's drills we work on the summer with me and my skills coach, too,

of, you know, how to poke better. Like when guys are coming, you know, the Connor Bredard, Austin Matthews, pull and drag. Like this has just kind of come in over the last five or six years where it's like, what, I had a good stick there. No, you put it through my triangle. Yeah, he changed the angle. And he scored. In fact, you were in position, but now you are screening your goal.

Now you're not. Exactly. No clue. Exactly. Yeah, it's crazy. Exactly. All right, so Tom had his gut check moment there. I'm going to do mine now because I've been talking about this a lot on the show this season.

But in watching around the league, I feel like, and this is probably a true. trickle down of the success the abs have had with McKinnon and McCar out there where their utilization of the high ice in the offensive zone was so extreme compared to a lot of other teams in the league in previous seasons right like you'd see constantly that rotation McCar's screaming down the wall McKinnon covers for him up top they try to get him extra puck touches by getting him there there's less defensive attention and so he hammers it from there and it's still probably not an ideal shock because it's the distance is there yeah but he's getting such velocity on it and with all that miscommunication all of a sudden now

less bodies in front of the net, more opportunities for them. It feels like heading into this year, we've seen more teams trying to integrate that into their offensive approach. Where all of a sudden now you're seeing the puck worked higher and trying to either isolate a defender two on one or just create some sort of a tactical advantage there.

And then I love the Cadmouse game and this will probably be more up your alley. From the defensive angle of that, we've seen teams much more aggressive kind of Carolina Hurricane style following guys high in the zone, trying to contest it, not giving him that free space,

and the number of breakaways that have resulted accordingly off of, like, a quick low poachic or a miscommunication on a pass, D-to-D, and then all of a sudden, you've got a break going the other way because everyone's so high, or so low in the offensive zone.

Are you kind of seeing that as well? Is that, like, something like you're talking about in terms of, like, identifying it when it's materializing, you need to, like, pounce on that and try to create an non-man rush opportunity? Yeah, 100%. Like, like, all high-end players, they want room.

They want room to make their play. They want time and space. And there's that fine line of being too aggressive where these guys all takes as one, you know, one turn and they're, you know, around you. Or, you know, do you use your gap, keep it, take away all their options? And teams, as you said, like Carolina, I mean, they're so men on mind. They'll follow you right out of the zone, you know, wherever you go. But then there's other.

They'll follow you to the bench. They'll fall you to the bench. And then, like, Edmonting we played last night, they do like the 2D at the net with their center was coming out. So every ozone face off, like a center release, like if you can get, to pick on that guy and have somebody come high, you're going to buy yourself some time. So, you know, and have a quick three on two.

You know, a guy falls down. Whatever happens. So that evolution, you know, it wasn't like that before. Like before I was basically on face-offs. This is my guy. I'm with him wherever he's going. But teams get creative. You know, there's that play and dry-sittle saw score on it a couple games ago

where he takes the face off. He goes to the far side dot. Streaks of boss opens up for the one-time, yeah. The Pud Colson picks the center. He can't get there. Boom, one T's in the back of the net. Like, we're talking three seconds, two and a half seconds of this play happening. And, you know, there's certain players that can turn something into nothing,

or turn nothing to something, sorry, pretty quickly. There's some guys who can turn something to nothing. Yes, yes, those guys, too. There's those guys out there that are in the national somehow. But, you know, those guys that, you know, all it takes is just that little bit of room or that little pick. Next you know, they're at your net front. you know, Colorado is a big part of that.

And that comes back into doing the video before games. Like there's tendencies some of these guys do, you know, Crosby when he's on his offside. Like he's a good chance he's whacking him to the wall, going out finding that highest himself and creating. And guys can score from distance now too, right, with those one-timers and opportunities. So you're always, it's D-Zone face-offs. You're already starting 200 feet from your net, from the other team's net. So you've got to be on alert to begin with. And then you throw in all these crazy creative plays.

It's not fun. All right, guy. Let's take our break here and then we come back We're going to jump right back into a close out today's show with Brendan Dillon you're listening to the Hockey PEOCast streaming

on the Sports Night Radio Network. All right, we're back here on the Hockey PEOCast joined by Brendan Dillon, Thomas Drance. Let's keep the conversation going. Here's my next thing for you, Brendan. So you guys obviously,

and we've been documenting this throughout the year on the show, the offensive struggles for you guys, right? And Jack Hughes certainly misses an extended period of time. You guys have had a lot of key contributors in and out of the lineup.

up your 30 second in the league and shooting percentage which certainly doesn't help. You listen to a Sheldon Keith Presser after every game and he's talking, reinforcing the process like in the way you played despite the results. You and I were talking about this a little bit before we went on there, but I want to get into it because I think this is so fascinating from

being in the room and kind of living it on a day-to-day basis. It's very easy for Thomas or myself to distance ourselves emotionally. You look at the numbers and you say, all right, you guys are fifth and shots generated. You're 10th and expected goals. like you're getting slot looks, you watch a game even,

and the game in Calgary, for example, where you wind up scoring your second goal in overtime to win 2-1, it's not an impressive offensive output yet you look at, you cue up all the chances and you're like, you know what, I like the way we played, we got the puck in a good spots, it's going to reverse fortune. And to be clear, it's mostly been me being like,

they'll be fine. Yes. Yeah, we appreciate it. Yeah, thanks, man. And yet, we're at, you guys have played 50 games. Yeah. And so at some point, I don't know if you start to question that necessarily or whether you allow it to seep into your play from a decision-making perspective,

right? And I think you go two ways. One, you kind of start pressing a little more offensively, trying to make stuff happen and kind of increase the urgency. Or it could go the other way where you're like, all right, even the past two games, you know, we got four big points in the road. We won both games to one. And so if we start pressing offensively, getting guys up the ice, really kind of trying to go for broke offensively to create a goal, if it winds up resulting in a back-breaking goal against our offense isn't playing at a level now where we can dig ourselves out of a 2-0-3-0-0 hole

early on if we're scoring two goals a game essentially. How does that kind of that dynamic work over the course of a season in terms of like the process versus results and then not allowing it to almost be like a self-fulfilling prophecy where it's like we're struggling offensively, the results aren't coming and then you start changing the way you play

and then it keeps happening as opposed to just like sticking with it and hoping that the regression is going to kick in and you're going to start being rewarded for it. Well, it's that fine line. You know, we can all share in the frustration here. I can share it from the logger. I mean, it's, we joke before we came on.

Like, when I signed with the Devils two summers ago, you know, this offensive juggernaut team that just needed a little bit of, you know, defending and we got any goalie and all this stuff. And it's like, yeah, we'll just score seven, eight goals a game now and only give up two. You know, and the reality of it now is, you know, that's the kind of, when you talk about the fancy stats or the analytics with the eye tests, like, I don't know, like with through, we're through 50 games now, right?

So we talk about it, we show video on it, we work on in practice. And it's like, I think we're starting to kind of just come to the realization, like, we've got to continue with these things. But our mindset, you know, that's that fine line. The mindset is like we're, the realities we're not an offensive juggernaut, right? Like, we're not a team that's throwing up five or six a night. And we have to be comfortable in a 2-1 game. Like we've got to be comfortable in a 1-1 game and a 0-0 game. Because when we do start sniffing for it or we do start pushing and opening it up a little bit,

if we get down 1 and then we really have to open it up come a third period or something when we're behind, it just hasn't been working out for us over the last 50 games, right? So as you said, like the message has been, has been, you know, stick with it. Stick with itness. Is that if that's a word we'll create today? Because we are getting good looks, you know, and it's, you know, our high-end guys are getting good looks, which is nice. You know, our power play was a big strength for us last year.

I think we're top five in the league. And, you know, this year, like it's coming. Like, it's, you know, between guys in and out and injuries and stuff like that. It's just been a work in progress. but, you know, five-on-five scoring is hard. Like, it's hard to score goals in this league. It's hard to score goals, you know, with, you know, the importance team's put on defending with the goaltending.

Everyone's getting better, you know, top to bottom. But we're comfortable in those games like last night where we're starting to kind to kind of take that, I don't know if it's a mature step or just an understanding. Like the, you know, through 50 games now, you're over the halfway point of the year. You're in crunch time now. the games are only going to get tougher. Like they're only going to get more teams jockey in for playoffs, not just playoff spots, but, you know,

home ice advantage, whatever it might be. And I know it might be frustrating for us. I know it's frustrating when you look around the league and you see, oh, yeah, this team put up five or this team put up six. And, you know, all these guys have got three assists and they're plus five. And then all these, like, it's something where we're in the business of winning hockey games.

And if we're able to do it 2-1, you know, we've got to do it. I know some Devils fans who are like, you know, that Wolverine meme where he's, sitting in bed looking at a picture longingly of like your goal totals from 22, 23. Yeah, man, those are the days. Yeah, for sure. You know, you're talking about sort of the, I'm really curious to know how the compressed Eastern Conference standings has impacted the experience of playing this year because, I mean,

the gap between. It's crazy. Especially in your division. Like in the metro, the gap between being like in third in the division and not even in a wild card. spot and being second last in the conference, like literally 11th, right, is, uh, or like the 11th non-playoff team is, um, is six points. Yeah. I mean, it's a good week one way or the other. Uh, has that amped up relative to most years where we don't see this level of sort of,

I guess you'd call it parody, but just like flatness in the standings. Is that amped up sort of the pressure, the, the cost of, you know, the classic like mid-January game in Columbus, but all of a mid-January game in Columbus feels well that was the most important game you guys played some of it I know I know that was literally like it's every game in the NHL I mean like every game you get to play in the NHL to

you know be a part of like it's it's best league in the world like there's like right on down from general managers to players to the guys in the America League trying to get caught up like there's a lot of pressure you know stress and importance to win like you feel that and that's something

like you know I love it because like the competitive side of you, like you want to win these games, you want to get a chance to play in playoffs. Like you literally play seven months, 82 games to just try and get into the playoffs. So that random game on a Tuesday night in Columbus or the, you know, back to back in Edmonton that, you know, is again, different conference, team you see twice a year out of those 82. Like there's some huge importance on that. And, you know, it goes kind of back to the evolution of the game, whether it's the video

preparation, the conversations you're having just with your D partner about that match. you're going to have that night. You know, just every team can realistically throw up four or five on you. You know, it doesn't matter if it's the last team in your conference. Like, you know, like the Rangers who I think are sitting last in ours, like they just beat Florida in that outdoor game. Yep. Would they score five or six that game, put it up?

And then... There's obviously a lot of guys on that team that can just nuke out. Oh, man. Don't get Thomas started on the Rangers. Yeah. Yeah. We don't know to open up that can of worms, you know. But it just really is crazy.

how this season has been any more, like way more than others. Like, like, you can argue that no teams are truly, truly out of it in our conference, right? Like you said, you have a good week. And next thing you know, you're two, three points out of playoffs. And those importance kind of four-pointers when you're playing amongst your division are just have so much importance, you know, and even just getting to overtime and getting one point. So, yeah, this year more than others has been insane. Yeah, I think there's 10 teams currently in the east between 53 and 59 points.

And so you guys are in that. You are three points back of the penguins for third in the metro, but there's also like five other teams that you could say that for. And so it's crazy. Part of it is also the condensed schedule because of the Olympics as well, right? Like the number of back-to-backs, but also three and fours, five and seven, whatever it is. Like I think that's contributing to some of these results as well. Like I just following the league, I feel like you watch a team on a given night

and you see a version of them. And then you tune in the next night and you just see an entirely different one. And then you look at their schedule, it's like, oh, yeah, they're at the end of a six-game road trip where they played six games in ten days and they're probably just ready to go home. You're like, you're praying that teams are feeling that when they play you. Right. You're just like, yeah, please take the night off. That'd be nice if you just, you know, just relax. The, sorry, the condensed schedule conversation just immediately made me want to ask you about the Olympics.

But let's stick with the devil's question. Then we'll get into Olympic takes because I'm obviously so excited for next month. Oh, yeah. I do just want to ask because of the conversation that's been surrounding your group, obviously, across the last two and a half months since the Quinn Hughes trade went down from within that room, sort of what's it been like to navigate some of that drama and some of that speculation that surrounded your group. Yeah, I think anytime, well, I shouldn't say anytime because they might be the only three brothers all in the league at some time. So when you have two thirds of a brother like that and there's rumors going on for real. realistically the whole year, kind of since training camp. Guys talk, guys are on social media.

You know, we played in Toronto early on in the year, and I think it even came up when we're there with some of the guys. And, you know, then two of them got named to the USA team. And we've had a bunch of unfortunate elephants in the room. Like, you know, when things got going. And that's part of being a professional, though, is just you come to work, you do. your work the best.

You try to win hockey games. And early on in the season, we were doing that. You know, it was great. And then the, you know, the trade speculation stuff came on. And it's not like your general manager in the room just telling you, hey, here's what our plan is. Here's, you know, you guys can pass this around the room. Sure.

You know, if you have any inquiries, please let me know. Like, it doesn't work like that, you right? We're going about it. It's funny. Like my dad, you know, my parents are still here in the Vancouver area. And, of course, between SportsNet and TSA and the radio, like, you know, Like my dad's calling me on this. He's like, yeah, this is what I heard about this.

And this is what I heard about that. And like, I'm in the actual locker room. You know, talking about guys. And I'm like, I haven't even heard that. Like, what do you mean? Like this guy. And so, yeah, would we love to have Quinn Hughes, of course. He's going to make our team way better just as he's made the Minnesota Wild better.

But to say, you know, to blame us not having a great November or December, whatever it was on that is, like, we can't. do. Like, you just, as a professional, you can't do that. And, um, I'm sure the same questions are going to come up if he doesn't sign on July 1st of this summer, you know, is he going to be in New Jersey Devil soon? The following summer when that comes up. And, um, I think that stuff, like for Jack and Luke specifically, I don't think they were sitting and, you know, hang in their head because, you know, Quinn wasn't on the team. Like, there was none of that going on. But I think more than anything, we just weren't playing good hockey. Yeah. You know, for, for that stretch of games that happened to be around that time.

And then, you know, Fitsy addressed us the other day, came in and, you know, just kind of said, you know, is his belief in the group, which is what you want to hear from your general manager. But at the same time, like, we've got to put the product on the ice. It's nice. We've won now a couple in a row, we've won over four of our last five to hopefully then, you know, kind of get that Joel last year. We trade for Brian Dumeland, you know, when you're adding to your group is what you, you know,

that's the area you want to be in. But, you know, for these blockbusters that happened during the season, you know, yeah, we would have loved to have Clint Hughes, but we didn't get them. So off we go and hopefully can be one of those teams that's adding here as we get closer to the deadline. Well, in light of that, one of my favorite developing storylines around the league right now is, you know, Dougie Hamilton was in the news, winds up being healthy scratched, comes back in your guy's game against Minnesota. Yeah. And has just gone off offensively since I think he's got like six points in five games.

He's playing next to Brendan Dillon. I mean, he's absolutely living his best life. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Batman and Robin. I love asking you this question. I think last time your answer was the Golden Knights, but of all the teams you've played so far and you've pretty much played everyone in the league,

I think, at this point. Yeah. What's the toughest group for you right now to kind of match up against? Because I think someone watching Devils games would probably say the Hurricanes, just because you've lost to them three times now and there's that history with the playoff series

from the past couple of years. Although I feel like, you know, they've been close competitive games. It hasn't necessarily been like, oh, we can't handle their speed or their relentless forecheck. Like it's a couple bounces, you know, special teams, stuff like that. But I'm curious if you find it's them.

You've played Tampa Bay a couple times. And obviously they haven't lost in like six weeks now. Colorado, you've played twice to highly entertaining games. It's crazy overtime at home. Play a crazy 8-4 shootout over there. Yeah. I would say, I mean, the Colorado game was right. I think we won the, they were part of the –

The first one at home was the eight win. Yeah, that was the one that she got hurted initially. Yes, yeah. and they're almost, I would say all three of those teams, if I have to pick one, I would say of who we've played so far. Tampa Bay sticks out because they just, they're fast, they're physical, they're structured,

you know, and when you throw those three together, you know, the team, they're not beating themselves. So it's not like you can just rely on, oh, yeah, they're going to turn it over and we're going to have 15, two-on-ones, and a bunch of these. They've got one of the best goaltenders in the ones, world.

If there are some breakdowns, but offensively, like, they work, you know, like, even, I remember after the first game, we play them this year, and we're, you know, you're kind of going back to that game. You know, they're high-end guys, the Gensels, the Hagels, you know, the Sorrellys, the Coutrelleys, the Coutreys, like, they're one-on-one battles to compete and get that puck, you know, out of the corner to then find the high-end backdoor play. Like, like, those are the plays, like, everybody sees, oh, yeah, that was a sick shot, you know, I would have passed by Cooch on the, on the, you know, I would have passed by

Kooch on the power play. But for them to maybe earn that power play, you know, they did something before that, you know, their structure to make you turn that puck over through the Neuchazone, trying that high in play, and then create that the other way. Like, those are the things, I think, that make them so good. And obviously the Mozar-Radish deep air. Yes. But I just think ultimately, I think Tampa's been really impressive this year,

and especially for a team that, you know, they've got veteran guys, they've been missing. like I think they're missing point, headman. Yeah, McDonough, yeah. Like some big pieces and they're still finding ways, which I think really, you know, we talked about the Olympic schedule and all this stuff, is it credit to these teams that are finding ways to win and finding ways to stay in it.

I mean, they're just so real, they come at you in so many waves. If only people could see how many times I've texted Thomas about Dominic James, for example. And it's like, I feel like your average fan at home who doesn't watch lightning games, doesn't necessarily know about it, but like you could probably be playing on most team's second lines.

It's just like unbelievable work ethic, making plays all the time. He's just an extra piece for them. Only for me to reply with Mitchell Chafee propaganda. Let's really quickly talk Olympics before we let you go. Obviously you're Canadian. We saw last time out, right? The US won in regulation and then Canada needed overtime

and a historic run of safes from Biddington to beat Team USA and now they'll have Quinn Hughes. How do you like Team Canada's chances of matching up? What are your thoughts on the roster selected? Yeah, I mean, I just think You hope it Is a Canada U.S. final? Yeah.

You know, I still remember 2010. Like I was, I hear like most of us, I'm sure. You know, it's just, it's everything you want. The, you know, Crosby leading the way. You know, you got, you know, McDavid and McKinnon who, you know, I think we're talking about before the game when we're, you know, pre-scouting Edmonton of how, like, he just had a 20-game point streak, right?

McDavid did. And, like, you know, they're, like, everybody is queuing on him before games and he's just that good. And then you could argue that he might even be the two C on the team. Yeah. Like he might be. I mean, McKinney and him,

I think they're both either way. He seconded on most people's heart ballots. Yeah. Right? Yeah. And then you throw in like celebrate. Like you're just, there's so many high ends.

I mean, I'm a proud Canadian. I'll be cheering for Canada no matter what. Even, you know, if I got buddies on the U.S. team and all this type of stuff. But ultimately you just hope for good hockey. Like I just want good competitive games.

Like these are the games that you've have best on best. that we haven't had. I mean, we had four nations last year, but again, you only had the four teams. You look at some of these other countries coming in, like, you know, like Czech Republic's going to be good. Yeah. You throw in all these other teams that,

yeah, there's some injuries on certain teams that saw Sweden's got some guys banged up. I was looking at Switzerland's roster. I'm like, kind of like you nasty. And Germany, man. Yeah, Germany. I mean, Dry Settle can carry, like, these are the teams that, like,

they have guys on them that can carry low. Like, like we've obviously got the three Swiss, Swiss amigos on us that are going to be, big for that. And a lot of those teams, like Romaniosi can take over a game at any given time. You know, Nico Hesier is a two-way just, he can shut down

the best of them. So I'm excited to watch it. I'll be on a beach watching it. You know, unfortunately I didn't make Team Canada this year. But, you know, I think it's just going to be an unreal for fans. We saw how good the Four Nations did last year. I don't know if we'll ever be able to have an All-Star game again,

which is how good that was. But yeah, the Olympics, man, the best-on-best. I'm excited. Just last note on Team Switzerland, you mentioned the Swiss Amigos there. I mean, Jonas Ekenthaler will probably be playing with J.J. Moser on that top shutdown pair.

And I'm going to be bugging you out. Get Jonas to get some tips from hanging around JJ Moser and just how he's doing it because the season he's having right now is just absolutely unbelievable. Brennan, you got anything to plug on the way out? You want people to tune in the Devils games?

I mean, if we get some Devils West Coast fans, we always love it, man. You know, we didn't get Quinn Hughes, so it's okay. you can still cheer for us with the other guys. You know, I mean, knock on wood, we'll see. I don't know if there's going to be much playoff hockey, you know,

from Vancouver this summer, we'll see. So you can always cheer, hopefully, for us down the stretch to get in there. I hope, but as always, a pleasure being with you guys. Yeah, a lot of fun. You can check out Tom at the Athletic. Of course. On Canucks talk here on the Sports Nighter Radio Network and the PDOCAST on Sundays. Even though we're doing this on Wednesday,

we'll be doing our usual Sunday special this Sunday. So tune in for that. That's all for today. for listening to the Hockey Ocast streaming on the Sports Night Radio Network.