The Hockey PDOcast - Blame Game in Boston, and Coaches on Hot Seat

Episode Date: November 20, 2024

Dimitri Filipovic is joined by Pete Blackburn to talk about Jim Montgomery's firing, and where things have gone wrong in Boston this season. Then they talk about future landing spots for him, and other coaches now on the hot seat. If you'd like to gain access to the two extra shows we're doing each week this season, you can subscribe to our Patreon page here: www.patreon.com/thehockeypdocast/membership If you'd like to participate in the conversation and join the community we're building over on Discord, you can do so by signing up for the Hockey PDOcast's server here: https://discord.gg/a2QGRpJc84 The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Media Inc. or any affiliate.

Regressing to the mean since 2015, it's the Hockey PEDEOCast with your host, Dmitri Philipovich. Welcome to the HockeyPedio cast. My name is Dmitra Filippovich, and joining me is my good buddy Pete Blackburn. Pete, what's going on, man? Dmitri, how are you? I'm good. I'm certainly better than you, I think. Although now you can finally mercifully stop recording very troublesome videos of you just sitting on a couch,

talking about how the Bruins need to fire their coach, because they've already done it. So I guess they listened to you. So you must be a little bit happy about that. I was one game too early. I fired that off one game too early. And I also recorded it the previous game, which they ended up coming back and winning. I recorded they need to fire Jim Montgomery after the second period of a game against the blues in which they looked like they were going to lose. And they eked it out by the skin of their teeth.

And then here we are a couple games later. He is gone. I'm not happy about it, but I was right. Yeah. maybe a bit relieved. I think all parties. We're going to get into all of it here. It's good timing because you and I had already planned to get together

and have you on the PDOCast for the first time this year. And then on Tuesday afternoon, the Bruins went ahead and fired Jim Montgomery, making him the first coach fired this season. And so it's convenient timing for our purposes that we get the chat here and break it all down. Let's get into kind of what happened and sort of the path towards this inevitable conclusion that happened this week, right?

They've got this eight, nine, and three record. most recently they went into Dallas, got spanked 7-2, then they got outplayed and outshot badly by, in my opinion, the most mid-team in the league right now, the St. Louis Blues. It was 31 to 18 in shots in that game. And then I think the final straw was at that home game against the Blue Jackets, where they lose 5 to 1. They've got a minus 21 goal differential,

which is 31st in the league, only the penguins are worse. I've got a bunch of stats here about the offensive issues and the defensive ones, and both of those kind of played their part. but what do you think was the ultimate sort of undoing here or the path that they took to getting here because I think that even if you thought that the Bruins were going to take a step back heading into this season still had 109 points last year

I don't think anyone would have anticipated this happening and certainly Montgomery being the first coach fired considering the other options that would have been available there on the board so what happened here Pete? Yeah I mean so let's address the elf in the room to begin with like this roster is not amazing it's not but what we've seen in the previous two years

is that Jim Montgomery is capable of maximizing what is put in front of him roster-wise like we've seen the Bruins take a major step back in roster quality with the loss of Patrice Bergeron and David Craichy like I think everybody expected the regression to hit last year when they were running out Charlie Coil and Pavel Zaka as their top two centers that doesn't sound amazing on paper

but he found a way to make it work this year they added Elias Lindholm to that group down the middle, which conceivably makes them a better team than they added Nikita Zedorov on the back end, which conceivably makes their blue line a little bit better, plus another year of Basin Lurai and some of the other young players that they're hoping to slot into this lineup and make an impact. Where it's inexcusable is the difference between this team and its details versus what you've seen in years prior.

And a lot of that stuff doesn't necessarily show up on stat sheets every given night. And I know this is the PDO cast. And I know that you're very, very stats heavy. But as somebody who watches this team religiously and has for most of my life, the difference between what I've seen the Bruins be over the last couple of years under Jim Monk, and what they've been for the first month and change of this season is just it could not be more night and day. Their details aren't there. The discipline has been horrible to this point in the year.

They're throwing passes in other players' feats. Like they've always looked somewhat slow. Like they're not a fast team. But the details just aren't there. Their entries are awful. And they don't do anything well. Not a single thing. they don't do a single thing well

and all of those things combined with the general sense of it sliding downhill and compounding game after game after game I think it leads you to the point where you look at Montgomery's record with the Bruins and you say, hey, that's pretty good,

but it is time for this team to go in a new direction because they need a hard reset. Yeah, obviously the sub 500 record is one thing and that's not good enough. I think the optics of it are an important piece of context here, right? I think of just watching these games, certainly compounding, but even in individual

segments, it was just such like a lifeless performance for a lot of them. It was almost like a level of sort of apathy. It's like, oh, here we go again. Like you watch that Starz game. It's like, oh, it's happening. The game against the Blue Jackets was the final straw. I think our pal Dom Lus Chishin had this note in his article on them on the athletic that

that Blue Jackets game was their fifth loss this season by a four plus goal margin. And in the eight previous years, all of which the Bruins made the playoffs in. They were averaging 2.6 of those types of losses per for the entire season on average. And so they already have five of those. And I do wonder, you kind of bring up sort of what happened last year, right, in the fact that after Bergeron retires, Cretreux retires, I think everyone expected them to take that natural step back. And then they follow it up

with another 109 point campaign. They beat the Leafs in round one. They ultimately lose their Panthers, but they force a pretty competitive six-game series out of them. And I think heading into this season, everyone just sort of expected like, all right, well, that happened last year, and then they make these additions in the off-season. So I think the natural expectation is more of the same. And I guess my argument against that is, I think if you look at the Bruins team they had on paper last year, that roster really had no business actually even beating the Leafs in round one. And they somehow managed to do so. I don't think they were a hundred and nine point. true talent team and they somehow managed to do so.

We're going to talk about the goaltending. They drove that and a lot of the top players as well. But it just feels like they sort of like flip-flop these two seasons, I guess, right? Where if they had this type of season last year, everyone would have been like, all right, well, that makes sense. They just lost their top two centers and this was going to happen to them eventually. But because they somehow managed to pull last year's season out of the bag the way that they did, it almost threw people off the scent.

And I think even now you see the way people talk about the bruneration. and maybe it's not even people who cover them on a day-to-day basis or watch their games daily, there's a certain like reverence or respect for the fact that they've stretched out this competitive window in the manner that they have over multiple different cores now to the point where they're almost like a boogeyman where no one really wants to write them off because I think everyone has been burned in their preseason predictions pieces over the past couple years where like, all right, this is finally the year the Bruins fall off. And then they have another 109 point season and you have egg on your face.

And so even now, watching them with this 8, 9, and 3 records struggling the way they have, a lot of people are still, like, struggling to come to terms of the fact that this is actually unfolding in real time before our eyes, right? And I think that also plays into this where I think if you just pull up their depth chart on paper, they might not be an 8, 9, and 3 team and 31st in goal differential, but I also have a tough time arguing that it's one that should have the sky-high, lofty expectations of, like, legitimately competing for a Stanley Cup this season. Yeah.

And I think there's also a bigger, bigger discussion that we had on leadership, too, because, you know, you can talk about the leadership and how that's kind of been, I feel like leadership has been tied into like the Bruins sustainability. And like over the past couple of the years, you've said, you know, the roster has regressed. And despite that, the leadership and the culture in Boston has been so good that it's allowed them to keep that window open because they just buy into a system and they show up. and they work hard. And yeah, at some point, I think that's that is true. Like, that's a fact. And it's a big part of why the Bruins have been successful, maybe longer than they should have.

But I also think that, like, there can be a discussion, too, about leadership two years ago when they were the best team in regular season history. And then things started to come apart at the seams in the playoffs, and nobody stepped in front of it. And then you started to see it come to life again last year in the playoffs. in the first round against Toronto, where it was like, oh my God, is this going to happen again?

Is anybody going to step in front of this? And you're one David Poshnock overtime goal away from, like, that narrative completely changing. And now you have this year where, like, things started off very bad, and nobody stepped in front of it. And I think that it became pretty apparent that leadership was not there, at least not to the degree that they needed. Jim Montgomery included, but not exclusively.

Like, you're looking at Brad Marshand, and he is, I think, the only, like, clear and loud presence in that room. And then beyond him, like, who do you have for leaders of that team who are going to step up and step in front of things? Like, Charlie McAvoy is a guy that's been there for a long time, but I don't necessarily view him in that light in terms of being like a very loud and demonstrative leader. Like David Posternox, not that guy either.

Like, is Jeremy Swayman that guy? And is he allowed to be that guy after he has the, the quote, unquote, holdout in preseason that prevents him from being in camp? And, like, I don't want to talk about the Swayman situation affecting this team for the first month and a half because it's pathetic to talk about it on November 20th, still affecting this team. like at some point you got to get over it. But from the people who have been around the team, seem to think that like that did bleed into the start of the season and it was hard to recover from that. And it still might be having lingering effects.

And to that point, like, who's the leader who's going to step up and say, all right, enough. This happened. It's done. Let's reset and refocus and get right. And nobody was able to do that before it cost you in Montgomery his job. Well, and the trick with that leadership thing is a lot of those players, and listen, like, we're not in that room, so you're not kind of privy to the way stuff's unfolding in terms of like what's being said and what's being done. But in theory, you'd say regardless of some of those personalities, you mentioned, the top players for this organization have been their top players for so long that at the very least you have like leadership through action or production where it's like you don't even need to say anything.

You can go unspoken because you're just going out there and winning your minutes and scoring goals or making the saves or driving plays. were driving play the way that they have. And then you look this season and it was like a cute little storyline in the first couple of weeks where I was like, oh, look at this fourth line of Castle Lake and Beecher. Like they're producing so much.

The Bruins have done it again with these random guys stepping up and getting production out of them. But it's sort of papered over the issue that the top players weren't playing up to their capabilities. I know Flut O'Sonzo had this thing about how both Marchehan and Pasternak suffered injuries in the off season and entered training camp,

not 100%. And they're sort of working their way. into actual game shape, and that certainly plays a part in this. But you look at it and we'll leave Swamint to decide here for a second because I've got a bit on that later. But like Pasternak has fewer 5-1-5 goals this season than Cole Kepke on this team. Last year with Pasternak on the ice, they were up 72 to 45. In his 5-15 minutes this year, they're playing it to a draw 10-10.

Marchand is playing less at 5-1-5 per game than he has since he was a rookie. they've scored four five on five goals with him on the ice this season McLevoy had to be like mercifully taken off the top unit power play because of how bleak it looked and struggled obviously in his sort of adjustment playing was the door of early in the year and they quickly kind of put that to the side and so yeah it's like all right you have questions about this team's depth and it's been deteriorating along the way but the big difference between this year I think in previous seasons

and why they were able to get away with it is their top players just haven't been good enough Yeah, 100%. And their pillars need to be their best players and they're going to drive this team. And like if you think that the roster is not good enough, fine. I agree with you. But what they have should drive them to be at least like respectable and maybe like on the bubble, especially in a really bad division this year. Like it's really tough.

The fact that they're even within like spitting distance of a playoff spot still speaks to how bad the Atlantic Division has been. And like if you have Hasernock, Marchand, McAvoy, Swayman, like those four guys, if they are playing good hockey, they're going to mask a lot of problems. And it's happened for for a while to this point. They're going to mask some of the deficiencies on this team. But if they're not playing well, you're going to get exposed pretty quickly. and I think that's happened. Well, I assume that part of the sort of impetus for like their urgency of doing this move

when they did now to try to salvage this season is exactly what you said there, right? Where for as bad as they've played, you look around and it's like, they're still tied in points with the Islanders for the final playoff spot in the east, and that's almost entirely because of the state of that Atlantic division outside the top three.

The Sends are 8, 9, and 1, the Sabres are 8, 9, and 1. The wings are 7, 9, and 2. And so you look ahead and it's like, all right, well, their upcoming schedule these next three weeks, it's Utah, Detroit twice, the Canucks, Islanders, Penguins, HAB, hawks, and flyers. In theory, that should be a get-right spot. I guess the issue, though, is we just saw them get smoked by the Blue Jackets, right?

They got shut out at home by the Flyers. So I also don't want to portray that schedule as like Cupcake for them because these are the teams they've been struggling with. And I think at this point with the way the Bruins are playing, unless they fixed stuff internally, none of those are necessarily actually, quote-unquote, easy games for them. Yeah, they should be winnable games, but they've been dropping a lot of winnable games,

which is why Jim Montgomery is out of a job. And I think that that's an important thing to recognize as we head into this first Joe Sacco stretch, is that if they start winning a bunch of games, you've got to be careful not to overreact because those are games that they should be winning. But it's a good spot for them to get some confidence behind them with this reset. The SACCO thing is interesting because I was hoping for an external hire. And I know that it's interim. It could change.

But like I was hoping for an external hire just because it's a harder reset. And Joe Sacco is part of the staff that has failed to get the most out of this group or really like anything out of this group to this point in the year. And the only. the only way that I feel like this higher, no disrespect to Joe Salko, because I don't fully know what he's capable of as a head coach at this point in his career. I know what happened in Colorado,

but it's been a long time since then. I feel like the only way that you're getting like a really, really significant spark by staying in-house is if it's a wake-up to everybody in the room that they just cost Jim Montgomery their job. And you saw some initial quotes come out today from Brad Marshand, who was like, you know, our collective failures individually has run this guy out of town,

has cost a good man, his job. And like that is the reaction that is needed from every guy in that room to say, got to wake up, got to lock in. Otherwise, I'm costing people that I care of their jobs. Yeah. I am with you. I don't know how I feel obviously when your team is performing the way they have this year. It seems tough to justify being like, all right, well, we're going to just promote someone who's already involved in this operation,

considering how badly everything is floundered. Sometimes we have seen, though, I think the best example, wasn't necessarily behind the bench. But you look at the Washington Capitals, for example, right? Where, like, when they decided to part ways with George McPhee, they ultimately promoted his assistant GM, right-hand man in Brian McClend and who had been there for a while. And I was like, oh, man, this seems like kind of. cutting corners here and then he's done a phenomenal job in his time running that team and a it's possible to be an assistant or be on that staff regardless of its manager or coaching and like have

different opinions or different views or stuff that you want to do but ultimately don't get to execute because you're not the person in charge but also i want to leave the room open for coaches getting better the similar to how players do as well right like i ultimately joe sacco's only head coaching experience at this level was so bad that it got the color avalan Nathan McKinnon one season. So it's not necessarily like a glowing resume, but at the same time, it's been, what, 11 years or so since then?

He's been with this organization the entire time. They clearly like him. He seems to be well respected in league circles. So I'm skeptical that it'll work out. I think there's ultimately going to be a more established higher at some point here, but I'm okay with it for the time being. I guess my issue with the coaching change in general here,

and I hear all your kind of arguments and points about why they needed to do it, is ultimately it is like the easiest and kind of swiftest course of action right it's like you can't really especially with the players they have they don't have very many desirable players that they could trade out they don't have that much that many assets to move they clearly don't want to move futures at this point considering where the season's going and so the easiest is like all right the coach is going to take the fall here my problem with that is I feel like it sort of suggests that this situation is his fault and I'm not saying

that that's the way it's being portrayed. But I feel like this kind of notion that it's like, all right, well, Jim Montgomery wasn't doing a good enough job of trying stuff out or he was just being a passenger here. It's like, well, yeah, he's a player's coach, but we saw him bench pasturnack when he felt like he wasn't giving Max effort. We saw him certainly get into it with Brad Mershon on the bench. He did that McAvoy off the top unit power play switch.

I feel like he's kind of pushed all the logical buttons here beyond just a fresh face, fresh voice, motivation perspective to realize that this isn't good enough, I feel like this ultimately absolves the actual culprits here, which is the management group that's been doing this for a while now. And so we'll see if that's something that gets rectified in the off season, if this season keeps going the way it has. But I feel like right now it's the ultimate Band-Aid move. I agree with that. And I also think that, like, yeah, I think luckily everybody recognizes that Montgomery is being thrown to the wolves here a bit. Like, it,

it is such a failure at almost every level from the players to the coaching staff to the front office that it should all be split pretty equally but the easiest guy to throw to the wolves is the coach especially when like he was essentially in a way thrown to the wolves before the season even started because they let him enter this season in a walk year which puts him in in a firing line and if you want to believe the stuff that Mike Grinnell has said about like management and how they they spoke to Sacco and were like, hey, if things don't go well, like you would be first in line to get this job.

Like, I don't know how much truth there is to that, but there is something to be read into the fact that they allow Jim Montgomery to walk into a year three with no new contract after two seasons in which he definitely pulled the most out of a pretty unspectacular group given to him by management. I guess maybe not the first year. The first year, obviously,

was pretty, pretty, a really strong team. But he still managed to draw the most that he possibly could. More than any coach in the history of the league is drawn out of his group in that first season. So allowing him to come into this year without a new contract, I think says a lot about maybe what the front office thought about him or the concerns that they might have about him, whether they were right to or not.

But absolutely, I think that is the last bullet in the gun for this front office. It was firing Jim Montgomery. Like, attention and pressure is fully on Cam, Cam Neely and Don Sweeney at this point. And I don't think that they, I don't think they've done a really bad job

in terms of getting results on the ice. But where they really have failed is the transition. Like there has not been a transition into really, extending this window and transitioning to a new era or a new window. Like we're still trying to keep the old window open right now versus

pushing towards opening up a new one. What's your bigger concern with this team right now from an on the ice play perspective? Is it the lack of offensive juice we've seen? Because they're 31st in goals, right? Only the Blackhawks are generating less. But a lot of that is driven by the fact that

they're dead last in the power play. They're generating less than four goals per hour there. Just as a point of context last year, they were at 8.1 goals per hour on the power play. Like they're only winning man advantage minutes nine to four this season. And two of those short-handed goals against came in the most recent game. Or is it defensively where I do think that, and it's to be expected,

but post-Berser-on, like last year I thought we saw some signs of deterioration and decline defensively in the environment, but it was just masked by the fact that they had 82 games of utterly elite goaltending and now they don't. And so we're starting to see it a bit more. Which one of those do you think is a bigger concern? Because I do think both could be pointed to as the biggest reason why this team is going to is going to fail this season.

Yeah. I mean, I think I have more faith in the defense and or goaltending being tightened up because like I like their blue line as. a collective. It hasn't had amazing returns, but I also don't think that they've really struck chemistry on that blue line to this point, and

Jeremy Swayman has been very bad. I think at least one of those two things is going to come back towards the middle here. I don't have a ton of faith in their forward group, especially if Marshand

is a step below what he's been for most of career with these injuries and this age. David Posternock, like, I think he's going to start scoring, but like you can't build an offense around one guy. And nothing else is really clicking outside of their fourth line.

Like their fourth line has legitimately been their best line for almost the entire season, both in a like, like both in production and just an effort and details every single. night. Yeah, defensively, they're down to 20th, unexpected goals against, and 23rd in slot shots allowed. Swayman's at an 884, and that's obviously not good enough. I'd expect him to bounce back.

It's interesting because, like, the public models, if you go on evolving hockey, they have them as the third worst goalie this season behind Georgiev and Connor Ingram in Utah. Yet, if you look at some of the more like advanced or private ones, like Spore Logic, they actually had him as kind of like neutral from an expected goal save above average. perspective prior to the Blue Jackets game, of course, which hurt that a little bit. And I think that speaks to the defensive environment, has been getting worse. And it was last year they just had a top three save percentage. Offensively, I'm with you, though.

They're down to like 20th or so in expected goals and slot shots and all that stuff you look at. And that's what I point to this offseason where I think individually isolating them. I was like, all right, well, they have a clear need down the middle. And it's a last line home is the best, most established center. so we're going to get him. Nikita Zorov had this amazing, like, charismatic, just unbelievably fun to watch postseason. So we're going to bring him in and he can kind of do his stuff.

But then you look at what they did to accomplish that. It's like you let DeBrusk, Hinen, Boquist, even Shattankirk, who gave them some nice offense last year from the Blue Line go. And there's just not that many creators on this team anymore. It's nice that the fourth line creates the way they do, but so much of the burden here in responsibility is on Pastor Nack to keep improving as a playmaker the way he has. as, but also just score pure goals.

And if he goes through stretches like this, there's no real insulation. And so I do think he's going to start scoring more. But I do question or wonder just generally where the offensive production and creativity is going to come from on this roster the way it's currently constructed. And that's why I kind of made the point of like, I don't want to let the management green off the hook here because I do feel like tracing back to just what they did this past off season. They went in a bit of a different direction from a team building perspective.

and that's what's done them in here. And so I think it's fair to question kind of their involvement in that and their responsibility and the culpability here. Yeah, and I also think like the Swamen struggles have something to do with how bad they've been at defending around the net.

And they were bad at that from the first second of the first game. Like they could not defend around the net. And I think that that has an effect on a goaltender. And I also think of goaltender struggling has an effect on the defense and I think both those things can come back towards the middle you're right though like the they don't they don't have enough creators and you see them like constantly smashed their head against the wall to the same results over and over and

over again it's sloppy entries it's pucks and skates it's nobody really like it's one chance and then going the other way they've had almost no sustained pressure uh throughout this entire season and when they do it seems like they shoot themselves in the foot with whether it's an offensive zone penalty whether it's just like giving up a rush chance the other way and and giving up a goal they they just are not able to get out of their own way or establish any sort of momentum within games for longer than like a few minutes at a time yeah all right p let's take our break here and then when we come back we'll we'll jump right back into it and we'll close out today's show. You're listening to the Hockey P.D. Ocast streaming on the Sports Night Radio Network.

All right. We're back here on the Hockeypedio cast joined by Pete Blackburn, Pete, in part one of today's show. We spent a lot of time looking at the Bruin specifically. I got one final note here on Jim Montgomery before we segue, and I think it's going to be a neat segue for us. I feel, as I said, I feel bad that he's the person that's kind of being thrown under the bus here for the Bruins performance. I think he's going to be just fine, though, moving forward. I think, I don't know what your mileage is on this. Obviously, he didn't do a great job of this season just based on those results we talked about. But I still think he's a good coach.

We've seen him get a lot of results out of teams over the past couple years in two different stops. Now, I think X's and O's wise in particular, I think he's got a lot to offer. There's some questions certainly come to postseason about like adjustments and when the going gets tough, kind of like handling of situations like that. But I feel like there's probably at least 10 to 50. teams around this league you look at right now and it's like all right tactically he'd probably be a massive improvement on what they already have and i think that it's been about 24 hours here now since the news broke that he's been let go by the bruin's and i'm sure he wants to take a bit of

time off to sort of just like reflect and regroup before he takes whatever next offer he gets but i'm almost partly surprised that he still hasn't been hired by a different team not that any other team has let go any coaches in the meantime but i feel like he's such an obvious upgrade for a few and we can talk about them here, that I'm almost surprised that he hasn't already been scooped up. Yeah, I think you hit the nail on the head on all aspects there. And he is, I believe, the kind of coach that you do fire your coach for, like, quality-wise, if you're on the fence. And I think there are a number of teams that are their seats cooking as well. I also just noticed, are you blonde right now?

I am. I just noticed this. Yeah. Well, it's me, Marty Nature. Joe Burrow. There's a few others. It's a bit of a movement. No, it's still a, it's still a lasting thing from Halloween. I still haven't shaved my head yet. I was planning to, but then I feel like, I've enjoyed it so much, and I'm keeping it for at least a couple more weeks. It looks pretty good. What were you for Halloween?

I don't know if you'll get the reference. My wife wanted to go as Kim Possible, and then she's got this sidekick with blonde hair, and I was going to get a buzz cut anyway, so I just decided to just bleach my hair for the time being. And then I've never done anything like that because I've always just had like dark brown hair And then I was like, oh, I don't hate it. And so I don't hate it either. Sorry for the derailment of the goat-fishing top. It really struck me. You know what?

You know what Drenz told me? One time I came in and I came, the first day I had it, I came into the studio and we recorded a show. And then I was like, are you going to say anything about this? Because we've been talking for 45 minutes here and I'd have a totally different haircut. And then he's like, you know what? I thought I was going to hate it.

And I'm kind of mad that I don't. And so I feel like that's a good encapsulation of where I'm at right now. On Monty, what do you think the most logical landing spot is for him? Because I feel like for me, I think for the Red Wings, it's almost a must. I guess you could argue we talked about the pressure for the Bruins of salvaging the season and how this is such a crossroads part of the schedule for them. You could make a similar argument for the Red Wings, maybe less so because they don't have this track record of postseason appearances that they want to uphold

and they're theoretically not as old of a core as the Bruins are but what we saw from them recently in their California trip and the fact that I presume that he has about as much leash and kind of control as any GM in the league does is Steve Eiserman but eventually they have to have some of the show for this run

that he's been overseeing the team for and I feel like they're reaching a boiling point there as well and I feel like he'd be such an obvious upgrade for them. So I don't know. I think the Red Wings from me are kind of top of mind there. Yeah, I agree. I think the Red Wings are number one for me. And one that intrigues me,

I don't know if it's going to happen, but the Blackcocks. Like Luke Richardson, I think it's, I think maybe running out of a little runway there in Chicago. I would be interested. And I think that it's obvious, a different situation, Detroit versus Chicago right now in terms of their readiness.

But I feel like that would be a nice fit in both places. I do like Detroit for sure is number one. And I think that you're really coming up on Lone's kind of tenure ending there because at some point you've got to take a step forward. And I know the roster isn't amazing either, but like Monty has proved that he can maximize in a pretty underwhelming roster, and I think the opposite has been proven by Derek Lone. Like in Detroit needs something right now to get the most out of the group that they have.

Yeah, that trip they just went through and completed it in California was about as catastrophic as you can have. Right now, they go through, they lose to the ducks, the kings, the sharks. They give up 15 goals in those three games. I think even more importantly, though, they just have no offensive footprint as a team.

Like, they got out, shot 100, and 4 to 64 in those games. They're generating 1.5, 5-1-5 goals per hour this season. They're 30-second and shots chances and expected goals. I'm with you that personnel-wise, there's only so much you can do. Like, they have Ben Chirot and Jeff Petrie still playing top four minutes despite getting caved in every night. But I also think, like, Michael McCurdy had this interesting thread

that was kind of noting how every time their games are within one goal, whether it's tied, they're leading by one or they're trailing by one. They essentially just immediately park the bus. get into a defensive shell and don't create anything. And I think that might speak to some tactical conservatism, right? And I feel like that's an obvious area you could just improve just by like pushing a bit more offensively and letting your players play. And I do wonder if Jim Montgomery came in if he would just immediately do that and

things would just look a little bit different for them. I'm not sure how far I would get them. But you know, talking about lame duck coaches, I believe Derek alone isn't the last year of his deal. This is his third season there. They haven't made the playoffs. They came really close last year. I think people were expecting they take that step this year

and they look like they're just regressing and moving into other direction. And like I said, I feel like just looking for scapegoats and kind of throw someone under the bus, I feel like for Steve Eiserman, just putting all of that blame on with Eric Lawn and hiring a second coach is probably the thing we're going to see whether it's right now

or down the road. I would do it right now while John Montgomery is still available, but we'll see what they do. Yeah, and like to your previous point, like that's what you saw Montgomery do. with the Bruins when he arrived was like he kind of freed up their guys to just play their game and be a little bit more aggressive and take the chains off that were were applied when Bruce Cassidy was there like Bruce Cassie I think used such a structured defensive system like

didn't really allow a lot of the guys specifically on the blue line to to activate and to jump into play and be a little bit more aggressive and when Montgomery came in you started to see them change the way that they played and it really made a difference specifically for those guys on the back end and like a most sider under Montgomery would be pretty fascinating

to me to watch to see like how much different he would play and how much it would affect the wings another spot that I'm looking at like that absolutely needs a coaching change but I don't know if Montgomery is the guy is Anaheim

I just feel like in Anaheim, Greg Cronin has kind of worn out as welcome. And you can see it all over the faces of everybody on that team who wears the sweater. And it's unfortunate, especially considering like the year-to-year turnaround on the perception of Greg Cronin has been kind of unbelievable because they started off the season last year. And you're like, oh, wow, he's like getting some results out of this group. And they're starting to play pretty well. And like a lot of the players were talking about how how, how, how, how, how, how,

awesome it was to play for him and like how how he pushed them every single day. And I don't know what's happened there, but it's it's kind of turned into a mess. So I think Montgomery at this point, like probably is going to have his pick of a job. And I don't know if that's the most appealing one. And we had this conversation on what chaos today about Pittsburgh and like how Mike Sullivan might be in his last days there, which honestly, I think firing Mike Sullivan would be a favorite of Mike. Sullivan at this point. I look at the Pittsburgh job as one of the least attractive jobs in all of hockey right now based off of their roster construction, some of their commitments,

and what might be happening there in the next year or so. Like that job would not be attracted to me whatsoever. No, that would be a bad one. It's just to step into. I feel like the Ducks one you mentioned is the exact opposite of that, where the vibes have been so bad. Now, they're coming off a three-game winning streak here, right? They just beat those Blackhawks. You mentioned last night. So I think maybe a little bit of that sort of buzz is starting to die down. But I think ultimately, like big picture of you, we had that report recently. The players have been increasingly unhappy with what's going on there. There was a lot of stuff at the end of last season with the exit interviews where they express their displeasure. I think there's like a massive generational

gap almost, right? We had that Lubushkin comment in the preseason where he was just complaining about how like he would waste so much time during practices or whatever, just telling them stories as opposed is actually practicing. And I don't know what they're trying to accomplish necessarily, but the worst case scenario for them is kind of what's been playing out, where it's not the losing. It's that guys like McTavish and Ziegress are all taking steps back and just looking so miserable.

I think Leo Carlson's the only one of those young forwards that's really taken another step this year. And so they need to address that. And I feel like for whatever flaws you might have as a coach, we know that Montgomery, like his players love him. And he'd immediately just come in and improve the vibe. and let them play more fun-free hockey. And so I would really like that as a fit.

I'm in complete agreement with you where the Penguins won would be a disaster in terms of like trying to step back into it immediately and I guess rebuild your image or whatever or have a second go at this because that's such a sinking ship that I would, if I were advising him, I would tell him to enjoy his time off before accepting that one,

assuming they eventually fire Mike Sullivan this season. Yeah. And I mean, I don't think that anybody, I hope nobody looks at the situation in Pittsburgh and says like that's Mike Sullivan's fault. Mike Sullivan's a bad coach. It's just kind of the what's been handed to him there. And I don't know.

Like it's a weird situation for Montgomery too because again, he's in a walk year right now. Like he's got one year left on that deal. It's not like he's going to be paid to sit on his butt for like the next two, three years. So maybe he takes like the first job available to him. But I think that he's in a good spot where he's coveted and there's going to be opening soon.

and I think that he can do better than Pittsburgh. Yeah, I think the more interesting Penguins note here, assuming they eventually fire Mike Sullivan this season, is that it feels like he would be a logical fit for the Bruins. Obviously, because of his reputation and past success, but also he's a guy who definitely favors his veteran players, and so it'll be a seamless transition to go on this Bruins team and work with a lot of their bets.

But I don't know, I feel like there are... He also is family, too. a very important prunes player. I don't know if anybody sees that as a positive or a negative, but he's Charlie McVoy's father-in-law. That's true. Charlie, you're going back on PowerPlay One, baby. I don't know, man.

This Penguins team is tough. I've spoken a lot about them this season, but you watch most recently last night on Tuesday night against the lightning, and Tristan Jari's got a shutout going heading into third period. You're like, all right, wow, the miracle's going to happen here, and then they give up not only two goals, and then the third and overtime,

but those two last ones are like in such cartoonish fashion where it's just, it's really tough to watch these days. I'm not going to, I think his hands are tied because of the personnel, I can't exactly say that Mike Sullivan has done an amazing job this season either because they kind of just haven't really changed anything. I don't know what you can really change there,

but just like aesthetically and from an optics perspective, it's increasingly tough to justify, I guess, unless they're just very happy losing and improving their draft lottery odds, which they probably are. are. All right, you got any other kind of next coach fired candidates or hot seats? I feel like we named a lot of the obvious ones. I know that Andrew Brunette is on the top of a lot of these lists that people are publishing now.

I guess if they keep losing just because of their expectations. But yeah, like I think they can appreciate how good of a coachie is. They saw it firsthand last year. I know that the Bruins did as well with Jim Montgomery and 20 games made them change their mind. But I feel like for the Predators and Andrew Brunette, that would be a bad decision, in my opinion. Yeah, I agree. And there's maybe call me a fool, but like I still think I expect the predators to to reverse course a little bit and be okay. Yeah, scoring more like they did in their last game against the Canucks will really help.

Similar to the penguins, though, they look a little bit slow to me, especially defensively. And I'm not sure if they can actually play the way Andrew Burnett wants them to, which is a bit concerning. But we'll see on that. Okay, let's talk about the abetchen injury because I haven't done a show since he got hurt. in Utah, after starting the season with no goals in his first three games, I've got him down for 15 in 15 games since then. I think you noted this on your show that I was listening to, obviously the fact that he's once again at this age leading the league in scoring for now is incredible and his, you know, shrinking the gap between him and Gretzky as he tries to get there this season. I think the manner in which he's done at this year is almost just as impressive to me

because it's for a couple of years, we've spoken about how his game has really become limited offensively in a way where, like, people who weren't watching the NHL 10 to 15 years ago when he was young, maybe might not realize that he was just like the ultimate freight train and he would just come down the wing off the rush and just bowl over people and put together a series of moves and just like forcefully just get the puck into the net. And you'd be like, how did he do that? That was amazing.

And then he became this guy who just essentially started getting memed for standing in the left circle, not being guarded, and just hammering one-timers and scoring on them, right? And this year, that power play hasn't really gotten going yet. I think there's still like 24th or something in the league. But at 5-1-5, him playing with Strome and one of my favorite players Lexi Proto's, they've been just a wrecking ball, and he's been scoring in a number of different ways. I think he's third in the league in 5-1-5 goal scoring. And so for me, like, the manner in which he's done it and how he's kind of thrown back the clock at 5-1-5 is almost just as impressive to me as the actual raw goal totals themselves.

Yeah, 100%. Like, he's really diversifying the way that he's scoring. And, like, I also think there, this is, it's obviously unfortunate that Ovechkin is hurt for however long he's out, especially with how well he's been playing recently. But it's, it's kind of just like the point that we're at right now and how good everything was in Washington with the team with Ovechkin, like how much he seemed to be enjoying playing and like I just go I go back to the goal that he scored I forget against who but like he threw it off of

a defender's stick and it went in it was like one of the ugliest goals that he scored this season and he was just celebrated it by laughing he was just laughing with a bunch of his teammates and like it just seems like he's in a really good spot right now both with his on ice play the team and like just obviously his production. I don't think that anybody fully expected him to lead the league

and goals at 39, but with all of that kind of coming together and hitting a perfect storm and then having it immediately shut down with an injury is like that's what made it really hard to swallow is that we were like just getting into, holy

crap, get a load of this guy at 39 and we couldn't enjoy it for more than like 10 minutes before he got hurt. Yeah, he had just scored in five consecutive periods in Vegas in Utah, which is incredible. And it's really unfortunate that that had happened. I'm holding out hope because I think they've listed it as week to week. But after he got hurt, he was able to at least go back on the ice and test it out by going for a spin.

So I don't think it's like anything catastrophic structurally. So we'll see, obviously, I think players, he might be the exception because you just never really seen him be hurt for an extended period of time. But older players typically do take a bit longer to recover. And so I think there's some nervousness with that. But it's pretty much the first thing that's happened to the Capitals this season that hasn't been absolutely amazing, right? Like they've had a few games, like the Leafs game where they kind of blew it late and didn't wind up winning.

But they've been so entertaining and so fun to watch and just vibes-wise, everything's been going to their way to the point where I was watching that game against Utah and they go to intermission. And I don't know if you caught this, but like their local broadcast on a monumental sports or whatever, pants at a studio for their intermission. and they've just got Bruce Boudreau standing there like super awkwardly wearing his seat and then he just went on this unbelievable

10 minute tirade on goalie interference because they dubiously gotten a goal taken off the board in the previous period and he's just like going off on how goalies are too coddled and how he hates it and then he like stopped short and he's like all right I probably shouldn't say what I want to say next and I'm like no boost please keep going so the vibes wise like Bruce is the best

everything that's going on with the caps right now is amazing and hopefully Ovechkin doesn't miss too much time because it was such a good story. That was kind of unfolding before our very eyes. Yeah. And my biggest fear was that, like, Ovechkin, as he nears Gretzky, it would just be like a sad, sad show that, like, that was the only thing worth tuning in for.

And it was happening at a slow pace. And so the way that the season has started for Washington, like, it was the complete opposite of that. They were one of the most fun teams to watch. He was ripping it up. Like we were talking about, you know, now he may not do it next year. might do it by like the all-star break that doesn't exist because doing four nations face off but

like it could happen by midway through the year with the way that he's producing so again like it the only i think it's going to be all right but it's just it instills some fear in me that that we're going to maybe like waste what was lightning in a bottle here for the washington capitals yeah me too um all right we got a couple more minutes here i want to talk to you about your uh your recent excursion to Utah. I don't have as much time left as I was hoping for it to get into that, but do you have any kind of quick notes on that that you think are relevant? I really enjoyed your interview with Bill Armstrong,

not to butter you up here, but it was awesome just seeing a GM sit down and kind of so openly and frankly talk about stuff. And you guys tried to ask him some sneaky questions, and he actually indulged you quite a bit, I thought. So that was a pretty fun watch. I'd recommend that for anyone who's listening right now. Yeah, he was great. He was our first general manager,

and I don't think that I could pick a more perfect guy because he was just very conversational and casual. And he's just extremely nice. And yeah, so thank you. But also, like, Utah impressed me more than I thought it would. I was pretty skeptical about, like, the whole arrangement. Not, like, about, like, the success that they might have there, but just more about how quickly it all came together.

And they kind of just, like, cobbled together a team for this year. It definitely has some startup vibes to the whole operation. And I think they're a little bit understaffed and they're trying to work through it. But I also think that what is there is extremely encouraging. And I think the commitment to making it work is absolutely there. And they do not feel like a little brother in that city. They don't feel like a little brother in that building,

which has been home to the jazz for forever. they are really, really investing and embracing the team. And I think that it was really cool to be there on the Jersey drop day in which they finally got jerseys that fans could get. We were there for that. And it was unbelievable, a line completely around the Delta Center. I think the biggest regular season like pro shop day in league history in terms of merchandise moved.

was it was unbelievable. It was an absolute scene. They really care. And I think the biggest thing that I took away from that day is that that line around the block was only season ticket holders. About 90 to 95% of season ticket holders, they estimate showed up to get a jersey at like 10 in the morning on a Friday. So like when people should be working, that many people to be there, only season ticket holders.

And we were told by the team that only five. percent of season ticket holders for the Utah Hockey Club are also season ticket holders for the Utah Jazz, which is a way smaller number than I expected. So I have no doubts about that working there, especially with like the team is okay right now, but the atmosphere in that building was, was really awesome for the two games that we got, even the one during the week. And it helps that true to, true to form in the name of your show, you probably caught, in my opinion, in the most chaotic period of hockey that we've seen this season, that third period against the hurricanes.

Carolina. Yeah. Oh, yeah. The three kick. It was unbelievable. And then the 11 straight minutes or whatever it was of a power play time for them. That was quite a scene. All right.

We got to get out here, Pete. I'll let you plug some stuff. Let the listeners know where they can check out that video that I just talked about with Bill Armstrong and all the stuff you've been working on these days. Yeah, what chaos? Monday through Thursday, we go live on YouTube at noon Eastern. And then you can watch the show after the fact. if you can't get there live, but it's YouTube.com slash at what chaos, at what chaos, or at what chaos show.

Sorry, YouTube.com slash at what chaos show. And it's at what chaos show on all the social media platform. So we're constantly putting out stuff. We've got, I guess I'll tell you first before anybody, anybody listening to the show. We got Lucas Raymond next week, which I'm very excited about, got him in person. He's very fun. Gives us some good stories. So yeah, we got a lot of players, a lot of, we got our first GM, and we're doing stuff throughout the season.

So tune in to us there. Well, this show is a big fan of Lucas Raymond, so I'm looking forward to checking that out. Keep up the great work. I hope you know, I hope you don't mind. I've stolen one of your frequent guests in Steve Peters. I had him on earlier. Oh, he's the best. I'm having him on again this week to close out.

So I really enjoy my shows. I was like, listen, Pete, you got to come on and do my show instead, and he's going to oblige me. Pete, this was great. Keep up the awesome work. Looking forward to all those interviews and your regular shows. Thank you to everyone for listening. We'll be back on Friday with a mega day here in the feed. I think we're dropping three shows pretty much at once.

So check back in then. In the meantime, thank you for listening to us on the Sports Night Radio Network.