The Hoely Hour - The Coconut Did Not Consent

Episode Date: November 14, 2025

You know 'em, you love 'em, Amelia is assaulting Liz's thoughts with 'em. TikTok Sexy Chefs (which is mostly one man making a coconut squirt) is back in the zeitgeist. We also discuss performative males and how the general sentiment around them has changed with the times. We also read a listener email from someone going through a brutal breakup and offer the kind of heartfelt but unlicensed wisdom that we refuse to stop giving out. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See https://pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Hey. Hello. We're at my house today. The weather is dark. Do you want the house tour? You heard that song yet? It's Sab's Carpenter. We're on nickname basis, me and her. it is dark it's sad i slept three hours last night let's go let's fucking let's fucking go the weather sucks the darkness sucks and i think if they weren't compounded on top of each other i wouldn't feel so miserable yeah um i'm also about to get my period not good not a good combo i really i'm really crabby today yeah not with you good obviously yeah i tried to not take it out on anybody that's good yeah because i'm sure there are people that deserve it yeah yeah there

are you're you're a good person just by all the only people i've interacted with face to face today are you and mr liz and then later um maybe someone at the grocery store um depends on which grocery store grocery store i go to because i usually do the self-checkout you know the best grocery store on the planet town and country i've only been i haven't i've only like been in there once or twice and it's because mr liz needs to grab something real quick and that's just the closest grocery store it's i didn't realize it was a chain until very recently is it a washington chain I think it might be just Washington I actually don't know but every time I'm in there I'm like I could I'm going to live here it was really close to my old place and I just like

just never went and I didn't know what I had until it was gone ain't that just the way much like the McRib oh yeah I had asked Amelia before we recorded and I said you know what let's save it for the pod well because I was checking what was trending on Twitter and the McRib is trending so I asked her if she had ever had a McRib have you had a McRib I must have I've never had a McRib like before because I remember the last time it came back maybe not the last time one of the times it came back I was in college so I was still eating red meat and I remember thinking I should try that but I don't know if I ever followed through on it I feel like sometimes I forget that you don't eat red meat I feel like I have like a like the I have like a lingering memory of what it tastes

like so i feel like i must have had it wait have you did you just answer that no i'm i did have i i did answer and i have not had one you should try it yeah i think i will try the mcrib it's a i'm a little scared yeah that's fair because it is mcdonald's my dad every time we go to mcdonald's for my entire life he's gotten the filet of fish and that feels that feels brave that's chaotic but that is also exactly what i would expect a british person to do yeah 100 he loves his fried fish well i also have heard that it's not bad you know i think i think it just really it comes down to do i want fish from mcdonald's yeah that's i mean and i don't right i don't want fish from mcdonald's that feels safe and with the way that like food safety is kind of degrading because of

you know doge um and the current administration just cutting everything that's important i didn't think about like the fda with the government shut down are they still are they still like operating uh well now it's not gonna be shut down because democrats are fucking spineless fucks the fda was already kind of questionable um and now i feel like it's even worse but well i always check i always check online to see what recalls are happening so funny is no matter what we're talking about we always go into politics we were just talking about filet of fish well i think it's i think it's valid it's valid to consider that food safety is degrading um and that's why you see so many people like

getting i feel like maybe it's not as publicized because they also um fucked with like the cdc and like their communications to all of us that live here so just check uh check online to see what's been recalled in your state you know especially with me especially with me i what really made me not trust food was when celery was recalled that's crazy like you should be able to trust celery that's that's the only like if i was worried about eating anything i would just eat celery coli i don't remember i i mean a lot of yeah a lot of like vegetables it's e coli and it's mostly water too i remember when that there was a recall with cilantro huge recall with cilantro for e coli because there wasn't proper like bathrooms set up for the people working on

these farms so they're like shitting in the field yeah if you gotta go you gotta go i i honestly don't blame them like you're not providing any like breaks or safety or i mean absolutely accessible bathroom i don't blame them either but like ew yeah yeah so that's why the cilantro was recalled the cilantro folks the people that think cilantro tastes like soap are really they're turning out to be like genetic wonders well what's on the what's on the menu today amelia besides the mcrib um i finally want to talk about the performative male epidemic and the um whole like conversation of what's happening with that online but i'm excited i don't know a lot about the conversation that's happening about it because i deleted tiktok and i can't remember

if i've announced that yet i deleted tiktok you did announce it and i want to bleep myself it still hurts yeah i i hate not having it to open and entertain me and i hate it even more that i want to just mindlessly scroll and and then i find i have a lot of free time and then i'm like fuck what do i do with my free time i told this to frank and i'm running out of episodes to binge listen to he was like um she should start crocheting like that's what i said well i said knitting because i feel like i push crochet too hard but you know maybe you should start crocheting and we'll see i i still have a sewing machine i don't use so oh my god i use it in my head i'm i'm sewing yeah you know right and it's the thought that counts i could start with like

hemming some curtains yeah yeah start small start shopping your closet and then i'm like but if i have the curtains i have to take them off the yeah that's the whole thing your arms are gonna get tired like uh okay so the thing that i wanted to show you do you remember our conversation about um not our conversation but the first time i showed you tiktok uh sexy chefs oh yeah yeah they've made a resurgence well not really a resurgence but they are back in the zeitgeist this one guy has seven million followers i have to show you this one oh god i'm gonna be traumatized i just want to get your like initial reaction well i keep thinking i have the intrusive thought of that one guy who looked like he was fingering a raw chicken cutlet yeah it's like

it's the same guy it is because he does kind of the same shit fuck you you might feel a little fuck you in advance it does feel a little um violating this video so apologies in advance um i don't want to know that that's what imagine you have a chef like doing that in the back to your food yeah i mean there's a lot of spit oh uh spit yeah yeah spit should not be involved sorry i'm trying to like pause this at the beginning because i i need i need your reaction to the whole thing all right oh god it's 10 seconds oh god but it's a it's a rough it's a rough 10 seconds here you go i turned off the music her entire laptop yeah instead of turning it towards me and pressing play oh god okay the well the the uh what's it called the thumbnail

yeah uh is him full-on licking a ball is that olive oil it must be i think it's olive oil ew ew I hate him the coconut squirting gets me everything honestly the way that he motherfucker

what are you doing the coconut squirting I don't know what it is it like hits a nerve that makes me laugh every single time i see it this is upsetting imagine living your whole life this should be blurred out how is this allowed on tiktok this makes me feel so old i'm like clutching my pearls i'm like dude and that's a compilation of like some sexy parts of like other videos but he if you go to his profile and go to his most viewed videos like the ones at the

top are like like in like insane cedric lawrenson look at how many followers this man has seven million followers yeah so it's working for him i mean well i mean at some point you're watching it you're watching it because it's ridiculous for sure and he he must know that at this point he's been doing this for five years now i wonder if his food's any good you know there's there are theories that he doesn't actually make anything somebody comes in and that's hilarious prepared food that would be amazing but i do think he actually does make the things because like he had to get a start somewhere you know what i mean like i bet he saw some of that shit and he was like i bet i could do that i clicked on his um i clicked on

the link in his bio make cedriclawrenson.com it's cedric dash lawrenson cedric c-e-d-r-i-k oh wow make restaurant quality meals at home unlock exclusive recipes today and it's just him fucking a coconut probably making a coconut yeah just join only fans dude he i he i'm sure okay some of the recipes that are featured are healthy high protein frozen yogurt smoothie um crispy fish burger with chorizo mayo and goat cheese not gonna lie that sounds horrible yeah uh healthy leek and potato soup i love leek potato soup soft baked cookie pizza topped with strawberries and cream all of these things don't seem especially innovative yeah and like there's so many like steps that he takes when he's making his food soup

okay pumpkin soup one hour and 30 minutes I feel like that's a little long maybe the prep like yeah custard banana ice cream I bet he has a video of him making that and it's probably insufferable make the ultimate chocolate french toast four hours four hours well for what reason like what isn't french toast just egg and bread well and this is the ultimate chocolate french toast are you making the chocolate yeah we're making the chocolate from scratch first milk a cow look at the picture of this there's like a banana on there full banana you know y'all i don't know it just seems uh it's clearly a grift to get people to go to his website and pay for oh he has merch what does his merch look like just like dildos

oh it says i love consent oh i love i heart consent i only date men who can cook i heart cedric lawrenson i love consent ew play with her lips not her feelings as a hoodie an apron and a mug oh play with her lips not her feelings like like i understand that it's like a sexual innuendo but is he getting away with that because it's like like chef like he's making food i just like i feel like the only thing that he probably makes money off of any of this merch is i heart consent and why like what does that come from like what how is how does that tie into his brand i wonder because he's definitely didn't get that coconuts consent how much is he how many oh he's two million subscribers on youtube holy shit i mean like

the production value in these videos he makes longer videos on youtube i'm you know knowing how tiktok has been kind of a pipeline for people's like greater content creation career i'm sure he's now just unlocked this thing where he's like this this makes people click my other links well yeah i mean i also i don't know how much of it is genuinely people being like damn that's hot so much as people being like this is fucking ridiculous sorry you have to watch this one hold on sorry i'm i gotta it's too much i can see it it's you know what's interesting is it's usually the sexual stuff is usually just at the beginning of the video i would never hire him because i would be like this guy's gonna be fucking my food in the back this guy's gonna

be fucking my food this is why molten lava cake takes like 45 minutes he made it look like he was jorking off I hate this so much it's so there's something about it that is so fascinating and and hilarious to me and it kind of makes me love him like I kind of love him I don't I'm not I don't watch that like oh my god like this is so sexy I it's like entertaining to me do you respect the grift i do in a way because i don't think that he's doing anything nefarious with it fair you know like grift grift away well we don't know i'm sure people are sliding into his dms certainly they are and i feel like it's like really on brand for a performative male to fuck a fan yeah and have i love consent merch yeah but we don't know this about this man he

might be a great person but that is a great segue into our performative male conversation that i've been teasing for two weeks now so how how this is this conversation is going to be structured because I feel like if we talk about performative males we could talk about this for like five episodes because there's so much and it's changed so much over time like the definition of it but let's just like distill it down a little bit so the term originally performative male came from gender theory which i didn't realize i thought that it came from the internet you know what i mean same same like well i guess i mean i i guess i would have thought performative blank yeah is a theory well so all gender roles are performed in gender theory that's

so true so but the internet is using it more as like a trendy archetype of a guy who signals progressive values for clout or romance points so it's it's kind of turned into like misusing like an academic concept in a way which i think the internet does yeah it loves to do that very well yeah there's there's another example of this recently where it was like we're not oh um trauma bonding people fucking love talking about trauma bonding and it's just not how people use it like how people use it is like oh you guys went through something difficult together you're trauma bonded when really trauma bonding is being like attached to your abuser hmm because I literally thought it was yeah I thought it was ops deep emotional attachment to an abuser hmm isn't that

interesting yeah so it's just it's really interesting how the internet kind of takes these terms and runs with them same with like narcissism like everybody was a narcissist online for a sec when that's like abusive narcissist so then this begs the question is this just a new guy aesthetic like performative males became a meme like the tote bag matcha feminist books indie girl artists it gets a little muddy because like it feels like there are dudes that are doing that like to signal like being a safe man to be around in a nefarious way and then there are dudes that are doing it just because they like genuinely like those things yeah you know like i know a lot of guys that like love a tote bag and like phoebe bridgers yeah you know like but what but where is

the line in that because like it does I think I said this when we were talking about this last week too like it feels like dudes are using it against dudes in the same way that they were using like white knighting oh yeah yeah yeah you know like oh did she pick you dude yeah yeah yeah and when it's like oh I just like like these things so it feels like the definition has been like taking on kind of like a different vibe I guess like it's just it's been interesting watching the shift over time um and it's caused like kind of a trust issue for that reason women online say they can sense when a guy is using feminism as a seduction tactic their critique is that it's not that soft men are bad it's the performing safeness for social points yeah which

absolutely has we i remember a long time ago you brought up harry styles wearing a dress on the cover of vogue in that it was like frustrating in a sense because it's like you can just like take these like feminine things as like a costume yeah they're appropriating femininity rather than appreciating it yeah yeah purpose of like yeah not necessarily sometimes virtue signaling but like some sort of like signal to the public eye not not a genuine um use of these otherwise like feminine things yeah right right behaviors accessories interests whatever but like I guess the question then too is like how how do we as women that date men I mean we're not actively doing that but like women that date men like how can they tell the difference between

like genuinely aligned values versus like curated optics because like I mean it's gonna be different person to person but well I mean I think ultimately the way that women can tell when someone is genuine versus performative is it comes down to how the how they treat you and other women like do they have I think the biggest indicator would be do you have other like femme friends in your life that you aren't sexually attracted to that you haven't hooked up with that don't have a crush on you like do you have genuine uh companionship and friendship that's completely platonic with another like femme person yeah i think that would be a huge indicator to as to understand if someone is performative or not absolutely but also like if there's then the

performative male that like has a bunch of female friends that they haven't fucked but it's because they haven't been had an option to but they would you know what i mean so it's like somebody could have like a bunch of like i'm thinking about this guy on tiktok who's like kind of become like the poster child of a performative male he's like this like kind of grungy looking like not grunge more like emo like fallout boy kind of looking guy who's like i look like this but like what i really love is like coming home and like knitting and anyone who is straight up addressing women that's performative because you don't need to address women about femininity you don't need to address women about feminism you need to address men you need to be addressing other men

that's a really good i don't need a lecture on intersectional feminism yeah i know yeah that's that's a really good point go talk to go talk to your boys yeah yeah because it does feel like you're trying to get brownie points for being for liking oh yeah it's like the kid the kid with the cutting board who would just like give the most like oh yeah fucking basic uh not even advice just like you should be nice to the girl you're dating yeah it's kind of what it equated to yeah and then he did like a bad rap and then people would were they still tease him about it because you say cut a board because they're bored cut a board oh yeah oh i was thinking of a different guy there was a guy that like in like i think it's just kind of a common thing that uh the the

most entry level easy to identify performative male is doing cooking tiktoks that's so real but there was a guy that you and i both loved in like 2020 2021 who would just like cut fruit on camera and like talk about shit he was like oh yeah do you remember him yeah what happened to him yeah well some of those early tiktokers are no more yeah i don't know what they're doing yeah i mean fuck hopefully he's he hopefully he's good the e-boys yeah i think he was i think he was the the og dude yeah and he did just cut fruit but he wasn't like he wasn't trying to be sexy he just was yeah yeah and i don't think he was saying anything that was like i'm a feminist yeah no ladies no yeah you're right i think he was just kind of cute he was he was so cute just

kind of cute and cut and fruit i don't know cute cut is some fruity a fruity cutie um that's me so okay the the men the boys are talking online about the exhaustion of constantly performing masculinity and now also performing quote unquote the perfect progressive man which is a lose-lose i think at the heart of this problem is no matter what they're performing yeah like no wonder like there's a male loneliness epidemic epidemic because they don't know who the fuck they are there's there's no one that they can like look up to that is like in the public eye that is successful just being a normal fucking person yeah you know yeah just being a regular a regular guy yeah and one who cares about other people because that's just not interesting to people

like it's true nobody which sucks because it's the most interesting thing it's like somebody that's just like a good person we need um we need more influencers and famous people to just be showing off their their cool dads yeah they're normal dads i should really i should i should show i should have pete more on on the channel yeah pete's lovely he's he is the the perfect example that dude not a performative male yeah i think my dad's pretty normal yeah he's like sure you know fuck yeah we should we should interview no your dad doesn't know about the podcast does but no my parents know they just don't listen okay and i don't want them to one day we're gonna interview both of our dads that would be really funny be fucking hilarious i think my dad

would have a good time actually oh yeah so so would pete especially if he gets to sing karaoke oh my dad loves karaoke my dad used to love karaoke when we lived in tokyo we'll take our parents out on a parent date i would love that i think my parents would love your parents oh yeah i can't believe they haven't met i know because i feel like we're married yeah we kind of like didn't meet at the wedding like yeah what weren't they both there yeah um so the issue with the performative male kind of meme i guess is that it flattens nuance because the internet loves humor so this archetype kind of got turned into a bit but in flattening it we might end up accidentally reinforcing traditional masculinity by mocking the alternative the internet flattens everything

yeah I think you just need to get used to that being a thing that will always exist like the second the internet starts to amplify a new and interesting idea that's like the second it becomes flattened and it does kind of get turned into these like black and white arguments yeah instead like the internet really does hate nuance like yeah when you you can see it reflected in when anything like when there's a shooting now well so previously like within the last 10 years you know there was like kind of a people would not publicize the name or identity of the shooter of a mass shooting at all yeah because news news stations did not want to bring attention to these people right um and instead they like you know turn their attention to the victims right and

now it's a race to see like who did they vote for what's their political alignment and then they start dissecting what these people actually like believe and what space is their part of and then they can't really make sense of their ideology and it's because people contain multitudes yeah i don't want to blow your mind here but like yeah you're gonna see some kind of like incoherent beliefs and like that don't align completely like with the left or the right they're not they're not gonna just all fall into one category right because like i don't know there are leftists that i know i disagree with on different topics absolutely i don't expect every person to have the same exact thoughts and feelings about me on every single topic right so

i don't know right i'm sure that's part of the problem with like being young and online absolutely everything is flattened everybody has to have like the like the most like concrete opinion about things yeah and the most like interesting opinion yeah right because like saying like well yeah there are performative males but like there's also men that actually like this stuff is not that that kind of ends the conversation in a way that like isn't I feel like like virality culture has kind of turned everything into being like there's no nuance because yeah shit like that like if you have an extreme opinion about something it's going to get attention it feels like yeah i mean that's the whole that's i mean that's the grifter that's the grifter economy

yeah you know like totally is i mean that's why everything you see online is gonna piss you off yeah it like the algorithm is designed to piss you off for the most part unless you don't engage with it in that way yeah right right which is also hard yeah it absolutely is youtube shorts has been nice for me because it doesn't really know me yet and it's only showing me home and furniture restoration so i found some of my favorite things on youtube shorts there's this guy that does something called the career ladder have you have you heard of this no he does um he interviews people he says get on the ladder and they climb up the ladder i have seen a clip of this it's the fucking best he tries to guess what their job is based on like three minutes

of questions i haven't watched a full one i started i started to watch one and then i skipped it because i was like i don't give a fuck what anyone's job is i don't know there's some really don't give a fuck what my job is there's a he interviewed a 15 year old on there that like had brought like a consent voice recording from her dad saying that she was allowed to be on the show it was so fucking cute that's hilarious she was um a crochet artist oh yeah she sold crochet things you can have a job at any age in america and you know i loved that um but anyway it does it feels like this kind of like the conversation has gotten hijacked a bit by like the fact that people can't have like a nuanced conversation I also wonder how many

people that are like kind of polarizing these conversations how many of them are just young like I feel like it is a very 20s thing to be like I know a lot and I have a hard opinion about it yeah like that's so true back and listen to early episodes of this podcast and hear us do that exact thing yeah it's truly that's so true i i see it as kind of like a coming of age experience you like every person throughout their 20s is gonna think that they like are right and smart and know everything yeah and they're gonna be very like firm about that that's so true i love that i love that for the youth yeah they they need that you need to be you need to be you need to be demonstrated that you're wrong yeah yeah you know and even if you're not called out for being wrong

um eventually you'll get older and you'll reflect on that and you'll be like i've learned a few things yeah yeah you can shame yourself yeah yeah you can let it haunt you yeah um have it live on in perpetuity online yeah let it keep you up at night yeah yeah have it live in perpetuity online yeah run for office and then people will pull up clips of it yeah yeah yeah take it out of context that's such a great idea start a podcast yeah start a podcast and then one of these like little AI tools will make fake clips of you and then you'll go to jail for doing something you actually never did I think that this was honestly sound advice yeah that kind of is the end of like the conversation that I wanted to have but I just think I think it's really interesting how the my

bottom line in this whole thing is it's really interesting to watch how this has changed where it was like performative males are like they pretend to like matcha and like tote bags and phoebe bridgers but then like there are dudes that actually like doing that and they're being called fakes which then removes like kind of like the autonomy of men to just like enjoy things that are typically feminine you know or like stereotypically feminine enjoyable just like why do we need to again polarize the polarization of everything why does it need to be masculine why does it need to be feminine yeah like pink used to be for boys because it's light red oh shit i didn't know that actually yeah oh fuck and then blue used to be for girls blue's my favorite color

and i don't know i don't know if it's because blue is like a more calming color yeah but pink fucking slaps it really does pink's a great color I was thinking about when I was younger okay I a little bit off topic I've been like talking more about like having a childhood with like undiagnosed ADHD with my therapist because I've never really talked about it or thought about it that much yeah um and I don't know if this is true for you but this was so true for me when I was in school especially high school like and stop me if I've gone on this tangent with you or on the podcast I've gone on this tangent with Mr. Liz um so students these days like I'll see clips of teachers being like you have to write five sentences five whole sentences for this project

in class and the students are like five full sentences like they can't believe that they have write five full sentences not using chat GPT oh no and then I was like it's five sentences like just make some shit up yeah like that's what I was doing in high school like and then the more I thought about it I was like okay when I was in English class having to read these kind of like complex works of literature I didn't actually read them I would skim them and then my mom would buy me the cliff notes book from the bookstore um and then i would read the bullet points summarize whatever those fucking bullet points said and just make some shit up yeah and then i was like is that how everyone operated in high school like were they actually internalizing some

of these messages no i wasn't and i don't understand why we're teaching like students like the same fucking books over and over and over again fucking god i know let's update it yeah like there's no there's no um i don't know flexibility or like trying to meet kids where they are like why aren't we having them read more modern and interesting books and plays and whatever that they can relate to a little bit more yeah i mean it would be interesting to know why like what the rationale is because i'm sure that there is outside of just like being lazy and not wanting to update the curriculum but like it really like I there's no reason I should have read like fucking animal farm like nine times in school you know what I mean like that kind of

literature is not like you're saying it's not captivating it's not meeting kids where they are it's not like I don't I couldn't tell you a single fucking thing about animal farm because like you know it was interesting but I didn't actually really care and I wasn't able to like tie it back to what it was about which i guess is communism you know what i mean like it's like i don't i can't tell you really anything about any of the books that i read but i was the same as you like i was i was a cliff notes girly spark notes um yeah if it was on spark notes i would do spark notes but if it was one of the cliff notes book yeah books yeah yeah not everything was on spark notes yeah um i used uh spark notes for shakespeare that makes a lot of sense yeah what the

fuck is he saying well it does like bar for bar translation it has to well i did spark notes with shakespeare because i was in theater and we always had a shakespeare play and then i would be like i don't really know what's going on so i'm gonna read the spark notes version so i understand how to say these lines wow good for you i wouldn't even go that far i was i was the lead in pippin and i didn't really know anything that i was saying because pippin is kind of the same way it like is not shakespearean like it's it's english that is understandable but like the play doesn't make any sense oh shakespeare if it's meant to be performed not read yeah in my opinion because when you're seeing it performed and you're hearing the delivery if it has the right inflections

and like they're not reading line line line right you know yeah that's how it's written but if they're reading it like in a way that makes sense then you can understand what is happening right i don't know but then i remember some of these other kids in theater like had so much depth to like their performances and stuff and then i'm like is it was it an adhd thing to not have or a lot of emotional depth but other teenagers seemed like they did i don't know i just like i couldn't I think it's a combination of privilege and ADHD yeah I feel like my ADHD growing up manifested itself in like not giving a fuck about anything that I was learning about like yeah I did not care I only liked film class like that was that was it I didn't care I

liked English because it was like one of the only classes that was sometimes interesting to me and then um if I could do a project that involved doing something crafty yeah I always did really well on those because my my projects were so cute and it doesn't really matter like what's in the project as long as it's like spelled correctly and it's like presented cute I would get a good grade yeah yeah yeah but I didn't know what the fuck was going on I don't really even remember what I was writing about I remember I got a really good score on an essay about Romeo and Julia and I was like I don't even know what inferences I could have possibly made I didn't know what was going on right I don't know yeah no I'm like yeah did everyone just operate like that

or was it just me I don't know I like I think that like my big thing in middle school in high school and honestly college too was like I just didn't have the patience that I needed to get things done like and that was a big a big piece of that was ADHD like I remember like even with crafty shit we had to make like a poem book and creative writing and like like make like a scrap book out of it and I remember getting so frustrated at what I was doing I was just like I would like crumple it up and like rip it up and like throw it around my room and like I'm like I just that makes so like I stopped getting frustrated about shit like that when I started taking Adderall because it's like I was able to like really focus and like slow my brain down enough to get shit

done and i'm like i probably would have gone to fucking yale if i was like properly diagnosed and when i was younger like i probably would have been great at school i think that well how did you do in school not i mean i did like well enough but like i took ap gov and got a one on the ap test which is the lowest you can get what out of five oh okay so i skipped that was a waste of money i was like i'm not doing that i just wanted to get into uw i took ap physics ended up just going into normal physics but I was like this is going to get me into UW and then it didn't so I dropped

but yeah I just I did like well enough because I needed to like I like that's how I operated too yeah I was like okay I can't do bad in school but I'm not going to try my hardest right if I'm doing better than average then I'm fine yeah

so I was when I was talking to my therapist I was like I don't know if I've ever yeah i don't know if i've ever like fully applied myself yeah to anything yeah and what would that look like even today you feel yeah i can't think of anything where i've like put my whole ass into it hmm but i wonder like even if you did if you would feel like you were that's true i also wonder that like you're always going to feel like you need to be doing more and sometimes i feel like i'm missing out because i don't feel passionately about an activity yeah but i wish i felt really

excited about an activity but i don't you haven't found it yet though yeah i also wonder that is it a matter of not finding it yeah is it a matter of my attention span being totally fucked from scrolling on tiktok for five years in a row it might be honestly like i i know that i'm like always pushing crocheting on you and it's like kind of turned into a running joke with like with everyone I talk to I'm like you have to start crocheting my hands being busy doing anything but being on my phone feels so nice I have been playing with my did I've shown you my little squishy ice cube I've been playing with that non-stop so maybe you're right yeah I think maybe I should crochet you should at least get like a woobles which is how I learned it's like the

little packs that like teach you how to crochet okay it teaches you like the different stitches you make cute little animals I'll consider it because I'm like do I want to do something that I'm not ready to invest in you know yeah but I need another thing around the house um that's true I do there's still room on my craft table so you know or coloring coloring is like a great anyway I don't need to like tell you what hobbies to try but it really has like changed everything for me just like keeping my hands busy yeah maybe I need something to get me into a flow state first yeah and then it'll unlock something I don't know I don't know I'm 34 the issue though with crocheting it's over for me i can't find a hobby at 34 i'm basically dead

shut up i'm being dramatic i have realized that crocheting has kind of turned me into an ipad kid though like if i'm having a conversation with someone and like no actually no having a conversation with someone in crocheting helps me listen better because i'm keeping that part of my brain busy but if i'm like at like an event and i'm bored i'll start crocheting like it's like it's like being an iPad kid I'm like just put Amelia in a corner and like give her like a crochet hook that sounds like Mr. Liz with Bellatro I need to play Bellatro I think that you would love it everybody says that it costs like five bucks in the app store though and it's a one-time purchase I know and I've like spent more money on Candy Crush yeah it's not gonna rob you like Candy

Crush yeah wow Candy Crush I haven't heard that name in years I miss you bae um anyway we went off topic there for a sec as we tend to yeah but um we have an email we're not going to read the full email because the uh listener that wrote us this email said that they weren't ready for their full email to be read and after reading it totally understand um but to give some backstory that isn't too revealing this listener had a really horrible breakup their partner broke up with them in a pretty fucked up way in my opinion and I'll just read the last portion of it I'm getting support from my friends and family but felt a pull to reach out to you both to see if you have any wisdom for surviving a breakup that feels like it's going to end you I know it's a big

stretch and you probably won't even read this but I'm spiraling out and need some wisdom if you have any to offer if you have any to offer which feels like a question that is so common you know so that's why it felt like oh my god a breakup that feels like it's going to end you that's i thought that i was going to die i literally thought that i was going to die when i was going through my break yeah it feels like there's a gaping hole in your chest yeah and that's because your brain chemistry is telling you that you need this person like it's truly it's it's a it is you it's an addiction like if you look at the the science you've seen presumably every day of your life yeah for the last however many years right and and like if you look at like brain chemistry

of breakups like it's literally like you're going through withdrawal with your in your brain chemistry so just like if you're feeling like this right now like of course you are yeah and reminding myself of that when i was going through it really really helped because like it felt like I'm sure that you've experienced this too like when I was going through my breakup I was like nobody's ever felt this way I'm the only person that has ever felt this this is the worst thing in the entire world feels so lonely and isolating and at the same time it's like literally every single person like this is the most uniting feeling yeah there's so many songs about it yeah there's so many different like so much art has been created because of the feeling of

a relationship ending yeah and it is it there's so much grief in a in a relationship ending it's it's exhausting it's awful and you know us telling you that is not helpful because you know that well they ask for wisdom for surviving not necessarily advice that's true and my wisdom is like it is going to fucking hurt yeah for a while and then some days will hurt more and some days will hurt less and then it'll just the days that hurt less will start to become more than the days that hurt a lot yeah until it's just a small spot this might I've said this on maybe 20 episodes but this has always stuck with me my therapist like for a while when I was going through my breakup like I felt emotionally over it like for the most part but

it was still like I was still like grieving parts of the relationship as time was going on and she said she's like well it's you know it's like right now it's a big part of the painting of your life but as you paint more around your life that part of your life becomes a smaller and smaller part of the painting and it just like becomes a speck on the painting but it will always be a part of the painting it will just hold less weight and like that's so fucking real because sometimes I still think about my ex but I'm not like sad about it I'm not like I miss that or you know and like if you would have told me that five years ago that like one day I was going to wake up and be like oh this doesn't hurt anymore you literally did liz was like one day you're going to wake up and just

not care as much anymore and i was like you're wrong she's wrong about this she's been right about everything else this is the one thing she's wrong about but you were so right like i mean it's true you won't realize it happens but you'll wake up one day and you'll be like you'll just have a realization like oh i i feel okay yeah yeah and it happens slowly and then even if like you're sad after that like that's normal totally I was looking at so I mean my advice I suppose like actual advice is just to journal yeah like journal every single thought you have about like anytime this breakup comes up in your mind journal out every single feeling and what you're reflecting on because it's I think it's helpful because it's cathartic but then also being able

to look back at like what your mindset was or how you were thinking um when you get to a more clear-headed space you can like reflect on that and be like oh that's what I don't know like I'll go back and read my journal from my breakup and now I'm like oh my god yeah I was going through it yeah but then I'm also like uh I wanted to get back together with my ex so badly even though like our relationship was not good and I my I like when I was rereading parts of my journal like and reading like I'd written down word for word some of the things that he had said or like his text had said to me and he was like trying very hard to like set a boundary with me and I just was not willing to listen at all yeah and um I don't know I think it like when I go back and read

those entries I feel like both not sad like I don't feel sorry for myself but I feel sad for that version of myself because I'm like oh honey yeah it's gonna get so much better like it does get better than this and like no you do not want to backslide into this relationship that was not at all fulfilling for you yeah and I think one of my problems too in my 20s that I noticed was just dating dating someone because they liked me that I mean that wasn't the only reason but it's like okay if they liked me enough and I liked them but there were some things that would probably be like non-starters for me now I'd be like well I can change that yeah it was always like i would date people who i my thought process was like they're a fixer-upper yeah and i know

that's probably like my virgo and venus of like i can fix you um but i needed to fix myself first of all but having the mindset of like i can change this or i can overlook this is usually like not a good place to start a relationship yeah and um also like you shouldn't want to change your partner even if there's something that annoys you about them yeah i don't know i've it took me day like going to therapy and dating someone that like i feel like i genuinely chose for myself you know to be able to have all these realizations but i think it also comes with age totally yeah i mean i i'm completely agree with like with the journaling piece i had the benefit of having it on video and like talking about my healing publicly um which for me like I'm not saying

to do this because the internet's changed I don't think people would be as kind about it now as they were back in 2020 but um like the the like I found a purpose I think through the pain and for me that was really helpful because I felt turning your pain into something yes like that's why so much so many people like create art out of pain because it's like you you have to you feel like you have to be moving in it it's like it's so true you do have to move in it yeah i'm thinking about like i i got really into pilates which is almost kind of like a trope now um but i had so much like excess energy because i was so like i was so heartbroken and upset but i think it also like it depends person to person how you react to those feelings like my reaction was to be

so pissed I would be like fuck you I am gonna like have the time of my life yeah even though I was so heartbroken I had the best time yeah so it's true I kept myself busy at like yeah there's no way it doesn't hurt like in between in between my how heartbroken I was and all of my journaling I was still having a blast yeah like it and that just goes to show that like it's not your life is not just one thing or the other like you're not just like not heartbroken or heartbroken yeah like you can be heartbroken and still like make the most out of it and i really did make the most out of it yeah i mean you have to change yeah i was like okay i moved somewhere completely new i'm either gonna fucking sit in my room by myself and be sad

and like not make any friends or i can be very honest about having my heart broken with these people that i work with yeah yeah because they see me crying now um and keep myself busy and like hang out with people that I don't know yeah right and I did and I think too like the important kind of like bottom line of that too is making sure that you're doing it for yourself because like if you center your ex in your healing nothing good comes from that like and that was another thing my therapist really made me focus on because I was always like well he's dating someone so I should be I should be dating someone yeah it's like one thing I've said to you that I noticed the last time I was kind of like reading my journal was when I was going through my breakup

I had said that like after I so after this terrible breakup shortly after I started dating someone else and I was not ready to date them and I think so after I broke up with that person after realizing you know they're great they're just not we're not right together that's when my healing like pedal to the metal yeah it completely sped up I feel like that's when I had the most growth and the most change because I took a break from dating I was like I'm not gonna date anybody yeah I'm just gonna do whatever I want and that was the the time frame or that was like the period where I think like I grew the most yeah so I do think in a way that like focusing on like oh I need to start dating someone or like I need to find someone else like that focus takes you

away from like facing the grief that you need to face yeah but also at the same time I'm like I don't regret that I don't regret doing that no that that relationship still served a purpose for both of us totally um I don't know what purpose it served for him yeah but whatever that's his that's his thing hopefully it was some sort of like growth or helpful i don't know um yeah taking a break from dating on purpose is like i think one of the best things you could do for yourself when you are going through a breakup yeah i think like just you need to sit in the discomfort regardless of what that looks like i think the thing that we like are socialized to do is like be sad and then move on and it's like that's just not how emotions work like you really

have to that's literally how grief has never operated yeah you have to like pick up the emotion and like really honor it before you put it down and unless you do that like it's you know it's really hard to kind of shake the cobwebs of it down the line because you haven't done all of the healing that you need to do so like I think my bottom line in all of this is my wisdom I guess is like to give yourself grace it sucks of course it sucks like it hurts this fucking blows and it's unfair and you will come out on the other side of this so much stronger like I am so grateful for having my heart broken when I did like having your heart broken makes you cool yeah it gives you like it makes you cool especially if you're like I'm gonna I don't know I think every time someone

goes through a breakup they need to make it a main character phase absolutely 100 you need to be the like you need to become the most interesting person in your life yeah like do things for the plot be kind of crazy like yeah your life is an HBO rom-com now yeah have fun with it we want to sit we're rooting for the main character absolutely as the audience and also I'm really proud of you for like reaching out to us also because I think putting these things into words fucking sucks also like writing it typing out the story of what happened is not easy but like that's also a big step you know like just being able to like I mean it says in here that you have like support from your friends and family but like you know sometimes you feel like you're like okay how many more times

can I talk to them about this totally yeah but I think Amelia and I found a lot of like solace in each other like I was kind of already on the other side of my breakup by the time we were talking about yours yes and I was ready to listen to every single thing that you had to say about your breakup yeah because yeah it hadn't been that much longer than I had been dealing with mine that was really like our first like real bonding moment was like me texting you in March of 2020 about like how sad I was yeah you were like I'm here if you ever need to talk and I'm like bet we're gonna talk every single day yeah we're gonna talk all the time because COVID is also happening yeah so and then for the next five years also yeah every day every every single day it's true I do talk to

every day yeah what do we even talk about most of the time oh i like i said last week like i had said to mr liz like i was like this is how amelia and i talk at all times yeah we're having multiple conversations over text and half the things we're texting each other are just like i did this thing and i had a thought about it yep and i'm gonna tell it to you yeah we were talking about open ai today and like their bad business practices we just talk about everything yeah i i like to know i like to know little things that you have going on i like to share little things that i have going on fuck yeah and even if you don't reply I don't care yeah that's how I feel too again yeah I'm like if I have a thought it's going to listen I know you'll text me when you have time yeah

and I always do I'll text you when I have time amen sometimes I'll have my phone open on a crochet pattern how many times can I talk about crochet this episode I wonder let's see but sometimes I'll have my phone yeah everyone's gonna be like blacked out at the end but I'll have a crochet pattern open on my phone and my sound is off but it'll be open on my phone for like an hour and then i'll go to my messages and i have just like 20 texts from you just like all about different things liz is high and watching something yeah liz must be high again it is always a pleasure truly um i think we can do you have anything else that you wanted to share with any of our heartbroken listeners and this listener that wrote to us no um there's an app called mend

and it really helped me during my breakup you should also do the um how we feel app because I've never heard of this really I thought I told you about this I love how we feel I wish I used it more regularly I did use it pretty regularly for a while but um you can set up times for it to prompt you and you like log how you're feeling and then you can like write notes so I'll write like what has gone on that day or what is going on and then you can tag like where you are so like i would i added multiple locations that i regularly was at so like i'm at home i'm at work i'm at the gym i'm at amelia's or whatever and then um they added something else where you can add where in your body you feel you're feeling and um so when you choose you like log in and it it's like how

do you feel and it gives you a whole bunch of emotions so there is positive high energy positive low energy negative high energy negative low energy and i think that's a good kind of like totally way to like measure these feelings and then it has a description of each feeling so you can be like oh that that does resonate with me that's how i feel and then yeah that's when you log the notes and you can say like where you're doing what you're doing who you're with um you could take a picture and add that so it's almost like a journal and then yeah you pick where on your body you feel the feeling that's so fucking cool i love this yeah and i think it's a good way to kind of monitor like your how you're feeling in general because it is good to like be

prompted to pause and be like how am i feeling absolutely where do i feel that feeling yeah and like kind of reflect on your day totally that's a really good that's a great idea for an app not sponsored but you should definitely check that out everyone should check it's a great app it's free oh my god yeah and um i've had other people say like they use that app with their like special needs students wow yeah so it does a lot it's good to know how you're like be able to identify your feeling and feel it in your body yeah i really love that they have so many options for emotions too because sometimes i'm feeling positive low energy but low energy is it has a negative connotation you know like i'm feeling low energy but it's like no no i'm feeling kind

low energy i'm like vibing yeah i'm like chill crocheting yeah i'm like take another shot all right well shall we wrap yeah um one note to the listeners uh if you have netflix or plex you should watch the new frankenstein i almost watched it directed by guillermo del toro who does jacob alorti play the monster the creation the creation shut the fuck up and then um oscar isaac is is oh the scientist the things i would do to that man i love oscar i love oscar isaac uh and mia goth's in it that makes sense yeah yeah she would be uh well so she comes on screen and i say to mr liz do you think her character is important and then he was like she wouldn't be in this movie if her character wasn't important i was like that's so true anytime mia goth's in

something you're like okay it's a big deal yeah yeah she's about to fuck shit up yeah no i almost watched it last night i ended up watching uh i want to re-watch it i've been having frankenstein dreams really yeah oh it's like that i i can't i don't even know why so like right after we watched it both mr liz and i had frankenstein dreams makes sense because we watched it before bed right um have not been able to stop thinking about it wow it's it's a really great movie okay um when when we were watching it i was well because i thought this kind of seems like a boy movie yeah you know yeah um that was stupid of me you know Frankenstein was written by a woman Mary Shelley shout out Mary Shelley um and then I was watching it I was like no this is a girl movie hell yeah it's just

like some really deep commentary on how like men spend their lives wanting to be better than their father only to become them fuck yeah damn anyways well I watched host last night the movie that was made in 2020 about the friends that did a seance over zoom amazing it's actually very I wish that I watched it during the pandemic because I think it would have been horrific during like during that time now is it kind of corny now it's not really corny it's just not scary like have you seen the war of the world like people talking about the new world the worlds with it's like amazon sponsored no it's not it's alleged it's allegedly not sponsored by amazon but I'm like did they give this like director and producer like a fuck ton of money to make this seem like

amazon's really cool oh no i'm gonna send you a video of a youtuber recapping this whole movie and we need to talk about it okay because from my perspective working in working in b2b tech and being like the spaces i'm in now online is so filled with like corporate executive brain rot slop yep literally like that's the best way i can describe it it's just like it's like linkedin thought leadership yeah yeah that's what this movie is no a linkedin thought leadership what the war of the worlds taught me about b2b sales like it's oh no so i'm not gonna say watch the movie no uh but i'll watch the recap yeah it's starring ice cube um are you serious i really love ice cube um and they filmed it during 2020 so everyone like if if it had come out during 2020

that would be you'd be like okay this is cool for what they did for having to be fully remote but the fact that it came out in 2025 i think either 2024 or 2025 oh my god and it is so fucking bad i don't know if it came out this late because they tabled it or because the editing took so long oh my god i have to look at the um rotten tomatoes it's it's bad it's bad but to me it's the the takeaway i'm sorry if i'm spoiling this for anybody the takeaway from this war of the world is data is the most important um currency that we have data is super fucking important oh no and i was like that is exactly what i would expect some fucking tech ceo yeah to believe that sounds like something that you would see at like a trade event that's what elon musk believes yeah

i'm sure guess currency is the most important data data is the most important currency guess what the the Rotten Tomatoes score is three percent four percent you're really close I almost guessed eight four percent I have not seen that in a minute that's fucking wild okay so the video I'll send you it's Drew Gooden if the listeners are curious yeah so it's Drew Gooden doing a recap of this movie and it's so funny I was very high when I watched it and I I don't know if other people think it's as funny as I am but I know um one of our listeners are our Pisces bestie I think she'll really like that video because i think she can relate to the the corporate she absolutely can that's really funny on the side of um rotten tomatoes uh was the rating for good boy have

you heard of this movie no it's um it's a horror movie from the perspective of a dog oh wait okay i think i've seen like maybe people talking about this apparently the dog does not die in the movie there's like they clarified this because i would not watch it yeah i really want watch it 90 on rotten tomatoes anyway 90 that's surprising yeah anyway okay i could i could honestly keep going because i'm running on one brain cell right let us know if you guys want us to start a second podcast where we talk about movies and tv shows the the i want to i want us to become a recap podcast so badly the rolly hour like the roll like you're rolling oh thank you so much we already have a name hey um and cut okay sorry let's end it do you want me to sing us out

or do you want to sing us out i'll sing us out okay we love you our children thank you way more beautiful than the last couple i felt really good about that and that's because i took us out on those ones but that's why I felt the need to do it today you know you've really been carrying the team no no no no no no no no no I'm just jealous all right we love you guys love you bye