The Hockey PDOcast - The Most Important Moves Coming Out Of This Year's Draft Weekend

Episode Date: June 27, 2026

Dimitri Filipovic is joined by Jack Fraser to go through all of the trades that happened during draft weekend, and the big moves we're still waiting on heading into free agency. If you'd like to gain access to the two extra shows we're doing each week this season, you can subscribe to our Patreon page here: www.patreon.com/thehockeypdocast/membership If you'd like to participate in the conversation and join the community we're building over on Discord, you can do so by signing up for the Hockey PDOcast's server here: https://discord.gg/a2QGRpJc84 The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Media Inc. or any affiliate.

since 2015. It's the Hockey PEDEOCast with your host, Dmitri Filippovich. Welcome to the HockeyedioCast. My name's Dimitri Fulipovich. And joining me is my good buddy, Jack Brazier. Jack, what's going on in? I'm feeling good. I have ruck fever. You do. You got both of the rucks on your favorite team. Very exciting. I'd be curious to see some of the conversations that happened for some of the teams who were picking early and around two in between if there were any shenanigans or any considerations for up their plans, but it all worked out nicely. We are recording as day two, the NHL draft is wrapping up. And tomorrow I'm going to do another show. I'm going to have Scott Wheeler on,

and we'll get into all the details of the actual prospects that were picked, what teams did with their picks and all the analysis there. You and I today are instead going to focus on more of the main roster actionable items, some of the trades we saw in the lead up to the draft, and then on night one on Friday as well and break them down. And maybe end with some some questions we have leading into the next big date on the NHL calendar, which is July 1st, pre-agency opening up on Wednesday. I'll give you the floor here. I've got about seven or eight situations that I think definitely weren't unpacking for us

today, but I'll give you the floor as our guest to pick which one you want to start with. Do we want to start with Dorfav? Let's do it. I mean, undoubtedly an interesting one. Last time you and I spoke was during the Stanley Cup final. I think we had a question from a listener about which players had increased their stock and earning power the most with their performances postseason. And he was right near both of our lists. And he had an awesome playoffs, not just the 12 goals he scored.

But I think, you know, when you look at his player card, for example, on hockey stats, you see that he's 95th percentile, even strength, defensive impact. And it might surprise some people because I think these player types of elite finishers and shooters and goals scores typically don't carry that. that supplemental value with them, it's interesting comparing it to like the Vegas environment. And generally there's such a good defensive team and their players trend really well in that stat. But I think you could see it on tape and his performance in the playoffs with the forechecking and puck possession stuff along the wall that lends itself to him looking so favorably in that category. And that makes him such a unique player. Right. Like there's very few guys who can score realistically 35 to 40 plus goals in their prime who also have that type of defensive values. And they're

prime who also have that type of defensive value goal scores are generally very one dimensional and so that makes him a very interesting player and then certainly going from an extreme environment in Vegas to a very questionable one in New York with what they have amongst their personnel and then the investment they made and the acquisition cost like it's a it's a whopper yeah yeah I'm I'm a fan of the player and like you said the two-way impact the impact off the puck is I think the most interesting thing about him. You know, you mentioned the forechecking. I think he's just a more hardworking player when he's away from the puck, then people would give credit for it to somebody who profiles as kind of a pure sniper type. The big question, I think, starting him,

especially now that New York has not only, you know, obviously invested a decent amount of trade capital in getting him, but also locking onto that huge seven times 11 contract is how it's going to transfer over. I mean, the consistency in the impacts, especially the defensive ones year over year, I think are encouraging. The real area where theoretically this could go south is that he is such an off puck player. Like you look at his micro stats, you watch the tape. He's not a guy who spends a lot of time handling the puck himself. He's not very active in transition. He's not the most prolific playmaker, for example. You know, he's a relatively slow skater. You know, these are all things that with theoretically profiled not too interestingly,

but he puts the puck in the net so well, especially on the power play. He's such a versatile score, and he's somebody who doesn't need a lot of touches to make a big impact, you know, especially just like you watch him kind of on, you know, if you watch the tape of his goals, he really times his lanes well to get to the inside.

You know, he's not somebody who really hangs out in the slot. He'll kind of circle around and read the defenses really well. You know, obviously in Vegas, he was in a position where he was oftentimes playing with very smart playmakers. And that's not to say that there aren't smart playmakers in New York, J.T. Miller, Lafranier, is advantage at. These are all high-level passers, but not to the extent that he's gotten accustomed to playing with in Vegas. And so I am curious how that's going to transfer over, but I mean, the pieces to this player, I think, are really encouraging. and, you know, I don't think the Rangers really had to pay quite as much for them in a trade as I maybe expected them to have to.

Yeah, I think it's fair to question the why of it in terms of, you know, some of the moves they made over the past, let's say, year and a half of trading away veterans and looking like they're steering towards a rebuild. And, you know, it sounds like Vincent Trocheck will probably at some point become the latest guide. be sent out. At the same time, I do think the silver lining is Dorothea is going to be 26 at the start of the season. And this contract essentially covers like the extent of his prime from 26 to 32. And it's a nice change of pace for them to be investing at least this type of a player as opposed to their general history of acquiring and committing to, you know, declining assets who are already in their 30s. The price they paid is interesting to me because they send out the 26th overall pick, which has one hell of a trade tree already.

It's a pick that's been used to acquire Miko Randinen, Kianjadre Miller, and now Pavl Dorofiev, 90-second overall. And then the Rangers 2028 first, and they mitigate some of the risk by having a top 10 protection on it. But we'll see what winds up coming up that, and it's a nice trade chip moving forward for Vegas. Certainly the contract that they immediately sign him to then,

11 by 7, we typically don't see full freight paid for RFA's, even ones who are close to their UFA years the way Dorofiav is. You see a discount typically. And, you know, Dom on his model, like he had his market value at 11.1 million. And so that's pretty much in line with what they paid here as full price for him. And maybe that's indicative of where we're heading with all this talk about the cap going up and players looking to benefit from it. Typically, RFAs are signed as kind of like a projection of maybe you pay more upfront

based on the production they've had so far. But you're betting on it looking good as the, they get better in a bigger role and the cap keeps going up in this case they kind of just bet on the player being this good moving forward and so that makes it interesting and it also sets a nice little benchmark for guys like marchenko and these sort of scoring wingers that are going to come up for paydays over the next year or two to the point to and be like that's a nice little payday i want that myself so i think there's going to be quite a few trickle-down elements of this one yeah for sure i mean sticker shock is going to be a continuing theme this off season with these kinds of contracts

we've already seen it with the Tuck contract obviously. Yeah, the 11 million kind of being a bit more like at 8.5, 8.6 under the previous cap about halfway through that deal, I think is worth considering. You know, this is certainly first line money, you know, verging on kind of star territory money, but it's not the super, super star money that 11 million dollars used to be. So, you know, I mean, you know, like Donald is doing his model, like it is very conceivable that this is a contract that he'll live up to. I just hope for his sake and also for the sake of Rangers fans that his transition to a different team, a different environment and different linemates is going to be smooth and that he's going to be able to keep putting the buck in the net and playing that two-way game the way that he was able to in the environment in Vegas. Yeah, I mean, he's one hell of a goal score. I think he has 72 goals the past two years, which is tied for 15th most and added another 12 this postseason.

And I imagine he's going to have success on this power play, especially with like some of the options. they're going to have up top there with Fox, at least for the time being quarterbacking it, and then him and Zabinajad essentially being on opposing flanks. But at 5-1-5, I do think it is a fair question of, you know, for a guy who is very useful, but does it in unique ways where he doesn't typically touch the puck that much himself, unless he's shooting it. Who's going to get him that puck now? I thought because Zabinajad had a really nice and probably underreported bounce-back season last year,

and it feels like as he's entered this different stage of his career, he's sort of transitioned to being a bit more of a facilitator and playmaker, especially a 515. And so maybe that gives you a nice option there. But yeah, I think he's going to need to keep adding layers to his game and adjust because I imagine trying to sort of translate exactly how he played in Vegas the past couple years to this new environment. It could probably lead to a lot of frustration where he's just not getting the puck where he wants it.

Yeah, for sure. And I think it's also worth thinking about what this move means. for the Rangers. I mean, you alluded to that 2028 protected first round pick. You know, I think we've had some conversations about where this team is going, whether guys like Adam Fox might end up being available. You know, they've kind of been a bit of stasis the past couple of years after being, you know, on the verge of being a cup contender before that. I think this is pretty clearly making a mark in the stand saying that they are going to continue to try to go forward as long as Adam Fox and Shisterkin are in their primes.

which is interesting, and I think speaks to a potentially dangerous decision they've made, where by trading that pick to Vegas, they've almost kind of locked themselves out of rebuilding in the same way that you could argue the Leafs have by trading those future picks under for living, which, again, we'll see if that ends up working out. We'll see what further moves they make, because I don't know that just having a Dorfayev, Fox just Rekin Kaur is going to be enough to really get them back to that cup contention tier. But it's an interesting kind of macro level move that the Rangers have made here to really state that they're still going to be going forward and that they're not going to be taking a step back. Well, they did a similar thing with the J.T. Miller trade previously, right?

Kind of sending out of that was an unprotected pick or at least would translate to one and they wound up ultimately keeping it that one year. But it kind of positions them to keep going in that direction. They clear very clearly, I think, also showed this weekend that they don't really have a lot of desire to bottom out, because with their fifth overall pick, and I really like this player, and I think he's going to be an awesome NHLer, but they took Albert Smiths there. And one of the biggest selling points on him is how pro-ready he is already and how he looked at the Olympics and the idea that he's probably immediately

from the start of the season going to slot into the left side on their second pair and play meaningful minutes for them as opposed to some of these other defensemen that were available that might have more upside moving forward, but are probably going to take two, three years before we ever see them. in the NHL. And so I think the combination of these two moves kind of telegraphs that. I want to get into Vegas's perspective here a little bit because it's certainly sort of status quo for them in terms of not being committed to players.

And I think Dorofiev and Korzak were the only two guys on their Stanley Cup finalist roster that they had drafted and developed themselves. And now they send out Dorov here, who was a big success story for them as a former third round pick that they sort of nurtured into the player he's become. I think they could have made the money work conceivably. They would have had to subtract elsewhere. But assuming there's following moves, and I think one of them is probably going to be trying to find a suitor for

Aden Hill's contract after his signing bonus is paid on July 1st, maybe including either a Tamash Hurtle or a William Carlson. And if they accomplish that, it's going to carve out a pretty sizable amount of cap space for them to be a serious suitor for either Dylan Larkin or whichever star player they identify and want to bring in as the sort of latest edition that they've constructed as such. Yeah, I was not expecting them to be trading Dorafev, like just looking at the older names that are on their cap sheet like Carlson, like Thomas Schurdle.

But, you know, I think at the $11 million, it is a little bit more understandable to me why they didn't want to necessarily make that investment. I would not hold my breath that they're going to be using that New York Rangers first round pick at any point. But I mean, it is disappointing for them just because again, like there's a team

that has so much playmaking talent at the top end of their roster and they managed to have a real success story with Dorafei as a pure sniper who, you know, essentially complimented those guys absolutely perfectly as a guy who would be able to pitch in defensively

but isn't a puck dominant player can just, you know, compliment them on the power play and even strength. So they are going to have to find some way to replace those goals, especially since this is really kind of an all-in time for this core. I'm not quite sure how they're going to do it. You alluded to Dylan Larkin. That is an interesting option. They could theoretically make that work now in a way that wasn't really conceivable before. I know we've talked a lot about the questions of what they're going to do with Brassus Anderson,

whether they're going to just stick with their guns on that one or let them walk. But, yeah, Vegas has a lot of pressure on right now because this core is not getting any younger. They came pretty close this year and they've had a pretty big suppression in Dora Fav that they're going have to replace. All right. Let's keep it moving because we've got a lot to get through today. I want to talk J.J. Paterka next.

You know, Boston's 23rd overall and Florida's 2028 top 10 protected first, which if it isn't relayed becomes a 29 Bruins unprotected pick. It strikes me as a pretty low risk and reasonably high upside move for the Bruins, not only because, you know, they make it back to the playoffs this year. I think there was a lot to build on there. With the level, Pastor Neck is still playing at Charlie McAvoy, Jeremy Swayman, like it's understandable that they identified a player like this and wanted to go for it.

And honestly, the price carries very minimal risk, in my opinion, especially considering Petrka that turns 25 this season. He signed at a really nice number 7.7 times four for a lot of those prime seasons. I think a general trend that we've seen in the league this week is some of these guys who were signed under the previous contract terms are even more desirable because you don't have to worry about what that next ticket is going to look like for them. And I imagine he's going to be a great fit, especially if it's playing next to Pasternach, but obviously the connection with their coach, Marco Stern and the German connection there. I think they're going to get a lot out of them. And, you know, it was a very disappointing one year's stop for him in Utah, considering all the hype. And I'm responsible for that as well.

I did like a full show on the fit between him and the mammoth after they acquired him this time last year. I don't think it was necessarily as bad as it seems on the surface. I know that his points drop from 68 to 47 and come playoffs, he had six pointless games where he dropped down to, you know, fringe third line usage essentially for them and really fell into Andre Turney's doghouse and out of the team's rotation ultimately. But if you watch last year, like you still pretty much, all the stuff that they had so excited about him. And his 5-1-5 production was pretty much in line with what it had been previously in the two years in Buffalo before the initial trade.

And so the idea that he's going to kind of bounce back and might not even need to necessarily bounce back as much as you'd expect seems like a pretty reasonable scenario here for him in the Bruins. Yeah, I don't know that my outlook on him has really changed it all since that trade happened last year. And, you know, encouragingly, if all goes south, like clearly he has a skill set.

is being valued based on the fact that he had a down year and he still went for. I agree with you not an extravagant trade return and one that I'm totally fine with Boston paying, but also a pretty decent one in terms of assets. Yeah, I'm still high on him. I mean, that kind of quick strike offensive ability, you know, he's got great hands. He's got a great shot. You know, he also has, I think, that kind of off-puck IQ that you want in a goal score. I just think, yeah, like it seemed like a good fit at the time with Utah,

but I think there's some cases where a player can be so good a fit that he actually becomes a little bit redundant and that there are too many players of his type in Utah that, you know, looking back, it almost seems kind of inevitable that if he didn't immediately make a huge impact, that he might slide down the roster. I remember, you know, watching him early in the season and thinking that they were kind of asking him to do a lot of different things

that weren't necessarily pillars of his game. Like he was having to forecheck more. He was becoming more of kind of a facilitating guy in transition instead of a guy who carries the puck himself, which I think went a ways towards rounding out his game, but it maybe handcuffed him from making that kind of high-level rush impact that we saw previously in Buffalo. I think the investment that the Bruins have made here

really identifying this is a player that they want to target, speaks to, you know, the more central role that he's probably going to play in their offense. You know, and like you said, I think he is a quite compatible player with Pasternak, but I think he could also provide some kind of middle six scoring punch that they really, really need. And that 7.7, you know, like you said, is a totally reasonable caput for what he brings. I would expect him to have a pretty comfortable bounce back season. There's obviously issues with this player in terms if he's had some defense. of problems. He, you know, likes to blow the zone sometimes. He doesn't have a physical element to his game

anymore, which, you know, it's kind of interesting considering that it's almost the opposite of how he profiled when he was drafted. But given his 5-1-5 scoring ability and his ability with the puck, I think that he will be a valuable asset for the Bruins as they continue, almost like the Rangers, to kind of muddle through and continue to try to make themselves competitive because they have such, you know, incredible star players on the roster. especially in light of how they played last year under Marco Sturm, where they really did not have the puck a lot

and profiled very poorly in a lot of the possession metrics, but were quite dangerous off of those kind of counters and quick strikes, and his skill set is going to lend itself nicely to that. And yeah, to the point that I made earlier, like pretty much the entire difference in his production from one year to the next is represented by a lack of power play production in Utah, and that's something that plagued that entire team. I do wish we had gotten to, in hindsight, just see more of him with Cooley and Gunther.

There was a stretch there, kind of 20 games in to the season where it was like, this is exactly what I anticipated it would look like, and it was so exciting. And then they kind of went away from it, and Andre Turney clearly didn't trust them. And, you know, just generally as a philosophy, I don't love the idea of making these types of roster decisions based on a coach's preferences. I know they just gave Journey a bit of an extension, but I think we all agree that by the time this team is really at its apex a couple of years from now,

he probably won't be the coach of them. And I, in general, would like to just bet on the talent and allow it to work itself out and not sort of make these types of moves just based on a coach's whims. But we've gotten to this point. And so it was understandable why they went this direction. I would have loved to see a team like Ottawa pounce on this.

I know they acquired William Eklund, but like obviously the connection between him and stutzla would be an obvious one but i think in general like his shooting talent would lend itself so nicely with the pace that that stutza plays at so i would have preferred that instead from utah's perspective here um they wind up using a 23rd pick on sebastian kosah which is fine you and i neither of us are equipped to talk about him as you know what he is as a goalie moving forward i'll have kevin woodley on at some point in the off season and i'm sure we'll circle back to that, I think, just generally, though. They played Vemalco way too much the past two years.

There was that stretch two years ago where he played like 25 straight games. And then last year he was the only goalie in the league that played 60 plus games and he finished with 64 and was clearly invisibly wearing down. So it gives them another option there. I think the biggest benefit, though, is essentially having a do-over. You know, they wound up regrettably wasting the Josh Stone asset and we saw what he became in Buffalo. but beyond that, it clears up that 7.7 in cap space, leaves them with 20 plus now. And I feel like it's one of those TBD things in terms of evaluating it because I kind of want to see what they do with it next and how ambitiously they're able to swing. I know they've been very reluctant to include their top prospects like a Tiziginla or Caleb N. Waii or even the boot in Seymachev tier of guys they've drafted.

But they could put together a pretty compelling Jason Robertson package, for example. if they wanted to, assuming he'd want to sign there, with some of those young players, other picks. They've accrued like this Panthers 2028 pick and then even roster player contributors who are kind of lost in the shuffle someone in Utah, like a Barrett Hayden or a Sean Jersey. So that would be a very interesting sort of follow-up here

and I think would look more favorably upon this decision than if they kind of just use this cap space to add more sort of fringe middle six guys and just go into the offseason with all the room to spend. Yeah, I think they're also an interesting dark horse Larkin contender If that's somewhere that he wants to go as well Which is always the consideration with these things I did appreciate that they took

They're the ones who took belsheds yesterday They did yeah, they traded up to get him Yes, they traded up to get him And then they also added Kasa because I've always said on this show That I just want the mammoth to have the tallest team possible And I remember being a little annoyed that they traded Kesselring for Peturka last year because it was contrary to that narrative. So I do appreciate that.

But no, I'm with you. I mean, you know, looking at their depth chart right now, taking up a circuit does leave maybe a little bit of a hole in terms of scoring punch in their top six. So, you know, I think they have a lot of flexibility. They, like you said, are a very asset-rich team. I think their blue line is looking quite solid right now where they don't really need to prioritize that.

So it'll be interesting to see how they approach the rest of the soft season because really, in terms of their trajectory and everything like that, there isn't much of a reason for them not to be a compelling destination for those kind of, you know, mid-20s trade requesting players to go to. So I think that would be an interesting target. You want to see them put together an NBA team and Bill Armstrong's like, say no more. And he will gladly oblige with that. They also seem to be in the mix with, you know, the HABs.

And I imagine the Sabres in the Marchenko discussion. and we're going to talk more about Murchenko in a second here, but that would be an interesting swing for them as well. I'm going to quickly do Mason McTavish before we go to break because he was the third sort of big name player that was moved on day one of the draft. And I do think the amount of attention nationally this whole ordeal got over the past week

was probably overblown in comparison to what I actually think of them in terms of impact and as a player at this point. the blues send 15 and 29 for him and I'm kind of torn on it because I'm generally very skeptical of it and I feel like there would have been a lot of spots like let's say he went to the Rangers and they were rumored to be very interested I would have been completely out on it I do think the blues at least stand to be a potential fit for it in terms of minimizing some of his weaknesses and potentially getting the best out of them and it fits nicely with the general core and composition of their forward group and they had these four first round picks to play with.

So I don't necessarily hate it, but I do think that a lot of people are sort of receiving this news as, wow, what a big get. Mason McTavish. I remember when he was a top five pick and everyone was so excited about him. And there is some promise there if he can figure out the weaknesses to his game, but the weaknesses are so abundant and so visible that I think there's a lot of work to be done here. Yeah, like he, if he didn't have that kind of third overall pick pedigree, and you were just watching everything else in a vacuum. I don't think that he would quite have any of our approaching the hype that he has had.

I think because people, you know, they not only remember his draft position, but also I think he was considered to be a very, you know, heart and soul leader, you know, where's a letter, battles in the corner, battles in front of the net kind of player. And to some extent, he's been that player in Anaheim, but I think he's run into a whole lot of obstacles that have prevented him from being an impact player. That's a reason why, you know, in a vacuum, he theoretically should be a player that, you know, Verbeek loves him and becomes a core player of the Zanaheim, and instead he's, you know, one of the more expendable players. It's like you said,

like you watch him and it's a bit aggravating because there's good pieces there and stuff that could be really useful, you know, he could be that strong net front player. You see him handle the puck when he has empty runway in front of him and he does look confident and strong with it. He'll get the puck behind the net or in the corner and he'll make a tape to tape pass across the slot and you'll wonder where the hell that came from because the other half of the time you're watching him in transition fumbling pucks or failing to, you know, get to the outside or get to the inside off the rush. You know, I think the feet are just such a big problem with this player where he's always a step behind, you know, that really negative defensive impact

he has, I think, stems a lot from how much he wants to jump up in the play and how deep he wants to go in the offense zone and how completely flat-footed he finds himself caught. But also that, you know, if he's chasing a puck in the corner against the defenseman, he's almost never going to be the first one there. And he's not really able to dig in and use the physical gifts that he has productively. You know, like you said, I think that there's a way that they can take what he does have, you know, the smaller. area skill, the ability to go at the net front and insulate it properly and hopefully mitigate some of the more negative aspects. But it is going to be a project. I don't think it's going necessarily come totally easy. And I think that there's an awful lot of downside with this player just as much as there is upside at this point. Yeah, I'm sympathetic to the idea that, you know,

he misses all that time in the lead up to the year. And it's not only that, but he's stepping into then just a wildly different uptempo environment that Ducks played in compared to the past and just left him behind ultimately. And, you know, by the playoffs, he was a non-factor. He got healthy scratched a couple times. He wound up being their 12 most frequently used forward at 5-on-5 in their 12 playoff games. And it made him very expendable here and kind of getting off that 7 million times five commitment that they owed him. The defensive stuff is certainly worrisome being a first percentile defender of the penalties he. takes the foot speed though is the most unavoidable thing and i think it's gotten to the point

where i don't even really view him unless he dramatically improves it as a viable option down the middle and that's why i mentioned that i think the blues are at least interesting because they have robert thomas they have d'albert divorcese they have pew suitor for another year i like what i saw from ottenberg last year um they just took two more centers to add to the organization at 11 and 16. And so there's ways to kind of mitigate some of that risk by playing on the wing, hoping that some of the playmakers they have can get him the puck in advantageous spots. And he does legitimately have shooting talent. And so it could be interesting, especially for a player who's 24. I do like what the Blues are doing here in general, though, like all these guys with Thomas being

the oldest member of the bunch turning 27 this season. And then Dvorski being 21, pretty much everyone they have is in between that age range in that window with Holloway, Snuggaroo, McTavish now, neighbors, McMichael, who they acquired for Cairo. And so it's an ascending team. And I think in general, they're set up quite nicely from a talent perspective. They also acquired Brandon Carlo for two-thirds, which is whatever, but gives them some optionality on the blue line. And I love what I saw from Theo Lindstein, playing with Pareko particularly last year.

So it's an ascending team. The issue for them, though, is they're in the central division. where you not only have the three teams up top and we'll see what the stars ultimately look like, but I'd still expect them to be good. And then the mammoth ascending. And so it's a pretty brutal gauntlet they're going to have to run through. But I do think how they've sort of reoriented here on the fly the past year or two in getting a bunch of guys who are either young or entering their prime and then being very cost efficient where they still have a bunch of cab space to work with is at least exciting. And especially compared to where they were at a couple years ago where it seemed like they were headed towards needing.

one of these like full exhausting five plus year tear downs. They've kind of avoided that for now. And so I do think there's a lot to build on. Yeah, I think they're building towards being a good team. I think there is a valid question about what is the ceiling of what they're building towards. Because like you said, I mean, Robert Thomas, we're both huge fans of Philip Roperk. You know, they're building a good infrastructure around them. The question is just, you know, not only in the iconolative division, but just generally in the league where

you want to have as much high in talent as possible. Are they going to be able to accumulate that talent in the next couple of years, given how competently they've put together this very solid, you know, mid-20s type core? But, yeah, McTavish, I think the other place that I was interested for with him would have been Ottawa once Brady Kachuk got traded, just because I think you could have justified, you know, he kind of has, obviously Brady Kachuk is a much, much better player, but they do have some similar weaknesses and similar strengths, and it would have been interesting to see them just kind of slot him in

on the Kachuk development plan and basically put him in that exact role and see what happens. But like you said, I think at the very least St. Louis of teams like Montreal and the Rangers that were being rumored for him is one of the least likely to try to force him into that center role where I don't think he's going to be able to play. So I'm, you know, maybe on a new team,

where he doesn't have the pressure of being kind of the third overall pick and one of the headliners of a up-and-coming core, he can just simplify his game, become a contributor. And, you know, I feel like with this kind of player, you never really see the footspeed improve. I wouldn't expect that. But at least if he can kind of find himself a niche, you know, in their middle six and be a solid player who plays in that front on the power play and occasionally makes a really slick pass or shot that makes you kind of wish he could be something more. you know like we said rising cap environment

$7 million is a lot of money but it's not what it used to be so if he can at least be a solid middle six player then that's probably okay we'll talk more about this on the Sunday show when we get into the actual draft stuff but I do love that the ducks turned around and used the pick they got on him

at least the first first rounder on a guy with just an outrageous mixed tape of high skill plays and like holding on to the puck and dangling and just being so on brand in terms of some of the young forwards they have but we'll get more into clip of on Sunday, Jack, let's take our break here.

And then we come back, we're going to jump right back into it and work through some of the other most notable moves we saw this weekend. You're listening to the Hockey P.D.O.cast streaming on the SportsNard Radio Network. All right. We're back at our... You have a live reaction to the Adam Edstrom, Massimo, Rizzo trade. Oh, wow. You know what? I think we can skip that one. Okay. I do like Edstrom, but we can skip through it. Okay, I'll lead us back in.

All right, we're back here in the Hockey Pedyocas, join by Jack Fraser. Jack, I want to talk Sabres a little bit. Obviously, they did a lot of their heavy lifting with the Byram trade earlier in the week, and we broke that down on the Patreon feed with Harmon Dile, so you could check out a longer conversation on that. But I do want to kind of just stake stock of the totality of their work here, which I imagine you share the same feelings of being impressed with what they pulled off here, essentially sending out Byram, Greenway, Tux, Wrights,

and Anton Walt were a prospect they took 39th overall a couple years ago into fourth overall and they took Daxon Rudolph. We'll talk more about that on Sunday. Owen Zellweger, Louis Crevier, San Jose's third and 27, David Camps-Rights, and then used the cap space they have to lock in Zach Benson at a great number for seven years moving forward as well. I want to talk with Zellweger in particular because I'm a big fan of the player. I really like the bet.

especially as a one-for-one kind of stylistic replacement for what they lost in the buyroom trade and for a fraction of the price at that. And an interesting component of it to me is I imagine they'll probably go shorter term on him because he's an RFA looking for a new deal and bridge him just considering the long-term investments they've already made at the position with how much they're paying their top three, but then also the draft capital they've spent on Mercka and now Rudolph most recently. but I love the idea of him signing a long-term deal that AFP analytics hasn't projected for, which is like in the 6.25 to 6.5 range because it would essentially just perfectly fit in

as what they were paying Byron previously, but long-term, and provide them with a ton of cost certainty there with those stylistic similarities. I'm very curious to see what he looks like in Buffalo. I think there's a lot of very encouraging stuff that he showed in his limited time in Anaheim that's going to lend itself very well to this. And it could be an unbelievable fit where he realizes all that potential that had us so excited about him and just replicates at least some close approximation of what they got from Byram last season. Yeah, yeah, a very clever series of moves, I think, just to paper over the gap that was left

by Byron where, you know, I think there was some valid disagreement of the extent to which, you know, Byram was a real driver for them, even considering, you know, the amount of he was playing his productiveness. You know, I think there was a good reason that they weren't necessarily ready to give him the contract and the role that he wanted. You know, with Zelweger, I think ultimately they will go the bridge just because, you know, with a young player like that, who's kind of only played, you know, a relatively small role, you do kind of want to see how he'll adapt to a new environment.

But I, like you, was impressed by the steps that he took last year. I think he addressed a lot of the weaknesses that were kind of in his game to start. I still don't think that he's a great defensive player and there's a good chance that he never will be. You know, he's a smaller player. He's always been relatively physically weak and had some issues with that. And, you know, like Byram, like Nemitz, like a lot of these types of activating, jumping up in the players, he does tend to find himself, you know, oftentimes in the wrong area code on these counterattacking chances. But the Buffalo Sabres, especially the way that they played last year under Lindy Rough,

just do such a good job of insulating the D and allowing them to make those activations without really paying the price for them. Like the structure around them is so strong and the forwards come back so responsibly that I think he will get the opportunity to really kind of take off and see what he's capable of. And it could be an excellent fit.

You know, this was a player who, I think, early on in the NHL had a bit of that kind of tunnel vision issue where he was just not pass. the puck like he would just the puck would get to him in the defensive zone and he wouldn't really breathe the ice very well he didn't see his options he would just kind of carried in to end and then run out a road which is not a type of defenseman that you know i'm a particular fan of and last year i think he really improved at kind of taking his time with the puck becoming more patient processing things a lot faster and you know becoming a much stronger breakout passer using

his teammates better in transition while not sacrificing his footstreet I mean, you know, if you look at the NHL edge data in terms of how quick he was playing and how fast he was skating down the ice, there really was nobody who was playing at the pace that he was last year. You know, in some metrics and others, he was rivaling guys like Schaefer and McCar. So we know that foot speed is not an issue here. And I think the Sabres will give him a ton of runway to really see what he's capable of with the puck. And it really wouldn't surprise me if he ends up being a Byron quality player for them in the next couple of years. years and the price take was a lot cheaper and allowed them to collect a fourth overall pick in the process without giving up a lot of draft capital to the ducks who it really seemed

like we're just never going to find a way to make him work given the players that they already had on the left side in their system well you can find this on your website hockey stats dot com but you've charted it very nicely for everyone to see um to that point about the skating 20 plus mile per hour bursts last year on a permanent basis amongst all defenders number one Schaefer, number two, Zoe Wager, number three, Sanderson, and number four, McCar. And his numbers last year, I know he was essentially being used as a third pair guy, but look even better if you strip out the 115 or so minutes he played with Drew Hellison, who has become a punching bag for us here on the PDO cast and bumps up to like a 53% expected

goal share in all his minutes away from them. And to your point, this sort of team building style that the Sabres have adopted where they just let their defensemen run free and kind of create the offensive environment. And then their forwards really complimented nicely with doing the dirty work and extending possession and covering for them defensively is going to lend itself nicely to getting the most at a Zellwiger. I want to talk about the fallout a little bit for the Sabres here from all this maneuvering they did. You know, the long-term incentive is is very clear.

They get younger. They get cheaper. They get more malleable. They kind of double down on an existing strength. they avoid some landmines and they accrue those additional assets. In the process, I do think people are going to say, you know, at least on paper, losing Tuck and Byram while they would have been bad bets long term, especially at the prices they're going to command and Tuck already did.

They were clearly valuable contributors of the way they played in the success they had last year. And so losing them as you're entering this competitive window and replacing it with either unknowns or, you know, players who are less proven is concerning. I think my pushback to that would be one potential way to compensate for it is just continued internal improvement from young players getting better, particularly guys like Benson Doan and Power. And then the other, having O'Sland and Kulik, who they really didn't have either of in that playoff run available and healthy, is going to go a long way and just kind of create more opportunities for them to blossom. I do think that with some of these assets in the cap space they have now,

they still need to figure out Zellweger and Krebs's next deals, but they're going to have room to add another forward most likely, and I'm curious to see what they do with that. I might be inclined to say that I'm less concerned about replacing Tux roll on the wing, because I think they have guys who could fill that for cheaper, and more about what the plan is long term down the middle. one option is just Consta Helen who's being as awesome as he looked in a small sample

but I do think I at this point prefer Tage Thompson on the wing and I don't really trust Josh Norris to play 20 plus playoff games for you at a top six level if you're trying to win a cup and so I think it remains to be seen what they do there but at least now I think they

much more cleanly have the means to kind of address that and do so in a really important way yeah I mean remember too that last off season that a lot of people were also looking at the Buffalo Sabres and saying well they just got worse you know why why do these models have them making the playoffs

why would anybody think this team's making the playoffs they're going to get 82 points they lost butyrka they you know all this stuff and then because of those internal improvements as well as you know the the really essential work they did last year and essentially kind of trimming the fat from the roster and improving pretty much from the bottom up and getting rid of the kind of weakling that were holding the back. You know, I'm not implying for a second that Tuck and Byron were weaklings or anything,

but I think that there is kind of smaller work that this team can do to, you know, get themselves at least level to where they were last season without necessarily having to make massive blockbuster moves. Now, obviously, they have been involved in rumors on guys like Connor Hallibuck and Vincent Trocheck, and it does increasingly look like because of the success. they had last season, Buffalo might actually not be on as many no trade lists as they used to be, which would obviously dramatically improve the flexibility. But I mean, like you mentioned, it really seems like kind of the big hole in this roster right now, at least until, you know,

Helena has proved that he can be a number one center, which, you know, it would be nice, but may never be the case. You know, that's obviously the most difficult thing to add. And it may not necessarily be something, especially if a guy like Dylan Larkin isn't, you know, in their possibilities to add, I think that this team, because of just how deep they are in terms of up-and-coming players and they already have a very robust forward group, they might be well served to just kind of ride this one out, you know, see how Zellweger works, see how, you know, all these younger players fit in, and then maybe be able to make a decision further down the line rather than maybe rushing into something that they might regret.

You know, for example, you know, I know that there were rumors going around that, you know, maybe one of those first drunk picks yesterday might have been on the board to make a move for Trocheck, for example. You know, Trochec, I think, would probably look a little better on this Buffalo team than he did, you know, the past couple of years in New York. But I think it might make more sense for them considering the asset base that they have to hold tight until kind of the perfect move comes out. and I still think that this team looks like a pretty comfortable playoff team just looking at the roster right now based on the moves that they've made even considering the fact that they have shed tuck and byra.

Oh, undoubtedly. And yeah, I like the ability they have to consolidate some of these assets and really swing big when the opportunity presents itself. And I think timing that out and identifying the right player is going to be huge for them moving forward. I guess the last like actual trade that we saw, it didn't necessarily come on. Friday or during draft weekend, but I haven't had a chance to discuss it much here on the show was the Capitals going out and acquiring Jordan Kyrie earlier in the week and then sign and trade acquiring Alex Tuck and signing him. I don't think we need to spend a lot of time relitigating the concerns about Tuck and the Red Flags and whether that was an advisable

investment to make in him. I do think what's interesting about the caps, though, beyond the fact that they all of a sudden, I think, have a very interesting. forward group that just loaded with size, speed, and skill is they very clearly identified one of their weaknesses last year beyond a miserable power play was the team speed element and how unthreatening they were on the rush, off the rush for the most part. I think they were a bottom 10 lead team in terms of rush chances generated and they add two guys in Cairo and Tuck and even if Tuck's ability there has been diminishing, still going to clearly improve that is interesting.

And I'm curious for your take on kind of the direction they chose to go here and how they use this abundance of cap space they have. And they still have a bunch of room to work with while we're waiting on clarity on whether Ovecans is going to be back and whether that's going to take up a chunk of it. Yeah, I mean, they 100% improved and they improved in an area that they really needed to. I'm a huge fan of, I mean, I was going to be a pretty big fan of any team acquiring Cairo. I've always been very high on that player. And he's coming off the down.

you're obviously, but previously, like, his record was just so good in terms of just that quick strike offensive ability, you know, kind of a leveled up version of Petrka, I guess. You know, with Tuck, I think that does introduce some more complex questions about what this team's plan in terms of contention is really going to look like, just because I think most of us acknowledge the Tuck contract is probably going to be okay in the early years, but there's kind of concerning signs for the downturn. now obviously a good amount of that is going to be absorbed by the rising cap but I would imagine that the true contenders are going to be capped out in a couple years and so it's not as easy

it's just brushing away the idea of overpayments and debt cap space I think honestly like they're basically setting the table as well as you could really hope for in the hopes that these guys that they've drafted you know who are who have been undervalued like like pro dash like like Hudson, like Ryan Leonard, you know, if those are star caliber players, then this team is really set up around them with this kind of two-tiered core where kind of as they come up and reach their prime, you know, you still have these players like Cairo and Wilson and DuBois and Strom and, you know, Matt Roy, Jacob Chikrin, who are going to be, you know, still relatively in their primes. But if, you know, that core of young players,

doesn't quite reach the level that they need them to of being real standout star level players, then, you know, I think you're going to start looking at these, this older core of players who are somewhat expensive, who are starting to enter their 30s, you know, that might pose some problems in terms of what ceiling this team can reach. So I think if you're operating under the premise that Hudson and, you know, the younger protests and Leonard are going to be star players, then I think that this team will be very well set up to contend for the next couple years. If they don't reach that, then I think that it arises some problems, but they were going to be in trouble anyway.

So you might as well put yourself in as good a position as possible and maximize those years. Yeah, I think they'll be fun to watch. I think adding players, especially with these skill sets and now all the optionality they have, given that to Spencer Carberry, who I think very highly of as a coach, is going to be interesting. and then I'm curious to see if they're able to sort of merge these two timelines of some of those ascending players that are still cheap that you mentioned to go along with some of these guys they've invested in who are still playing at least somewhat close to their max capacity and trying to kind of fit that timeline in nicely. Let's close out today's show by talking about some of the things we're looking ahead to and some of the big name players who at least haven't moved at least in the time of this recording and it's always kind of precarious talking about this stuff because, anything could happen at any minute, although I imagine at this point, especially with the allure of top picks in 26 removed off the board. We might be moving closer to waiting until post-July 1 when some signing bonuses are paid, and there's more flexibility for teams to facilitate deals.

But I do want to talk about the blue jackets, Jason Robertson, Connor Hellebuck, a couple of the other names that have been in the rumor about but haven't been removed yet. And I'll give you your pick of where you want to start out of that list. Well, the Jason Robertson one is interesting just because it really seems like he's picking his destination even more specifically than we might have thought. I mean, people have been coming up with Trace to send Jason Robertson to basically every single team in the NHL. And it seems like the idea that, oh, like, as long as the team is willing to pay him $15 million, he'll go there. You know, I think that that's been suddenly very deflated. It seems pretty clear that he wants to be in Dallas and that he's. it's going to take a really good situation to get him outside of there.

You know, I've been, you know, theorizing for like a month about the idea that Jason Robertson, Dylan Larkin, SWAT, which may happen in the form of futures or something like that in a three-to-way trade. But, I mean, I still think really highly of the player. And, you know, the idea of adding him to a team, I know, like we talked about Utah earlier on, And the idea of kind of adding him to a team that could use that scoring punch and has the cap flexibility that Dallas doesn't is really enticing. And I mean, just given how drawn out this process has been and how reluctant Dallas seems to be to really invest him as, you know, their franchise player, which I think he pretty clearly is at this at the forward position. You know, I really at this point wouldn't so much mind seeing him go somewhere else, you know, especially if it's a already contending team that can slot him in really. nicely and put the pieces around him that you really need to maximize Jason Robertsman.

I really, I have to admit, I don't understand the skepticism on their part. And, you know, he's certainly leveled up in the meantime, but you could trace this all the way back to going the four-year bridge route in 2022, I believe. And that's why this has become an issue now. And, you know, they're certainly up against the cap wise, at least for this one season. I think there's ways around it or ways to make it work in terms of some track. acting guys off the margins who aren't essential and would probably hurt their their depth and their ability to maybe win a cup or at least compete for one in the central for one season, but would still benefit them in the long run because they'd retain Robertson, a player who's

in his prime, he's going to be 27. He's been a top 10 producer for the past however many years. And honestly, the skill set in my opinion is pretty unimpeachable. I think partly why we've been kind of fantasy booking him for all these different spots is because he'd be a fit pretty much anywhere, right? Like, you know, there's certainly drawbacks with the skating speed, but it just has been a non-issue in his NHL career and his ways to craftily work around it and still connect plays. And he's so good in so many different ways that it's really tough to envision a scenario where even if they replace it with a Larkin or, you know, how previously rumored if they'd made that crack in trade pivoting and bringing in a Matthew Nyes and just having more guys

available at their disposal in a relatively thin forward group, it's still tough to foresee how they're going to come out ahead here and, you know, extend this cup contention window while all these players are in their prime that they have atop the lineup. And so I find it kind of confounding, I guess, and maybe it's as simple as sort of they've sort of picked their stance and the relationship is deteriorated. Yet it still seems like Robertson ultimately wants to stand Dallas. He just wants to be paid at 14 plus million or whatever and be their highest paid player during this spot where he can cash in and go eight years with them. So, I'm not sure honestly why this is still an issue, but it is.

And I'm very curious to see how it plays out. Yep, 100%. But, you know, like you said, like your Dallas is willing to appreciate him like that. Then I think it would make sense to movement. I mean, yeah, there's just endless teams that make sense as a target. And it would be exciting. I would like trades to happen, please. Well, what's especially frustrating for the stars, I mentioned, how it sounds like kind

of a one-year issue for them, like really as soon as next summer when, against money comes off the books and the cap goes up once again like they're going to have 20 plus million encapsaries to work with and so really it comes down to kind of white knuckling it and stripping off spare parts for one year and maybe taking that loss but benefiting from it in the long run I've been asking people about this and got mixed returns depending on who I talk to I think a fascinating way to kind of satisfy both sides would be to just play out this year like go the qualifying offer and then arbitration route and then extend for seven years as soon as they're eligible in January. Some of the pushback I've gotten is obviously the injury risk for the player and the uncertainty

there as opposed to just getting the eight years now, but also, you know, from like a PA perspective and a league perspective, whether that would be looked at as circumvention or something that kind of goes against the spirit of the rule. But, you know, they could really afford to just if they got them in and like whatever, nine and a half or it wound up being for this one year, go. even as high as the Caprizov money moving forward. And as long as it kicks in the following season, he still winds up making more money in the long run

and they wind up retaining him. But it doesn't seem like we're going to go in that direction. Well, and the question is, you know, do they value him at the Caprizov money? Like, is this just a cap space issue or is this a situation where the team doesn't quite rate the player at the level that the player rates himself? And as, you know, we personally,

and I guess the Seattle Cracken would rate him. Like, do they think that it's unreasonable to pay him $16 million for seven years next summer? Well, I think they're spooked by how that Brown 1 series against Minnesota looked, where they objectively looked very slow, yet he was by far their best player, and it wasn't an issue for him. So it's kind of ironic in that way. You got any notes on Helibuck beyond him being a goalie? because he also didn't wind up being moved

and it seemed like there was a lot of steam connecting with the Sabres. You mentioned how the Sabre success last year has led to players being more, I guess, open to go in there via trade with trade protections. And it seems like you could include him in that list. And I was curious to see whether they would use that fourth

overall pick they got from Byron to facilitate it. And I think that would have been very interesting for them, but also a big win for Winnipeg just getting like a legitimate mid-premium asset in return for a 33-year-old goalie, which is such a rare trade and such a difficult position to be in for a team trying to recoup value in terms of what he's actually worth to you. Now that that is off the board, at least for the time being, I guess I'm curious to see kind of where this goes and whether Buffalo revisits it. We know Carolina has been linked. I think New Jersey would be interesting. There's countless stops that I imagine would still be

interested, but Winnipeg is going to need at least something in return to kind of make it worth their while. Yeah, I mean, I was so sure that they were going to, that he was going to end up in Florida. Like for the past, like, month, I was dead sure that that ninth overall pick was going to go to and, you know, and Samiskevich or whoever they got for Samaskovych. And once the Samiskevich trade was made, I thought, okay, now we're leading up. Like now tonight, Connor Halibuck will be traded to Florida. And of course, it was Brady Kachuk instead, which completely set that, you know, whole thing down because now, you know, there's rumors that Florida might still be his preferred destination. And, you know, Florida still wants him, but Florida just doesn't have any assets

available, essentially. I mean, Florida was just such an obvious one that it's kind of shaking me to even be coming up with the other ones like Buffalo, obviously was one that made a lot of sense. I think now that the draft has passed, Winnipeg is probably just going to be best served by, you know, not rushing anything. Like it would be one thing if Winnipeg could have left this draft with the fourth overall pick and the eighth overall pick or the eighth overall pick and the ninth overall pick and really kind of started off this new, you know,

this new generation of young Jets players, you know, all in one go and kind of started fresh. But now I feel, I feel like this is kind of a process where, you know, unlike a lot of these other trade requests, I think that it's been kept much closer to the best, what Helibuck's preferences are. You know, obviously he would be leading this process because of the clause in his contract, but, you know, we haven't heard, oh, yeah, he's just demanding that he only wants to go to Vegas and Florida, you know, like with certain players.

Like there's more flexibility potentially. And I think Winnipeg, this is a trade that they really need to get right. And I don't think it's one that they necessarily need to rush into. So now that the draft is over, I feel like unless an offer comes their way that really blows them away and really allows them to kind of reset here and set on the new era, I think this is something that, you know, teams always want a goalie. There might be teams in the regular season that really want a goalie that may have more flexibility during the regular season than we've seen recently. You know, that might be a trade that they're able to make, especially if their season starts to go south next year because, you know, they still have shyly. they still have Morrissey, they still have Connor. You know, they're still at least, you know,

nominally poised to try to continue to compete. So I don't see any reason for them to kind of force the trade out, you know, just willy-nilly, especially considering what an important player he is. And, you know, how desperate goalies or teams often are to add goaltending and end the pedigree that he has. So now that the draft is over, I think, you know, when they can play a bit more patient,

unless Hellbuck really starts making noise out in public. You can also add now they have Vigo Bjork to the list, baby. Yeah, the Florida one, I mean, listen, they literally do not have an NHL goalie on their roster right now under contract. And Hela Buck is great. And I'm sure he'd figure it out and have fun doing so. I don't know from a fit perspective, putting him in a spot where he's just going to, the only shots he's going to face are going to be breakways, essentially, is putting him in a position to succeed. But we'll still see what comes to that. I think the best argument for me from a Jets perspective for doing it anyways and even if you take a loss from a value perspective is if it signals a dramatic change and approach for them organizationally where it kind of forces them or pushes them into really properly rebuilding and kind of tearing this thing down.

And if they did so, they could really serve as kind of like a skeleton key for this off season because they have so many guys who would obviously be desirable even beyond the stars you mentioned there. Dylan Sandberg for the pricey cost for two years would be incredibly appealing as a trade asset and I'm sure they could make a lot happen but it doesn't seem like they're that inclined to do so and the idea of trading hellabuck for whatever they get and kind of just trying to otherwise plow ahead with their roster is probably the least appealing option as an outcome here for me

so we'll see how it plays out do you have any notes on the reported Hurricanes offer which seemed like it was Nikitian in the first because I, from a Jets perspective, I wouldn't be particularly interested in that. I think the proposition of paying Nikitian 8 plus million moving forward or whatever would give me pause, especially after the post season he had. I know there's extenuating circumstances where he was essentially a year one player playing in North America. Even in the playoffs, he took that nasty hit to the head and missed a couple games.

And it could explain some of his performance yet, it seems pretty clear that the hurricane, hurricanes are skeptical and I think generally betting against the hurricanes when it comes to their evaluation of defensemen is a scary proposition and I think they're right in their stance where if you you you know I always talk about how the way coaches use players is far more indicative of how they really feel about them than anything they might say publicly or in the media that's cliche filled and they were using him as their six defensemen they were giving him 75 plus percent offensive zone starts and if you look at his opponent and they were very actively keeping him and Gosses bear away from anyone who could actually

score against them. And if you put him in a spot, like let's say Winnipeg, I think some of the foot speed concerns what he's not getting to play to his strengths, which is constantly being in the offensive zone and then pinching at the blue line would become a massive issue. And so viewing that as kind of this premium asset that you're getting as the crown jewel of whatever package you get, I would probably be steering in a different direction if I were the Jets. Yeah, I think, I mean, the most interesting thing about that offer to me was, like you said, the, you know, the light that it kind of shines on the Caroline Hurricane's evaluation of Nekheason, who obviously had so much hype entering into the season. You know, maybe we were putting a bit too much stock in high production in a very depressed KHL scoring environment, you know, since the war. but I totally agree with you.

Like, you know, the idea of paying Nikitian that long-term money for a team that I think is as savvy as the Hurricanes and likes to have the flexibility that the Hurricanes have, I understand why they would be unsure about it. And, you know, this is a player that I think, like you said, has a lot of potential. He has a lot of aspects to his game, you know, that you'd like to see. but also I think that full tilt aggressiveness combined with the limitations that he has in skating have some serious downsides that may not really accord with the way that the hurricanes like to play and would probably be fairly exposed on Winnipeg as well.

So I think for Winnipeg's sake, it makes sense that that's not a return that they were willing to take. I would imagine that they were never really offered the fourth overall pick or anything really meaningful around the fourth overall pick because I'm sure they would have taken that from Buffalo. but yeah I think for Winnipeg unfortunately at this point you pretty much have to go for a pure a pure futures trade the thing obviously for the Jets that's a consideration is just the you know the the market the realities of the market you know the potential downsides of going through a lengthy rebuild in that city considering some of the issues with attendants and especially kind of corporate ticket sales and things like that but I don't really see much a wave around it and you do.

don't want to end up in a situation where you end up getting yourself handcuffed by all these players with no move clauses forcing themselves out to different teams. And then you end up low on assets that you've received for them, plus with the prospect of a full tear it down, lengthy rebuild out of you. So I think it would make sense for them to start exploring these options and maybe getting this process done quicker rather than drawing it out. But I understand from their perspective why they're hesitant to really pull the trigger and start firing here. Okay, I know we've gone long, but I want to add one more thing to our docket here before I let you go. I want to talk blue jackets a little bit because what on earth is going on here?

It seems like the entire league is just kind of seemingly buzzing around them right now. And I don't think it helps matters that I'm not sure Don Wadela's their GM is equipped to counteract it because every time he publicly speaks, it makes things worse. And I always wonder why he just said that. But what they've done here is interesting. to me where they start the offseason, they signed 34-year-old Charlie Coil to a six-by-six, and he was great for them last year. They trade a second, third, and a fifth for Val Nechuschen, and I think at face value, that's a great deal for them. But now they're in a spot where,

at least for the time being, and this is going to change after the Adam Fantili extension, their four highest paid forwards are 31-year-old Natushkin, 34-year-old Coil, 30-year-old Garland, who they acquired at the deadline, and then 32-year-old. Sean Monaghan. And it seems like every day now there's just an emerging story at the draft. It was Marchenko and him apparently saying that he wouldn't extend with them, or at least at the time now, wouldn't consider it, then Zach Wrenzky most recently.

And he's really been pushed up every insider's trade board. And understandably so, given the quality of the player and what a difference maker that would make. but they have a lot to sort out here. And I think probably one of the more interesting situations is the league in terms of how the next couple weeks are going to play out and what the fallout from this is and what the team looks like heading into next season because this could really go off the rails pretty quickly, I think.

Yeah, like it seems like they've almost been caught unawares by it because like you said, they make all these win now trades not only at the deadline, but, you know, even as of like this past like couple weeks with Koyle and with Nishishkin, but this team this roster only really makes sense if Adam Fantilli is a star number one center and if Zavkwaransky is there

and stays there you know as soon as you take out Zach Werenski this whole thing in Central Crumbles and I mean it's not like this team has had staggering success like they pull out of kind of a four year bad rebuild they have two mediocre seasons

you know I didn't really have them particularly highly rated you know next season or in the next couple years. You know, they've had obviously the best of Werensky, including a Norris trophy winning season. You know, they had Marchenko, who I think just kind of came out of nowhere

and was a real fine for them. You know, I know they have your favorite Jet Grieves and Net, but like, I just haven't really been convinced by this team that this was going to really work out as a proper cup contender, even as they came out of that rebuild. And now they've just kind of

set up this entire like house of cars that is entirely contingent on the presence of zack warrensky to succeed and i you know like i mean the timing of where they say well we're going to meet with them after the draft we're going to discuss his options after the draft i mean i'm there were teams that had really high up picks in this draft that i feel like would have you know made very compelling offers for zack warrensky that it would have been worth exploring quite a long time ago you know I mean, San Jose being such an obvious example of it. Now, I feel like a lot is going to be kind of on hold around the NHL as teams wait to find out where he's willing to go to. I think that introduces a whole other question.

Like, is he going to be one of these players that only wants to go to at a certain number of destinations? You know, I mean, I see like least fans, you know, fancasting like, oh, what if, you know, he comes to Toronto and some kind of Matthew Nishter turn or something like that. but until we know where Zach Wrenski is willing to go, I don't think there's really any way that we can seriously speculate on on what this looks like. Would I like Zach Wrenski to be a San Jose shark? Sure. Does Zach Wrenski want to pay California taxes or whatever it is?

You know, God only knows. But from a Columbus Blue Jack's perspective, I mean, it really is just kind of the worst case scenario because this is a team that, you know, fairly or not, I think has been associated with mediocrity for essentially its entire existence, with the exception of, you know, one playoff series and then a couple kind of fun years

where they had Panarin and Jones and Wrenski on the roster. And the idea of them just staring down that barrel yet again, you know, and, yeah, you know, I mean, like, if Wrenski's gone and they're just building from scratch again, is Adam Fantilly going to want out? Like, we have to have these conversations again,

and it just seems like a constant churn with this team where I can understand why they felt the need to go and get Nitchikin and Garland and try to really convince these guys that they're building a winning program because the Columbus Boojahas have just never been a winning program. And it's disappointing to see, you don't like to see these hockey mad small markets really deal with a lack of success like this and mediocrity.

But I think that that's the position we're about to see them in where they're not really going to be in a position to fully tear things down. I don't know how much they're going to be fully bottoming out even if they do trade Warneski for futures. And it will remain to be seen whether they can even get a fair return forward Werensky based on the level of control that he exerts with his with his cause. I think the two situations are quite different. You know,

certainly in terms of caliber of player as much as I love Marchenko because of Werensky coming off these two unbelievable seasons and what he did last year and being recognized for it as a Norris winner. And then the fact that he signed under 10 million for two more years. And I do think a lot of the justification were kind of the lens through which they made a lot of these moves you talked about was under the guise of like, well, if we make it back to the playoffs and we show this can work and we're competitive, Wrenski's going on to stay. And I think that is kind of sound from the perspective of without having spoken to him personally,

just kind of reading the tea leaves and everything you hear about him. Like it seems like he wants to be in Columbus. He just wants to also as one of the, if not the best defender in the world, play competitive games and have a chance to win a Stanley Cup. And so I do think there's going to be some time to figure it out and there's not as much urgency. Whereas for Marchenko, he's playing at $3.85 million next year, but then he instantly becomes an arbitration eligible RFA, just one year out from UFA. And pretty much as soon as the season starts. And we've been talking about this on the show since last summer.

As soon as this season starts, you lose all your leverage. So you either need to extend them at this point or, try to maximize the return and the, you know, spots for him. We mentioned Utah. I think Buffalo, you know, Montreal has certainly been circling this. And the fit would be unbelievable in terms of getting the most out of Demadov and giving them another massive weapon in the top six. And I think Markchenko is just an unbelievable player.

Like he's such a stud and such an offensive weapon and a bonafide top line driver and is going to be worth the 11 million or whatever he signs for long term. But for Wrenski, it's a bit of a different. calculus and I know you mentioned the sharks there. I think the stars are very interesting here and it remains to be seeing how the Robertson situation plays out, but a package potentially built around Thomas Harley makes a lot of sense to me because he's a couple of years younger. He's locked in long term at 10.587 with no trade protection until 2027. I know he's coming off a rough year, but we saw the year prior when Hayskinin was out,

like he got thrust into that number one defenseman role where he really had the car keys to do everything, and I thought he looked great in that spot, and we'll see if he can kind of regain that form, but I think it's a very viable bet and not as massive of a downgrade for a prime age player, and then you could put together whatever you want in the package, whether it's Maverick Bork's rights or picks

or however you want to frame it. And honestly, you know, circling back to our conversation, about Robertson if the stars were able to pull that off because of the as trivial as it seems, the one million dollar gap or whatever between the two guys in Wrenzky and Harley, they could probably more easily just pay Ray Robertson what he wants if they did that. And I don't know if they want you ultimately as we talked about, but it provides some interesting scenarios and then obviously the fit of Werenski kind of taken on a lot of the offensive responsibilities and really allowing Hayskinin to play to his

strengths and not have to do as much as he's had to do the past couple years. I think that would be a no-brainer fit. So I think there's still a lot to be resolved here, but that would probably be the most interesting spot for me if he were to be moved. Yep. Yeah, no, I mean, that's not really an option that I thought of. I know that I had seen rumors about Werenski to Columbus possibly, and my first thought was just how that didn't really seem to make sense based on the

hand in his balance on the Dallas Stars roster. I do really like the idea of swapping Harley there. And I will say for as thing, when as I was about the blue jackets, I would feel a little bit better if they were maybe just kind of taking a downgrade, but moving back in terms of years and getting a player that's more aligned with the age of those young guys. So yeah, I think, you know, this is the summer edition of trades we'd like to see. I think that would be a win-win trade for everybody involved.

So wouldn't mind that at all. Yeah, I will say a while it wouldn't be a downgrade and the logic is very sound. I guess the question of where it ultimately gets you for Columbus while you have Wrenski in the roster is fair considering they didn't make the playoffs the past two years, but pretty much every bankable thing they had that looked good for them was because he was playing at the level he was

and really just kind of generating everything for them. And so I'm not sure where they'd ultimately be without that even if I do think of highly, of Harley as a replacement. All right, buddy, thank you for indulging me on this very long extended conversation at the end of draft weekend. I will let you promote some stuff because in particular,

leading up to free agency, even if the caliber of players isn't as high, we'll see a bunch of signings. And I'm sure our listeners are going to be very curious to familiarize themselves with the players their teams just signed. And I think your site is the best resource for doing so. So I'll let you talk about that a little bit. Yeah, I appreciate it.

Yeah. So hockey stats.com. We have not only player cards, interactive dashboards. We have scouting reports for over 300. HL players, including almost all the big names available. And we also have our draft page, which I think is live updating as we speak, because we're talking about halfway through the fourth round right now. You can find NHL equivalency prospect cards for every player who got drafted as well as currently drafted prospects and even prospects going back about 15 years or so. So if you're curious about that as well.

And then obviously keep an eye on J. Fresh hockey on Twitter. I'll be posting about every trade and signing that happened for the next little bit. Spending my Canada day next to a barbecue with my laptop out. Unfortunately, as has become a yearly tradition. But these are the things we suffer through to bring hockey content to the good people during the summer. A lot of Ryan Shea breakdowns ahead, a player you're very familiar with. All right, this is a lot of fun.

Give us a five-star review. Wherever you listen, subscribe to the PDOCs Patreon as well, have had a bunch of shows the past two weeks doing off-season blueprints. for various teams. We're going to keep that going and then various trade breakdowns as well. So join us there. If you want more content, we'll be back on Sunday, as I said, to talk more about the draft and get into the details of what went down on Friday and Saturday. That is all from us for today. Thank you for listening and subscribing to the HockeyPediocast.