The Hockey PDOcast - Episode 150: Stranded On An Island

Episode Date: March 10, 2017

Arthur Staple joins the show to discuss all things New York Islanders - including the midseason turnaround following the coaching change, the elephant in the room with John Tavares' looming free agency, and how Garth Snow fumbled the JF Berube situation. Here’s a quick rundown of the topics covered: 6:30 The mid-season Coaching Chance 9:40 John Tavares' Supporting Cast 14:45 John Tavares' Next Contract 19:55 Garth Snow and a JF Berube Deep Dive 28:00 The Josh Ho-Sang Faux Controversy 33:00 Being Critical vs. Maintaining Relationships as a Beat Reporter Sponsoring today’s show is SeatGeek, which is making it easier than ever before to buy and sell sports and concert tickets. They’re giving our listeners a $20 rebate off of their first purchase. All you have to do is download the free SeatGeek app and enter the promo code PDO to get started. Every episode of the podcast is available on iTunes, Soundcloud, Google Play, and Stitcher. Make sure to subscribe to the show so that you don’t miss out on any new episodes as they’re released. All ratings and reviews are also greatly appreciated. Thanks for listening! See acast.com/privacy for privacy and opt-out information. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices If you'd like to gain access to the two extra shows we're doing each week this season, you can subscribe to our Patreon page here: www.patreon.com/thehockeypdocast/membership If you'd like to participate in the conversation and join the community we're building over on Discord, you can do so by signing up for the Hockey PDOcast's server here: https://discord.gg/a2QGRpJc84 The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Media Inc. or any affiliate.

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Welcome to the Hockey P.D.O.cast. My name is Dimitri Philpovich. And sitting across from me is Arthur Stapel. Arthur. What's going on? it's great to be here to be here. So I've been looking forward to doing this Islanders deep dive with you for a while. And it's, I don't know how many times I've been able to say this over the past few years, but I feel like the Islanders are actually a pretty interesting team. And a lot of it has to do with the fact that they've had a really topsy-turvy season, I feel like. And I don't know, let's get right into it.

When they were struggling early on in the season, I really struggled with trying to divvy up the blame because obviously when things don't go the way you're hoping for, someone is going to have to pay the price, and that wound up being the coach. But I couldn't decide between whether I thought that the people that put the team together were more so in charge or responsible or whether the coach just wasn't optimizing what he had with him. What was your take on the situation at the time? You know, I feel like assigning one person or one empty blame for a team doing poorly,

unless it's something really obvious where you're a Colorado or something where it's just everything, stinks. You know, with the Islanders, and I think your work showing, you know, time leading and time trailing, even before Jack Capione was fired, it was obviously they were in the upper echelon of that, you know, the percentage of time leading versus time trailing. And it jibed with what a lot of people who saw every game of their saw. You know, they were the worst team in the league after 20 games at the fewest wins. And that included five games that they lost in the last three minutes of regulation. You just tied the last three minutes, no points.

And that, to me, I'm sure a lot of it is bad luck. You know, I think if you looked at each of those games, you'd see, you know, a missed assignment or two, but that happens to everybody. It doesn't always end up in the back of your net. And I think there were just so many different factors that went into it. And really, I think the narrative part of it, I think a lot had to do with the guys that they let go and the guys that they brought in who were not, who didn't grab the ball and run with it right away.

but I think over the long haul you can see that you know and teams will always say this like we're not as bad as our record shows I think it was actually true with them I think they were the construction part of it was going to take some time but but I think it was just some rotten fortune that really dropped them behind the eight ball so quickly yeah I mean that's why they're I keep looking at one of the big outliers for me because you know by maybe the standings or just even conventional possession metrics they're sort of middle of the pack. They're nothing. You know, they're not popping out either as horrible or really, really good. But then you look at some of the company they're keeping. And as you mentioned, they're like in between the sharks and the penguins in terms of what percentage of the games they've spent leading. And they're between the Rangers and the haves in terms of their record and goals decided by two or more games. And we kind of know that that's probably a better indicator of how good the team actually is because the good teams generally win those games that are kind of decided with more certainty, whereas one goal game record is sort of a

random balance, as you mentioned here, they're like a minute with a minute left and you have nothing to show for it, but that doesn't necessarily mean that you deserve to lose and they're 28th in the league at that. And I understand that, you know, for someone like myself, maybe it's pretty easy to look at that and, you know, say, preach patience and say, so eventually even out, but I mean, there's still 28th in the league and one goal game record and there's like 20 games left in the season, hour 15. And it's tough. I understand sort of the urgency for either the people running the team or the fan base to kind of make some sort of changes to accommodate that rather than just holding tight and holding things even out. Yeah, you know, I think you can look at some

of the personnel decisions that Jack Capuona made. I think, you know, and I think you can do that with any coach that's been there a long time. I mean, he was there almost seven years. And, you know, I think his desire to really push a Nick Luddy, Travis Hammondick, top pair the first few months of the season was fairly costly to them. It was not a good pair by any metric, anything. One of the worst in the league. One of the worst. And I think, you know, they were obviously, you know, the numbers are going to be extreme for a pair that's going to be playing against other teams' top lines or playing a lot of the majority of the heavy minutes. But I just think as it was constructed, you know, Nick Ledy and Johnny Boychuk had been a pair when they got there in 2014-15 and were very good by every standard.

But Boychuk took a bit of a dip last year. So I understand the desire by the coaching staff to try to see things a little differently and maybe put a guy like Travis Hammannick in a spot that. he's not quite ready for, and may never be ready for it. He may just be a very good second pair guy. Not there's anything wrong there. No, no. And he's paid like a good second pair guy too.

But I think, you know, Jack, also you have, every coach has their guys, especially over the long haul. And one of his guys, one of the players that was definitely not his guys was Calvin DeHont. Calvin DeHon had to earn a lot of even the third pair of minutes that he was getting. And Calvin DeHon is not a modern defenseman. that people look at and say this guy's great. I mean, he loves the block shots, which is always a bit of a crapshoot.

And he doesn't skate particularly well, but I just think positionally in his own end, and really, I think since Doug Wade has come in, he's tried to accentuate how good Calvin DeHaan has been. And I think people are starting to notice a little bit more. Obviously, when he's paired with Dennis Seidinberg, he's going to do a little bit of the heavy lifting. But I think in Edmonton, they reunited him with Hamannick, and that has traditionally been a very good pair for this team by all standards. I mean, I think they're coursey 4 percentage over the five years that they've both been on the team. It's in the mid-50s, which is pretty high for a team that's had some bad years.

So I think Doug has the benefit of seeing the things that Jack did wrong and trying to, you know, correct them a little bit and stay away from certain pairings and certain lines. And, you know, that coupled with the usual new fresh voice guys looking in the mirror and saying, gee, I got my coach fired because we sucked so bad. I think a lot of those factors have really helped bring them the results more in line with what the numbers were saying a little bit. Well, I always wonder about that dynamic between the head coach and the assistant coach. It's like, because I imagine the assistant coach is usually the guy that the players are probably getting along with better because he doesn't necessarily need to, you know, hand out the bad news or really play the bad coffee, he can probably kind of be more buddy-buddy with the players. And it's been, it's been an interesting transition. I mean, schematically, or systems-wise or maybe personnel-wise, as you just mentioned,

has there been anything else that's been eye-opening about the differences between the two coaches? Because what I've noticed, just from the numbers, is that they've definitely tightened up defensively a little bit, at least, where they're giving up way fewer shots at five-on-five than they were under Capuano. Yeah, they were, I think they were, Jack was trying to figure out a way to, you know, he understands, and I think all coaches understand whether they express. it or not, that you have to generate shots and you have to prevent shots and you have to have the puck more. I mean, you know, you can measure it however you want and fans on Twitter can scream about it that their coach, the coach of their team doesn't understand it. They all get it.

Yes. And he knew that there was something wrong, the first, you know, 40-so games of the year that they were just giving up way too much. And their goaltending wasn't as good as it was last year. And I think that's part of the reason why Yarrowalak kind of ended up being separated from the group of three because, you know, he's, he just wasn't playing like a number one goalie, and I don't think they see him as a number two goalie. So leaving that aside, I think schematically Doug came in, and the first thing he did was try to get his centers to swing a little bit lower in the defensive zone. I think they were less concerned with pressuring the points, the winger's,

pressure the points he wanted wingers more to win wall battles and kind of quickly get things out. Jack's change when they started to take a dip last year in that in Corsi 4 was, we called it short support. That was this little word for it that you'd get guys coming into space, whether it was a wing or the center coming down low to help the defensemen and make a short pass and turn and go.

But I think they just, they botched it really badly the first 30 years or so. They were just guys that were not doing it, whether their wingers just weren't strong enough to push off the wall or get into space or whatever, they slow themselves down way too much.

So I think Doug kind of scrapped that and he really wants just the center's to swing low and feels like he's got guys like Tavares who can win pucks and get going with speed. Brock Nelson, I think, has improved a little bit. Ryan Strom has played a lot of center, and he's one of those guys that Jack didn't always trust very much, and I think he's clearly improved quite a bit. So, you know, I think it's, yeah, when you're the assistant coach, you can be the good cop a lot of the time.

And I think Doug Waite, being a guy who had the career that he had is a guy, you know, for better or worse, that players look to and say, this guy knows what he's talking about. He played 1,200 games. he won a Stanley Cup. It's not always fair to the coaches that didn't play, but I think that's why you have guys like that on your staff. And I think the surprising part is that he's taken that to the head coaching part and really reduce the why can't you just get it.

This is the way I did it kind of attitude. And he really hasn't brought any of that. And I think the relationship part, his individual conversations that he has with guys, he's a very direct guy, but in a way that players appreciate it. And certainly media appreciates. and, you know, Jack, God love him. He was, you know, kind of had the adult ADD where he had 50 ideas and he could express parts of all of them when he was talking.

I think that's the way he was a lot with the players too. So I think that just the difference in the communication and the directness of the message has helped too. Right. And I think the other thing that maybe Capone didn't do himself any favors with or the fans could point to as something that needed to change or something that he was doing wrong during his time behind the bench was just the players that were playing with John.

and Tavares. And I always, I mean, it became a thing, probably became a bit overblown, just, you know, especially when Calcutterbuck was paying with him and it became this whole thing, an internet meme. But I think that even the past few years, I've always been kind of amused seeing how much they've struggled trying to find just two guys that are just always playing with John Tiberas. Like when you look at his, like, common line mates, it's always just this medley. It feels like he kind of plays probably 5% of his minutes with this guy, 10% of this guy.

It's like all over the place. And I've always wondered whether what was going on there, whether they're just trying to find the best combination possible or like it seems like it wouldn't be that hard considering how good John Tavares just makes everyone else around him. The odd part to me is that when Jack came in, he had Matt Mollison and P.A. Parento, who were terrific linemates and made very nice careers for themselves

out of starting out playing with John Tavaris. And really, I think now you have guys that on either side of him in the exact same spots who fit the same mold as those guys the best. Andrews Lee is very similar to Matt Moulson, probably maybe a little bit more skilled. And Josh Bailey has a lot of PA parent to him as a guy who, you know, likes to be a playmaker first. And I think people always would get confused about what guy would work best with John, whether it's someone to get him the puck or someone to be ready to receive the puck.

And I always figured, well, why not have one of each? Because that's, you know, and I think when Anders Lee turned pro, that was, this is what they had in mind that this was a guy if his skating could pick up and continue on path that, you know, he was a guy who wasn't going to play hockey when he was in, I think he was Mr. Football in the state of Minnesota as a high schooler. So I think people thought he was never going to be a hockey player and made himself into the captain of the Notre Dame hockey team. And as a six-round pick might end up being one of the best six-round picks in the last 30 years. So this is what they envisioned for him. Josh Bailey, I think people envisioned maybe a little

bit different as a ninth pick overall. Yeah. But as a guy who plays a strong two-way game and has shown flashes at times when I think when Jack threw up his hands instead of all right, I'm just going to put Josh with him because they work well together. I think Tavares has proven that he can do a little bit of everything, but really, he's a score. He's a guy when the puck is on a stick, everybody converges on him. So if you have somebody to make a good play to get him the puck when there's not everybody converging, that's the kind of guy you want. And really, of anybody on the roster, maybe Strom is that guy too, but he hasn't shown a lot of that the last year plus.

So, and I think sticking with it, you know, I think they started playing together really in December, which was a little late probably to save Jack's job or to save the first half slide. But yeah, I think it's just the, this is the line together. Obviously, they're dominating possession-wise. They're scoring big goals. But just leaving it alone and trying to tinker with the rest of it is really probably the best way for them to go.

Well, I mean, I fully acknowledge that I'm as guilty of this as anyone, but sometimes it's easy to forget just how dominant John Tavares is and can be. I mean, I remember last year, he just kind of slips off your radar for whatever. He's obviously not yours. You're following him on a daily basis. But for someone just covering the league as a whole, it's kind of just, he's in the background. And then all of a sudden, that playoff series against the Florida Panthers, he just looks like one of the best players in the world. And you're like, just reminded of that.

And I had a similar wake-up call this season where he kind of started out of the gate pretty slowly. And then I think he had like 10 goals in like a 17 game span in January there. And it was like, oh, yeah, John Terrer. This is why he's considered one of the best players in the league. It's because he's capable of this. Yeah. And, you know, no matter what kind of help you get him, he's obviously still going to be the focus of every other team to stop him. And the fact that that's been the case now going on seven plus years and that nobody really slows him down.

I mean, obviously he's going to, he's not going to finish. He's going to need a strong finish to finish with 70 points, which is kind of a low standard for him. But that's going to end up being 10th in the league. I mean, and after the start that he had and the team had, that's pretty impressive. And, you know, it's, it is remarkable. And I think it's not as remarkable to me, like you said, I'm around him all the time. And the people who are around him a lot, he's just, you know, outside of Sidney Crosby, I don't think there's a harder working superstar in the league.

Like, he's a guy who takes things very personally. He took Jack being fired very personally. I, when I, a couple of times I talked to Jack since he was let go, you know, the first person who called him was Tavares. And basically it was a 10-minute apology for letting him down as a captain. And that's, you know, there's not a lot of. of superstars who might do that. And, you know, I think, you know, the debate raging about whether he's going to resign and whether there's enough there to resign. And I think a guy who, with that

sort of laser focus, you know, he's answered the question a million times. I really don't think he's given it much thought yet. Like, this is the most important thing to him is these last 16, 17 games and trying to get in the playoffs. So I'm going to tread very lightly here because I made the grave mistake a few weeks ago or maybe a month ago now of making a kind of tongue-in-cheek joke about Tavares maybe leaving town next summer and Islanders fans that I didn't even know existed came out of the work and just terrorize my mentions. So I would be very careful here with the language that I use. But I'm curious, you know, this next contract he's going to sign will probably cover the rest of his, definitely his peak, but probably like all of his or most

of his most productive individual seasons considering he's what, 26, 27 now and that'll probably take him into his early 30s. I just wonder for a player like himself, you'd have to maybe not now, but maybe in the summer or maybe next summer, look around and wonder whether there's enough surrounding him to help him reach that next level to win a cup, which every great player

strives to do, obviously. I don't know, like, do you think that critically looking at the situation there's enough around him here to actually take that next step? I think personnel-wise there is. I think, you know, I think their core of young guys you know, depending on who they exposed in the expansion draft, they could, you know, there was certainly talk that a guy like Brock Nelson who's shown fits and starts and been really good at times and really, you know, invisible at times.

If they could have, if he was part of a package from Matt Duchain, that would obviously have changed the dynamic of the team quite a bit. But I think there is. And I think the most important thing for him is really just seeing what direction the team is going to go on when the season ends. If it's April 9th and they don't make the playoffs or if it's in May after, you know, playoff series or two. They've got six to eight weeks to show, you know, the ownership, if they're going to bring

somebody in as they've been interviewing everybody that's ever played in the NHL, it seems. If they're going to bring somebody in above Garth Snow who's going to run hockey operations, they have to make that decision. If there's going to be moves that are going to be made, which clearly there are before the expansion draft or after the expansion draft or at the NHL draft, if they're going to make a big play for Dushain again. Maybe they do that. You know, everything that has to happen has to happen before July 1 when they can officially start talking.

Right. Because I think from everything I understand, he's looking for reasons to stay. Yeah. And I think a big, you know, there's lots of factors that go in. He's a big union guy. He's a very, you know, he's very involved in the PA. I don't think he's a guy who can decide I'm just going to take a two-year deal somewhere else and try to win a championship. That goes against all the things he's heard and been taught and wants to promote as far as the union goes, especially with the specter of 2020.

looming. And I don't think that he would look around and say if he's going to get more than 11 million a year for, you know, if he's going to get 80 million for seven years, which is probably the most he could get from anybody else, what is that going to do to the team that brings him in? I mean, maybe Toronto could make room, but then it's goodbye William Nealander, goodbye a few other guys. Right. So I think based on what they've got and that they've built around him, much like Stamco's,

obviously his cast of characters was a lot more appealing in Tampa. But they've got Matthew Barsall coming. Josh Hoseng has come up and shown some good signs. You know, they've got his core cast that's been around him for a little while. That's probably not going to change in the next couple of years. They've got the potential to, you know, they've got some prospects that they can offer up for Matt Dushan or Tyler Johnson or Ryan Nugent Hopkins or someone to be that scoring number two center that they've, God love Franz Nielsen, but they've never had since he's been there. So I think there's things in place. And I think his relationships with the people that have been around him a long time in the organization are good enough that if there's good signs that he sees between the end of the season and July 1, I would imagine that July 2 or 3, you'll see him sign.

That doesn't happen. July 4, my personal feeling, and Pierre LeBron, at least a respectable national guy backed me up, they got to trade him. Yeah. And which would be, I mean, I'd set fire to my laptop and never look at Twitter again if that came. But that's got to be the play. Because if he doesn't decide right away, you have to be able to get something for him. Because I assume if he doesn't make that, if he doesn't say yes to what I imagine will be eight years and somewhere between 82 and 86 million, at least as a negotiating point. If he says, no way, I'm not negotiating, then that's it. He's not saying. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it would be, I mean, it goes well saying this.

Probably the most lukewarm statement ever. But it's like if he walks and you don't retain anything for him, that would set the franchise back however many years. and that's untenable. So I agree, but man, that would be interesting because obviously he'll always be, especially now with where his careers, he'll be compared to Stamco's, just because we went through this last year with Stamco's. But on the one hand, I've always kind of,

I don't want to psychoanalyze anyone that's not my job. But it always kind of struck me as, like, Tavares was more of a guy that'd be willing to kind of just stay where he is and a more loyal character like that, rather than the lure of a place like Toronto or something like that. But at the same time, he hasn't had, the type of team success that Stamco's had so far, and it would make sense that if he looked around and thought

maybe the people in charge weren't surrounding him with enough talent, maybe he'd look elsewhere. So I don't know, it's going to be fascinating. I'm kind of selfishly hoping he doesn't sign that early just because of all the stories. I'm not saying I hope he doesn't sign with Islanders eventually. You better throw that qualifier in there. So I'm glad you brought up Garth Snow because he has been a tricky GM for me to evaluate,

because his moves have really, I said this with Mark Bergermann around the trade deadline, but he's another one of these guys where I feel like there's been a lot of moves where I've been a huge fan of them and then a lot of them

where I've been highly puzzled by them or raised my eyebrow. And I think a small one in the grand scheme of things, but a very curious one that I've been waiting weeks and months to ask you about is just explain the entire Jean-Francois

Barouet's situation to me because from the outside, just all the hoops they just, jump through to keep a third goalie at the start of the year, was curious. And I haven't really seen, I'm waiting for like an ESPN 30 for 30 or something to come out, describing like everything that happened behind the scenes for what's going on there. Well, yeah, it is, it sort of would be the worst viewed 30 for 30 ever, I'm sure. I'd watch it for sure.

You know, I think, I think it was one of those situations we were talking about how a coach gets used to certain things and wants, you know, and it just says like, these are my guys. You know, I think the general manager experienced a lot of frustration with Yarra Halak last year. Injured a lot. He has your reputation, and this has not come from anybody inside the Islanders, as not the hardest worker, which is how you end up flaming out of a couple of organizations like Halak did. And, you know, I certainly seen it firsthand that he's not, he's not the cheeriest guy around. And plenty of goalies are not, and plenty of athletes are not, and plenty of writers are not.

And that's not a condemnation. But I think when they picked up Rubin' waivers, which at the time was a smart move because Halak wasn't ready to start the 15-16 season. They thought, here's a guy who's developed in another organization, a good one that's developed some goaltenders, and we'll take a shot with keeping him around. So they kept him around. It turned out that aside from the fact that Barubei barely played last year, excuse me, it was the right move because Halak ended up with the season ending injury in March. They needed it back up.

He was fine, sitting on the bench, and stubbing in for Thomas Grice on occasion. And then this summer comes, and I'm sure that Garth Snow tried to dump Yarra Hollock's contract on anybody who would take it, which was the number of that was zero. There was just no interest, him coming off an injury. Then he goes out in the World Cup and plays lights out. And I think Garth Snow was probably taken quite a back by that because all three of them came to camp, I assume, and I don't know, that the plan was if Halak didn't play well in camp, they would put him on waivers, sent him in the minors, or he got discreet. content, they just say, fine, you're out, forget it. Right. Let's leave this all beat. But he plays well in the World Cup and they think, oh, maybe we have our number one goalie

again. And he comes back to camp and there's still the three guys there. And he bristled at that and it's spoken often about it. And I think it just went on too long. They needed to make a decision. I really think the turning point for me was when Andrew Hammond was put on waivers. And that was pretty early in the year by Ottawa. And he cleared without a problem. And He's got way more NHL experience and better NHL experience than Baroube. And I think at that point, Garth Snow needed to just bite the bullet and say, all right, Halak and Griser are guys, and we'll send Barabay down. And if he gets picked up on waivers, he gets picked up on waivers. The problem for them at the time, which is really now we're deeply diving into, is that Christopher Gibson, who was a guy that got on the Michael Grabner trade and who played very well in the AHL last year and actually won them the game against the caps that clinched a playoff spot last season, who they like a lot too.

Had a knee injury that was nagging him and he was in and out of the lineup starting in November. And now he's, I don't know if he's had surgery, but he's done for the year. He's been done for the year since before Christmas. So they really had two very inexperienced AHL goleys. And I think they were worried if Barrabe left and Halak got hurt. They were totally screwed. To me, you're not totally screwed because you can always give a six-term picked somebody else to get a goalie to back up Thomas Grice. But that's just my job.

We just saw like Jonas Enroth or whatever. Right. Whoever. There's a million guys out there. You know, and I think they personally quite like Baroubae and see him eventually as a serviceable NHL goal. I don't know where eventually is going to be. But yeah, so it just sort of escalated. And then you throw in Alan Walsh's tweet and halak being halak and being really discontent.

And really the funny part is that right after the tweet, I think both Garcino and Jack Capiano said, all right, the hell with it. You're our guy. And he started seven straight and he won one of them in November. And that really sent them even further into a slide. So, you know, I think it was just, it's easy to assign blame. And obviously Garcin was the boss, and it was ultimately his decision. And finally, you know, really, you know, the turnaround for them didn't start with Doug Wade. It started when they sent a lockdown.

Right. That's the scary part of all of this is that if they'd done that a month earlier, maybe, you know, Grice might be burned out by now because they're really riding him hard. Yeah. And he's never really played a full season like that before. So, you know, it's, it's. It's quite a saga to look back on. And I don't, you know, they're going to lose Barubei to Group 6 free agency.

I don't know whether he's going to want to stay. You know, they've got Ilya Seroquen over in the KHL, who's really the prized possession of this organization. And if they can get him over here, and they've always got Thomas Grace under contract, they're not keeping three guys then. Right. So Barube will be cast aside at some point.

So it's a very strange situation. And the way that Garth operates, you know, he definitely dances to his own rhythm. always has. And sometimes it works out where you have a day where they get Nick Lutty and Johnny Boychuk within an hour of each other and all of a sudden their fortunes change. And then it doesn't. And you've made a big trade for Thomas Vannick and then you've got to dump him off for less than nothing at the trade deadline. So, you know, it can be a mystery. And I think the fact that he's not a big, you know, he doesn't talk to a lot of media people around the league

doesn't really help his perception. But he's also dealing with a, very different situation now with owners that are different than Charles Wong who are very much looking over his shoulder and like I said talking to people about possibly expanding the front office and having somebody to have Garth Snow to report to which he has never had in his time I guess it's 11 years now as president and GM so you know I think there's some there's some pressures there that weren't there before and there's some there's some friction there that wasn't there before so maybe that will produce something better or something more transparent or maybe it'll drive them further into the bunker. It's always hard to say. Well, I told people we were going to do

an Islander's deep dive and I feel like we really lived up to the hype of that one. Yes, the Christopher Gibson updates. Let's take a quick break here to hear from our sponsors and we'll be back. In case you didn't hear the news on the last show, we've got C-Kkeek back on as a sponsor of the PDO cast. Let me tell you a little bit about C-Kkeek because it'll hopefully be able to save you a bunch of time and money in your pursuit of tickets to watch your favorite hockey team play. For those of you that haven't used it before. I honestly can recommend giving it a try enough. I'm off to the New York area in a couple weeks and as part of an attempt at a little bit of brand synergy here considering the podcast you guys are currently listening to, I'll be checking out an Islander's game at Barclays.

I've heard their sight lines are immaculate and the scoreboard is positioned perfectly, so I'm going into the experience expecting it all to go without a hitch and for it to be a great viewing experience. All right, fine. Maybe that's not for you, but I'm sure there's some other Gamer Concert out there that you'd like to go to, and Seekek, and they're incredibly easy to use mobile app, will hopefully be able to help with that. In just a couple clicks, they basically search multiple ticket sites, compare prices, and find the best deal possible for you to use. So to get your own $20 rebate on tickets, all you have to do is download the Seekek app, go to the Settings tab and click add a promo code. Enter the promo code PDO, and Ckeek will send you $20 after you made your

first ticket purchase. All you got to do is download the CKKK app and enter the promo code PDO today. Now let's get back to the show. Okay, so I don't even really want to talk about this, but since we are doing all things Islanders, I feel like just purely from our due diligence perspective, we need to discuss it. And it's this entire Josh Hossang situation, faux controversy, whatever, whatever you want to call it. Where are you at with this? Because obviously, you know, it's part of your job. So you have to do the reporting on it and maybe asking the questions. but I imagine, you know, you seem like a very reasonable guy.

You probably see the just the comedy in this actually being... I don't want to speak in the language of social media where everything is the worst of the stupidest. This is the stupidest thing I've dealt with in my seven seasons on this beat. Yeah, it's astonishing. And I, you know, I haven't dealt with Josh quite that much, you know, when you're one beat reporter at training camp, it's hard to get into it with everybody.

I've seen, you know, I've talked to him at rookie camp. And I've certainly read lots of the articles. And one thing Josh Hossang is not is a dumb guy. Like he thinks about things, maybe a little too much, I think, for the, for the likes of Hockey Canada or NHL coaches or junior coaches or whoever. I mean, I think, you know, conformity is the way to go. And he is a non-conformist for sure. So I think that's part of it.

And I think, you know, maybe if he was a French-Canadian kid from Laval and he was wearing 66 all through midget and someone said to him when he got to the queue like no we don't we don't do that here or you know a parent might say that to him that would be the end of it but but he's certainly been raised to be his own man and um it's always interesting to me to see these kinds of things come up where you know it's the old man yells at cloud meme of like are people are people doing that other people really doing this because I feel like the the love hate thing that we all have with Twitter is that if something starts on Twitter. you can find the source of it pretty easily if you do a little bit of digging.

So I was trying to look and see, was someone authoritative, was someone in the NHL, did a player or a reporter who I respect, or someone say, this is wrong. And I really couldn't find it. I think it was just kind of, we were in Dallas, and someone, not me, asked him about it, and he gave an incredibly thoughtful answer that I thought, okay, well, that's pretty much the end of it.

And then we got to Edmonton, and someone was, you know, one of the reporters up there was asking Connor McDavid, who's a friend of Josh's and he kind of said, I'm not interested in time with that. Someone asked Todd McClellan, and Todd McClellan looked awfully puzzled. Really, the best answer that anybody gave was the same reporter asked Doug Wade in the scrum

before the Edmonton game, and I think said something like, well, some people up here are upset about it, and Doug just said, why? Yeah. And I feel like that, he didn't have to say anything else after that. He did, and Josh answered it again. And, you know, it's the funny part to me,

and I really haven't been able to report it out because I don't know who advocated it in the island. organization, but he didn't wear 66 in Bridgeport this year. He wore 26. And I think that was, you know, Michael Delcalle wears 71. He was wearing 17. I think there was just an edict at the lower level in the organization that we're not going to wear high numbers. We're just going to, you know, Chris Lamarillo is a new member of the front office, and he really runs Bridgeport, and he is a lamarillo. And I think, so maybe those kinds of things just don't fly. And Garth Snow is not

someone who, you know, when he hires people, he lets them do what they need to do. And I don't think he's a micromanager, but I think when he got to the NHL, I think he asked to put 66 back on him. Garth Snow is, like I said, he's a nonconformist too. So I think he was perfectly willing to let him wear it. And, you know, if people are going to, we go to Pittsburgh in a couple of weeks, I'm sure it's going to be lots of booze. And to me, I'm curious to see how he'll handle it, but I imagine that people booing him

is not going to be the first time that Josh Hossang has heard that. So, you know, if you have a guy who's, you drafted despite all the things that you heard about him, you're going to let him do what he's going to do despite all the things that people are going to say. Yeah. And, you know, I mean, people always ask me, like, who do you, who do you root for? What are you cheering for? And I tell him I'm trying to be an objective reporter. I'm, you know, but I really do now kind of cheer for stories and for individuals and stuff like that.

And seeing him score that goal the other night was very nice. And I hope he succeeds because he's, you know, we'll see what kind of of the NFL player is going to be, but obviously at every level so far, he's been very dynamic and an electric offensive producer. And I'd like to see that become more of the narrative

of how well he's playing and how much he's contributing to the team as opposed to this story, which really, I mean, is, as you mentioned, it's a non-story. I mean, he's wearing a number that he's legally allowed to wear that isn't.

It's doing it for all the right reasons. So I imagine that. I ask me. I like that. Yeah, I think he even said himself, right? He said that if Mario, like, call him or something and say, I don't want you wearing my number, he would then reconsider it. But it's like, obviously, obviously it's never went to that. I don't think that's going to happen.

Yes. Okay. One final thing before I let you go. I'm always curious to speak with beat reporters because I think it's a fascinating job from my perspective because it's easy for someone like myself to be very critical and have strong opinions online because I don't. have to go to the rink every day and deal with the same people over and over again. But for someone like yourself, whose daily job is to cover one team, I guess you've been doing it for so long now that maybe it's just become second nature. But is there like a balance you have to strike between being a critical journalist who's writing about what they're seeing and

hearing versus, you know, not burning too many bridges or at least keeping lines with communication open so that you can keep doing your job and getting information. Asian and sources. Yeah, it's something that, you know, I tend to lose it a little bit, especially with the Twitter interactions, because Twitter interactions are really, you know, the way for reporters like myself to interact with fans. And it's, that's a, you know, I started a sports writer 20 years ago, and obviously nothing like that existed back then and not even 10 years ago when I was, started out in a pro beat business covering the Rangers. So that sort of interaction is good, but it can also get you in trouble because if you're, you know, everybody can see it. And I've said

this many times since Twitter really became in vogue that I could write a 10,000 word article about why John Tavares stinks and why the Islander stink and no player or coach would read it. And if I tweet that same thing, all of them will see it. It's just whether it's them or a family member or friend, people are always on the lookout. Twitter to me is the place where people go to get angry. Yes. And that's not a new idea, but it's certainly when it comes to sports, there's way more important things than sports, but in my little world of it, you know, corner of it, there's definitely a lot of

people who want to come come at you and fight you on your opinions and fight you on why don't you do this and you should ask this and you should do this. And it's a constant stream of things. But I've had plenty of battles with players and with coaches about things that I've tweeted or posted online. And it happens two to three times every year. And it's, it can be exasperating because you go in and to be honest, I had something with John Tabaris last year about an offhand tweet that I posted after a game and it got back to him somehow and turned into a bit of a thing and we just, you know, we had a conversation and it was certainly not, there was no animosity in the conversation and he was direct to me and I was direct with him and I

kind of said, you know, like I hear you suck and your team sucks 10,000 times a day. Right. And if I post something that's, that's a bad attempt at a joke and I hear it and I hear you suck from you, like, you know, it's just you kind of roll your eyes and say, all right, well, who doesn't think I suck or who doesn't, who am I, who am I working for here? What, which half of the audience is going to respond to this by outrage, you know, outrage about one lineup decision or one game or one comment or one quote? So it can be a little, it can be a little draining at times just between that and the travel and life and all the other things that can get in the way that, it's, it is very unique.

And, you know, I think when you, when we are a little club of beat writers and I think for me, personally, it's even more different because I'm the only one who travels to cover the Islanders and it's been that way since I started the beat in 2011. So the people that I interact with the most are the people who work for the team because that's really who's around. And it's good that I have the relationships that I have with some of those people to be able to explain myself if I tweet something or write something or post something that they don't get or that they think is offensive to them or someone with the team. So it usually diffuses pretty quickly. But I can see where, you know, and there's a lot of people, you know, Jack, I always used to kid Jack

because he would try to do that you guy, like you guys didn't pick us to win in the playoff series. It's like, it's just me. Like, who else are you reading? But there's, you know, you encounter people who kind of do like the capital T, capital M, the media, everybody's doing this. I'm kind of like, all right, well, you know, I do what I do. And I try to, you know, Twitter to me is a place to break news and to engage.

to kind of, you know, even if I post something that's kind of half-baked, it's really not, to me, it's not the central part of what do I do. What I do. My job is to report and find out what's going on with the team and write articles for the paper and online and Twitter is, as much time as I spend on it as a small part of it. And, you know, I've found, after all these years, a good audience of a couple hundred Islander fans who I like engaging with. And I think, you know, get that mostly I'm just trying to be sarcastic and post bad music recommendations and, you know, complain about, you know, the daily things that everybody complains about. Do most Islanders fans think you're, like, it's always funny to me because it can go one of two ways, right?

Where if someone's covering, and this happened to me a lot when I used to cover the Canucks on a daily basis, where there's like a segment of the fan base that thinks you're being like too hard on the team sometimes. And then there's people that think you're like being too much of a Homer. It's like, how could it possibly be both things at once? but if you ask the two different people, you're going to get two wildly different responses. Absolutely. And like I said,

it's really just me who's covering all the games and Newsday in general. It's covering all the games. So I think there's a lot of people out there that want me to be all things to all people. They want me to do deep dive articles where I use a lot of analytics and dig deep about, you know,

is Brocknell, should Brock Nelson be a center or a wing? And I'm like, read the articles in the paper. Like there's 10 paragraphs long most times. Like that's all I get. Yeah. You know, or give my opinion about why Garth Snow should be fired or why Jack Capuano should be fired. And, you know, my newspaper, we kind of did away with general columnists, one of our, you know, purges many years ago.

And, you know, we have sport columnists, but we don't have a hockey columnist. And my job is to report and analyze. And I fall back on that a lot and try to explain to people that, you know, I think as you probably in There's a lot of people don't really know what goes into the job, like how much writing is involved and how much paying attention is involved. And if I'm tweeting during a game, then I'm not really seeing who left the bench and all the stuff. And, you know, I think, I think to me that my always my goal is online. And when I meet people, it's to just humanize the fact that, like, I'm a person, like, you're a fan. I'm a reporter.

Right. And you should be happy that that's the way I feel. I grew up a Ranger fan in New York City. But I got rid of that a long time ago. And ultimately, you know, I want, like you said, we root for stories and we root for intrigue. And I'm happy that the team turned it around because I've covered seasons where they were out of it by December. And it's just, it's just floating to the end. And you're fending off people who want you to, you know, take out your blow torch and set everybody on fire.

Yeah. That to me is a waste of time. There's so many opinions out there. And I try to accentuate that, like, if I give you the information, go do whatever you want with it. yell at each other, fight about it. Right. But really leave me out of it. Yes.

Yeah, no, that's well sad, man. Well, I appreciate you coming to take a time of chat. And I enjoy the rest of your road trip. And hopefully we can chat again soon sometime. That's great. Thanks so much, Dimitri. The Hockey PDOCast with Dmitri Philipovich. Follow on Twitter at Dim Philipovich and on SoundCloud at soundcloud.

At soundcloud.com slash hockey PDOCast.