The Hoely Hour - E8 Just Smoked a Mouse

Episode Date: August 6, 2020

Dentists know when you’ve just given head! Is breakup sex a bad idea or a terrible idea? And why do so many things look phallic? Amelia and Liz talk about breakups, social anxiety, and The Bohemian Rhapsody of our generation. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

it is that's the bohemian rhapsody of our that's the bohemian rhapsody of our generation is all the things she said by tattoo Welcome to the Holy Hour. I'm Amelia Stamson. And I'm Liz Ball. I feel like I sing my name differently every episode now. Amelia Stamson. I'm feeling show tunes-y today. So we've been recording for an hour and a half before we did this intro. Just realized we hadn't done our intro yet. Oh, whoopsie. Well, thanks for coming to Mass. Yeah, thanks for coming to Mass. We are so happy to see you in our pews as per use as per use in our pews per use we like i don't i don't i don't know it's always a surprise to you guys and a surprise to me

while i'm editing how this episode how these episodes pan out i literally never know what's going to happen when i was leaving my house today my dad was like what's the topic for today i'm like we don't really do topics anymore we always go with an intention i think eventually we'll probably get back on top i think so too i think once we have guests it'll probably be a little bit easier topics but for now and there's some things where i'm just like i don't want to talk about this yet because i want to have a guest here to discuss this yes same same so and there's some stuff i want to revisit with guests like porn yeah yes and butt stuff butt stuff yeah i know i know a butt stuff expert on the pod here for it somebody that does colonoscopies maybe

invited my colonoscopy doctor can you tell if someone just had it all what's the weirdest thing you found in someone's butt wait that reminds me i i think it was a tiktok of a it was a dentist saying that they can tell when somebody's recently given head okay i don't know if that's true i've heard that so many times wait i should text the dentist yeah do it i'm gonna do it now i'll answer i'm so curious oh my god i almost texted my boss because they have similar names i'd be like can you tell if someone's given head before they come in for an appointment i'm like what the fuck amelia this is inappropriate and also yes okay i just texted him important question for the pod he's usually pretty responsive so

just just for context i'm i was dating a dentist for a sec and we still respect each other so we still talk from time to time oh he texts me back so oh shit is it true that dentists can tell when someone's recently given head is it only if they come in their mouth he said what's the pod i said podcast he knows about the podcast oh he's typing wow he's really on it oh lol sir we need an answer oh he said yes oh my god all right he's typing i asked how this is the best this is very exciting this is like having a guest on yeah it really is i'm so excited for the listeners oh what wait what's it say he's he said it was obvious with you every time what

what does that mean wait what wait he's not your dentist no and he's never really examined my mouth with his eyes wait but like dentists in a professional sense listen dr d can y'all tell when someone's recently given head from like a tooth standpoint he's probably laying in bed reading he's like in bed at 9 p.m nerd yeah he has to god you're taking way too long to text dude we're live right now my guy i need to know okay if any of you are dentists or um are close with a dentist please we need

to know yeah we need to crowdsource this i need more information my dentist is a family friend so i'm really concerned and another family friend does my pap smears so everyone's just got you covered wait but they're all they're a doctor it isn't just a family a family friend looks at my vagina sometimes for fun she's like great work awesome layout awesome layout wait you stopped texting he's probably just been typing for so long it just up to saying that happens oh my god i'm so warm i don't know if it's the san juan seltzer or the steamy convo it's both that's the anticipation yeah well i'm really when you leave i'm gonna make a frozen pizza oh i should check where my wings are while we're waiting for this text

watch them have canceled my order i'm gonna be so bummed out when molly's describing someone who sucks she calls them a wang that's amazing it's so funny she's like he's a wang i love that i'm gonna adopt that that is remarkable shout out to molly thanks for listening big fan of your of your terminology oh he said oh oh my god oh my god he said haha that was a joke his first text about being able to tell i would give him a whole lot of head that's why said that he said he had a great dick he said you can tell because it can create he put in parentheses red spots on someone's palate from the pressure slash stimulation it doesn't always do it but it can but also those signs don't always mean you were giving head it

could mean something else but if you see it you could assume that someone was recently giving head nice nice so if you're about to go to the dentist maybe maybe make them go down on you instead they should be anyways yeah yeah like sorry i can't give you head tonight i have a dentist appointment give him a hand job for the first time since high school yeah bring back the sad dry hand job yeah that sad dry indian burn hand job i forgot about indian burn oh my god that triggered like a childhood memory the first time yeah you don't know what it is and your cousin just twists the shit out of your arm and you're like what the fuck what are you doing did you ever get horse bites my brother used to do that to me all the time those hurt it's when you like put your fist

together and like grab their skin and pull it hurts so fucking bad i'm so glad my brother is younger than me oh yeah i feel like i'm a lot of why i'm tough is because of what matt put me through as a child but also the reason i cried a lot as a child life's about balance yeah for sure that guy is my best best friend oh the dentist is typing again who's texting me oh ask him if he can tell if like a man has gone down on a woman oh oh okay if a cishet man oh he sent me a picture wow i don't know who these people are that are giving such intense head there's like he sent me these pictures of the example of that word that i couldn't say and there's just like a bunch of red spots in people's mouths i feel like i get that when i eat hot food

though you know i mean maybe a hot hot food is more of a burn look at this person's teeth the bottom right ew what ew why do they look like that they're atrocious guys they're like they look really weird ew yeah you guys i am hooking up with this guy right now who is a it's he's an he's an expert like i've never the transitions are really good like between positions i've never had that before like we're like usually we have to like exit and re-enter when we're like getting into a new position he's like a masterful like shifter he never has to exit you know what i mean we're all over his apartment and it it never i just want to keep having sex with him like usually when i'm done having sex i'm like oh my eyes are dark but like he he energizes me

i'm just and so last night we were like all over his fucking apartment and then after we just like i just like put my head on his leg and we were just like talking for a few hours i'm just like a big it's just it's doing a lot for me and like a lot of different emotional arenas in my life and i just emotional and sexual which is also emotional yes he's just oof i like this the sex is just so fucking good that's good it's good he's really bad bitch i'm a ratty dick all night but yeah no he's like really showing me a lot about like what i want sexually and we've talked about him in the past about like maybe he's also into bdsm because like That was in the last episode, which came out today, folks.

We're recording on hub day. We're recording on hub day. Because your girl can't catch a fucking break. Oh, my God. I know Liz is all over the map this week. All over the map. Which is why I'm... And next week, too.

...jade rolling the fuck out of my face. So I had been thinking about what I want my boundaries to be as far as, like, talking about who I'm currently dating. um because i don't want to rob myself of enjoying my time like my experiences yeah because i'm thinking about like or i'm i'm worrying too much about how i'm gonna talk about it and how it's going to affect them and like i just i just want to experience it how i would normally experience dating like i just happen to also co-host a podcast right so some of the boundaries i've come up with is like um i'm gonna kind of stop talking about the people that i date while i date them uh at least this one because you really care about him it's different when you actually have

feelings for them one thing that i think is important to keep talking about also is like when i do talk to my male friends who listen who listen to the podcast um i love digging and being like what did you think about like the us explaining this experience like what's what's your take on this um and then they're able to open up and share like how they felt in on the other end of a circumstance and granted i am pressing for this information it's not like they're like dumping it on me you know that's the difference so um i i appreciate that they share like their perspective with me and then um women also obviously are like very quick to come forward to us and be like thank you for talking about this so yeah or i experienced something similar

or whatever um my jade i keep dropping it um but it's so interesting to hear two different sides oh my god and like we want to be having these conversations with each other but we don't know how so like hopefully this is a source of facilitating these transparent conversations for listeners to have yeah whether it's relating but like also just like empowering you guys to talk to each other about sex openly like to be honest like having to be so transparent on both the podcast and in my personal dating life because of the podcast has been the absolute best thing to ever happen to my sex and dating life yes and it's because like both aspects demand transparency and like I think regardless of what happens with this podcast like my experiences in

relationships because of it I will always treat them that way like not even just like romantic relationships but friendships and relationships with my family as well yeah of just being like yep i have to be really fucking honest with you because i'm going to talk to the general public about it yeah so just being able to have that um very special connection with someone because you have to be transparent with them is really nice yeah um i had been thinking about this earlier uh and i had mentioned it to you but i think the guy i'm seeing is pavloving me into being naked around him because yeah he was like um he was like i think it's really attractive like how confident you are being naked around me and i was thinking about it later and i was like well

anytime i'm naked he like compliments the fuck out of me he's for sure pavloving you maybe he's subconsciously pavloving me he my means so i mean if you want to be naked around your significant other more compliment the fuck out of their body yeah keep giving them little rewards yeah yeah he gives me specific compliments yeah that helps but he gives me specific compliments in like things that i take so like i'm like oh my god that's an amazing compliment like so i've never had abs and i've been like working out really hard for a long time i mean it's a long time to me it's probably since november that's a long time yeah yeah i mean there was a few months where it's like covid was happening but i stayed thin from anxiety and being unable to eat and sleep thanks

anxiety thank you for keeping me we're sponsored by anxiety this episode is sponsored by anxiety it's not a healthy diet zero out of ten recommendation um so anyways i like was finally able to like go back to my regular workout routine and i'm very proud of the work i've done like i i i like how i look and i've i've been like pretty vocal of like yeah i've been working out really hard and i love this place i go to and um like this is the first time like i have a picture where you can see my abs for the first fucking time i fucking took it yeah amelia took it i was like they made their debut after 28 years you look fucking bomb for real it just is so like rewarding to see this work you've worked so hard yeah and it wasn't to like have abs but

anyways like um right the guy i'm seeing like it's to be healthy yeah the abs are a nice byproduct it is exactly um and the like the ab work is actually my favorite to do hell yeah it's just the most fun so the guy I'm dating like he complimented my abs and I was like wow I like hearing that compliment are you a words of affirmation baby I think I actually am way more than I thought I was it shipped and I mean it makes sense because like I am a wordy person I'm pretty verbose that does I mean but you're also a writer so it's like as I sit here and talking to a microphone i'm constantly making jokes about me shutting the fuck up i'm like are you sick of me talking yet i'm like i'm like yep i'm sick of hearing my own voice and then i

also have to hear it when i'm editing this i was thinking about that today how often you have to listen to both of us well listening to you is fine listening to me i'm like god bitch shut up and well it's it's a really out of body experience oh i bet because you're like I'll be like listening to myself telling a story and then I'll think something and then I'll say it I'm like damn we got the same break yeah I feel you bitch yeah I'm like that's right good point Liz thanks Liz this girl gets it it's good that you stand by what you say yeah it's always a joke I'm like that bitch got it i love that it's nice to know i'm the same no matter what you do have a unique

experience editing you really i do really enjoy it and i'm so glad because i don't know what the what the fuck i would do i really do not um i do want to talk about so someone tweeted both amelia and i a listener tweeted both amelia and i about um his he wanted to help his friend out with his hinge account because he was having like a hard time matching with people and um he was like should i like message them for him and i might be like not uh verbalizing this totally accurately but also i'm not about to go pull it up it's 10 p.m you could go and look on our on our twitter yeah yeah it's there if you're looking for it you could go find it but he was like what do you guys think and then i so my stance is like i think yeah it's totally fine

to spice up your your profile and um amelia had given me this like little tidbit um on hinge like you're able to answer a prompt and the advice she gave me was to like position these questions and prompts as like a really great open door to um someone responding and starting a conversation you want you want to initiate a conversation you don't just want to be like i'm overly competitive about everything like what the fuck am i supposed to say with that like what like what i don't want to know if you're really competitive about everything i don't want to talk to you no or if you're going to announce it i don't want to talk right it just doesn't open the door for conversation yeah exactly that's like such a dumbass response yeah it's fucking stupid

anyways that's it's really like upsetting for me and triggering for me to talk about clearly um but uh yeah to set up your account or your profile um as like prompt or a way to initiate a conversation yes and um yeah i don't so i have kind of a weird story that's kind of like in the same realm and i mentioned it briefly in my tweet but when i was in college i started talking to this guy who um i don't know he was like he was cute enough but uh we randomly started texting and i like enjoyed talking to him and i thought he was just like an interesting guy to talk to and like he's fun to hang out with and then um when we were together in person he was like a little different and like it was like somewhat awkward and then um we like yeah we

like kissed and hung out a little bit and then kind of like things just generally fizzled out you know you're in college yeah and then like months and months later i found out that pretty much every single time i texted him his roommate was responding that is the that's creepy to me it was like it's just like because i really hit it off with his roommate like we i ended up like making out with that guy and like having a big crush on him oh no way yeah so for then that's when he told me he was like yeah i like responded for him most of the time when you would text him i was like holy shit like that makes all adding a lot of sense yeah but also like that's so fucking weird and like um i don't think it was like malicious or wrong in any way but also it

just like not a genuine connection at that point it's like I feel like there it makes so much sense on the surface to be like like dude help me figure out what to say yeah can you help me with my profile or like like write my prompts talk to these girls for me so like I understand it from that standpoint but then what we both said to this person that reached out to us was like it's so disingenuine isn't a word I found out recently yeah you told me that but disingenuine it's so disingenuine to like end up going on a date with someone that you like haven't been truthful with that's fucked up yeah it's just fucked up you don't like you don't and i know that it's not malicious like you're saying it's it's always with like oh it's always well like

oh help me out like how do i respond i need to consult the bros then they meet up with you i mean i consult amelia right i mean like behind every risky text there's like 10 women yeah yeah but like that's different than being like having your entire dating profile be dictated by someone else yeah it's just the the intention is pure but then you end up going out with this person your personality is entirely different like yeah and I mean speaking from my personal experience too is like there's been so many times where I've been messaging someone and they're so quick on their feet when they're messaging me but then in person they're not able to like keep up the same level of banter and that's like I don't want to say it's a turnoff but um I mean like that's like

the main point of appeal for me is that that banter and then when you don't have that in person you're like I don't I can't really sense if this is the right connection for me now because I I like that's the kind of conversation I enjoy and um when it's lacking in person then it's tough yeah but I've also noticed that some of the best connections I've had have been like we have like pretty minimal conversation until we meet in person yeah and i've also the more i've done like this kind of like app dating the more i've realized like the harder it is for to get me invested um like i'm not gonna invest a shitload of time in like messaging and texting you before we meet yes and it's nothing personal it's just like i don't have time to be doing all that yeah

So, once we meet and there is, like, that connection, then I'm definitely more responsive and, like, you know, I see some sort of, like, future meeting up again. Mm-hmm. So, that's the difference. Yeah. And I would say, like, the best connections I've had have been those circumstances where neither of us are, like, oh, we need to constantly be texting or whatever. Mm-hmm.

I fucking hate texting. And then it just kind of happens naturally. Yeah. Amelia and I were having this conversation when she showed up too of just like can you please not he's so annoying he's so cute but he's so annoying lately um yeah but like it is hard to be texting someone constantly like even though I'm I look at my phone pretty often it's because I'm mindlessly scrolling through something oh yeah my screen time is yeah embarrassing it's because i'm taking a break from working or podcasting stuff to just turn my brain off and consume like

some sort of meme yeah and you don't to texting you don't want to like give like a half-assed response exactly i don't want to give some like filler dumb boring conversation via text i want it to be interesting and like at least like clever yeah so yeah that's i just he you should just like want to yes he's like mom get me the newest iphone i just i always i mean i'm all about like people being into you like for who you are so like there's a lot of power in knowing that somebody decided to go out with you based on you being exactly who you are and if you're awkward awkward like in air quotes awkward and like you don't know how to have like conversations with people there's somebody out there that's experiencing the same thing and that's the

person for you maybe like you don't want to like earn a date with someone like through someone else's accord yeah and you can kind of gauge based on like their profile and just like basics of your conversation that you've had if they're going to be like cool yeah um and you don't need to have like you can get a better idea once you meet in person yes and i do i do someone from hinge has told me like you know they'll make plans to go on a date pretty quickly because a lot of women in seattle will just bail yeah seattle freeze yeah i mean i i don't i don't do that i don't bail like i even if i don't want in my if i don't initially want to go on the date i will still make myself go on the date yeah because i'm like i'm in a weird headspace i need to get out of it

and like i literally don't know what's gonna happen because you know there's been times where i'm like i don't think this is gonna go well and then i meet them and they blow me out of the water yeah so yeah you don't know what's gonna happen and you need to put yourself out there yeah just get yourself out of your funk yeah i think that um a lot of people are quick to say that men are the ones who are going to to blow you off or like not show up for a date but it's not it's it's women yeah women are like yeah not even just a date too i feel like i've heard from a lot of my yeah well a lot of my guy friends have told me that women will just like they'll be talking for like a week and then they'll just like stop responding so there's also that i mean i do

that shit i wish that i did it kind of done that to someone not on purpose no i just got super busy and then also i started more consistently seeing someone someone and yeah and it's not it's not like i'm like i'm going to see this person exclusively it's just like it feel it doesn't feel genuine or authentic to be talking to anyone else right now yeah it's just like why would i be talking to you and then that poses the question of what like i feel secure enough that i don't need to have another like i keep thinking back to our dating episode like our um dating app episode our dating app episode where you're like you have to have multiple people on the roster and here i am i don't i'm not doing that and i have zero desire to and i just like i feel like you found

somebody that fulfills a lot of different areas yeah and like it's true like i like i would definitely do that when i was like hyper focusing on someone who triggered me so um now that that's not the circumstance of like i'm not seeing someone who makes who triggers those insecurities yeah yeah and when you find that yeah yeah i'm like confident in myself i'm confident in this person and like i'm also not trying to like rush into anything i just i'm enjoying it and i don't feel the need to be like filling in different parts with different people right totally but then it's like when is the appropriate like how much time is talking to somebody like before you have to tell them that like you're moving on from them because you've like yeah what's the

threshold I never met this person I never met this guy in person it was like he I thought he was really funny and clever and like um we were just kind of hitting it off and then that was like a month ago and then but then they also apparently fell off he tried um but I was super busy oh my god since I have my headphones on I can hear my neighbor across the way singing so i have this neighbor in the building across from me who he does this every single day where he's listening to music on his headphones and he'll sing and he's so bad i can't hear him right now stopped yeah you'll hear him again okay um but he like he's not you hear even okay even only i can barely hear him right now but he's a terrible singer and

i don't know how to explain his voice of how he sings it's very spoken wordy it's either it's either kind of spoken wordy like monotone or complete falsetto where he's like he was saying he loves ariana grande yes yes i i know it's really cute and i've totally like i've been like what the fuck is going on and i've looked out the window and seen him like with his headphones on just like dancing around his apartment and um i think most people would probably be annoyed hearing this guy sing but it brings me so much joy for him to not care at all if people hear or see him his window must be open and just yeah it is because i'm i'm sure he's always done this but stop i'm sure he's always done this but um now since it's like warmer weather i'm sure his

window's open oh yeah now you get a show every single fucking night so um no but yeah it brings me so much joy because it's just like he doesn't give a fuck who hears him singing and like singing i know for me personally i i enjoy singing like singing in the shower or just like singing along to a song because it naturally releases endorphins and i just think it's like so fucking cute hey guys we have an asmr obsession even though i fucking hate asmr thanks i hate it oh my god it's so uncomfy it's hard to not like want to do asmr when you have a microphone

when i was visiting my friends this weekend her boyfriend kept calling it a robot dildo it does look a little phallic doesn't it i mean a lot of things look phallic that's true i wonder if they're intentionally designed phallically like i don't know the makers of it are like things in general people are just like i like this i don't know why this is this microphone really doing it for me my dick internalized homoeroticism who me you look like you're about to attack the back of my head and i don't know how i feel about it he's he's vibing smoke a mouse straight vibing just smoked a mouse a lot of people don't understand this reference i think it's so funny so back in the early covid

days um and i when i had nothing to do i would go on my my coronavirus walks because like my gym was closed and i would work out in my apartment but i like needed to be outside or something so and like the weather was nice so I would go on my coronavirus walks just around my neighborhood and there's like this mural on the side of someone's house and it's a cat with a top hat and it's smoking a pipe and there's a mouse in the pipe and then and then I took a picture of it on my walk and I posted it and I was like damn that's a cool cat about to smoke a mouse straight vibing and then later that night like all like all the beginning I'd say the first like two months of COVID I was high all the time and so like anytime Amelia texted me I'd be like

sorry I'm really high right now yeah that's so true I haven't gotten that text from you no um so I had yeah she like texted me something and I said something really fucking weird and I was like sorry i'm really high just smoked a mouse straight vibing i was crying i was crying well then when you're high and you like make a dumb joke you're like this is hilarious comedic genius the things that are funny to me when i'm high oh god amazing yeah i love that um it's kind of like a running joke of like guys that like being little spoon yeah exactly i mean it feels nice yeah girls you need to spoon spoon your man spoon your man um but i was but i was like oh are you saying i have big spoon energy like you do bse big spoon energy baby i like that big spoon

energy um spoon your man after sex see what he does oh speaking of post-sex uh stuff that's kind of a good jumping off point for my conversation with okay comedian okay so um you and i will obv connect on how much of this needs to be cut out but i'll just tell you the whole story so on Wednesday of last week I was over there and we had sex and after we had sex I brought up that we had had this conversation about aftercare on the podcast and I was like and I explained to him what aftercare was no point in going over it again and he was like oh I've never like I've never thought about that that's a really good question he's like like what's your like what's your aftercare and I told him like just like chatting and like cuddling and explained to him

what mine was yeah that like emotional fulfillment is important to me and he was like god that's a really good question he's like can I get back to you on that and I was like for sure so I left when I got home um my good friend Megan is my parents are like her parents in Washington her parents live in Michigan and so she was over and um she was up when I got home and um we just started chatting and I texted the comedian and I was like hey it's sorry to use code words when I talk to you normally about this so often um but so once we stopped talking I texted the comedian and I was like hey sorry Megan's been over um we've just been chatting like I got home safe I'll talk to you in the morning and his he turns off his phone when he sleeps and it went to green

so I was like oh he's asleep so in the morning I get a text from him where he turns off his phone when he sleeps yeah he like it's like better for the battery I've never understood he has a warm clock like a fucking weirdo I know I give him I give him shit for it all the time um but he texted me and he was like hey good morning like how was Megan and I said good and um he was like uh hard shift um and then like a colon and then a gap and then a very long paragraph that was basically like um so just like for context that that liz has that i don't think i've ever covered like i've been in this casual relationship with this guy who is a comedian for nine months and um it's gotten to the point where like we've been seeing each other for so long that

it's been a little difficult to keep it cash like I've kind of been treating him like a boyfriend but also I've been out doing my own thing because I'm so comfortable with him like I call him when I'm like driving home at night and like I like tell him the exciting stuff that's going on in my life and I was kind of um not consciously but unconsciously like filling in the gaps from my ex like the stuff that I was missing from my ex I was doing with the comedian which I didn't realize I was doing at the time if I realized that I was doing it I would have stopped because that's unfair especially because um he wanted to be official with official with me and and i i'm sure in your head you also didn't want to admit that to yourself that's a hard thing to try and

confront and like if someone was like hey do you think that maybe you're just filling in the gaps of what you're missing with your ex yeah i would be like fuck off yeah mind your business yeah i'm an adult i don't need your opinion yeah i know and and it's i don't know it sucks i know hindsight's in 2020 that's like a cliche but it really it really is like i didn't realize exactly what i was doing until i was out of it um but he was always such a gem like was very patient with me we had this agreement we would check in a lot we were like changing our terms and conditions a lot and like t's and c's t's and c's always revisiting the t's and c's and um so this text that he sent me the long text they sent me on Thursday morning was basically like um this is not this is this is

getting really difficult for me but then the text didn't really have any sort of meaning like it kind of seemed like he was just telling me that it was getting difficult for him and I was like completely understandable like let's reconnect and figure out how we can make this better for you and he sent me a text that was basically like um yeah you let you wanted me to let you know when it was getting too much for me to handle and I needed to bow out and so that's what this is and i was like hold on let's take it back a few steps like this is you bowing out and he was like oh yeah and so we had like a bunch of texts back and forth where i was like why the fuck would you do this over text we've been seeing each other for nine months we have

a very open like channel of communication that you shouldn't feel like you need to text me this i understand that it's easier to bow out is like too casual yeah i mean it's the whole thing was just way too casual for what what it was that we were dealing with so um long story short at the end of the the conversation he was basically like I would like to have closure in person before we go our separate ways I was like I cannot fucking believe that you did this over text yeah my mind is blown so I was upset about obviously not having this like companionship that I've had for so long but I was focusing so much of my energy on being pissed that he did it over text like it was just it felt very juvenile and i was like what are we going to get together

just so we can like say bye like i don't want to fucking do that so i texted him back and i was like i'm already mad at you for doing this in a text yeah like we have way too much respect for each other for that to be in the appropriate way to handle this so i was like what what do you think closure would do and he was like i just he's like i know that i didn't handle this well this is what i should have said and whatever and then he was like i just care about you too much to leave it at this um so we ended up seeing each other on saturday and i came in guns a blazing because i was mad yeah and i sat down and right you know when like you you walk into someone's house when you know that you're going to be having a conversation with them and you do like the

awkward small talk for a little bit like how was your day how are you yeah what's new what are you doing the rest of this weekend let's pretend we're gonna relax before i lay into you yeah yeah well we did none of that i sat down and he just went into it and i was so appreciative of that like i was like there for one reason and we were going to get to it so that was great and he off the bat apologized for how we handled it he explained why that happened and it's not worth getting into but i completely understand why he did like he didn't intend for it to go there and like he was just trying to give me a heads up because i had asked for a heads up that when this gets too hard for him i want to know that he wants to talk about it um and he was just like i just said too much and

that wasn't my intention I was like okay whatever and we worked through that so that was fine but then he started talking about on Wednesday when I brought up the aftercare piece and I brought up that we had talked about it on the podcast he listened to the podcast when I left and um I mentioned this on a previous episode but he had told me that he's not listening anymore um me talking about him on the podcast I've cleared with him in the past like he's given me permission to talk about him the conversation that I brought up about how he's gotten like a little bit edgy or mean after we have sex is a conversation we've had so none of that was surprising it's not like I like caught him off guard by that but he said that he listened to

that part of it and he was like I feel like I'm acting in ways that is not genuine to who I am as a person he's like I feel like my jealousy is making me into somebody that I'm not and it's killing me and I just kind of let him talk he just talked for like a half hour um um like everybody in your life compliments your life but it doesn't define your life and I feel like I'm putting myself in the position where I'm trying to define your life and I don't want to be that person for you and he's like no matter what you're always going to be concerned about me hearing about things or like when you're dating people you're going to feel like you can't tell me about it or like you can't like put it in a way that I'm going to ever hear about it and like he's like I've

never been a jealous person and I'm like I'm jealous all the time at the end of that we basically got to the point where we both decided that like continuing on with the relationship wasn't the best thing for us it was either we were going to end it now and we both still had respect for each other or we were going to end it in six months when we had a reason to hate each other and at the end of the conversation like we were both like so like do you like do you have any any questions and we were like no um and he was like can I can I hug you I was like yeah and so I hugged him were you crying no I cried at one point but it was about um how I always feel like I'm unintentionally hurting the person that I'm dating um because I care so much about hurting

people like it's i put so much effort into not hurting people how they take like i don't know their interactions with you is on them i can't i cannot manage people's emotions you don't know what's going to hurt them and also yeah it's all on them how they're right like if they're going to be hurt by something you're so right it's just it sucks because it's like i've i've been i've tried to be honest with him from the beginning about what this is and he's even said like even if I wanted to be with him he can't be in a relationship right now because he's wanting to be moving soon um I have nothing bad to say about this guy like he is so fucking good and so kind and like he's been so patient with me and like our relationship was so fulfilling in so many ways

so like leaving that conversation sucked because it's like it's so much easier to hate the person oh yeah have something to like anchor on to that is rooted in anger um and i had none of that and so and he said the same thing he was like it kind of sucks that we're not mad at each other because like all we have to do is be sad about this like that's so true um but that was basically it and like i haven't talked to him since so it's just been like i would say the good news is i almost feel like it's easier to truly get over something when you're sad about it versus angry yeah but that's just for me for me personally like if something pisses me off like that stays in my heart for so long that's interesting because for me anger for me personally for anger is so much

easier for me to deal with than sadness like I have such an easier time working through anger than sadness i fucking i know everybody hates being sad i hate being sad like it is so it's such an uncomfortable emotion i put so much effort into never feeling sad which i recognize is a normal human emotion but i don't know what happened to me in my life that i like you probably i mean i use i've talked about this before but i like have totally used anger as a shield for so long so i think that's why and love and hate are so closely aligned like just like that line the line between them is obsession you know yeah and yeah i think that's why it's like so hard like when you go through a breakup and you truly fucking hate the person you broke up with yes

you are going to obsess thinking about them and thinking about how much you hate them and you want to know what they're up to and you want to make sure they're like miserable and like when you finally get to the point where like you process your anger you process your sadness and you've moved on that's like the best fucking feeling that's a really really good point you know what i yeah i don't think you're like a good person like you weren't a good person to me yeah but you don't take up this i'm not yeah exactly you're not living rent free in my head like if I remember you I'll be like yeah that sucked yeah yeah anyways what am I gonna eat for lunch yeah no that's that's real that's actually so true I think that I've now hearing you talk

about it like with my ex specifically I've had an easier time dealing with the breakup when I've stopped being angry about things so I don't know maybe like how it comes in phases is shifting with with the comedian it's just it's hard because it's like I feel like I went into this expecting that I could just keep everything at one level the entire time I was seeing him and I learned very quick that that is not how it's going to be like emotions shift and I felt so so comfortable with him so fast like I was completely myself with him and that took years in my last relationship to just be able to be like a fucking idiot around my around my ex and that says nothing about who my ex was but it was just it takes a long time for me personally to feel

comfortable being like that with someone it's so interesting because i am literally the opposite of you really of like it depends on who i'm dating how much of myself i am and um wow like i with shoe man uh he i don't know i wasn't fully like i fully let go of all of my anger towards him recently like there was always a part of me that was just like god i fucking this guy fucking sucks and like yeah i do still think he sucks but i don't think he's a malicious person um because i had watched the show normal people and the main character the main male character he has social anxiety and i didn't fully understand like they do such a good job representing how it affects you in your day-to-day life and like how you treat other people because

of social anxiety and I didn't fully understand that until I watched the show because like I I mean obviously there's like so many different kinds of anxiety and like I I obviously want people to like me but I don't have social anxiety in that way like crowds of strangers stress the fuck out of me like and it ultimately um like after talking about it in therapy I'm like it it's ultimately because I am afraid of mass shootings um and that's why it freaks me out like I don't know if I've told you this but like I make my grocery list in order of where things are in the store wow yeah so I can just like be in and out wow and then if too many people are in an aisle i'll like skip it and then like go back but did you know that's like a ptsd response

really my therapist um i don't want to cut you off but just an anecdote my therapist was talking about how she worked at the va when she first graduated um and specifically with veterans that have ptsd and they will go to the grocery store specifically the grocery store at like midnight so nobody's in there i love when no one's there me too and they have to like if they if they have to go in that there's a lot of people in there they stay um on the perimeters of the grocery store they don't go down aisles so like they'll stay where they can make sure that they have their back covered no matter where they are oh my god which so it's interesting to hear you say that as a result of shootings because i think that our society that we're living in we're seeing a lot of

like peripheral ptsd from just what we're seeing on the news so frequently like holy shit well so like when i started feeling this way was um my cousin died when he was 12 um from cancer and like besides like my great grandma he's literally the only person in my life i know that has passed away so like that was my first like real experience where it's like you're not really expecting this to happen especially not to a child and um i was i was 22 and i just like really like had to deal with all of those emotions on my own and that sucks like i have a super irish catholic family and like i was so devastated and i didn't feel like i could like lean on either of my parents like trying to process death is already hard and not having to have to process it until i

was an adult like is it's kind of a mind fuck yeah because you have just like this different level of awareness when you're an adult yes then as a kid where you're like yep people die so and that was like my first really like time i've ever had to experience it so that happened and that kind of happened around the same time as like sandy hook and then more and more shootings were happening and like yeah everyone has so many different kinds of anxiety and i was like i lived in las vegas when like the largest mass shooting in america happened and I was working in PR and um all of my clients were clients on the strip it was my first job in PR too and I can't even imagine I really can't like it was my first weekend like so we would

take I worked on the social media team and we would take turns monitoring the clients on the weekends so like you know if you you just wanted to turn your brain off that weekend like someone else was taking care of the clients so that was my first weekend monitoring and I was about to go to bed and then I was like I was using sprout and all of these notifications started coming in about like a shooting and I was like what the fuck is going on and I was about to text my boss and then she texted all of us I did not sleep that night and then I went to work and then we like had a meeting where we kind of talked about it but i just like i don't know i don't think that people are like companies are not ready to help their employees process this kind of trauma no

and um one of our clients was like directly across from like where the shooting was at mandalay bay and like i would drive past it and like the windows were shot out and it was haunting yeah that's what i was talking about so yeah i didn't understand that um a shoe man i didn't understand what processing social anxiety is like until i watched normal people um and was watching this protagonist so a character like i support experiencing social anxiety and i think the times i've seen social anxiety portrayed it's always been a female character um so to have a male character uh experience this and i think like i i don't know like men have social anxiety and it's not represented so to have it represented in a good way like a way that i could finally like

understand um was really helpful in me letting go of that last bit of like anger wow towards him wow yeah i was talking to my therapist after i had finished the show and i was like i didn't understand what it was like like like yeah i don't i don't think that there are any excuses for the way that he treated me and he also has not apologized for any of those things but i also understand that like he he can't control this no yeah and i am so thankful that i don't have to feel that way like i like sure i want people to like me but at the end of the day i also don't really care what they think of me right and that takes some strength to be the ceo of your self-worth yeah exactly it's incredible so I I just have a new level of compassion

like trying to understand when um people are experiencing social anxiety in that way of like worrying so much what people are thinking of you when I was leaving the comedian's house he he he walked me to the door and he was like this might be a douchebag thing to ask but should we do one more for the road like breakup sex and in the moment i was like man maybe but my gut was like it's gonna be too sad but it made me think i've never been approached about breakup sex before like what is your what's your take on breakup sex uh i don't know man i i haven't ever i don't okay so i haven't had like breakup sex per se but it's in the same vein as breakup sex like um when i've broken up with someone so when shoe man and i broke up like i went home for christmas

and then we hooked up then we hooked up twice but it was like we like he had i had a meltdown the first time and then he had a meltdown the second time oh shit both of us just had like our respective meltdowns so it's bound to happen yes okay so that's another that's another interesting questions like having sex with exes yeah that's i've had sex with an ex and it was like years later and it was it was good from what i remember you know that's good yeah we had a good time that's good but there were no feelings involved at that point no that's the difference like i feel like when there's still residual fields it's like never a good idea to hook up with your ex absolutely no i don't think i've ever hooked up with an ex like i i mean in college like

when me and my ex we like did the off and on thing a bit and like we would hook up but then it would always lead back to a relationship so like you know but i've never hooked up with somebody that i've actively stopped hooking up with so i'm always curious to hear people's take on like what yeah i don't know i wouldn't classify what i've done as breakup sex but definitely along this similar lines but my experience was not good like yeah it was so painful yeah emotionally yeah i mean everybody knows it's a bad idea like yeah everybody talks about it like don't ever hook up with your ex but when you're so familiar oh i knew we were going to yeah like even before i went home i was like we'll probably have sex and everyone was like no don't do that

it's all that idea don't do it yeah i know i know i i can't can i like i don't know i don't know like what and i'm thinking about now specifically with the comedian with this with this specific situation like how i would feel if like we reconnected and i don't i just don't think i would be able to i think it just complicates things especially when there are so many feelings involved at one point because even if you're on the same page about like this is this is what it is this is breakup sex like there's always going to be one person involved that is more emotionally invested in it than the other person and i feel like that causes issues you know yeah but again i'm speaking from like hypotheticals because i've never done it but all of my friends that

have hooked up with exes always end up regretting doing it yep it's a bad idea folks don't do it the consensus between the two of us is the votes are in yeah don't don't be doing that don't do it have you ever um remained friends with an with an ex i want to get into a deeper conversation about friendship after sex eventually but like we at a high level goal yeah uh and friendship with an ex friendship with somebody somebody that you've had that you've had sex without like more than once oh not just like a drunk hookup yeah yeah yeah uh i mean the two people i'm thinking of like i have had sex with each of them twice and like it was uh it was it was very like yeah we were out at the bars and like went home together and like oh but we were talking okay so

and then afterwards like years later we we've become super good friends that's i like forget that i've hooked up with these guys that's interesting and i i talk pretty openly with them about it too yeah which is really funny or well with one of them mostly huh i i like don't really remember what the sex was like because it was so long ago yeah um and like i'll like occasionally i'm like i can't believe that like we have had sex it's so weird to me and i'm because i and because i just can't imagine that like happening now yeah i'm just like we're such good friends and like we wouldn't be so close if like we didn't hook up yeah at some point interesting yeah and it's i think the best thing is like also like not having any like romantic

feelings or desire towards them it feels really like i don't know it feels really awesome to have those friendships where you're like yeah we did hook up a long time ago but we were children like you didn't know anything we were so different back then and it's like awesome that that was like groundwork for our friendship now totally and it does define your relationship no not at all i like just knowing about a funny thing that happened knowing about your friendship it's it's crazy for me to i don't know i i appreciate their friendship so much yeah and um i've also always like thought about how i don't know like if you're dating someone who's friends with someone they used to sleep with like being in this circumstance and knowing it's totally feasible

to be like yeah we hooked up like when we were 21 and it was not great because we were both drunk like yeah and we like we used to like flirt and talk to each other but now like there's literally no way that there could be any romantic feelings like to and how would that make your partner feel you know yeah because being in this situation i i'm putting myself in their shoes too because i've totally been someone who's been like you used to hook up with that girl and you guys are friends she's totally in love with you yeah or like you're trying to like you would get back together with her if you could or something like that and me being in the in that same situation of like i am such good friends with people i've hooked up with that i like forget we even hooked

up like it's weird because essentially they're essentially like big brothers to me now that's really that's an important stance to take because it's it's such a universal thing for women and men to be like I don't want you talking to this person jealous yeah oh my god like I can't even imagine dealing with that like the in college and in my relationship I was always concerned about my ex being around people that I knew that he had hooked up with or had feelings for once upon a time and it's just so easy to associate that with something threatening when in reality like you're saying like a lot of these situations are just like one-offs or like we were so young and like things have changed and we we don't want to fuck each other anymore yeah it's like it was

like a once upon a time thing it's almost like the opposite of like what normally happens like your friends first and then you fall in love yeah it's doing it the other way now it's the opposite it I mean it's not like I was in love with these people it's like we had like romantic feelings for each other first and then it became friendship yeah that's pretty that's mature like that's like a very mature way I mean it did not come out it did not come without a few hiccups yeah the fact that you can get to that point now and not have to be like yeah now it's like a funny joke between us yeah I want to get to that point hooking up is such I mean it's been like almost a year now for me but it's such a new thing to me that I don't have I haven't had enough time past that like the

people that I've hooked up with like you can pal around be friends yeah and I even like I like genuinely respect the guys that I've hooked up with but like there there's none of them I like want to like you know have a slumber party with yeah you know yeah so I don't know it'll be interesting to see how our relationships like evolve in the future I don't really talk to the majority of them anymore yeah i don't have a single ex that i'm friends with that's different that's fair yeah there's some that i wish i like we could be friends but maybe one day there's nope thanks for listening love you love you our children Oh, yeah.