The Hockey PDOcast - Episode 130: If You're Going To Do It, At Least Do It Right

Episode Date: January 18, 2017

Mike Johnson joins the show to help pick this year's All-Stars. Here’s a quick rundown of the topics covered: 1:15 Should we care about the event? 6:30 Atlantic Division All-Stars 24:20 Metro Division All-Stars 33:30 Central Division All-Stars 48:00 Pacific Division All-Stars Every episode of the podcast is available on iTunes, Soundcloud, and Stitcher. All past episodes can be found here in chronological order. Make sure to subscribe so that you don’t miss out on any new episodes as they’re released. All ratings and reviews of the show are also greatly appreciated. Thanks for listening! See acast.com/privacy for privacy and opt-out information. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices If you'd like to gain access to the two extra shows we're doing each week this season, you can subscribe to our Patreon page here: www.patreon.com/thehockeypdocast/membership If you'd like to participate in the conversation and join the community we're building over on Discord, you can do so by signing up for the Hockey PDOcast's server here: https://discord.gg/a2QGRpJc84 The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Media Inc. or any affiliate.

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Filippovich. Welcome to the Hockey PEDEOCast. My name is Dimitri Filipovich. and joining me as my good buddy, Mike Johnson. Mike, what's going on, man? Oh, good, DeMere. How are you doing? I'm good, man. It's been way too long since we've had you on the show. I know you're a busy guy, so I don't want to take up too much of your time,

but I feel like at least once a month or once every six weeks, we've got to get you on here. Listen, you know where I'm at. I'm always available. It is you who is becoming very busy, which is a good thing. We happy to see your voice and your words in more and more places, because it's making people smarter. Well, I'm happy to hear you say that. But yeah, you got to keep busy in this industry.

And you know what? I haven't had a chance to discuss the All-Star game much on this podcast up until now. And I figured that I'd kind of solicit your help to help me figure out whose play this season's actually warranted in all-star appearance or at least consideration. And who was voted on but probably didn't deserve it. So do you want to just get right into it? Yeah, absolutely. Let's go.

Cool. Okay. I think some theoretical questions first to get into before we actually get into the guys we're picking. Do you care about this game at all? Currently as a fan, I am not as intrigued by the game. As a player, I think it is a real honor for guys to be recognized and asked to go. I understand if you're one of the guys that is so great that Sidney Cravee gets asked, a dozen years in a row that maybe it doesn't become quite as special.

But I think it's not for me, and it's not even for the players. This game is for, it's a business weekend where the NHL can do a lot of business with their sponsorship, their corporate sponsors, and get their best players around their biggest sponsors. And that's part of the engine that drives the revenues of the game. So the players need to appreciate that their attendance is important because they're getting half of everything that they can generate or help generate through things like this. And the other thing is for, it's for the kids. It's for younger people who want to watch breakaways and crazy games

and the best players do funny things. And, you know, maybe the ones who are a little bit older like I am, you kind of roll your eyes to say this is not that great. But for kids who are falling in love with the game who look up to these players as idols, it matters to them. So for those guys, it's important. For me, even in my current capacity as an NHL analyst, it's not that significant.

Having said all that, last year's was actually pretty fun. Last year's was pretty interesting to watch the tournament go down and the John Scott influence and all those things. It was as interesting as I can remember the actual game or event being. Yeah, I mean, I'm of two minds of it. Like, obviously, you know, it's, you don't want to take it too seriously, and you just take it for what it's worth. It's supposed to be a fun little event where everyone kind of gets together.

For media members like you and I, it's a good networking opportunity. As you mentioned, it's a good, business opportunity for sponsors and all that. And for young fans of the game, it's kind of cool to see all these guys that don't get to play together on a nightly basis kind of mix it up and have some fun with it. And I think that when it comes to actually picking the team,

I actually kind of take it a bit more seriously than I probably should just because there actually is things on the line here in terms of performance bonuses and contracts. And sometimes this stuff gets referenced. And, you know, when I'm discussing a player's leg, or Hall of Fame candidacy or future contracts for certain players. So I think if we're actually going to go through with this event, we should probably actually pick the guys who deserve to go there based on their play

rather than just putting a bunch of names in a hat and just kind of picking random guys. And I think it's okay to forego big-name players if they are not as deserving as a lesser-name player because generally speaking, you're going to have 80% of the guys they were going to be big-name guys no matter what, because they deserve to be there. That's why they're big name. But if you have a case of Taze, for instance, this year, whose play does not warrant all-star inclusion, it's okay to say no to him.

I get the sponsors like Jonathan Tate's, but generally there'll be enough big stars there to appease everyone. So let's recognize the guys who do deserve to go. And I don't, you know, financially for sure, if you're one of the guys who have a rookie bonus or one of those things in your contract, definitely. But I'm more for the recognition. recognition for guys to get because if you're not a regular all-star candidate, you may not

have another chance. Cam Atkinson may never get another chance to go playing an all-star game. But he deserves to be in this one, and he's not getting asked to go because he's Cam Atkinson and not Alex Webatchkin. So, yeah, so I'm with you. I just take, when I put my list together when the teams were coming out, I went with the rules where I had a player from every team, but I just said, I don't care what name that player is. I'm taking the best guy that I can think.

Doesn't matter if he's not the West well-known player. It doesn't matter who I leave off. I'm taking just the most deserving. And in many ways, I think that's how they should do it. Yeah. And I think that I understand the guidelines for, you know, you want to have one player represent, at least one player from each

team representing them, and you have to have the six forwards, 3D, and two goalies on each team. But I think, like, we'll get into this when we discuss the Metro Division, but sometimes those restrictions make it very difficult because you'd like to put like seven or eight forwards and maybe 2D in a particular division, but you can't and then sometimes maybe guys get left off,

but they actually deserve to be there. Yeah, you know what? I mean, I think the easiest way to fix it beyond, you know, using your criteria, which I'm sure is the very best there is, is to just add two more forwards and one more defense. Make it eight and four. Yeah. And then, you know, pretty much you'll be able to get in all the deserving players

and you'll probably be able to get all the big stars if maybe they aren't quite as deserving and everyone probably will go home happy. I don't think the players will get too upset about, you know, not playing quite as much or whatever. They don't care while they're there. They're just having a good time. So maybe just expand the roster a little bit just to include some of those periphery guys. If you want to give it to the most deserving, then you can also have the big stars. You want to give to the big stars.

You can also get it to the most deserving. Yeah. Okay. Let's get into it. And let's start with the Atlantic Division. And I sort of broke it down team by team. and I think that this division's probably the most cut and dried. Like, I don't really have any major issues with any of the guys that were necessarily selected.

I mean, for Montreal, you have Shea Weber and Kerry Price, and I think that we're both probably pretty cool with those two selections. Yeah, for Montreal, although in my world, I had Max Patcheretti on the team as well. So if you're having Patrick Reddy on, who are you kicking off in terms of some other forwards? I'm paying off Brad Marchand. Interesting. You know, I know, I know Brad Chattretti on. Mad Marchand.

Remember, I did this before he had his five-point game this past weekend. Right. And the picks were made before he had that five-point game. So you can't reference it now. I get that he's a huge possession player. I get that him in Paris-Bergrand drive that team. But Montreal is quite a bit better than Boston. I even pains me to say because I got a lot more assist than goals,

but I recognize that goals are more important and more difficult to get that assist. Patcheretti has more of those than... Brad Marchand. And so I don't care if there's three Montreal Canadians. I think that I would take Patcheretti over Marchand. You know what's funny?

I think the last time I had you on this show was about like six weeks ago or so and we were discussing, I think Max Patcheretti exactly, in terms of he was one of the guys that was getting a lot of shots but wasn't converting a lot of them into goals and we were discussing.

At some point, that shooting percentage would come around. Yes, yeah. We were saying how, you know, it's easy for us to be like, yeah, wait for it, but it's understandable. you're Max Patcheretti or if you're the Canadians to kind of be freaking out a little bit.

But, you know, like, I don't think there's any player in the league. I mean, I'm sure there are some guys, but he seems like for a guy that's consistently scoring so many goals and making such a big difference, it feels like every year there's at least some point in the season where there's like these articles coming out, like, what's wrong with Max Patoretti? Like, it's so bizarre to me. Like, there's never anything wrong with him. He's a fantastic player.

Yeah. If something wrong means 35 goals in, you know, 65, 7, 8, 6. 65 points, then yeah, I guess something's wrong with them. Well, it's two things. It's Montreal because it's Montreal. There's a ton of attention. He's the captain that is the most high-profile captaincy in the league. By far.

More responsibility than anywhere else. I played in Toronto, maybe the second or the biggest market. Montreal, maybe the second, maybe the Rangers. What the captain in Toronto has to put up with is nothing even close to what the Montreal Canadian captain has to deal with. So that's part of it. And I think it's just for goals. scores, we still are working to get through the idea that everyone talks about consistency while

he's a streaky score. And I think we just, everybody's a streaky score. When you score 40, you don't score a goal every other game. You get 15 and 20 games and then you get five in 20 games. Like that's how the nature of the sport. That's just how it happens. And you end up with where you should end up, which is 40 goals. That's just the way it works. And I still, I still think people cling to that idea when somebody goes through a slump, whether it's because of poor play or poor luck, they want to say, well, he doesn't do it every night because nobody does it every night. So we've got to get past that, and I think Matt's Patchretti, as a goal score who can run hot for stretches and cold for stretches, falls victim to that. Yep. No, I completely agree. Every goal score other than maybe Alex Ovechkin is basically like that in terms of having ups and downs and peaks and valleys.

and I'm perfectly fine with having Pat Charette on this list instead of Marchand. I had Marchand on mine personally, but it's a coin flip. I mean, you can't go wrong either way. I think that having Tuka-Rask as the Bruins representative is a no-brainer. There's a lot of good goalies in this division, but if you just look at the difference between how he's played and how all of his backups have played, like you can make the case that he's one of the frontrunners for MVP just based on, you know, without him, they'd be completely screwed.

they're in the playoffs right now, although just hanging on because they've played more games. They've only won one game when he hasn't played. And the team numbers are so much worse, like twice as many goals against. If they're playing, all the goalies in Boston play behind the same team. And yet his numbers are so much better than whatever backup they put in. In other words, McIntyre or Houdobin or Malcolm Suban, yeah, absolutely no-brainer for Tukor-Rass to be the Boston representative. For me, it was an easy pick.

Yeah, yeah, I think that I looked at it. it a few weeks ago and those three guys that you mentioned as the backups combined for like an 870 or an 880 save percentage for a year or something. It's impossible to win when you're getting that, yeah. And it's hard to put up an 880 for 10 games. Like that's not easy to do. That's not good goal-thetting. Yeah. Yeah. So for the Leafs, Austin Matthews, no-brainer. Is there anyone else on that team that you kind of at least thought about for a bit? I mean, you could look at Nassum-Crodgerie for the year he's had. the goal he's scoring.

All of the underlying numbers are very strong, but I don't think they were good enough. And the Leifes, again, this is 10 days ago, the Leaps were not where they are in the playoffs now. They've been playing well as of late and climbed into a playoff spot. But you could consider Cadre, you can consider Mitch Marner for all that he's done. You could consider Freddie Anderson in that.

But I didn't really, no, I thought Austin Matthews, and that was it for Toronto for me. Yep. And then similarly for the senators, it's Eric Carlson and that's it, I think. Yeah, that's easy. That was very easy. Yeah, there wasn't much else to talk about there. Yeah. Okay, so the Panthers are interesting because I have no issue with Vinny Trochik. And I think that, you know, most casual fans probably would be like, who? Like, why is he going to the All-Star game? But then you just look at sort of what he's meant to that team, just purely based on usage, especially with all the injuries they've had. and Sasha Barkov not really taking that next step to becoming a Anzegov-a-Kobatar-type star

that we would have thought he'd take this year. So I think that, you know, Troutcheque is a pretty good candidate for me. He is, absolutely. There's three options, really, for Florida. And I think it was going, it's Yager, if you want to go, like, the Veteran Lifetime Achievement Award and tie him into maybe his last all-star game opportunity. But I don't go that route. And so to me, it's Barkoff or Troyf.

check, and I put Barkoff in. I think that he had more points than Troycheck had more goals at the time of the selections. He's an excellent possession guy. His shot shares are really high, and he's done it with a revolving door. I mean, Yarmor Yager is 45 years old, and a whole bunch of different wingers. Marcia had a great start, but he hasn't had his usual guy there at Uber-Doh. So I put Barkoff. I have no problem with Troycheck, but I put Barkoff and also, you know, he gets difficult matchups. He plays a lot of tough centermen up head to head, so I went with him. Yeah, I think that's fine. I'm not going to fight you over that one.

For the lightning. Save it for later. Yes, yes. So for the lightning, Victor Headman and Nikita Kutrov made it, and it's tough to quibble with either. I think that the interesting thing for, okay, there's two things about the lightning here. one for headman where do you have him in terms of sort of the norris race at this point of the season compared to his peers and the second thing is like i've been i've spent so much time just

looking into the numbers and trying to be watching their games and trying to make sense of what's going on with the lightning this season and obviously the injuries have played a huge role i mean they're playing a lot they're there they're this revolving door of guys coming from the hl and having to play games for them here and there and they're all over the place with their roster but it's just from start to finish they've just been so underwhelmingly mediocre and I'm just trying to make sense of what's going on with them.

It's been tough and you can't ignore the injuries of course that's a legitimate reason excuse reason, whatever you want to call it, it's reality they've had some really important players injured for for long stretch of Stamco's being the number one of them

their goal tending has been significantly worse I don't know if Ben Bishop is, you know, last year, Steve Stamco's didn't have a great year. And he talked about after the fact that he was very bothered, distracted, whatever you want to call it, by the prospect of leaving the team and all that was going on with his pending understicture free agency. And I wonder if Ben Bishop is going through the same thing.

I mean, he's a human. He kind of figures his time there is going to end in Tampa, whether it is in March 1st or whether it's in the summer or whatever. maybe that's impacting his performance a little bit because he's not been great. So, I'm not sure. I mean, their Tampa's structure seems to have gotten away from them. They don't play a very tight game anymore.

They give up more shots, more chances seemingly this year than they have in years past. That's a concern. It's tough to be successful that way. You know, they're still out-shooting teams and out possessing them, but goal-tending hasn't been there, and it's been an issue.

But for headman, you know, I would have him probably, if Brent Burns has got to be a finalist for sure. Yep. For the Norris. I probably have headman as a finalist at this point, given the role he plays and the points he puts up,

and, you know, how important he is to that team over, you know, look at the drop off, I know Straumann's been excellent, but he's been in on the lineup. But when you start getting down to, you know, the Schuster's and the garrisons and the Nesterovs and those kind of players, a lot is on Edmund's plate to run the table there in Tampa. And so for that reason, he probably is in the final.

He's a finalist for me. Yeah, I have Burns as sort of the clear-cut runaway winner right now, and I have Headman and Carlson interchangeable there in the two-three. And I think that the thing that's working in Headman's favor and that discussion is heading into this season one thing I noted was you know the thing that was holding him back from these north discussions was just that he wasn't really playing nearly as much as some of the other top guys and a lot of that was because Tampa Bay could afford to do so they had a lot of depth and they were you know playing great hockey so no one was really complaining but this year mostly by necessity

he's had to play north of 24 minutes he's approaching 25 for the year and and that's a big jump from where he's been in years past and he's done remarkably well in those minutes so I think that you know it's pretty cool to see his ascension towards becoming one of those top guys over the years. Yeah, and it's really been a slow and steady progression. Remember, you know, taking second overall. He was between Tavares and Douchain, I think. My memory goes back to be correct, and it wasn't that smooth.

He didn't step in and say, okay, this is the guy. This giant from whatever that town is Romoto plays. I don't even try to say it, is the guy. It's taken two, three, four years, but he has ascended now, and he is one of the top five defense in the league, and he has been for a few years, and he will continue to be. So, yeah, he deserves to be an all-star game.

He deserves to be a Norris trophy finalist, and he is both, in my case. And same with Kuturoff. I mean, I think a lot of people around Tampa will tell you that Kuthorov might be their best offense to flare, which does a lot, given they have Stamco's on that team. So Kutrov's up there in league scoring. He scores lots of goals.

He helps the teammates get better. So, yeah, I have Kutroff. on my roster as well. Yeah, I remember towards the end of last season, I wrote an article, which was kind of received not great by a lot of people, but I just made the point that, you know, Kucharov was the one guy.

They had to make sure they kept this summer, and he was much more irreplaceable than Stamco's was. And, you know, he hasn't let me down. He's played well this season. I think that the interesting thing was Stamco's that I think a lot of people don't mention is that, you know, he really had bounced back to form early in the season before he got injured.

And the effect of him not being in the last, lineup, you know, there's the actual goals themselves that he would have scored that they're missing and other people have to fill in. But I think there's also, you know, guys like him and Ovech can have this sort of gravitational pull on the defense where it's like they open up so many more lanes and options for their teammates and for other guys on their team just because, just because of their presence, either, whether they're on the ice or whether on the bench and the other team has to game plan for them and prepare for them. And I think that's sort of an underappreciated component of it. Yeah, yeah. And those, those

are tough to quantify because you know, you can look at what the team does when they're on the ice versus whether or not. But yeah, I mean having played with some very good players, you know, when Matt Sundeen was on the ice, the team was playing you differently because they weren't worried about you. They were worried about Matt. And

that's a good thing for other players that want to try to play offensively. So I think Stamco has that impact, and Kuthorov does as well. Underrated playmaker for me as well, not just strictly a goal score, but he can really really, you know, he can really pass it around as well.

So he's a no-brainer, and he'll fit right in in that all-star environment. Listen, I don't know about that phenomenon all too well. I mean, people are listening to this podcast right now, and they're not worrying about what I'm saying. They're waiting for MJ to speak, so let's, uh, let's, as if. Yeah, yeah. But this is, this word got tough, though. Yeah.

Okay, Buffalo. Who's going from Buffalo? Well, I'm fine with Caliq Pozo, just because... I'm not putting Kyle Gopozo in there. Do we have to put someone on their team? I put Jack Eichol. I don't care if he's only played 23 games. He's miles away their best player,

and I think that Ocpozo, which I'm happy for, and it's great for him that he got to go. But his numbers are so not that great that I think Eichol, despite playing half as many games, could go with him. Now that's a bit of a wild card pick because it opens up a whole bunch of doors, like how many games you have to play to go. And the fact that the team did so much better,

and a lot of the guys around him did so much better when he got re-inserted in the lineup. I put Jack Eichl on a bit of a wild card pick over Calogposal. Yeah, I think that there's no question he's their best player and most important player. I think that, you know, they've been a fascinating team this year because they have all this forward talent and a lot of it has missed various time with injuries here. but their best, their backbone of their team has been their goaltending, and unfortunately, you know, there's no place for this team for a guy like Robin Leonard just because there's other goalies just playing better than him.

But, I mean, like, he's a guy that deserves consideration just because he's arguably been their most important player from start to finish so far. Which you wouldn't have thought, and listen, Anders Nielsen's been no slouch in the backup spot either. No, he's been awesome. You know, and I'm not buying Nielsen stock just yet. I mean, I've seen too much in other spots, but, goal-tending hasn't been the issue. I really, yeah, their defense just hasn't come together the way they hope.

Ristolainen's palling up a lot of points, but he still gets, he gets boxed around a little bit, five-on-five, as far as, as, you know, he's in his own end an awful lot, and he gets out-shot and out-chanced a lot, which comes to playing with not a great team, but I know a lot of people are thinking Rastlis Rist-Linean might deserve consideration for the defense, but I think when you look at some of his underlying numbers beyond just the points, he's not up there with those other guys. Yeah, I like the Jack Eagle pick here. For the Red Wings, the Franz Nielsen pick really kind of split me in two separate directions

because for years I've loved, I love Franz Nielsen, and he's been this sort of poster child for being a perennally underrated player that, you know, the regular box car stats don't necessarily fully appreciate or encompass their impact on the game. But I don't, like, I just, I think that I would have gone, you know, sort of with your Iko wildcar pick, I would have gone with a guy like Anthony Manta here just because even though he hasn't played the full season for them,

when he has been in the lineup, he's just been so far away their best player that I think that, you know, the league wants to promote its youth and sort of this next generation of stars and kind of introduce some of these guys that haven't necessarily burst onto the mainstream scene yet to the casual fan,

and I think that having a guy like Manta there would have been a good opportunity to do so here. Wow, I like that one. And you know what? And when I was, you know, again, 10 days ago, Anthony Manton had played three, four less games. But you look at his numbers and he is, wow, better than I anticipated him being. Now, I love watching him play. He's always guys to see him on the ice.

He always looks like he's in control. Like good things are going to happen. The way he skates, the way he handles the puck, the way he moves his body around. It appears as though he should have the puck and good things are going to happen. So I went away from Nielsen. went a bit to like if a guy's not having a great offensive season and Nielsen certainly is not. I went to Hendrik Zetterberg just because he's a star, his numbers are better as far as goal scoring than Nielsen would have been by a fair margin or point getting.

He still does a lot of the other things really well defensively and in a shot share, all those different things. So I had Zetterberg, but you can convince me, listen, if Iicle can go, then Anthony Amanté could go, but I went with Zetterberg just to get a bigger name guy, certainly bigger. as deserving as Franz Nielsen this year. Yeah, yeah, I think that's fair. All right, let's move forward to Metro Division. And instead of going sort of team by team here,

because we're already at the 25-minute mark, and I feel like we could be here all day if we go at this rate, I think let's touch on some of the bigger topics. And I think that when I look at this division, this is where that sort of discussion about having the restrictions for having to have a certain number of players at each position really comes into play, because I love Anthony, I love Seth Jones.

but I think that, you know, guys like Cam Atkinson and Brennan saw it on his own team have been much more valuable than he has this year. But I had a tough time trying to find, you know, two other defensemen beyond Ryan McDonough to be on this team. So I think that that's sort of the main argument for Seth Jones here. Well, see, I went to his partner and said, I think Zach Werenski deserves to be there ahead of Seth Jones. I think Werenski plays often with Seth Jones as the same difficult match. matchups, he's got more points. Jones was hurt for a few weeks with the foot, and Werencki quarterback's the best power play in the league.

So for all those reasons, if you're going to take a defender from Columbus, then I think it should have been Werencki and not Jones. And talk about bonuses and impacts. You know Werencki has those in his contract, and he will not be claiming them now because he's not on his way to Columbus. So, yeah, I have Worenski over Jones, in because Columbus and also because Carolina doesn't have any compelling forwards. I put Jacob Slavin in there.

Yep. Not Justin Fawkes. Jacob Slavin is underrated. He gets lost down on the shuffle there in Columbus. He is a very good, underrated player. He pairs up with Pesci, and they do a lot of good things. And I just don't think he probably gets the attention. He deserves.

they have the best PK in the league, which he's a big part of. He has more points than Falk. And Falk's a real power play specialist. So if I got to get a hurricane on there and I need three defensemen, then Jacob Slavin's my guy. Right, yeah. It's interesting how time changes things, right? Because I think whether it was last year or two years ago, like Falk was left off this list and he was one of my guys is like he has to be on this team.

He's playing so well. But I definitely think that Slaven has surpassed him in terms of importance to this team. And, you know, it makes sense that Falkkech has. scores a lot of goals. He's that trigger man. He has a big shot in the power play, but as you mentioned, but Slavin is just one of those sort of like Chris Tanevish players, except he's a better skater, of course, but it's just like he does all these sort of little things that add up. And I'm glad that we have all of these more nuanced metrics now to quantify that and help show his impact on the ice, because if you're just looking at block shots and hits, you never know, right? Yeah, exactly.

You'd never know. You did like, oh, no, he's good, but why? Prove it to me. How was he good? and you need these kind of other kind of metrics and stuff to support players like that. And yeah, so he's probably lost the shuffle could deserve a bit of attention. Goaltenders were easy for the metro, no. Brobrosky, hopey, no-brainer, so simple. Well, I think the bigger story there with the goalies

is that Schneider and Lundquist have had such, you know, uncharacteristically poor seasons that's made that decision easy. Especially Schneider. especially Schneider. I mean, I thought he was going to be, you know, I thought he was on the top four goals in the league

heading into the season. I really like everything about him, and that team has come off the rails and also Lunkwist not yet being Lunkwis-like and being probably outperformed by Ante Ronta, which sounds crazy to say, but probably has happened to start the season, which is

unusual, but you turn to the forward. New Jersey can't put anyone on there, right? Like who on New Jersey deserve to go? So it's Taylor Hall. He's their best forward. I don't care how many games he's been injured for. The Islanders don't really have anyone that deserves to go,

so it's got to be John Tabaris. Yeah. Right? Philadelphia becomes interesting. You put Jeru, you put Vorichek, you put Wayne Simmons. I put Wayne Simmons in my pre-picks, so I was happy to see him make it on a personal level

because he's one of those guys that probably won't go again. Yeah. The way this is set up. and to recognize he's one of the best power play guys in the league. And so I was happy to see him get the nod out of Voracek, Zeru, and Simmons. Yeah, it's tough to differentiate those guys, I think, especially early on in the season of Warwick was playing at such a high level that he would have seemed like the obvious choice,

but he's tailed off a bit. And listen, I'm never going to complain about Wayne Simmons getting love. He's so fun to watch for, especially for kind of like hockey nerds or purists that are watching the little things, just the way he operates around the net, sort of how he positions his body to receive passes and make it easier for the guys getting him the puck and just the stick work he does.

I mean, he's such a treat to watch, and then obviously he does all of that more old-school physical stuff. So he's one of those players that just does a little bit of everything for whatever your taste or interest might be in a hockey player. He does, and so, yeah, absolutely. And I think probably around the league, on his team and stuff. I think a lot of people

were probably pleased to see him get recognized and go. Crosby and Malkin are easy, right? They have to go second and third in scoring, driving Pittsburgh along. The real difficult question, the Metro, is Cam Atkinson or Alex Ovechkin?

I mean, that really is what it boils down to. And again, 10 days ago when they made this decision, Atkins had more goals, more assists, more points on a better team. A team that really was, the story of the first half of the season. So I put Atkinson on my all-thir-te-year-old

now, Ovechkins had some big milestones and big moments in the last couple weeks, but that was a tough one because it's not like Ovechkin doesn't deserve to go, I guess, but I have Atkinson on nine. Yeah, I mean, it's tough. Like, it would feel weird to have this All-Star game without Ovechkin just because of sort of the personality and the star that he is. And his play has also warranted.

to score 40, 45 goals against the season. So it's, you know, he's still playing at a high level. But I actually think that I would have had Brendan Sott on this list ahead of Cam Atkinson, which I think is, I'm not sure as a popular opinion. But, you know, the interesting thing about Saad for me is he's second in the league in 5-15 points. He's neck and neck with Connor McDavid there. And the thing about him is, like, it's just the fact that he hasn't unfortunately gotten to crack that first power play unit. Like, I think if you put him on there, his, his total points would be just through the roof, but unfortunately, you know, they've been firing on all cylinders, and Sam Gagne has sort of taken that spot in front of the net, and there hasn't been a room for him

there. But I think that, you know, Saad, just his 5-1-5 impact in terms of driving the shot metrics, but also producing points is just too good for me to overlook. You know what? I got to tell you that he snuck out on my radar. I'm just, I looking at him now, and yeah, yeah. He's crazy, right? His numbers are incredible five-on-five. And Now, you know, we get hung up, not hung up, but we get very caught up on five-on-five numbers because they are indicative of the bulk of guys' play. Right. But there is, you still have to allow for value in being good on the power play.

Right? They still have to be somewhere in there. You're like, yeah, but this guy's amazing, the power play, and that matters. So that's probably not enough, but no, Brandon's odd. You look at how well he's done, and you're right. you could make a very, very easy case that he is as deserving, if not more, than Cam Atkinson. You know, maybe I fell in love with Atkinson because he's part of, like, he's kind of symbolic of the feel-good nature of all of what was happening in Columbus. Yep.

But you're right. Saad is a very compelling case. No, it's very easy to root for Cam Atkinson, as you just mentioned. And I think that, you know, sometimes we do get too hung up on 515 points. I mean, a lot of 5-1-5 production is sort of, I guess, more predictive of what is going to come in the future and sort of sustainability. But the All-Star game is kind of capturing what's happened in the first half of the season. And Cam Atkinson has banked a lot of goals and a lot of points, and that does count for something, right? Like the whole point of the game is to outscore the opponent.

So if you're generating more goals, that's a pretty valuable, valuable skill to have. Yes, absolutely. I mean, both are having great years. but I guess I'm surprised and you've opened my eyes maybe just how impactful and how good thought has been because he had a bit of a slow start

it seemed like the first 10 games as far as producing points and so maybe you didn't associate him with a guy that was having that kind of year but he is so yeah get on him I think did we had all the points

on the Metro Division here is there any other players we're missing? I think that's it I think we covered all the bases yeah okay let's move on to the Central and I think that an interesting discussion here is the Minnesota Wild because, you know, they just beat the Blackhawks and sort of surpassed them in the standings and they've been playing remarkably well. And, you know, I expected big things from them just because Bruce Boudreau teams always do well in the regular season. And there was no real reason to believe that they wouldn't be at least a playoff team. But I mean, they've exceeded even my expectations. But when you're trying to kind of take guys from this team and reward them on this All-Star team, it's tough because the whole nature, the whole nature of the Minnesota. while is that all the individual parts combine and it's sort of you know you have jason zucker and

grandland and koiwu is a line and then you have need onita rider who has been playing remarkably well especially defensively and you have all these guys that are sort of chipping in even the fourth line with jordan schrader and chris stewart but you know i think maybe eric stall is the one guy where he's just been so effective i mean he's almost at a point of game this season and and he's a guy that i definitely had concerns about as recently as last season and was working that someone might overpay him this summer, but the wild got him on a good contract, and he's made a world of difference for them.

He has, for sure, but I mean, I think, yes, and he's played well as of late, too, so he's piled up some points in the last kind of spit since the All-Star game was announced. But, I mean, Devin Dubnick's going to go, right? And so you're going to have representation there. Ryan Suter is going to go, as he should. Yeah, so I didn't, I did not,

have Territzal on mine. You can make an argument that he deserves to go, but I think you're right. Just the strength and numbers and the depth and the four lines

and everyone contributing probably minimizes his perceived impact, even though he's had a really good one on a really good deal. But if you're going to take multiple,

you know, it's basically that, because Devon Dubnick has to go, right? Yep. So you're basically you have to say there's only three extra picks

beyond one from each team for the central four. so if Crawford's going, I'm taking Kane, I'm taking Panarin ahead of Eric Stahl. Right? Yep, yep. So those guys don't get, and I'm taking Souter over Eric Stahl, and I'm taking Keece as well. So I just don't see the fit on where Eric Stahl makes the team.

Yeah, and here's the thing with Suter. I get his contributions to his team, right? He plays a ton of minutes every year, and he plays against the other teams best, and he plays, you know, he kills penalties. He's in all these high leverage minutes. But at least, you know, last year, for example, there was, you could quantify his 5-1-5 impact. He had very positive shot metrics.

And this year, for whatever reason, they've kind of fallen off the table. And I'm just, you know, he's always been one of those interesting test cases for whether guys reach a point of diminishing returns with regards to usage where I wonder if he was playing 24, 25 minutes, night, whether he might be more effective because he could spend more energy on each given shift as opposed to, you know, when he knows he's going to have to play 29, 30 minutes, all of a sudden

the actual impact. He manages it. He does. You watch him play, and there's moments where he doesn't push all the way through because he only has, if he's got 100% of his tank to spend, he has to be judicious and how he throws it out there because he's got lots of play, and you're right. I think they know that, though. I mean, he talked to Bruce Brudrow.

I've talked to Scott Stevens. Both about this. And I think last year he was like 28 and a half, almost 29 minutes per game. They wanted him down closer to 24, which would be a huge cut for him. But I think he would be better, and he would be better when they get to the playoffs. It hasn't quite gotten there this year. I think he's about a minute and a half lower, closer to 27. But, yeah, the shot, the shot shares are a bit off for him this year.

And yet his goal is four percentage, which is maybe not so predictive. but it's still very, very good. So I just, if he's the anchor of the best team in the West, and he plays the most minutes, and he's putting up some decent points, and, yeah, I had him on my team. Well, and one of the other things working in his favor is, if you're going to have three defensemen in this division,

you know, P.K. Sue Ben's one. Duncan Keith is another. And then, you know, a lot of other guys we would have expected to have really good seasons, haven't had them. Like, a guy like John Klingberg has really struggled. Roman Yosey has been very up and down. down. I had Bufflin on here for a while, but I'm perfectly okay with sort of penalizing him

just because of how bad the Winnipeg Jets have been, particularly lately. So I think that, you know, there isn't a third super obvious choice where you have to have them above Ryan's suitor. So if you want to make that argument, I'm perfectly okay with it. Yeah, I mean, who would, yeah, and who would that third defense, if it's not clear, who would it be? Would it be Chattonkirk? Could it be Chattonkirk? I don't, you know, If he played well enough, it might be. But, yeah, so I think Suter gets in there for sure. And when you move to the forwards,

Kane's going to make it. Sagan's going to represent Dallas. Tarasenko has to represent St. Louis. Tave got picked. He knows he shouldn't go. It should have been Panarin. He knows that. Yeah, let's not even waste time on that.

I think everyone knows that. We know top hundred players. He's going to be one of them, and good for him, but he doesn't belong there. The two ones to me So you have Winnipeg needs a pick And so does Colorado

So I went off the board on both I took Sheifley ahead of Line A And I took Duchyne And I took Duchenne ahead of McKinn Yeah Um I know Line is very good Scores a ton of goals

But I just think Shifley does As much or more to help the team out Everywhere His goals And at points totals are Well points are better than Line A goals Not quite there

But he scored a 20th already So I just think as a total player, he's probably better than Patrick Lainey. Oh, no question. And I think that, you know, a guy like Blake Wheeler is also ahead of Lainey on my list in terms of just Winnipeg Jets forwards. Oh, yeah. And maybe even Nick Eilers.

And I think that, you know, that's not a knock against Lainey because he's been electrifying so far before his injury and he's been very productive, particularly on the power play. But for young players, it's really tough to make that sort of next leave to being, you know, a positive driver at 5-on-5. and line A has struggled so far in his career at that, you know, the defensive component of the game. And I have no doubt that I'll come in time as his game matures, but I think it's fair to say right now that just in terms of pure impact,

he's been behind all of those guys in terms of what he's contributed to the team. Yeah, and all those other guys are really, really good players. So it's no embarrassment to get to be behind Blake Wheeler, who almost feels lost. We've lost there for a while, that Brian Little to play with on that next second line. and Nick Eler is becoming one of my favorite players. He is fantastically good.

But yeah, so I had Sheishley, and I had Dushain over McKinnon. You could talk me into going either way with them. You know, Duchin scores more goals, so I went with him. That's pretty much how it went down. Because no one in Colorado has done anything remotely close to warranting all-star consideration. Are you as frustrated watching Nathan McKinnon as I am just based on and he has these flashes where you could, you know,

you think, wow, this guy should be one of the best players in the league. Like, he's so dominant. He's clearly the best player on this ice on this given night, and then the total package just hasn't added up for him yet. Yeah, probably. I mean, and you think back to the World Cup and that overtime goal and how great he looked there, you're like, okay, this is the year. He's going to take this springboard of the World Cup,

and he is going to be a wrecking crew, an amazing player for Colorado. And it just, it hasn't happened. I almost wonder if, I'm just thinking off top of my head, if he needs to add,

we understand he's so fast, and that's great. I wonder if he needs to add a little change of pace to his game. The ability to slow it down and then speed it back up. Right. Because it seems like when you watch him,

he's always going at overdrive speed. And when there's open ice, he saw the breakaway goal. He scored this past week where he just flew through and nobody was even close to being able to catch him. But I wonder if he's just

occasionally offer a different look because even when guys are going super fast, if that's all they ever do, you can figure out how to defend it. But when you use change of pace, change a direction laterally to create a little more time and space, I would imagine more

offensive options would open up for them because his number is, wait, 63 is rookie year, 38 and 64, 52 and 70, and he's on pace for 56. I mean, those are good player numbers. Yep. There's not great player numbers.

I mean, those are numbers that, like, I got numbers like that in my career, and that's not where Nathan McKinnon should be. He should be well ahead of me. So, yeah, I imagine he's frustrated, and I wonder how much work they do on it. Like, how much work Colorado and Nathan McKinnon does breaking down his game,

trying to figure out where he can add more so that he can get more done, given his immense talent. Yeah, and I think that sometimes it's easy for us to be spoiled or kind of take it for granted because you see a guy like McDavid or Matthews coming to the league and just instantly kind of get it and just and do everything well right off of that. And there is sort of this adjustment period for a lot of other NHLers and Nathan McKinnon, as talented as he is, he's only 21 years old right now.

It's very possible that, you know, he's going to add these different wrinkles to his game. Like you'd love to see, you know, him go spend the summer, like just go to, go to Sydney. Crosby's lab in Halifax and just sort of like rewire himself to do all these different different little things little nuances and hopefully he will. I think that what gets lost in the shuffle a little bit is, you know, Taylor Hall struggled with this a lot, a long time in Edmonton where pretty much whenever he did anything, he had to do it himself. He basically had to take the puck from his own zone and go coast to coast. And that's a really tough thing to do in NHL. Generally, when you have to carry the puck that long yourself, you're going to have some of these highlight

real rushes that wind up on the top 10. But you know, it's a lot of times you're going to either lose steam or get hit or turn the puck over. It's not going to materialize. And if he had actual defensemen beyond Tyson Barry that could actually get him the puck in the neutral zone with speed, I think that would also do wonders for him. Or just not play on their own end the whole time. Yeah. Yeah, that too.

And Colorado as a whole, I mean, like, I expected them to be way better this year. I thought Patrick Waugh was a bit, like was part of the problem there. I thought just, you know, his lack of system and structure was not great. And I thought that Jared Bednar, without knowing anything about him, would improve just because I'm assuming if you get a job in the NHL, you have to be excellent at that. And yet here they are once again last in their job differentials and give it up tons of shots and scoring chance against. And so maybe it's not just Patrick Warren.

Maybe it wasn't him at all. Maybe it is in fact the players that they have there that are just incapable of playing back. for five on five because they're awful. They're terrible again. Oh, they're really, really bad. Yeah, it's not good. Surprisingly bad, yeah. Yes.

Yeah, the one final thing that I had on the Central Division here is I noticed that the Blues, you know, they had this nice little two-game stretch in California where I think they gave up one goal and two games combined, but, you know, they're 29th in the league and overall safe percentage, and that seems so weird for a Ken Hitchcock team, you know, we've come to expect with Brian Elliott and Jake Allen. And before that, Yoroslav Halak, they, they were always amongst the league leaders in terms of goal suppression and ability to stop other teams offensively. And I think that, I don't know, like, what do you do if you're them? Because they're in this weird little limbo here with, you know,

it's Hitchcock's final season there. Shatton Kirk's an impending free agent. Last year, they went for it. And they made it far, but then they lost David Backus for nothing. And they're sort of trying to balance winning now versus thinking about the future because they are a team that's not going to spend a ton of money. So just like when you look at that situation, how would you approach it in the coming sort of two months here before the trade deadline? I would be monitoring it very closely if I'm running St. Louis. A couple different thoughts.

One is you're carefully evaluating, you know, are we going to make the playoffs? And if we make the playoffs, can I be honest with myself and say we really don't have a chance against to go far, given the way our current. team is. If that's the case, then, and I think that is the case for St. Louis, they may fall right out of it, but, you know, if they're hanging around the wild card or whatever, I'm certainly not going to go out and add pieces and spend assets to get them. I would have two options. You know, you could trade away UFA to be a guy like Kevin Shankirk, I think, would have a pretty good return for him, especially if you get him to a team that he would resign with

before the season expires. Or do you just try to say we are where we are because our goaltender has lost his confidence. I mean, Jake Allen is still going to be the goalie of the future there. I think they still believe in him, but it's just not happening right now. But game is deteriorating technically and mentally maybe more so than that. So if you're going to just say, we're going to do a reset for Jake this summer, is there an option? Could you trade Kevin Shattankirk to Tampa for Ben Bishop in pieces?

You know, would that be something that St. Louis might entertain just to get an idea of, okay, well, we're going to fix our goal center for this year. You know, we're in the UFA, so we're not going to resign, and we're going to trade our UFA who we're not going to resign for him. We probably get a little something extra on top of Bishop because Chatton Kirk might stick around in Tampa.

But, yeah, that's the kind of thing I might look at if I'm running St. Louis, but yeah, and the hitch dynamic of his being last year, it will mean nothing to me as a manager. I won't start going for it because Hitch is That's not how I would be running the team. Right.

Yeah, of course. No, I think that's perfectly fair. They are in that weird limbo, and I think that, I guess, depending on how they play in the next six weeks here, it'll determine a lot what they do. Let's power through this Pacific Division because it's pretty ugly. I don't think it deserves too much of our time. I had the same six forwards as that were picked. I really did. On my list, I had McDavid, of course.

Jeff Carter, of course. Ryan Kessler, of course. He's been terrific in Anaheim this year. I need a flame. I took Johnny Goodrow. Now, you can, I know you're going to want Michael Backlin there, and I got no problem with that. Michael Backlin has had an amazing year.

I know where you're going with it. I know what you're up to. But I just went, again, 10 days ago, maybe not the point push, but Goddrow, big star, probably not as deserving as maybe a Michael Backland. but that's where I went. I took Pavelsky, of course,

and I took Bo Horvat out of Vancouver. Time to turn the page and get some youth in there. I never really considered Ryan Miller that seriously, so I took Bo Horvatham. Those are my six. Now, I know you can make a case for Backland. I'm expecting it to be a good one. Well, listen, I'm perfectly cool with Goddrow for two things.

One, he's pretty clearly their best player. You know, he's not leading the team in scoring right now, but it's because he missed 10 games or so, and if you adjust it for per game, he is. And I just want to watch him at 3 on 3 with Connor McDavid. I think that's going to be amazing. So I think just purely from the spectacle and sort of the enjoyment of the event,

I think it makes perfect sense. The other thing is I love Backland. He's been underrated for years. It's kind of tough to separate him. It's sort of what we were just discussed with the wild. Like, if we could just have Backlin, Kachuk, and Frolek, just be like one person and just send them out there as a line. I'm perfectly cool with that.

Yeah. Just send them out there and just shut down the other team's best three-on-three unit. But like other than that... Just play the other end the entire time. Yeah. And with Godroll, like, it's tough because, you know, he plays with Monaghan a lot. They've split him up recently. But they've had this sort of never-ending search, this revolving door to find a third guy.

You thought that it would be Brower because of how much they paid him and sort of it made sense in terms of being a stylistic fit where he just kind of stand in front of the net and bang the puck home. But it hasn't worked out. and then they went with a guy like Alex Chassan. And I just, it's not optimal. I think that the flames are an interesting little team here because the Pacific Division is so weak

that I think they very well could sneak into the playoffs. And if they have one big hole other than maybe acquiring a top four defense in which every other team could use, I think a more tangible thing is adding another scoring winger to play with those guys because they could desperately use one. Yeah, and go down to Arizona and grab Radham Verbara. You want to score, can play with good players. doesn't do much else, but he can score.

Reading for a bottom might be a good fit there. You're right, but that line probably deserves a quick little note management. Matthew Goodchuck, the impact he's had as a rookie, it's been very impressive for a league. Much like Backlin, they've been kind of similar players for other careers,

known to be defensive, but really do a good job not having to play on their own end the whole time, even when they're playing against other teams, good lines, and then Backlin as well. So, I knew you'd like Backlint, and I appreciate that, but I put good drill on that one. I'm cool with that. The defense, Burns, of course.

Dowdy, of course. Yep. And because Arizona needs a guy, I did not put Mike Smith. I can't put a goalie on the worst, like, one of the worst teams in the league on the officer game. I know he doesn't get a lot of support, and I know his say percentage is good and all that, but he's the most impactful player

on the ice, and he's on one of the worst teams. So as great as he sees him he's having, he can't be that great, because they're terrible. So I put Ekman-Larsen. closest thing to an All-Star on defense as well. So you would have Martin Jones and Cam Talbot as the two goalies here, or would you have Chad Johnson instead? Yes.

No, I put Talbot. I just don't know if Chad Johnson's played enough. I don't even know how many games Chad Johnson has played relative to Camp Talbot. Talbot's played a ton. Chad Johnson played 26, got a 9-24, 15 and 10. That's very good. I went with the goaltender who's played more, had more, had more, success numbers aren't quite as good but you know you played whatever it's almost 60 70% more

game so uh i went with talbot as maybe a bit of reward also for emminton being uh surprisingly pushing for the lead in the pacific yeah yeah i'm cool with that i think that you know pavelsky um is isn't a surprise by any means he's been one of the better players and more more productive players at least in the league for years and he does all these um bring things really well i think that, you know, his production's down a little bit, and that's, I think that's twofold. One is Joel Thornton has definitely taken a step back this year, particularly at 5-on-5, and I think that's slightly concerning. That's slightly concerning, you know, we know that he has a ton of miles and age, but he played so remarkably well last season that you could have possibly talked yourself into giving

him a two, three-year deal this summer when he's, when he's up for a new deal. But I think that with the way he's play this year, it would make it a pretty dicey proposition. And the other thing is that, you know, people that listen to his podcast often ask me to sort of point out stuff they can watch sort of nuances when they're watching the games. And I think the San Jose Jose Powerplay has changed this season where last year Logan Kutcher was much more of that sort of bumper where he would be a release valve to release a bit of pressure. Whereas this year, he's much more of a shooter. And I think that's taken away without looking at the numbers, even, I think that's sort of anecdotally taken away some of those opportunities for Pavelsky

where he was cashing in so much in previous years. So I think that sort of accounts for it, which means I'm cool with Pulaski. And one other thing, too, is that Tomash Hurtle, who has been hurt this year, he played a lot with that. Probably the best 5-on-5 line last year was Pavellski Hurtle and Thornton. And when I covered them the playoffs, they played such a unique style between the three of them. Like no other line on San Jose played the same way as far as the routes they took and the way they moved the puck around through the neutral zone into the offensive zone.

and hurdle understood it, was comfortable with it, and good at it. And I think that they're missing his comfort level to go along with Pavelski and Thornton, and that has also heard their five-on-five play. Yeah, yeah, totally. And I think that one other guy, we sort of breezed past is Jeff Carter. I mean, he's obviously a no-brainer, but I just think that, you know, it's remarkable that he's on pace for 43 goals and 75 points this season. I think it's floated under the radar a little bit, just how awesome he's.

been. And I think what's cool is how well he's holding up. I mean, he's in his 30s now. And he always struck me as a type of player that might sort of break down with age and not necessarily age as gracefully. But the thing that stands out for me when I watch him is, you know, he's one of these guys where it doesn't never look like he's moving fast and he sort of never bends his knee. He never bends his knees when he skates, just sort of kind of glides. And I'm sure that over the years, that's irritated people and made him think that he's not trying hard enough. But then every once in a while, you just sort of see his eyes light up when he sees. daylight in front of him and I think he's one of the more kind of sneaky fast

skaters in the league when he really wants to get going. He is. I've been in foot races with them and you're right. He's one of those guys not like Scott Needhamite or but similar in that they don't look like they're working hard. Like you feel like your legs are going a thousand miles an hour and they're just out there for a pleasure skate and yet they're going faster. He's got that long, fluid, beautiful stride and I think he doesn't get a lot of attention because he doesn't, I don't think he craves it. I think he's just so happy to be a chill guy, go out and

score is 25, 28 goals a year, wait for the playoffs and then be really good in the playoffs. And just, you know, and just go home. Let Kopitar and Dowdy and Quick be the stars of L.A. He's so comfortable in his own skin that he doesn't ever crave it. In fact,

he's just so relaxed about it all. He just goes and shows up and then goes home. But this year, I think, not at its necessity, but because Copa Tart has had such a quiet year. Quick hasn't been around. You're forced to kind of pay attention to Jeff Carter a little bit more and realize, man, he's really, he's really, really good. And he's having an incredible year. I wouldn't have seen this coming out of him, but he definitely deserves to be in L.A. for sure.

Yeah, yeah, definitely. MJ, where can people check you out and what are you up to these days? Yeah, I'll be at NHL Network, of course, on TV. I do some stuff on the NHL Network on the radio at the lunch show when I'm around. And I will definitely. be out in Los Angeles for All-Star Week, enjoying the sights and sounds and sunshine of L.A. And I hope I see you there. Yeah, I'll definitely be there. Let's catch up and maybe even do an in-person show while we're there.

All right, sounds good. You know where to find me. Talk soon, man. The Hockey P.D.O.cast with Dmitri Filipovich. Follow on Twitter at Dim Philipovich and on SoundCloud at SoundCloud.com slash HockeyPedocast. Thank you.