The Hockey PDOcast - Watchability Rankings for 2024-25 NHL Season Part 1

Episode Date: October 8, 2024

Dimitri Filipovic is joined by Thomas Drance to do their annual Watchability Rankings for the upcoming NHL season. If you'd like to gain access to the two extra shows we're doing each week this season, you can subscribe to our Patreon page here: www.patreon.com/thehockeypdocast/membership If you'd like to participate in the conversation and join the community we're building over on Discord, you can do so by signing up for the Hockey PDOcast's server here: https://discord.gg/a2QGRpJc84 The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Media Inc. or any affiliate.

Progressing to the mean since 2015, it's the Hockey P.D.O.cast with your host, Dmitri Filippovich. Welcome to the Hockey P.D.O.Cast. My name is Dmitra Filippovich. And joining me here in studio is my good buddy Thomas Drens. Tom, it's a wonderful day. It's watchability rankings day here on the PEDAO cast. How's it going, buddy? I'm doing well. Thanks for having me. Excited. Today, we've got three games on tap. We're recording on Tuesday. I guess you might be listening to this tomorrow. So I shouldn't have said that, but this is great podcasting. And look, I mean, a full day feast of hockey.

I love that actually that there's a game starting early in the day. What's better than this? Who's got it better than us? Yeah, the start of the season's phenomenal. And this is a phenomenal day in particular here for us and our listeners because this has become an annual tradition for us. It provides us an opportunity to just genuinely have uninhibited fun, right? Like I think just based on the exercise itself. technically someone has to be ranked 32 here and so that may kind of have like a negative

connotation to it but I think really the way I'm viewing this and and I feel I think you feel the same way is it just gives us an opportunity to kind of geek out about every team highlight the fun things about them reasons to watch them especially because we're getting in a point now with this league and I feel like we've mentioned this a couple years in a row now but it really feels especially true this year there's just so much talent in the league right and in particular because of scoring being up so much games are never really in doubt or never really, you know, finalize until the final buzzer, teams always have a chance to come back. And that sort of forces teams that I think would otherwise, maybe their coaches

prefer that it's lower pace, lower scoring, grind out regular season wins. It forces teams to kind of speed up and get involved in just the nature of today's game. And so what that means from a viewership perspective for us is that every team is essentially playing fun games, right? There's going to be slogs along the way, especially as you get into the meat of the season. But for the most part, there's fun games across the board. Every team has at least one or two reasons for someone without any rooting interest to just tune in just to see what that player is going to do, especially the bad teams in the league this year, right? I think in the past years, it's been like, all right, Chicago or San Jose, they're 32 with a bullet here because it's so bleak, there's no reason to watch.

And even if they're going to lose a lot of games this year, Celebrini, Badar, like, those are such amazing young talents that we want to watch from the very beginning that you're going to tune in. And when we do this list, I think people are going to be like, wow, I can't believe those teams are that high. And this has nothing to do the standings. This is purely like, I want to watch these guys every step of the way in their career. We've reached this odd inflection point where the way we talk about hockey doesn't change as quickly as the product itself does. Right. And I think we can even fall into this trap, but certainly a lot of what I consume in terms of hockey content,

it focuses on that. When you look at where the game is at, when you look at sort of the end of, you know, what I call the fixed percentages era, you know, no offense to the name of your podcast, right? A world where save percentage has dropped significantly. A world where shooting percentage is on the rise. A world where in the decisive moments of games, star players are actually as likely as their stature to be the guys who make the difference as opposed to, you know, the Ruslan Fedetenko. hero game that we've enjoyed in the past. You know, we're getting NBA style dominant superstar playoff runs from the best player in the world. We, you know, have this influx of young talent that is wild. We're seeing like bigger forwards with, you know, more robust skill sets. We're seeing fourth lines built with guys who have first line scoring rates on it. We are seeing teams prioritize rush attacking, you know, up and down.

the lineup. I mean, the game itself, the product, the hockey is as exciting and fun as it's been in my lifetime. And, you know, one thing I hope for this year and hope to do over the course of the show is like, I hope that the conversation around the game reflects where we're at right now. Yeah, and some of the positive changes as opposed to like, you know, us all falling into the old, like, was this hit dirty? What's Arborzac guy doing? Should, You know, on and on and on. Like, I really hope that we can focus on the unprecedented skill level of the game this season. And I mean, the like royal we, your listeners, you and I, the media in general,

as opposed to getting bogged down in some of the like storyline obsessiveness that actually is kind of side show stuff, which, you know, honestly, is also less compelling than it used to be because the game is a little bit more straightforward. And just enjoy hockey for what it's giving us, which is some of the best. actual hockey we've seen in decades. I feel like I'm kind of aging like Benjamin Button as an analyst. And what I mean by that is I was sort of led to believe that the longer you do this, and I feel like this is kind of just like generally true for every industry, the longer you do something, you become kind of disenchanted with it, you see how the

sausage is made. And so you're just like, you come kind of kromagny, right? As you get older in your age, not that I'm necessarily becoming an old man, although sometimes I feel like it with my creaky knees. in the morning. But I feel like when I started this, I was so critical in a way of like the deficiencies in the sport and how teams were acting in terms of not realizing stuff like, oh, like this guy's shooting percentage is inflated. This isn't like a real thing. And so I was frustrated with the dialogue in that capacity. And then now as we get here to start of 2024,

2025 season, I feel like I'm just so appreciative of the fact that you get to just like watch these cool games and athletes playing at the highest level the sports ever seen. And that's fun. And so I think that's like I think the tenor of the show has generally started to gravitate really specifically in that direction of like there's going to be moments for us to be critical certainly and call out either bad play or bad decisions along the way. But in terms of just actual games and reasons to be excited, I'm, I feel like a kid again.

Well, and hockey will still fool you in terms of the players who are performing at a level that, you know, is unsustainable in the conversation, the manic conversation that... Right, the wild swings over the course of the season. And the, you know, the idea like, how could this player not be listed in the top 10 among NHL centermen? He just had whatever.

Right. And it's like, okay. You know, like, let's... You're talking about him like he's Nathan McKinnon. And I've watched Nathan McKinnon play. This guy's not Nathan McKinnon. Anyway, the... That still happens.

But I do also think there's like a pretty high baseline of competence right now. Like I'm thinking about watching that Monday night football game with Tomlin and Mike McCarthy toward the end of the game. And it's like, these guys are Super Bowl winners, like veteran coaches. And the decisions they're making, managing just like time on the clock is like wild. And I contrast that with, for example, how excited I am to watch Craig Barubei install a rush attacking system in Toronto or, you know, some of some of the stuff that I've

seen at Canucks training camp in terms like Rick Tock it trying to up. the volume of rush chances his team generates. And I'm just like, that's, there's actually like a level of tactical sophistication, I think, through and through hockey. There's not a lot of donkeys. And I think that's also part of where we're moving to with the product being in such a good place. There is some, I feel like I'm just blissfully ignorant to it right now because I'm just choosing. Like, eventually some, you're, eventually you're going to watch some team play

Uber conservative stress hockey and it's going to drive you mad. No question. All right. Well, let's save the hurricanes until we get into this list. But what I will say to that is I'm sure it's happening. I just feel like maybe because I'm just spending less time on Twitter because it's become so inaccessible and difficult to use for me. I have no real appetite or interest in like getting bogged down in conversations about top 20 rankings or bad hits and whether they should be suspensions and officiating and stuff like that. I feel like I'm finding myself just being more appreciative of the fun parts of it. And so that's going to be. sort of the basis of today's show. I think the other thing that helps, right? And this has been happening for a while now, but with the salary cap and with how our understanding of, I guess, like age curves and stuff,

we're just seeing teams incorporating young talent and fast-tracking it, right? And I think that's what helps here as well, whereas where a team like San Jose, for example, all of a sudden now you look and they just have this extremely explosive young talent that they're going to be incorporating into our lineup, And that's exciting for us. And so I'm sure they're going to be dreadful from a standings and a win-loss perspective, but that doesn't really matter here.

In fact, if anything, it could be kind of inversely correlated to the watchability rankings because I want to see wild back-and-forth games with bad defense. And that's typically what we get from young-skill teams. We're kind of learning the ropes at this level. Right. Or, yes. Well, no, no, I've just got good points to make, but I'll save them for when we get to the various teams. Okay, let's do it.

One final thing, then we really got to jump into this. Just I think people listening now have heard us talk about this for years, but just in case there's new people tuning in, whether it's on the podcast feed or on the radio and listening to us, what are we looking for here? Like how are you, what's our subjective criteria? What's the methodology? What are you striving for in these teams as you bump them up the rankings? For me, it's a combination of vibe, crowd, broadcast uniforms.

And then honestly, I think the most important, other than the young talent, is just the game unpredictability and volatility for me. I find the teams, as you'll see in this list, that I know exactly how they're going to play and how they're going to squeeze out wins aren't particularly appealing for me to watch in November and December. I know that I'll see them in April and potentially even further on into the spring. And so I feel like I don't necessarily need to be sitting on the edge of my seat for game 20 for them, whereas a team that is going to be pretty bad defensively, but also I think has a lot of

boring talent, I'm going to want to watch because I think there's just going to be a higher sort of probability, I guess, of a wild game that you have to be watching as opposed to like, all right, I know this team's going to win 3-1 on November 7th because that's what they do every year. Yeah. One thing that I really prize is the opportunity to watch, like, every time I've ever gone to a rink, knowing that I'm going to watch Crosby or knowing that I'm going to watch McDavid, right? There's a different vibe. Yep. Around that experience. Yeah. Like I'm, you know, walking on the seawall

to the game, I'm like thrilled, like so excited. And so there's a few players that I anticipate having an opportunity to watch in that manner. Having one of those guys. Yes. Sets you apart. Like that I'm, that's the number one thing. Probably my number one criteria is do you have the guy who I'm like, oh man, I get to watch Nathan McKinnon take predatory strides through the neutral zone before blowing me away with some incredible playoff the rush. Like, you know, that that experience looms very large for me in these rankings. Yeah, who's the player that the broadcast is going to, you know, when they like flash the graphic

of these two teams are playing and they like pick one player to show like their headshot as like who this, who you're going to watch. And I think of that as you and I are sitting at Bruhall last Monday. like Titans, Dolphins. It's Will Levis versus Snoop Huntley. I'm like, oh God, how do we get to this level? So I don't want to see that from your team. Let's get into it. The toughest part of this project for us, undoubtedly over the years, has been fighting

the urge to spend a disproportionate amount of time on the lower rank teams because we come out of the gate hot. We're excited to talk about them. Then we look up at the clock and we're like, we have 20 minutes left for the top 15 teams. So let's just quickly squeeze them in. It's become a great bit. But I think we're going to be able to do.

better today because we afford ourselves a little wiggle room with this two-parter. So let's get started with that. Number 32 on my list, Tom. The Calgary Flames. That's such a good pick. Now here's my argument for it. One, I think you just look at their sort of opening day lineup roster already an apparent woeful lack of talent.

I think they're also a great bet to strategically make themselves worse as the season goes along. Now, one of the complicating factors is that a lot of the guys that would theoretically be of interest to contenders, like a cadre and a Coleman, have a bunch of money owed to them and no move clauses as well, right? And so I think that's going to tie their hands a little bit

in terms of that. A guy like Rasmus Anderson, though, at a very palatable cap hit for the next two years, right shot D in his prime, I think he's going to generate a ton of interest. You could see guys like that moved. We already saw them telegraph what their intentions are last year around the trade deadline,

where they started selling off parts and accumulating as many futures as they could. And so here's one of my best bets for you this year. The Calgary Flames plus 1900 on Fandul to finish with the worst record. Behind teams like the sharks, blue jackets, ducks are ducks, Blackhawks and Montreal Canadians. Obviously, they have like enough competent veteran NHL players, right? That they're not just going to be like aggressively bad right out of the gate.

There's a certain level of competence to them. But based on what we saw last year and just projecting ahead to what this full season could look like for them, I feel like at those odds, they're a pretty interesting flyer for me as a team that could really just bottom out. And so for all those reasons, I'm not particularly excited to tune into their games. What do you feel about that ranking and kind of where would you have them? Oh, no, I love that they're toward the bottom of watchability. I think that makes a ton of sense. Now, I guess my one pause, the one thing that gives me a little bit of pause is, you're a Jonathan Hubert, okay. Well, I am a Jonathan

Huberto guy, but more than that, their power playing like the last 15 games of the season. And hey, we don't know if that's real. We don't know if that's, you know, all the other teams zoning out because they're playing the Calgary Flames late in the 2023, 2024 season. But when I think about it and when I think about Kuzmanko, Cadry, and Huberto, right, I don't have a ton of interest in what, in what that group can do five on five. But five on four, there could be some interesting elements there. Yep. For the most part, though, the guys that I really want to watch in Calgary...

Well, I want to watch a Conner's Erie. I certainly want to watch McKenzie Weger. Like, they have players. No, but the guys I really want to watch are not on the team's... Braden Pakal? Yeah, no. Well, Braden Pakal. No, but it's Zane Perak and it's Bashar.

Of course, yes. You know what I mean? But that's down the road. That's what I'm saying. So it's just like, I think there will be a time where the Calgary Flames shoot up our rankings, but this season's not it. this season is going to be, I think, pretty miserable. Organizational, I feel way better about where they're at right now than I did this time last year.

Like, I think they made very important initial steps to not being a middling, mediocre team and actually having a bright future. I just think there's going to be some lumps along the way I kind of want to get ahead of it here. And this is a bit of a sort of projection on my part as well. I think it's also a reflection of what we just said. Like, compare this to past 30-second ranked teams that we've had on these lists. and it was just so hopeless in terms of no real even top light NHL players to speak of. This obviously isn't the case with this team. There are still former stars and guys who can still play at a high level.

I just think in terms of the total package and where I expect them to be in the standings this year, I think if you're having to pick on a busy Saturday night with a bunch of teams playing, I would have them lower on my list, and I think that's the rationale. Yeah, I mean, at least they have three first round picks this year. Entering the season with three first round picks is nice. Well, they have 10 picks in the top three rounds over the next two years. Like that's, that's key. And after the draft they had as well, like, that's something to definitely build on.

And at least they're finally going to give Dustin Wolf some run. So that's the other sort of side plot that I'm at least interested in watching. This guy should be really sick. So they have a Lamborghini. They brought him back as well. And so. Got to give him the watchability show. Of course.

They didn't just bring him back, but they're going to play them a lot. Of course. They prioritized them, as they should have. And then, and then also just shout out to Blake Coleman for being. Like, you know, Lomberg's as fun as it gets on the fourth line. But Blake Coleman from a, you know, like a my guy's criteria perspective, just in terms of the two-way reliability, the like constant effort. Like, no matter how miserable this team is,

you're going to see Blake Coleman frustrate the heck out of some star players and do some cool stuff himself. Love watching and play. So there's at least some stuff to be hopeful about and watch. But, yeah, I agree with you. They should be low. and I do like them as a best bet for worst record. The reality is someone has to be low on this list.

And it's really not even meant to be taken as a negative. It's just the reality situation. Well, and if you go look at the points over unders, like they're at 81.5, like 20 points ahead of San Jose and solidly 10 points clear of the ducks. And I think there's a very realistic possibility that we get to mid-November and we're looking at the flames, the ducks, and the sharks as very much in the same tier.

or one of the California teams having escaped that. I think the only way that Calgary does is if Dustin Wolf comes in and is unbelievable, which I'll leave the light on for. I'll be rooting for that. That would sound like an awesome story. Yeah, but I'm going to dim it down. Yes. Okay, number 31 on my list, this pains me because a couple weeks ago heading into this exercise

as I started thinking about it, I thought they'd be much higher. And then as we look now on the eve of opening night, the Columbus Blue Jackets. and part of this is we just got news as well that our guy, Dmitri Varancov, is out long term with an injury and the prognosis does not sound good. Boone Jenner as well as out long term. I think there's a lot of future pieces to be excited about here.

I'm very happy that Adam Fantilli will be back because I really enjoyed watching him before he got hurt last year. I was actually thinking, I'm not sure if he's going to start the year with the team because he just got to sign back to the H.L. That might just be a transactional move. But Denton Metechuk,

who we loved as a prospect looked awesome in the preseason. Take that for what it's worth. But I assume he'll get some run this season on this team as well. And so there is young talent in place. I just, I think we had them pretty high last year because I was excited about all these young pieces. And then it just didn't really materialize. I know they mercifully made a coaching change. But I got to see it to believe it, I think.

And so I have them down here. I'm willing to move them up as the year goes along if some of these young players start immediately producing out of the gate. But I've got them here on my list. I think that makes sense. Now, I want to shout out a best bet here, though, because if you're talking about playoff odds, okay, to make the playoffs,

the lowest team in the league is plus 1,600, is the San Jose Sharks. The second lowest team in the league is plus 1,400. That's the Columbus Blue Jackets. Then you've got the Ducks, Blackhawks, Montreal, Canadians, Calgary Flames. Calgary Flames, by the time you get to them, you're at plus 290.

Yep. given what I see is the potential impact of the coaching change, the upside case from a guy like Adam Fantilli taking a major step back, the positive impact that a coaching change could have on a player like Kent Johnson. Yeah. Well, there's certainly Talisman plays that keeps the door open for them to shoot up. There is no reason, though, in my view, for them to have playoff odds comparable to the San Jose Sharks and the Anaheim Ducks,

even. I mean, even with the duds. looks, look, I guess it's explained by the quality of the division, right? The Metro seems to be more of a knife fight than the Pacific. The Pacific's a little more stratified. But I do kind of like, if you were looking for like a long shot to make the playoffs, but I feel like Columbus is your best value. So I do want to at least note that they could be a lot of fun,

but it's going to a lot hinges on what Dean Eveson can accomplish. And to his credit, I think he's kind of thought of as, I don't know, I don't know he's thought. I was going to say I think he's thought of as kind of generally more of an old school coach. Part of that might just be the association with the Minnesota Wilde as well, right? Because they just never get that love in terms of like being a fun team, even though under him they certainly had stretches where they were very exciting to watch. And to his credit, he really just gave free reign to a talent in Carol Caprizov to just essentially do whatever he wants

and play his game and funnel their entire offense through him, right? I don't know if they're necessarily at least right now heading into this season. They have a talent at that echelon. I think there's certainly a couple guys that could eventually get there or something approaching that along the way. But at least the fact that we've seen him do that and not just immediately try to sort of, you know, rein him in and be like, all right, you're not going to play that type of way here

when you come to the NHL. I think that is exciting and gives hope that this Blue Jackets team will play fundamentally differently. Now, give any other notes on them or do you want to keep on? Yeah, let's keep on. I've got four teams here. I teared that I struggled to differentiate. And we're already getting into a very difficult part

where I feel like my excitement level for teams isn't necessarily reflective of what that number is. It's just they have to be here. The Seattle Cracken, the St. Louis Blues, the New York Islanders, and the Minnesota Wild. Okay. The blues were under Craig Barouba. And then even when Bannister took over,

they didn't really change that much from their profile. They were a high rush team. I still expected it to be that with. guys like Thomas and Kyru, right? They bring in Holloway, who now, by the way, I think once we recorded our guys, he was kind of playing on the third line on their projected depth chart, and now he's bumped up to the top line. So that's a big W for our show so far.

They have talent in place. I think fundamentally, though, or philosophically, this is where I stand with a team like this. I need a certain level of blue line talent to make it work for me because you need to have guys who can very reliably function. within an offensive scheme of moving the puck up. Now guys like Pareko and Falk can certainly move the puck. Yeah, I still think Peraco's got game, but I just don't know.

There's a lot of foot speed there. And ultimately, where I struggle with them is, I know they were kind of hovering around the playoff bubble until late, into last season after the coaching change. I just don't know what the upside is here in terms of like, do you need to tune into them in early November because you want to be able to appreciate them in April when they're like, one of the core teams that you need to care about down the stretch,

I don't really see that as a realistic scenario for them. And so for me, I think they can play some fun games. I just think in terms of like what it's going to mean at the end of the year, I couldn't get there with moving them any higher here. And so that's why I had them in a tier with other teams that I think you can make a similar case for. I think you've got them in the right spot. The fact that I'll always be excited to watch giant players,

like giant wingers in particular play skilled hockey, whether it's Pavel Boosnevich or, um, obviously Holloway, but also like I love myself, my, I love me some Alexei Toropchenko. Yeah. From an entertainment value standpoint. I still think Pareko's got game, but I think you're right about this defense, um, you know, adding Ryan Suter to it sort of really puts the cherry on top of this particular Sunday. Yep. The blues should be fun.

There are players that I will be excited to watch on a nightly basis. But I think you've got them in the right tier. Well, as we go on, if I list a team along the way and you're like, you know what, I'd rather have the blues here. I'm open to hearing that. As much as there are players that I find exciting to watch, I'm not going to spend too much time being like, and so they have to go higher given that your tier also includes Barzell and. Of course.

And Caprizov. And then the Cracken, who added fun players with skating ability. And have Maddie Baneers. Yes. Who, when he's playing swashbuckling hockey the way he did, you know, in his rookie season, when he had that swagger. I mean, that was a blast, not to mention Jared McCann shooting and on and on.

There's a ton of things I enjoy watching about the cracking generally. I actually think the Wild are the team that I'd push back on the most. I think the Wild should be a lot more fun this year. I still don't really understand what happened to them last season. There was games or moments where they played remarkable hockey in my view. you've got some upside there in Marco Rossi you've got some boldie for sure boldie yeah you've got some power you've got some interesting in my view uh sort of upside pieces that could hit this upcoming season Liam Ogren in particular is a guy I want to be very very high on entering the season

would have picked him as my guy but I felt like it was a little too niche and he hasn't played a game yet marat kuznetinov yeah for sure but augerine's the guy yeah augerine's the guy that I think is more likely to make an immediate impact for them this season. And then Caprizov. So I also want to spotlight a couple of bets. Liam Ogren, who probably doesn't play opening night unless Boldy doesn't make it back, is plus 3,000 for most rookie goals. Just keep an eye on that because that's a guy who I think has a very NHL-ready toolkit

from a physical maturity standpoint. and I'd be keep an eye on that one I feel like there's pretty good value there given some of the other players valued in and around there and then here's honestly probably my single favorite bet going into like my favorite single long shot future going into the season is curil caprisov is 20 to 1 to have the most power play points in the league it's wild team I like I get it look in everyone's minds they're like, well, how is he going to beat McDavid? And McDavid's plus 170 and didn't even lead the league in power play points last year. In fact, was well short of Kuturov, who's 5 to 1, by the way.

I also like that. We can get back into that later. The Wild had like the fifth lowest power play shooting percentage. No, granted, that's not necessarily going to regress. We think that teams can sustain inflated percentages a little bit more directly in special teams' environments. But 20 to 1 for Caprizov? I mean, opportunity knocks here. If that power play can get to finishing it, a league average clip,

he's going to be in the mix, and you can get that at 21. That's phenomenal value. Maybe the best value on the board. Yep. I like that. I mean, listen, the wild have also in the past had these blowups where they get into these really fun game environments. They had that one year where they just kept pulling the goalie and scoring an obscene amount of goals to rally back late.

So, like, they have that within their range of outcomes. I like these teams. Like, I'm going to be tuning into all of these teams, right? Like, the Islanders, the connection with Horibat and Barzal last year was legitimately fun. They played much more aggressively when Patrick Waugh took over. No Adopsons playmaking from the Blue Line. And I know your appreciation of his skating stride and how he tucks or untucks his jersey is a big selling point. It's the Madano jersey flapping in the wind.

You love the flapping in the wind. So there's elements here where I'm very excited about. We're already getting into the range where I feel like these teams are almost must watch. But Caprizov is the guy of the teams in this tier who, Who is... He can do stuff. They have like three other people on the planet. Who is destination viewing for me.

Yep. And who I'm excited to get a chance to watch whenever I get a shot at it. I also just think his stock is gone way too low because of what was a disappointing and sort of miserable wild season all around last year. Yep. This guy remains, you know, truly one of the absolute giants in the game. And I can't wait to watch. He had like a 30 or 40 game stretch last year where he had like a point or he was factoring into like 50% of their goals. for this like half the season stretch

and it was just like what he was doing if they had been better he would have been in the legitimate MVP conversation they just didn't have the talent around him let's take our break here our first one he was Western Conference Crosby last season yes the first time that comp has ever been made

we're gonna take our first break here when we come back we're gonna jump right back in it and keep going with our watchability rankings you're listening to the hockey PEDEO cast streaming on the SportsNet Radio Network Hey it's Big Nazar have your say and join me on the people show with big takes and even bigger bets, weekdays three to four on SportsNet 650, or wherever

you get your podcast. All right, we're back here on the HockeyPedio cast with Thomas Drans. We're doing our watchability rankings for the 24-25 season. Tom, we're already getting into the weeds here. Number 26 and number 25, I have lumped together. And this is why I had that disclaimer off the top. This has nothing to do with projections for standings and how good they're going to be this season.

26. The Boston Bruins. 25. The Carolina Hurricanes. Stop smirking at me like that. Both are too low. Both are too low.

I just have... Do I hear my next tier? Sure. The Ottawa Senators, Montreal, Canadians, Buffalo, Sabres, San Jose, Sharks, Chicago, Blackawks, and I'm ducks. I have a young team tier ahead of them.

Just because all those teams, teams are going to be worse than them. I'm not disputing that. I just, I know exactly what I'm going to get. I know the Bruins made a lot of changes in terms of personnel, right? Bringing in Zedorov and Linholm. There's talent there. Pasturac

is the top 10 player in terms of just pure, viewing, like aesthetics. Marchand, too. They're a fun team. I just know, like, I think they don't have a lot of motivation to get into these crazy back and forth games. They actually might be one of the teams that I think will try

to grind out games. Yep. And And we also just got to watch them go through two rounds of the playoffs as well. We're going to have teams that won't even further them higher, obviously. That doesn't preclude you from being high on this list. It's just like, I've seen this Bruins team. I know what they're going to do. I know how they're going to play. And it's not bad.

It just doesn't, the range of outcomes for me isn't necessarily as high as some of these other teams where I just think they're going to get into more fun games. I think the, look, I've got a. if you've got Pasternak and Marchand and Nikita Zadourav, you should be average at worst. Nikita Zedorov alone. So you think I should have had them in this middle tier with the Canucks, Golden Knights, and Jets? Absolutely. Okay. That's fair.

Absolutely. That's where I would put the Bruins for sure. You're the guy who had the Blackhawks last year, like fifth on your list or something. Yeah, wanted to watch Bedard, and it paid off. It was amazing. And so that's how I feel about Celebrini. Not that he's the type of caliber prospect, but close enough that I want to watch. especially with Will Smith in combination.

Are ducks? I don't think I need to present the argument for you for why I have them that high. I'll watch a truly clinical amount of ducks hockey this year. Although I'd say like Greg Cronin had the ducks playing, you know, an educational brand of hockey. Yes. From a shut it down perspective throughout last season. So, you know, I'm not. Did you see that, I lily Bushan interview?

I didn't. He had this interview. where he was complaining about how like Greg Cronin was spending so much time, I think essentially I'm paraphrasing here, correct me if I'm wrong, but Greg Cronin was just spending a bunch of time like not actually in these team meetings, not actually doing anything hockey related.

And then like eventually they would start watching video and he's just like, oh my God, he was wasting so much of my time. Interesting. Oh, yeah, a L'Bushkin. What a, what a flamethrower. And well, you know, also that's probably a vet versus a young group that a coach is like trying to connect with and trying to explain things.

Build habits and stuff for sure. Right. And also honestly, probably trying to figure out different ways to communicate, right? Like trying to figure out different ways in. That would be my assumption. And I can understand why that would be frustrating for a seasoned guy like Lubushkin to go through, right? I mean, that might be a clash of perspectives as opposed to a substantive criticism of Cronin's method of doing business. Because one thing I would say is, you know, Ronan had that exciting Ducks team, that talented Ducks team, playing exceptionally conservative grind out wins hockey down the stretch of last season,

trying to win 2-1 with a roster that was going to lose 3-2. But nonetheless, they were positionally sound. They were not an easy night down the stretch for anybody. It's just that they also weren't a fun watch for me. So, you know, the Ducks, I see the upside case. I love watching Troy Terry. I love watching Mason McTavish. We're going to see Cutter Goce playing with Carlson, right?

You're going to have McTavish and Zegrois right now, Troy Terry, and then the blue line of Minchikov, Zellweger down the road. They've even got Tristan Luna on the lineup. Like Radco Goudis, like there's just players that I like here. I'm not sure what it's going to amount to as a collective, but there's enough individual talent there where I do want to have my eye closely to into their games. Yeah, no, I think that's fair.

There's a downside case that I think shouldn't be ignored based on how conservatively they approach the sort of second half the meat of last season. The Bruins, I mean, there's so much going on. But in addition to Pasternak, who I will say, I love watching play, but I don't love, he works better for me on television because he does some stuff really slow line changes, like some stuff that just bothers me in. and when I watch him in person, I know this is, now I'm getting comming. You're the commodgingy old hockey guy. 100%.

Yeah. But you know what? It reminds me a lot. He's got some habits that, um, that like remind me of the worst years of watching Conucks hockey. So I think I have a particular response to it. Sounds like he needs some video sessions with Great Cronin.

With Rick talking. Yeah. Anyway, no. The, I mean, obviously, uh, they're fine.

Like, I'm not criticizing him by any means. But, but it does detract a little bit from my enjoyment of watching them play when I, when I get the opportunity to watch them live. Um, I feel like the main person that I'm always excited to watch with the Boston Bruins is the black magic that makes the Bruins make zero sense. Rationally, I don't understand how they keep doing this.

And then somehow they keep pulling it off. They're like a trapeze artist or a tightrope walker at this point. I've been waiting for 10 years for them to fall in some meaningful manner. And somehow they keep avoiding it with like 50 point seasons from Pavel Zaka or, you know, some guy named. Mason Lorai is really good now. And like I'm always, oh, dude, and don't even get me started on Brasso. You know, Brad Marchand's evolved into one of the five best two-way wingers in hockey.

They kill penalties aggressively. I'm actually pretty excited to watch Lindholm, for example, operate with either Marchand or Pasternak in primary playmaker roles. And sort of one thing I think is kind of interesting is like most shots, if you go look at the like most shots futures. Pasternak has the best odds alongside McKinnon, but I think there's a real world where Pasternak has to adapt as he did last year, but even more so potentially,

into being more of a playmaker. Yeah. I think he's, at this point of his career, he's actually suited to it because last year he showed big strides in terms of using, you know that when you get to that next level as a shooter seeing the game where like, you realize that sometimes you're shot just existing on the ice is just as dangerous as the actual act of shooting.

For sure. And so you're sucking in defenders and then doing that one touch pass into the slot and stuff like that. And that probably will benefit a guy like Glennholm quite a bit who essentially just posts up in the slot and is waiting to tap that puck home.

Well, he's sick at the net front and he's sick at working in... Finding the soft spots. Yeah, working to find quiet ice. And so I think the fit there is potentially really interesting. And so if we see evolution in Pastornak's game, if we see Pastornak, first of all, work on those line changes,

but also just generally begin to, figure out a new way to dominate as one of the most gifted offensive players in the game. Like that to me is the sort of evolution that I love to watch from star players. And then you get Nikita Zedorov taking wild chances with the puck. I mean, honestly, this guy's a watchability All-Star. And he has been for years, right? Like, there is no world in which the opportunity to watch Zadora of in, you know, like, sort of smart enough to play to the don't poke the bear crowd in Boston,

just like mack trucking guys, taking absurd chances with the puck, and the way that the Boston crowd's going to react to him. Yes. I mean, that's, that's, that's going to be a special thing.

I'm pretty confident. So yeah, I mean, you put that all together. I think the Bruins, not only do I think the Bruins should be in that Winnipeg, Canucks, Vegas tier,

I think there's an argument for them to be ahead of it. given some of the sort of between the lines. I'm really fascinated to watch play out this season. Yeah, there are a few wrinkles there. I'm willing to concede that. Yeah, I think Zedorov's going to be so fun there. Like everything we saw in the postseason, the post whistle smirks, the end-dans rushes, the heat checks. Yeah, the preposterous quotes, like everything about it.

It's Nikita Zedora of time. My favorite Nikita Zedorov quote. The hurricanes, though, I'm not willing to concede on that. No, that's fine. I'm not, I'm honestly not going to push that hard until. they get some talent, like until they get some different players in the lineup. Because I think what we're looking at with the Hurricanes, you know, I don't believe that the hurricane's style of play exists in conflict with the act of winning in the playoffs.

But I know you do. And I've been proven correct. Well, they haven't broken through yet. Yes. But I don't think it's a style thing. I think it's a in time, in time, as, you know, you accumulate more talent and as, say, Jordan Martinuke and Jordan Stahl's minutes get replaced by players with, you know, a higher likelihood of threatening to score.

Yes. And I thought, honestly, I think we saw this play out last year with Jake Gensel. Like, fundamentally, I don't think. 100%. And they rose up my watchability rankings as it was 100%. Of course. So they're not going to be there to start the season. So that's why I'm absolutely not going to push back on this.

But if they make another move of that caliber, then I'm willing to revisit that. Or if, you know, down the stretch of the season, guys like Jackson Blake or Bradley Nadeau end up in the lineup, you know, down the line when the, when Nikitian comes over, stuff like that, I think is going to fundamentally change my desire to watch this team play. But I think early in the year, I don't have a problem with them being ranked relatively low. Well, here's the thing. After the Gensler acquisition, I think part of that was a concession on there. part of having to change a little bit. Part of it was, I think, just having a guy like Gensel allowed them to play this way. They became more of a rush team, a more of a puck-pac-perating team as opposed to a dump team. They certainly still had elements of that.

But they did fundamentally change the way they played. Unfortunately, now they don't have Gensel anymore there. And I think it's just a matter of waiting to fill that role again, right? Because I don't think Jack Roslovich is going to be an equivalent talent in that regard, right? I think he's certainly got pep to his step, and he's going to have moments of individual brilliance in the cumulative, though, a bit to be desired. So, yeah, it's more about what,

it's more about the Ndow Blake tier and then eventually what they add. I mean, you know, it wasn't just Gensel, right? Like the hurricanes were the team kicking the tires most aggressively on Patterson. I mean, this is a team that wants to add skill. I think they have a clear-eyed view of what they need, which is to graft additional skill onto this roster. But in a world where we're going to see, like, a lot of Martinuke and stall, and God bless them, great two-way players, play top six minutes,

you know, I think it's fair for them to be a well below average team in the watchability rankings, even if I admire how they get the job done. You can want, not O, but what you're going to get in the meantime is 14 shot attempts from Brembren's night. So if that's something you really want to watch, then go for it. Yeah. It's not necessarily for me. I'm not totally opposed. to it.

I will say. What I'm saying here, though, is like, I was kind of hinting at them when I said the predictability element. Like, I could map out for you the beats that a Hurricanes game is going to hit. And so for me, it's like, I can know when to tune in,

it went to tune out, and I'm not necessarily prioritizing having them on if one of these younger teams is popping off the page. And we know we're going to watch a ton of them in the spring. Of course. Now this next year,

I was stunned as I was doing this, and you can tell me if I'm just being too reactionary to the first initial viewings, because we do have the benefit of having watched the Sabres and the Devils already play two games. My concerns heading into the season were I liked, in theory, the moves they made on the margins to bring in guys like McLeod and Malenstein and Lafferty, who are like high motor grinders to, I guess, supplement or insulate their top young guys. The issue is, we,

think of them still as this sort of explosive high power scoring team that they were two years ago when they burst onto the scene. Last year, they were 23rd in the league in overall scoring. They were 28th on the power play. First two games against New Jersey, and they might just wind up being a really good suppressing defensive team because of their own skating ability. But the Sabres generated two goals in two games, zero power play goals in 12 minutes. And I think maybe at this point, we need to just embrace the potential that we need to sort of revisit how we imagine. in the sabers and the way they play at our mind, right? Because I think we still think of them as that team they were in 22, 23,

when we were so excited about them. And it's been a bit of a while since we've seen that. So there's just so much scoring burden here on not only Tage Thompson, but also their defensemen to drive offense, right? Guys like Byram and Power and Dahlia, because you looked up and down the lineup in the forward group, and you're probably not going to get it from the bottom six. And so in that case, it's like if those guys aren't scoring,

and it's very dicey to rely on your defensemen to drive scoring in that capacity. Very few guys can actually meaningfully do it. All of a sudden you're going to a point where it's like, all right, what is this team going to be? And so that's where I'm at with them right now. I wish they were higher. I thought they'd be higher. But I have them in this tier with some of these other young teams that are kind of unproven. I think that's right.

I think we're going to see that warp speed, them try to execute that warp speed, Lindy-Russ style that we saw with the Devils. There's enough skill here that I'm still. going to watch a lot of them. Like, without question. Yeah, especially when they're wearing the goathead uniforms. Yeah, and I know there's already pressure on them because, again, they've, they've unfortunately already lost two games relative to the rest of the teams we're talking about.

So it almost feels like their first game in North America is a must win. Just from the outside looking in. Like, I think players around the league are already looking at it and thinking about it. One thing that I was surprised by was I did think the top line against the devils looked a little outmatched? In game one they did for sure. For sure. Yeah, they were a bit better in game two. A bit better. But I'm worried about it. That might also be reflective

of like the devils are back, baby. And we're going to talk more about that later on in the show. And that's what I hope it is. Yes. That's what I hope it is. But I suppose I had some top of the lineup concerns watching them play that I didn't expect to. And you're right. It may just be a matter of they bumped into a legitimate contender.

But yeah. So I think you're right, though. We're going to see them play some, you know, Lindy Rough style, Rick Tawket style hockey with that bottom six on the ice. A lot of like cardio kings doing a good job defensively while suppressing chances both ways. I do think that's on the menu for the Sabres this upcoming season. I suspect it will work in terms of making them, you know, more successful outside the top of their lineup than they were last season. But I don't know that it's going to be something that's as appointment, an appointment viewing. experience for me relative to what I would have thought if you'd ask me this question in August.

Do you have any other notes on the teams in this tier? The senators, Canadians, we did the sabers now, sharks, Blackhawks, ducks. I think we, I think our thoughts on the ducks are well documented. We don't necessarily need to expand on that. I mean, and I don't do you just the, just the, just the Maclin Celebrity of it all, which is that I don't think people are prepared for quite how good this guy is, um, for the fact that he absolutely belongs, you know, coming right after Baderd. You know, I feel like there's just not enough hype around him. Whereas this guy's, like, this guy's not a, you know, one of those 101 years where, where you don't have a Tavares or Stamcoast quality process. Like, he's in that group. And he's going to be a must, like, he's going to be

appointment viewing from the jump here. He's plus 300, by the way, to lead all rookies and points. So I wanted to at least spotlight that bet before we leave this tier of teams. Yeah, well, I think assuming health, and he's already been banged up a little bit, but assuming health, I think he's a great bet for them to essentially funnel everything through him, both on the power play and 5-1-5. Imagine being William Eklund, because you're like, you have this last year where you're just in a desert without water, essentially. He has this one game near the end of the season, which I loved so much against the blues, where I think he scores two goals, and then he scores a Hattra goal in overtime to win it. And it was like, Hat Day or something.

in the arena. And so all of these like straw hats and fedora started being thrown on the ice. And then he put one of them on and started celebrating with it. And I was like, I'm in. I love William Eklund. And I already did before. But now all of a sudden he looks up and he's like, oh, I'm playing with Celebrini and Tyler DeFoli. Like this is an actual top NHL scoring line. This is very exciting. So I'm incredibly happy for him because he went through a lot last year, certainly. And so I wish the blue liners on this team were a bit more advanced because I think the forward talent is actually, and this may be encouraging for like they could play, get into some fun, high scoring games, because I think they do have some pop certainly up front. The issue is the blue

line you look and it's like, I know, I like that they got Walman. Yes. Right. And I think he can certainly, with his skating ability and his swag can add elements to that. You've got the Cody CC unintentional comedy factor, which I think should not be dismissed. Um, but I wish there was more like, I wish their defense right now was in sync with where the forward. group is at right now right and that's obviously the next step for them yeah uh in this developmental arc um but that's the one thing that i think could be a drawback in terms of like uh we've seen 10 games of them and it's just not really functional because of that well and and you know eventually you're going to want that not just because you're going to need it but also because celebrini you know

grew up with a brother who was a high level defenseman right a year older than him as celibriini played um played a sort of sort of up in age group and then also obviously it be you last year played with Lane Hudson. And they actually had a two-man game, right? Like when you watched BU play, there was like a pronounced two-man game that Hudson and Celebrini would play together that was electric, flat-out incredible.

Some might argue too good for the level. It was absolutely too good for the level. And so, you know, I think there's something natural to Celebrini about working off of high-end defenders. They got to get one. They do. that. And speaking of Hudson, like that's almost, I think there's elements to this Habs team. Like, I really enjoy watching Nick Suzuki play. I thought he had an awesome year last year. Slavikoski

took a big stride. There's pieces there in place. But I think the selling point for me is like that little, because I don't really watch that much college hockey, but that one little dose at the end of the season that we got from late Hudson and then some of the preseason stuff, I'm sold. Like I want to see more of it and I want to see him making plays from the blue line and doing all the stuff that makes him such an electric talent. And so that's enough of a selling point for me. And I think the team is like bad enough on the edges that I do think they're going to be, there's games that they're going to be down like 5-1 early in the second period. And then all of a sudden it's like, all right, now they scored a couple of power play goals. Layton did some cool

stuff. And I'm back in. I want to be watching this game. I'm pretty in, but I'm not convinced yet. And I guess this is going to be fun to watch is finding out whether or not Hudson really has the escapeability. You know what I mean? To play big minutes at his size, given the way that this game works. There's no questioning the offensive skill, right? But how many times have we gone down this road

with guys like Bachfist? You mean like in his own like the four-tracker breathing down on him? Because I think he's already shown enough like on the offensive zone blue line. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Where it's like he's going to make people miss and get the puck to where it needs to be. I'm talking 200 foot escapeability. You know, that's where there is a gap between Quinn Hughes and him for, example, or young Quinn Hughes and him. Yeah. Right. I think he's got the hands. I think he's got

the intelligence. Um, does he have that ability to escape pressure, evade pressure, beat guys up ice, be a one man breakout, um, because there's no doubt that he can do some sensational stuff on ice. I just, I just, we've seen this so many times. The hurdle, like the level that you have to be able to jump over with as a player with this profile, in terms of, I just, I just, we've seen this. I just, terms of your ability to key the transition game, in terms of your ability to feel and beat pressure is so high. And the gap, the gap between those players who just jump over it and don't becomes enormous. And so I'm excited to see Lane Hudson, but I think this is a very volatile, from a watchability perspective, this is a very volatile player as we enter this

season. It could be one of the best watches in the sport. It could literally be 10 minutes a night. Yep. That's fair. Do you think I needed to have the Blackhawks hire based on where we had them last year and then the level to which Conradar delivered on that promise? And then the fact that they brought in a couple of guys who are legitimately fun players along the way as well? Probably. I mean, I just think it made sense from like a stylistic tier to have them in there. I think it does. I think it does. I don't know. like I've been really enjoying the Connor Bedard revenge tour in preseason. I definitely,

this guy is definitely going to be a top five must watch players for me as an individual. They've also added some players who play styles of hockey that I don't love, from like an individual attacking perspective. Like there's only so much appetite that I have for Ilya McAyev and Athanasia off the rush, like attacking downhill with very limited chances of, of East West passing place. I think they'll be more fun on the power play with Terra Vinen,

but look, I think they're fine to be in a roughly average tier. Like, I'd put them at the top of this tier, but I think they're fine in this tier. I'd probably have them ahead of Winnipeg. I're messing with my list. I feel like Winnipeg makes more sense for what the teams I've lumped them with, but that's okay. I think there's like a bridge between those two,

and you can tinker with that if you want. All right, Tom, let's take another break here. We're going to switch over to part two of our watchability rankings, PDOCAS. We actually made it pretty much halfway through the league in part one. I'm very proud of us. We're on the right track here. So we're going to take a break here, jump to part two, and then when we come back, we'll jump right back into it. You're listening to the HockeyPedocast streaming on the Sportsnet Radio Network.