The Hoely Hour - E134 Blame The Puritans

Episode Date: April 28, 2023

Have you ever groped for trout in a peculiar river? (You probably have.) Amelia shares euphemisms for sex and their origins followed by a story about the "weirdest" orgasm she's ever had. Liz talks about the 6 stages of relationships and when most couples break up. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

now it's called a sneaky link for the kids listening strange is what a sneaky link used to to mean yeah back in my day when i was your age i used to walk uphill both ways welcome to the holy hour a podcast about sex relationships mental health and everything in between i'm amelia sanson and i'm liz ball follow us on instagram and tiktok at the holy hour i'm on instagram and tiktok at amelia samson and i'm on instagram and tiktok at liz ball so hard you can also watch us on youtube or listen ad free on patreon at patreon.com slash the holy hour check out our merch at theholyhour.com and email us your spicy stories at holy hour podcast at gmail.com oh my god speaking of adult baby i learned like a new kink where people like it's

a diaper kink like they'll like wear diapers like they're babies but then like they'll like completely dress themselves in diapers they'll like it's like an abc party but like not a party they just go out with like they like cover their arms in diapers and like their legs they do like leg warmers they want everything to be diapers weird and it's like part of the kink being completely covered in diapers um jordan peterson oh god not a good transition i think it was today he tweeted he tweeted a picture of a cisgender heterosexual couple so man and a woman and the man has a baby kink and somehow he circled it back to the gay community and dylan mulvaney specifically why and i was like how could you why would you look at a picture of a straight couple

doing their weird kink and think it was specifically gay because it's it's not queer that doesn't make any i'm sure queer people have kinks obviously yeah that doesn't make any sense like no in my experience straight men have the weirdest kinks dylan mulvaney is really getting it like she's really getting the brunt of all of this it's so fucking stupid you see people are like driving over like their packs of bud light because like they did a deal with her you already bought it like the fucking babies also like yeah they already have your money why do you care that much yeah it's like it's weird that i i was uh watching someone i can't i don't know who the person is they were like answering a question in an interview and he basically

explained how trump made these people think that politics were their identity and yeah i found a list of euphemisms for sex oh and i thought that was an interesting article because it says like the origin of them and like a lot of them date back to like well a very like hundreds and hundreds i love a good origin i you know i love the linguistic origin you do you're big into the lore of things just things just you just love lore i do love lore you mentioned lore twice last week it's it's a word that i am using often now yeah it's a good word yeah do you ever find a word that you're like i'm gonna find a reason to use this word all the time and i usually use it incorrectly i do that as well thank you for saying that but i

think i figured it out that's great at least i figured out lore that's fantastic sounds right to me how you've been using it thank you um okay so I'm just gonna read a few there's 130 of them so I'm obviously not gonna do all those I'm just gonna read the ones that there are origins for okay um all right make the beast with two backs it's a line from Shakespeare um in Othello dates back to the 1500s that reminds me of an episode in that 70s show I probably have mentioned this before but one of the characters is like donna and eric are finally gonna make the beast with two backs and then fez is like the bacosaurus oh my god that's really funny i want to re-watch that 70s show i watched that that 90s show or whatever the one that's like yeah is it a

flop it fucking sucked it like reads as like a disney like mid it actually it feels like like a a 2020 like disney show you know how they all got like a little too like chipper yeah it's just like that i hate it the next one is give a girl a green gown the origin of this is charming enough this endeavor actually refers to lying down with a maiden in the green grass and dates back to the 1300s give a girl a green gown i sort of try saying that that's fun give a girl a green gown isn't that kind of fun to say it is i'm gonna start saying it whenever i'm like propositioning anyone for sex i'm gonna be like do you want to go um give me my green gown you want to go give a girl a green gown i'll be like what is that

fuck me in the grass okay obviously fuck don't you know anything about linguistic origins of god yeah euphemisms do you know anything about medieval terms for sex okay idiot riding saint george it's a vintage take on the cowgirl position that comes from the 1800s and the tale of saint george and the dragon the person on top gets to play the dragon i forget that people like from way back when also enjoyed sex and like also had a sense of humor because it's like when did people start shaming everybody about having sex and i think it's like when the puritans came over fuck the puritans or like you know yeah when they're like we're christian we're gonna go to america and make everything shitty i think it was columbus's

fault i feel like everything's columbus's fault yeah he does play a big hand in things my ancestors could have been happy in ireland yeah i could have not existed and that would have been amazing for me that would have been fucked up for me though so have you ever thought about that didn't think so listen liz yeah next time you think that you don't want to exist think about being so fucking selfish um okay have your corn ground oh as corn was ground repeatedly by pounding it with a stone this phrase carries considerable meaning and sounds like a classic fuck boy idea of great sex yeah well and like crushing something with a a stone how is that sexy you know you know how like when we were reading our um pussy rhymes

and i raised you the one that like one of my guy friends did you were like of course he talks about destroying vagina yeah that's just i think just a thought that a lot of men have that like we just love violence we love when our cervix is like rammed open like a battling ram yeah speaking of that not to make this about me please recently my cervix was obliterated it's not a good feeling no and it was on accident but of course because it was also right before my period so your cervix is lower yeah that shit was dropped oh and then i cried because i was in so much pain yeah i believe it there was one time when i was in high school my um high school boyfriend had to like carry me to my car oh my god and then i went home and sat in the bathtub because i was in so much pain oh

yeah that was when he fingered you right no it was trim sex oh yeah how old were you when you lost your virginity 18 18 you were still in high school oh yeah because you have an early birthday i have a late birthday i was only 18 in high school for like two days a minute yeah grope for trout in a peculiar river that sounds like you know when people would say like i'm gonna go get some strange did you do you remember that phase yeah but what was it strange and like strange pussy or whatever it means like like hooking up with a stranger can we go get some strange oh that's so fucking funny i had only really heard it used once and i was like okay it's remarkable now it's called a sneaky link for the kids listening

strange is what a sneaky link used to to mean yeah back in my day when i was your age i used to walk uphill both ways okay so grope for trout in a peculiar river we have shakespeare and the 1600s to thank for this little gem this was the first fishy reference we can't say we're a fan of this trend and paved the way for all ocean bound references to come not to mention giving those people with vaginas paranoia paranoia about cunnilingus for centuries cheers will this is also um i never saw what website this is from it's really fun it's called um live or live live sozies s-o-z-y um i think it's someone's blog but like i fucking it's so cute how it's written um okay here's the last one okay give one's arse a salad toss the salad it's back to

the 1600s i love that so they've been eating ass for a minute they have been tossed in salad didn't mean the same thing it must have i love that um so those are the fun little euphemisms euphemisms euphemisms euphemisms that i found the other ones are like really boring um oh this is kind of fun one word wonders for sex i'm just gonna i'm just gonna uh rattle through these fuck obviously shag obviously bone bang boink i i do like boink screw nail stop that's what my mom calls it shtup yeah um i think that's a yiddish uh ball rut score and smash i think my favorite of all of those has to be boink and shtup uh we have a friend who says bang oh my god that's true she does she's always like did you guys bang that's so funny she's so straight up about that

shit i love her so much i love her i wonder when she started saying bang she's just a she has a never-ending surprise that with that woman um my one of my best friends from college always says bone bone it's a good one is bone i would say for some reason i decided that the past tense of bang is bung so i'm always like did you guys bung or like yeah we bunged people are always like bung when they hear it for the first time and they start using it bung because it feels good we bunged we bunged frank wrote some pussy rhymes i can't wait to hear them he did liz met frank i did and i adore him he's really great i'm so happy you got to meet him that was so like unexpected too i was just like yeah i want him here right now you invited him on a whim yeah

and he was like i'm there so yeah me and my side piece met him yeah i love this new name for me too i just i'm like enjoying calling him it's so fucking good we were we're big fans i went back to his place after and he opened up his computer to show me something he was wearing a corduroy shirt that he had just got when he met y'all he had googled what to wear with corduroy because he was so nervous oh he's and i saw it and he pointed out he was like i was really nervous i didn't know what looked good with the corduroy i do shit like that all the time he could look on pinterest that's a good place i mean he listens to the podcast so yeah there's a fun tip uh you can always look at pinterest because i found that sometimes pinterest has better answers

for what i'm looking for i love that i did that with tiktok yeah oh that's a that's also a good idea or reddit anything reddit if i knew how to use it i just google what i'm thinking or like what i need an answer to and then put reddit at the end brilliant and then i find a bunch of different things that are addressing the exact topic i am trying to find real responses to and they're all candid response they're all candid responses yeah that's why i like it yeah you don't get that very many places on the internet all right so here are the pussy rhymes uh someone dm'd us theirs oh my god recently i believe pussy saves souls baptize in it oh my god amazing pussy makes wells capsize in it pussy resurrects can't die in it

pussy so creamy make pies with it oh that's like a cream pie one pussy makes pussy synthesizing it i know amazing whoa the reason i thought we read this is because i read them to to my side bitch oh oh and the reason that they sound a little familiar is because after frank told you one of his on thursday you read those to us oh i read these to you guys too see i don't remember thursday um yeah bussy on prep cream pies in it oh my god yeah like your butthole yeah bussy wow this is truly an art that this is a gift that keeps giving it really is i i know i don't think i will ever get sick of hearing them or reading them no um this episode is really all over the place so far it really it truly is this is all over

the board it's just such a mercury and retrograde moment we had a lot of tech issues at the beginning and still we kind of are all right i'm wearing sunglasses now because my eyes are really sensitive today for some reason and the ring light is hurting them the blue light glasses helped a little bit but the sides are uncomfortable these are so cute thanks did you get these from somewhere not amazon i got them on amazon i should have just that would have been a better way for me to have asked that question did you get these on amazon from an actual did you get these from an establishment that is not amazon i also got these sunglasses for me they're really great thank you i have to i'm returning like 700 worth of shit from amazon tomorrow oh i ordered

for Coachella that just like didn't work out for me um I Liz T-Ball first of all when did I stop when did I start calling you that I think in would be that's when I remember I was gonna say would be too it just rolls off the tongue Liz T-Ball Liz T-Ball that is my name yeah with my middle initial anyway um i on our sex podcast have a sex story i i am so excited that one of us finally has a sex story it's been a while because i my last sex story was just i was in pain yeah that's true damn and you know it's like when you think about it like like not all sex is gonna be good you know we had to have a flop you have to one of these times you have to i wouldn't call the whole thing wasn't a flop it was just the the part where i got hurt

yeah you know right so i just kind of overrode the rest of it if you if you start crying well to be fair i didn't i wasn't in pain until afterwards because you were cramping yeah because you're like oh i'm gonna puke because i'm in pain if there's still any confusion i mean all of them all of the people with penises that listen to our podcast are like so smart and well informed but if you're listening and you think that hitting our cervix it's like good it's it's not no it's it hurts a lot i would it's a lot would you equate it to like getting hit in the nuts maybe i think i might equate it to that it is really painful it's really really bad and cervixes it's like your cervix is like it doesn't have like a ton of nerve endings but

when you hit it hard it like really fucking hurts yeah it's connected to a bunch of other stuff yeah it's not fun i wouldn't recommend and then i was like it's moments like this where i'm like maybe childbirth will never be for me i mean when i was getting my iud taken out and put in i that was a moment i had i was like there's getting it taken out easy peasy oh it's awful for me oh i mean i only got i've only had one taken out oh i need to get a new one when i got it put in that's when i was gonna die anyways tell talk about sex story your sex on uh the sex podcast let me get comfy last night i sent liz a voice note when i was driving back from frank's house because i was just like we were just trying to figure out like when we were going to be

recording this week since i'm gone next week and like mid voice note i was like my brain isn't working because i just had sex so like bear with me i have not been able to stop thinking about this moment it was like i have never i had such a weird orgasm in a good way it was good okay but it was not like anything i've ever experienced normally so first of all i've mentioned this in the past frank a plus a plus head giver he's a generous lover he that dude i i've asked him i asked him when he was doing it once i was like where did you learn how to do this i see him i'm gonna shake his hand you must he is true he's a legend on the sex he's he's it's yeah i didn't i honestly this this sounds like a hyperbole i didn't know that sex could be that great it's

so great but anyway i love this for you enough gassing him up he's gonna get a big head um but usually his hair is just gonna get bigger it's where he keeps all his secrets it's where he keeps all of the i don't know compliments all the compliments um maybe all of his sexual knowledge is in the hair he took a sexuality class in college and he like learned a lot like a human sexuality class oh my god i would love to learn what he learned yeah me too he learned in that class how important foreplay is it is important okay sorry i keep okay no you're fine so normally since i've been on prozac like my libido hasn't gone anywhere but like it takes longer for me to come and like i tend to get in my head about that i'm like okay like come on

amelia head in your head you're like yeah it's like i gotta wrap this up because this is probably like this takes away the excitement yeah exactly you feel guilty you're like i don't want to have a guilty orgasm no and i don't want it to feel like i'm like trying to rush along my experience for this person so i finally communicated that to him because he's so easy to talk to about shit and he was just like oh my god like i love doing this yeah don't rush like a honestly a green flag is when a man that you're hooking up with is like they're they're trying to get you off for themselves you know like it's it's fun for them it's it's like self-fulfilling to be like i i want to get you off because that we all want we all feel that way i don't know how to explain

it no i know exactly when you get someone off you feel good about yourself yeah it's like i fucking did that yeah fuck yeah that's right yeah yeah that was that was me you're welcome or who to come back and on um yes so we had we had sex and then he came and then i was saying like i was like i didn't i don't know if i can come you know and like and i i haven't faked with him because i don't want to and and also you don't want to you know yeah that's the good word but also i i kind of always do you know because it's just like men that i've hooked up with just like are so they it's such an ego thing for them and it's just like i don't need you to i'm just gonna make you think i came you know wait you have done that yeah you do often wait yeah i fake orgasms like

kind of a lot what yeah amelia since i've been on prozac yeah because it just takes so long I know and like they're not doing a good job and like I'm gonna do it better by myself why have you not been telling me this I don't know dude I mean like it's before I got on Prozac you have so many casual admissions where I'm just like what the fuck I I would have remembered if you told me this so you heard it here first Amelia has been faking her orgasms not all of them but just a handful quite a few but I haven't with Frank I need to hear about who you have faked orgasms with everybody i've talked about on this podcast everyone except frank yeah phenomenal yeah oh my god we haven't had sex that many times because we've like we've just started dating but

but i don't want to fake with him i'm shooketh because he he really gives he's so like it matters to him and i know so i'm like i'm gonna actually take my time in this and enjoy it you know so i finally communicated it to him that is the loudest truck ever i thought it was a plane that feels intentional that woke up gatsby it's just very old it's a very old truck um at some point it's like don't you yeah at some point just kind of get a better chalk it up to an l you know it's probably more expensive to fix your car than get a new one yeah and fill it up yeah that's what she said uh sorry so yes i've been faking but haven't with frank and so i had this conversation with him where i'm like it like i'm really sorry because like i take prozac and

like it's kind of like makes my orgasms take longer and he's like never apologize like i could have kept going after you came you know so this was the first time since we had that conversation where i was like i don't need to rush but i didn't think that i was going to want to come and then i was like about to leave and he was like do you mind if i go down on you for a little bit and i'm like i'm not gonna stop you give it a go i'm not gonna stop you so like there was a gap between sex where i was like already like warmed up and coming and i came so fast and i think it was because i like leaned into it but also there was something like it was i explain it like normally like i feel like i don't know where the top of the roller coaster

is and then i have an orgasm you know i can like feel it building this was like like really fast and i have never shook that much in my life he was like a quaking orgasm it was even beforehand though like even i was just like like you know that um somatic healing thing it was like that he was calling me mount vesuvius um but i was like i couldn't control my body and i was like when i started to come i haven't talked about sex on here in so long this is like i feel like nervous i i'm i you're right like we haven't really you haven't talked about like a specific sexual experience that is recent yeah in like 50 episodes yeah literally um but he could like tell that I was like gonna come hard and he like held on to my legs and like flipped me on my side

and I don't know what the fuck happened to me I blacked out but when I came to I had so much energy like normally when I come I'm like oh for like a sec and then I'm like up I was just like up I was like I was I said to him I'm like I feel like I'm using a hundred percent of my brain right now he gave you an orgasm so good that it turned into what's that fucking movie where he takes the pill and knows everything limitless yeah you had an orgasm so good it became limitless that's exactly what it felt like isn't that matthew mcconaughey wasn't it bradley cooper oh yes they're all the same white guy fucking guy yeah bradley cooper and matthew mcconaughey have the same kind of like vibe yeah yeah and owen wilson i always get owen wilson and

matthew mcconaughey mixed up but that's also like i always got like shoulders and elbows mixed up as a kid and nickels and dimes and i feel like it's just owen wilson and matthew mcconaughey are victims of that they're nickels and dimes yeah they're all nickels and dimes you know one of them's worth more but oh no you guys are worth this name who would you say is worth more owen wilson me too but like matthew mcconaughey is like kind of killing it in the acting game i just don't like him yeah he he seems a little insufferable yeah anyways continue about this this limitless orgasm i bring this up to say outside of us having a sex podcast so when did when did he flip you on your side right when i started to come he like he like took he like had my legs and he was like

still between my legs and he just like kind of rolled me on my side so then he's like yeah head sideways yeah and i was i don't even know dude who know i truly don't remember what happened why did he roll you on your side because i was like gonna kick him in the face apparently i move i buck a lot when i when he's eating me out i truly lose entire control of my body i don't know and he's like he has to like hold me in place because he'll like his neck gets sore and that makes sense i'm saying this out loud it's like testing a uh airbag yes yeah exactly i give him whiplash pussy so good no whiplash in it it's good uh but he listened to last week's podcast

and this man is so like dedicated to me feeling good and also him feeling good too he was listening to the podcast and heard about the sex drawer conversation we were having and um you talked about spreader bars and homie went on adam and eve and bought a spreader bar with our discount code our code holy h-o-e-l-y and got a spreader bar and it's being delivered after i get back from hawaii so in some ways he's getting the spreader bar to keep you in place that's exactly right tie you down that's exactly that's what he said he was like you just i just need you to not have not move at some point it's like not even kinky it's just logistics yeah he's like i can't do this anymore no i'm just kidding but like the the idea of like me not being able

to like i'm fucking hyped i know you said they're like a little um what's the word you use i think i said maybe inconvenient inconvenient well because like they can be difficult like when you're actually having sex they can be a little difficult yeah because they do kind of get in the way right especially depending on where you are like if you have it on your ankles that's usually where it is right but it can like kind of get in the way but it's like i would say it's like probably the best use for foreplay uh-huh um but otherwise if you're think because if you're thinking about it like think about the positions you end up in and just like a bar being between your legs and you guys are trying to have sex yeah that's true but it's a little it gets a

little it gets a little complicated uh-huh i'm gonna make an amelia pretzel but i'm really excited to try it i'm really excited to try it i'm i'm excited to hear how it goes this orgasm though i don't know i have never i seriously like there is a theory that orgasms um like take men's energy and women get energy from having orgasms i mean that's what it seems like dudes like pass the fuck out after having an orgasm and i think it's because their job is done biologically biologically they can just go and hibernate i guess that would kind of make sense if it gives you energy after you gotta this make a baby yeah you have to wait for you have to like have energy for the sperm to get to the a i don't know yeah but i'm just improvising right no it's

i'm not a doctor i mean but you could be like listen i could be a doctor i choose not to be a doctor right they actually tried to give her her phd and she was like no thanks i choose to be miserable working in marketing okay yeah that's my choice and that's that's a sacrifice that you've made and that's pretty beautiful is yeah i'm accepting less money and more misery someone has to do it she's a giver she's a giver yeah but i'm like this whole adam and eve like partnership that we have going has it's or it's enhanced my sex life already i'm so fucking hyped i'm so excited to try i mean i'm gonna use our own code i'm not lying oh yeah no for sure for sure i've been looking at the uh the wedges the sex wedges well yeah you've

been talking about that because like doggy is fun but i it can be too painful for me sometimes i'm not a big person and mr liz is a foot taller than me okay so let's think about sorry who um my side bitch oh right okay is a entire foot taller than me yeah he yeah and i'm i'm not gonna go into specific details about his penis but anything that is bigger than like maybe four inches is gonna be kind of big for me especially in doggy yeah yeah like that's like a straight shot i can't see your eyes right now and it's really really making me nervous i don't i mean like please keep them on because it's good for you but i'm i'm nervous what i feel like i'm talking to like julia fox because these are intimidating sunglasses they really are like you're a vibe

right now i suppose you can't like really see my eyebrows as much so you just aren't seeing me being i feel like i'm talking on the phone with you which is always scary um i have been complaining to mr liz that i i mean my side bitch that i am like he's mysterious you know yeah he just has kind of a mysterious vibe and i don't have any mystery i'm just like an open book here i am on this podcast talking about my entire sex life and all of my mental issues and the things that my therapist says to me like there's not a single secret about me yeah you know right and and then he was like well like that's you're outgoing and amiable and like that's also great and then he's like but you could still be mysterious by dressing mysterious oh and i was like i hadn't thought of

that he's like cover up them ankles bitch and just dress like a nun yeah like who is she yeah pilgrim liz era why is she holding someone's hand oh my god she's like a risky nun so he's been making sure he tells me when i look mysterious i love that and these sunglasses help those are affirmations that maybe this is why i like wear all black maybe i'm trying to i want to have that mysterious like femme fatale thing but that's just never gonna be me and i'm coming to terms with that well you've gone through a lot of changes in the past like five years that's true who knows maybe like 35 year old liz is gonna be like i am in my femme fatale peak femme fatale clara peak femme fatale mysterious lady oh none yeah yeah yeah but anyway okay back to adam and

eve liz is gonna get a wedge i'm gonna get i need to get some toy cleaner that's a good idea because i've been using hand soap i don't think that that jives well with my ph balance no so i'm gonna get some toy soap i need to get some cuffs because my roommates in college got me handcuffs like as a joke like a joke gift freshman year because i was like when i lost my virginity you were like wait yeah but they are like straight up like cop cuffs they're like metal cuffs that's painful yeah and like scary because they like have a key oh where's the key and what if you lose the key that's exactly right you should get the you should get like little leather ones yeah that's what i'm thinking yeah that's what i'm thinking so anyway once again if you want to use our code

holy on adam eve it's just adam eve.com but if you look up adam and eve.com you'll find it um but you'll get 50 off an order in the u.s or canada um discrete shipping so if you live with people that you don't want to know that you have ordered a giant dildo yeah two big rabbit vibrators yep and a vibrating whip they'll never know because it's discreet shipping but this like working with them has been so dope because it's just like they have everything on this website truly and they've been around for so they're like the like our founding fathers of sex toys i like that it's more than just toys you know like they also have things like you know restraints and the sex pillow the sex triangle yes um and the spreader bar yeah or or a sex swing have you seen those yes

have you used one of those no have you no i'm curious though i kind of want to i kind of want to try it yeah i mean maybe maybe i'll add that to my order i feel like it'd be fun yeah well especially considering the height difference that could that could absolutely help me out a little bit yeah could avoid some of the cervical damage i have recently experienced yeah god oh god it's so fucking painful can you bruise your cervix i'm pretty sure you can yeah bro that shit's not fun no anyway let us know if you guys get anything you don't have to tell us what you got if you don't want to i but i will have people have been telling us that they've been using our code i want to tell them about like what specifically the vibrator that we we've been loving oh yeah um

i actually already had it pulled up because i put the link to it in our patreon oh that's a good idea but it's called eve's rechargeable thrusting rabbit and it's typically 99.95 slap a 50 off coupon on that and honestly the charge lasts a really a long time i know i haven't had to charge mine yet i'm now i'm like oh i'm gonna have to travel with this thing maybe i'll buy it a little a little bag yeah a little case have its own suit you could get its own little like pull along that i can't not look at it and think of like look at me i am the captain now and it is it is the captain now it really is the captain of all my vibrators yeah that's yeah it's a new sheriff in town yeah god y'all it's it's worth a hundred

so the fact that you could get 50 off on this thing that honestly a hundred dollars is average pricing for vibrators which is yeah wild to be honest i mean i bought a vibrator from a different company i'm not gonna say their name because they're not gonna get free advertising um but it was like 180 so not worth it so not worth it so this is on life and goal.com and it is the stages of a romantic relationship um i also believe there's a book i'm gonna have to take my sunglasses off for this because i can't see my screen sacrifices you make for this podcast i know i know um but i i thought this was really interesting i have been like learning a lot about um attachment theories lately um just because i wanted to learn more you know i

am a secure attached partner um and i wasn't always so it's like interesting to for me to notice how i've changed and just like that it is possible to change because when you see people talking about detachment theory and stuff like on tiktok or whatever it's kind of like everyone's accepting that that's how they are and not trying to change it right it's like an iq score yeah i'm anxious attached and this is what i do and it's like yeah you can't you can still be that way but you should also be working towards like healing yourself totally and that's evidence too by like people like the retaliation attachment styles that people do to like adjust to other people's attachment styles that's evidence enough that like you can it changes yeah well i have the

disorganized attachment style so that means like i would kind of take on whatever my partner was doing i would do the opposite i guess so looking into attachment theories i came across a woman on YouTube who was talking about attachment theories and applying them to the six stages I wish I could remember her name it's like Thais something I have also seen her on TikTok um so she's on YouTube she's on TikTok she's giving advice um but the six stages are the dating phase the honeymoon phase the power struggle phase the stable phase the commitment phase and then the last phase is the blissful phase damn okay so the dating phase is like very early on yeah i would say like the dating phase is probably that first year you know it's

just like you're kind of getting established um so this it's a this website says um the dating phase means going through the early stages of a relationship before the two parties get too serious in other words it's the period when everyone gets to know each other without commitment or pressure from the outside so you know like maybe like up to six months ish you know i've i felt like i was in this phase even into nine months wow um even before the honeymoon phase yeah wow um this is a very important stage for couples who want to take their relationship to the next level obviously oh they give a timeline this period lasts from the beginning of courtship all the way to about three months at the average speed of relationships i think maybe i felt like

i was still in the dating phase because the person i was dating like even nine months in like we weren't very connected yeah we just he was very routine and we just like never really progressed to a more intimate level okay um emotionally um but after this at this stage you will observe how fast you two connect with each other you will notice that you really click or not most couples do not realize when they fall truly head over heels because they're strong attraction towards each other your main focus must be to make sure that you are truly happy with your future life partner don't rush into anything just yet the honeymoon phase is actually when most people get married so they do the dating phase and then once they're in the honeymoon phase that's typically

when people decide to get married that's so interesting because like in like society just like layperson terms everyone uses honeymoon phases like the first like six months of the relationship and sure the that is a really fun time yeah but i think it makes more sense to say like that is the dating stage because you're like we've dated we've had maybe like a couple like of conflicts here and there but usually it's not anything very big you know you haven't had to make any big decisions together yeah and then when you're in the honeymoon phase you know you move in together you like are happy and excited and like things are progressing in an obvious direction so then both of you are like we should get married things are going well but you haven't really had

any hard challenges yeah um so this website says now comes the honeymoon phase this phase is where you spend quality time together and slowly get closer to each other during this stage your communication level increases it's during this period that most partners begin to realize that they have fallen for each other um i think it's pretty obvious like you know we've all heard of the honeymoon stage but i did think it was very interesting that this is when most people decide that they want to get married it it's basically saying that um communication is the key to everything and i think that's true like when you're in the honeymoon phase you do need to already have a foundation of good communication and you should have been working on that from the

beginning um and i don't mean just like talking regularly i mean like having honest conversations with each other even when it's hard um and then uh the next stage is the power struggle phase and this is when most couples break up um or get divorced if they did end up getting married in honeymoon stage there's different types of power struggles um and this has its own link to look at so the different types of power struggles that you have are um demand withdraw power struggle this occurs when one partner is constantly demanding things from the other and the other backs down instead of standing their ground this type of power struggle can lead to resentment and communication breakdowns as both parties don't feel respected or heard the second type is control

avoidance power struggle. This type of power struggle occurs when one partner tries to control every aspect of their relationship and the other avoids conflict by not speaking up or taking action. This can lead to feelings of helplessness and frustration as well as lack of trust between partners. And then the third type is dominance submission power struggle. This type of power struggle occurs when one partner tries to dominate the other either through physical force or emotional manipulation. This type of power struggle can lead to abuse and dangerous situations if not addressed quickly the fourth kind is hostile conflict power struggle this type of power struggle occurs when partners are constantly in conflict with each other leading to tension and

resentment this type of power struggle can be difficult to overcome as both parties feel like they're not being heard or respected which can lead to further breakdowns in communication and the advice for how to get out of the power struggle phase is take time to reflect on the situation talk it out with your partner agree on new boundaries and rules take responsibility for your actions and find ways to reconnect with each other and i was also looking up like just different things about the power struggle phase and one of the commonly asked questions like on google was like can you avoid the power struggle phase and it's like no yeah the answer was no this is a phase every couple has to go through i think that's so important to know too

because I think when some couples will go through it it's like oh no this is like not working clearly when it's like it's just a thing that happens yeah well and sometimes the power struggle phase can just be as simple as like you know if you're in a relationship where it's like the anxious avoidant cycle it could just be an avoidant partner being like this is too serious for me I'm not ready I want to end this relationship or like an avoidant partner just not communicating their feelings and then the anxious partner probably picking up on that and being like wanting to be closer and being more controlling and trying to control the outcome of the situation and i think what a lot of people don't realize is like if you do have an insecure

attachment style like you're automatically only going to be thinking about yourself when conflict arises like you're going to be thinking about how to protect yourself how you're going to respond how you want to like repair the relationship and not thinking about just like having empathy and like figuring out how to talk about something in the moment yep you're thinking about how you want to make this feeling go away yes yeah and it's kind of like a sick joke that like it comes on the heels of the honeymoon phase because it's like everything is so so good and then things get like not so so bad but just like bad actually challenging yeah and it's like oh well the honeymoon phase is over like guess we're not supposed to be together and it's just easy to

dip for a lot of people so it's just like that fucking sucks that that's the phase that like follows yeah such a happy place it really does but the important thing is is like once you make it past the power struggle phase then you'll know like you'll make it to the stable phase and you'll have a lot more confidence in if this is the right like long-term relationship for you um the stable phase is like you've overcome this conflict you know how to resolve conflict together and this is the stage where you know each other well both of you have learned to accept the other for who they are and in this stage you can expect some changes for example you will probably get into a new habit such as eating dinner together every night um it just creates a lot of stability

and a feeling of security and it brings joy and peace of mind um i've also read that like this is a phase where couples start to they feel maybe a little bored with each other and that makes sense because you have gone through all of these exciting stages and now you're finally in a a stable place yeah yeah that makes so much sense stability means that you're able to trust each other and depend depend on one another the key to building this type of relationship is communication we've already always said that like communication is the key to literally anything yeah um but this means confidence that an individual can remain consistent and reliable and i think like it is really hard to find consistency yeah um especially if like two people are insecurely

attached yeah it's hard to find stability it's it's just hard to find stability anyway when you're just like two like autonomous beings that have different moods and like you know are going through like different phases and cycles and like just like having like a stressful time at work like it's stability is like i don't know if like a fully a truly stable couple exists that i can think of off the top of my head i also think well once you get to like a point the way you would get to the point of stability is you would need to you need to use the power struggle time to heal those attachment issues yeah and um like practice communicating in a different way that's more effective when you're faced with challenges and conflict like that is the chance

for you to recognize like well I know that I'm anxiously attached and this is how I've been responding to things in my past relationships and it hasn't worked out for me so what can I do in the moment right now like I realized I'm triggered what can I do right now that is different to get the result that I want yeah and to say how I'm actually feeling and that's it's the same thing if you're avoidant yeah it's not just an anxious person like when you feel yourself pulling away and shutting down you need to stop in that moment and think like is this sincerely how i feel and what i think or is this me falling back into a pattern that i feel is safe because it's predictable yeah and i don't have to be vulnerable yeah and then after the stability stage when you

know couples start to feel maybe a little bored because they've overcome all this conflict and the honeymoon stage and the dating stage um the commitment phase is the fifth phase uh commitment is also known as being faithful oh lord obviously i would have hoped that by this point yeah you would be faithful and monogamous right if you are choosing to be monogamous but this is the phase where you two have decided to be together regardless of the challenges ahead and I think that is like such a great way to explain commitment in general is deciding to be together regardless of challenges so you've overcome the power struggle phase you have moved into the stability phase where things have kind of really settled in and now you're in the commitment phase where

you're like yeah we have overcome hard shit and we still made it through and in the stability phase you're choosing to be together and then the commitment phase you're like yeah shit's gonna get hard sometimes but we've already dealt with hard things and now we can we know we can manage it moving forward and in the stability phase like we've learned what we love about each other yeah ideally you would be getting married in the commitment phase and not the honeymoon phase right because you will have gone through difficult things and know at that point yeah totally i kind of feel like you know at our age we end up seeing those couples who got married really young if they like rushed into it and they haven't learned how to overcome the the power struggle stage

we're seeing them get divorced now yeah because they can't get out of it and then last is the blissful phase um this is the final phase where you two have been through so many ups and downs throughout your relationship this is a stage where you two are like soulmates and choose each other every day and i think that's important like once you get past all of the drama of like being an excitement early on in a relationship i heard someone recently explain it as like falling in love it happens to you you're falling you don't have any control yeah and then once you have you're no longer falling in love um you have to choose the partner that you're with yeah you know yeah it's not going to be this passive thing that's happening to you it is now requiring action

yeah that's a good way to put it and i just i don't think that like a lot of people realize that like you have to continue to to like be present with the partner that you have chosen yeah and you chose them for a reason so remind yourself of that yeah but like it does become a choice at some point and i don't think like i guess maybe i didn't fully realize that until this relationship to the relationship i'm in now because um like i'm past the point of like it being thrilling and having butterflies and like you know the person well enough that you're like yeah I'm choosing to be with this person now yeah I'm not with them because I need them I'm not with them because it's just like fun and exciting and I don't know what's gonna happen yeah so you're

in it because you want to be in it exactly you want to keep working at it yeah yeah so often online we just see like hyperbolic conversations there's no nuance where no one knows what's going on in another person's relationship specifically and people are just like bandwagoning like you need to break up with him like that's so disrespectful whatever and sure sometimes that is warranted if it's like a really dangerous red flag but like you also need to consider that conflict in a relationship is important it's important to know that you can actually overcome conflict yeah um because i don't want to end up in a relationship where like we haven't had any challenges or conflict and then we like decide to get married and then when conflict

actually arises it becomes messy and but you also like learn so much about like your relationship and the other person when there's like conflict happens like yeah and it's like it could be something stupid like like you don't wash your dishes right away you know like that's a thing that like you have to like you have to know that you can like argue with someone yeah it's such an important thing and it doesn't even just show you how they argue it shows you so much about them like like emotions like how they open up like there's just all of these parts of like what like when you don't have that you're not seeing like a full picture of someone well and yeah because that you need to figure out yeah how they argue or just generally how they handle conflict

because i would say we're not really arguers it's more of just like this is the conflict and of course we both will feel a different way about something that is causing conflict but i have to say it's nice that we're never like arguing about it specifically sure maybe like there'll be like a little like snapping back and forth like i don't like how you said this to me yeah and then it's like okay well this is how i was feeling does that make sense and it's like yeah but even when you feel that way can you please talk to me differently yeah and then that's that yeah but when it comes to more serious and bigger challenges it's more like this is the problem that we're experiencing right now and we both need to be very honest with each other about how we're feeling and what we

think and realize that it's not all going to be solved overnight yeah um but the thing that makes me just feel like i'm thankful for conflict and i'm thankful we're at a point where like we are having important conflict because i want to know myself like if we can actually overcome this then this is a relationship that i want to be in yeah and if we can't then it's going to be a mutual understanding that this is not the right relationship for us. And I think that's also like something I've been working towards in general. Like I don't want my relationships to be like surprising. Yeah. The way my therapists have talked about it is like if you are both honest with how you're feeling and that that doesn't mean just like saying how you feel it means

understanding your own feelings understanding the thing that is triggering you yeah and um that means i'm not i feel like i'm just falling all over my words today like very explicitly knowing your childhood trauma and when that feeling is coming up for you because that is going to like inform your behavior yeah the whole idea of like conflict and like arguments whenever those do come up like being able to advocate for yourself in those moments too is such a skill that like not everybody can do like I recently got good at advocating for myself because like I that's something you have to practice you have to practice it I'm so used to just kind of being like yeah but anything's fine with me because truly like a lot of things

I can just kind of like be fine with you know what I mean like yeah I know exactly what you mean but like it it doesn't when you want to build like a lifelong relationship with someone potentially like you're not going to just be like fine whatever about things for forever like you kind of have to shift how you talk about things and that's like the kindest thing that you can do for yourself is to actually like bring things up when they're bugging you and getting to the root of them like you know like realizing that you haven't avoided an attachment style like it really does help facilitate those conversations to know where it's coming from because like you said like it makes it less personal yeah too not only for your partner to hear but also for yourself to be

like oh I'm this way because of this exactly exactly well and the thing that had helped me like change from a disorganized attachment style to secure attachment style was obviously therapy but then also this relationship with him at the beginning of our relationship I was able to practice the things that were so hard for me and and approach him with conversations about how I was feeling about something and that is uncomfortable you're doing something you've never done before and you don't know how to do it's outside of your comfort zone but that is how you heal coming to like the realizations of your own childhood attachment and trauma is like a really overwhelming experience and it's it's really challenging it feels so hard yeah um

you're just having this kind of like upheaval of emotion and i i can only imagine like being in a relationship while having these kinds of major realizations is really difficult because you're like how do i balance like me discovering myself while being in a relationship with another person that's a lot yeah i mean like we're that's the thing like i've said this before i don't know on the podcast but i say all the time off the podcast it's incredible to me that relationships ever work out yeah because like there's there has to be two people that are choosing to keep doing the work together yeah and like you it's all it's a process like you're always like you said like you learned how to have you know do all of this work but you're still like learning how to

be like a better listener and that's what it is it's always like learning and growing and evolving and when you have somebody that i'm choosing to stay in this relationship and learn these right and you have that's the thing like you have to like if you have somebody that's like like indignant about like oh i've already done all this work and clearly it's not working it's like that happens i see that happening so often and it's like no you kind of always don't have to be working and that's exactly bonkers to me that it ever works out and i've seen so many successful relationships so i know that it does it's just like you have to keep choosing each other and like the work and the adjustment is so uncomfy like when I first started like speaking up for

myself for example I was texting you a lot that I was like I had this difficult conversation I just like couldn't stop crying and it was either you or Katie that like helped me realize that it's like I keep getting shut down when I was bringing up these things that were difficult to bring up and it it was like oh yeah you finally do the work to like bring it up and then somebody shuts you down it can be so it feels so easy just to like retreat and be like I'm just not going to bring things up again and you can't you can't do that that's so true if I didn't get the chance to practice that successfully in this relationship now I would probably have responded the same way it's so much easier just to retreat but it's not like it's easier in the moment but in the long

run it's not because you're not advocating for yourself yeah and that can be really scary when like you start advocating for yourself and like conversations start getting difficult to feel like oh like what if we can't get through hard things and maybe you can't you know like maybe it's not the right relationship for you as long as you are looking at it as like a learning opportunity then it'll feel less like shitty that's the only way i could think of explaining it yeah i've accepted that a relationship can end at any time yeah because people change you're gonna change your partner's gonna change you might end up changing in different directions and you need to allow yourself the the ability to end a relationship with someone yeah because it can

feel so like if you're in your head like oh i don't want this person to ever leave or like i want this relationship to last forever like you're kind of putting yourself in a box where you're not like if if the relationship doesn't work out it's going to be more painful you know yeah like i it's it's less like oh well this relationship could end at any time and i'm going to be pessimist about it it's more like i want to have the choice to change my mind yeah if this relationship can't survive challenges anymore yeah yeah absolutely yeah and like it also kind of when when a relationship feels like finite too it it's like you almost like protect it you're like it's like a different kind of like fostering its care because it's like this this could just

not last for forever yeah that's also gonna be the thing that is like triggering this like anxious avoidant chasing cycle you know i think we should wrap this up because this episode is already gonna be a fucking mess and a mess to edit yeah liz is um gonna get a nobel prize for editing the episode after what we just went through this entire episode so i hope y'all enjoyed it it's giving mercury retrograde i can't believe we're back in a fucking retrograde the direct planet direct was all planets direct was good that felt good it felt like hell for me so oh so you're happy in some ways i'm like is astrology real like having a whole it's a cornerstone of my personality now i'm questioning

yeah all right anyway sing us out and we love you our children wow i really thought i was gonna be on my own for that one i panicked