The Hockey PDOcast - The 2025 Mock Draft

Episode Date: June 20, 2025

Dimitri Filipovic is joined by Cam Robinson and Chris Peters to do their annual mock draft of the top 16 picks in this year's class. If you'd like to gain access to the two extra shows we're doing each week this season, you can subscribe to our Patreon page here: www.patreon.com/thehockeypdocast/membership If you'd like to participate in the conversation and join the community we're building over on Discord, you can do so by signing up for the Hockey PDOcast's server here: https://discord.gg/a2QGRpJc84 The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Media Inc. or any affiliate.

since 2015. It's the Hockey P.D.O.cast with your host, Dmitri Filipovich. Welcome to the Hockey Pee-O-Cast. My name's Demetra Filipovich and joining me on this special day, my good buddy, Chris Peters, live from Abbotsford, where he's covering the Calder Cup finals in my own neck of the woods. We're really, should have driven out here. I should have gone to him to do this in person, but we're on Zoom to facilitate the three-man pod, as we always do. CP, how's it going, man? Demetri, it's awesome. It's always, I know the draft is like right upon us when I get to join you and my pal Cam. And we and Cam and I have had so much fun doing these mock drafts that we just decided to do a podcast together now. So you you are the matchmaker.

Yeah, I'm not sure how I feel about that because on the one hand I love it when a love story comes together like this and the two of you can find each other and make sweet content together. But it feels like a slight against me. You almost cut out the middleman and just went directly to the source and the two of you just started doing these shows. So I'll allow it for now because I know it's the busiest time of year. You two in particular are two of the busiest men in show business during this week. And you're very generous with your time coming on here. As always, the third man in joining us as well, your podcasting partner. And my pal, Cam Robinson.

Cam, how's it going, man? It is going very well. This is, like Chris said, we're like a hallmark movie now, the three of us. This has been so many years of doing it. And we had so much fun that we branched out and we got ourselves a candle factory up, state, New York somewhere. the credits are rolling, but it's going to end right back where it all began here, right? We're going to wrap up the season with another mock draft on the, on the PDO.

I'm very excited. This is one of our longest standing and most fun annual traditions. I look forward to it every year. I know the listeners do as well. I believe we've been doing these since 2019 or 2020. Definitely Cam and I have been doing it since 2019. I remember he came over back when I was still working for Yahoo. And he was hanging out in my living room.

we recorded the show our pal lufit bodine fell asleep on the couch because he had just come in from Sweden and jet lag hit him like a like a runaway train and so he fell asleep and then we I mean this is how long ago it was we we like woke him up frantically to give us a scouting report on philip broberg at the time and he somehow delivered because he's a true professional and that he immediately fell back asleep so uh it's been a long winding journey but I'm excited to do this again with you guys over the next two hours we're going to go through the top 16 picks or the first half of the first round of this year's class. I'm sure a lot of listeners have been with us for the ride the entire time,

but for those that are just tagging along now and aren't familiar with the deal, we're going to go pick by pick. We're going to break down each of those picks. We're going to do a bit of a mock draft, try to spice it up a little bit, go against just the chalk or the convention, apply the logic, mix in team fits. I think that's where I can probably provide my own most utility in terms of where the teams are at and what the logic is because obviously the two of you are much more well-versed with the actual intricacies of these players. At the top of each of these shows, I like to do this with

you guys just to kind of set the table and get ourselves thinking about how we got to this point. I want to ruminate a little bit about the process that you guys endured to create these evaluations and kind of how you got to this point with all these guys. Cam, I'll start with you. obviously you have the luxury of doing this year-round. The legwork probably starts even well before you're getting a bunch of these viewings on these guys and then kind of putting it all together. And then once we get closer to the draft, you really kind of try to make everything fit. You're obviously speaking with a bunch of sources throughout as well

and just trying to get as many nuggets as you can along the way. How has that changed for you over the years now that we're in 2025, I've been doing this for however many years now, comparing it to when we first started or even last time, spoke last season in terms of mixing everything together, the secondhand sources, the in-person viewings, the analytics, some of the tracking data from Mitch Brown, all that sort of stuff. How are you kind of putting that all together as different pieces of the puzzle to find the final product?

Man, I feel like I should be getting a Michelin Star one of these days. Like it is literally, you're taking all these ingredients and you're trying to make this dish at the end of the season for a draft rankings. And fortunately, since I moved to EP, I only dropped one ranking. So I don't have to look like a fool when my September one comes out and looks completely different than the one I put out in June. But, you know, I'm really fortunate, obviously, to work with a group of like extremely hardworking and intelligent people at elite prospects. And they, the amount of effort that is put in for like the draft guide and for us for our boards and stuff is astronomical. Like I don't even think people understand.

I don't think Mitch Brown sleeps, to be completely honest with you. And then, yeah, like you said, like it's, it's been really nice. As my role is kind of elevated with EP. I get to be on the road a lot more. so I get to see more live games, I get to more tournaments. And then consequently, I'm around scouts. I'm around executives far, far more often. And so that's opened up, you know, just a broader rolodex of information that I can

lean upon and I can pick people's brains and I can talk to the kids too, right? I get to talk to them at the CHL USA game and talk to them there and hang out with them, spend some time with them, you know, and through the line to world juniors, U-18s. And so you get to kind of see them evolve and grow throughout the season as people as well as players. And, you know, we're not picking for NHTS. HL teams right now, but you are trying to get as broad a snapshot onto these players as you possibly can to predict their future success. And so all that information, all that manually tracking that Lassie and Mitch do, that we can also bank into our assessments. It's all, it's all gravy. And like I said,

it's just a smorgasbord of ingredients coming together and you hope what comes out isn't burnt and flopped over. CP, how much does that process change for you? In particular, you're, as I said, you're out there in Abbotsford. You're watching these Calder Cup games. That's kind of the next step of development along the way towards the NHL. We just watched the Stanley Cup final wrap up between the Panthers and the Oilers, and that's the highest level of hockey, right? And so when I'm watching those games and then I'm trying to put together my list

and going through some of the tape on these players and swooping in last minute to provide some analysis, in the back of my mind, I'm always thinking about how some of these guys and their skill sets or some of the weaknesses that I see you guys list fit into. them participating in that type of an environment. If everything goes right, how they can contribute what that looks like at the next level. Obviously, there's a certain level of projection or scaling that is up to randomness in terms of the situation they fall into how they develop along the way. These are 18-year-old players for the most part.

And there's a lot of variance between now and when they're 22 or 23 and actually at that level. But watching these games, how much of it in the back of your mind are you thinking of sort of how they fit into that or are you viewing this purely as in a vacuum, this guy, and then acknowledging that all that stuff's going to come later on in the process? Yeah, I mean, it's, it has, it has changed over the years. I mean, in my whole process has kind of had to change in the last two years just because of the amount of responsibilities that I've taken on at flow and, um, the different things that I have to do. So I've, I've, you know, my, my live viewings have gone a little bit down, but I still get to a lot of the big things. CHL and TDP was like a new,

thing this year. You know, go to the world junior camps, go to the world juniors, go to the U-18s, those kinds of things. So it allows that, but you know, you're still doing a lot off of video. And I think the thing that, you know, and I actually just recently talked about this, we do watch the playoffs and you say, okay, well, clearly some of these skills will translate better in this setting. But I think in the end, you still have to go with who do you think is going to be the best player? And the best player may not have that physical edge. Like, you know, Cam and I are, like, just for, to use this here as an example, Cam and I are both really high on James Hagen's,

yet there is the argument that maybe a player at his size and, and with his skill set doesn't translate as well to the playoffs. I tend to disagree with that because I think he's such a smart, skilled, speedy player that that'll help. And I mean, like, I'm sure that people could have had those same arguments about Patrick Kane, and Patrick Kane was a better player in prospect at the time. But still, those were the same kind of things when we were having the debate, should James Van Riemsdike go ahead of him?

Should Kyle Turris go out of him? Those are the kind of conversations that we're being had about Patrick Kane. So, you know, I think it all comes back to what is, what is the best combination of skills that this player possesses? Hockey Sense is always going to be a huge importance to me. And that's a big reason that James Hagen says as high on my list as he is because of the hockey sense component.

So, you know, I think that players will find out, the best players always find a way to make an impact. Maybe it's harder in the playoffs. Maybe, you know, like, why do you? Johnston didn't have the best playoffs this year, but I don't think anybody doubts that he's going to be a top postseason performer as his career progresses. And, you know, I think that's just, it comes with development. So, but also to get to your point about, you know, I am watching a lot more HL hockey. We carry the HL on flow hockey and have all their games live. And so that has

actually helped my process quite a bit because you see those guys that we, we had as top prospects at one time and how that how that even translates to the hl level that is a really tough league and so you're starting to see kind of some of these guys that we were so high on um you know you think guys like brad lambert and others that maybe you know had some of those concerns about size and maybe they were missing pieces of their game and they don't necessarily pop um even at the a hl level then you're you know so that's kind of helped recalibrate some of my thinking as well in terms of you know how i value size and other things. But I mean, it always comes back to Hockey Sense with me.

And that will always be the most important. And if that's the foundation, then, you know, you can separate some of those guys pretty quickly. Yeah, I imagine one of the complicating factors and something you have to juggle throughout the year and just hearing CP talk about Higgins. And I think that comes to mind for me with him is some of these guys who have kind of been under the microscope for a longer period of time, let's say, where a lot of their stuff gets nitpicked.

especially if you come in into their draft season with heightened expectations, how you're viewing or valuing what you see from them in that year, compared to some of these later risers along the process, whether it's down the stretch of the regular season or into the playoffs or tournaments or even testing and kind of meetings at the combine, it feels like some of those guys have the benefit of kind of clear eyes in a way, whereas someone like Higgins, who you've been sort of closely monitoring for a longer period of time, you may be unfairly so expect some level of kind of evolution or improvement.

And if they're just ultimately the player that they even were previously, that still might not be an indictment against their development, but it's not necessarily what you're looking for. How do you kind of weigh those two things between that and someone like, let's say, whoever just rose up in this process that went up 10 picks in your first round compared to where you had that maybe in the midseason? Yeah, it's a really interesting and kind of convoluted, I think, process to flesh out because we're all human.

We are naturally going to compare players to themselves at different stages. We're going to compare them to previous players. And so I think that James Higgins, and I've said this, I've said this to NHL Scouts. I've argued it in the EP Slack Group too that I feel like he's been nitpicked a little bit because of just how demonstrative he was as a draft minus one and how successful and all the scoring titles that he broke internationally and all of these things. Whereas, you know, if he had been under the radar and then all of a sudden was the first line center at Boston College as a draft eligible and all of a sudden was the first line center

for team USA on a gold winning world junior squad everyone would be losing their minds they big where who is this kid he's a superstar but because he had such a great pedigree going in the expectation was even more and that was aided by we just saw macklin celebrini we just saw him do the same thing younger you know at college we saw adam fantili the year before that we see these players that have gone in as true freshman and just blown it out and Higgins didn't do that and so So the expectations was, you know, he's going to go play with Gay Pro and Ryan Leonard. And that's going to be like the best spot in college hockey. But he wasn't Will Smith.

And so he wasn't, it wasn't going to be as seamless as everybody hoped. He had, they had to, they all had to figure each other out. And he had to learn not to defer to his wingers in that regard. But I still think, you know, the kid just put up a season very comparable to what Jonathan Taves did as a as a true freshman at Nodak all those years ago. A point of game season, a first line center for them and the NCAA, a first line center of the world juniors winning gold. These are accomplishments that we do not see very often from a draft eligible.

And yet for some reason, it's not even giving him credit. Some of them are even being held back against him. Well, look who he got to play with. Look at the opportunities he got. And he still didn't pop offensively. So it is because you always want to have your players going, the development curve going upwards. That's what you're looking for.

That's why guys like Beckett Seneca all of a sudden spike right at the end of the year and their draft stock explodes. We see Brady Martin doing the same thing right now. You put James Higgins in London. for this past season, he's winning the scoring title in the CHL. He's probably out kicking Michael Mesa. And the, you know, the story around him is going to be completely different heading into the draft. So it's it's comparables.

It's human nature to look for more, for always wanting more when we're looking at these players. But sometimes you have to take a step back and be like, how would I look at this if things were different? What at the end of the day, all that matters is what's this player going to look like at 24, 26, 28, 30? It doesn't really matter about today. I like that. All right. I think that's enough foreplay from us. Let's get into the fun stuff. Let's get into why the people have tuned in here and are listening to us. We're going to start our mock draft. I've divvied up the order.

CP, you're first on the clock. You are picking for the New York Islanders. What's your first selection? Yeah, you know, I would love to listen to and see those bumper stickers and, you know, in and around on Long Island for James Hagen's. but, you know, as much as I love the option of a James Higgins, I have to really go pragmatically here. And I think that the opportunity to draft the number one defenseman is too great. So with the first overall pick in the PDOCAST mock draft,

the New York Islanders are proud to select Matthew Schaefer of the Uri Otters. And really, you know, I think the consensus has circled around Schaefer. The one thing I will say, and I've said this many, many, times is there are not many instances where we have stamped a guy that played 17 regular season games as the number one overall pick. So I can say to you that this is not a pick without risk. This is not a pick that you can feel 100% confident in. But what you can say is that of all the players in this draft, which is the most likely to be a top of the lineup player and the combination of skills, the size, the skating, the willingness to defend, the physical,

the competitiveness, the hockey sense, all of those things, Matthew Schaefer, most, mostly feel, I feel most comfortable projecting him as a number one defenseman, which to me is a lot better than maybe this guy's a number one center, maybe this guy's a number two center, maybe he's a wing, maybe he's not even a center, I just think that Matthew Schaefer gives you the best chance to land a player of the highest quality and of a guy that will potentially be a cornerstone player for your franchise. Well, the books certainly agree with you because Van Duel has the first overall pick being a defenseman at minus 1900. So it's essentially lock at this point.

And I imagine that's certainly going to be Matthew Schaefer. Cam, where are you where are you at with a selection, especially within the grand scheme of clearly him being at the top of this class, but in relative to other first overall picks and defensemen of this caliber, because on the one hand, I've only heard glowing reviews. and it's certainly very easy to become enamored with the skill set and what that projects like in this modern NHL game. On the other hand, after his injury, we saw a relatively abbreviated workload in terms of what, like he played like 17 or so at HL games and then the couple World Junior games before breaking his collarbone. So it sounds like he's been clear to play. He's been on the ice. There's no real concerns there.

But obviously it's just a shorter runaway, I guess, leading up to this process compared to maybe past previous examples. Oh, without question. I think people, especially on Long Island, need to recognize that, yes, Matthew Schaefer is the top player in this class. I don't think it's that huge a gap between him and Mesa. But he's not a near generational talent to anchor the class like we have seen in the past. He is more in the mold of, you know, when Owen Power went first overall, where it wasn't a slam dunk that Owen Power was going to go first overall, when Jake Sanderson went third overall, these are the type of players that we should be looking at Schaefer, you know, at the same age. that's the type, the caliber of players, someone that you're like, this is, this is a very good chance to be a number one defenseman or a very good top pairing defenseman, but not someone who's probably going to push a point of game and really dominate Norris trophy votes. I think I've watched like every shift of his this year and I'm doing a film room that's coming out next week on him. And so he's very, very good, but he's not, he's not a superstar at this point yet. And which is what I'm so interested to watch is what the Islanders decide to do with him for his development. He's very, very young for this class.

He had the completely abbreviated draft eligible season. Is he best served to come to camp and make the NHL roster and play 15, 16 minutes a night, be in and out of the lineup, not be able to go to the American League? Or is he better served to go to school? Is this, you know, do they wait until the draft and we know that there's a handful of players, a large swath of players that are waiting to get drafted, talk to the teams who drafted them and see, do you want me to go play college? Do you want me to sign a contract and go back to the OHL or the WHL or the WHL or whatever? personally, I think going to university for a year for Matthew Schaefer would do him wonders too. At the same time, I do think he is skilled enough. He's got the will that he could come into camp and he could impress so much with his skating,

with his IQ, with his maturity as a human being. Like this kid has seen some things. He's gone through some things and he keeps coming out of it with a smile on his face. And that's something that you just can't teach. So he might just be good enough to force his way onto an A&T roster. But if I'm the Islanders, if I'm Matthew Darge and them, I'm like, this is our new, this is the golden beetle right here. We got to make sure that he pays out.

Go play at BC for a year. Go play with James Higgins. Go play at Michigan State. Go win a national championship. And then we'll see you in in April. Maybe we're pushing for a playoff spot then. Yeah, I like the point you made there about the fact that, you know, he still is 17 and turns 18 in September, I believe,

and that kind of helping counteract a little bit of that abbreviated developmental runaway this year in terms of games played, just that there's more opportunity here, considering that age cycle. And we'll see. I think it's a fascinating one because on the one hand, you have Patrick Waugh coming back. As the coach, it is Matthew Darsh's first move, essentially, as an NHLGM. And it seems like a no-brainer one, but how they instill the path afterwards will be fascinating just because of the situation on the blue line for the Islanders, right?

We'll see what happens with Dobson's RFA status and whether he gets moved or whether they pay him and sign him long term. Romanov is in a similar spot as well. And then you've got Pelick and Pooleck and Mayfield all in their 30s. but signed for the next four or five years. We sized Isaiah George, who I think we all loved in his draft process as a fourth rounder, make the jump to pro. And I thought gave them really good minutes last year.

So there's a lot of moving parts there. They used like 13 different defensemen last year, picking up because of the injuries, guys like Tony D and Bowquist along the way. And so there's a lot of people in Deptart ahead of them. But at the same time, I think the opportunity is there given that skating ability that will probably play from day one. so we'll see how they handle it. All right, Cam, you're back, or you're on the clock here now with the second pick for the San Jose Sharks.

I'll say that Chris and I's podcast just came out this morning. We recorded yesterday and he threw a little grenade into the fire and said that there's some teams out there. There's some rumors of buzzing that maybe it's not Michael Mesa is the top forward. Maybe it's not a slam dunk that the San Jose Sharks take Michael Mesa. But in this world, in the appropriate world, in the logical world, Michael Misa is going number two. to San Jose and they get to stack Macklin Celebrini with Michael Misa for the next decade plus, slide Will Smith over to the wing, let him create all he wants over there. And it's going to just be fun and sunshine in Northern California.

This kid has good size. He has hard skill. He's a great skater. He's a great playmaker. He's a great shooter. He's a competitor. He's got some jam. He's a number one center who's going to get to cosplay as a number two center and get

all those easier matchups in San Jose. So it's Michael Mesa's time. time here at number two. I love that. C.B., what are your thoughts on Mesa and that fit there for the sharks and everything Cam just said about it? Yeah, I think it works. And I think the question the sharks are going to have to answer right off the bat is, you know, long-term projections for both Mesa and Will Smith, who's the best fit to be that number two center. I tend to think it is Mesa in that scenario. I think that the size and the competitiveness component are helpful. It allows Smith to be more of a facilitator from the half wall,

from kind of not necessarily having the defensive responsibilities of a center, which he might not be as equipped for. You know, I think that there is, you know, at least, you know, I feel pretty comfortable. Mesa was too on my list. And, you know, I feel pretty comfortable about him being, you know, having the ability to play two-way, but it just helps that you have Macklin Celebrini, who's already looking like this two-way stalwart guy that's going to play, you know,

tons of years in the league and be one of the top stars. And I think that pressure off of Mesa is helpful because now you've got, you know, an exceptional player in, in, uh, Celebrini who takes as Matt, as, as, as, as, as Cam said, takes away some of these matchups, but you still have a guy that's going to be a handful for whatever line gets him next. So I think that that's, you know, to me, it makes a lot of sense. As Cam said, there is this interesting growing buzz about Frundel, and I heard more of it today. No one's convinced it's going to come to play that way because I think that there is, there is that public pressure component. Everyone says Mesa, right? So how could it be anyone else? But sometimes, as we've seen in

years past, and I said this on our show as well, when that nugget of information slips out, it's sometimes that test balloon to see, how bad is this going to hurt if we do this? Because we started hearing the Y. I Slavkovsky chatter in a similar time frame a few years ago

when Montreal was like, hey, we just got to get the fans ready that we're not picking Shane right. Reading the, in preparation for this, reading the EPD draft guide, it seemed like one of the knocks or potential concerns was some of the one-on-one skills. I would argue that in this particular landing spot, that's way less relevant when you have the forward talent already in place and man-beaters like McLeodem. Certainly, what we

saw from Will Smith in the final 25 games, playing on the wing after the Four Nations break, where I think he had 22 points in 25 games and his speed and shock creation was really popping. Even William Eklund and the playmaking chops, he's shown there's so much talent there where some of the stuff he does in terms of creating time. in space off the puck and getting open to attack to go along with the pace he can play at and the idea that, you know, this Sharks team is going to be able to just run their offense through these top forwards and play at that sort of a speed and create that way. I think that's highly intriguing and that obviously you can get into the goal production and everything he actually

did in Saginaw in the OHL and how remarkable that was. I feel like that is the perfect landing spot for a guy with this particular skill set to insulate some of those. potential drawbacks that would stop him from being in first overall contention while maximizing all the stuff that makes him a pretty clear number two in my mind. Yeah, I think that's spot on. And I also think that it's it's perfect for him as a person, as a player like it, like all those things you mentioned, I think San Jose is they are coming, right? They are so chalked full of young, exciting assets and they're going to have all this room to go and then spend and buy themselves that push you over the top piece in a couple of years. And he's going to just be supported by

all those things rather than going to a traditional number one, number two picking team where it's like you're the shiny new toy and you are kind of everything for them over the next five or 10 years and hopefully they can build around you. No, he gets to step in and be like the third shiny toy behind Smith and Salabrini and just kind of fly under the radar a little bit in that regard and be supplemented. But across the board, this kid has like a machine of a motor. It never ends. He's going to be a fan favorite coaches are going to love them. He's going to be able to do all those little details that that will make him successful in the middle of the ice, which is why I've never wavered in my belief that he is a center.

And yeah, you know, Malcolm Spent said at the combine, you know, yeah, when they asked him about San Jose, he's like, yeah,

my roommate, their niece, he's hoping to go there. And I think that that was a little tongue and cheek. He obviously wants to go first overall, but if he's not going to go first overall, landing in San Jose is one heck of a consolation prize. Especially with the sharks,

I mean, having the second pick certainly helps, but they have 30th as well. They have two seconds, two fourths. And then the same thing again, in 2026, essentially, and you look at their books and we'll see what Mike Greer does this offseason. I've been linking Keandre Miller is a very interesting fit in terms of getting a fast-paced defenseman who can play with some of these guys. They're certainly going to add just because they need to take on more contracts along the way.

But especially up front, they really, other than DeFoli's $6 million, which is expiring in 26, 27. They have like nothing on the books beyond their ELCs. And that is the summer that both Will Smith and Macklin Celebrating Europe for their second contract. so things are lining up pretty nicely for them to keep adding there, certainly. All right, guys, let's take our break here. And then when we come back, we will jump right back into it. We're going to keep going with our mock draft of the top 16 picks. You're listening to the Hockey P.D.Ocast streaming on the Sports Night Radio Network.

All right, we're back here in the Hockeyedoccast doing our 2025 mock draft. I am next up here with the third overall pick for the Chicago Blackhawks. It does feel like the first two we went through with Schaefer and Mesa seem like not locks because anything can happen come to draft, but certainly the favorites to go in those slots. This feels like this is really where the draft starts. I think part of this. And Cam, you are noting this in one of your combine pieces. What's playing into that is the Blackhawks for every reason.

I've been very coy about what's going on, not necessarily scheduling any dinners with any of these prospects, not really hearing a lot of buzz in terms of where they're leaning or what they're doing. They do have, what, 3, 25, and then 34 overall as well, and an extra second on top of that. so we'll see what they wind up doing with all that. But I'm going to go with James Haken's here. And I get all of the concerns that we talked about off the top

in terms of some of the progression stuff this year, you know, the size, especially comparing it as or putting it in place with Connor Bedard already there and sort of stacking your team together that way down the middle. But one thing I keep coming back to is especially this high in the draft. And I think the Blackhawks are probably hoping that this will be the last year. They're picking this high. after how disappointing last year in particular was. This is where you, I think, need to take some of these home run swings

at the type of talent and puck skill in particular, the drives offense and is very difficult to find in other areas via trade or free agency. And what the idea, I guess, or theoretical possibility of what Hagen's could be in some of the puck skills he's already shown is just too tantalizing for me to pass up here. I'm not sure, I know in the EP draft guide, cam you guys had shades of Logan Cooley. I get it from that creation perspective and how sort of like fluid he is as a mover and how aesthetically pleasing it is. I guess one thing I'd say is

something Cooley certainly added to his game in a year or two in Utah was just what a dog he was in terms of his range and his pursuit. And I think Hagen certainly would need to add more to reach that height. But that's a great starting point for me. And I just feel like with that skill set in particular, that's just something you have to bet on at this point and live with the consequences if it doesn't wind up turning out that way. Yeah. And, you know, I sat down with James. I wrote a big piece on him. I talked to him. I talked to David Carl, who coached him at the World Juniors. I talked to Mike Ayers, his BC assistant coach, their associate coach. And I asked both the coaches, like, what's something underrated that maybe doesn't get enough love? And they said his competitiveness.

Like, this kid wants to get better so that he can win. Like that is, that is goal number one. When he asked for feedback. Like he, he means it. Like, tell me what I need to do to get better so that I can win more. So I do think that he does have a bit of that dog in him.

That's a little underrated too. I'll say this too, is that he's not going three. Like, you know, Chicago's being pretty coy, but just it doesn't make sense for them to stack, you know,

him, Nazar, Connor Bred, all overmore, all sub six foot centers. Like you just can't win in the playoffs under that model through traditional thought. And I think that they are fully buying

into that traditional. additional thought too. But I also think as Hagan slips down the board on on the actual draft day, the value is just going to grow and grow and grow and teams are going to probably regret that level of thinking, thinking that he's too small to potentially play the middle of the ice at the top of a lineup. Well, he's, he's not that much smaller than Nate Mack. You know, he's not that much smaller than Braden Point. Like all these, there are number one centers who fit his physical profile too. And he also has that great speed. He has those great handles. He has good vision. I think his shot is underrated. So, you know, talking to Chris and I, like, we love Higgins at three. That's where we got him on our

board. Yeah. But I don't think either one of us think he's going to go there. Yeah, CPL. I love it. I think. Well, let me just say this. And I'll let you jump in. And we kind of noted this, the, you know, the idea that 37 points and 37 games is a freshman at BC is, his view to some sort of a disappointment. I do wonder what his year, his draft year would have looked like if he was playing on some OHL team as the focal point as opposed to having a play with two guys that are already been drafted in Ryan Leonard and Gay-Purro.

And I imagine this is one thing where if he does slip past a certain point, this time next year we're going to be looking back and being like, man, his D-plus one year in Boston College was so obscene. And he took another step and he produced a boatload of points and we're going to be left wondering

why teams allowed this to happen. It's like, how did this guy not go third overall? That seems like the most realistic path their possibility to me here in terms of how this plays out. I agree with you that he probably won't go third because of the situation, but I've remained pretty unwavered in that belief that that's exactly the conversation we're going to be having after this next season is done. I completely agree with that. I think that the issue here, you know, as you look at the draft board and you say, you know, the team fit situation is where things get dicey because

because of what Cam mentioned with the with the centers that they already have and it's not you know i think you could say james hagan's probably has a profile that that projects better than probably all of those guys and i i really like frank nazar i think he's got that you know potential you know kind of diet brayden point opportunity in front of him here um to to be it to be that guy for chicago but what i what i think you know it comes down to and this will be the same discussion with utah as well with Logan Cooley and Clayton Keller and, you know, that's, those, those are the kind of things that you do have to kind of figure out. I'd say in a year where there were fewer centers that, you know, I think that this would, this would not have been as big of a debate, but because

we have some centers with size, guys like Danae with good two-way capabilities, guys with, you know, Anton Frundel with that, that bigger, stronger profile, a little bit more power to him. You know, Jake O'Brien at 6-2 with a chance to tack on some strength. or maybe even Roger McQueen, I think teams are seeing that opportunity to balance the middle of the ice there with the size. But I agree with you. I think that the thing is,

is like basically when New York, when the Islanders won the draft lottery and the board set up the way that it did, I think that's been more of what's behind the James Hagan's slip than really, you know, anything else. It's just the team fit situation. just kind of goes a little bit further down, further down. Like, because I think you'd be a great fit for the Islanders, a great fit long term, you know,

and a guy that you could potentially have on your team for 15 years and a guy that desperately wants to win. But at the same time, you know, it's just the way this draft season kind of played out, he slipped. But yeah, to your point, I think we're talking about a Hobie Baker candidate next year, even with Gavin McKenna in the NCAA, as we assume that he will be. So, you know, I think there's so much. much potential. And whoever is lucky enough to have James Hagan's fall to them is going to be very

excited to draft him and feel like they probably got the steal of the draft. I love what I saw from Frank Anazar at the end of last year. In particular, that there's no way game against the abs when the habs were trying to clinch their playoff spot. And he seemed hell bent on just like an individual mission to prolong the pain for them and make sure that didn't come against them. And they wound up winning that game in the shootout, I believe. And Allemore is coming. And I'm intrigued by him as well. But this is an organization. that last year took Levchenov second, passed up the opportunity to take Demidov, obviously, as a reported, tried to trade back in to land them, presumably. But I feel like sometimes this is

getting a bit too cute or overthinking it, because it's like, all right, we have this one particular player or a couple of these guys. And so now we're going to try to supplement it with different skill sets. And I certainly think you look at any successful team and the Panthers are a great example of that. You need to have different areas of contribution and different body types and different size and skills and all of that. But for a team that has really done Conradar to service by not giving them enough meaningful help from the skill perspective, some of that is coming along the way that they've already drafted. But I feel like you can almost never have enough of it. I certainly would argue the Blackhawks aren't set in that category. And so I'd be very reticent to pass that up

just because of this one particular quibble. But this is really where it gets fascinating. Right. I mentioned those fan dual odds earlier. Frontel is the favorite right now at minus 140. And then You've got Denway at plus 250, Martone plus 450, Mesa plus 750 if he falls. And then you get to Hagen's at plus 900. So the market certainly agrees with us that it's a very unlikely third pick here. And it's fascinating that Lundell,

or Fondell, sorry, I've still got Anton Lundell on the mind after what he did to the Oilers and Stanley a final. It jumps up into this category. So we'll see. But this is where it really gets fun. All right.

The Utah Mammoth, CP, you're back on the clock for their fourth overall pick. Yeah, I think, you know, with the guys that are off the board now, there's a lot of intrigue. And I know we've heard different things about, you know, Brady Martin and others. You know, I think Anton Frundel would be a consideration here. But I'm going to go with Caleb Dinoje in this section because I think, for one, they have their number one center, I think, in the long term in Logan Cooley.

They have, you know, some really great opportunities to build up their next line. You know, right now they're going into next season, I believe, with Barrett Hayton, as their number two center. You know, I think Caleb Daynoia is a better fit for that role long term. There's enough offense there. He's a consistent winner, too. And I think that that's something that does resonate with teams. One a QMJHL, one Alenka Gretzky, one of U18 World's Gold Medal.

You know, he's been a guy that can be a centerpiece for a team and was the MVP of the playoffs while playing through injury. I think that the Brady Martin fascination is absolutely valid and that there's going to be teams that are probably going to consider them, including Utah in this range. But I just think that there's a little bit more versatility in Danoye. And Utah getting the number four pick, they were close last year. Like, they weren't that far away. They don't have as much time.

They have Dimishchev and Daniel Boot under contract now, two of their top prospects with size. You just go and get a guy that's a winner, a dog. And I think that Caleb Danoia is a great stylistic fit for them here with also the upside to be, you know, a really strong number two center option and give them some balance in their lineup. Cam, this is a fascinating spot for them because as CP said, they were so close to making the playoffs last year.

They're going to be a very trendy sleeper pick next year. I would be stunned if they're picking within the top 10 for however many years moving forward. I guess my question for you here is what's the likelihood they actually make this pick? Because I think they're going to be very aggressive this offseason. and they have six picks in the first three rounds in 2026 as well. They have a ton of cap space. I know they're very intrigued by the idea of adding like a youthful winger

with size in particular to play with some of these guys like Keller and Cooley and adding to Gunther of course as well and maybe bump and Schmaltz down a little bit so he's not playing such premium minutes in that top six. There's a lot of options there on the trade market that they can possibly explore. And I do wonder they might ultimately just wind up being like, well, we're going to take advantage of winning this lottery and getting the fourth overall pick and is the last time we're going to get a chance to add a player like this. So we'll add them to our system and explore upgrades for our immediate future elsewhere via the trade market.

But I do wonder whether they at least entertain the idea of using this pick to fast track that and adding someone who fits in that timeline. I can step in and immediately play with some of these guys because of what they showed last year and how close they already appear to be. I think, and I've been told this from a number of different sources, that Utah is, is very eager to do all sorts of different things. They are excited to make the fourth overall selection. If that's what they decided to do, they are open to sliding back a few spots

if a team really wants to jump up. And if it is, it's probably for Brady Martin. I think that's very realistic. I don't think anyone's trading up to four to get Higgins. I think they might trade up for Brady Martin. And that was put to me when kind of the buzzer on the combine was how much they loved this kid and took him out for dinner. And, you know, he wowed.

He wowed at the combine, everybody. But, you know, we were told specifically Utah. And that could be a bit of a smokescreen because they know that teams 5, six, seven are going to be very interested in taking Brady Martin. So maybe one of them jumps up and makes a play, right? And then they can get the player that they still love at 5,67 and they get extra assets. I think that they are going to make, if Sam Bennett, if his Miami nightclub announcement doesn't prove true, I think that they are gearing out to offer him a major contract.

I think that they are looking to do the same thing for Mitch Marner, if they can get them to come and visit Utah too. I think they want to make a big, big splash. And that could also include moving that fourth overall pick. So if I'm betting odds on it, though, I think at the end of the day, I think they trust their scouts. And if a package isn't right there on the table for them,

it makes sense, they're going to go ahead and they're going to make that pick and they're going to do well with it. And it's, you know, we talk about Chicago kind of like the key to opening up, the beginning of this first round, what they do. I think it's the same thing at four.

Because really, It's difficult to get a gauge once we get to that zone. And then the chips will kind of fall as they will. I think at 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11. Those picks, there's a number of players there that you can kind of mix and mingle in any certain way. But what Utah decides to do it for, I think, will really kind of shift the balance of this draft. I mean, Danway is certainly interesting.

I had a fifth on my board, so he was coming up here in a little bit. And at the risk of being overly simplistic, it's hard to argue with the fact that the dude is just a winner. And a lot of the stuff he does, it's very easy to project what that's going to look like for any team that picks him. So I think that'll be very logical. But to your point, Brady Martin is actually listed as the favorite right now for this pick, whether it's Utah keeping it and making it themselves or whether they really

kind of use the hype and all the buzz that's been generated at the combine to get a package to move down a couple spots, get someone to move up and take that pick. It seems like if that does happen, it probably would be for Braden Martin. And I imagine that's why the market is positioned the way that it is. All right, Cam, you're on the clock here for the National Predators at number five, who you could argue out of all these teams have the most openings in terms of just needing to add talent in whatever form that looks like regardless of position. I just like to say that anybody who's betting on that on that Brady Martin and Ford

that they can come and complain to me if they lose their money because I'm pretty sure my tweet from the combine is what's driving that line right there. I'm moving the market. And I had someone send me an article of Bill Armstrong talking about. He's like, he's like some blogger said that we were going to take Martin, but nothing's decided yet. I was like, Bill, I hope I hope you're not just calling me. only a blogger these days, but I have a podcast.

I have five, right? Exactly. Yeah. Good guy that Bill Armson. At five, though, you know, Nashville, like you said, they could, they could do any number of things here. And none of them would be wrong because they have needs in all, in all kind of spaces. And so for me, I'm going to keep it nice and simple.

I'm going to take the best player available on my board, the one that offers potentially the most unique upside in the class. And that's Porter Martone. You know, he, he's a finesse playmaker. wrapped in a power for its frame. And he has the ability to turn it on. He has the ability to throw some thunderous hits to be a load to handle at the net front

to drop the mitts every now and again. But the primal part of his game is playmaking and finishing in high danger scoring opportunities. And that's what Nashville needs and everybody needs. And I think that as he matures and he gets into his mid-20s and his late 20s, then he'll start to unlock that kind of dominant physical ability that will make him a potential super

star. So the feet aren't electric by any means, but you just need to package him up with someone who's going to drive that middle and he's going to be able to playmake off the wing, which is why I personally think he's such a great fit for Chicago with Baderd being such an unreal finisher and him being a big body playmaker off the wing. It makes a lot of sense to me, but I will say, you know, from some people in the industry, from some sources saying that it's very unlikely to be Porter Martone at three. So if he's sitting there at five, I think that's a great pick for Nashville. Especially since something that I feel like Badaard has struggled with early in his career amidst all the dazzling skills is just getting into the high danger areas in the middle of the ice part of that is just because he doesn't really have anyone to buy room for him or attract any attention.

So really he's having a carve through the defense all by himself, but you look at some of our pal Mitch Brown's tracking and how much this guy excels at getting the puck from the boards into the middle of the ice. And what a valuable skill that is in today's game. That would be an amazing compliment. NCP. I don't think anyone's going to feel bad for someone who's built the way this guy is, where it's like, what is he, 6,3, 2.10 or 2.10 or whatever. And he's a massive person, but I do feel like sometimes players of that, of that size and stature get unfairly evaluated with these knocks on not always using the size to their advantage or not being engaged, because it looks a little different than someone who's undersized and just has to be so scrappy

to essentially accomplish the same stuff as they do or cover the same amount of ice as they do more naturally. And so players like this, sometimes it's certainly valid and you wish that they would just always utilize it to their full advantage. But in a way, I feel like we need to provide a little nuance or context to this because I often see, especially with prospects of the size, kind of that knock against them of like, they're this massive, but they never actually use it the way you wish they would. I wish I was that big. So I could utilize that to my full advantage and make everyone look small and silly by comparison. Yeah. Yeah. It's interesting. I think as long as you know, you kind of know that going into when you get a player.

I think you have to know who they are and not hope for what they can be. You just got to know what they are. And I think in Porter's case, as Cam said, you know, it may not be there all the time, but he has it in him. He's shown it at times. And I think the big thing is that his true value is probably in the skill, the hockey sense, the ability to make plays in the end. So, I mean, it makes sense.

And I do think Nashville is going to prioritize size. this range as well. You know, I think that there's still the potential that they could take a swing. I think Barry Trots has said in the past that he wants to be more aggressive at the draft. But this is still an upside situation, you know, with Porter. Like, he's got a lot of tools. He's going to figure out how to put them all together. He did come into this season as one of the guys in the discussion for number one for a reason, you know.

and he had a great season. I just think that in the end, there are some things about relative consistency of competitiveness and other things like that. But just, you know, as long as you're not drafting him to be something he's not, which is to say a consistent, mean, nasty power forward, then I think you're still going to be happy because he's going to be a large playmaking forward

that engages physically enough and still has that scoring capability. So there's a lot to like about him, whether he's going to be a bruiser or not. We're through the top five here. And just to put this into context, the market has Anton Frundel as a minus 4,000 favorite to be a top five pick. And we've kind of mentioned him a couple of times, but obviously we're through five picks and none of us have made it.

And Caleb Dan Wiener as well is a minus 430 with an 80% implied probability to be in top five pick. So it could look very different than what we've got so far. But I like the path that we're on here. I believe I'm annexed up here with the Philadelphia Flyers at six. They had the sixth overall pick, 22 and 31 as well. They have four second routers. They have 11 picks in this draft. They have Couturey and Kate's sign long term,

but there's clearly an organizational need and thirst for them to add center talent in any capacity. And this is their, they're going to be very active in the trade market, certainly. But I think that this is their most logical path to getting a head start there. And so I will take Anton Frundel at this point. I'm curious for your take on where you kind of land on him with your ranking. He's very high on Bob McKenzie's big board. He certainly agrees with the market.

And maybe that's what's influencing a little bit because he's got him fourth. I know you're a bit lower than that. And I get some of the concerns in terms of dynamic playmaking ability. And whether a guy you're going to take fifth or sixth overall, you're looking for a certain capacity there. And whether he's going to get that or whether he's just going to be a good NHL player. But considering the production we saw from him in Olsenkine and some of the stuff that I've

seen from him on tape, I think for the flyers at number six, it's a very logical pick in terms of addressing a lot of needs and just getting a good hockey player at that position. Yeah, not only logical, I think that if he's there at six, he's gone at six. I think that he fits exactly what Philly is hoping for. And if he's not there, then Caleb Dainautier will be there for them and they can take him. And if he's gone, then maybe it's James Higgins who's there. So they're sitting very, very pretty. I think it's six to allow the chips fall where they may.

And if it is, Rondell, you know, I've ridden the roller coaster with this kid all year, coming into the season with high expectations, being kind of let down with his early season play, all the sudden, even internationally. And then all of a sudden, he rebounds in the back half of the year. And he just goes banana pancakes for like three weeks there. And he looked like a star. But even when he looked like a star, I still didn't see, I don't think a single viewing where I was like, this is a top five pick right here.

This is a guy who I would be feel comfortable taking in a lottery position. And then obviously we know what happened at the U-18s where he airlifted in and he just wasn't. He just didn't have it. He just didn't have it at all. There wasn't a jump in his step. And it was poor decision-making. And some of the things that plagued him early on in the year at the hockey Lels Venskin level, which you could, you could, you know, compartmentalize. Hey, he's a 17-year-old playing pro hockey.

He's just trying to keep things simple. He's chipping. He's chasing. But now it's like you're playing Switzerland at the U-18s. Maybe don't chip and chase every time here. let's see you hold on to the puck, let's see you make a play. And that's where my major concerns are, is that his ability, his lack of dynamic overall skills offensively other than his release, which I think is pretty top end.

And just his understanding of when he can do more, when he can be more creative. Now, at the same time, he's very young for this class. You know, you mentioned the production in the Al-Zvanskien is historic on a per-game basis. I've also talked to some guys that he works with in Sweden in the offseason. and they say like do not bet against this kid like he has that factor that it factor where he wants to get better he has like that internal drive they've mentioned like yesper bratt had a similar mindset and he's kind of like the the staple the the guy who everyone looks up to if you want to get better and you want to take big strides you you act like jesper bratt does and we've seen

what brats you know turned his career into so it's like i have a hard time betting against him because of this information but at the end of the day it's like this is what i've seen this is how i project and I think he's going to be more of a middle six guy, really a strong second liner potentially. Maybe it's on the middle, maybe it's on the wing, someone who can be a two-way, have a heavy release,

needs someone to probably get him with a puck in space. I just don't think he's going to be a heavy lifter. You brought up Anton Lundell. I think that that's not a terrible comparison to what he's going to be long term. And we see, you know, Lundell is an elite third line center.

You know, he should be a second line center. And maybe he up jumps there next season. But, you know, he's not a story. He's not someone that you're going to really look for for a point of game season, but he's someone that's going to be very, very useful on a good team that's going to be pushing for us down the cup.

And so if he can be insulated, you know, if it is Chicago, if he can be played behind Connor Bernard. I mean, I think that that would make a lot of sense because he doesn't need to be the guy. In Philadelphia, maybe he would have to be the guy down the middle and with Mishkoff driving the offense on the wing. So there's lots of potential for him. I had a really difficult time finding a spot for him. At the end of the day, I just kind of line them all up and was like, would I feel comfortable

taking this player in front of him? Yeah, I would. And so he landed at 10 for me. Yeah, you mentioned some of the chipping and chasing, and Mitch Brown's data backs that up. The transition profile for him is pretty rough at the same time. If this were the landing spot, I imagine Rick Tocke, would be very happy with it,

a setter with his physicality and the finishing ability as a shooter. I can work with that, certainly. CP, you were a bit higher on him. You have them at 4th, which is kind of in line with what we just said, Bob McKenzie Azamette, and it is polling of scouts and the market as well. where are you at with him in terms of the upside? Do you think the baseline in terms of that physicality and the position and the shooting

is just good enough where it's like even if he doesn't reach that star level ceiling, there's going to be enough there where he's just going to be such a good reliable player that it's worth it at this point of the draft? Yeah, you know, I just, I feel like we just never saw this year what he's fully capable of, but at the same time, there were flashes of the brilliance that could be there. You know, Cam mentioned the shot. I think it's really high end. I think that the opportunity that he brings with some of the power that he plays with,

some of the hard driving nature that he plays with, I think that that's good, too. You know, I think that that wasn't always evidence against the pros, but there were instances where you could see it. You talk to any of the Swedish kids that kind of grew up playing with and against him, and they almost view him like a demigod, really. I mean, like, it's kind of like they're in awe of the player. which which I find interesting.

I always think that, you know, the players have some, some unique insights because they go head to head with the guy. You know, and I think the other thing that kind of gives you a little bit more kind of warm and fuzzies about him is the statistical profile in terms of his production and how it was better than so many guys at the same age, including Willie Neelander, and David Pasternak, Philip Forsberg. You know, I think that the defensive elements of his design, game will become more evident as time goes on. I think that there are things that I've seen from him

over the course of the season where there is that commitment. He is trying to model his game after Sasha Barkov, which obviously would be great. If you can get there, I think it is lofty. It's lofty for anybody, really. But really, you know, I think that as long as you're attempting to model your game after that player, I think that's good. He will play in the SHL next season. I hope you get some more looks at center, you know, because I think that's the thing is that this is a guy that played a lot on the wing this year that everybody seems fairly comfortable as projecting a center, which is his natural position. So, but I just think the player, while there is absolutely risk, any inconsistency was confounding this year. I mean, his play in his own age group this year was

absolutely, I still can't really get over it, because even at the World Junior A Challenge, I don't think there was all that much to write home about. And that was a lower level competition. So I think that there's risk there. But I think if I'm the Flyers, that's an easy pick to make in this range. Just because I think there's a little bit more completeness to his game, as opposed to say, a Jake O'Brien or Brady Martin. Who amongst us isn't trying to model ourselves out?

It's a Sasha Barkov. I feel like that's a good level to strike. I'm not sure we can accomplish. it, but we should all be trying to strive to be more like Barkov, certainly. All right, guys, let's take our break here. And then when we come back, we'll jump right back in a, we got, we got Chris Peters on the clock at number seven for Boston. So we'll let him do some last minute decision making there and then file his pick.

When we're back, you're listening to the Hockey, Ocast streaming on the Sportsnet Radio network. Back here on the Hockey Ocast, 20025 mock draft. Let's keep it going. We've got about 45 minutes left here. We're through six picks. We're making good time. I feel like in the past, we've, uh, we've spent such a large amount of time on

like the first five guys and we get to pick 12 and we're like all right we have three minutes left here let's rattle through just a bunch of names so hopefully we're pacing ourselves better here today with that said cp you're on the clock for the bruin's at number seven yeah and i think this is where you know things are getting tricky because you know i think some of the guys that the bruin would consider here are are gone um you know i think that that's part of it but this is where you know i think if if we're in real life uh the brady martin watch is is still on very much in this spot the Jake O'Brien, you know, is he, is he an option? Do we look at defensemen?

Because the interesting thing is, is that normally defensemen are going to go in this range in most drafts. It's rare to get outside of the top seven with just one defenseman selected. But that is going to continue here. And I'm going to go off of my own list. And I don't feel necessarily that this guy is the best possible fit for the Boston Bruins. However, I think you need to go with some legitimate upside. And I see that in Jake O'Brien. So I'm going to go with Jacob Bryan here. I think he's a good dual shot pass threat. They need centers in their system. He is, you know, a guy that can make plays. I like him with the puck on

his stick. I think there's going to have to be a lot of focus on building strength, building more speed into his game, building other things that he can do to be a center. But I think that offensive profile really projects favorably for him being a top six center, which is tough. The Bruins don't have much in their system. They don't have, and they're kind of in this limbo where, you know, you still got Pastor Mackay and McAvoy. And, you know, maybe it would make sense for them to take the swing on Roger McQueen. Maybe it would make sense for some of those. But I just think there's still a bit of a swing here with Jake O'Brien because he's a lanky center. But as I look through this group and the quality of centers, I think that the gap between them and the

defensemen here is big enough. And then I also think the gap between Jake O'Brien and the next tier of center that we're looking at projects more favorably. So I'm going to make that pick on my own. But again, I don't, you know, if I'm the Boston Bruins and I have a type, I'm not necessarily sure that Jake O'Brien is that, but I'm just going to go off my own list here and make that executive decision for Don Swinney. I feel like the Bruins are in a position to be looking for fit, considering the situation they're in, how much they got to their team,

how bad they looked last year, and just how barren the pipeline is in general, because one of the consequences of just being an annual contender is trading away first and never picking high. And so they take McAvoy in 2016, and then they've made four first round picks since them. One of them was Uro-Balka-9th, John Beecher, 30th, Fabian Lysel, 24.

first and then Dean Letternoe 25th last year. And so they just need talent wherever they can get it. They did an admirable job, in my opinion, properly tanking this year after the deadline, after they made all those trades. They finished 31st in point percentage post-deadline to put themselves in a spot to pick this high. And so they got to maximize it. Certainly, I like Jake Bryan quite a bit. Jake O'Brien quite a bit.

I had him going eighth to Cracken just from a fit perspective because I think that some of his passing ability and how he exploits seems and his vision would play. really nicely with a lot of the shooting talent they have and some of the lack of playmaking relatively, but that's a very logical selection here for as high as him on him as you are, and I think you have him, what, seventh on your board? So this lines up

perfectly with the Bruins taking him. Cam's got him fifth in his top 85. So I'm going to let Cam cook a little bit here on Jake O'Brien. I like me some J.O.B. I just see so much runway for this kid. Physically, super underdeveloped, right?

Like, it looks like he's got toothpicks coming out of his shirt sleeves. And so he, he probably isn't going to stack weight super easily, but you can, you can pretty safely assume he's going to be playing at 15, 20 pounds heavier in his prime, hopefully even a little bit more. But most creative player in the entire draft class, I think so. You know, some of the handles that he pulls off, like it is full on creative mode. One of the best playmakers, too, a little relying on the power play for sure, you know, playing with Nick Lardis, jacking a goal game, didn't hurt, you know, he, he, he, he, he, if he could shoot more than once a game, I think that defenders wouldn't be able to sag off him as much,

because he actually has a pretty good release. Like it snaps. It's got good velocity. It's got good aim. He hits his target. So let's unlock some more strength. Let's unlock, you know, a better shot. Is this sounding familiar to anybody?

This kid stacks up very, very similarly to Elise Pederson in his draft year in 2017. And the knock on PD back then was had a bit of a muffin for a shot, was too skinny, wasn't a burner. say the exact same things about Jake O'Brien. Now, Pedersen went back and completely remade his shot and it became an absolute weapon. He's still obviously a little enigmatic in his career, but he's a hundred point guy. And not a lot of people probably forecasted that with those creative handles that he had, though. He was super offensive, but it was like, and he ended up, you know, going at five there. But I think Jake O'Brien, where I put him at five is that if you're stacking him up against

Dan O'ye, Frondell, Roger McQueen, Brady Martin, he's far more dynamic than all of them. Like he's far more dynamic. You're taking a bit of a risk on him to take him over those guys because they have a higher floor. But I think at this point of the draft, and especially for a team like Boston, like you said, they can't be drafting for need. And I think that they would probably just take Brady Martin right here because that fits what the Bruins do.

But go ahead and take a swing on someone who could be a legitimate first liner. Maybe he's a point of game. Maybe he's a 90 point guy. Maybe he's a 100 point guy if you get the right wingers with him. So yeah, I like that pick a lot. It's impressive that he's listed at 170 with a 6-2 frame. So certainly a lot of work to do. The Bruins hopefully will beef up their weight room along the way and help them get there.

But yeah, for an 18-year-old, that's not really a big concern for me. There's certainly a lot of time for them to put on that weight naturally. And I'd expect that. Cam, you're on the clock here for the cracking at 8 overall. When I own got Mason Marchmont there this week had that deal. I wasn't allowed to share it. That killed me. I teased it out a little bit, though.

That's a team. If you look at that roster from top to bottom, it is so, mediocre. It is just missing that big piece, that guy that you can surround. And, you know, if O'Brien was sitting there, I probably would have given him to them. But instead, I'm going to take the guy who has the widest range of outcomes among anyone in the first round or in this draft maybe. And it's big Roger McQueen. We do not see six foot five and a half centers stick handle in a phone booth outside of Tage Thompson in Buffalo. Like this kid, has incredible hands, has great offensive instincts, has the body, has the long reach to protect

pucks and get off the wall and get to the net and find soft areas and finish. Misdiagnosed back injury early on in the season, you know, led to all that confusion and to that time off, came back, different injury, not the back, was fully healthy, competed and did all the testing at the Combine was the most heavily scrutinized player at the Combine this year because teams need to know in the shadow of Caden Lindstrom in a whole missed year of development. is that everybody's a little gun-shy. But it's like I could sit here

if we're at the debate table and make an argument that on pure upside alone, Roger McQueen should be the number one pick. And so if he's sitting there at number eight for Seattle, the potential to get, you know, a unicorn, a guy like that at the front of your lineup with his size and his skill,

they do not come around very often. And I think that you could also unlock a little bit more of that mean, spirited nature that you want from those big power pivots as he matures as well. It's someone that could end up not breaking right, but at eight, the upside, too much to pass on.

I completely agree with you. And I see the vision. I will say, though, in reading the B-draft guide, Cam, I think we need to have a talk about comparing everyone to Fgeny Malkin because it's been a couple, couple times now. And that's very a lot of here. I do, I do certainly see at that size with the ability now, only the 20 games in his draft year and what happened with Ken Linz from last year as well, I certainly factors into it. My question was going to be, and this may be irrelevant because it's not based in reality, but without that red flag and without the back injury, how high he would have been on boards

and whether he could have been pushing Misa for second or Schaefer for first. It seems like you, that's the way you feel. Yeah, I think for sure. If he had a full season and then he put up his 90, 100 points in the West, no doubt about it with his physical profile. And then if you had the statistical profile and no concerns about the injury, about the back, no problem. He's locked in that top five.

And yes, I think he's pushing right up. and I'm sure there would be several teams that would have had him number one on their board. C.P., how do you feel about Roger Queen? I believe you had him 10th on your board, baking in some of that, bad risk? Yeah, I think the risk.

And I try to, when I do the list, I try to think about that, you know, in the real world as well in terms of, you know, I'm not making multi-million dollar decisions, but I think that you have to try and approach it that way. I think in this range, this is where, you know, I start getting more comfortable with Roger McQueen

and the issues that exist because I do think that you're starting to see, you know, the talent pool thin out enough where, you know, if you want to be somebody that, you know, takes a chance here, I mean, I still think there are teams within the first, you know, five to ten picks here that are going to consider Roger McQueen. So for all the reasons that Cam said in terms of the size, the hands, you know, I think he's a good skater for what, what, what, where he's at size wise. I think that there's a lot of, you know, opportunity for him to be a pretty a pretty credible score in the end i just think that there's so

much unknown and it's always great to be six five unless you have a back injury it just seems like those bigger guys that have gone through through these these uh these various issues i think about you know you can go back eric d'a martin hansel like guys that just can never get their back in in gear and obviously having the the kane lindstrom effect of last year which i think I think if Kane Lindstrom didn't have the situation where he didn't play all season this year, maybe we don't talk about it quite as much. It's a different situation. But, I mean, this is kind of the way that it is, and it's the way that it goes.

And that's where we're at. But I think that in this range, it starts to be fair. I'll be interested to see exactly what Seattle does here, because there's a couple of interesting factors with Seattle's draft position. One is that they have routinely drafted centers, Maddie Baneers, Shane Wright, Berkeley, Caton. Maybe not all of those guys will be long-term centers. You know, and maybe none of those guys are going to be a number one center. That's the other thing you kind of have to decide here is, can you find that in this draft range?

The other thing they haven't drafted is defensemen. And this, again, we kind of get into that discussion about, hey, we're in that range where we normally see defensemen go, Redeem Mertka played for the Seattle Thunderbirds this year. I'm not saying that you know, that local angle matters all that much or that, you know, Robert Kron is a countryman and all those other things. I think that they have not drafted that player yet. They have not drafted a premium defense prospect yet. Do you at least consider that?

That's what I think would happen here. But beyond that, that's a very long winded to say, I have zero problem with the Roger McQueen pick. I think Seattle is in a position where they could make some real interesting moves there in terms of who they pick. I think it'll be worthwhile dice for a lot of. for them. I love when they took Berkeley Cadden, 8th overall last year. And for all the

qualms about their offensive firepower, I think they actually do have legitimate shooting talent there. What we've seen from Yanni Newman so far, and then I thought Shane Wright flashed as a shooter last year as well scored the 19 goals. Baneers certainly has that in his bag, even if he hasn't utilized it as much as we'd all

love. And then McCann on top of that, and so adding someone with these playmaking chops would be really interesting as a long-term fit. I'm up here at number nine for the Buffalo Sabres, and I'm going to go with Victor Eklickland. And I was completely sold as soon as I learned that he has one of the best motors in this draft. I feel like that's a constant theme for me.

In these mock drafts, that's something that I just, I love because I feel like it's so translatable. And I know he's got some size concerns, but the way he attacks off the forechecking on these retrievals and just goes after bigger players and still is able to create down low and below the goal line, I think that's an incredibly appealing. set of skills now for the Sabres. It's interesting because I think you mentioned Merka there. I think there's certainly going to be some pull for them to mix things up and add a right shot defenseman that could feasibly play with either Dahlin or Owen Power in the future because that's been something that's really been plaguing their roster. And there is a bit of a forward log jam with all these guys. They've been taken in the first round and second round over the past couple of years. And we'll see how that all plays out, especially with Peturka as an RFA this

summer, but I love this guy's skill set. I feel like he might drop even further than this just because of the nature of the position and the surplus in this class of centers and us knowing the teams really value that. And so we could see a long stack of them and it would bump someone like Eklund down because he plays on the wing. But I feel like it's a really nice fit here for the Sabres to add another piece like this. It doesn't necessarily address an immediate need, but it just gives them another good player and someone who can continue doing what Benson's done for them so far, which is just being incredibly annoying to play against and being able to leverage some of that defensive ability into creating more offense for some of their really skilled players.

And so I know he's got some knocks about lack of manipulation or how dynamic he really is as an offensive player, but I feel like they already have enough of that. And he can certainly grow along those guys. And so I've got Eklund here. What do you think about that, Cam? I love William Eklund. I love Victor Eklund. And so it's like, right?

It's easy to love these type of players. And Victor is probably as talented as his older brother. And then he also has this just unbridled enthusiasm to get in on it, you know, to get under position and get under the skin. And like I keep saying it, he just screams Seth Jarvis to me. Like he just the type of guy who you don't think is going to be the guy, the beating heart, the guy who's going to lead your team in playoff scoring. because he's an undersized winger. And then he does because that's all he does.

He was the better of the two for Gergarten this year between him and Frundell. He was the better player. He was at the World Juniors. And he was arguably their most consistent threat for Team Sweden that entire tournament too. Every time I see Victor Ecclin live, I come away just more enamored with his game.

And every team I've talked to loves them. They all love them. But like you said, Dim, is that because of heavy centers, and then we have three defensemen that are going to be sitting there waiting to get. picked, I think that he's going to be sitting there in the mid-teens and some team is going to scoop him up and it's going to look great. Now, for Buffalo in this spot, I do wonder, you know, Costa Heleneas, not a very big player. Zach Benson, not a very big player. You know, they've traded

Matt Savoy, not a very big player. Newell, Osslin, Yuri Kulik, like all their first round picks going back to 2022 have been small. Isaac Rosen, right, going back to 21, not a big player. So they have this, they have this long history of doing it, which might just like bleed into your theory that it could be a good fit for them, or it might be like, okay, we've taken enough of these players. We have to get a little size.

And so we keep passing on Brady Martin here. But again, like if any point, he gets to sitting there at nine, I think he's gone at nine to Buffalo too. But I can't say enough good things about Victor Eklund. He is in my top 10. He has been all year. I considered him as high as number five

because I really believe in this player and I believe that he's going to stack on enough weight to survive the style that he's going to want to continue to play because he's not going to change. He's not going to change his style. So either he gets strong enough to do it or smart enough to do at the NHL level or he's going to get cratered every second shift and it's going to be trouble for him. But I believe in the player. I believe in the skill set and I believe in the will.

So yeah, if he's there at nine and he goes at nine, I think it's good. CP, you're up with Anahem Ducks at a dental role. Yeah, I mean, this is interesting too because like now that Brady Martin is still on the board, and Anaheim's got, you know, a litany of top end forwards and abrasive players, you know, it's like, you know, Mason McTavish Part 2 kind of situation here. But, and though that would be, you know, on my board, Brady Martin is listed at 9, Roger McQueen at 10. I really hope, I really would love to see if Roger McQueen is there for the Sabres at 8

just to see if Kevin Adams will do it because of, you know, there's lots of speculation about his job security. In the end, for me, what I think the ducks will do is I think that this is where we finally see one of the premium defensemen, the next tier defensemen go, as opposed to Brady Martin. And I don't expect Brady Martin to be available past at this point. But I do think that, you know, as I've done, on all these different mock drafts. I've done a lot of the Anaheim ducks in that mix. And the guy,

like, there's a lot of debate about which is the correct defenseman in this next group to take first. I do think in terms of fit profile and everything else, I do think Kayshaun H.erson is the guy that I would take if I were Anaheim. You've got Radkill Gudis as your captain. How about getting a guy that's going to play a very abrasive physical style at the top of his his NHL projection. And then, you know, he did score 26 goals this year from the blue line. I don't believe that he's going to be a natural NHL goal score necessarily. I do think that he's going to pop points.

I do think that he's going to be a very reasonable producer. But I think that you take him because of the tenacity to compete, the physicality, the ability to defend. And, you know, there are some, you know, limitations, I think, in his game, absolutely. But I think in that environment, you know, they have kind of their offensive-minded defensemen in that group. Getting a little more griminess in your mix is something that it seems like they want to do. And I think it's something that I would encourage to do. And I have H.S.N. at 11 on my board.

So this is going off of my list. But just to me, I think that the Brady Martin, while he absolutely could fit there. And I think that there's, you can make the case all day for him to be in that mix because they are so loaded up front with young talent. You know, and you can get more of a role player,

which is what I think Brady Martin ultimately could be, maybe at the top of his projection, a second line player. But I'm going to stick with Kishan H.S. in here, and that's going to be my pick for the ducks. Yeah, I think if Braden Martin were there and I agree with you, I don't know why we keep saying that he should go and then none of us are actually picking him.

Maybe we're just saving him for Cam to take him at 11, and I'm sure that's what he's going to do. But that would be a good fit for me here for the ducks. I get all the centered depth already there with taking Leo Carlson and watching him and cut her goche playing down the stretch and then McTavish there, although he's up for a new deal and we'll see how that works out.

Something I really did not like last year, Under Greg Cronin was just the way he buttoned up that team and tried to make them play. And I imagine with a new coach and a new year, they're going to try to play more a straight line and attacking hockey and do that moving forward. And they certainly have the horses on the blue line with what we saw from Lecombe last year. And then Minchikov and Zellweger, I'm still high on both of them that they can facilitate that. And so just as an attacking team, that would make a lot of sense for me. But I love

Acheson. I loved his tape. He's such a throwback. He's an absolute wrecking ball. I think he's also want to be one of those players where this might be a bit rich for me. I had him 13th on my board. he's someone who's just immediately going to endear himself to whatever fan base winds up getting him and he's going to be someone you love and just an awesome player for you. I'm with you on it's so hard scoring goals as a defenseman in the NHL level. Pretty much Kail McCarran, no one else can do it consistently at high level. And so I wouldn't expect that from him. But some of the playmaking, sorry, play killing ability and the open ice hitting

and what he demonstrated last year in the OHL is is very enticing. I know you did a mock recently, Cam, and you had him going, pretty high as well as the second eventsman off the board yeah uh he's he's arguably my favorite player just to deal with and to watch he's so much fun right smash mouth throw throwback style player who loves to hit loves to fight loves to score big goals and always just has this like big smile in his face gravitational pull everybody wants to be around him he's fun he's he's he's he's a great great kid and uh and you know yes i think what cv said was it was pretty accurate there is that you know there are some limitations to his game. He doesn't, he doesn't project someone who screams being an

offensive producer. Goal scoring from the blue line is one of the hardest things to replicate year over year unless you're like a true superstar. But I'm like, I'm willing to bet on this kid because of all the intangibles that he brings and that playoff style performance when the whistles get away and he's going to step up and open ice and just change the energy in a game with one big thunderous open ice hit. And I've said it so many places and I'll say it one more time, he just screams KB3 to me. Kevin BX, I even said it to BX when we were in Montreal

for the four nations and he was like, yeah, I can see it. So yeah, no, I think that there's a good chance he's the number two, D-Men off the board. I think that this makes a lot of sense for him here at Pick 10 too. And I know there's a team that's sitting just outside of the top 10 that is very hopeful that he gets to them

and they don't think he will. So I think this is about right. Cam, so I was reading one of my favorite sources and most trusted ones this time of year, with the following. It feels like the floor for Brady Martin is seven. He owned the past week at the combine. Teams couldn't get enough of them. Now, you're up here for the Pittsburgh Penguins at 11. Do you have a chance to rectify that? Are you going to finally do it? Yeah, those are my words, right? I forget who it all blends together. I'm, you know, I'm picking, I'm picking nuggets here and

there from all these different places. But yeah, it sounds like something smart that you wrote. Sounds like something I would say. Brady Martin is going number 11 here to Pittsburgh. And it's like the slide must fall. It must end. You're telling me that Kyle Dubus has taken a guy from the zoo? Oh, it's shocking. I know. I know.

Never heard it happened before. But it's too easy, right? This is just found money for Pittsburgh. I think that they, you know, they took out. They took Raddy Murtale for dinner. They took Roger McQueen out for dinner. I believe they took Kay Sean H. H.S.

They're looking big. They're looking big and heavy. And I'm sure they didn't take Brady out because they didn't think they had a chance at him. And realistically, they don't. But hey, in this world, Brady Martin, playoff style performer. He's got this like,

he's not even that big. Like when you look at him, like I know he weighed out at 190 or something like that, but when you look at him, he looks probably more like 178, 180, but he's just like, they save that farm boy strength.

And it's legit. Like Matt Nichol was saying, it's like, you couldn't, I can't replicate what this kid's doing at the farm in my gym. Like you just can't do it. And the strength that he's been building

year over year over year going back to being a kid working on his farm. it's that's how he hits so hard and that's his technique is so supreme i think he's a little frenetic in his in his skating and his handling ability is that like he can do some stuff and he'll try some things but it's always like looks like it's just on the border of being out of control um and so he'll want to refine that and clean that up a little bit but you know on the on the on the will side of the game his desire to win his desire to push push push push unrelenting um is going to make him a very translatable n hler

it's going to make him a very translatable playoff performer. And when he ends up going five or six or four, wherever it is, like I know Sam Bennett's the one who's about to get paid this summer, but he might owe, he might owe Benny a dinner because of his playoff performances really helped elevate Sam Bennett or Brady Martin stock this draft season too. So it's kind of the perfect timing for both of them. One's hitting free agency.

One's coming up for the draft. And teams are just looking for that type of player that they don't really care if he puts up 50, 55 points in the regular season. if he's going to go off and be one of the best players on their team in the playoffs. And that's the type of player Brady Martin projects to be. Yeah, his shades of being Sam Bennett takes a whole new meaning, has a whole new shine to it after what we just watched with Bennett certainly winning the cons mithe and doing a very deserved fashion.

So that would be a no-brainer. But as we've said, many times so far, he probably will not be available at this point. And seven probably is the floor for him. All right, guys, let's take our final break here. And then we come back. We're going to finish up and rattle through the final handful of picks. You're listening to the Hockeyediocast streaming on the SportsNet Radio Network. All right, we're back here on the HockeyOcast doing our 2025 mock draft.

We are up to 12th overall for the New York Rangers. Now they have until 7 p.m. Eastern on June 25th to decide if they're actually keeping this pick or they're conveying it from the J.T. Miller trade to Pittsburgh. If they don't, it becomes a completely unprotected 2026 first and they're already down their second in 26 and 27. So a very interesting decision for them ahead. I'm going to go with Jackson Smith here. 6-3 left-shot defenseman. I love his skating ability,

especially a lot of the conversations we've had about fitting in the modern game and as a four-way mover kind of leveraging that defensively, gaping up, taking away space in the neutral zone. You also look at the left side of the Rangers blue line moving forward and a lot of questions there certainly as well

with Fox and Borgon on the right side, locked up long term. We'll see what happens. with Braden Schneider as an RFA. And so I just feel like certainly this is very plausible, I think, because as CP astutely noted, this feels like kind of the portion of the draft from about 8 to 14 or so where teams typically talk themselves into, well, this is our chance to add a defenseman because they're going to be very expensive if we don't.

And it's just too intriguing to pass up. And I feel like this is, I like Jackson Smith of the process quite a bit. And I feel like the fit, if the Rangers do keep this pick, makes a lot of sense for them as well. What do you think, Kim? Yeah, I mean, you obviously broke into my word docs and saw the mock draft that I'm going to release in a few days here because I got Jackson Smith going 12 here to the Rangers too. I think it's a great pick for him. He's so toolsy, right? Incredibly toolsy with his size, an excellent skater, excellent skater. There was times throughout the season where I saw him flash some like legitimately high, high end offensive stuff where he, you know, would break somebody's ankles coming out of the defensive end, open up his hips, mohawk around, break coverage. again, walk in, make another dangle and set up somebody for a one-timer, like serious stuff that we see from some of the top NHLers. He would flash that kind of potential.

Now, I don't think he has, I don't think he has the tool box to carry around all his tools at like a number one defensive level. But I think at this part of the draft for his size, his skating, and the tools that he has, there's no reason that he can't be like a really strong second pair guy that's going to be able to play on a second power play unit and maybe, you know, develop into some really high end stopping ability to, just maybe not that electric stuff or maybe he's going to have some brainfarts here

every now and again too. But I do like Smith in this zone. And I think you'd be a great pick for the Rangers. At C.P. You're up here. 13th overall for the Detroit Rerlings. Yeah. So it's getting interesting now. I think some of the guys that... It's been interesting for a while now.

It's been interesting the whole way. But this is the range, you know, as we get into the 13, 14, 15 range, you start to feel the little twinges of things kind of starting to fall off a little bit. However, I think if I'm the Detroit Red Wings in this situation, and I've seen those two other defensemen go off the board,

I have to be thinking about Redeem Murtka here. And the reason I think that is, you know, obviously the way that Detroit has drafted over the last couple of years, they've gone fairly forward-heavy, then they have an undersized defenseman in the Axel Sandian Pelica that they've taken. They've kind of drafted the same kinds of forwards. You know, Michael Branson, kneeguard. You know, just kind of some of the different things that they've done.

This is an opportunity to kind of get back and really take a look at upside. I think Murtka, like he's 6'6, right shot defenseman. The likelihood of a player like this being there at 13 seems not very likely, right? It doesn't seem like this would be the place that you'd see a six-foot-six player to go there. Merck is not as aggressive physically and competitive physically that I think teams want to see in a player of his size, which is part of the knock on him and why he may be available in this range. However, I think he's got a good skater. I think that he's got great ability to, you know, that length and that range that he has.

And I think that the other thing that fascinates me about the player, he hasn't really been. and add it that long as a very competitive hockey player. He didn't really have that foundation of like, hey, I'm actually going to be a, I'm going to be a dude. You know, like, and the other thing he mentioned, the combine, you know, it's tough. You got to put your best foot forward. But he talked about how, you know, as a kid growing up, he couldn't hit people because he would always get penalties because he was bigger than everybody else.

And so he kind of lost that little bit of his game. So he's got to find that because I don't think you can be a six foot six defenseman and be passive. So, you know, that's the thing that's going to have. to come down to it. But when you think about the aggressive defenders, you know, the more exciters and the others that they have, I think this actually makes a bit of a fit here. They have Simon Edvinson. They have Axel Sandine Pelica. I think that this is a guy in Mertka that can potentially be the four, you know, in the top four with that group of players

long term. And the fact that he's a six-foot-six right shot defenseman only makes that more exciting and enticing. So I do think there are a couple of other forwards here that would make sense for the Red Wings, especially in the way that they've drafted recently. But I'm going to go with the big man on D. All right. I like it. Cam, you're up for a 14th overall for the Columbus Blue Jackets. I'll also mention that Ruddy Murtka models his game after Momo Sider too. So head into Detroit, I guess he could hang out. They don't play a similar style game, but they're both big men, but with big boys, big boys for sure. Now, Columbus, I don't know if they're making this pick, to be quite honest.

I think that they are actively looking to shift both their first rounders to get a now piece or to move up. I got to go with my gut here. I got to go with who I think is the best player available because if I'm drafting for Columbus, if I'm putting myself into their mind, I'm probably taking someone else because they've taken so many centers recently. And they have loads of defensemen in the pipeline too. but I'm going to stick with another center. I'm giving him Carter Bear. And this kid, you know, some players, they got that dog in him.

This kid's got that bear in him. Like, he's got, he's got a nice growl in the tummy. Like, I think he is 40 goals and 50 games in the West this year. I think his shot might be his second best offensive tool. I think his playmaking is highly underrated and very advanced. I think he plays with all sorts of edge. He flies in on the forecheck. You know, everybody's really raving and drooling over Brady Martin.

Carter Bear is, a similar player. He doesn't hit as hard, but he's a very similar player who produced more than Brady Martin did. He just had fewer games because of the slashed Achilles, which was a partial laceration. He's back skating. He's the expectation he's going to be good to go for World Junior Summer Camp next month. So, you know, he won't be coming up on stage hobbled like we saw some other guys with Achilles injuries in the past. I like Carter Bear. I think that he's got the will. He's not the biggest guy at six foot, but I think he's going to place at a heavy tag there with his weight He plays a heavy, skilled game who can,

dual threat offensive guy who I think will be a really strong, another one who's got a potential to be a really strong second line center. I love that pick. I love Carter Bear as a prospect. You had me at shades of Brennan Hagel. That's always going to catch my eye. Certainly in terms of the motor and just what a competitor he is. And you look and I know you guys had this in the draft guide as well.

He finished third in WHL in even strength, primary points per 60, just how he challenges defenders and how he works his tail off. I think he's going to be an awesome fit there. On my board, I had the blue jackets because I didn't have a lot of defensemen going on at this point. And I thought a guy like Murka would have made a lot of sense for them, considering how wide open the right side of their blue line is and the potential fit there. But the blue jackets generally tend to swing for the fences with these picks, right?

We've seen them go very high skill along the way over the past couple classes. And this would be a really nice player for them to add to the pipeline. And so I like that quite a bit for them. I believe I'm up here. Do you have any notes on Bear CEP before I jump into the Canucks at 15? I think I'm good. I think that's said at all. It's all good.

All right. I'm picking 15 and in my mind, my mock I had Carter Bear going here. So I feel like can't really swipe me in the last minute here. I feel like the next guy on my board would be Justin Carbono. I cannot see the Canucks making that pick. And so I'm going to allow sort of common sense or logic to prevail here. and I'm going to go with Lyndon Lachovic.

And I just feel like if you look at the types of wingers that this regime is certainly liked and how much they invested in Jake Debrusk and some of the size with just the straight line attacking and what we saw from him last year, I feel like that would be a player. They'd be very interested in obviously has the size at 6'4 as well and can attack in the open ice. I think the Canucks could certainly down the road use more transition ability. That's something they've really struggled in the past couple of years, making a coach change change now. So we'll see if that fix the thing somewhat.

But I feel like that would be the most logical pick for me here, considering the guys available and where they would probably go with their player preferences. What do you think about that, Cam? Yeah, I mean, the size, the reach, you know, he played on a not such a great team and was kind of looked at, you know, especially Braden Yeager left. And it's just, it wasn't a lot to work with this year. But he has like some really unique upside as a scoring winger for sure.

And so I think that there is a bit of risk. with him because it's just, I just never really saw it consistently throughout the year, but he would flash it and he can volume shoot and he can protect the puck well and he can be a load to handle down low. And he does have really good goalscoring instincts and a nice release. And it's, Vancouver needs help all throughout the lineup, especially offensively. So I'm sure they would love to get a center here. Would they reach on a kid like Cole Reschney, maybe?

Or would they go for that size profile on the wing? I got to say, I think Victor Eklund is going to be sitting there for. them at 15 and I think that as a swede that that's going to be an easy pick for them too if they want to if they want to go down the small man path on the wing but I like lookovic here yeah hecklin would be an instant smash you as soon as uh Columbus goes 14 you just run up to a podium and you file that pick before before they can take it away from you all right we're gonna close out here with 16 with the monchoa canadians they have 17 as well we're gonna cut it off at 16 here but CP bring us home with the final pick of uh yeah 25 PDO cast mock draft I'm I'm so thrilled and honor to to start it and end it. But the, this is interesting, this range here, as I mentioned on every time I pick, they're all interesting. But what I think, based on my board, the best player available is Justin Carboneau. And that's, that to me, you know, it was for many years,

you pick the QMJ, the best QMJHL kid to go to the Montreal Canadiens. and it has been a long time since they picked the best player from the QMJHL. It has been a very long time. And so this is just, I think, a good fit because you've got Carboneau who has tremendous skill. He has hard skill, too, where he is difficult to play against. There's good strength to him. There's good aggressiveness. There's all those things.

And I think with what, you know, Montreal has the next two picks, too. So I'm also thinking about that where you have this. this potential. I think, you know, you could make a strong consideration for Braden Coots here. I think you can make a strong consideration. You know, if, if Lakovick is still there, obviously he wasn't on this opportunity. You know, is Cole Reschney, the more skilled kind of option, a guy here as well. But for me, I think Carbino is a good stylistic fit. You've got some size and your wings with your I Slavkovsky, but now you're getting another guy that kind of has that strength profile that I think can fit into a top sex. And he's extremely skilled and a really good

goal score. So I think there's a lot of opportunity. It's not, you know, I just wanted to make sure I put it out there that this isn't the lazy. Have them pick the kid from the queue. It's not that. So, but yes, but I just think it makes sense for them here. And I think it'd be a great pick in this range. I do think that there's the chance that Carbino could be one of the disruptors that people aren't expecting maybe. But beyond that, like by disruptors, I mean like even higher,

you know, maybe he crashes the top 10 party. It's not a guarantee. But I think if he's still there, it makes a lot of sense for the haves to pick him. I love that pick. The idea of him and Demadov on the same team is an absolute highlight factory

and a mixed tape creator's delight for me personally. All right, guys, we did a top 16. Cam, I'll let you, is there anyone that we haven't gone to yet? Give me a, not necessarily a dark, so a long shot, but someone that throughout this process, you've kind of planted your flag on that we haven't talked about yet as your guy, someone you want, whether it's in day one or day two, when they get called up and someone's team picks them, they get excited about them because

they've got the Cam Robbins and stamp of approval. Oh, boy, there's a couple guys. I mean, I really like, we haven't talked about Malcolm Spence. I think he's going to just be kind of a heart and soul type guy who I think fits into maybe where the habs are picking back to back there. You know, Chris and I talked about a Max Sinha, a 6'4 right shot defenseman coming out of the West in Portland there. Huge upside. Huge, huge upside, I think is that when he inevitably goes on day two of the draft, I think whoever's picking him up, like whether, you know, is it San Jose, who's like, dang, we missed out on Maddie Schaefer. And now we're not going to get our number one D, but are we going to get a kid on the right side who could be, you know, a really impactful guy for us long term. Let's get Sanichka.

So there's a couple guys that I have a lot of time for that are still going to be sitting on the board. and I'll mention one more is Ben Kindle, who I think has electric stuff, nearly put up 100 points. I think it was 99 there in the West this year. He seems like a perfect fit. Just go play for the flames, right? Playing for the hitman is right down the road or playing in the same barn as high, high skill kid. You know, parents are both like super elite soccer players. He's got those quick feet.

He's got the quick hands. Ben Kindle, I think, is another potential disruptor, as Chris mentioned for Carbono, who I think could all of a sudden be like, he went away earlier than we expect it. I like it, C. who's the name you want to shout out? Yeah, you know, I think I think when you get into the latter stages of the first round, we're looking at so many different guys

that we feel are like, you know, second round picks. You know, there's these flaws that, you know, maybe we can't necessarily get over. But I look further into, you know, the draft and different things where I can, where I can see where teams might be able to mine some value. But just in terms of the guys like that are still

in a first round project, situation. You know, I think guys that I still, like, I've used this term an awful lot where there's a lot of guys that are very easy to like, but not a lot of guys that are easy to love. I think one guy that I really like an awful lot in the back half in the first round is Milton Gastron from, from Modo. He's, he's really, he was the captain of the under 18 team for Sweden. He's got a good motor. He's got good down low skill. I think that he makes plays. He's not super exciting. I don't think he plays a flashy brand of hockey. I just think he plays right, the right way. And he's, he's in a very similar range for Malcolm Spence for me as well,

another player that, you know, Cam mentioned that I liked quite a bit. But, you know, even as you get further and further down, down this list and go into it, you know, we talked about a guy yesterday on our podcast that I think will be a second, maybe even third, could go later than we have them. But Ben Kevin, who's on his way to Arizona State next year, play for the Des Moines Buccaneers. Really quick, really skilled, good goal score. I think there's more than meets the eye there. He's a kid that's going to need to grab some strength.

But I've thought about this a lot, and I feel like a lot of people underestimated Jake Gensel for a lot of the same reasons they're underestimating Ben Kevin. He needs to get stronger. He's a little bit slight. I think he can be a little perimeter at times. But if he builds more of that into his game, the hand skills and the speed are going to give him a chance to play at the next level. So those are a couple of guys that, you know, I definitely feel pretty good about.

I love it. Well, guys, you both certainly delivered. This was fun, as always. I love doing these with you. And I'm sure the listeners are enjoyed as well. Cam, I'll allow you both of you. But, Cam, you go first. Plug some stuff.

CP keeps bringing up this podcast that apparently two you have. So maybe you want to plug that. But also let the listeners know about the draft guide, which remains the gold standard. And especially for someone like myself swooping in last minute, is an absolute must in terms of preparing yourself for the upcoming draft. Grab your sack, a wonderful pistachios, fire up, called up the prospects podcast, and sink into about 1,900 pages of the elite prospects draft guide.

You have to read every single scouting report that we put in there, even if the guy's not getting drafted. We got our Russian guy, Dylan Griffin. I think he logged something like 25 reports on one Russian kid that we gave an F to, like psycho behavior. That's what we're talking about over there. So, you know, you can get the amended version too and slash the Scatterner Reports. But yeah, get that guide.

Obviously, we're running a sale right now, 33% off an annual subscription. You're not going to get a better deal than that for all the content. We wheel out all year. But this, this is a silly season. All the film rooms are coming out. I've got my mock draft coming out. I've got the bold predictions. I've got a couple of things set up to talk to some players around the pool there in L.A.

once we get down early next week. It's going to be great. It's going to be a lot of fun. The sprint to the finish line here. We got about 10 more days and then and then just slink off to the beach for a few. weeks and we'll see y'all in august hippie what do you got to plug hey flow hockey that's where you can find

everything and obviously listen to our podcast called up the prospects podcast we we found ourselves our voices here on the PDO cast and we decided to branch off so you'll always have that on here we're off the PDO cast coaching tree but so that that's that's very positive for you dim

yeah if you want to support our work the best way to do it is get subscriptions to to plow hockey you'll be able to get access to the A HL, the USHL, we announced the QMJHL is coming on next year. Really excited about that. Get some more stuff coming up soon too. But all of our draft coverage is there. I'm going to have my draft rankings are out, which we obviously leaned on heavily for this opportunity.

And then I'll have my own mock draft coming out here. It should be out after this public or before this publishes. So go ahead and check that out over at flowhockey.tv. But yeah, that's the main stuff. And at Chris M. Peters on Twitter, because we're still doing that. So, you know, that's the thing. But other than that, man, I'm really excited. We're going to have a lot of draft coverage.

We're going to be on site. I got my whole team coming. So lots of video, lots of analysis, and certainly a lot of live coverage of the 2025 NHL draft. But, man, what a way to close out our season here. We're at the finish line. And if we did the PDO cast, it means the end is ever nearer. And I cannot wait to sleep again.

That'll be fun. The end is near, yet the fun feels like it's just beginning. I can't wait for the draft and to follow the coverage from both of you. Keep up the great work, as I said. I'm not saying this just because you guys come on every year, truly the two of the best in the business. And I love doing these with you. If you want to help us out, smash that five-star button wherever you listen. Join the PDOCast Discord as well.

It will be an awesome place to follow along during draft weekend and keep up to date with everything. That's all for today. We'll be back Sunday night with our pal Thomas Trans for the Sunday special. Hope today's show helps wet at your appetite for the Friday. draft next week and gets you ready for that event. Have a great weekend. And thank you for listening to the Hockey P.Docast streaming on the Sports Night Radio Network.