The Home Service Expert Podcast - How to Become The Number #1 Contractor In Your Industry and Get More Customers

Episode Date: December 25, 2020

Dave Euse had two decades of experience in SEO and raising the profile of clients on the online realm. Now, he’s a year into running a service that connects homeowners with top-quality contractors, ensuring a successful professional relationship for both parties. In this episode, we talked about leadership development, business consulting, marketing, consulting, demand generation, performance marketing...

you know, I always say, think of Google like the librarian. And if you were to walk in with a book, you know, when I was a kid, I'll date myself here and I show you these wisdom hairs that I've acquired over the years. But, you know, when you're a kid, we used to wrap our school books in brown paper bags, right? We'd make these book covers on it and that's how you keep them good. Well, if you didn't have anything on it and if you took it into a library and the librarian could not open up the book, it's a guess as to where that book should be indexed on the shelves of the library, right? So think of Google in that sense that if you create a website, you can have it look great,

great images, great content, that sort of thing. But if you don't go the extra little mile to make sure that you've got properly written title tags and descriptions that work in harmony with what we see with our eyeballs, right? Google is looking at the code, users are looking at the face. And so that code, those title tags and descriptions still today play a very big role. And if you don't bring your website to par doing those little things, then you're really missing out on some of the easiest and least expensive stuff that you can be doing welcome to the home service expert where each week Tommy chats with world-class

entrepreneurs and experts in various fields like marketing sales hiring and leadership to find out what's really behind their success in business. Now, your host, the home service millionaire, Tommy Mello. Welcome back to the Home Service Expert. I'm Tommy Mello. You guys know me. I'm here with a good friend of mine, Dave. And Dave, you're going to kill me, but I don't want to butcher your last name. I think it's easier than it sounds. Yeah, it is. You know, just remember useful or useless. So, you know, either way it works. But yeah, it's use.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I've heard it. I just could have said use or use. Yeah. I'm going to go over some of Dave's expertise here. He's an expert of leadership development, business consulting, marketing consulting, demand generation, and performance marketing.

He's the co-founder and president and CEO of Savon Services. And he also owns a company called Raise Your Rankings. He's got two decades in SEO and raising the profile of clients on the online realm. And now he's a year into running a service that connects homeowners with top quality contractors, ensuring a successful professional relationship for both parties. I know Dave for a long time. He's generated hundreds of thousands of leads.

He definitely knows what's going on. And I think, Dave, the thing that I love about what you're doing is, I think Google has way too much control. You know, we just went over a book on my podcast, the people that are involved in my book club. Yeah. And it's called The Four. And it talks about Amazon, Google, Facebook and Apple. And they pretty much own the world now. And I like what you're doing and first of all let's talk a little bit about your entrepreneurial that's a tough word for me your journey over the last couple decades and how you got started kind of in the lead gen space and how you connected

leads to good companies yeah well the entrepreneurial journey I think it started the day I was born I think my mom said that know, I didn't require the slap on the butt. So she knew I'd be a self starter. So it kind of all started there. And, you know, everything from mowing yards and shoveling snow back in East Cleveland, you know, being able to go ahead and do that, I just kind of realized that, that having that kind of flexibility and that kind of freedom, you know, money at the end of the day really just comes down to giving you time. And I think I've always valued that and being able to want to do it. So it's just a matter of where you find yourself being successful and winning just, you know, it tends to bring more winning. You know, all of us that run businesses, most of the time, I think everybody gets pretty excited. We all like making money, but the entrepreneurial journey is usually about accomplishments. And those are the things that we kind of gauge our business on is being able to move the chains, get the first downs,

keep moving in the direction that we know that, you know, ultimately we feel like we're in forward progress. So for me, the whole entrepreneurial thing has just always been laid in the process, you know, building things, love building things. So the digital journey side of it started to evolve back in 97, 98, you know, the internet was kind of rolling in and I kind of realized that it wasn't going to go away. And as a kind of a sales and marketing guy through my twenties and thirties, I got to the point where I realized that, you know, the internet is going to be an emerging piece that businesses are just going to thrive on. And I kind of guessed right. One of the things that were fascinating to me and not being, you know, necessarily an engineer or anything like that, I just was fascinated by

how the engines and directories were positioning websites that were out there. And I knew a couple of guys that were in web development and building websites, and they were building out $50,000 and $100,000 websites for corporations, you know, enterprise level stuff. And my office at the time was in that same building. So I kind of saw what they were doing. And I kind of said, you know, there's so many companies that are putting money into having a web presence. And back in 98, it was back in a time when companies were scratching their head going, we really think the internet's going to be around. Is it going to last that if I could figure out the ways that these engines were determining the rankings, there might be a business there. And it was actually before, you know, SEO was actually an acronym. So it kind of started back then. I started a search AZ, which was an Arizona specific search engine. And it was kind of like a little directory

and had a series of buttons underneath everybody's listing. And we upsold the buttons for 20 bucks a piece. And it went off well. We just started contacting, calling, and, you know, asking people, if you don't have a website, we could light up this little info button or a coupon button. And people responded to it. And it taught me that other people like me were seeing the internet as an emerging technology. So I just kind of stayed on that path. And it evolved into realizing that I would take an experiment, created a website originally

called MetaTagMD. And it was kind of like figuring out that the meta tags in the HTML code and not being a web guy myself, I just realized what are the pieces that are talking to the engines that help identify the content. And that was the beginning of my SEO journey is it locked on and it made a lot of sense to me that if you can learn how to optimize, even at what we call a par level, then you can really drink all the juice that you can squeeze out of an orange. Because if your cup has holes in it, it's not getting to your mouth, right? So I think a lot of times businesses, when they have websites, the things that you can do even on a budget are just to make

sure that you've got some of the basics covered from an optimization standpoint. And today, there's just a plethora of knowledge and help guides and insight in doing that. Whether you're using WordPress, Shopify, GoDaddy's platforms, any of these other web builders, many of them now integrate with some SEO tools. So that journey for me was just very captivating. And it just kind of took me into building a company that did lead generation with live calls, pay-per-click calls. And when I started contracting or calling contractors, telling them, you know, we've got this new lead source, they were really intrigued by the fact that we were doing exclusive calls. So compared to the landscape of everybody else, whether it was HomeAdvisor, Angie's List,

any of the other people that were out there doing lead gen, one thing that seemed to resonate pretty strongly with everybody was the fact that if we were willing to give you an exclusive lead, would we have more to talk about? And I know it's rhetorical, but it worked like a charm because every time I would reach out to a business owner, particularly in the home services space that were buying leads from some of those other sources, they really realized that there was a value in being able to know that if they were gonna be the only one to get that lead call, that was gold.

And again, I just kind of stayed on that tradition and it went for 10 years. I mean, at our peak, we were doing four, five, 6,000 lead calls a month, billing out at 30 bucks a piece. I thought I had a money printing machine. It was just phenomenal. And I'm touring the country, bought a big motor home and just love the internet nomadic lifestyle. So it's in me. I like to evolve and help businesses. It's pretty, pretty awesome.

So quick math here, 60 times 30 is 180,000 a a month that's a pretty darn good living and um i know some of the companies that you did it with i actually used to bump into your website all the time so you had several of them and they rank and the weird thing was is the way that you built it they'd really rank well like you know maricopa county has 32 cities and there's this area called Florence. There's another area called Casa Grand and that's in another county. But your website would automatically take the top spot of maybe not Phoenix, but all the surrounding areas. And that would drive leads.

And it's crazy because, you know, I kind of compare it to this. I knew crypto was going to be something. I knew Zoom was going to be something. I knew Zoom was going to take off when COVID happened. I knew it, but I didn't do anything. And sometimes the writing's on the wall. Sometimes it's like, you just got to act. That's right. You know, Google changed your algorithm. And let me tell you this. There's not anybody that's been in the game as long as me and you. I've been in garage doors for 15 years, but I knew SEO the minute it started.

I think Google came out, there was still other search engines, and then it slowly over a year became the dominant force. But a lot of things happened. I remember Mobilegeddon is what they called it. Instead of Armageddon, it was called Mobilegeddon because they'd literally take your website and just throw it out if it wasn't If it didn't, wasn't mobile optimized. And that kind of was the end of your, not the end of it. Cause you still made money, but kind of just screwed you up one day, just all of a sudden you woke up and you were probably like, what happened? Tommy, I had a dashboard on my computer. I'd, you know, I'd log in. It was like my control center, you know, it was on my on deck and I could see all the calls coming in and all the contractors. I mean, we had lots of companies

all over the country and lots of different verticals that we were generating calls for. And I'll never forget that, that morning, you know, 2012 waking up and realizing that, you know, just got kicked in the gut because we went from about 6,000 phone calls a month and we lost 80% of our business literally overnight. That's a pretty big haircut. So yeah, you know, Google's obviously, you know, they're Google, you know, you got to find a way to play with them and they're always evolving. One thing about them is obviously, you know, the web spam team that's headed up by Matt Cutts that, you know, that team is obviously there to try to make sure that the quality, the content, all those things,

the best practices are always adhered to. And it's always been a game of cat and mouse. I think that, you know, every particular marketer wants to be able to get a leg up. And I think in the digital realm, you know, there's always the white hat, gray hat and black hat. And I knew enough because of my early SEO agency of optimizing for clients, you'd never want to put a client at risk. So you made sure that you really avoided doing anything that was in the black hat realm. But I lived in the gray hat. I lived in that zone where to try to get an advantage,

but I didn't perceive it as spammy. I just felt like I was doing all of the little, little tiny things better than my competitors. And your example doing all of the little, little tiny things better than my competitors. And, you know, your example about using like the little cities and the zip codes. To me, I always called it the POE, the point of entry. If I can have more points of entry into my website, indexing into the search engine, I improve my visibility. Even though you may, all those pages aren't going to necessarily come up, they are going to start to come up, especially as the technology for Google started to be able

to check geo and they could actually start to see that that user is, is down in Chandler. And so, you know, the Chandler, Arizona customer may not be putting in garage door repair Chandler or plumbing repair Chandler, but sometimes they just put a zip code in, right? Or they just put in garage door repair. I mean, even way back then, there was the ability for that to start to get sniffed out. So if I had an optimized page that was targeting that geo, those cities, those zip codes, then that's how I kind of dominated early on was I just had more POEs than any of my competitors. And so the guys like yourself that were actually in the business with a service website, if you weren't optimized for those series of zip codes and those cities and those geos back then, then yeah, I mean, we kind of dominated.

We had multiple websites on the first page of Google. So oftentimes we were controlling 30, 40, sometimes 50% of the first page of Google with all these different industry-specific websites. And yeah, collectively, they generated a lot of calls. You know, the best way to describe it back then, and it still kind of works like, yeah, it's a bad descript. I don't know if you guys can see this, but I just kind of drew it. Your homepage is a big cup and you got your state. Let's see.

City. Yeah. And the neighborhood. So you give your domain enough authority and the homepage fills up into the state pages. You fill out the state page. It goes to the county, then city, then zip, then all the way down to some people search neighborhoods.

Yeah. You said it was really good at it. And I remember, I mean, I knew who all the players were in every category because you know one day i decided it's too easy so i built 20 websites with over 10 000 pages a piece yeah this thing called best spinner i spin the content you know there's nothing that says you're gonna go to jail and this is illegal right there wasn't anybody jc petty's got kicked off the internet i mean there wasn't anybody not who's anybody because google's

algorithm wasn't now i play by i'm the whitest of white hat i mean yes really like i built a brand that i want to keep yes eight generations a different game i mean i go to matt diggity and some of these conferences i've been at thailand and these guys are still they mess around with their own sites but it's a shitty game to play dave i gotta tell you it's like you never know yeah it's a short short game and it's not in my opinion it's just not worth it but get real reviews from real customers do the right thing and you know what i've learned in the last week is i looked at our indeed in our glass door and and it was good but it wasn't great and i always think about good reviews on yelp and and google and next door and groupon and all these places but i never really thought about

what people see when they see their indeed so i was just talking to two of my recruiters and i'm like all right let's get our happy employees let Let's get the word out there. Let's put a bunch of pictures. Let's answer every question. Let's put link to videos. And the one thing I'll tell the people listening is the best way to grow a business is through the employees that are seeing your customers. So make sure that looks good too. Make sure those places that employees are finding you have good reviews too, because

I'll tell you what, your conversion rate with employees is when you're growing is just as important as customers. So let me ask you this, and I know you shifted and we're going to talk a lot about that here in the second half, but what's a good SEO strategy for a home service company on a limited budget? Well, I think it's kind of what I said earlier, you know, in terms of making sure that your site is to par and par is just making sure that you've got proper title tags, descriptions in your in good content, making sure that you're, you know, your targeted keyword. Don't try to capture too much on one single page. We always say that point of entry page should have one primary call to action and really just be focused in on on a particular keyword target so that Google can interpret it. You know, I always say, think of Google like the librarian. And if you were to

walk in with a book, you know, when I was a kid, I'll date myself here and I show you these wisdom hairs that I've acquired over the years. But, you know, when you're a kid, we used to wrap our school books in brown paper bags, right? We'd make these book covers on it and that's how you keep them good. Well, if you didn't have anything on it and if you took it into a library and the librarian could not open up the book, it's a guess as to where that book should be indexed on the shelves of the library, right? So think of Google in that sense that if you create a website, you can have it look great, great images, great content, that sort of thing. But if you don't go the extra little mile to make sure that you've got properly written title tags and descriptions

that work in harmony with what we see with our eyeballs, right? Google is looking at the code, users are looking at the face. And so that code, those title tags and descriptions still today play a very big role. And if you don't bring your website to par doing those little things, then you're really missing out on some of the easiest and least expensive stuff that you can be doing. And again, there's a lot of tools to be able to help do that. One of the things that a lot of people that are on that trail don't realize is that there's extra weight given to when you have the

keyword term appear closer to the front of a title tag than at the tail end of the title tag. So those are little things, you know, that you should really pay attention to that. If you're selling garage door Springs and you have a garage door Spring page, you know, make sure that garage door Springs leads your title tag and then bring in some other things behind that. You wouldn't want to necessarily bury it in the back end of the title. So just those little things are what I call tiebreakers. So if there were 30 websites that were all pretty much up to par with you, what is that one little thing that you could be doing to differentiate you and have Google give you that little extra nudge that's going to give you that extra visibility. One of the things that I found with title tags is not a lot of people that even

do SEO look at those. They take the first paragraph of that page and it kind of just says mumbo jumbo when you could actually customize that, which doesn't really help SEO as much as conversion rate. Right. So my buddy Graham's out here asking a difficult SEO question. And I think Matthew Woodward covered it. It's all about the Google core vitals that are coming up right now. You could actually look at those and adjust for them. And Matthew Woodward covered it. I think Matthew's so tied up in the game still, and you're on to bigger and better things, which we're going to discuss.

What do you expect? I'm just going to ask you, what do you think to expect here in terms of SEO in the next year or two? I think, obviously, making sure that you stay in the white hat area, number one, is going to be paramount. It's just far too sophisticated. There's little things that you can do, but I think that going forward, you know, making sure that you've got good local, all of your local signals are working really well, that they're all dialed in. I think with COVID, that brings in a whole new level of how does the

normal behavior of a consumer, how has that shifted or changed? And how does it impact your business? You know, what's the behavior difference for a particular customer? So I think having content that maybe addresses some of that can actually be pretty purposeful. Understanding what the intent is of the customer. From an SEO standpoint, I think that those are the kinds of things that Google and other players are really starting to look at in terms of, are you offering up the quality experience that's answering the intent of the user search term? And I think that that really is, it's going to be bigger going into the near future here. I think there's just a lot of things that are going

to help play into that. And so for us, when you think of the points of entry, like I said, I call them POEs. If you can have points of entry, just make sure that that opening paragraph, and you said it right, Tom, that the opening paragraph has to lead to that call to action. Make sure that the customer within that first three seconds landing on the page clearly knows that they're in the right spot. So don't think that every customer has to land on your homepage. Make sure that they're just landing on a page that is clearly defined, that the call to action is right there. And if you want phone calls, make sure that the phone call is available there. I know back in the day, before pay per call was got hot. Back in, you know, 2000 2001, we're, we're doing, you know, lead forms, right. So we were getting people filling out a form, and then we forward the results on to somebody that was paying us for the

lead. So that evolved over time into pay per call, then we got rid of the forms, and everything was phone numbers. So I think today, giving people good connections that way, I think that it's all going to be part of the mix of the whole SEO thing. I think people are going to start to realize that they just need to, if you get the visibility, then just make sure that you're converting because little things like time on site, right? Google's looking at that. They know how long people are staying on it. What are people doing in terms of bounce rates? All those things are still in the mix. Well, you know, I think that Google's collecting more data with their local service ads because they're tracking the reviews now. And what I do think is we're going to a world where voice is going to be a lot bigger.

You're going to be able to tell Siri or Alexa or Google what you want and when you want it. And it'll decipher who's the best based on proximity and real data. And they'll say, how many warranty calls? How many people are actually using the guarantee program against the company? All these things, but it doesn't change as fast as we'd like because the consumers don't change as much. So, of course, Google would like everything to be Uber, would be able to drive without a driver and all this stuff. But the problem I have with that is they said we wouldn't use cash. They said we weren't going to write checks anymore.

25 years ago, they said cars were going to fly and back to the future. But it just doesn't happen as fast as these tech companies like Amazon Home Services, which I've given the shot three times is a bunch of shit it doesn't work because the guys that created it are geniuses but the guys that i gotta work on it aren't and they want to uberize our industry and it's just it's not possible and that's why i've decided to build a company that's going to go all over the country in one industry where these big companies are going to need me because I have trained guys, reliable transportation, the skilled technology aspect each tech has to have to have a tablet and a CRM. I got two more questions before we get into

the meat and bones. Service magic switched to home advisor and I've got people leaving comments. And I got to tell you this, I've made a lot of money with home advisor and I've got people leaving comments. And I got to tell you this. I've made a lot of money with home advisor. I've made money with thumbtack. I made money with, with a lot of crap, not a lot of money, but I had Dave Smith, the COO of home advisor speak a little bit of my book. He wrote a chapter in there and I don't hate him. I don't think they're God's gift to mankind, but they make money.

But service magic switch to home advisor the problem is i do something with the data you know they resell the data and they also you got four or five people competing who's the cheapest what are your thoughts on a company like home advisor obviously they're the 900 pound gorilla in the space for providing leads they have been for a long time i mean obviously there's going to be additional players that then enter the realm, but here's kind of my take on the whole model of selling leads to multiple contractors. Okay. So number one, when you look at the commercials or you look at that whole model of, you know, it's like the lending tree model, right? You know, let contractors compete for your business. So right there, if you just take those words and you say, let contractors compete

for your business, the message you're giving to the consumer is price should be your prevailing concern. So I think what happens with that model is the consumer becomes overly cost conscious rather than quality of service conscious because they're expecting to get a bunch of phone calls or they're expecting to get a bunch of quotes anyway. And to me, that's where the Achilles heel is on those models. So I think that in combination with the fact that the way that the consumer interacts with a company like HomeAdvisor or some of these other companies is that the consumer is calling in and they become the product, the consumer. It's your data. Because when you give up your name, your address, your email, your phone, what is my project? You're putting a lot of information out there that's going to now get dispersed to four,

five, six contractors that are all willing to buy that information from a company like HomeAdvisor or others. And you and I both know that only one company is going to actually get the job, right? So only one company is going to make the money off of that particular lead. So the four or five or six other companies paid for the lead and that becomes a cost of non-acquisition because you just spent money, right? And good for home advisor and companies like that. But I just believe that beyond that, I don't shame them for wanting to make money. They do very well, right? They're very large. But what I find a challenge with is that I like helping the small business owner and not at the expense of making them all compete against each other.

I just think that it's a bit of a flaw because the consumer that hasn't had that experience yet and now their phone is blowing up for sometimes weeks, even months after whether it's a garage or your hot water tank or whatever it is has been fixed, sometimes there are some contractors that are not on their game. And so sometimes they're finally catching up on leads that they paid 50 bucks for. Two weeks later, they're calling the customer going,

hey, I hear you got a broken garage door. You need some help. Well, that was fixed two weeks ago. Oh, well, okay. So again, I think a lot of contractors, the ones that are Johnny on the spot or Tommy on the spot, they're going to do well with those. But I think that there's a lot of churn there. So that's part of where I think some of my evolution to today has kind of brought me to where I'm at. But I think that those models are always going to work, but there's just going to be a lot of churn. I think that contractors kind of come and go. And I like to keep contractors happy with us and staying with us. And I, fortunately, I've gone through cycles with my previous lead gen company because of the exclusivity of those leads where I had more

turkeys and Christmas cards being sent to me just because I, they love the exclusivity and that loyalty. You know, one of the things that I've realized over the last few weeks is the best companies that do recruiting and they do orientation correctly and training always win. That's because they build a machine and they don't settle and they top grade and they make sure that they're good drivers, good at inventory, good at communication,

good at communication with the CSRs, the dispatchers, follow management, show up to meetings, don't call out on the weekends. And that's the machine that most home service companies get wrong. And I wanted to hear one more thing from you because you said you've had probably hundreds, if not wanted to hear one more thing from you because you said you've had probably hundreds, if not thousands of companies that have bought from you. And I'm sure

if you came to a company like me, I'd be like, I'll buy whatever you got because I know how much a real lead costs. As long as I track everything and I'd say, how well are these customers doing for me? And I'm the type of guy, as long as it's reasonable, I'll try anything. And the good news is your stuff is free, which we're going to talk about. But what did you notice about some of the best businesses that were buying your leads? What were the attributes that stood out for you? Well, I think that back then, we weren't free. So we had to actually still reach out and differentiate ourselves. And as I mentioned earlier, our big differentiator was the fact that we were willing to give you an exclusive lead. So that was a head start. And it always got everybody's attention when I said, you know, hey, if I was able to go ahead and get you five to 10, you know, exclusive calls that none of your competitors are going to see. Would we have more to talk about? Rhetorical, yeah, but it always led to that becoming the focal point was the exclusivity.

So now once we got them signed up, you know, we had calls recorded back then because that's how we were able to determine whether it was a valid lead or not. So we had call auditing. Human beings would actually, we would listen and we would be able to tell within the first 30 or 40 seconds where it looked like it was going. And then we would bump to the tail end of the call to hear if it ended up being a booked call. So we were able to provide that level of auditing, if you will, to make sure that our calls were actually working out and resulting in bookings. We never followed through to find out how much money you made off of them because really that wasn't any of our business. But our goal was to get you these exclusive calls that would result in appointments.

And we found that because of that exclusivity, there were 60, 70% booking rates off of our lead calls. In fact, I won't mention by name, but we had like a major franchise that told us that they converted our lead calls better than lead calls that were coming in off their own website. I always found that hard to like, how do you get to that spot? I guess what I'm asking is you probably had some really crappy companies sign up. They were just like, they didn't appreciate it.

Then you had other ones that thought it was gold. So what did you find in the service providers the garage store companies the air whatever all the different niches you were in what did you find in them that kept them on for a long time and appreciate the leads and willing to pay 30 bucks is nothing for a lead by the way i mean for a voice call lead exclusive i mean to me it's worth a lot more even 10 years ago than 30 bucks. But what did you find in the attributes of these service companies that are actually on this call right now on the Facebook Live listening? And not to mention the 25,000 other people going to listen to it when it comes out on the podcast. Well, I think, Tommy, that I don't always just decide on the biggest

is the best. Obviously, you're doing some things that are obviously very successful. You're growing, you're expanding, you got multiple locations. So those are all really good indicators for somebody like me to be able to ascertain, is this a company that I want to do business with? So that's kind of a head start. I never turn away from considering working with a mom and pop or a company that has been family owned. They got one location, they're working in Topeka, Kansas, and they're considering us. So we take a look at everybody. But I think it really just comes down to realizing that these calls are happening in real time. You know, this is not a web form. This is an exclusive call that's coming to you live,

just as if they were calling off of any other piece of advertising that you have. So what are you going to do with our particular members? In our new model here, which we'll talk a little bit more about, there are some criteria and some expectations that we have that probably didn't live as much in my previous company, because at the end, I was billing out for a phone call. And so now under our new model that we'll talk about, it's a free option for the contractor. And so what we're going to be looking at is probably

going to be, we want good reviews. We want companies that place that importance of customer care, taking care of their customers, because that's where the hinge point is going to be, is that our particular members in our new business is going to be really tied, connected to our contractor choices. And so we got to make sure that everybody is on point with that. So I just find that, you know, you have to be willing to go ahead and treat each call as if it could be the last, Because if you do that, you build that loyalty. And so we've built something that we believe is going to have that co-loyalty brand, if you will. All right. This is killing everybody. So you started a company. Is it your nephew?

Yeah. My namesake. The other david we're the double daves so you started a company called save on services you're an expert at lead generation and for some reason which i still think you're crazy for and i've told you that you decided i'm not going to charge any contractors to do this. You said what you wanted to do is participate and help grow it for everybody's sake. But let's go ahead and go into it. What is Save On Services and how is it relevant to the home service business? By 19 months ago, Tommy, I had one of those aha epiphany moments.

Woke up in bed like three o'clock in the morning, lightning bolt to the head. And God sent, you know, it was just clear as day and the words, build it like a Costco model. That's what was stamped on my brain. And I just started to noodle on this because my frustration from, you know, the 10 years that I was literally felt like I was printing money when we were selling the leads for 30 bucks a piece, and it just felt like it would never end. And it came to a screeching halt, and I took two years to try to resuscitate it. And after two years of not being able to get the sites back ranking again, we decided to sell off all the assets. I took a two and a half year hiatus from the business, and I have some other interests, aviation and whatnot, and just kind of took a break from it. But 19 months ago, that lightning bolt hit the brain. And that was it. And we've been off and running. I called my nephew. He's my namesake and just a great, great kid, 35 years old, brilliant, very creative, has been a videographer and is on the

creative side of our our business he's he's actually self-produced you know all the videos and everything you see on our website all the imagery uh that's got david's stamp all over it so together we took this idea and i said dave i think i've i think we've come up with a way to to kind of revolutionize the way that a contractor and a consumer is going to be able to interface. And, you know, today, everybody, we carry our phones with us everywhere. If you would have gone back to Kodak days and said in the future, the most popular camera in the world is going to be a phone, right? Nobody would have ever imagined that, right? And so you could say the same thing

with computer, the most powerful computers we carry in our hand now. So how do you take that and now leverage it to create a new cultural behavior for the consumer in the way that they're going to get connected with contractors? And, yeah, you know, there's a tendency to look at Google as a big go to place, but there's just too many other options out there. You know, Home Advisors running television commercials, Angie's List runs television commercials, Porch, Tackle, all these companies. So everybody has this voice out there that we're all trying to go ahead and funnel in the consumer. Save on Services, I kind of thought of it in a sense that I wanted to put the whole lead gen model on its head. And instead of charging you guys for leads, I felt that if I could give you a lead for free, number one, you'd probably be pretty loyal to our brand because I'm zeroing out your cost of acquisition.

So it's literally no cost to you. We sell memberships to consumers. So we are the Costco model, if you will. So we charge a $30 annual fee, not monthly, annual, 30 bucks, $29.99 actually, to a consumer. And they can get a membership that gives them access to our exclusive mobile app. And once they log in and that market is open, then you as a contractor can reserve as many zip codes as we have on our database for your particular territory in your category. And you can have multiple categories that are applicable to your business. If you're first in

and we look at you and your reviews are great, I personally like to talk to every owner. We've had national brands. I mean, you know, we just recently did a deal with Chemdrive, biggest carpet cleaning company in the world, and they've decided to come on board. And so franchisees all over the country are now joining our platform. So the advantage is that it's going to give those contractors these exclusive calls because now our homeowner members, when they launch the app, it's real simple, two clicks. You hit the button to open up the app and you're faced with a screen of categories with a little phone icon. And the consumer hits the icon and the call goes right out to the contractor

and that's an exclusive call. Nobody else is going to get that phone call. So we feel that doing this is going to kind of revolutionize the way it's going to kind of modernize, if you will, the way that homeowners and contractors get together. But I think the thing that I'm most excited about is that I think that we're creating a new behavior for the consumer. We believe that there's three kinds of situations that our members are going to be in. There's what I call the high anxiety repair, right? So that's like the refrigerator going out after you just put three or $400 worth of groceries in it. Your AC goes out and you live in Phoenix.

The heater goes out. You're up in Duluth, Minnesota. The garage door spring breaks when your daily routine is you open up the door. You're getting ready to get into your car. You hit the button on the wall, and all of a sudden, they hear the big bang. So the broken springs and your door's hanging cockeyed on there. You're not leaving. So car's not getting out of the garage, high anxiety. So the choice is, is that people can either go into Google, you know, they have to decide, do you really want to be waiting to get

quotes from multiple companies? What you really want is you want somebody that you can trust and you want somebody that's going to be priced fair. And so we believe that if we do the heavy vetting, if we find the companies that are top rated, good quality companies, fair price, we don't get involved with your money. We don't tell you what to charge. We just say that if we're willing to give you these lead calls for free on an exclusive basis, then what we want you to do is to participate in a way to incentivize our consumers to keep using our app. And so typically what we do is on anything that is up to $250, then a contractor gives our member a 10% price reduction on that expense. So again, anything up to 250 bucks, 10% off. Okay. From $250 climbing up to 2,500,

the consumer now is going to have their percentage of discount increase from 10% up to a maximum of 15%. But the consumer has to be spending $2,500 to reach the ceiling discount 15% okay so linearly across that $250 all the way up to $2500 that extra from 10% to 15% is the run of discount it's very incremental it's very proportional so it'd be 11.26% if it's like 1827 exactly so now 15% is the ceiling, but the customer has to be spending 2,500. Now, if you continue the dollar spend all the way out to $10,000, now what happens is we set up the code so that the discount now starts to descend from 15% and it'll drop down to 5% when it reaches $10,000. So anything north of $10,000 is a flat 5%. So there's tools on our website, both on our contractor page and in the homeowner that's looking at a membership,

where they can actually predetermine and see there's a little slider bar on there. And you can kind of play with that. And it's goof proof. I mean, that's the neat thing about it is that the more money the consumer is spending, the more money they're saving, regardless of that percentage. But for the contractors, what makes it really valuable is that once it reaches that peak at $2,500, it starts to descend. And so combined with a zero cost acquisition, even giving a discount or price reduction to our members clearly makes sense to everybody. And I mean, I've had moms and pops in major corporations that have looked at this new model and they're celebrating it. They're pretty excited

about it because again, zero cost acquisition. So you're taking money in, in one hand, you're just taking a little less of it, but it's not combined with any other double discount, nor does it come with an actual cost for that lead. So, you know, I know we spoke, I signed up all my locations, obviously. Had a few pissed off people about that. See, I'm pissed off because someone might lock up the next 10 areas I'm going to in the next eight weeks. And I know it's kind of first come, first serve. If there is one that's taken and they're vetted, you kind of have a backup, right? You're

going to say, if these guys don't do a great job, we start getting negative feedback. You're going to pull in over, you'll give them a chance to correct it. You're not just like, you get an customer that happens, but the next step is that secondary contractor to get a chance. Am I right? Absolutely. So we have the ability to go ahead. We're going to vet a company. And if you're the first in and you've got great reviews, you check all the boxes off. Yeah, we're going to put you in. But if you're the next company that comes on board, you're going to have the opportunity to be on our wait list. We're going to make sure that everybody is held to the standard to perform because

see our revenue is generated to that $30 membership. There's 130 million front doors in the United States. So our goal, our pathway to revenue is by signing and selling those memberships. We have, you know, consumers that are going to renew that thing year over year over year, and that's what we need protected, right? So the contractors have to be able to go ahead and make sure that they adhere to, you know, the minimal rules that we have. Case in point, you know, you can't ask a consumer if they're a member prior to giving them a quote. So that would be an example of a violation of our terms from the contractor side. So we don't want anybody doing that because that'll give the perception that you're trying to pad the quote, offset the discount that you got to give the customer. I mean, we're already giving you a

free lead. So don't try to circumvent our program. It's just going to result in you probably being removed from our platform and next up is going in. And we don't turn the wagon around once we make that decision. It'll be a costly error for somebody. So the word of the wise is get on our platform and then play by a good rule. But yeah, to answer your question, there's going to always be a lot of good companies that are not going to get on our platform, at least initially. But there have been times when we do need to remove somebody. Even on my old model with the paper leads, 30 bucks a piece,

we had to remove companies from time to time. So this is the hard part because what do they say? There's no such thing as a free lunch. Yeah. You're not charging. You're not collecting credit card information. So you're telling me every one of the people that are listening, they go to your website, they sign up and you're not collecting their, their information. You're not trying to charge them a bunch of money. You're talking about the contractors? Yeah. Yeah. Contractor goes in, they fill out an application form so that we could vet you. I want to know about your website so we can do all of our social proofing and do the things that we do internally here in order to check the

box. But that's what we're collecting. But no, you never give us a credit card. You don't pay us a dime. We want good quality companies that are going to complement our experience. We believe that our pathway with this platform is going to revolutionize again, the way that the consumer interacts and finds business. And here's the thing, you know, back to, you asked me earlier, the home advisor model or any model where the consumer is being, you know, a lead broker, they become the product. Their information becomes the product. Today, all of us as consumers feel pretty exposed with all of our information. I mean, let's face it, it's out there and it's being used sometimes against us

in some horrific ways. But just for the most part, there comes a point in time when you want to feel like you're a little bit more in control of your information. With Savon Services, our model from the consumer side is that we never sell their information. We're never giving that personal information to the contractor. So the contractor receives phone calls just like you normally would. And so, yeah, when you come and sign up with us, you're going to get phone calls. And just think of. And so, yeah, when you come and sign up with us, you're going to get phone calls and just, just think of it like, you know, you're going to get more phone calls. They're free, treat our members well, and you'll thrive. I don't really understand. So you said there's multiple contractors

and when do the consumers get involved? Is there a threshold of contractor? You said that when we open that market, how does that all work? So, you know, we have right now, we've loaded in, you know, we started with about 30 different categories and we're up to 65 categories because every time we get introduced to a new contractor or a big franchise, you know, they have little subcategories that they're interested in having. And, you know, we don't want to grow it out. We want to somewhat keep it tame, but we do feel that there's a lot of good value in being able to parse out some subcategories. It'll just be more intuitive for our users to be able to make a call, not be rejected by a contractor saying,

oh, well, I don't do that particular part of that particular piece of the industry. So we've grown it up now to about 65 different categories. And we've identified 11 of the 65 are what we call primary categories. And these are, you know, like garage door is one of them and appliance repair, roofer, AC, electrician, pest control. These are all primary categories that have to be filled in with a quality company in a particular market. And we're now up to 255 markets around the United States. So 65 categories per market, 11 of them are primary. We got to have those filled before we'll start taking $30 memberships from consumers. We just won't open up the market to a consumer and take their $30 until we have the value there so that when they download our app and they launch it, that there is sufficient category representation there.

So we want to make sure that people are able to go ahead and get value for their $30 membership. As you can imagine, the more categories that get turned on, they become more active. There's just more value there for them, right? We believe that the consumer will really start touting and talking about us, hopefully in a positive light, just because they're getting guaranteed discounts, their privacy is protected, and they're getting a discount regardless. It's not like a coupon that says, hey, this is a coupon you had to find that didn't expire, right? Nobody likes to haggle sometimes. I mean, some of us do, but there are consumers out there that are a little intimidated. They feel a little embarrassed. It's kind of like getting a steak that's a little overcooked, you know, and there's always that consumer that says, oh no,

it's okay. I'll just eat it. You know, they just don't want the confrontation. They interpret it that way. And we believe that if we can make it easy for the customer to bridge that gap, where they know that they're going to get a discount from every one of our contractors that are participating and they never have to haggle. They just, they're going to have on the app, this calculator that's built in right into the app. It's the same calculator that the contractor uses and there's full transparency. Everybody knows what the discounted amount is going to be. So it prevents that tension. It prevents that anxiety. And the consumer ultimately wins. The contractor wins because they're getting free business. And then together, our brand wins because both halves of our model are serving each other.

And at the end of an 11-month run, the consumer has saved three or four hundred dollars or more. What's the chance of them not renewing their 30 dollar membership with us? Right. We believe that that's where for us, the big pathway to 30, 40, 50 million homeowners around the United States. And that's where we want to go. But we can't get there without good quality contractors and happy consumers. And so we all have to be working together. You know, from my understanding, so the biggest thing is when a contractor signs up, you're going to, right now you're willing to talk to each and every one, explain to them basically how it all works, maybe give them a little demo, which is amazing because you decided to basically take your hiatus and come back because of this idea.

The early adopters need to understand it and embrace it. And for me, I want to get everybody in Phoenix, but now we're in 14 states, about to be 22 states. That's awesome, Tommy. Congratulations. As possible, because the more I get the roofers, the air conditioning, the hot water, the faster those markets open, the faster we start working with each other to get free leads. So theoretically, anybody that signs up right now should be calling 10 of their buddies

in that same city to get those filled out. Absolutely. And you're exactly right, because we want to go ahead and get those 11 primaries in particular, get those filled in, and we can go ahead and launch. But here's one of the things that we're going to do to kind of put fuel on the fire, if you will. So we've got digital gift cards, and we actually have printed up physical gift cards that people can buy. And we've put this package together so that realtors and mortgage people and whatnot, they can pre-buy these gift cards. And that's represented on our website as well. But here's what we're doing with all of our contractors. And this is relatively new announcement. So everybody's hearing this, you know, probably for one of the first times. We're going to give every contractor, every

company that comes onto our platform, we're going give you between 500 and potentially 1,000 digital gift codes, which are going to basically be a free membership that you can actually email and send out to your favorite customers. And it's your way of saying, we were selected by SaveOn Services to be the exclusive provider here in our area. And as a result,

we'd like to give you your first year membership for free. Now we're going to do that. And look where this takes us at this, this strategy. If we have 20 contractors that help to open up a market and using your example, Tommy is getting the word out, getting your buddies, getting your network. There's BNI, there's different networking groups that people get together with and not in conflict with each other, but you know who other good, solid company players are in your area. So get them to our platform. And if we give out 500 to a thousand of these digital certificates, think about 20 companies sending out these digital certificates and we're able to now seed in 10, 15, 20,000 homeowners that are now signed up to our platform right in your local market, do you think the phone

is going to start ringing? And so we want to build Team Tampa. Tampa is our first market that we're opening up in and we're going to follow where the primary categories take us. So this is great. And I want to just say thank you for doing this podcast with us, because we believe that this platform is the future. to go ahead and connect good quality companies, separate the noise, and put consumers and contractors together so that there is a cohesion and a good result that everybody gets from that platform. So you vet the companies out. You used to bring in two, $3 million a year off a lead. So any idea, you sound like you know what you're doing. I've known you for a long time and you, you know, you're shit when it comes to this stuff. So I do believe in your mind too.

I think right now it's, I can be a voice for you and I'm going to get the word out there. And I think there's a couple other people that could get the word out. But as you start sending out more franchises and these spots keep taking up, I mean, right now is the time to go get it. Where do you go? So you go to SaveOnServices.com? Is it special?

Yeah, so it's S-A-V-O-N, SaveOnServices.com. And then there's a contractor link up in the top right corner in the main menu. Click on contractor. And we have a little three-minute video that gives you a presentation about the value of our platform. So the contractor page is there and there's the little slider tool. You can kind of play around with that. You can see the percentages. Everything's right there on that page. And then if you want to get started, just look for the get started button. It's right there and you can fill out the application step. And then we let you pick out the zip codes that you want. So let me kind of

clarify something because you did touch on a good point a little earlier. So this is probably a good time to insert it. If you're one of the people that's first to your market for your category and all of the zip codes are available, take them if you service them. But we're like a buffet restaurant. Take all the food you want, but eat all the food you take. Don't take zip codes that you are going to be taking phone calls in for. And then you're going to be telling our members, we don't service that zip code. Don't take a zip code to tie it up. That's another way to get on the shady side of me. So I want you to take all the zip codes that you service in your area. And if that's the case,

then great. But if we have, let's say, 200 zip codes represented in your market and you service 130 of the 200, then leave the other 70 on the table. Another company can come in, take those zip codes. But here's how our mobile app works. When the consumer launches the app and they hit, let's say, the plumbing button, it reads their zip code in their profile, and then it matches up all the contractors that should be aligned with that particular zip code. So we could potentially have two plumbers serving the same market, but neither of them will ever talk to the same customer because they're only connected to the customers in the zip codes that they represent. So I hope that that makes some good sense to everybody because we want to make sure that every consumer gets serviced.

Right. And so we want to make sure and calls are recorded. Just play by the rules. Take all the zip codes you want, but service all the zip codes you take. So when we were prepping we briefly talked about this but when you do get those core i guess core construction companies and you know air conditioning and whatnot that's when you start attacking the hoh realtors mortgage companies home service providers so your goal is to kind of come at it and get everybody to download it. You're really going after that reoccurring the next year is when they get the savings. So you're willing to take it at a loss almost upfront. You spend a lot of money in

development. You spend a lot of money. It's pretty cool because this thing's got a lot of legs right now. I think that it's going to take off. And I think that the main goal is you got to ask. You're giving free leads away. So you got to ask these contractors. Spread the word. Post it on your Facebook. Reach out to your B&I chapter. Maybe talk to a couple of the different advertisers you work with to see if they could send the word.

So, yeah, I love the, like I said, I signed up. Unfortunately, I couldn't sign up the areas I'm going to be going to because it's not fair. But basically, you'd be an idiot not to sign up because it doesn't cost anything. So I don't know what else to tell everybody except, you know, anybody that can make, like I said, $2 to $3 million off of a $30 lead. You know what you're doing. You see the writing on the wall. You had the epiphany. You listened to your gut and you built it. And here we are, end of 2020, reaching a new year. And what do you think is going to happener. And I just love the fact that somebody could expand their vision as big as he has, as young as he is, and for all the accomplishments that he's done thus far in his life. I look at that as a great inspiration to being able to see big picture.

And, you know, David and I, my nephew, you know, we started this thing 19 months ago and COVID hit. We were thinking of launching back in, you know, January, February of this year. We were almost ready. And then COVID hits and it's like, pump the brakes. Wow. What are we going to do here? And, you know, guys like you, the essential businesses all needed to

corral all the lobbyists. Everybody had to get together to make sure that you guys could still be able to get into the homes. Here we are creating this promotional mechanism for you guys. And we just had to pump the brakes and slow down. So what it did is David and I decided to take that time and to kind of retool stuff that we knew that we could make better. And I think that we were able to go ahead and make good use of the time. I know that both of us have been pretty passionate in trying to get to the launch pad, but not in spite of quality. And we believe that certain things are happening for a reason. And I think that this is just a good time. It's a good time.

There's going to be 2021 is going to be phenomenal. We've got 255 markets. If you're a contractor out there and you'd like to go ahead, get onto our platform, we'll watch the video, take a few minutes, fill out the application. We're not like some of the other companies that are having you jump through a lot of hoops. I personally will talk to you. I'll know if you're a good fit for us. We like winning, but not at the expense of customers having bad experiences. Because again, our revenue is connected to that little $30 membership. So we're kind of like Costco. It's got to be good. It's got to be good for everybody. And if is then everybody will benefit but we see it

going very big yeah like me too dave one of the things i ask every guest on the podcast and so this is the live and then it will be coming out the podcast will air and probably the next six weeks but give me this top three books and i've got a bunch of books i mean i get the e-myth all the time but give me three books to really stand out got a bunch of books. I mean, I get the e-myth all the time. But give me three books that really stand out that you really enjoy. It doesn't need to be about business per se or marketing. It could be about anything. But is there three common books that you'd recommend to the listeners?

Well, there's a book that for years, it's kind of funny. It kind of came up. There was an older gentleman that lives near me. And he and his wife owned a flooring business. They're retired now. And the name Tommy Hopkins came up, you know, and I, and they, they actually went, you know, and they went to many of his seminars and it was kind of funny. They're quite a bit older than I am, but they tossed his name out as somebody that was influential to them. And I said, yeah,

the official guide to success, huh? And they, they both looked at me like, are you kidding me? You, you know, Tom Hopkins and I, are you kidding me? You know Tom Hopkins? Are you kidding? He's a legend. So Tom Hopkins' official guide to success has always kind of been one of my favorite go-tos. I always like The Magic of Thinking Big. Schwartz is just another great read. You just got to get outside because you don't know what you can do until you just start the journey. So The Magic of thinking big was pretty impressive. One that I've just read recently here is a book called Intentions. And Intention is awesome. It's a $12 book on Amazon. It's a quick, easy read, but man, it's just loaded with some really good stuff. Tony Hopkins is just another good stuff. But I am consumed usually by that kind of good

food material. And yeah, that's a great question, Tommy. I think that if everybody just keeps feeding their brain, you know, you treat your brain like a garden because if you don't tend it, it's going to be taken by the weeds. You know, it's funny that you mentioned garden. For some reason, I thought of hose just now because you water the garden and McDonald's Ray Crox is when your enemies are drowning, you stick a hose in their mouth. I love that quote, but it's so off topic. It's the ADD kicking in. Yeah, it's all good. If someone wants to get ahold of you,

obviously they go to save on services. We put the link here. There'll be a link on home service expert.com. If you find this podcast, if you can't figure it out, it's savonservices.com. And if they want to reach out to you personally, what's the best way to get a hold of you? Dave at savonservices.com. And you can reach me. I'll give you my global toll-free number is 888-200-8984. That's my personal toll number. It'll ring to me. So I take the partnerships and the relationships that we have seriously. So it all starts with quality. And we've taken 19 months to put this thing together. So we're ready to, we feel like it's fueled. It's our Elon Musk rocket that's on the launch pad. It's pretty exciting. I'll find a way

to get it to everybody, but there's a very inspirational video i call it the best four minute movie you'll ever watch uh if you go to youtube and you just put in spacex uh launch celebration that the background on the thumbnail is kind of like a teal color and there's a sunset in the background go watch that movie if it doesn't put water in your your eyes then then something's wrong with you. And so I think I'll probably leave you with this. Zig Ziglar, I had a chance to fly on a plane with Zig Ziglar, probably one of the greatest motivational speakers of all time. He was a great storyteller. And you know, Zig's model was if you help enough other people get what they want,

you'll automatically get what you want. It's by default. And so for us, we believe that our model doesn't just make us money. We're willing to give away these digital gift certificates to really get the phone ringing. That helps you guys. We'll wait on our memberships. We think that if we do a good job, word will get out. It'll go viral. It's all based on all of us treating you know, treating the consumer, play by our rules. You know, the rules are pretty simple. Don't ask them for a, if they're a member before you give them a quote, it's pretty simple. But we just think that if everybody does their role, it's win, win, win for everybody, including the consumer. So Tommy, I thank you for your,

for your input on doing this. I really do appreciate it. And I'm looking forward to, you know, inspiring your offices and your company to go to the next level as well. We'll do our very best to do that as well as every one of our other contractors. Well, last thing I'll say is it sounds like to me you need a kind of a punch. You need to get this off the ground. So by people sharing, by people signing up and just placing a link, making a couple of phone calls, you know, I'm going to call a couple of people for you, some big influencers. And, you know, I know there's going to be a time that you're probably going to ask us to do something. If you need me to hand out a thousand of those memberships,

that's not a problem. If we need to send an email out of my CRM, that's not a problem. If you need a link to your website, because here's the thing. I hate to say this because it sounds selfish, but it definitely benefits my company, my employees, my internal customers by doing this stuff. So people out there, they sign up, they're patient, they understand what they need to do to help. And we get this thing going and everybody makes a lot of money. But I'll tell you what, I'm going to open it up one last time. Whatever you want to finish with, I'll give the floor to you. And thank you very much for coming on as well. Well, I'll tell you, you know, they say happiest are those who feel that what they should be doing and what they are doing are the same thing.

Every day I wake up, I enjoy what I do. I've been able to be traveling full time since 2006. I enjoy our country. I look for Mayberry all over the United States in my travels. And I'm very fortunate to never think of myself as a retired individual because there's ideas and the internet has inspired all kinds of great things that people can do. I'm always in wonder and amazement by the imagination of people who want to do good things. And we'd like to make sure that, you know, and I'll speak for my nephew, David and I, high levels of integrity.

We just want to continue down that path. And we know that the monetary rewards will follow us. But when you run clean and you build a business with integrity, then, you know, the rewards that usually follow you. And you attract other good quality people like this guy right there. A lot of people are signing up, so it's cool. Seems like it's going. I think it's time to end the podcast. You're in California, right?

Yeah. Looks beautiful in the background. Let's go watch this SpaceX launch celebration those of you that are still on and I think it's awesome so Dave can't say enough how much I appreciate it you added a ton of value I think that's what the guests love is when we could add a lot of value and it sounds like we're going to get a lot of value down the road here so appreciate it very much sounds good Tommy thank you and thank everybody for tuning in we're looking forward to working with you and we're going to jump off this call and jump right in there and start looking at some

applications. See you later, guys. See you. Hey guys, I just wanted to thank you real quick for listening to the podcast from the bottom of my heart means a lot to me. And I hope you're getting as much as I am out of this podcast. Our goal is to enrich your lives and enrich your businesses and your internal customers, which is your staff. And if you get a chance, please, please, please subscribe. You're going to find out all the new podcasts. You're going to be able to ask me questions to ask the next guest coming on. And do me a quick favor, leave a quick review. It really helps us out when you like the podcast and you leave a review, make it four or five sentences, tell us how we're doing. And I just wanted to mention real quick, we started a membership. It's homeservicemillionaire.com forward slash club. You get a ton of inside look at what we're going to do to become a billion dollar company. And

we're just, we're telling everybody our secrets basically. And people say, why do you give your secrets away all the time? And I'm like, you know, the hardest part about giving away my secrets is actually trying to get people to do them. So we also create a lot of accountability within this program. So check it out. It's homeservicemillionaire.com forward slash club. It's cheap.

It's a monthly payment. I'm not making any money on it to be completely frank with you guys, but I think it will enrich your lives even further. So thank you once again for listening to the podcast. I really appreciate it.