The Hockey PDOcast - Episode 267: The Big Cheese

Episode Date: December 17, 2018

Dom Luszczyszyn joins the show to help size up where we stand with the various major individual awards races now that we're rapidly approaching the halfway point of the season. In this episode we discuss potential storylines that could help swing the Norris (1:00), whether there's a case to be made for anyone other than John Gibson for the Vezina (18:50), if anyone can finally dethrone Alex Ovechkin for the Rocket (27:00), the new benchmarks for the Art Ross this season (33:30), who the Most Valuable Player is (43:40), and Stanley Cup Odds (46:20). Sponsoring today’s show is SeatGeek, which is making it easier than ever before to buy and sell sports and concert tickets. They’re giving our listeners a $10 rebate off of their first purchase. All you have to do is download the free SeatGeek app and enter the promo code PDO to get started. A reminder that we’re hosting a daily fantasy listener league contest over at FanDuel every Thursday this season. While you wait for the next opportunity to play to come around, go over to fanduel.com/PDO and tell them we’ve sent you. They’ll hook you up with a bonus $5 to play with after your first deposit, which will surely come in handy throughout the year. See you there! See acast.com/privacy for privacy and opt-out information. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices If you'd like to gain access to the two extra shows we're doing each week this season, you can subscribe to our Patreon page here: www.patreon.com/thehockeypdocast/membership If you'd like to participate in the conversation and join the community we're building over on Discord, you can do so by signing up for the Hockey PDOcast's server here: https://discord.gg/a2QGRpJc84 The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Media Inc. or any affiliate.

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My name is Dimitri Filipovich. and joining me in his own apartment is my good buddy Don Lus Chish and Dom. What's going on, man? Not much, man. How are you today? I'm good. I'm excited. We've got the Twitter famous Ruby in the house. Your dog's here. So I'm sure should we make a cameo and we'll get some sort of a appearance, whether it's in howling form or hot take form or something. She has the hottest takes. She does have the hottest takes. So today, you and I, we're recording this on a Friday afternoon. I think we're we're going to save it until probably early next week. So hopefully nothing too dramatic or catastrophic happens in the meantime. But if it does, be aware of that.

I thought today would be a good time for us to talk a little bit about the individual awards and the races for that and some of the betting odds and sort of where we're at with that. We're over the third way mark of the season. There's no like third way pole. And so now we're kind of getting into that region. of the season where a lot of the numbers are becoming more legit and more sustainable and we can kind of stay with confidence what's happening and what's not and it's always fun to talk about these

awards and talk about the best players in the league and try to hammer out some of these arguments and look ahead to what the raging debates will be come June when it's award season um let's start with the Norris trophy because when I suggested this topic to you when I got here you're like okay let's do it and then we were both like wait who's the favorite this year like it seems like um You know, there isn't an obvious sort of media-driven storyline yet. It feels like every year we have. Yeah, I've heard a lot of Ryan McDonough buzz. And, you know, we're going to slander Ryan McDonough.

But in his defense, I think he's been a lot better than he showed. Like, he looked like he was on a big time downward trajectory last year. And whether it's health or acclamation to a new surroundings or what have you, he's been pretty good. I don't think he's been Norris Trophy good. But I said this on a podcast recently. I feel like Alex Petrangelo really is crap in the bed here because obviously now he's injured, unfortunately. But it felt like this really could have been a year for the Alex Petrangelo.

He's earned it. This is his time. Buzz if he just had like an Alex Petrangelo season. But unfortunately, he's been bad and the blues have been like an abomination. Maybe if he got traded to the Leaps, he might get that buzz. But he's not getting it on that team. No. With the way he's played this year.

Yeah, he's not. And I don't think anyone on that. that team's going to be in the discussion for any awards. But who are you thinking? Because we threw some names out here before we started. Let's go through the list of sort of the, I don't know, a handful of guys that seem like they are having the best seasons. Before we get to the favorites who are not Ryan McDonough,

I just want to say that Ryan McDonough is having a great season. He's taking the load off of headmen and taking shutdown assignments and doing well. In those assignments, I do think part of the buzz is his plus minus. as it does. I remember last year I wrote an article about how the Norse trophy generally gets decided and it's generally a mix of points facing tough comp plus minus and being on a good hockey team and Ryan McDonough checks all those boxes plus you have the fact that he hasn't won it yet so you have the it's his turn factor so I can see why there's buzz I just don't think he should be that close to the conversation.

For me, and we both mentioned this before we start recording, but you see the way Calgary is playing this year and Mark Giordano, who I think is 57 years old, is still chugging along as an elite defenseman. He's point per game right now. He's still tilting the ice as well as he ever has, even without Dougie Hamilton this year. And he's just been a big driving force of how good the flames are, how great their power play has been this year as well. And I think he probably, if it's anyone's, like, every year it's always his turn. I feel like I'm not sure why Marjorado isn't getting the, it's his turn buzz.

Yeah. And he's also got the plus minus working in his favor. It's plus 18 on the year, right behind Michael Kempney and Ryan McDonough at a company's turn? It's Kempney's turn, man. He's, he's putting up some numbers. No, it's, I think Giordano, obviously the production speaks for itself, the 32 points and 30 games. The fact that he has, you mentioned, has shown that, you know, I think for the past couple of years, people were wondering how much Dougie Hamilton was sort of extending Giordano's peak and usefulness. And it turns out that Sheridan himself can prove to be perfectly capable without

Dougie Hamilton's services on his side. And the flames have that narrative brewing as well in terms of the good storyline because they very easily could win the Pacific Division. They're playing really exciting hockey. their final watch. And Giordano, the captain, is kind of the driving force for that success. So it seems like it could be a perfect storm of in the next couple weeks. And as we get further along into the season of people going like, I don't know, this could be Mark

Giordano's ear. Yeah, I see it for sure. Who else is there? I think Chris LaTang is in the conversation, depending on whether the penguins can turn around because the rest of that defense has been brutal. and he has been carrying that team to respectability. John Carlson's having a great year, not just points-wise,

but he's doing much better with puck possession and whatnot, better than he usually does. And he, unlike the other guys we're going to mention, he doesn't face tough minutes because in Washington, that goes to Orlov and Niskin, but those guys have been not very good this year. Yeah, and Carlson, I mean, he just got Michael Kempney a,

plug on this podcast. I mean, there we go. That's a testament to what he's been doing this year. Yeah, he's been a pleasant surprise because after he signed that contract this summer, I think a lot of people were deservedly lukewarm on it, I'd say.

I don't think anyone was super critical just because, you know, he's still in his prime. He's obviously a useful player. But just in terms of how the capital's cap situation is shaking out, I think a lot of people thought they probably won't or shouldn't be able to afford him because they could probably use that money elsewhere. I know he's always been a tad bit overrated for what his underlying numbers are actually like compared to how people talk about him.

But he's taking his game to another level this year, I feel like, which based on his age and how long he's been in the league is a bit surprising to me, but it's a testament to him. Yeah, and I think it does help that he no longer has to carry Carl Osner around. It's true. Although, I mean, last year he was playing with Michael Keppney full time, and he was fine. Yeah, he was fine, exactly. I feel like he's gotten even better this year. Yeah, but the years before, he always... didn't look that great. And I think it's always a struggle to take quality of teammates into account,

especially with defense pairings. And Carlson was always this overrated guy. And we see what Aldner is now in Laval, not even Montreal. And as soon as he got a capable partner, the underrated Michael Campney last year, the deadline, because even before Camdeny rolled in, I think he was playing a lot with Brooks Orpick last year, which is an even worse fate than Carl Alsner. And as soon as he got a able partner, he started looking much better. And this year, we're seeing that where he's above water possession-wise. I think you and I have had this discussion on the podcast before, actually, but I wanted to rehash it because Michael Kempney is a great example of this of a guy who we see these defensemen time and time again in the NHL. I feel like during his time in Chicago,

he was putting up these ridiculous underlying numbers. And a lot of it was sort of being that prototypical sheltered third-parring defenseman where, you know, he was probably feasting on easier competition and he wasn't necessarily being asked to do too much. And he was obviously making the most of his opportunities. But when we're looking at guys like that, like what are we looking at to feel more confident saying we can take a guy like that and plug him into a bigger role maybe on a different team and he'll still be able to thrive as opposed to being one of these guys, you know, Eric Schell and R whoever go on down the line that we've seen time and time again where they have ridiculous shot share numbers and limited roles. And then all of a sudden,

if you ask him to do anything more, they're just going to completely fall apart. Yeah, we have seen that a bit, but some of the, I guess, cases where it has worked, like a company, like Nate Schmidt, I think. Yeah, Vegas killed it with it. Yeah, where, like, Colin Miller, Nate Schmidt, I mean, even Braden McNabb. Yeah, I think Colin Miller, he was sheltered last year in Vegas, but when Schmidt was out, he was moved up the lineup a bit and still thrived. And what I noticed anecdotally, and this would obviously take a lot more testing, but

the guys that do succeed in those bigger roles tend to be. the guys who can enter and exit the zone, they do well the puck, they're the guys driving the bus. Like if you look at the data track by a Quirichinator, I think, with Schmidt, when he was in Washington, he was just insane across the board. And that's why I think he was able to parlay what he did in a third pairing role and transfer that to far off the lineup. Whereas someone like, say, Julius Honka is. was fine in a third-paring role, but didn't do as much with, I guess, the puck. He just sort of had those results, and if you asked him to do something more, he didn't really get to it.

And I used to be a Julius Honker Truth, but that was mostly because he seemed to do well on the power play, and that also has value, but he probably isn't the guy at 5-on-5. Yeah. I'm surprised you saying that name didn't, like, cause Tyler to randomly appear. Um, no, you're right. I think if you actually go back in the, uh, in the archives of my articles, it was the year before the expansion draft where two guys I identified, because I was tracking all the playoff games for defensemen, Nate Schmidt and Shay Theodore were two of the guys that

really popped off the page in terms of how smooth they were in the neutral zone, both with moving the puck and actually also using their feet to be like, modern day defenders, I feel like aren't the guys who are like throwing big hits in the neutral zone. It's more so the guys who can like keep that gap control and play good positioning and use their sticks well and those are two guys that really stuck out to me and obviously Vegas identified them as well as guys that could thrive in bigger roles and so far both guys have looked awesome there so I'm not surprised to hear that so it's it sounds like it's a kind of combination of the numbers and I guess the eye test as well right seeing like identifying actual individual skills that could

potentially lead themselves to be useful in a better bigger role and that's where better data would help immensely because there's been so many times where analytics people including the both of us have been caught down the rabbit pull of, okay, give this guy better minutes. Look how good he, his numbers are. And that might not be the case because he doesn't maybe have the individual skill set to move up the lineup.

Yeah, well, I feel like it would be great for providing context for how those numbers are being accumulated, right? And obviously, I think I was talking about this with Rob Bizzola, our mutual friend that's going to go on a podcast. I'm not sure maybe some point next week.

But, you know, the NHL is going to be using all the, this new proprietary tracking data to partner with MGM, and they're probably going to release it publicly eventually. And I think there's going to be a lot of mistakes made where people are going really like zone in on specific little micro stats and lose sight of the bigger picture. And I think that's going to be a mistake. But I think when you're looking at the bigger picture and then you take a deeper dive and you go, okay, what's happening to cause these numbers?

And then you can kind of identify either strong factors or weak links in a person's game and then put them in a position to thrive. I think that's where we're going to squeeze the most value out of Yeah, I'd have to agree. So we've got, I agree so far. I think Giordano and John Carlson have good cases. We're talking about Morgan Riley a bit. Yeah. And I know, you know, it's funny.

There's like a huge Toronto contingent, obviously, on hockey Twitter that's going to be pushing this obviously. You know, a huge Morgan Riley fans. And then there's going to be like a natural pushback to it. And some of it is deserved and some of it is not. But a lot of it is just that like Toronto fatigue where people are just as soon as someone starts talking about a guy from the elite. they're going to go like, no, you're like, you're so full of it. You're just making a bigger case as than it is.

But, I mean, he's obviously been great this season. Yeah, he has. And with the Toronto thing, and you saw this with Mitch Marner. Yeah. Players get so overrated that there's this complete opposite effect on the other side to completely trash a player to the point where they're also seriously underrated. Yep. And the right answer is somewhere in the middle of those two extremes.

So I don't think Morgan Riley is a friend. front and for Norris. I don't think he's even in the top three, but I think he is definitely a dark horse candidate this year with how he's played. He's scoring points, obviously, on a lethal power play, but that's never hurt any other Norris candidate. And I think what gets overlooked a lot with his underlying numbers is that he does often get the toughest assignments and has to do so with 65-year-old Ron Hainsey, who isn't even a right-handed shot and is playing on the right side. And it sometimes feels like it doesn't even matter which way Ron Hainesi shoots. Like he is just not the most common player with his stick.

And you see that Moran Riley has a much tougher time having to do the job they does because teams know they can just attack the left side and they'll be mixed breaking out the zone difficult. And that's why his zone exit numbers aren't as sterling as, I guess, some of the other guys who would be there and especially for a guy who has a reputation as a puck moving defenseman. but I think if he played for any other team that wasn't Toronto, he would be getting a lot of, why aren't we talking about this guy who has one of the toughest usage situations in the league and is going point per game

and breaking even in shot rates and does have the plus minus to go with the usual North Kansas scene. I think there's a case for him to at least be in the conversation. Yeah, man, for a pair of guys who hate plus minus, we've talked about it a lot in the first 15 minutes of the show. Yeah, but that's when, if we're talking about award cases, that is something that award voters consider. And at the same time, while it's not like useful, it bears mentioning sometimes, not just plus minus, I guess, like at least five on five goals that take out the garbage of it. Let's talk about someone who's plus minus sucks, who should get consideration of Eric Carlson.

Yeah. I agree. I agree. Good luck convincing the voters. that he has been deserving of it. And listen, I think there's, like, I'm one of the biggest Eric Carlson fan out there, and I've been defending him for years.

I think there's the couple guys you mentioned before are more deserving based on what they've done so far this year. But I'm very curious to see how, sort of the final 50 games or so go for the sharks because they've shown flashes of having that excellence that we expected from them before the year, and they haven't really been able to put it together for sustained stretch.

obviously, you know, they're dominating the shot shares in possession and their expected goals. And it looks like they have a very viable case to be one of the best teams in the league. There's goal-tending concerns there with Martin Jones, obviously. But I think that I wouldn't be surprised at all if they did put it together in the second half. And Carlson went on a crazy run where he was like averaging like 1.2 points per game or something like that for the final 40, 50, 50 games. Yeah. And he's a big part of why their shot share and their third-goal share is so high. and I wrote this in my 31 stats column, I think, two weeks ago.

And the sharks experimented with Carlson Vlasic as a shutdown pair, and the underlying numbers were great. They were just getting torched and scored upon. So DeBore went to Old Reliable, which is Vlasic and Braun, and they've been getting destroyed on a nightly basis. And it sort of feels like the problem wasn't Eric. Carlson. Yeah.

Yeah. Surprising. You know what? He has the offensive numbers and, you know, he's having a typical offensive season for Brent Byrne standards, but he's, every time I've watched the Sharks, he has not looked very good this year. And yeah, I think Carlson is going to need to be driving the bus there for them to continue success.

And I really just want them to revisit that shutdown pairing because I think it could be one of the most effective pairings in the league. they just got, it was a grace period for Carlson because he was a new team, a new system. He hasn't played that role in Ottawa because they, for some reason, gave it to Cody Cici. And I think now 33 games in he's more acclimated with the system. He probably knows better what Vlasic plays like. I think it could work a lot better because right now they're separating the three guys into three pairs. And I don't think that's the best way to go about things.

Yeah. Yeah, especially as we head towards the playoffs, right? I think this team has Stanley Cup aspirations, or at least being a contender and front-loading the lineup and playing your stars as often as possible, seems like what they should be focusing on. Yeah, I don't know if there are any other guys, to be honest, that are really warranting conversation. Like, none of the National Predators guys have really separated themselves from the pack, I feel like. I don't know. I think that's, I mean, we listed four or five guys there. Let's move on to the Vesna.

Yeah. Let's talk goalies. This is one I feel a lot better about because I feel like there's two guys that have been head and shoulders above the pack and then there's another one or two guys that I think are right behind them and then it's like everyone else.

Yeah. Do you? I feel like there's one guy who's severely above everyone else and then I think possibly two guys who are battling out. Who are your guys? So John Gibson is, he's saved 22 goals above. We got the same page up.

We got the same page up. Which is just, like, frankly, insane. And I remember looking at this a while back in the analytics Corsica era. So going back to 2007, there's, like, one Tim Thomas season there. And then there's, like, two Sergey Bobrovsky years where, like, they were in the 30s or maybe even approaching the 40s in terms of goal saved. And, man, if Gibson keeps this up and he stays healthy, like, he's going to. shatter all of those seasons in terms of individual excellence. And I mean,

just the fact that the ducks are still sitting in a playoff spot. Some of it has to do with the Wong Key Pacific Division. But I mean, the fact that they've stayed afloat with all the early injuries they had and just the general Randy Carlis of their team is, it's remarkable how good he and Ryan Miller have been. Like, their goaltending has been carrying them on a nightly basis. Yeah, I'm with you.

I think it's John Gibson's world. We're just living in it. Before the season started, I had Gibson rated as the best going league and pretty much the sole reason that I had Anaheim comfortably in a playoff spot because I recognized the rest of the roster was kind of crummy but they had Gibson who I think I had carrying similar value to some of like the best forwards in the league and it's hard to be certain about goalies but he was so far above the rest that it wasn't that difficult to say that because I think he was he's the only goalie who, who's been above 920, I think, three or four years in a row, and he's just been so remarkably consistent. And this year, even with a terrible team in front of him, I think his expected save percentage is under 900, and he's still managed a 924, which is just incredible and contributes to that.

Yeah. 22 goals saved. And I tweeted a couple days ago about how Logite Ducks are much better with Andre Kasha in the lineup and quoted their much better coursey at 48.5%. and to most people it'd be like, wow, that's still an awful hockey club. And to me, I'm like, that's good enough with John Gibson. Yeah. Oh, for sure.

Yeah. Yeah. To at least be competitive enough on an heavy basis. Yeah, I agree. I think Gibson's clearly been the cream of the crop, I think, the year Freddie Anderson is having, especially with, here's the thing. And I'm not even going to consider, like, the two different markets and the attention on them.

I think just in terms of how good the two respective teams are, like, I'm not. Like if the Ducks do for whatever reason fall off, if John Gibson plays like a mere mortal in the second half of the year. And the Leafs are just going to win so many more games and just be so much more relevant than the Ducks team that I feel like from a voter perspective, Freddie Anderson could potentially steal some votes from him just because of obviously being deserving, but also all the other stuff that goes into that voting. Yeah, and Vezna isn't voted by the professional hockey rights association, so we can't even lobby really on Twitter for John Gibson's goals. saved above average, but Anderson has been incredible this year. He's been the MVP of a very

strong Leafs team who has defensive issues, but those defensive issues have been mitigated immensely by his play. I think the Leafs for all their defensive warts are top 10 and goals against this year, and that's largely because of Anderson. I think Pecorini, though, is probably right there with him. Yeah, 929 on the year and double digits also on goal saved. I think he's like fourth behind Anderson, Gibson, and Halak. So, yeah, he's having a second straight, awesome season. And I think it's, I'm really happy that for a variety of reasons that he's been this good, but especially because can you imagine how annoying it would be if he struggled this year

out of the gate and how all the articles being written about how last year's game seven against the Jets and him getting pulled and his struggles there, you know, resulted in these, in these struggles. He's shaking and his confidence is shaken. and he can't perform anymore. It would be so exhausting. So the fact that he's having a good year sort of goes a long way

towards eliminating those stupid narratives and sort of that psychological element of it. And there's also the old analytics narratives about how Pecorane was one of the worst goals in the league propped up by the Nashville defense and now he's completely turned it around. Like I was one of the people who wrote those articles I think three or four years ago

and he's been a changed man ever since and I just want to say kudos to you, Peckerene, if you're listening. listening to idiot ass. And kudos to the Predators. He obviously is, has nothing better to do. And kudos to the predators for handling the financial situation well. Yeah.

I really like the contract that they signed him to because I feel like there was a potential there for them to give him a ridiculous loyalty contract that was many, many years too long. And I believe it was only a two-year deal after this year. So it's completely reasonable. And now they're going to have him and Soros as like a top three to five goalie pair for the next couple years for less than most teams will be paying just their starter. So it's a pretty sweet spot that they've got themselves in. I think, do you think Vasilevsky has a chance to enter this discussion?

Obviously, his full season numbers are ridiculous. He missed a stretch of time with injury. So his games played is a bit lower than some of these other guys. But if he stays healthy the rest of the year, like the lightning ride him pretty hard. I wouldn't be surprised to see him get into the 50s in terms of starts, which probably would be enough. Yeah, I think we'll see that. I think there's a potential for the lopsided win record to have a big factor in that. I know last year his goals saved by the average was, I think, it might have been negative.

Yeah. And he still met. Did he win the Veson last year? Was that? No. Did he? He did not. Packer Rene?

Yes. It was René, Rene Halibach, and Vasilis. And I just recall him being nominated despite that. Yeah. And then someone like, Bob Rolfs. Well, he was amazing to start the year. And then he really dipped. This was his first full season as a starter, so I understand that.

Yeah. But I just remember being very myth that Bobrotsky and especially John Gibson weren't nominated when they were so much better. Just they didn't have the team backing them to those Ws. Yeah. Yeah, I like, I think Vaselowski definitely, I mean, you saw that performance he had last night against the week. Sure did.

And obviously, you know, his A game is right up there. And just in terms of like what he can do physically. Yeah. Um, and so if he can string together enough games without that drop off he had last year with how good the lightning are going to be, I think it's perfectly reasonable to lump him in with those other guys. Um, yeah, there isn't anyone really else. Like, I've been kind of pleasantly surprised to see, uh, Braden Holpey continue his strong playoff run. And, you know, he's been up and down a little bit this year, but he looks much better than he did last regular season. And there were concerns about whether, uh, his best days were behind him. So that's good.

But otherwise, I think it's pretty clear that those top two or three guys are. above the pack. John, let's take a quick break here to hear from a sponsor, and we're going to keep this conversation going on the other end of things. Getting tickets to sporting events can be far too complicated. With hundreds of websites and varying levels of reliability, how do you know who to trust out there? That's why Seekkeeks so clutch because they're going to take all the guesswork out of it for you

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75% of the players maintain like a point per game pace. They're going to slow down from these video game numbers, I think. But we're probably going to see like 30 point for game players this year. There are currently 50 guys at a point of game and 44 of them are over a point of game. Yeah. I think around 30 to 40 is probably where we settled in, which is still absurd from where we were last year. Because they were just like I remember when I was doing projections before that started the year, I only had, I think, 15 or so above point per game,

but there were so many people above 75 where you look at them. You're like, you know what? This guy, I can imagine. I can see it. I remember I think I had Eichol at like 78 points. I'm like, if Eichl rips off 95, I would not be surprised. Yeah. No, that's ridiculous.

But I mean, especially in terms of goals, like, yeah. I mean, obviously some of these guys, the shooting percentages are not going to continue. We can say that with certainty just because you and though. we're living in a different era now. You know, we've never really seen a guy shoot at even a reasonable volume for over 20% for a full year. And, you know, like what, Braden Point is he still shooting like 25%. Something like that, yeah. Obviously, even on that lightning team, we're not really expecting that.

Yeah, he's 24.1%. I mean, Jeff Skinner is at 22.7, Ovechkin's over 21. And like a lot of these guys, Joe Povilski 22, that's going to come back down to Earth a little bit. Now most of these guys shoot at such a high volume that they're going to be able to maintain, you know, they're not going to completely fall off if those shooting percentages normalize. But I don't think, like right now we're basically headed for like a handful of guys approaching 60. And considering what we've seen in the past few years where like if you're in the 40s, you're a freaking star, it's just a different world we're living in.

And I think we're going to have to readjust to that. but I think there probably is at least a bit of a middle ground moving forward. Yeah, and Ovechkin's obviously leading right now with 25 and 30. I don't think he's going to score on one-fifth of his goals, wherever he's at now. And it still just feels hard to take him out as the frontrunner right now just because of the lead he has and the fact that he's Alex Ovechkin. Do you think it'll be him or line A this year? Well, so he's, so I was looking up the odds for the betting odds.

So he's plus 380. okay so you bet 100 you win 380 for those at home McDavid line A and McKinnon are next at plus 1,000 which makes me feel like that's like a pretty massive gap that is a very massive gap yeah and then you've got Matthew David yeah and then well we'll get into him on there ross but then you've got Matthews Pastor Nack and Brainpoint next at like 11 to 13 to 1 um I think if I was if I was betting if I was a betting

betting man, I would feel very uncomfortable betting against Alex Ovechkin, just because even at plus 3-8, those are pretty good odds. No, it is. But I mean like, I mean like I, I think line A, for example, like what we saw from him for a while there and sort of the insane binges he can go on and what his ceiling is if he keeps shooting as much as he has this year, I feel like he's got tremendous upside to potentially dethrone of Etchen in this award. And there's enough, the field is so good this year. I mean, Ovechkin's still the goat. Yeah, yeah. And I haven't seen anything otherwise from him.

I mean, just the fact that he played, what, 106 games last year, drank all summer, became a father, won a Stanley Cup, and he just comes back and how he has 25 goals and 30 games, like, it's just obscene. I mean, theory, what if Ovechkin was really bogged down by the constant pressure of winning a cup that... Now he's playing free and easy. Now he's letting loose. He's having fun out there. Breezy, beautiful Ovechkin. He's having fun out there. He's having fun out there.

He's having fun. he's scoring goals at a rate he hasn't in a long time. And yeah, I think that might have been it. Just this was the mainstream media's fault that he wasn't doing this all along. Yeah. I'm glad he's been unleashed and now he can finally start to score some goals. It's an exciting time. Who would you, would you have Linae after Ovechkin in that?

Yeah, I think it's between Ovechkin and Linae. If Matthews wasn't injured, I think he would definitely be in the conversation. He has 16 and 18 games. Yeah. But that injury really took off whatever volume he could have had. And I think the rest of the guys, I'm less confident. Like they might fall off. Like maybe Posternak will be up there.

Maybe Skinner. Not as confident in Braden Point keeping up 26%. Yeah. He's not going to shoot that high. What I will say about Braden Point is like he's in a pretty sweet spot right now with how he's being used. Like playing with Kutrov at 515 and being on that like basically the trigger man on the top pari play unit. Finally. Because he wasn't to start.

No, he wasn't. And so obviously that's going to be a great spot where I wouldn't be surprised to see him flirt with like the high teens. And he's shooting quite a bit this year. So I don't think he's got the upside that Ovechkin and Lina do in this race. But I wouldn't be surprised to see Braden Point have a crazy offensive season that's going to result in many, many dollars coming his way this summer. Yeah. Or a contract standoff. I can't imagine anyone doing that.

Okay, yeah, I like Ovechkin Flizs where I don't think there's any like real dark horse sleepers. that could rise quite a bit, right? Like, it seems like most of the... I mean, it's crazy. We've already got eight guys over 20 goals. Mm-hmm. And we're at, like, yeah, the third waypoint through season. It's...

Joe Popelski has 20 goals and seven assists. I didn't even know that, but that's quite the style. He does, yeah, he's shooting 22.2%. Yeah? No, I mean, he's been... He's been good for them. Timo Meyer as well as right up there. The Art Ross...

So this was a testament to, and this obviously is an award, well, same with the Rocket Richard. It's not an award we're voting for, but I did want to get to this because I noticed that McDavid, and maybe deserved really so, is still a pretty heavy favorite to win this, even though Ranton has built up

a nice little cushion here, but I get it. I mean, I would not want to bet against McDavid in this award either. Although Kutrov, Kuturov, I remember he started off a bit slow this year. Yeah. And people were like, oh, he's just, he's overpassing.

He's just not playing his game. And now he's got 47 points in 33 games. And he had a stretch there where it was like, I think he had like 25 points in 10 games or something. Not bad. It's insane. So yeah, he's been just fine. But yeah, I don't know.

Like what, I apologize to Miko Ranton on the most recent podcast I did because myself and Andrew Berkshire didn't have him in our top 20 wingers to start the year. And obviously now he's on pace for 135 points. And I've been deservedly getting some flack for that. where what's a reasonable because you do the projections for the end of year what do you think is a reasonable projection for what to expect from me coranton and the rest of the year because obviously he's not going to keep this up but when a guy does have 52 points in 31 games i feel like you do need to sort of expand your horizons in terms of what is possible especially considering

um just how good himself mckinan and landis gaw are so you know there are eventually going to go through a bit of a percentage spoon and it's not going to be two to three points per game for them but I think of like what are we expecting as a reasonable outcome for him. It's tough because that line is shooting lights out now. I think they might still have an insane on ice string percentage as you'd expect from a high powered line but just I don't think to that degree. Right. My projections are based on the last three years, weighted for recency, age adjusted. So number one, Connor McDavid, 120 point pace is. what I think is true talent levels at.

Yeah. Number two, Nathan McKinnon, 107, and number three, Mika Randon at 100. Yeah. So he, just the way he's played this year has been enough to put him on that level of point scoring ability, where I think that 100 points is a reasonable midpoint for him, which seems absurd. I wouldn't be surprised if he just completely cools off, but he's been at that level since I think last December or so

since being put on a line with McKin full time. Wait, so you're expecting him to be a 100 point player the rest of the way, or you're expecting him to end the year around 100 points? The rest of the way, so he would end around like 105 to 1010, I think. Yeah, it's true. I mean, I was thinking even like,

if he just ended the year at 100 points, that's 48 points in the next 51 games, which is like nearly a point, like that's still a pretty damn good pace. Yeah, yeah. obviously based on what he's done so far i mean it's it's weird because i can't like lines and players go through slumps especially if scoring goals but this line it's really it really does seem like every game they're generating at least like two goals it's yeah it's wild yeah it's

insane i still can't fathom it last year in my fantasy hockey leagues the guy was just like trying to give ranching away like he's trying to upgrade his like keepers whatever and like no one want him just because he was peddling him so much like how he can't be that good why you keep trying to give him away and then he decides to lead the league in scoring through the first 30 games. Yeah. It's, yeah,

I guess with McDavid, like, I mean, what, he has 45 points in 31 games so far. But the thing with him is like, he's just doing it so, um,

sustainably, I feel like is, is the right word. Because it's weird, because a lot of these other guys and some of these wonky numbers were seeing in early, early in the year, you're looking at the percentages,

you're just based on past expectations. You're like, okay this is eventually going to stop. When McDavid, it's like he's just, he's not doing anything that seems out of the ordinary. Like he's just doing like one, two points a game. Occasionally he bursts out for a three, four point game. But it's just like constantly chipping away at it, shooting a reasonable percentage, pretty in line with what he's done throughout his career. And he's just like, every year he's like just raising the benchmark ever so slightly.

And I, what do you think the, what do you think the reasonable ceiling is? Because obviously like at his peak? Yeah. Like let's say like three. three years from now when he's like at that combination of like physical peak and strength while also still not having his skills deteriorated at all and he's still flying at an all-time high like I mean if the game obviously keeps going this way it might be impossible to answer that question but let's say things stay where they're at right now like could we see him

flirt with like 150 I I don't that like I remember when crosbie was getting like a hundred points a year. Yeah. And he might have been like a 100, 110 point player. Yeah. And then he went off for, I think, 67 and 41 and was flirting with 135. Yeah. So if you...

During a time where like no one was going to goal. Yeah. Exactly. And I think McDavid, as of now, seems like he's a better score than Krazi was early in his career. And I don't think 150 is out of the question in his peak best season. Yeah. Because I don't think we've seen it yet, which is extremely frightening. Yeah, man, 32 goals and 66 points and 41 games in 2010-11 before that concussion or before the concussions.

Yeah, that's one of those all-time what-ifs. Man, that three-year span where he didn't have one full season was like it just breaks your heart because that is, those were his, that was his peak and it was just taken away from everyone. Yeah. Like I remember that point streak during that. 66 and 41 games and he looked insane yeah he was unstoppable but it's weird because he was doing it in like very sidney crosbie fashion like it's not like like when you watch macdavit you're like this guy's like a different specimen like he's just so much fast he does everything so much faster than anyone else out there with crosbie it was still like so methodically even though he was younger

than he is now and the cool thing about crosbie who has what he is 32 points in 27 games um the Penguins powerplay has been fine, but actually before we get into Crosby, the Penguins and the Leafs are the two teams with the fewest power play opportunities this year. And I was watching the broadcast the other day. I think, I don't know if the two teams were playing or someone was bringing it up,

but I think it was a Penguins Ottawa game. And the commentators were saying how before the game, the senators and everyone involved was saying how one of the keys to the game for them was to stay out of the penalty box because they know the Penguins' power play is so lethal. Are we buying that teams, like are identifying and realizing that if you put the leaves and penguins and I guess maybe the lightning on the power play, you're screwed.

So you're just like not taking penalties. Like on the one hand, it makes sense. On the other hand, like these teams are so good that they have the puck more often than you. And if they do so and they're in dangerous spots to score, you're probably going to have to take penalties to avoid giving up goals. So I feel like some of it is probably just random early season stuff. But the penguins have had like an inordinately low number of power plays. As a vocal proponent of. just don't take penalties.

Yeah. I think it is possible. For some players, it's like in their DNA. For me, when I was playing hockey, I won most sportsmen like every year because I just did, I was the Ryan O'Reilly just not taking penalties because like, it's not hard. Just don't, like these are illegal activities.

Just don't do them. Like you don't need to hack a guy. You don't need to crush a guy. Just if you're out of position, you know what? Take your L. You don't need to be a little dick about it. Just don't take penalties. I just don't see how it's that difficult for a professional.

professional players to just not do it. Yeah. And I don't know if teams are figuring that out against specifically Pittsburgh and Toronto. I don't know if there is a league-wide conspiracy against these two teams. I don't know if it's just teams are playing clean games. It's so weird to me that it's happening. I mean, the reason I brought it up is because, you know, Crosby is well over a point of game.

He only got eight power play points. And the Penguins power play has been perfectly fine in terms of efficiency, but they've had such low volume that, you know, he hasn't had the benefit. I mean, he had 38 power play points last year. Yeah. And we'd expect him on that unit to, you know, be able to accumulate some nice volume there. So if he's not, that kind of explains why it kind of contextualizes the fact that he's actually having a really awesome season and he's probably going to flare with 100 points again,

which he hasn't done in a while. And, you know, at this age, the fact that him and Ovechkin are still as good as they are, even though we keep hearing about this new era of guys that are coming in and redefining the game is cool that the torch still hasn't fully been passed yet. My favorite for this award, though, in terms of if you were betting, and we talked about this, was Johnny Goodrow.

Yeah, 31 to 1. I mean, the likelihood of him leading the league in scoring is probably not great, but at those odds, it'd be an interesting flyer just because that team obviously plays such fast-paced, exciting games, and he's right up there and with Monaghan and Lynn Holm, like he's got a shot to do some pretty special things. I think they draw a lot of penalties as well.

Well, they should maybe give some tips to the leaves and penguins. Maybe. But yeah, Gujaros is one of the best in the league at that. Kachuk does it in his own special way. I know. So. I wonder if there's like a, I mean, I guess you could possibly look into this in the numbers,

but like Matthew Kachuk is so annoying that obviously he draws a lot of penalties on like himself. Yeah. But I wonder if there's like a residual factor where like he like leaves a lasting impression on the other team of leaving them and so annoyed. They like, he goes off the ice and they're just like, oh, screw it. We're just going to take a pedaling and someone just because they're still pissed off of that guy. It's a special skill he's got. I think that's it for the individual words.

I don't really want to get into like the Selkie. Is there anyone? The heart? All right. Let's get into it. Let's get into it. I mean, we just, we just, we just, we just, the big cheese. Is that what we're calling the heart these days?

Yeah. That's why I just decided to call it right now. I'm hungry and... Not to be confused with Marshall Erickson, the Big Fudge. All right. Because I don't think it's necessarily a point debate because I would personally have McKinnon over Rattanon. Yeah. I mean, McDavid is the most valuable player in hockey.

Yeah. If you're not going to count goalies. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Like John Gibson's the most valuable player. Mm-hmm. So we're just not giving his goals. So Gibson, McKinnon, McDavid are...

I think so. Yeah, I don't think there's any defensemen that are warranting discussion. I don't know. I think that's, I'm cool with those three. Yeah. I know Tyler Dello brought this up on Twitter, I think a couple weeks ago,

and he mentioned Cindy Crosby as a potential candidate, and I think he's having a great season with his underlying numbers in terms of carrying the penguins that I think, despite the fact he only has 32 points and there's so many people like ahead of him, I think he's done enough elsewhere

to be in that conversation. conversation like he's currently tied with mckinnan in game score per game right and is in that conversation with him and mcdavid so i would like to see that imagine crosbie winning the hard and ovecun winning the rocket richard just like old times yeah it'd be fun and yeah like i said i mean obviously if he starts getting more power play points it'll help his uh his counting stats and he'll help hit the case for him but you're right i mean what he's done beneath the surface is is very impressive um yeah i think i mean mac david yeah macdiv is yeah macdiv is McDavid.

Like, I don't want to We went through his last year. I mean, hopefully, like, if the spoilers do make the playoffs, then I feel like it'll be, like, impossible to not give it to him. Like, I just don't see an argument for it. Like, they're literally the worst team in the league

with him, not on the ice, and they're one of the best teams in the league with him on the ice. Like, what more do you need to see? Like, it's literally the definition of most valuable. And yet, last year, just didn't see, we just looked the other way and said, let's give it to these fringe playoff team leaders.

He's going to spoon feed Alex Chassan 30 goals this year. That guy who said Alex Sean is a dark horse. Dark Horse or 35 goals. This might be finally right. Adrian Dater. Yeah, that's right. Yeah, that was a good, yeah, that was a long, long time ago. Amazing stuff.

It was a long play. So we did, yeah, he was ahead of his time. We did, are you satisfied with a discussion with the big cheese? Yeah. All right. Let's do a, let's do Stanley Cup odds. So do you agree with the argument or the statement that, well, first off, the Jets and the Preds tops in the West?

Are we all comfortable with that? Yeah, very much so. Calgary is obviously up there and they have the Pillow Soft division to get through, but I think it's those two. If I was betting the, for Stanley Cup odds, I'd rather, bet the sharks than the flames personally i just i just think they're upside as a team is higher yeah but yeah i mean both are probably good value plays just because that division is pretty open and they're not going to have to play the jets or the predators in the second round and hopefully like

we saw last year those two teams just beat the crap out of each other for seven games and then a pacific division team possibly waltzed in and yeah steals that western conference final and you know that's completely possible we literally saw it last year um do you think the lightning should be considered in a tier of their own in the east, or do you think the Leafs or the Capitals or anyone else should be lumped together similar to how the Pres and Jets are lumped in the West? I think they're in a tier of their own right now. It really depends on, I guess, how the season goes. Like, I think earlier this week I had the Lightning and Leifes virtually neck and neck, but that win yesterday getting Basilevsky back was enough to put them in their own tier. And I think the

are in the middle between the lightning and the two Western teams, mostly because of how they played without Matthews, how they played without Nylander. And all these new young guys like Kappan and Janssen stepping up, filling in the void of the players they missed yesterday exactly as the team hope they would, and they have Matthew Severa's caddry down the middle. It's just an incredibly strong team up front. I think some of their, half of their defense are underrated,

half their defense are terrible. and it's a bad mix, but it works out okay. And they have Anderson who is in the best of the conversation. When you have a goalie like that and offense like that, I think they belong in the space between Tampa Bay and the two Western giants. Yeah, and it still feels like they're a prime candidate to make a move at some point between now and the trade deadline. Probably not going to be as big of a piece as some fans are probably hoping for, but, you know, they could add someone similar to what they did last year,

although hopefully someone more useful than Thomas Paganage. but yeah I like I like that I mean I think it's going to come down to I think that race for the first spot in the Atlantic Division similar to how it shaped out last year is going to be really crucial because especially with the way

the wildcard teams are looking right now not having to play the ruins likely in round one would be a lot better last year how we saw like that cakewalk against the devil's in round one really helped the lightning in round two where the Bruins by the time they got in there half their guys were either injured or completely spent and they just waltz right past them.

So that's going to be huge and obviously the leaves are still within striking distance of the lightning. So I'm curious to see how much that race is prioritized versus just getting ready for the playoffs. So to make sure you're healthy and fully functional. Yeah, well, the lightning right now are pretty much almost have that. They don't have it sealed up, but they have made a very nice cushion.

Right. Like I have them at a very nice cushion. nice, 69% to win the division right now. Nice. And the Leafs can obviously be a factor in the lightning will maybe slow down. I think they've won eight in a row or something like that. And Toronto can realize the potential with any land in the lineup and make it a race. But right now it looks like it's Tampa's to lose there.

Yeah, I'm with it. I'm with it. Let's hand out some superlatives since we're doing awards. What's been your favorite under the radar team to watch? watch just in terms of like, don't see like the lightning or the leaves. I get it. They're very good. Um, has there been a team where like you're like finding yourself randomly tuning into their games and you're just like, why am I watching so much of this team? Um, my favorite under the radar team to watch is, uh, the Anaheim ducks. And it is genuinely for, you must hate

yourself. It's just for betting. Yeah. And it's because my model is much higher than them that my roommate is laughing right now because you're all in on the duck because of how many times she's like we're betting on tonight and I'm like well the ducks are playing so she might be laughing at Netflix I don't know but just was the time it was right and we've talked about this a lot

and yeah I just end up watching so many ducks games and in the early season like it was really painful and there's just a big disturbance between where my model was at and where the market was at and then Andre Koch came back and everything changed this team. I usually had just like massive bets on the ducks because I thought they were good and the market was treating them as a bottom five or ten team and they rattle off a lot of wins in a row and I'm sitting here on the couch just silently screaming at like 12 a.m. because it's late and my roommate's sleeping. I mean in their defense like you know with guys like Brandon Montour like they have like individual players that can do exciting things like the overall package might not necessarily be exciting but at least there's like the talent there. So I'm with you. I think

You know, my answer's got to be a lot of what senators. Obviously, their paces slow down a little bit, but like what they were doing for a while there in terms of like just load up on every, like, if you're playing DFS or if you're betting, just like, go over and just load up on every single player involved because, my goodness. Why not? Especially like Thomas Chabot, like literally every, I said this in an article I wrote about him recently, but I think the two most potent offensive units this year have been the one with Thomas Chabot on and then the one he's playing against.

That was a great tweet. similar in scope because we thought they'd be bad to start the year and well ottawa is still bad but this team isn't i think buffalo has been a fun team to watch as well especially during that streak like every game was going into like overtime and every game's close and they have that top tier challenge uh dalien is insane to watch uh ickel was doing things skinner was showing carolina um a few miles away what uh it's like to put him with a competent center yep And, yeah, they've been a great team to watch, I think. Yeah, I think so, too. I think Montreal has been also fun as well. You know, I'm not sure how sustainable them being in a playoff spot is right now and what the second half their season is going to look like.

But, like, surprisingly, like offensively, I've really liked watching. Like, I think the combination of Dolmey and Druan has been, you know, surprisingly effective, especially with Andrew Shaw on that line. And, you know, now that we've got Weber back. And so I've kind of enjoyed them. watching them, they've been a bit of a guilty pleasure. What's a team that when you do watch them, you're just like, oh, God, I, I'm really rethinking my love for hockey.

Chicago, without a doubt. The Kings are an abomination. Yeah. Like, they're like an upfront to everything that is good and holy. I don't think I've tuned into, like, many Kings games since they started just being complete garbage, but I'm going to take your word for it. I put on a Kings game and, like, the commentators are like talking about, like, someone named Amadio or something.

thing. They had so many guys. These guys don't exist. Like, I remember, I think on the PDO cast a couple years ago, we talked about Pontus Aber. And we talked about guys who are made up. Yeah. The Kings lead the league in guys who are made up.

Matt Luff? Yeah, I mean, they're, yeah, their fourth line. Austin Wagner, Nate Thompson, Michael Mario. Yeah, Matt Luff, second line winger for them. Alex Ayafalo, first line winger. Yeah, they've been really tough to watch. Yeah, so I just don't. But I've watched a few Blackhawks games because the same story as

Anaheim, where... Okay, name three defensemen who are currently in their lineup. On the Blackhawks? Yeah, on the Kings. And I will say that Muzin and Alec Martinez are currently out. Drew Dowdy, Oscar Fentenberg.

Okay, well, Paula Dew. And only to brag, okay, yeah, I get it. You also have looked at Daley Face Off. I mean, yeah, Paula Dew, Oscar Fattonberg, Sean Walker. I actually didn't know that one. Is Dumpin-Ull? Number 61, yeah, he's... out, but yeah, oh, he's still there. He's making like five and a half million for like three more

years. Yeah, he's still there. Um, yeah, the kings have been upsetting. Um, yeah, I don't know, like the blues have also, like they have some talent, but I just expect it to such better things from them. So yeah, they've been tough. Um, they've been probably this year's biggest. Oh, you know what? The Islanders. Really? Yeah. I mean, they, listen, they're sitting currently third in the Metro Division. So I don't know they're complaining. It's been a great story considering people obviously expect them to completely fall off the face of the map after the summer they had. But in like trots is trussed up so hard with that team. Like it's just they're playing such low event hockey and they're just like

scratching and clawing in every game and it's so tight. And it's effective. Like it's the way they have to play it because I think if they tried to play like the 100% enores are playing, they'd be absolutely getting demolished. Yeah, that's why I'm last year. Exactly. Yeah.

But at least they had like with Tavares there. They actually had some offensive talent. to get into some of those shootouts. Like I feel like now, especially with Matt Barzal, not having such a great season. Yeah. They would really be in rough shape.

So I have not enjoyed watching them play. Dumb, let's, uh, let's get out of here. I was, uh, we're not going to do any Riverdale talk today. I'm like four episodes behind, thankfully. Let's just put this out there. Riverdale is just complete utter garbage. Are you still watching?

I didn't watch the most recent one, but like, I can't quit it, man. I, I'm so close to, winning it. I know. But every time you're about to quit it, something happens where you're, like, something slightly redeemable and you're just like, I don't know. I think, I think, I think, I can change the show. I think, I don't know. What redeable aspects of this season have there been for you? Yeah, it's been pretty bad. It's been off, they're off the deep end. Yeah. All the prison stuff has been insane. Yeah. Just, just, I don't even want to talk about it.

Okay, sorry to upset you and on such a sour note. Um, plug some stuff. What, uh, what, What are you working on these days? Where can people find your work? Give me all the lowdown. Recently at the Athletic, I wrote about the top Canadian teams for Stanley Cup Pod. So similar to what we were discussing. And I think we were on the similar pages where it's Toronto, Winnipeg, Calgary. And then everyone else kind of just...

But you had Toronto ahead of Winnipeg? I would say. So where do you have them? Yeah, it's pretty close. I mean, I think they're both probably the second best team in their conference. Yeah. in the respective conference, right? So it's right there.

So, I don't know. I think you can't go wrong either. For me, I think Toronto is ahead. I mean, that's mostly, I think it comes down to goaltending because Hellebuck has not been his best self this year,

and Anderson has been a best-man candidate. I think that's the big difference because the two teams are similar in that they have incredible offensive players. They have three good defensemen and three bad defensemen well, Winnipeg has three and a half good defenseman. Are you counting Dustin Bufflin as one and a half there?

I'm, no, I'm counting Myers as half a good defenseman. Okay, okay. And then the other two are just very bad. Yeah, it's really funny.

Like, because both teams also similarly are going to have interesting summers with the RFAs they have to sign and how they figure, make all the, all the money fit. But with like Winnipeg, it's funny because you hear some of these conversations sometimes and people are like, yeah,

Winnipeg has a lot of questions. I mean, you know, they've got to sign line A, they've got to sign Connor. They've got to figure out what to do with Tyler Myers. I'm like, what do you mean? Are you like, is this a big issue right now?

Like, just walking away from Tyler Myers? Like, I would be looking into potentially trading him with a trade line for something. Like, I don't. Someone commented on my article for this yesterday and they said, Toronto and Winnipeg, Tyler Myers for Jake Gardner, who says no? Travis Dermott just slides up to Gardner's spot. Garner goes top four with Bufflin. for some Wild West hockey.

And Leifes have a cromulent right-handed defenseman. Oh, man. Mike Babcock would love to have a lot. Yeah, and he has experience playing tough minutes, and I think he's a bit underrated for what he brings the table. He can break even doing that generally, and I think he'd be a good fit.

I think Toronto has the better player, but I think the fact that they're still trotting along with Ron Haynes of the top lineup is. Yeah, well, obviously, yes. Tilt the ice. Yeah, I think so. So I think it, they're both understood free agents. I think it could work maybe.

Yeah, I can't see the, I can't see something like that happening in the NHL. It sounds too creative. It's not even that creative. It's just like, we have a left guy, you got a right guy. Have you seen the way in Angel things operate? I, I have. I have a good point. Yeah, all right.

So check that out. People can follow you on Twitter as well. Yep. At my name, Dom, L-U-S-Z-Z-Z-Y-S-Y-N. All right. Hopefully you were listening to that at half-speed, and I can figure that out. Dom, this was a blast, man. And surprisingly, Ruby was pretty quiet. I'm a little mad about it. She got really sassy when Demetri came in. Yeah, a lot of howling. I thought she would make a guest appearance, but she did not. So I'm a little pissed about that.

All right, man. We'll do this again soon. All right. Take care. Follow on Twitter at Dim Philipovic and on SoundCloud at soundcloud.com slash hockey p-docast.